Question:

And I suppose to you it is an earth shattering event?? To me it don’t mean a damn thing. The death of my father,obscure and never publicised,was of enormously greater import.  Maybe you need to get a life.

losin a father, of course, is significant. how did you feel when you heard john lennon was shot? john kennedy? how did you feel when someone you admired and considered a hero died? listless? happy? don, maybe you need to get a life…. a real life. walt

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BTW, Dale Earnhardt was a native North Carolinian! — Opie  –Planning for the Past–

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have just returned from Raleigh.  I took my dad his somewhat new golf cart.  I listened to the Daytona 500 on the way down and upon my return. Though I have never been a big NASCAR fan, I will truly miss Dale Earnhardt. He was one of the best loved and hated in his sport Opie  –Very Sad–

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I have just returned from Raleigh.  I took my dad his somewhat new golf cart.  I listened to the Daytona 500 on the way down and upon my return. Though I have never been a big NASCAR fan, I will truly miss Dale Earnhardt. He was one of the best loved and hated in his sport Opie  –Very Sad–

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I was about to post the following when Mark  beat me to it.  Cut and paste" Sad news in NASCAR racing, today.  Dale Earnhart, 7 time NASCAR champ, died after a crash on the final lap of today’s Daytona 500.  Michael Waltrip and his team-mate Dale Earnhart, Jr., came in 1st and 2nd.  Earnhart would have been third except for the incident that caused him and Kenny Schraeder to crash out of the race on the final lap.  The crash wasn’t that bad.  I’ve seen Earnhart walk away from far worse.  My heart goes out to all you Nortch Carolina boys, especially Pamlico Jim who was a wonderful Earnhart fan. The irony of it:  Michael Waltrip has been Cup racing for 15 or so years and never had a good car or someone to trust in him. He had never won a Nascar race. Earnhart saw the talent in Waltrip and owned the car that Michael drove today. I only hope he new that both of his cars, Waltrip’s and Jr.’s, came in 1st and 2nd. Dave L.

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Yeah, well, don’t count your elephants before they hatch! Opie  –Presently rosy cheeked–

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I don’t think too deeply….. Beginning to suspect there is little truth to this assertion. Wolfgang

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Joe F. wrote… <snip <snip   I guess if your number’s up… Friend, how about a little respect?  Lets not treat this mans death as some meaningless happening.

I think it’s pretty strange when drivers race cars at about 200 mph around an oval, within inches of one another, and then people get all surprised and upset when someone gets killed. The danger is really the POINT of auto racing. If somehow the powers that be could contrive to make it perfectly safe, interest in the sport would drop like a rock. It would have about as much interest as watching teenagers play video games. These guys race because paying customers like to see them risking their lives. They probably enjoy it, too, but they wouldn’t be doing it unless a lot of people were paying for the spectacle. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/

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I feel miserable about the passing of Dale.  Last evening I was planning on tying a few flies and relaxing for the evening.  I then heard the news from a buddy of mine on the phone.  I still am in shock over the untimely death of a man that I hated, loved and admired.  I hated him on the track for his dirty ways.  I loved him for his zealousness, competitiveness and what he has done for the sport of stock car racing and apart from him racing ‘dirty’ at times, he appeared to be a true gentleman. All who watched the Daytona 500 on Sunday were able to witness a ‘new’ Dale Earnhardt, in that he was protecting the lead for either Michael Waltrip or his son, we don’t know which one, but we can all attest to the fact that that was very uncharacteristic of  the ‘Intimidator’ and I was very happy to see Dale race in that fashion.  He left us with an image of what he was probably like as a father, husband and friend— a real man, one who is loving, protective and gracious, even though in the past that picture wasn’t painted on the race track.  But, it is evident that Dale was a gentleman and he will be greatly missed!!!! Growing up I attended many NASCAR races at Michigan, Bristol, Charlotte and Daytona and he was always the thorn in this fans side because he always was winning, or preventing one of my favorites from winning—I was always happy to see him a lap down, running out of gas or with a blown tire, but never, ever did I wish any harm to him, nor any other driver.  I remember talking with my father during a Sunday race about Earnhardt and that he drove us nuts…..then we both agreed it was fun seeing him run his tank empty or blow a motor (which was rare for RCR Enterprises Engine Building Team) but we would never like to see him be injured because of a mishap.  I have lightened up over the years concerning Dale, and I actually enjoyed seeing him win the Daytona 500 a few years back.  I thought, "Good for you Dale, you have definitely earned it!!!" I sat last night in shock and tears because, reflecting on past conversations with my father about racing and Dale, I remember us agreeing that NASCAR wouldn’t be the same without Dale out there doing what he does best. I’m sad and I hurt for the whole community that was so close to him, his dear and close friends, and his family. To Dale:  It won’t be same without you!  Thank you for many years of fun filled and exciting races. You are and will be missed.  Richard may have been the King, but that never stopped you from making it to the top! God Bless the family, friends and partners of Dale, DEI and RCR.

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And I suppose to you it is an earth shattering event?? To me it don’t mean a damn thing. The death of my father,obscure and never publicised,was of enormously greater import.  Maybe you need to get a life. —  Don Thompson Another of the Thompson Boys

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Joe F. wrote… <snip <snip   I guess if your number’s up… Friend, how about a little respect?  Lets not treat this mans death as some meaningless happening.

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I don’t think too deeply…..

Beginning to suspect there is little truth to this assertion. Wolfgang

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Joe F. wrote…

<snip <snip   I guess if your number’s up… Friend, how about a little respect?  Lets not treat this mans death as some meaningless happening.

Response:

Well sure he was a great personality. No doubt about it. But would you classify his death as noble? Ever read the short story entitled "The Lottery"? NASCAR reminds me of that.

Don’t know about ‘noble’ but I guess if I had to die young, a sudden death while fishing wouldn’t be the worst way to exit. I never met Dale Earnhardt, but I kind of think he felt the same way about racing, or he would have retired after Neil Bonnet’s death. As it was, Earnhardt wasn’t the same for some time after Bonnet died. George Adams "From the rockin’ of the cradle to the rollin’ of the hearse, the goin’ up was worth the comin’ down." ___Kris Kristofferson "The Pilgrim/Chapter 33"

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have just returned from Raleigh.  I took my dad his somewhat new golf cart.  I listened to the Daytona 500 on the way down and upon my return. Though I have never been a big NASCAR fan, I will truly miss Dale Earnhardt. He was one of the best loved and hated in his sport I hadn’t heard until your post.   I couldn’t believe it.   I’m not a NASCAR fan either; but I have to appreciate anyone who’s done what Earnhardt has done in their particular venue.   Damned shame. Odd though, that in the news coverage, the crash that killed him didn’t look so bad compared to many of the flip in the air, acrobatic, car-disintegrating wrecks that some drivers walk away from (including the Home Depot car in that race).   I guess if your number’s up… Joe F.

Not to be flippant about a serious matter, but it’s like the old saying, "It’s not your parachute not opening that kills you, it’s the sudden stop that does it."  A "wild" crash certainly looks spectacular, but look more closely – the cars flip and/or spin, all the while losing speed and inertia – Earnhardt, basically, "instantly" decelerated (not "instantly" in the absolute, but you get the idea) from 180 MPH when he hit the wall at maybe 25 degrees from perpendicular and then the other car "drove" his.  If the other car had not driven his car sideways, I’d guess the "seriousness" would have been more readily apparent.  When I saw the crash the first time, I thought what most were saying – it didn’t appear too bad, but when I saw it in slower motion, looking critically, it looked pretty bad. TC, R

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Odd though, that in the news coverage, the crash that killed him didn’t look so bad compared to many of the flip in the air, acrobatic, car-disintegrating wrecks that some drivers walk away from (including the Home Depot car in that race).   I guess if your number’s up… Joe F.

Actually the ’spectacular’ crashes are sldom fatal because all of the acrobatics tend to scrub off speed and dissipate the force of the inpact. The truly deadly crashes are the sudden decelleration type that killed Earnhardt. 180 to 0 mph in less then a second. The human body simply wasn’t designed to deal with those kind of g-forces. The two drivers killed at Loudon, NH last year suffered the same type of injury, and niether crash appeared ’serious’. There is really no safety equipment that can be added to the car or driver that would prevent fatalities from this type of injury. Track design, (’soft walls’, water barriers, etc, might help. George Adams "From the rockin’ of the cradle to the rollin’ of the hearse, the goin’ up was worth the comin’ down." ___Kris Kristofferson "The Pilgrim/Chapter 33"

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He was a *great* sportz personality, regardless of Zimbo’z *opinion*! While I have never been fascinated by celebrity, nor have I ever had a hero, I must say that Dale Earnhardt’s death has affected me for some reason.

