Question:

Dan’l, you really don’t need a wading staff.  Studs are better there. I just go with plain old felts (i don’t have studded wading shoes) and the "linked recovery" wading method.  I’ll have a non folding wading staff for whoever wants to use it. You can get away without one, but if (just two examples) you want to fish the narrow chute along the north bank above the Cable Pool – or for that matter, fish the main stem along the Cable Pool, you’re gonna wish you did have a staff. /daytripper (Won’t leave home sans Folstaff)

Wading there and in most places is dependent on flows. Typically flows are down in the Winter. Willi

Response:

<snipped Danl, Weather right now is in the 40’s. http://www.weather.com/weather/cities/us_nm_navajo_dam.html I don’t think you will need a wading staff, but you might want to consider studs or some boot chains.  The rocks are a little slippery, but the water is really low. bc. — Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy. -Benjamin Franklin

Response:

Dan’l, you really don’t need a wading staff.  Studs are better there.

 …..good advice snipped….. Bruce, Thanks for the heads up on the clothing. Danl

Response:

Blackcat, Thanks for the update and link. You say the water is really low now. Does the flow (release from the dam) fluctuate a lot during the winter? Danl – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Weather right now is in the 40’s. http://www.weather.com/weather/cities/us_nm_navajo_dam.html I don’t think you will need a wading staff, but you might want to consider studs or some boot chains.  The rocks are a little slippery, but the water is really low. bc. — Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy. -Benjamin Franklin

Response:

Dan’l, you really don’t need a wading staff.  Studs are better there. I just go with plain old felts (i don’t have studded wading shoes) and the "linked recovery" wading method.  I’ll have a non folding wading staff for whoever wants to use it.

You can get away without one, but if (just two examples) you want to fish the narrow chute along the north bank above the Cable Pool – or for that matter, fish the main stem along the Cable Pool, you’re gonna wish you did have a staff. /daytripper (Won’t leave home sans Folstaff)

Response:

Dan’l, you really don’t need a wading staff.  Studs are better there. I just go with plain old felts (i don’t have studded wading shoes) and the "linked recovery" wading method.  I’ll have a non folding wading staff for whoever wants to use it. As for the temps, it can be from 20 to 60.  It’s usually really cold in the early am and you find yourself peeling layers as the day warms up, like everywhere.  One thing for sure – the water is cold and your feet get cold no matter what.  Getting out of the water for a few minutes does the trick though. If you have a waterproof jacket with a hood, bring it.  I will also have both breathable and neoprene waders.  Fleece pants are needed if you’re wearing something other than neoprene waders. There’s an excellent report from Resolution Guide Service on http://www.ifly4trout.com – updated yesterday.  There’s some chance that the lake will be "turning over" and the water murky.  If that’s the case, there will be less sight fishing, and maybe less dry activity, and more blind casting nymphs.  Pray for clear water. Strong Hooks, bruce h Before you buy.

Response:

In that case, I recommend a cheap and plentiful supply of brandy for the fishing hours.

Can’t! Then what would we do in the non-fishing hours? Danl

Response:

Did you say that a folstaff or equivalent was mandatory or at least highly reccommended for the wading impaired such as myself? BTW, Aaron at Rizzuto’s said we should expect daytime temps in the 30’s, zat right??

In that case, I recommend a cheap and plentiful supply of brandy for the fishing hours. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/

Response:

   Bob Skinner and I will be leaving early Fri morning, with about 8 hours driving time we should be there by cocktail hour.

Charlie,   I don’t know.  With this group of guys, we may have to leave Denver around 2:00 am in order to get there by cocktail hour:) Snoop — —–= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =—– http://www.newsfeeds.com – The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! —–==  Over 80,000 Newsgroups – 16 Different Servers! =—–

Response:

PS    When I a was much younger person, I stood shoulder to shoulder with a veterinarian who had both arms, up to the elbows, inside a cow helping to deliver her breeched calf. Hot bovine body fluids were splattering both of us from multiple orifices while we stood and knelt in a well used barn on a hot summer day. Until I read the posts of the last weeks, that experience was my baseline on the disgust-o-meter. Now I have a new baseline. The cow and the vet were doing the best they could under the circumstances. The end justified the means. I won’t accept that argument here.

  Damn candy ass!  You had a vet?  Your "disgust-O-meter" is calibrated differently than mine.  How about removal of—–oh, nevermind.  Not on a "familly" newsgroup. Snoop — —–= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =—– http://www.newsfeeds.com – The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! —–==  Over 80,000 Newsgroups – 16 Different Servers! =—–

Response:

OK, here’s the straight dirt, in order of importance: (really good time stuff snipped) Whatever I can do to make it easier for any of you, I’ll do.  Just let me know. bruce h

    god, i am envious. wayno

Response:

Whatever I can do to make it easier for any of you, I’ll do.  Just let me know.

You could move New Mexico about two or three travel days closer to North Dakota, so that I would be able to come… Kevin, green with envy

Response:

OK, here’s the straight dirt, in order of importance: 1.  Sierra Nevada Pale Ale and Hornitos or Herrardura Tequila.  Buy in Aztec or Bloomfield or Albuquerque.  I have some tequila.  Of course you can rely on me for the "cheapest liquor" info.

