Question:

I was given my first fly rod …. a cheap cane one bought at Sears …. a Ted Williams or something, as I recall I took it to Yellowstone in 1970 on vacation and caught my first fly caught trout …. and it changed my life. What was the "value" of that old "cheap, give away’ rod?     To me, it has been priceless …. the rod, itself is long gone…. but, what it started grows faster each passing year… a love of trout, fly fishing, and the places both require About 20 years ago I gave a ‘kid" that worked for me an old Fenwick glass fly rod, I had "advanced" to graphite.    To make a long story short, he got hooked, went to school in fisheries biology, and now works for  Fish and Game.    I just got a phone call from him, to tell me where the ducks and geese where at, in case I wanted a good hunt, in a little known spot. The value of the old glass rod?…. well, what is somehing that points a young person towards a good career worth?  What is an "insider" phone call worth when the fishing gets hot?… I get several a year because of that rod. A number of  years ago, a fellow, then in his 80’s,  that I barely knew gave me an E.C. Powell rod and told me it’s history.  To my "why me?" he answered, " I saw you fishing Silver Creek, and it’s rare to see a person enjoying the sport that much, I walked by you within feet and you never even noticed, you were totally absorbed, in your fishing.   The rod comes with a requirement …do no ‘collect’ this rod.   I’m giving it to you becasue I want it FISHED, not collected." I do fish it, too, a few times each year.  It could be "collected"…  Walton Powell, wanted it for his collection when he was still alive.   But, when I get to the point where I can’t fish it, you will see me walking the banks, looking for the right person to pass it on to …. and he will be told to fish it, not collect it. Got an old rod, that you don’t really use?  Consider giving it to a "kid" …. even if it’s "just a rod" to you, it won’t be to him, if it gets him out on the streams Got a valuable collectors item …. at least consider fishing it, now and then.   Imho, that is the best way to honor it’s maker

Response:

  A number of  years ago, a fellow, then in his 80’s,  that I barely knew gave me an E.C. Powell rod and told me it’s history.  To my "why me?" he answered, " I saw you fishing Silver Creek, and it’s rare to see a person enjoying the sport that much, I walked by you within feet and you never even noticed, you were totally absorbed, in your fishing.   The rod comes with a requirement …do no ‘collect’ this rod.   I’m giving it to you becasue I want it FISHED, not collected."

Your settings are right on the mark, Larry.

Response:

Larry, Were you born on March 25th 1945 ? — Bill Kiene Kiene’s Fly Shop Sacramento, CA, USA www.kiene.com   I was given my first fly rod …. a cheap cane one bought at Sears …. a Ted Williams or something, as I recall   I took it to Yellowstone in 1970 on vacation and caught my first fly caught trout …. and it changed my life.   What was the "value" of that old "cheap, give away’ rod?     To me, it has been priceless …. the rod, itself is long gone…. but, what it started grows faster each passing year… a love of trout, fly fishing, and the places both require   About 20 years ago I gave a ‘kid" that worked for me an old Fenwick glass fly rod, I had "advanced" to graphite.    To make a long story short, he got hooked, went to school in fisheries biology, and now works for  Fish and Game.    I just got a phone call from him, to tell me where the ducks and geese where at, in case I wanted a good hunt, in a little known spot.   The value of the old glass rod?…. well, what is somehing that points a young person towards a good career worth?  What is an "insider" phone call worth when the fishing gets hot?… I get several a year because of that rod.   A number of  years ago, a fellow, then in his 80’s,  that I barely knew gave me an E.C. Powell rod and told me it’s history.  To my "why me?" he answered, " I saw you fishing Silver Creek, and it’s rare to see a person enjoying the sport that much, I walked by you within feet and you never even noticed, you were totally absorbed, in your fishing.   The rod comes with a requirement …do no ‘collect’ this rod.   I’m giving it to you becasue I want it FISHED, not collected."   I do fish it, too, a few times each year.  It could be "collected"…  Walton Powell, wanted it for his collection when he was still alive.   But, when I get to the point where I can’t fish it, you will see me walking the banks, looking for the right person to pass it on to …. and he will be told to fish it, not collect it.   Got an old rod, that you don’t really use?  Consider giving it to a "kid" …. even if it’s "just a rod" to you, it won’t be to him, if it gets him out on the streams   Got a valuable collectors item …. at least consider fishing it, now and then.   Imho, that is the best way to honor it’s maker

Response:

  Larry,   Were you born on March 25th 1945 ?   —   ahhh…pretty close…right age group, for sure.   but, I don’t know the significance of that date … am I being dumber than my normal, very dumb, self ???  