Well sure he was a great personality. No doubt about it. But would you classify his death as noble? Ever read the short story entitled "The Lottery"? NASCAR reminds me of that. –Steve

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I have just returned from Raleigh.  I took my dad his somewhat new golf cart.  I listened to the Daytona 500 on the way down and upon my return. Though I have never been a big NASCAR fan, I will truly miss Dale Earnhardt. He was one of the best loved and hated in his sport

I hadn’t heard until your post.   I couldn’t believe it.   I’m not a NASCAR fan either; but I have to appreciate anyone who’s done what Earnhardt has done in their particular venue.   Damned shame. Odd though, that in the news coverage, the crash that killed him didn’t look so bad compared to many of the flip in the air, acrobatic, car-disintegrating wrecks that some drivers walk away from (including the Home Depot car in that race).   I guess if your number’s up… Joe F.

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I don’t think too deeply, nor do I dwell upon the aspects that might make a *sport* appealing to varying people.  NASCAR is a *sport* and one that has in recent years drawn a good deal of attention from BIG MONEY sponsors.  The fact that some of its participants die is regrettable, but no more so than in other sports.  Dale Earnhardt knew the dangers involved and chose to race anyway.  I don’t lament the way in which he died, but the fact that he did die! Steve, people die everyday playing, for money and/or enjoyment, one or another otherwise *meaningless* sports.  If folks gain something from participating in a particular sport or from merely observing said sports, I have no qualms with it. Why would you suppose that I might think any death as noble?  I rarely use the term, when referring to humans! Opie  —-

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – He was a *great* sportz personality, regardless of Zimbo’z *opinion*! While I have never been fascinated by celebrity, nor have I ever had a hero, I must say that Dale Earnhardt’s death has affected me for some reason. Well sure he was a great personality. No doubt about it. But would you classify his death as noble? Ever read the short story entitled "The Lottery"? NASCAR reminds me of that. –Steve

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Zimbo writes: The really sad thing is that in addition to the fact that Dale was killed (he didn’t *die*, he was *killed*), this news will only bring more popularity to one of the world’s stupidest sports. –Steve

Give me a break!  It is the most popular sport in the world.  I would guess that more people are killed fly fishing every year than in organized automobile racing.  Bull fighting, mountain climbing and auto racing are the only sports. The rest are games (according to Hemingway).

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He was a *great* sportz personality, regardless of Zimbo’z *opinion*!  While I have never been fascinated by celebrity, nor have I ever had a hero, I must say that Dale Earnhardt’s death has affected me for some reason. Opie  –Planning for the Past–

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Kelly writes: I love Winston Cup racing, but for me, a big part of the thrill is gone. It’s been said he could see the air.  There wasn’t anyone like him, probably never will be.

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Kelly writes: I love Winston Cup racing, but for me, a big part of the thrill is gone.

It’s been said he could see the air.  There wasn’t anyone like him, probably never will be.

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Kelly writes: I love Winston Cup racing, but for me, a big part of the thrill is gone. It’s been said he could see the air.  There wasn’t anyone like him, probably never will be.

    When they put Waltrip’s car on display across the street from the speedway, tragically absent will be the donut Dale would have put on the driver side door.                    Kelly

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The sudden stop from 180 mph seems to be what killed him. The sudden decelleration caused severe head injuries. There really is no way to protect against this type of accident. Dale’s best friend, Niel Bonnet died under similar circumstances a few years ago.

The really sad thing is that in addition to the fact that Dale was killed (he didn’t *die*, he was *killed*), this news will only bring more popularity to one of the world’s stupidest sports. –Steve

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – The sudden stop from 180 mph seems to be what killed him. The sudden decelleration caused severe head injuries. There really is no way to protect against this type of accident. Dale’s best friend, Niel Bonnet died under similar circumstances a few years ago. NASCAR might take a hard look at the recent changes in the "aero package" that causes the cars to stay bunched up for 500 miles. It makes a great show for the fans, but with an 18 car wreck, and then the fatality, it has proved very costly. Ironically, Earnhardt has been a vocal critic of restrictor plate racing for many years. A very sad day indeed. George Adams

    When they first ran the new aero package last fall at Talladega, and Dale made that great run from 15th or so to the victory in 5 laps, I’ll admit I thought the new rules were terrific. But I agree with you. Something needs to be looked at. Talladega is a lot wider than Daytona. I think the cleaner aerodynamics are safer at Daytona, where there is less room to bounce around. The big wreck was bound to happen. I know Dale hated the follow the leader plate races that he was so good at. I didn’t catch his feelings about running under the new rules, but I thought most of the Dodge and GM guys were favorable to them. NASCAR did indeed get the show they wanted, at least until the last lap, and it was one of the most thrilling races I’ve ever watched (even my wife watched a good part of it), but that’s not the kind of racing I like if this is how it ends.                      Kelly

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Forgive the spelling mistakes in that last post.  Very shook up over this.  I can hardly believe it.  It was a joy to see Earnhardt racing his son and protecting him.  I’m going to have to find a new hero……. and Earnhardt is going to be difficult to replace…

Response:

The sudden stop from 180 mph seems to be what killed him. The sudden decelleration caused severe head injuries. There really is no way to protect against this type of accident. Dale’s best friend, Niel Bonnet died under similar circumstances a few years ago. NASCAR might take a hard look at the recent changes in the "aero package" that causes the cars to stay bunched up for 500 miles. It makes a great show for the fans, but with an 18 car wreck, and then the fatality, it has proved very costly. Ironically, Earnhardt has been a vocal critic of restrictor plate racing for many years. A very sad day indeed. George Adams "From the rockin’ of the cradle to the rollin’ of the hearse, the goin’ up was worth the comin’ down." ___Kris Kristofferson "The Pilgrim/Chapter 33"

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I was about to post the following when Mark  beat me to it.  Cut and paste" Sad news in NASCAR racing, today.  Dale Earnhart, 7 time NASCAR champ, died after a crash on the final lap of today’s Daytona 500.  Michael Waltrip and his team-mate Dale Earnhart, Jr., came in 1st and 2nd.  Earnhart would have been third except for the incident that caused him and Kenny Schraeder to crash out of the race on the final lap.  The crash wasn’t that bad.  I’ve seen Earnhart walk away from far worse.  My heart goes out to all you Nortch Carolina boys, especially Pamlico Jim who was a wonderful Earnhart fan. The irony of it:  Michael Waltrip has been Cup racing for 15 or so years and never had a good car or someone to trust in him. He had never won a Nascar race. Earnhart saw the talent in Waltrip and owned the car that Michael drove today. I only hope he new that both of his cars, Waltrip’s and Jr.’s, came in 1st and 2nd. Dave L.

    As a big fan, I thought our run was over a few years back when, during his long winless streak, Dale passed out on the pace lap during the Southern 500 at Darlington and hit the wall coming out of turn 4. But then he came back at Daytona the next year with a truly spectacular victory. As the other drivers of his generation ended their careers just trying to make laps, he was still the best one on the track. He was amazing and thrilling to watch. Nerves of steel and will of iron. I thought the Goodwrench team was going to do it again this year.    DEI did an incredible thing today putting a brand new team in the winners circle at the 500. But I feel just awful for the Earnhardts, Michael and DEI, and RCR. This really is a very, very sad day for me and a lot of other motor-heads. I love Winston Cup racing, but for me, a big part of the thrill is gone.                                  Kelly

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Question:

 For those that use Outlook Express, I need your help.  I want to accomplish two things. 1) change my name that appear on the NG to "fly-fishing-midget." 2) have another of my hotmail addresses appear on the NG instead of my primary address. I am now using My Deja to accomplish this.  However, I rather use Outlook Express unless I’m searching something. I think everyone will know why I want this changed due to be all the hoopla going on lately.  I hope to eliminate the hate mail that my wife sees coming to my primary address.  I can read it at one of my other addresses without upsetting my wife.  She has nothing to do with my actions on this NG or other e-correspondence.   Vern U Before you buy.