 …other great info and awesome display of preparedness snipped…. Bruce, Thanks for the offer of the room, but I’ve already burned the plastic for a room at Rizzuto’s. I wish I could figure a way to bring a keg of Dortmunder, but another time. Did you say that a folstaff or equivalent was mandatory or at least highly reccommended for the wading impaired such as myself? BTW, Aaron at Rizzuto’s said we should expect daytime temps in the 30’s, zat right?? Danl

Response:

Anyone know what Bruiser drinks, besides pond water of course?  <g Dave LaCourse

Response:

All, Actually, Aztec is closer, and cheaper! Bob in El Paso – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – <snipped Danl, You can buy beer in Navajo Dam, just not any hard liquor on Sunday. The prices are pretty expensive too.  I would pick up something in Farmington. bc. — Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy. -Benjamin Franklin

Response:

OK, here’s the straight dirt, in order of importance: 1.  Sierra Nevada Pale Ale and Hornitos or Herrardura Tequila.  Buy in Aztec or Bloomfield or Albuquerque.  I have some tequila.  Of course you can rely on me for the "cheapest liquor" info. 2.  Steve, I’m ready.  We can fish another stream on the way up and drive into Navajo Dam late Friday night.  I’m planning on driving back to albuquerque late tuesday after fishing.  We can also wait for dan’l and his rental car but that may prevent fishing friday. 3.  I’ll make sure everyone has directions to the river.  Directions from just about anywhere are on the ifly4trout.com website. 4.  Dan’l, maybe you can jump into Bob’s room for the nights you’re there.  He’s got one booked at rizuto’s – http://www.rizutos.com – and that way we’ll already have arrangements made for you.  Bob, in case you’re wondering, Dan’l was voted world’s nicest person at the western clave. 5.  There are flyshops galore at the river, and Rizuto’s is a flyshop also.  Abe’s is across the road.  Float n Fish, which i’ve designated ROFF’s "official" flyshop because of their friendliness and dry fly prowess, is about 300 yards away from rizutos.  They are also psyched to have this group coming to the river, they’ve heard about you guys : 6.  Keep tabs on http://www.ifly4trout.com – especially the reports from resolution guide service.  All of the "tips of the month" and FAQs are helpful also and reading them in advance will get you to the fish quicker. 7.  I’m involved in a remodel and simultaneous move but i’m still fifty flies into my goal of tying at least 200 flies for everyone’s use.  And they *are* a little slicker than those i tied for the raffle. I am really psyched for this deal.  If we can get warren down here that would just top it off completely, I really think he’d like a few days on such a different river. Whatever I can do to make it easier for any of you, I’ll do.  Just let me know. bruce h Before you buy.

Response:

Danl, I’ll be at Rizutto’s from the afternoon of the 7th thru the morning of the 12th. Bob in El Paso – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hey Bruiser, et al, What about an update on who, what, when, where, and how much for those of us who have been on the road, are interested in flyfishing, don’t want to wade through the crap that ROFF has apparently been lately and are too lazy to Deja News it to find out. Danl

Response:

Dan’l writes: What about an update on who, what, when, where, and how much for those of us who have been on the road, are interested in flyfishing, don’t want to wade through the crap that ROFF has apparently been lately and are too lazy to Deja News it to find out.

   Bob Skinner and I will be leaving early Fri morning, with about 8 hours driving time we should be there by cocktail hour.

Response:

<snipped Danl, You can buy beer in Navajo Dam, just not any hard liquor on Sunday. The prices are pretty expensive too.  I would pick up something in Farmington. bc. — Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy. -Benjamin Franklin

Response:

If folks want to consider me an asshole

for saying so, that’s fine by me.< Hmmm.  Asshole’s a pretty strong word.   I prefer to think of you as a Frightened Illini.   Or is that Frightning Illini?  Or Illinoi*s*ian?   (Accent on the "s" of course.)  <g

Response:

Chances are, work will shut me down on this one, but God hates a coward so I’m buying airfare as if I was going. Plan on flying into AlbertQQ on Friday and slinking home on Tuesday AM.

I’ll be arriving on Friday morning, at which time Bruiser has pledged (or at least hinted) that he’ll duck out of work, pick me up at the airport, and go fishing. Hope to see you then, Dan’l. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/

Response:

Dan’l writes: What about an update on who, what, when, where, and how much for those of us who have been on the road, are interested in flyfishing, don’t want to wade through the crap that ROFF has apparently been lately and are too lazy to Deja News it to find out.

I’ll be flying into AlbertQ on Sat. afternoon and visiting with friends until Sunday a.m.  I’lll rent a truck or car and drive to Rizuto’s.  I need directions, btw, Bruiser. Hope to be there about noon time on Sunday, so hope you dudes will leave directions on where to meet you on the river.  Looking forward to it.  However, I doubt my eyes will survive tying these #22 and 24 hooks! I fly back to Taxachusetts on Wednesday afternoon. Dave L.

Response:

… PS    When I a was much younger person, I stood shoulder to shoulder with a veterinarian who had both arms, up to the elbows, inside a cow helping to deliver her breeched calf. Hot bovine body fluids were splattering both of us from multiple orifices while we stood and knelt in a well used barn on a hot summer day. Until I read the posts of the last weeks, that experience was my baseline on the disgust-o-meter. Now I have a new baseline. The cow and the vet were doing the best they could under the circumstances. The end justified the means. I won’t accept that argument here.

Paraphrasing Harry Truman who in response to "Give ‘em hell, Harry", said I’ll tell the truth and they’ll think I’m givin’ ‘em hell. A little bit of word play on a Usenet newsgroup can in no way be compared to the ugliness of institutional bigotry and casual racism. If folks want to consider me an asshole for saying so, that’s fine by me. — Ken Fortenberry

Response:

I’ll be arriving on Friday morning, at which time Bruiser has pledged (or at least hinted) that he’ll duck out of work, pick me up at the airport, and go fishing. Hope to see you then, Dan’l.