Response:

Question:

    i think the problem lies with bad leader material.  leaders "age", and become absurdly brittle and weak, even in packaging.  the damn stuff has probably been on the shelf at wallyworld for five or six years.  go to a decent specialty shop and get new leader material.     otherwise, i think it’s your knots.  i have desperately tried to snap flies off on the back cast, and i just can’t do it.  hell, maybe you just have a special talent…

Excuse me, may I help you?  Oh, I see.  Well, you turned left into "Leader Minutia" by mistake.  Go back down the hallway you came up, make a left by the drinking fountain, head for the sign that says "Actually Fishing Outdoors", and then past the restrooms, and right into "Turning A Nice Phrase".  Don’t mention it, have a nice day.

Response:

 Check your leader often, especially if you see a messy cast.

hmmm….this will be bad news for anyone fishing with me… you boys’ll be doin a whole lot of leader checks… jeff (purely messy)

Response:

…from my experience, cloning ain’t required…damned things are everywhere already…and around water? well, you probably haven’t seen the movie and don’t know the reproductive methods of gremlins, but…let’s just say it doesn’t look good for fisherpeople… jeff (creator of "the gremlin defense" – royalties required, unauthorized use or duplication will be punishable by law, bycracky) – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – … gremlins…….caught a glimpse of one once…looked sorta like a tiny waldo-wolfgang thing….. Nasty little buggers from all I’ve heard. Wolfgang and the BAD news is we got the technology to clone!      

Response:

It might be that the back cast is low enough to actually hit the water or the ground, then there’s no need for special talents to break off the fly. Most of the guys that I’ve helped with their casting technique had one common problem, their back cast was way too low. But for this problem to appear again and again, I would also guess that the leader is the problem. /Roger

I agree with both points. I have occasionally broken the hook off the fly by letting it hit the rocks behind me. What really makes that a great trick is to continue fishing with the hookless fly. Makes it a bit more of a sporting challenge! Bob — http://rwpatton.home.netcom.com/

Response:

By the way, I live in McKinney about 30 miles or so north of Dallas. Thanks again, Nick Wright

Dale gave you an excellent tip re: the FWFF event in September, and what sounded suspiciously like an invite to Backwoods for the Roadkill Roundup.  You could gain quite a bit by attending either, and moreso by attending both.  If you’d like, drop me an email, and I’ll try to provide as much "local" info as I can. TC, R

Response:

Check your leader often, especially if you see a messy cast. Remove the overhand knots before they tighten.  Don’t delay cutting knots out of the leader and rebuilding it.

Great advice! I saved a lot of time and frustration once I started noticing my messy casts right away and dealing with it before it became an unmanageable mess.  You can untangle things (usually) fairly easily if you stop casting right away. A guide told me the minute rule (ok, maybe 30 seconds)…if you can’t fix it in under (a minute), then cut and redo… you’ll save time, be happier and get your fly on the water… which is the only way you can catch fish. — Rob (of course, fixing messy casting is another problem alltogether…)

Response:

Nick,     Ssounds to me like the whole outfit has been sitting around for a long time…I don’t know why floating line would sink rapidly unless it was old…..Also, there are several sites you can visit to learn to tie different types of knots, buy books, post messages, buy equipment, etc. http://www.flyanglersonline.com/   they have a beginners’ section http://www.thejump.net/fishing/fishing.html  fishin’ knots & other things And here are some links that may be helpful: http://flyfishing.miningco.com/ http://www.njflyfishing.com/ http://www.roundrocks.com/rocks/html/misc.html I’m sure all the others here can also help you a lot…keep at it, ask a lot of questions & PRACTICE!!! Graden

Response:

… gremlins…….caught a glimpse of one once…looked sorta like a tiny waldo-wolfgang thing…..

Nasty little buggers from all I’ve heard. Wolfgang and the BAD news is we got the technology to clone!      