Response:

Vern, try this: For 1) Select the News Group Select TOOLS Select Accounts (Hi-Lite Account Desired) Select Properties Select Name and enter the name you want to use Select OK For 2) Try: Same as above except select E-Mail Address instead of Name, Both Name and email address can be entered at one time if you want. Personally, I like Vern better and the hate mail will die quickly, good luck Jim – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – For those that use Outlook Express, I need your help.  I want to accomplish two things. 1) change my name that appear on the NG to "fly-fishing-midget." 2) have another of my hotmail addresses appear on the NG instead of my primary address. I am now using My Deja to accomplish this.  However, I rather use Outlook Express unless I’m searching something. I think everyone will know why I want this changed due to be all the hoopla going on lately.  I hope to eliminate the hate mail that my wife sees coming to my primary address.  I can read it at one of my other addresses without upsetting my wife.  She has nothing to do with my actions on this NG or other e-correspondence.  Vern U Before you buy.

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  I hope to eliminate the hate mail that my wife sees coming to my primary address.  I can read it at one of my other  Vern U

Ohhhhhhhh Vern baby….I just hate it when youstop touching me in that special way you have…….I just hate when you have to leave so early in

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  I hope to eliminate the hate mail that my wife sees coming to my primary address.  I can read it at one of my other  Vern U Ohhhhhhhh Vern baby….I just hate it when youstop touching me in that special way you have…….I just hate when you have to leave so early in

Hooooboy… I think ASADI slipped in the stream and hit his head!!! Someone get a DOC and a cold beer! Tihs man is hurt! {shudder} — Michael Era

Question:

This seems a particularly inauspicious time to post a report about George’s handiwork, but then again when the hell isn’t it.  He will piss off most of ROFF every other post.  Nevertheless, I promised this report and ROFF will get it. The brown truck arrived this afternoon as promised.  This evening, I departed for Spring Creek with  a 4 and 5 wt line as well as a comparison rod.  I am not an expert on cane rods, although I have two which I fish regularly.  One is a 1950’s vintage Orvis with the letter line rating that translates to a 6 wt.  That rod was not unsheathed this evening.  The other is -at least until now – my favorite.  I purchased it at Farlow’s, Pall Mall, London and it is a 7 ft. 4-5 wt. Tony and Mike, among others,  will know of the store.  When I was there (1989) the cane rods were all stowed across the rafters in the ceiling, while the carbon rods were on display along the walls.  I climbed a ladder and picked out several rods, eventually purchasing one without the benefit of casting -which was not possible under the circumstances.  That rod, however, is a magnificent fishing tool. I took the Bastard to Spring Creek fitted out with a four weight line and fished it.  The rod was a superb fishing tool.  At normal fishing distances – for me 30-40 feet – it performed as well as any rod I have fished.  Then, I went up on the bank along the stream for some pure casting comparisons and put the 4 wt. line on the Farlow’s rod. After that, back to the Bastard for more casting.  At normal fishing distances, the Bastard was better.   With a modest double haul I could put out about 50 ft., but that was the absolute limit at my abilities. The Farlow’s rod can get better  distance than that – I punched out 60 ft. this evening.  But to George’s credit the Bastard is lighter and at normal fishing ranges it peforms better than the Farlow’s rod.  Of course, I  understand that Wayne Cattanech (sp?)did not make the comparison rod and I am hardly the equivilent of Steve Rajeff. Nevertheless, the Bastard is a fine product that by my standards is all that I could ask for in a bamboo rod.  The only thing I would change is to use a cigar rather than full wells grip. Thanks George, and the check is in the mail. Mark Faulkner

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – This seems a particularly inauspicious time to post a report about George’s handiwork, but then again when the hell isn’t it.  He will piss off most of ROFF every other post.  Nevertheless, I promised this report and ROFF will get it. The brown truck arrived this afternoon as promised.  This evening, I departed for Spring Creek with  a 4 and 5 wt line as well as a comparison rod.  I am not an expert on cane rods, although I have two which I fish regularly.  One is a 1950’s vintage Orvis with the letter line rating that translates to a 6 wt.  That rod was not unsheathed this evening.  The other is -at least until now – my favorite.  I purchased it at Farlow’s, Pall Mall, London and it is a 7 ft. 4-5 wt. Tony and Mike, among others,  will know of the store.  When I was there (1989) the cane rods were all stowed across the rafters in the ceiling, while the carbon rods were on display along the walls.  I climbed a ladder and picked out several rods, eventually purchasing one without the benefit of casting -which was not possible under the circumstances.  That rod, however, is a magnificent fishing tool. I took the Bastard to Spring Creek fitted out with a four weight line and fished it.  The rod was a superb fishing tool.  At normal fishing distances – for me 30-40 feet – it performed as well as any rod I have fished.  Then, I went up on the bank along the stream for some pure casting comparisons and put the 4 wt. line on the Farlow’s rod. After that, back to the Bastard for more casting.  At normal fishing distances, the Bastard was better.   With a modest double haul I could put out about 50 ft., but that was the absolute limit at my abilities. The Farlow’s rod can get better  distance than that – I punched out 60 ft. this evening.  But to George’s credit the Bastard is lighter and at normal fishing ranges it peforms better than the Farlow’s rod.  Of course, I  understand that Wayne Cattanech (sp?)did not make the comparison rod and I am hardly the equivilent of Steve Rajeff. Nevertheless, the Bastard is a fine product that by my standards is all that I could ask for in a bamboo rod.  The only thing I would change is to use a cigar rather than full wells grip. Thanks George, and the check is in the mail. Mark Faulkner

Very nice report Mark. But I gotta know, did ya get skunked? walt — Ezflyfish.com http://www.ezflyfish.com BRBG http://www.abebooks.com/home/BLUEBOOKS P.O. Box 5112  Banner Elk, NC 28604 (828)963-5001

Response:

Hi Walt,  My brother is looking for a Cortland Fairplay line in WF4F, I didn’t see one listed on your site…do they even make a WF4F?  Come to think of it, all I’ve ever seen in WallyWorld is 5 & 6 wt.  Just curious… Frank Church Elkhart, IN USAF  RET.

| | This seems a particularly inauspicious time to post a report about | George’s handiwork, but then again when the hell isn’t it.  He will piss | off most of ROFF every other post.  Nevertheless, I promised this report | and ROFF will get it. | | The brown truck arrived this afternoon as promised.  This evening, I | departed for Spring Creek with  a 4 and 5 wt line as well as a | comparison rod.  I am not an expert on cane rods, although I have two | which I fish regularly.  One is a 1950’s vintage Orvis with the letter | line rating that translates to a 6 wt.  That rod was not unsheathed this | evening.  The other is -at least until now – my favorite.  I purchased | it at Farlow’s, Pall Mall, London and it is a 7 ft. 4-5 wt. Tony and | Mike, among others,  will know of the store.  When I was there (1989) | the cane rods were all stowed across the rafters in the ceiling, while | the carbon rods were on display along the walls.  I climbed a ladder and | picked out several rods, eventually purchasing one without the benefit | of casting -which was not possible under the circumstances.  That rod, | however, is a magnificent fishing tool. | | I took the Bastard to Spring Creek fitted out with a four weight line | and fished it.  The rod was a superb fishing tool.  At normal fishing | distances – for me 30-40 feet – it performed as well as any rod I have | fished.  Then, I went up on the bank along the stream for some pure | casting comparisons and put the 4 wt. line on the Farlow’s rod. After | that, back to the Bastard for more casting.  At normal fishing | distances, the Bastard was better.   With a modest double haul I could | put out about 50 ft., but that was the absolute limit at my abilities. | The Farlow’s rod can get better  distance than that – I punched out 60 | ft. this evening.  But to George’s credit the Bastard is lighter and at | normal fishing ranges it peforms better than the Farlow’s rod.  Of | course, I  understand that Wayne Cattanech (sp?)did not make the | comparison rod and I am hardly the equivilent of Steve Rajeff. | Nevertheless, the Bastard is a fine product that by my standards is all | that I could ask for in a bamboo rod.  The only thing I would change is | to use a cigar rather than full wells grip. | | Thanks George, and the check is in the mail. | | Mark Faulkner | |Very nice report Mark. But I gotta know, did ya get skunked? | |walt | |– |Ezflyfish.com http://www.ezflyfish.com |BRBG http://www.abebooks.com/home/BLUEBOOKS |P.O. Box 5112  Banner Elk, NC 28604 (828)963-5001 | |

Response:

Same old story as many others really….

(another tale of woe snipped) Joe –  Several years ago I finished fishing Spring Creek at dark, just below Bellefonte, and put my cane rod on the roof of my car while I got out of my waders, had a beer, etc.  As you would suspect, it wasn’t until I heard the rod roll off the roof of the car onto the asphalt that I realized the magnitude of my stupidity. Mark Faulkner

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Very nice report Mark. But I gotta know, did ya get skunked? Yes. MF

Mark is too much the gentleman to say this, but I understand that conditions are abysmal in PA.  Spring Creek has been reduced to a trickle, Penns is a puddle, and Fishing hardly flows.  Under such conditions not even the vaunted George could tease up a fish. Peter P.S.  We’ll have to have ourselves a little cane shootout once life gets breathed back into that little creek.