 Steve, I’m sposta arrive about 2:15PM. I’m gonna rent an infernal combustion engine powered contraption of some sort (SUV). If Bruce can’t make it, you’re welcome to ride up to Navajo Dam with me. How much they charging you to put Simon and Heather in first class with Arlo? Bruce, is Rizzuto’s the place to be? Can I buy beer (not pale yellow belch water) in Navaho Dam or do I need to take care of this in Albertqq? Danl

Response:

Hey Bruiser, et al, What about an update on who, what, when, where, and how much for those of us who have been on the road, are interested in flyfishing, don’t want to wade through the crap that ROFF has apparently been lately and are too lazy to Deja News it to find out. Chances are, work will shut me down on this one, but God hates a coward so I’m buying airfare as if I was going. Plan on flying into AlbertQQ on Friday and slinking home on Tuesday AM. Danl PS    When I a was much younger person, I stood shoulder to shoulder with a veterinarian who had both arms, up to the elbows, inside a cow helping to deliver her breeched calf. Hot bovine body fluids were splattering both of us from multiple orifices while we stood and knelt in a well used barn on a hot summer day. Until I read the posts of the last weeks, that experience was my baseline on the disgust-o-meter. Now I have a new baseline. The cow and the vet were doing the best they could under the circumstances. The end justified the means. I won’t accept that argument here.

Response:

Question:

Dave was unable to attend the ceremonies as I was stuck at work trying to make PeopleSoft run…what a bummer…

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – By the grace of God its BEEN DONE!!!! In a historic moment in Maines history, the infamous Edwards Dam on the mighty Kennebec River was breached at 9:36 A.M. this morning. 17 miles of freeflowing river has been returned to the fish and the people! [snipped] From one CUrmudgeon to another: OUT-FREAKIN’-STANDING!!!!!! Wish I could’ve been there to watch the festivities, Ed. Did you and Dave take the "Green Submarine" out to officiate? /daytripper ps: Does this mean I can remove that old bumper sticker? ;^)

Response:

Dave was unable to attend the ceremonies as I was stuck at work trying to make PeopleSoft run…what a bummer…

Ah – another illustrious CU member and Ordealist Extraordinaire heard from. Take heart old friend, you’ll be cruising those seventeen miles for years to come! /daytripper (fishing the Kennebec in his dreams…)

Response:

I am sure the information, in detail, is beginning to circulate everywhere.   There are a couple of TU News Release Articles at Rx F Fish in our News Release section at:  http://www.rxffish.com/PR The same information is also available from TU.   Either place, it’s great reading of an historic and very meaningful event that will surely have many long-range benefits for decades to come. Regards,   Trent Roberson ***** – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Ladies and Gentlemen!!! By the grace of God its BEEN DONE!!!! In a historic moment in Maines history, the infamous Edwards Dam on the mighty Kennebec River was breached at 9:36 A.M. this morning. 17 miles of freeflowing river has been returned to the fish and the people! I never thought we’d see it in my lifetime, but I saw it with MY OWN EYES!!!! God bless America, Land of the Free! Here’s some pointers to the latest: www.ctel.net/~mudfish  My home page for a report on the breaching and www.ctel.net/mudfish/condi/  my river conditions page with some thoughs as I left the river late last evening.. (this is NOT a commercial spam). Please no flames :8). www.centralmaine.com/edwards/  Carl Natale’s feature story for Blethen Newspapers featuring some hot pictures of the KENNEBEC RIVER EVENT OF THE YEAR! Tight lines Ed Blum Registered Maine Guide

Trent P Roberson                  Rx F Fish        For your good health, Fly Fish             http://www.rxffish.com             FREE Business Listings          For the Fly Fishing Industry          http://www.rxffish.com/index2.htm            rxfNET Development Group        Web Site Development and Hosting       Image Editing – - Software Training       Marketing and Internet Consultation          http://www.rxffish.com/rxfnet

Response:

By the grace of God its BEEN DONE!!!! In a historic moment in Maines history, the infamous Edwards Dam on the mighty Kennebec River was breached at 9:36 A.M. this morning. 17 miles of freeflowing river has been returned to the fish and the people!

[snipped] From one CUrmudgeon to another: OUT-FREAKIN’-STANDING!!!!!! Wish I could’ve been there to watch the festivities, Ed. Did you and Dave take the "Green Submarine" out to officiate? /daytripper ps: Does this mean I can remove that old bumper sticker? ;^)

Response:

Ladies and Gentlemen!!! By the grace of God its BEEN DONE!!!! In a historic moment in Maines history, the infamous Edwards Dam on the mighty Kennebec River was breached at 9:36 A.M. this morning. 17 miles of freeflowing river has been returned to the fish and the people! I never thought we’d see it in my lifetime, but I saw it with MY OWN EYES!!!! God bless America, Land of the Free! Here’s some pointers to the latest: www.ctel.net/~mudfish  My home page for a report on the breaching and www.ctel.net/mudfish/condi/  my river conditions page with some thoughs as I left the river late last evening.. (this is NOT a commercial spam).  Please no flames :8). www.centralmaine.com/edwards/  Carl Natale’s feature story for Blethen Newspapers featuring some hot pictures of the KENNEBEC RIVER EVENT OF THE YEAR! Tight lines Ed Blum Registered Maine Guide

Response:

Question:

Aaaaaaahhhh, A message from that knowledgeable Bill Kiene is like a warm spring breeze on this board. Alas, at 4500′ elevation it will be awhile before we southern Idahoans see any bluegill or bass action. Jim – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi All, If we have about a week or two of good sunny weather here in California, we are going to start to have some great warm water fishing. We have tons of  ’farm pond’ or ’stock ponds’ that are below 2000′. Most of them have black bass and panfish in them. I would true to get out on one of these ponds from March through June for some great action. I prefer afternoon/evening for warm water fishing. Bill Kiene Kiene’s Fly Shop www.kiene.com