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Could it be that you’re snapping the fly off on the backcast? If you put too much energy into it you can crack the line like a whip, and the fly goes hell knows where. Bob Just what I was thinking.  Put a little mark with a marker on the knot and tippet just above the fly to determine if this is happening if you can’t easily tell.  Does it appear, by looking at the tippet end, if the knot is untying, or is the end, once the fly is gone, a "clean" end? Where in N. Texas are you located?  If you’re near the DFW area, there are a number of instructors (Main Street Outfitters, in FW, for one), and a couple of FFing clubs that might provide some help.  IMO, instruction, particularly professional instruction, will provide dividends beyond the cost incurred (see a recent related thread on this very topic).  If you are comfortable with doing so, reply with a general location – there are several regulars in the general Fort Worth-Dallas <G area. TC, R

Thanks for all the advice. Thinking back on it, this may very well be what I was doing. I had not thought about it before. But that would explain why the leader looked as though it had been cut rather than the knot simply coming undone. I’m going to get all new line for my rod. The "floating fly line" that came with it sinks very rapidly, and it did not come with backing. So I’ll buy some new lines and leaders (hopefully this will help a little) and I’ll continue practicing my casting. Another question semi-related. I’m going to buy the leaders that come tapered instead of tying my own, in this case how necessary is it to have a tippet? By the way, I live in McKinney about 30 miles or so north of Dallas. Thanks again, Nick Wright

Response:

Another question semi-related. I’m going to buy the leaders that come tapered instead of tying my own, in this case how necessary is it to have a tippet?

Knotless tapered leaders are good, but you will definitely need to get some tippet.  Every time you tie on a fly you’re going to lose some material and by tying on some tippet you can delay replacing the leader.  I remember when I was starting out – I ended up changing leaders quite often until I solved my tailing loops (if you see lots of overhand knots all through your leader you are throwing a tailing loop) in which case adding tippet is not as big an issue<g.  Check your leader often, especially if you see a messy cast. Remove the overhand knots before they tighten.  Don’t delay cutting knots out of the leader and rebuilding it. What length and weight leader/tippet to use is an important question.  For most of the fishing I do (panfish, small bass, small trout) I get by with a 7 foot 4x tapered leader with 4x and/or 5x tippet added on.  I carry spools or 4x through 7x tippet for modifying the end of the leader as needed. –Stan

Response:

As a newbie of one year My most difficult time learning  was trying to forget I didn’t have a spinning rod with weights Easy does it grasshopper. Let the rod and line do the work — Fly Fisherman With a Furless Naked Cat named Dub.

Response:

that come tapered instead of tying my own, in this case how necessary is it to have a tippet? By the way, I live in McKinney about 30 miles or so north of Dallas.

I live in Plano. You need to buy a spool of tippet material. When fishing for bluegill around here I simply buy a 7.5 foot tapered 3x leader and immediately tie on a couple of feet of 4x tippet material. The waters we fish have so much stuff growing in the water that you gather a bowl of salad on each knott on a regular basis. By the time you leave a couple of flies in trees and snap a couple of flies off on the casts and change flies a couple of times you will need to replace the tippet with another couple of feet of tippet. It is no problem as a roll of tippet material lasts for a couple of years anyway and it is a good idea to replace it every couple of years anyway. BTW the Roadkill Roundtable meets each Saturday morning to tie flies and tell lies at Backwoods in the southeast corner of Campbell and Coit in Richardson. Come join us for a bs session anytime you want.We are a kind of a splinter group of The Dallas Flyfisher Club and the guys that work at the shop are always available to answer any questions. Ron manages the shop and Marshal works there and they are very knowledgable. Big Dale

Response:

nick – you’ve gotten plenty of good opinions, but you’ll soon discover the truth… gremlins.  damn things been plaguing all aspects of my flyfishing.  caught a glimpse of one once…looked sorta like a tiny waldo-wolfgang thing. they can tie knots in the tippet, snag flies in trees, pull rod tips into closing doors or ceiling fans, push you down into the water in front of your fishing companions just as you’re stepping into a stream…oh the horrors you’re in for now!!  you’ll love every moment – well, most of em. (my opinion… big fly, light or bad tippet, too powerful snapping and too soon on the forward casting stroke.) jeff – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello, my name is Nick I live in North Texas. My wife recently bought me the little $20 kit from WalMart since I’ve been wanting to try flyfishing. I’ve just about got the knack of fly casting (at least short distances), by practicing in my yard with a small piece of cloth tied on. My question is this, I took it out to the water tonight to give it a "real world" go and I ran into a problem. The flies would not stay tied to the leader. I tried the improved clinch and also the double clinch and without fail after about 5-6 casts the fly would be gone. I know that I’m tying these knots correctly. So I’m wondering where the problem can be? The little piece of cloth I’ve used for practice never once came off. Is it possible that the leader that came with the kit is either just really bad or possibly really old? Will getting a new leader solve my problem? Or are clinch knots not the proper way to tie on? Thanks for any advice. Nick Wright

Response:

Hello, my name is Nick I live in North Texas. My wife recently bought me the little $20 kit from WalMart since I’ve been wanting to try flyfishing. I’ve just about got the knack of fly casting (at least short distances), by practicing in my yard with a small piece of cloth tied on. My question is this, I took it out to the water tonight to give it a "real world" go and I ran into a problem. The flies would not stay tied to the leader. I tried the improved clinch and also the double clinch and without fail after about 5-6 casts the fly would be gone. I know that I’m tying these knots correctly. So I’m wondering where the problem can be? The little piece of cloth I’ve used for practice never once came off. Is it possible that the leader that came with the kit is either just really bad or possibly really old? Will getting a new leader solve my problem? Or are clinch knots not the proper way to tie on? Thanks for any advice. Nick Wright

Response:

Could it be that you’re snapping the fly off on the backcast? If you put too much energy into it you can crack the line like a whip, and the fly goes hell knows where. Bob — http://rwpatton.home.netcom.com/

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello, my name is Nick I live in North Texas. My wife recently bought me the little $20 kit from WalMart since I’ve been wanting to try flyfishing. I’ve just about got the knack of fly casting (at least short distances), by practicing in my yard with a small piece of cloth tied on. My question is this, I took it out to the water tonight to give it a "real world" go and I ran into a problem. The flies would not stay tied to the leader. I tried the improved clinch and also the double clinch and without fail after about 5-6 casts the fly would be gone. I know that I’m tying these knots correctly. So I’m wondering where the problem can be? The little piece of cloth I’ve used for practice never once came off. Is it possible that the leader that came with the kit is either just really bad or possibly really old? Will getting a new leader solve my problem? Or are clinch knots not the proper way to tie on? Thanks for any advice. Nick Wright

Response:

Could it be that you’re snapping the fly off on the backcast? If you put too much energy into it you can crack the line like a whip, and the fly goes hell knows where. Bob

Just what I was thinking.  Put a little mark with a marker on the knot and tippet just above the fly to determine if this is happening if you can’t easily tell.  Does it appear, by looking at the tippet end, if the knot is untying, or is the end, once the fly is gone, a "clean" end? Where in N. Texas are you located?  If you’re near the DFW area, there are a number of instructors (Main Street Outfitters, in FW, for one), and a couple of FFing clubs that might provide some help.  IMO, instruction, particularly professional instruction, will provide dividends beyond the cost incurred (see a recent related thread on this very topic).  If you are comfortable with doing so, reply with a general location – there are several regulars in the general Fort Worth-Dallas <G area. TC, R

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello, my name is Nick I live in North Texas. My wife recently bought me the little $20 kit from WalMart since I’ve been wanting to try flyfishing. I’ve just about got the knack of fly casting (at least short distances), by practicing in my yard with a small piece of cloth tied on. My question is this, I took it out to the water tonight to give it a "real world" go and I ran into a problem. The flies would not stay tied to the leader. I tried the improved clinch and also the double clinch and without fail after about 5-6 casts the fly would be gone. I know that I’m tying these knots correctly. So I’m wondering where the problem can be? The little piece of cloth I’ve used for practice never once came off. Is it possible that the leader that came with the kit is either just really bad or possibly really old? Will getting a new leader solve my problem? Or are clinch knots not the proper way to tie on? Thanks for any advice. Nick Wright

Most likely you are snapping them off.  Untutored beginners frequently show a natural tendency to crack a fly line like a whip.  The correction is a matter of timing.  You are probably starting the forward cast too early and overpowering it, causing the fly to accelerate to supersonic speed in a small fraction of a second….more stress than the tippet can handle.  It didn’t happen with the piece of cloth because it’s greater air resistance simply wouldn’t allow that kind of acceleration.  Watch you back cast.  Don’t start the forward motion until the line extends completely to the rear. If possible, get an experienced caster to coach you.  If not, take lessons or rent videos and practice, practice, practice. Wolfgang

Response:

"Wolfgang Siebeneich" Most likely you are snapping them off.  Untutored beginners frequently show a natural tendency to crack a fly line like a whip.  The correction is a matter of timing.  You are probably starting the forward cast too early and overpowering it, causing the fly to accelerate to supersonic speed in a small fraction of a second….more stress than the tippet can handle.  It didn’t happen with the piece of cloth because it’s greater air resistance simply wouldn’t allow that kind of acceleration.  Watch you back cast.  Don’t start the forward motion until the line extends completely to the rear. If possible, get an experienced caster to coach you.  If not, take lessons or rent videos and practice, practice, practice.