Response:

Joe –  Several years ago I finished fishing

Spring Creek at dark, just below Bellefonte, and put my cane rod on the roof of

my car while I got out of my waders, had a beer, etc.  As you would suspect,

it wasn’t until I heard the rod roll off the roof of the car onto the asphalt

that I realized the magnitude of my stupidity. Mark Faulkner

Mark; The three basic rules of fishing cane rods are: when you are thru fishing, 1-take care of the rod! 2-take care of the rod! 3-take care of the rod! follow all three steps BEFORE moving on to removing waders, drinking beer,etc. and your rods will last much longer John Share what you know. Learn what you don’t.

Response:

Joe and Jon – Bellefonte is still a nice little town, that has the additional advantage of a first class trout stream running right through it.  The story of the six weight deserves to be told. Mark Faulkner – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Mark: I’ve got an uncle in Bellfonte (sp?), and family (with land and creeks) in Brookville. I grew up catching brookies there. Nice area, Ditto that.   I used to go there on business and knock off early to fish Spring Creek.   Bellefonte is a pretty little town (I thought).   Despite driving my car over my 6 wt. there, I’ve always wanted to come back. Joe F.

Response:

Joe and Jon – Bellefonte is still a nice little town, that has the additional advantage of a first class trout stream running right through it.  The story of the six weight deserves to be told.

Same old story as many others really.   I was downstream from Bellefonte toward Fisherman’s Paradise trying to squeeze in just a few more casts before having to be somewhere else.   I came out of the stream and began packing up in a hurry.   Waders off, shoes on, vest off, etc.   For some reason I was distracted enough to leave my rod leaning against the passenger side of the car when I backed up to leave.   I heard the rod scrape against the side as it fell and realized what I’d done, but too late.   From the position of the rod, I certainly had run over the tip. Surprisingly, it looked undamaged except for a slightly bent guide, so I put it back in the sock and tube and went on my way.   It wasn’t until weeks later getting ready to fish the Tulpehocken that I thought to check it out before I hiked down to the stream in my waders.   I tried a quick cast on the parking area and; well, lets just say the rod was a bit less stiff than I liked. Joe F.

Response:

Very nice report Mark. But I gotta know, did ya get skunked?

Yes. MF

Response:

Mark: I’ve got an uncle in Bellfonte (sp?), and family (with land and creeks) in Brookville. I grew up catching brookies there. Nice area,

Ditto that.   I used to go there on business and knock off early to fish Spring Creek.   Bellefonte is a pretty little town (I thought).   Despite driving my car over my 6 wt. there, I’ve always wanted to come back. Joe F.

Response:

Hi Frank, The Fairplay line isn’t manufactured in a 4wt., 5wt being the smallest. It is a good line for the money….I have one loaded on a Danica Large Arbor reel and it performs quite nicely. There is a 4wt 333HT but it costs more. However, all the 333 lines are on sale everyday at ez…. –Walt, puttin the lid back on the can. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Walt,  My brother is looking for a Cortland Fairplay line in WF4F, I didn’t see one listed on your site…do they even make a WF4F?  Come to think of it, all I’ve ever seen in WallyWorld is 5 & 6 wt.  Just curious… Frank Church Elkhart, IN USAF  RET. | | This seems a particularly inauspicious time to post a report about | George’s handiwork, but then again when the hell isn’t it.  He will piss | off most of ROFF every other post.  Nevertheless, I promised this report | and ROFF will get it. | | The brown truck arrived this afternoon as promised.  This evening, I | departed for Spring Creek with  a 4 and 5 wt line as well as a | comparison rod.  I am not an expert on cane rods, although I have two | which I fish regularly.  One is a 1950’s vintage Orvis with the letter | line rating that translates to a 6 wt.  That rod was not unsheathed this | evening.  The other is -at least until now – my favorite.  I purchased | it at Farlow’s, Pall Mall, London and it is a 7 ft. 4-5 wt. Tony and | Mike, among others,  will know of the store.  When I was there (1989) | the cane rods were all stowed across the rafters in the ceiling, while | the carbon rods were on display along the walls.  I climbed a ladder and | picked out several rods, eventually purchasing one without the benefit | of casting -which was not possible under the circumstances.  That rod, | however, is a magnificent fishing tool. | | I took the Bastard to Spring Creek fitted out with a four weight line | and fished it.  The rod was a superb fishing tool.  At normal fishing | distances – for me 30-40 feet – it performed as well as any rod I have | fished.  Then, I went up on the bank along the stream for some pure | casting comparisons and put the 4 wt. line on the Farlow’s rod. After | that, back to the Bastard for more casting.  At normal fishing | distances, the Bastard was better.   With a modest double haul I could | put out about 50 ft., but that was the absolute limit at my abilities. | The Farlow’s rod can get better  distance than that – I punched out 60 | ft. this evening.  But to George’s credit the Bastard is lighter and at | normal fishing ranges it peforms better than the Farlow’s rod.  Of | course, I  understand that Wayne Cattanech (sp?)did not make the | comparison rod and I am hardly the equivilent of Steve Rajeff. | Nevertheless, the Bastard is a fine product that by my standards is all | that I could ask for in a bamboo rod.  The only thing I would change is | to use a cigar rather than full wells grip. | | Thanks George, and the check is in the mail. | | Mark Faulkner | |Very nice report Mark. But I gotta know, did ya get skunked? | |walt | |– |Ezflyfish.com http://www.ezflyfish.com |BRBG http://www.abebooks.com/home/BLUEBOOKS |P.O. Box 5112  Banner Elk, NC 28604 (828)963-5001 | |

– Ezflyfish.com http://www.ezflyfish.com BRBG http://www.abebooks.com/home/BLUEBOOKS P.O. Box 5112  Banner Elk, NC 28604 (828)963-5001

Response:

steve, by far the best post yet on the whole issue of  bastard rods thanks for your time and effort chris smith – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello, all. I am the owner of a new Bastard bamboo rod and so I thought I’d share my experiences (and many photos) with you. I had planned to post my story directly to the group, but because the battle has escalated to such an extreme (and embarrassing) level, I’ve decided to post only a link to it. Here it is: http://www.ipass.net/~stevez/gehrkerod/ If you’re interested, check it out and feel free to respond here or directly to my email address. For those of you at the Ball, I’ll see you soon!!! Steve Zimmerman

Response:

Steve….     As someone who has lurked more than participated in the Bastard Bamboo Rod fiasco, I was more than a little uncomfortable that such extreme positions were taken on one side or the other.  Your report, coupled with photos, is, in my opinion, the best post on the subject to date.  It was a fair and accurate report and you did a good job of articulating your opinions and backing them up with photos.  Thank you.  I think that anyone thinking about purchasing a Bastard Rod will be in a much better position to make a purchase decision thanks to you..     As to those who took "extreme positions" in their posts, I’m not throwing rocks at any of you.  If you were not happy with the quality of the rod you received, then all of the feelings attached to such a transaction are going to find their way into your post.  Similarly, when George felt that he was being "attacked", his defensive posture also came through in his posts.  All of this is understandable.     It was nice, however, to see a post like Steve’s Barry

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello, all. I am the owner of a new Bastard bamboo rod and so I thought I’d share my experiences (and many photos) with you. I had planned to post my story directly to the group, but because the battle has escalated to such an extreme (and embarrassing) level, I’ve decided to post only a link to it. Here it is: http://www.ipass.net/~stevez/gehrkerod/ If you’re interested, check it out and feel free to respond here or directly to my email address. For those of you at the Ball, I’ll see you soon!!! Steve Zimmerman

Response:

Steve, I got to tell you, that was a beautiful well done work. Although I haven’t been around in a while ( I relocated and been busy with the new home), I found a little time to read some post. I must say that the post concerning the Bastard production line held my interest. Although George has his foes, he has a respectable amount of heart. If his rods are lacking (judging by the previous posts), I am sure that they will improve with experience. Chris Fleitman Fisherman by nature-goofball by society.