Response:

Hi All, If we have about a week or two of good sunny weather here in California, we are going to start to have some great warm water fishing. We have tons of  ’farm pond’ or ’stock ponds’ that are below 2000′. Most of them have black bass and panfish in them. I would true to get out on one of these ponds from March through June for some great action. I prefer afternoon/evening for warm water fishing. Bill Kiene Kiene’s Fly Shop www.kiene.com

Response:

Hey Bill: The warm water fishing here in Northwest Arkansas is just now kicking into gear…caught four blacks one evening last week and two Sunday morning (biggest was a pound and a half) on a new bass fly (to me) "G.W.’s Glory"……Chartreuse rabbit strip tail, chartreuse ice chenille body, and chartreuse Sili Legs collar…..2/0 Mustad 34007 saltwater hook.  WOW!  They hit it hard!  Searched tonight for stripers off my favorite point here at Beaver Lake…full moon shining off the lake was like fishing under a huge spot light…lake was like glass…no stripers caught but what an absolutely beautiful evening. Got an email from a guy Saturday (from the Bass newsgroup) who pulled a 44"er off this point Friday…not on a fly rod though.  Can you imagine a 44" freshwater striper on a fly rod?  I built a 10wt. St. Croix Legend Ultra last year for stripers; it’s just a matter of time before I hook the big one!!!!  Last year I pulled a few 6 and 7 lb. hybrids and stripers off this point…….this Spring…who knows??!! Greg H. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi All, If we have about a week or two of good sunny weather here in California, we are going to start to have some great warm water fishing. We have tons of ‘farm pond’ or ’stock ponds’ that are below 2000′. Most of them have black bass and panfish in them. I would true to get out on one of these ponds from March through June for some great action. I prefer afternoon/evening for warm water fishing. Bill Kiene Kiene’s Fly Shop www.kiene.com

Response:

Hey Bill: The warm water fishing here in Northwest Arkansas is just now kicking into gear…caught four blacks one evening last week and two Sunday morning (biggest was a pound and a half) on a new bass fly (to me) "G.W.’s Glory"……Chartreuse rabbit strip tail, chartreuse ice chenille body, and chartreuse Sili Legs collar…..2/0 Mustad 34007 saltwater hook.  WOW!  They hit it hard!  Searched tonight for stripers off my favorite point here at Beaver Lake…full moon shining off the lake was like fishing under a huge spot light…lake was like glass…no stripers caught but what an absolutely beautiful evening.

Hi Greg, Was just out walking off dinner and did also note the big moon here in CA. In Aril/May/June we go out on the full moon to the mouth of the Feather River where it goes into the Sacramento River about 20 plus miles north of downtown Sacramento. We fish the afternoon for American Shad, then after dark, we fish for stripers that are also running up to spawn. Both of these fish were imported from the East Coast of North America in ~1877 and  I guess their populations went crazy with the condition that our drainage was in that long ago. We take a little barbecue and make a time of it. Bill Kiene Kiene’s Fly Shop www.kiene.com

Response:

Question:

One of my favorite fishing spots has been lost forever due to trash left by other fisherman.

 There’s an area in Utah where I’ve fished for years, with my Grandpa, and dad.. This is just a farmers field, where the Weber river cuts off, but really good fishing…  The owner started charging 10$ per, due to garbage left by others.. It seems that those who were littering don’t feel like paying, so it’s clean now.. But still costs… And I skipped ahead.. I agree, I did get the main point… My dad’s ALWAYS taught us to leave the areas we go cleaner than when we got there…

Response:

Hey wake up,,, most states have these rules.  This IS why beer cans are tossed over…… why carry around evidence.  In Illinois it is that way……. Texas is apparently still civilized. kw – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – If you pick up someone’s beer cans, then you could get arrested for suspicion of having consumed alcohol on the water and that is likely why the cans are in the water in the first place….. Well, I live in Texas USA not in Canada.. There are no laws here in Texas which govern the amount of beer cans you have in possesion as long as you are not boating intoxicated…So there is NO excuse for littering our waters at all!!! I have witnessed guides in Canada sinking cans in the lakes as soon as the beer is consumed for just this reason. Well, if this is true then good luck to the future Canadian fishermen because there wont be any clean fishing areas left & that is very sad….    .  +  * _    *   + .  *   + .      . *    )O/(     *    .  *   + .                                        . + . . (o o)     + .  *   + .   . * .         . *.  /._. ***STAR*** ~ .                                             + .  ~~~  . * . +

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hey wake up,,, most states have these rules.  This IS why beer cans are tossed over…… why carry around evidence.  In Illinois it is that way……. Texas is apparently still civilized. kw If you pick up someone’s beer cans, then you could get arrested for suspicion of having consumed alcohol on the water and that is likely why the cans are in the water in the first place….. Well, I live in Texas USA not in Canada.. There are no laws here in Texas which govern the amount of beer cans you have in possesion as long as you are not boating intoxicated…So there is NO excuse for littering our waters at all!!! I have witnessed guides in Canada sinking cans in the lakes as soon as the beer is consumed for just this reason. Well, if this is true then good luck to the future Canadian fishermen because there wont be any clean fishing areas left & that is very sad….    .  +  * _    *   + .  *   + .    . *    )O/(     *    .  *   + .  . + . . (o o)     + .  *   + .   . * .     . *.  /._. ***STAR*** ~ .     + .  ~~~  . * . +

bullshit……. canadian take more pride in their waters than most ever visit the great white north????? well youcan still drink the water out of most of the lakes and rivers there….. as for polluters.. maybe we should look more at the american mine companies in northern ontario for what is really polluting our waters?//

Response:

I have picked up other people’s garbage numerous times!! It’s just pure outright laziness!!!! One of my favorite fishing spots has been lost forever due to trash left by other fisherman. The landowner even posted signs warning people that he would close the area if the littering continued. The next signs he put up were " No Trespassing- Violaters will be Prosecuted". I have talked to him and tried to get permission to fish. His response " blame it on your fellow fisherman".