I had virtually the same thing written out to send and then thought I’d check and see if it was already in the thread. What he said! Clark

Response:

Could it be that you’re snapping the fly off on the backcast? If you put too much energy into it you can crack the line like a whip, and the fly goes hell knows where. Bob

Good advice. Is it possible that the leader that came with the kit is either just really bad or possibly really old? Will getting a new leader solve my problem? Or are clinch knots not the proper way to tie on? Thanks for any advice.

The leader could weak. If in doubt, you don’t have to buy a new leader. Buy a spool of 5x tippet and learn to tie about a 18" to 24" piece onto the leader with a double surgeon’s knot. You should be doing that anyway. Cut the leader back to a thicker diameter first. It wouldn’t hurt to replace the whole leader, though. Did you say you paid $20 for this outfit? A decent store-bought leader will cost a quarter of that, but you can tie up your own, after spending more than $20 on materials. Then you can look into buying fly-tying materials, and then you can build your own rods. Eventually, you might build a drift boat and even knit your own waders. The possibilities are endless.

Response:

Hello, my name is Nick I live in North Texas. My wife recently bought me the little $20 kit from WalMart

    i think the problem lies with bad leader material.  leaders "age", and become absurdly brittle and weak, even in packaging.  the damn stuff has probably been on the shelf at wallyworld for five or six years.  go to a decent specialty shop and get new leader material.     otherwise, i think it’s your knots.  i have desperately tried to snap flies off on the back cast, and i just can’t do it.  hell, maybe you just have a special talent… wayno

Response:

I’ve seen a lot of people do it Wayne. But I agree, the leader is probably shot which exasperates the problem. Clark

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello, my name is Nick I live in North Texas. My wife recently bought me the little $20 kit from WalMart     i think the problem lies with bad leader material.  leaders "age", and become absurdly brittle and weak, even in packaging.  the damn stuff has probably been on the shelf at wallyworld for five or six years.  go to a decent specialty shop and get new leader material.     otherwise, i think it’s your knots.  i have desperately tried to snap flies off on the back cast, and i just can’t do it.  hell, maybe you just have a special talent… wayno

Response:

It might be that the back cast is low enough to actually hit the water or the ground, then there’s no need for special talents to break off the fly. Most of the guys that I’ve helped with their casting technique had one common problem, their back cast was way too low. But for this problem to appear again and again, I would also guess that the leader is the problem. /Roger

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello, my name is Nick I live in North Texas. My wife recently bought me the little $20 kit from WalMart     i think the problem lies with bad leader material.  leaders "age", and become absurdly brittle and weak, even in packaging.  the damn stuff has probably been on the shelf at wallyworld for five or six years.  go to a decent specialty shop and get new leader material.     otherwise, i think it’s your knots.  i have desperately tried to snap flies off on the back cast, and i just can’t do it.  hell, maybe you just have a special talent… wayno

Response:

I don’t know where you live in North Texas, but you might want to check out an event that the Fort Worth FlyFishers Club is involved with that will happen on Sept 21. It is called the Trinity FlyFest and it will include casting lessons. For more information go to WWW. FortWorth FlyFishers.com. The Dallas club does not have an event scheuled in the near future which includes fly casting lessons because our next event is our annual club auction on Sept.21. You might just t ask at the Dallas Orvis Store. There is usualy someone there that will give any customer some casting tips and demonstration  in their parking lot. It is a lot easier to work these kind of problems in person rather than on the net. Contact me if I can be any help. Big Dale  

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Question:

Our Sir Louie goes by many handles but he just acquied a new one today – "Captain Carp."  We *were*supposed to be steelhead fishing but carp proved to be a bigger attraction. He caught him on a #12 stonefly at the base of the dam in Caledonia. Peter

Response:

Yes and Joe F. caught a small mouth by the tail while salmon fishing on friday, Opppps oh no it’s a sucker ( 12" sucker ) Vern

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Our Sir Louie goes by many handles but he just acquied a new one today – "Captain Carp."  We *were*supposed to be steelhead fishing but carp proved to be a bigger attraction. He caught him on a #12 stonefly at the base of the dam in Caledonia. Peter

Response:

Yes and Joe F. caught a small mouth by the tail while salmon fishing on friday, Opppps oh no it’s a sucker ( 12" sucker )

Yep, it’s true.   Not that I could deny it, since I caught it just updtream of the bridge in front of a dozen witnesses.  (Just don’t start calling me "Captain Sucker".)   Joe F. (Good, now I can leave that out of my trip report.)