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Steve, Nice pictures. I had wanted to see the tipping wraps. I had a dicussion with George on his chat room one night about and he had told me that they were four threads wide. But on your pictures some of the guide wraps are tipped and some are not. sf

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello, all. I am the owner of a new Bastard bamboo rod and so I thought I’d share my experiences (and many photos) with you. I had planned to post my story directly to the group, but because the battle has escalated to such an extreme (and embarrassing) level, I’ve decided to post only a link to it. Here it is: http://www.ipass.net/~stevez/gehrkerod/ If you’re interested, check it out and feel free to respond here or directly to my email address. For those of you at the Ball, I’ll see you soon!!! Steve Zimmerman

Response:

will, i got involved with george origionally on VFS. i pointed out an inconsistancy in a statement he made about pricing  which included a general insult to a large group of people. i was polite. he replied with venom and vitriol. i contacted him privately. we communicated calmly and civily. he offered to send me a rod to see for myself how well made it was. not to buy, just to try. i said if he’s willing to go that far the least i can do is buy it – if it’s as good a rod as he claimes. sadly the rod he sent was pretty miserable. not suprising since it was one of the rods he’d sent to daytripper. which was returned  -which george said was so bad he destroyed it -which he now claims is perfectly fine. i told him i would give him a chance to talk about it privately before i posted my thoughts publicly, which was something i stated i planned on doing right up front. i sent him my review and had no responce. i sent him another request to respond and a time when i would post  publicly.from the time i posted to him to the time i posted publicly( 2 days) george was on line responding to and attacking others. my post was polite and truthful with a couple suggestions and best wishes for future success. his responce was typical george-i was made out to be a liar and ignorant. my next reply was georgian. if he can’t take it he shouldn’t dish it. i’m glad codemarine recieved a rod he’s happy with. it’s alot nicer looking than mine. BUT if you look at the cane work you can see there is room for improvement. the flats irregularities show up even in online photos. georges claimes of being better than Granger, Heddon et al are bad for this reason; it blinds george to realization that there is room for improvement in the bastards. if he keeps this attitude about his work and continues to trash anyone who dares disagree with him or finds fault with one of his rods, he’s hurting himself and his business. i for one tried to give the guy a chance AFTER he had ripped into me and look where it got me. on george gehrkes’ ENEMIES LIST. i wish him luck because with him instabilities he’s gonna need it.  bob smith                  .  I do believe George    is honestly   doing his best to satisfy all his customer< —–he has a funny way of going about it—

Response:

 Steve;  A wonderful report on the Bastard Bamboo Flyrod. It’s been extremely interesting reading these posts on ROFF about these rods. I’m a graphite man myself–although I do, on occasion bring out my Orvis Battenkill 8′ 6 wt. circa 1965.   I have no intention of ordering a Bastard–and if I did–I’d have to consider that decision quite carefully after reading some of these exchanges. Well done, Thanks!   Dave M

Response:

Bill: Thanks for a thoughful and conciliatory post.  I wish you would post more often. I myself enjoy quite a reputation for my rod building talent (glass & graphite), but hesitate at the challenge of building a bamboo from scratch.

I apologize ahead of time if I should recognize your name/business in a commercial flyrod context, but I don’t.  Do you build rods commercially, or just as a hobby? The reason I ask is that I honestly wonder how other people who post here, *and* make a living somehow from flyfishing, feel about George’s commercial use of this group.  It has always been shrugged off in the past as the acceptable (to some) price that was paid for all the "contributions" he made to roff.  Personally, I’m having a hard time seeing the contributions of late, but maybe that’s just me. Bob Before you buy.

Response:

Bob, You really shouldn’t recognize my name/business.  I’m just a "have fun" flyfisher who enjoys the sport immensely.  I’ve been involved with many Fly Fishing clubs at one time or another and have taught several rod building classes in my time.  Lost count of the number of rods I’ve built at around 300 or so and that was quite a few years ago.  I just enjoy getting the best performance I can out of a blank. Most of my rods have been donated to good causes or traded for flies.  I definitely have a reputation for having built more rods than flies.  I did meet George at a show a few years back and I believe him to be sincere although a little sensitive concerning his products.  In my opinion, he tries too hard to make everyone satisfied (which is impossible) and then is hurt when someone isn’t satisfied.  His commercial posting on ROFF would seem out of place to me if it wasn’t for the fact he seems to be a part of the group.  Each group needs a diverse set of personalities.  George contributes to the group on a regular basis, providing information, insight, and definitely excitement. You haven’t seen me post very often, because I’m too busy.  Life has caught up to me and I had to get an education to change careers.  I just graduated with a BS degree in information systems while working 65 hours per week. Lurking on ROFF has helped me keep some sanity in my life during this time that I’ve been locked into my studies.  Hopefully not too long now until I can get employed at a real job and will be able to enjoy my weekends fishing again. Bill – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Bill: Thanks for a thoughful and conciliatory post.  I wish you would post more often. I myself enjoy quite a reputation for my rod building talent (glass & graphite), but hesitate at the challenge of building a bamboo from scratch. I apologize ahead of time if I should recognize your name/business in a commercial flyrod context, but I don’t.  Do you build rods commercially, or just as a hobby? The reason I ask is that I honestly wonder how other people who post here, *and* make a living somehow from flyfishing, feel about George’s commercial use of this group.  It has always been shrugged off in the past as the acceptable (to some) price that was paid for all the "contributions" he made to roff.  Personally, I’m having a hard time seeing the contributions of late, but maybe that’s just me. Bob Before you buy.

Response:

Hello, all. I am the owner of a new Bastard bamboo rod and so I thought I’d share my experiences (and many photos) with you. I had planned to post my story directly to the group, but because the battle has escalated to such an extreme (and embarrassing) level, I’ve decided to post only a link to it. Here it is: http://www.ipass.net/~stevez/gehrkerod/ If you’re interested, check it out and feel free to respond here or directly to my email address. For those of you at the Ball, I’ll see you soon!!! Steve Zimmerman

Response:

If you’re interested, check it out and feel free to respond here or directly to my email address. For those of you at the Ball, I’ll see you soon!!! Steve Zimmerman

Steve, All I can say is OUT-FREAKING-STANDING!!! Well done!  A truely fair report and analysis.  I especially liked the pictures to back up the claims made and to actually receive my first glimpse of a bastard! A++ Warren Riding a horse through a stream and chopping down a tree near you!

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Just when we thought it was safe to go in the water

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This, I think, says it all. A masterful production, codemarine. My hat’s off to you. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/ something bogus to avoid spam)

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A breath of fresh air, a Bastard related post without name calling, well done and informative. Thanks, Jim – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello, all. I am the owner of a new Bastard bamboo rod and so I thought I’d share my experiences (and many photos) with you. I had planned to post my story directly to the group, but because the battle has escalated to such an extreme (and embarrassing) level, I’ve decided to post only a link to it. Here it is: http://www.ipass.net/~stevez/gehrkerod/ If you’re interested, check it out and feel free to respond here or directly to my email address. For those of you at the Ball, I’ll see you soon!!! Steve Zimmerman

Response:

Steve, you are to be congratulated on an excellent report on the B*stard rod, one I consider fair, well done and containing excellent advice for all concerned. I have stayed out of the fray, primarily because I am not in the running for a rod named B*stard, say what you will, but that is an offensive term to me. (maybe someday I’ll get over it) But I digress…I hope George takes to heart your advice, because, notwithstanding his reputation in ROFF, I wish him well.  Yours is not the first post stating that you found him to be a personable, decent fellow when not trading insults, etc. on ROFF. Let me say right up front that I believe these were honorable, trustworthy people who sent rods back to George, it is just incomprehensible to me that they would even consider dealing with George in any other way. It is my hope, yes even my plan to someday fish with Dave L., Daytripper, Mudfish and all the ROFFIANS that I can fit in to my fishing life, and yes, even George. Life is too short to spend it in any other way than to enjoy in person those people who I’ve come to know and respect on ROFF. It grieves me to see what has been going on these past weeks, for I’ve been a member of ROFF for over 5 yrs now and although I’m not a frequent poster, this group has jump-started my day (with a cup of coffee) for the past 5 years (when I’m not on the road)  It has become a part of my life, instead of having coffee and a donut, I have coffee and ROFF. And, a last special request to George…..read and reread CodeMarine’s advice, step back and give it some thought. As stated before, I wish you well in your rod venture, but you must change your public persona, and stop believing that people are out to "get you" with sabotage or other devious means to hurt your business venture.  Until you go nationwide with your rods, these folks on ROFF are all you’ve got to ’spread the word’ about B*stard rods. In other words, be cool George! In my opinion, _you_ are your own worst enemy, and only you can change that. Good luck and remember, regardless of what’s happened in the recent past, I’ll bet 99.9% of ROFFIANS want to see you succeed. I’m on the road this morning to Denver for 4 days, I want to see some positive feedback from you when I return George…..now, get your ass on over to http://www.ipass.net/~stevez/gehrkerod/ and read and heed! Respectfully, – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello, all. I am the owner of a new Bastard bamboo rod and so I thought I’d share my experiences (and many photos) with you. I had planned to post my story directly to the group, but because the battle has escalated to such an extreme (and embarrassing) level, I’ve decided to post only a link to it. Here it is: http://www.ipass.net/~stevez/gehrkerod/ If you’re interested, check it out and feel free to respond here or directly to my email address. For those of you at the Ball, I’ll see you soon!!! Steve Zimmerman

Response:

A really nice, balanced report — thanks!