   I was out paddling a canoe this past spring looking for spawning grounds, saw a few beds, also many sunken beer cans. Really sucks.

Response:

Cutam281 Writes: There are alot of lazy ass people whom continue to carelessly polute our rivers & lakes…I have picked up other people’s garbage numerous times!! It’s just pure outright laziness!!!!

KEW Writes: you could get arrested forsuspicion of having consumed alcohol on the water and that is likely why the cans are in the water in the first place….. I have witnessed guides in Canada sinking cans in the lakes as soon as the beer is consumed for just this reason. kw

Cutam281 Writes: Well, I live in Texas USA not in Canada.. There are no laws here in Texas which govern the amount of beer cans you have in possesion as long as you are not boating intoxicated…So there is NO excuse for littering our waters at all!!! I have witnessed guides in Canada sinking cans in the lakes as soon as the beer is consumed for just this reason. Well, if this is true then good luck to the future Canadian fishermen because there wont be any clean fishing areas left & that is very sad….

KEW Writes: Hey wake up,,, most states have these rules.  This IS why beer cans are tossed over…… why carry around evidence.  In Illinois it is that way……. Texas is apparently still civilized. kw

NO!! You wake up "KEW"!!!   The way you keep comming up with excuse after excuse to sink beer cans leads me to believe that YOU are most likely one of those whom do the sinking… If the laws in Illinois and elsewhere are strict on beer being comsumed while on water, then you and others should find another beverage to drink while boating and obey your state laws!!  If you must have your alcohol then wait till you get back on dry land & drink…As I said, "There is NO excuse for littering our water AT ALL!!!!    .  +  * _    *   + .  *   + .      . *    )O/(     *    .  *   + .                                            . + . . (o o)     + .  *   + .   . * .         . *.  /._. ***STAR*** ~ .                                             + .  ~~~  . * . +

Response:

bullshit……. canadian take more pride in their waters than most ever visit the great white north????? well youcan still drink the water out of most of the lakes and rivers there….. as for polluters.. maybe we should look more at the american mine companies in northern ontario for what is really polluting our waters?//

Hey Mark, Try telling this to "KEW"… He seems to have accused Canadian guides of sinking beer cans… Hey KEW, Are you sure you witnessed them sinking the cans?? Maybe what you actually saw was the guide pulling some sunken cans OUT of the water.. Hahahahahaha!!!!!! ~    .  +  * _    *   + .  *   + .      . *    )O/(     *    .  *   + .                                            . + . . (o o)     + .  *   + .   . * .         . *.  /._. ***STAR*** ~ .                                             + .  ~~~  . * . +

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – NO!! You wake up "KEW"!!!   The way you keep comming up with excuse after excuse to sink beer cans leads me to believe that YOU are most likely one of those whom do the sinking… If the laws in Illinois and elsewhere are strict on beer being comsumed while on water, then you and others should find another beverage to drink while boating and obey your state laws!! If you must have your alcohol then wait till you get back on dry land & drink…As I said, "There is NO excuse for littering our water AT ALL!!!!    .  +  * _    *   + .  *   + .      . *    )O/(     *    .  *   + .                                        . + . . (o o)     + .  *   + .   . * .         . *.  /._. ***STAR*** ~ .                                             + .  ~~~  . * . +

reason why you see beer cans strewn along the highways too…but do I care…. no way.  I offered an analysis…. you offered — WHAT? kw – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –

Response:

Hey Mark, Try telling this to "KEW"… He seems to have accused Canadian guides of sinking beer cans… Hey KEW, Are you sure you witnessed them sinking the cans?? Maybe what you actually saw was the guide pulling some sunken cans OUT of the water.. Hahahahahaha!!!!!! ~    . *    )O/(     *    .  *   + .                                        . + . . (o o)     + .  *   + .   . * .         . *.  /._. ***STAR*** ~ .                                             + .  ~~~  . * . +

///// I was not accusing "Canadian guides" ……. at least not in general.  In fact, I didn’t accuse anyone.  I simply pointed out a direct observation.. You don’t have to believe it…. why would I care?. kw – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hey wake up,,, most states have these rules.  This IS why beer cans are tossed over…… why carry around evidence.  In Illinois it is that way……. Texas is apparently still civilized. kw That excuse doesn’t hold beer.  Some states have such laws while others don’t but you wouldn’t be able to tell which is which from the beer can litter on the water, or anywhere else, for that matter.  Personally, I think that states should raise beer can deposits to $2 per can. Then, if the drinkers are still too lazy, there will at least be a substantial incentive for others to pick up after them.  Who knows, someone might even get a franchise going, something like "Surrogate Mothers of America", with the slogan "We’re still picking up after you !" greg pavlov  [not affiliated with Canisius College]

I share the same sentiments of raising the deposits on beer/liquor containers up in the "$$$" range. This would make people think twice about chucking their cans anywhere.

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WAS FLY FISHING I COUNTED A NUMBER OF POP AND BEER CANS WHICH WERE FLOATING DOWN SREAM FROM THE DAM.