Response:

the bridge in front of a dozen witnesses.  (Just don’t start calling me "Captain Sucker".)   Joe F. (Good, now I can leave that out of my trip report.)

Since this won’t be part of the trip report we just hafta ask the questions here! What kinda fly were you using while sucker fishing? Were you sucker fishing down and across, upstream-dead-drift, downstream with a twitching retrieve? What’s a sucker fishing license cost in NY?  Where are the best waters to sucker fish?!  Do you know America’s best sucker fishing rivers? And, lastly, for those who are sure to ask.  What weight sucker fishing rod were you using?  What is the best sucker fishing line? What reel do you recommend for sucker fishing? — Wayne (just helping you to keep it all in one bucket, Joe!) To fish is human….To release Divine! Before you buy.

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Question:

I am looking to move to Bend and would love to hear about rivers and boatin in the area…John

Response:

John, There are a couple of good oregon books: Soggy Sneakers and Oregon River Tours. Bend is a pretty place, lots of great fly fishing nearby (my fav. hobby). As far as boating rivers: The Deschutes river is nearby, it actually flows through bend (the upper section), but the lower section is the one most often boated.  It is probably the most popular rafting river in oregon.  The river has 5 or 6 class IV rapids and a couple of falls that are pretty much unrunable (unless you’re one of those crazy guys I see on tv).  The river also has a myriad of class 1 through 3 rapids.  The floatable section is close to 90 miles long.  However it is conviently broken by access points into two three day floats, with a couple of one day floats possible as well. The river gets very heavy traffic however.  In the middle of july, expect to count up to two dozen rafts in each direction.  Midweek brings much smaller crowds.  The Rangers have done a really good job discouraging the drunken Frat House parties, thus everyone is pretty pleasant. You also have access (2 or three hour drive) to the Rogue River.  It’s a scenic river with limited entry in the summer.  It is amazing! Since I raft and driftboat, I don’t have experience with smaller boats in Oregon. However, I think that other rivers close to bend may well accomodated kayaks. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I am looking to move to Bend and would love to hear about rivers and boatin in the area…John

Response:

Question:

Dear All,     I will be at a conference in Port Douglas, N. of Cairns, Australia, in late May.  Any advice about FF in the area (contacts, guides etc) Thanks, Gordon

Response:

Dear All,     I will be at a conference in Port Douglas, N. of Cairns, Australia, in late May.  Any advice about FF in the area (contacts, guides etc)

Yesterday I talked with an Australian guide at the San Mateo Expo. He was really enthusiastic about the flyfishing at Cape York, which in in that general area. He seemed like a good guy. His outfit is Australia-America Fishing Connections and his name is — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/ something bogus to avoid spam)

Response:

Dear All,     I will be at a conference in Port Douglas, N. of Cairns, Australia, in late May.  Any advice about FF in the area (contacts, guides etc) Thanks, Gordon

Peter Haynes is one of the best up there (Cairns based). Ph 07 40332398 He is an estuary and river FF specialist who does very well on the glamour species plus some of his own specialities. The guy rw mentions is a booking agent of sorts but I don’t know how many australian outfits he has arrangements with – might be worth an e- mail. You can also hire your own dingies at Port Douglas and do it all yourself – some terrific little creeks up there – mind the crocs though. Cheers JK Before you buy.

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Question:

Roffians, A friend of mine wants to get on ROFF but doesn’t really know how to do it. He is using AOL, which I’m not familiar with. I was hoping one of you who have AOL could give him some guidance. His name is Dennis, his email is Thanks Tim Apple — "Bamboo is Better"

Response:

A friend of mine wants to get on ROFF but doesn’t really know how to do it. He is using AOL, which I’m not familiar with. I was hoping one of you who have AOL could give him some guidance. His name is Dennis, his email is Thanks

From the task bar, Click on Internet, Click on Newsgroups Click on Expert Add Type in rec.outdoors.fishing.fly, press enter he will be subscribed To read Click on Internet Click on Newsgroups Click on read my Newsgroups Wayne who if he could ever get his other ISP to work right on text based newsgroups would leave aol in a heartbeat. Wayne Knight (remove nospam to respond via mail) Expert in the creation of  wind knots and tailing loops.