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello, all. I am the owner of a new Bastard bamboo rod and so I thought I’d share my experiences (and many photos) with you. I had planned to post my story directly to the group, but because the battle has escalated to such an extreme (and embarrassing) level, I’ve decided to post only a link to it. Here it is: http://www.ipass.net/~stevez/gehrkerod/ If you’re interested, check it out and feel free to respond here or directly to my email address. For those of you at the Ball, I’ll see you soon!!! Steve Zimmerman

Response:

<<Hello, all. I am the owner of a new Bastard bamboo rod and so I thought I’d share my experiences (and many photos) with you. Great post Steve.  Thank god for gentlemen.

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<SNIP Excellent.  Thank you very much for the effort. I am also glad that you enjoy the rod and am pleased for George. Hope he takes your suggestions to heart. TL MC

Response:

Steve, A hearty THANKS from all of us.  A positive and informative post is as refreshing as one can get and with pictures to back it up. Kind of verifies what I have thought all along.  I don’t believe any "Lies" have really been said on this news group.  I do believe George is honestly doing his best to satisfy all his customers.  The fact that he sent those rods to Dave and Dave at the last minute is proof of this.  However, that was a definite business error on Georges part.  He himself admits rods #11 and #12 were sent out in a rush, I think perhaps with a cut back in Quality Analysis to make the deadline. An effort to satisfy a customer at the cost of the perfection George is striving for. Dave and Dave on the other hand having received these rods, noticed some imperfections and felt a need to correct George on these points.  An appropriate action to take.  An action I believe I would have taken under the circumstances. The blow up seems to have stemmed from this action. I believe George is a man of honor who honestly wants to help people enjoy the sport. And has accomplished that many many times over.  However George tends to take on challenges of large magnitude.  None of us would take on the challenge of producing a quality production bamboo flyrod.  In fact it’s quite difficult to produce a single quality bamboo fly rod. I myself enjoy quite a reputation for my rod building talent (glass & graphite), but hesitate at the challenge of building a bamboo from scratch. I believe George takes great pride in the work he does and as well he should.  He has accomplished the close to impossible in the challenges he has taken on. Several posts from satisfied customers verify this.  However I’m afraid he strives to perfection to a fault.  He wants every product he makes to satisfy everyone perfectly and he won’t stop till he gets there. Unfortunately, no one is capable of perfection,  so when a criticism is made it is perceived as an attack. Thus a defensive stance which provokes another defensive stance which then provokes another defensive stance and so on it goes. It is time each forgive one another.  Motives were correct from both sides of the camp.  Perceptions, however tend to have a life of their own. I’ve heard comments about complaining to ISP’s and such.  Come on, bury the hatchet.  Let’s enjoy one another as the Roffians that we are. I neither defend George nor Dave and Dave.  I simply believe that the majority of all this uproar is due to misperceptions on the part of all. George misperceived Dave & Dave’s comments as an attack and the correction George made to those comments were perceived as an attack.  It’s just time to forgive. Bill (the Lurker)

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello, all. I am the owner of a new Bastard bamboo rod and so I thought I’d share my experiences (and many photos) with you. I had planned to post my story directly to the group, but because the battle has escalated to such an extreme (and embarrassing) level, I’ve decided to post only a link to it. Here it is: http://www.ipass.net/~stevez/gehrkerod/ If you’re interested, check it out and feel free to respond here or directly to my email address. For those of you at the Ball, I’ll see you soon!!! Steve Zimmerman

Response:

(snippage has occurred) Steve Zimmerman

Well thought through and well designed post Steve.  However, considering the touchiness of the situation, I will have to see the longer term results to say it was effective in all the areas you intended.  I do think your post serves well as a model for resolving intense, sometimes emotional, conflicts on ROFF. — Wayne To fish is human….To release Divine! Before you buy.

Response:

Question:

I need some help casting.  I’m fairly new to the sport and trying to improve all the time.  I just bought my second rod and spent a lot more money on it. I did it right this time, I hope.  However, that’s have nothing to do with my problem.  I was out at our local park practicing my casting.  The back cast looked good, the loop was fairly small and shot backwards like two horizontal lines that straightened out to one.   I let the line continue to straighten out and then made my forward cast without whipping the rod.  The line moved over my head and rolled in front of me.  That’s the problem.  The forward cast had a large loop instead of shooting straight forward.  I should mention that there was a very slight wind that I was casting into. However, it was a very slight wind.  I’ve been told to close up the loop in the back and it will help eliminate the forward loop.  However, I think my back cast looks good.  How can I get rid of the large loop in my forward cast?  Any advise will help.  I will try all requests at my local park before driving out to the field.

Response:

I should have said that this regarding fly fishing.  Thanks

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Question:

Hi folks: I have noticed on our newsgroups a bunch of spam coming through.  You don’t have to take this.  Subscribe today to the Flyfishing and Flytying Mailing will be automatically subscribed. Come join in on the clean fun of flyfishing and flytying…and no SPAM. Joe

Response:

Hi folks: I have noticed on our newsgroups a bunch of spam coming through.  You don’t have to take this.  Subscribe today to the Flyfishing and Flytying Mailing List.

I dunno, I’ve discovered all kinds of fly and line dressings as well as other scented and flavored lubricants that way.   — TimW Halfordian Golfer

Response:

 I actually have a fablualous  idea for once…….here goes Saddam Hussein  ( sorry about the spell ) has a home page . Since Iraq has no internet service the dope has all of his e-mails hand delievered to him each day from Jordan…….I say we plaster the boards with the site and let the spammers go nuts……. I personally am going to send all spammers with another a major jerk. Here is Saddam’s home page or so I’m told: — Visit my web site:http://www.commonlink.com/~Midwestflytying

Response:

Yes, I found this to be a valid page. I will send first an American flag GIF to him! Gee, I just hope his e-mail supports HTML.

|

Response:

Question:

Hi  I would like to know what licenses I need for flyfishing in Finnmark, Norway??

Response:

Hi  I would like to know what licenses I need for flyfishing in Finnmark, Norway??

Try this URL: http://www.flyshop.no — Esa Niemel

Question:

Howdy I’ll be moving to Sping Lake N.J. in mid Oct. from southern Alberta where I’ve become quite fond of spectacular fishing. Anyone have a suggestion of where i can continue to get my fix? My e-mail is only go until Oct.7 Thank ya all, Cheers.

Response:

As one resident said last year… the besst fly fishing in NJ is in PA and NY.  But Spring Lake in on the coast, and the other resident didn’t ply the salt.  Great runs of of blues are in the offing.  Check any of the local tackle shops.  Fresh water is mostly up north and west.  Shad and stripers run the Delaware regularly.  Trout are mostly stocked, so listen to the original advise and head to PA and the NY Catskills.  There is a NJ fishing home page, and if you can scroll back into this groups archives it’ll be listed . good luck from Long Island jg

Response:

Question:

Never had a problem with Bass Pro Shops.  The worst thing that happens is that something(s) is backed ordered and you get it in dribs and drabs, but they will tell you what is back ordered on the phone.  They have a good selection too.  The other catalogs have the same items in them, though Cabela’s seems to have a lot more "kits" (i.e. Small Plano type plastic boxes with an assortment of lures like Power Worms, Slugos, etc.). * Sony Electronics        phone: (201) 930-7039               * * Sony Drive – MD#3D2     fax:   (201) 930-6361               * * Park Ridge, NJ 07656    http://www.sony.com                 *

Response:

I would like to know what the general concensus is about Bass Pro Shops catalogs. What is the selection, service, pricing and other info about this catalog.   How does this compare to Cabela’s and Gander Mtn? Thank you and good fishing. Dan

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: I would like to know what the general concensus is about Bass Pro Shops catalogs. : What is the selection, service, pricing and other info about this : catalog.   : How does this compare to Cabela’s and Gander Mtn? I order stuff from Bass Pro several times per year. They are excellent, about equal to Cabela’s, it’s been a very long time since I ordered anything from Gander Mountian so I can’t compare them. I grew up in Springfield, Missouri, Bass Pro is an instituation there. Dave Fortner

Response:

I would like to know what the general concensus is about Bass Pro Shops catalogs.