I can totaly relate to your post…. There are alot of lazy ass people whom continue to carelessly polute our rivers & lakes…I have picked up other people’s garbage numerous times!! It’s just pure outright laziness!!!!    .  +  * _    *   + .  *   + .      . *    )O/(     *    .  *   + .                                            . + . . (o o)     + .  *   + .   . * .         . *.  /._. ***STAR*** ~ .                                             + .  ~~~  . * . +

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I have picked up other people’s garbage numerous times!! It’s just pure outright laziness!!!!

One of my favorite fishing spots has been lost forever due to trash left by other fisherman. The landowner even posted signs warning people that he would close the area if the littering continued. The next signs he put up were " No Trespassing- Violaters will be Prosecuted". I have talked to him and tried to get permission to fish. His response " blame it on your fellow fisherman".

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WAS FLY FISHING I COUNTED A NUMBER OF POP AND BEER CANS WHICH WERE FLOATING DOWN SREAM FROM THE DAM.

If you pick up someone’s beer cans, then you could get arrested for suspicion of having consumed alcohol on the water and that is likely why the cans are in the water in the first place….. I have witnessed guides in Canada sinking cans in the lakes as soon as the beer is consumed for just this reason. kw

Response:

If you pick up someone’s beer cans, then you could get arrested for suspicion of having consumed alcohol on the water and that is likely why the cans are in the water in the first place…..

Well, I live in Texas USA not in Canada.. There are no laws here in Texas which govern the amount of beer cans you have in possesion as long as you are not boating intoxicated…So there is NO excuse for littering our waters at all!!! I have witnessed guides in Canada sinking cans in the lakes as soon as the beer is consumed for just this reason.

Well, if this is true then good luck to the future Canadian fishermen because there wont be any clean fishing areas left & that is very sad….    .  +  * _    *   + .  *   + .      . *    )O/(     *    .  *   + .                                            . + . . (o o)     + .  *   + .   . * .         . *.  /._. ***STAR*** ~ .                                             + .  ~~~  . * . +

Response:

I think all of you missed my point!!! It’s not just beer cans it’s garbage in general. the point I was trying  to make is that we all have to do our part to clean things up!!!  You can’t blame people….You have to take action. Next time you see some garbage PICK IT UP!!! Set an example that it’s the IN thing to do!!! Show kids it’s cool to clean up even if it’s not yours!! TEACH BY EXAMPLE!!!! It is easy to sit here and write about it. DO IT!!!! So enough said, I thought I’d get a positive response, not a blame it on someone else session. THANK YOU TO ALL WHO READ THIS AND UNDERSTOOD WHAT I SAID AND PICKED UP  SOME GARBAGE THE LAST TIME THEY FOUND SOME!

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I STOOD IN MY WADERS THIS EVENING IN A RIVER NOT FAR FROM MY HOUSE. IT IS A RIVER NOTED FOR SMALL MOUTH BASS, CATFISH, WALLEYE, MUSKIE , PIKE , PANFISH, ALL WHICH ARE ABUNDANT. AS I WAS FLY FISHING I COUNTED A NUMBER OF POP AND BEER CANS WHICH WERE FLOATING DOWN SREAM FROM THE DAM. THERE WAS A  GROUP OF FISHERMAN WHO WERE NEAR THE DAM FISHING UNDER THE FROTH FOR CATFISH I SUPPOSE. I’M NOT HERE TO BLAME ANYONE…… BUT I STARTED TO THINK OF HOW FAR THE RIVER HAS COME FROM WHAT IT WAS. I USED TO HEAR ABOUT THE RIVER AND HOW DIRTY IT WAS. THERE WERE NO FISH AND SO ON. TODAY THE RIVER IS A TROPHY FISHERY THANKS TO THE WORK OF MANY VOLUNTEERS AND PEOPLE LIKE YOU AND ME. SO THIS IS JUST A REMINDER TO LEAVE THE AREA YOU FISH BETTER THAN THE WAY YOU FOUND IT. PICK UP SOME TRASH AND THROW IT AWAY….EVEN IF IT’S NOT YOURS. REMEMBER TO EDUCATE THE YOUNG AND SHOW THEM BY EXAMPLE LIKE MY FATHER DID. LET’S TRY TO MAKE AN EXTRA EFFORT TO CONTINUE TO MAKE OUR RIVERS, LAKES , PONDS AND STREAMS BETTER PLACES TO FISH FOR EVERYONE!!                                                        BECAUSE I LOVE TO FISH!!

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Question:

Next week I’m finally taking that trip up the Little Kern to Golden Trout country that me and my fishing buddy have been talking about for two years.  Plan to take the forks of the Kern Trail down to the forks, then pack in from there for a couple of days.  Anyone have any useful info for fishing the area this time of year.  Flies, good campsites, etc.? —                                                            -dnc-

Response:

Next week I’m finally taking that trip up the Little Kern to Golden Trout country that me and my fishing buddy have been talking about for two years.  Plan to take the forks of the Kern Trail down to the forks, then pack in from there for a couple of days.  Anyone have any useful info for fishing the area this time of year.  Flies, good campsites, etc.?