Response:

Question:

Register now for: Fly tying classes, instructor Derek Tay,  beginning January 1999 Fly Casting classes beginning April 1999 Christmas gift certificates available Atlantic Fly Fishing School Brookfield, Nova Scotia www.flyschool.net

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Register now for: Fly tying classes, instructor Derek Tay,  beginning January 1999 Fly Casting classes beginning April 1999 Christmas gift certificates available Atlantic Fly Fishing School Brookfield, Nova Scotia www.flyschool.net

____ Your http://www.flyschool.net  will show up blueif you add the http://  (I think!)  Why it didn’t light up as a web site, I don’t know.   Someone will tell me. Anyhow, I think teaching people "how" to use their hands tying flies is the primary goal before we teach them specific flies.  For example, how to use the hands to tie in tails, wings, tying knots, etc. When I go to Sports Shows with Fly Tiers, I will watch instructors on how they explain tying a fly, and FEW, if any ever cover what they are doing with their hands to properly divide the wings for that fly, for instance. "Sure, I know you use Calf Hair, but . . . " I will visit your site and see what you have. If you need to try some FLY-MAKER’S WAX or order some, let me know at: http://www.gink.com/ (Was I tactful enough with that fellahs?) no?  huh?

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Question:

INDICATORS IN FLY FISHING IS BOBBER FISHING

<whole bunch deleted Why is fishing with a bobber with a bait imitation worse than fishing on the bottom with a bait imitation? Doesn’t seem as bad as using artificial stuff to float or sink a fly. Charlie…

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George:  After reading your post I can only say, Thank God we don’t fish together.  I have always believed that tolerance is the hallmark of an educated man.  Hopefully, as we get older and wiser, we learn to "never say never" and to refrain from declaring that the "one way is the only way".  If we decide that indicators violate the spirit of fly-fishing then we must insist that all fly lines be a neutral color that exactly matches the water color.  Otherwise, those who watch the tips of their fly lines to detect strikes are taking an unfair advantage.  Then there are those of us who, due to advancing age, couldn’t see a leader or tippet at ten feet on our best day.  Time to hang up the rod?  Or, maybe, use an idicator.        By the way…love your floatant…too bad I can’t find it in Ontario.  Tight lines.   JIM WARD

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Over the years, as one generation fades into the sunset, it leaves behind certain rules and manners their fore-fathers abided with . . . but if left unsaid, undisciplined, untaught to the new . . . who are left to fend for themselves,  youth resorts to invention; the father of necessity. <<a bunch of oversimplistic blather about the "tradition" of "true Fly Fishing" snipped

(random snips from Joe’s post because it was more fun than the usual wholesale snippage, don’t take it personally) OK, George…Don’t bother…getting your…shorts..you’ll only embarrass

yourself. The fact is, George,…EVERYTHING we do…was…damned…effective… after a couple hundred years. As long as you…carry the ‘lure’, you’re fly fishing. Even…the pure ‘traditionalist’…claim…to…use the tools, materials, hooks, and lines of the ancient Egyptians… Do you nymph with… the beadhead…Isaac Walton the WORM…or… that "upstart" Lee Wulff! Surely you…claim that HIS flies are…silk…braided-core PVC coated…horsehair..ones? Have you got…steel…in the closet? Do you use…automatic…aircraft…? Does your rod have a…floating agent…??? If you use ANY of these things, then you are not the lily-pure ‘traditionalist’ you set yourself up to be. …     …unless, of course, you can show us where Isaac Walton and Dame Julianna promoted silicone…

(All this brought to you from the state where the line-item veto is used to delete single words, letters and even punctuation to achieve greater meaning in the annual budgetary laws.) Ah, there is something comforting about the posting of a truly good troll (it doesn’t matter if it was totally serious or just a stirring the pot). The laying down of the gauntlet, the surety of the combustive responses, the playing out of the thread into ever widening circles encompassing more and more tangential issues. I think Muskie should takes some notes from George’s post. It was written in civil, admirably constructed prose (minus a grammatical, syntactical or typographical error here or there), brought up an issue that will boil the brains of many a lurker, and was laid in like casting a fly on a 1 wt. line to a boiling pool of starving hatchery fish. With such a post you can be assured the world is as it should be and everything in its place, like the coming of Autumn or the first snow frosting the surface of the Earth. It is clear that to George (if we step one step away from the strike indicator controversy), flyfishing (to a greater or lesser degree) lies in the simplicity inherent in the limitations of the mechanics of the fly fishing rig as a predatory weapon to catch trout, all other things falling within the comforting framework these limitations define. He limits his rig to maintain this simplicity (as he views and purportedly enjoys it). There is some merit to this as an aesthetic pursuit. After all, art is what you make of it. To some, certain pieces of artwork are garbage and to others are beauty embodied. (George, I am interpreting your post and am not putting words in your computer, feel free to slam me if this offends you.;-) This does make me contemplate what flyfishing is to me (viewed as a different question than "why do you flyfish?" which is somehow easier to answer). I think it is similiar to why I bowhunt. There is an underlying aesthetic experience that goes far beyond the taking of game. I think I’ll have to mull it over for a while.  Any takers for the ethereal? Jon (better get some more coffee)