I have been more than pleased with their service.  I recently ordered an assortment of tubes that was supposed to be in a metal tin. When I received the tubes they were in a plastic container.  When I called back to complain, they told me that the tins were discontinued. They let me keep the lures for free ($10 value) and sent me a $10 refund for the product that I was supposed to receive. Not too bad!

Response:

   I too order a lot of stuff from both Bass Pro Shops and Cabela’s.  I find that both are extremely good and the prices can’t be beat.  I’ve never had to return anything from either place so I can’t comment upon that from personal experience.  However, a friend of mine recently returned some Gore Tex rain gear to Cabela’s after having had them for over a year.  I won’t go into the whole long story but, despite some initial reluctance, Cabela’s gave him a complete refund.  Given the competition between the two companies, I would expect BPS to be fairly equitable on their refund policy if you have a legitimate gripe.    Most of the ordering that I do from BPS is actually throught their Offshore Angler catalog because they have a vastly larger selection of saltwater equipment than does Cabela’s.  Cabela’s has improved their saltwater gear a lot over the last few years but still can’t compete with BPS.    Dennis

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:    I too order a lot of stuff from both Bass Pro Shops and Cabela’s.  I : find that both are extremely good and the prices can’t be beat.  I’ve : never had to return anything from either place so I can’t comment upon : that from personal experience.  However, a friend of mine recently : returned some Gore Tex rain gear to Cabela’s after having had them for : over a year.  I won’t go into the whole long story but, despite some : initial reluctance, Cabela’s gave him a complete refund.  Given the : competition between the two companies, I would expect BPS to be fairly : equitable on their refund policy if you have a legitimate gripe. I’ve found that Bass Pro’s return policy is a lot more liberal than Cabela’s. I’ve returned things to Bass Pro just because I didn’t like ‘em, they have always accepted the return AND PAID FOR THE RETURN SHIPPING (this is AFTER the items were USED)! This spring I tried to return a pair of expensive fishing pliers I bought from Cabela’s and order the ones with the serated jaws, they gave me a hassle about it and they were gonna make me call their customer service department to get authorization, etc, etc. It turned out that one of my fishin’ buddies dropped ‘em overboard before I could get authorization to send ‘em back, but I was a little peeved that they were giving me a hassle about it. Dave Fortner

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I fished with a guy for several years who used to by merchandise from most of the larger catalog sellers and after a year or whenever he got tired of the merchandise, he would send it back for a refund.  Some placed made him work for his money, but by and large, he always manage to cheat the seller out of his merchandise. I know he did it with Bean, Orvis, Cabela’s and many local merchants who operate on a shoe sting.  I even saw him buy a used fishing reel and send it back to Orvis for a full refund.  He received about a 200 refund after investing seventy dollars in the used reel.  Skumbags like that will ruin it for the honest person who may experience some difficulty with some piece of merchandise.  Bad business ripping the merchant off and if we are all not careful even the compitition will not protect us from this privilage being revoked. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –   I too order a lot of stuff from both Bass Pro Shops and Cabela’s.  I find that both are extremely good and the prices can’t be beat.  I’ve never had to return anything from either place so I can’t comment upon that from personal experience.  However, a friend of mine recently returned some Gore Tex rain gear to Cabela’s after having had them for over a year.  I won’t go into the whole long story but, despite some initial reluctance, Cabela’s gave him a complete refund.  Given the competition between the two companies, I would expect BPS to be fairly equitable on their refund policy if you have a legitimate gripe.   Most of the ordering that I do from BPS is actually throught their Offshore Angler catalog because they have a vastly larger selection of saltwater equipment than does Cabela’s.  Cabela’s has improved their saltwater gear a lot over the last few years but still can’t compete with BPS.   Dennis

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Question:

Has anyone fished the West Fork of the San Gabriel (Southern Ca.)  lately? I see they are planting trout weekly.  If you have (fished) what are the taking , where is the best area etc.                   Thanks, Becky

Actually, Becky, they only plant the lower section of the West Fork. The catch & release, artificial lure w/ single barbless hook only section begins at the second bridge upstream from the parking area and it is wild trout only. This is the area you want to visit. In fact, bring a bike and you can easily cover the entire 5 miles or so of managed water. I haven’t been up this year yet but I would guess that conditions would be great. Plenty of water! In the past I’ve had success fishing just about any dry fly. I knew a Becky Marsh who worked for Nordstrom??? Tim

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Becky, Follow the advice of the last message, take lots of Beadheaed nymphs In #14-16 in olive or brown, fish soft hackle wet flies (March Brown, Partridge & Orange or Starling and Herl, carry some #16-18 Elk Caddis, a few Royal Wulfs, California Mosquito, the good old Gold Ribbed Hare’s Ear Nymph #14-16 and a few Pheasant Tail Nymphs in the same size.  Use 9ft leader tipped with 6x and cast everywhere. This is a good stream to learn on. Get a bike, pack a lunch and enjoy it any month  of the year.  I’ve fished the West Fork for almost 20 years.  Sometimes it’s hot and sometimes it’s not…never give up on it, though.  It’s a great little stream if given half the chance!

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Has anyone fished the West Fork of the San Gabriel (Southern Ca.)  lately?  I see they are planting trout weekly.  If you have (fished) what are the taking , where is the best area etc.                   Thanks, Becky

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Question:

Any west coast trail experts out there?  Please feel free to answer some, all, or none of these questions.  I have read the Sierra Club guidebook, now I’m looking for a little more personal and/or personal advice" (paraphrased quotation). I’m planning my trip in May.  Am I setting myself up for a lot of mud and rain? One book implied that the average rainfall in May is not too bad. If I hit the low tides I’m hoping to do a bunch of beach walking, so that might get rid of the mud.  Comments? I’ve got favorable tides (low tides in the afternoon) from May 13 That gives me, say, 8 days of reasonable tides for beach walking. My wife and I aren’t very good at getting up early, so an ideal tide would maybe reach it’s low at 15:00.  We’d then hike from 12:00 to 16:00 and not worry about getting caught by rising tides. It sounds like the southern section is where I’ll really apreciate low tides (to get around Owens pt, for example) so I’m thinking of flying or driving out to the Island on the 8th-10th, leaving the car in Victoria, taking the bus (or the bus and The Lady Rose) to Bamfield, starting to hike on the 12th.  Then if we spend the planned 10 days/9 nights we’ll get out on the 21st. That’ll give us the 21st/22nd to get to Victoria (is this hard?  Does the Knight Limousine Service still operate?) to reclaim our car and the 22nd to the 24th to drive back to Calgary (or fly back, sans car of course.) Sound reasonable? If you had 10 days to spend on the trail, how many of them would you hike?  Would you hike all 10 (an average of 7.5 km/day?) or would you spend a day or two in the middle somewhere just beachcoming and relaxing and seducing your spouse or S/O . (Is it *possible* to seduce your spouse or s/o if you’re both soaking wet from all the rain and you only have freeze-dried food?).  Where’s the best place for these sort of activities? Where’s the best fishing?  How can I find out more about the fishing? I’m not normally a fisherman, but hey, I’ve got 10 days.  And if I catch some fish I could even stretch our food supply to 11 or 12 days. How warm can I expect it to be? How hard is it *really* to cross Nitinat Narrows?  Does anyone actually ever have to wait for more then a day for the friendly Indians to ferry you across in May?  If so, should I hike from the south to the north so that I can relax after the crossing on the better beaches in the north half?  (Or are the better beaches in the south?) THANK YOU IN ADVANCE.  Please, if you’re too busy to answer all my questions, just email me something.  If I get enough somethings it will be better then one detailed response. (Man, am I ever looking forward to this vacation!) — "Wow, it’s like a ‘Calvin and Hobbes’ fantasy but without the "Dilbert" talking about Internet. — – — – — – — – — – — – — – — – — – — – — – — – — John E. Abraham                 ryryryryry   /    Mathematical Modelling ******* Current research:  Transportation and Land Use Interaction ******* trombone/piano/harmonica blues/jazz/rock player < backpacker < traveller

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People have swum the English Channel and the Nitinat Narrows would be considerably easier but the full pack would make it interesting. It is just as well I waited the 15 minutes for the boat ride.