Years ago I fished the main stem of the Kern, from Junction Meadow up to Lake South America–very similar countryside to where you’re going.  (I accessed the area from the Whitney Portal trail.)  As I recall, there were good campsites just about everywhere.  I was in my attractor fly phase, and I caught tons of rainbows and goldens using mainly just a bi-visible.  I’d fish a fly until it was chewed beyond recognition, tie on another, and keep catching them.  I even kept on catching them during an afternoon thunder shower (ducking under a tree during the worst of it, then continuing after the lightning had moved up the canyon).  These were wild fish, and they weren’t at all picky.  You can probably get by using generic sorts of attractors: Adams, Humpy, bi-visibles, hare’s ear nymphs, zug bugs, PTs, etc., and some black Muddlers for lakes.  Smaller sizes are probably best. What I remember best was the bear that I saw one morning.  I had fished upstream a considerable distance from my camp on the opposite side of the river, when a black bear ambled by on the far side, heading upstream.  He never saw me, until I let him get a couple of hundred feet above me, and I whistled.  The bear stopped, looked around a moment, until he spotted me.  We held eye contact for a moment, then he continued on.  Since he’d come from the direction of my camp, I was concerned, but there was not much I could do after the fact–so, angler that I am, I kept on fishing.  Later, I crossed over, and back tracked the bear toward my camp.  I was amazed to discover that the bear’s tracks had made a wide circle *around* my camp, in an obvious attempt to avoid contact with humans (that would be me, such as it is). Understandable, certainly, but I never counted on that happening again. Even though my next day’s hike took my upstream also, I didn’t spot the bear again.  (And, oh yes, I have had California black bears in camp, trying to get my food, on other trips.  Usually they’re pretty benign; shouting, banging pots and pans, throwing rocks will run them off.  I insanely chased a bear out of camp one morning.  I chased him up to the top of a hill.  I was stone out of breath, he was still fresh, and acted like he wanted to play some more.  I skedaddled.) The moral of this story is to always exercise the best "bear discipline" you can while in bear country; and you’ll catch lots of fish, too. Enjoy your trip, Anglerboy — Trout fear me, Women want me. http://www.midtown.net/~angler/

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Question:

Hi Dan – Glad to se you are on-line again. Missed you while you were out – but I went to ASU ! bob

Hey Bob, Sorry, didn’t mean it as a slam against ASU.  I was making fun of his "gotta get some weapons" post to the fly fishing newsgroup.  I just happened to know that Arizona State is in that area because my daughter lived in Mesa for a while.  I figured this guy was a student there and wondered if his parents knew what he was doing – possibly with the school money.  Didn’t mean anything by it  8^                                                Oops!                                                   Dan Dan Gracia                                                               Orvis West Coast Fly Fishing Schools If you kill that big fish you can’t catch ‘em again.  So what if they eat other fish?  If you kill the big ones there will only be little ones left (funny how that works!).

Response:

Hi Dan – Glad to se you are on-line again. Missed you while you were out – but I went to ASU ! bob – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – (Allan Gay) writes:     I live in Arizona and I am looking into purchasing a crossbow just to shoot for fun and possibly at pigs during the handgun season.  If you have a used crossbow that you want to sell respond to me personally with a description of what crossbow you have and how much you are willing to sell it for.  I live in mesa, I am ready to buy right now, don’t waste time e-mailing me, I want to start shooting as soon as possible,  I pay in cash. with a description and whatever price you want for it.   I will get back to all of you.  I am serious, I am ready to pay cash right now for a recurve or crossbow or if you have both.  E-mail me right now for jims, any other cool toys you might have.  I do not personally want the slim jim but i have a friend who will pay for one and any books on how to use them.  e-mail me with any info on anything you want to sell, you might be surprised at what i will buy!!!!! You betcha!! we got ‘em.  Use ‘em mostly over here to shoot carp and squawfish.  Have a special today on the whitefish model though only for resident Montanans and Oregonians. YOu must be going to Arizona State right?  Does your mother know you are doing these things?????                                       8^                                            Dan Dan Gracia                                                               Orvis West Coast Fly Fishing Schools If you kill that big fish you can’t catch ‘em again.  So what if they eat other fish?  If you kill the big ones there will only be little ones left (funny how that works!).

– Dr. Robert K. Sato Catalytica Inc. 430 Ferguson Drive Mountain View, CA  94043   USA Voice:  (415)940-6375 Fax:    (415)960-0127

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -(Allan Gay) writes:     I live in Arizona and I am looking into purchasing a crossbow just to shoot for fun and possibly at pigs during the handgun season.  If you have a used crossbow that you want to sell respond to me personally with a description of what crossbow you have and how much you are willing to sell it for.  I live in mesa, I am ready to buy right now, don’t waste time e-mailing me, I want to start shooting as soon as possible,  I pay in cash. with a description and whatever price you want for it.   I will get back to all of you.  I am serious, I am ready to pay cash right now for a recurve or crossbow or if you have both.  E-mail me right now for jims, any other cool toys you might have.  I do not personally want the slim jim but i have a friend who will pay for one and any books on how to use them.  e-mail me with any info on anything you want to sell, you might be surprised at what i will buy!!!!!

You betcha!! we got ‘em.  Use ‘em mostly over here to shoot carp and squawfish.  Have a special today on the whitefish model though only for resident Montanans and Oregonians. YOu must be going to Arizona State right?  Does your mother know you are doing these things?????                                       8^                                            Dan Dan Gracia                                                               Orvis West Coast Fly Fishing Schools If you kill that big fish you can’t catch ‘em again.  So what if they eat other fish?  If you kill the big ones there will only be little ones left (funny how that works!).

Response:

     I live in Arizona and I am looking into purchasing a crossbow just to shoot for fun and possibly at pigs during the handgun season.  If you have a used crossbow that you want to sell respond to me personally with a description of what crossbow you have and how much you are willing to sell it for.  I live in mesa, I am ready to buy right now, don’t waste time e-mailing me, I want to start shooting as soon as possible,  I pay in cash. with a description and whatever price you want for it.   I will get back to all of you.  I am serious, I am ready to pay cash right now for a recurve or crossbow or if you have both.  E-mail me right now for  any other cool toys you might have.  I do not personally want the slim jim but i have a friend who will pay for one and any books on how to use them.  e-mail me with any info on anything you want to sell, you might be surprised at what i will buy!!!!!