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -INDICATORS IN FLY FISHING IS BOBBER FISHING Over the years, as one generation fades into the sunset, it leaves behind certain rules and manners their fore-fathers abided with . . . but if left unsaid, undisciplined, untaught to the new . . . who are left to fend for themselves,  youth resorts to invention; the father of necessity. [snip] Without compassion you have

Question:

        There are five spring ponds on one of Alberta’s largest ranches which have just been opened to flyfishing. The ranch is bordered by the Belly and Waterton Rivers in the southwest of the province, not far from the Montana border.         The scenery is beautiful and so are the trout. Rainbows of over 20" are not uncommon and they cruise the ponds feeding on prolific mayfly, caddis and midge hatches.         If you like to stalk large trout, this is for your.         A friend, Matt Sparrow, is the keeper and he may be contacted by telephoning 403-626-3050. The cost is C$50 per day (for now) and food and lodging may be arranged at the comfortable bunkhouse. Guiding and local flies are also available.

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   There are five spring ponds on one of Alberta’s largest ranches which have just been opened to flyfishing. The ranch is bordered by the Belly and Waterton Rivers in the southwest of the province, not far from the Montana border.

So are those "poor ranchers" not making end meet on cows,that they have to jump into FF ?    The scenery is beautiful and so are the trout. Rainbows of over 20" are not uncommon and they cruise the ponds feeding on prolific mayfly, caddis and midge hatches.

I hope that all those Rainbows get whirling disease,just to take away any  possible profit out from all those  who want make    If you like to stalk large trout, this is for your.    A friend, Matt Sparrow, is the keeper and he may be contacted by telephoning 403-626-3050. The cost is C$50 per day (for now) and food and lodging may be arranged at the comfortable bunkhouse. Guiding and local flies are also available.

If your friend is trying turn this country into Europe or UK with "pay and fish" attitude maybe you should tell him about * Fishing License".How many times do you have to pay for a privilege to fish ?? How many greedy bastards do we have to feed?? Don’t support anybody who is trying to charge you for "just fishing" or you will find yourself in situation :"one day fishing $ 50.00 ,100.00 ,400.00 who knows where the end is *and you may keep the fish too* if you put "XY"amount of $ down. Please anybody from UK,or rest of Europe who can put more light into this ?Thank you. Have nice day Karel K.

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Question:

Any recommendations for the Stillwater the second week in July.  Looking for fly patterns and access points. Thanks! Don Albrecht

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I am going to fish the Stillwater River in Montana the second week in July. Any suggestions on flys and access points? I may have sent this message twice, since I’m new to the network and still learning! Sorry if someone sees it as a repeat. Don Donald Albrecht

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onald Albrecht write: : :I am going to fish the Stillwater River in Montana the second :week in :July. Any suggestions on flys and access points? : on : Don, There is a flyshop in Whitefish, Montana where I am sure you can get sound advice. Unfortunately, I can’t remember the name of the shop. Someone else here probably knows of it. Whitefish, by the way, is a delightful little town. If you have time, definitely drive to the Kootnai River. If I remember correctly its only about 90 minutes from the Whitefish-Kalispell area and it is northwest Montana’s best trout stream. Tim

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Any recommendations for the Stillwater the second week in July.  Looking for fly patterns and access points. Thanks! Don Albrecht

Back in ‘81 I had a great time staying at the Stillwater Valley Ranch outside of Nye Montana. They also ran an operation known as "Montana School of Flyfishing." It was owned by the Moat family, and was a real nice place for the novice or experienced fisherman. My understanding was most of the land on the river was private and protected (at that time) rather jealously by the ranchers. Haven’t kept track of the Moats, but don’t see their ad anymore in the mags. Best to check with the DNR for info and access, or see if these guys still have their place. Kevin Williams

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Kootnai river is definately some of the best FF in Montana – actually world class.  It is located near Libby MT, way up in the north west corner. As far as the stillwater is concerned, it is *ok*. As far as the FF shop in Whitefish, It is called "One Season Fly Fishing Shop" and the phone number is (406) 862-1298. Other inquiries about Montana FF are welcomed, reply to Jeff

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