Natural selection in action. Please DO NOT attempt to swim across Nitinat Narrows.  It is a tidal surge channel with dangerous undercurrents.  It may look relatively calm compared to the ocean nearby, but strong swimmers have died trying to cross. I have never heard of someone foolish enough to try.  Every book, map, etc. states that people have died, and it is passable only by boat.

Artificial selection in action.   Resident Cynic, Rock of Ages Home for Retired Hackers   {uunet,mailrus,other gateways}!ames!eugene Second Favorite email message: Returned mail: Cannot send message for 3 days A Ref: Mathematics and Plausible Reasoning, vol. 1, G. Polya

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I’m planning my trip in May.  Am I setting myself up for a lot of mud and rain?

We went in May last year and had a great trip, not many people, only two out of six days rain and not much mud.  Saw a bear on the trail (A worry!), but none around campsites, although always hung our food. We took the Lady Rose after hitching to Port Alberni, which involved next to no waiting at the side of the road and then at the south end,the Port Renfrew Connector to Victoria. How hard is it *really* to cross Nitinat Narrows?  Does anyone actually ever have to wait for more then a day for the friendly Indians to ferry you across in May?  If so, should I hike from the south to the north so that I can relax after the crossing on the better beaches in the north half?  (Or are the better beaches in the south?)

Forget it and wait. The southern boardwalks were very slippery!! particularily for my wife who had some newer boots on; Did one nice loop ending head first in a bog! Do you have your permit yet?  They have started requiring permits since last year. May is not the most popular month and we got ours at about this time last year.  Call Pacific Rim National Park and they’ll have the number to book it. Ian McKirdy Canada Centre for Remote Sensing Ottawa, Ontario  K1S 0Y7 613 947-1318 om mani padme hum

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Be prepared for rain.  I went 2 years ago and was caught in a near hurricane which forced the park service to close the trail for 3 days.  80 MPH winds and 2-3 inches of rain per day for 3 days straight.  Climbing down those ladders, covered with moss, with rain slushing down, rungs missing, and feeling the support anchors pulling out while wearing a 55lb pack was quite a thrill!   Once the storm cleared, myself and 4 other hikers had the trail to ourselves.  Although one woman came down with a fever and had to be helicoptered out, and two other silly hikers tried to wade across the Carmanah River after the heavy rains and lost all their gear when they were swept off their feet and nearly washed out to sea.  Luckily they managed to get to the Carmanah lighthouse, where they too were helicoptered out.  (A huge sitka spruce had fallen across the cable crossing…and was the main reason for the trail closure.)  The rest of us waited out the storm, until the water level was below our ankles. (The tip in the WCT trail book about crossing at low tide is a joke if the rivers are swollen with rain.) Whenever possible, travel the beach route.  There’s a beautiful campsite at Owen’s point.  If you’re a purist hike to Owen’s instead of taking the launch.  On the other hand, don’t miss out on the bogs either.  The bogs have elevated cedar walkways for the most part. I had no trouble hiking the trail in 7 days.  But I wish I’d taken a few extra days.  In particular, there are some interesting side trails such as a primitive trail up the Carmanah Valley. The best tip I can give you is to park your car at the Northern end of the trail, and then pay $10 to the Pachenat Band to drive you to the Southern end along the backroads (takes 3-4 hours).  That way you end up back at your car when you are done. A boat is required to cross Ninstints narrows.  I had to wait 4 hours for a ride.  Although, at slack tide you may be able wave down a passing fisherman.  I think the fee was $5, and you can buy a cold beer from the chief. You can probably buy or bum salmon/crabs off the fishermen and natives.  I was offered a 10lb Coho while waiting at the Narrows. Don’t drink the water!  Watch for black bear.  Climbing rope is useful if you go off trail.  Checkout Adrenalin Surge channel if you have a death wish. Good luck and have fun!   -bill

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People have swum the English Channel and the Nitinat Narrows would be considerably easier but the full pack would make it interesting. It is just as well I waited the 15 minutes for the boat ride. I hitchhiked from Bamfield to Port Renfrew and was assured by a park staff person that it would be quite easy to do so. It took me ten rides and 24 hours and some walking to do it. Nearly everybody who came by gave me a ride but there are few people on the logging roads that connect the two places and they are working and only going to the next turnoff.

Response:

People have swum the English Channel and the Nitinat Narrows would be considerably easier but the full pack would make it interesting. It is just as well I waited the 15 minutes for the boat ride.

Please DO NOT attempt to swim across Nitinat Narrows.  It is a tidal surge channel with dangerous undercurrents.  It may look relatively calm compared to the ocean nearby, but strong swimmers have died trying to cross. I have never heard of someone foolish enough to try.  Every book, map, etc. states that people have died, and it is passable only by boat. Dave Lee

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 Abraham) writes: I’m planning my trip in May.  Am I setting myself up for a lot of mud and rain?

I would definitely be prepared for rain and mud.  You may be lucky and hit a dry week, but spring on the west coast trail means a healthy amount of rain. It has been a very dry winter this year so it may not be as bad as normal. One book implied that the average rainfall in May is not too bad. If I hit the low tides I’m hoping to do a bunch of beach walking, so that might get rid of the mud.  Comments?

If you plan it properly you can do a lot of beach walking.  This is the most scenic part of the trip and well worth the planning it takes to get on and off the beaches at the right times.  Remember, some beaches only have one exit trail amidst very steep cliffs and if you get caught by the tide it can be a difficult situation. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’ve got favorable tides (low tides in the afternoon) from May 13 That gives me, say, 8 days of reasonable tides for beach walking. My wife and I aren’t very good at getting up early, so an ideal tide would maybe reach it’s low at 15:00.  We’d then hike from 12:00 to 16:00 and not worry about getting caught by rising tides. It sounds like the southern section is where I’ll really apreciate low tides (to get around Owens pt, for example) so I’m thinking of flying or driving out to the Island on the 8th-10th, leaving the car in Victoria, taking the bus (or the bus and The Lady Rose) to Bamfield, starting to hike on the 12th.  Then if we spend the planned 10 days/9 nights we’ll get out on the 21st. That’ll give us the 21st/22nd to get to Victoria (is this hard?  Does the Knight Limousine Service still operate?) to reclaim our car and the 22nd to the 24th to drive back to Calgary (or fly back, sans car of course.)

There is bus service back to Victoria, but I don’t remember the name of it. Hitch-hiking is also very possible to get back to Victoria. Lots of people will give rides to trail hikers.  Ten days is plenty of time to enjoy the trail with no need to rush. If you had 10 days to spend on the trail, how many of them would you hike?  Would you hike all 10 (an average of 7.5 km/day?) or would you spend a day or two in the middle somewhere just beachcoming and relaxing and seducing your spouse or S/O . (Is it *possible* to seduce your spouse or s/o if you’re both soaking wet from all the rain and you only have freeze-dried food?).  Where’s the best place for these sort of activities?

Five to six days of hiking is usually plenty to do the trail.  A nice side trip is up Nitinat river to Nitinat Lake.  You can camp beside the lake and do some fishing.  Usually very private for seduction type encounters.  The lake is tidal, but fresh water is available for washing, etc. Where’s the best fishing?  How can I find out more about the fishing? I’m not normally a fisherman, but hey, I’ve got 10 days.  And if I catch some fish I could even stretch our food supply to 11 or 12 days.

Depends on how much you carry, how much you eat, and how good a fisherman (person) you are. How warm can I expect it to be?

Cool during the day and cold at night. Probably not below 0 C however. How hard is it *really* to cross Nitinat Narrows?  Does anyone actually ever have to wait for more then a day for the friendly Indians to ferry you across in May?  If so, should I hike from the south to the north so that I can relax after the crossing on the better beaches in the north half?  (Or are the better beaches in the south?)

Don’t try to cross Nitinat narrows without a boat.  You will see what I mean when you get there.  Not a problem getting a boat ride across from the local natives.  They will offer to sell you some beer, and it will seem very tempting, especially if it is hot, but it can be very difficult to hike after drinking even one beer. THANK YOU IN ADVANCE.  Please, if you’re too busy to answer all my questions, just email me something.  If I get enough somethings it will be better then one detailed response. (Man, am I ever looking forward to this vacation!)

Its a beautiful trip.  I’m sure that you will enjoy it very much no matter what weather you encounter. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – — "Wow, it’s like a ‘Calvin and Hobbes’ fantasy but without the "Dilbert" talking about Internet. — – — – — – — – — – — – — – — – — – — – — – — – — John E. Abraham                 ryryryryry   /    Mathematical Modelling ******* Current research:  Transportation and Land Use Interaction ******* trombone/piano/harmonica blues/jazz/rock player < backpacker < traveller

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