Response:

Question:

You want: Trout and Salmon Rivers and Lochs of Scotland Bruce Sandison Merlin Unwin Books.

Question:

I will be relocating to the Balt. area in July, probably NW of the city. Does anyone know how the fishing is in that area? Is there a TU group there? Also could use some info. on places to live. The only thing I’m locked into is the Balt. area, so I’m flexable as to where I can move. Preferably somewhere that has a great trout stream in my backyard! Thanks

Response:

I will be relocating to the Balt. area in July, probably NW of the city. Does anyone know how the fishing is in that area? Is there a TU group there? Also could use some info. on places to live. The only thing I’m locked into is the Balt. area, so I’m flexable as to where I can move. Preferably somewhere that has a great trout stream in my backyard!

I attended my first meeting of the Gaithersburg, Md Chapter of TU last night. The guest speaker was a Professional Fly Casting Instructor whoes home waters are the Patapsco River which emptys into Baltimore Habor. He lives in Ellicott City, MD (on the Patapsco) and seemed very knowledgable. His name is Philip Krista (410-461-3007). — Alvin E. Crane 512 Suffield Drive Gaithersburg, MD 20878-2679 Voice: 301-208-8114  Fax: 301-208-8681

Response:

The Patapsco above Ellicott City (more specifically RT. 40 bridge to the dam at Daniels) is a ball to fish for smallmouths and redeyes.  It’s a small stream, easy to wade and full of fish.  Favorite stretch?  The 100 yard stretch below the island at the steel bridge at Old Frederick Rd.   The stream bed is full of junk tires, and there’s a bass in the middle of every one.  Yellow marabou muddler minnows, #6 or 8.  Don’t forget the Potomac River, either.  It’s within an hour of Baltimore, and great to float or wade.  

Response:

Question:

I most certainly a novice at Fly fishing, but I catch enough fish and have fun. The other day though I caught a fellow angler looking down his nose at me like I was some sort of kook. I had a fish on the line (a little one as is my usual luck) and was reeling it in.  I later saw this gentleman bringng hsi fish in by pulling the line with his free hand and letting it tangle around his legs. I was raised as a spin fisherman, so my instinct is to use the reel. I also know both sides of the argumant and have seen and heard many experts advocate fishing fighting both ways (reel or hand). So my question is, what really is the best way. I mostly fish for trout in the 8 to 18 inch range, though 12 to 14 is about average for around here. I also catch bass on the same rod. Pulling the line can be a pain, but so can trying to reel up the extra line  after setting the hook before the fish takes off.  – Thanks –Grant in PA

Response:

I generally let the fish decide!  Seriously, I let the fish pull the line out until I’m on the reel, then play it from there.  If it’s a wee one, I generally pull it in by hand.  The important thing is to get the fish to hand, using whatever technique works best at the moment. — Jim Benenson                 Los Alamos, New Mexico, USA "To protect your rivers, protect your mountains"       Emperor Yu of China, circa 1600 B.C.

Response:

writes: – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I most certainly a novice at Fly fishing, but I catch enough fish and have fun. The other day though I caught a fellow angler looking down his nose at me like I was some sort of kook. I had a fish on the line (a little one as is my usual luck) and was reeling it in.  I later saw this gentleman bringng hsi fish in by pulling the line with his free hand and letting it tangle around his legs. I was raised as a spin fisherman, so my instinct is to use the reel. I also know both sides of the argumant and have seen and heard many experts advocate fishing fighting both ways (reel or hand). So my question is, what really is the best way. I mostly fish for trout in the 8 to 18 inch range, though 12 to 14 is about average for around here. I also catch bass on the same rod. Pulling the line can be a pain, but so can trying to reel up the extra line  after setting the hook before the fish takes off. — Thanks –Grant in PA

Grant, it is a good habit to get the fish on the reel as quickly as possible.  If the fish you have on is large, you will have more control, more mobility, reduce line ware and lessor chance of fly line wraping around any and all weeds, twigs, etc. Fight fish that are either large, on in heavy water require the fisher person to be opposit the fish or below the fish for control measures.   Try and do the above with line around your feet. Best of Luck Joe

Response:

First rule of thumb, do what is easiest and most comfortable for YOU. don’t let anyone "look down his nose at you" because you are doing something the WRONG way. If you are used to playing a fish on the reel, do so, this will especially help when you catch a larger fish. The drag on your reel was designed to help you with this. Smaller fish can be played by just stipping line, but again there really is no right or wrong way. TieFlie

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Question:

I am just begining to become addicted to fly fishing, having long ago given up the lowly bait fishing.  I have gotten some valuable information regarding casting and fly selection …. but I can’t seem to find a good resource about different retrieve techniques.  All of the reference material centers around casting and presentation (usually in a stream setting), and nary a word about what to do once you get the fly out there.  I am interested in any info about fishing wet flys and what to do on the retrieve.  Any suggestions?  

Response:

writes: (deleted) I am interested in any info about fishing wet flys and what to do on the retrieve.  Any suggestions?  

Get a copy of Ernest Schweibert’s "Trout Strategies", Published by E.P.Dutton, ISBN 0-525-48052-8.  He discusses numerous fishing and retrieval techniques for Wets, Drys, Bucktail/Streamers and Nymphs. You might also see if you can find a copy of "Wet Fly Fishing Treated Methodically", by E.M. Tod, Published in England in 1918 by Sampson Low; Marston & Company. Tod is the Proper English Aristocratic type who eschews the use of the Dry Fly. Guy Manning

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