Question:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I will sponsor "Flies of the World" for the first fly tying information swap.  What I propose to offer is one fly tied of the following sets. 1.  your single most successful dry fly 2.  caddis, caddis, caddis all three stages. 3.  anything may fly from one nymph, dun, spinner, spent. 4.  your favorite terrestrial, INCLUDING dragon fly, crane, etc. 5.  your favorite stone fly dry and nymph 6.  parachute anything 7.  emergers, emergers, emergers diptera, caddis, etc. 8.  Fresh water Streamer.  Salt Water Streamer. 9.  Steelhead Fly 10. Salmon Fly Each fly will be photographed and if the tier can provide tying photos, all the better.  Each fly should have a photo of tier at vise.  Each fly should have a narration of how to tie it and also the why of it and how and when it is used.  The story is vital.  Latin terms are welcome and fly tying book references of pattern used also encouraged.  "I tied this fly up using Ernie Schwiebert’s book on "Nymphs" found on page # xxx. (for example) Those who are interested and who offer up their talents, will be entered into our companies "Flies of the World Wide Web Site" which is viewed all over the world.  I hope to make this a major factor in the world of fly fishing information over the Internet. This is an "Intellectual Swap" each tier becomes part of a major data base of fly tying information in an electronic book where I hope to keep you preserved for all time. The tying format outline will constructed so everyone uses the same quality steps from "Hook Size & Make" all the way through to finished product.  Each tier will have a full page display and lay out all their own for EACH FLY offered. We will reserve the right to edit and help the lay outs as much as possible so each tier is presented in the best light and as interesting as possible. The comments of our Flies of the World gets each month is remarkable and the interest on going.  We just need more of the same from serious fly tiers and fishermen just like you. Materials of all kinds are found in unusual places and sometimes it is helpful if a rare material’s source is divulged.  Synthetics are allowed for one major reason.  To make the first fly out of Polar Bear requires the death of a magnificent animal.  Yet, there are sources where old taxidermy mounts are salvaged and someone has a large piece they are willing to share, or better yet a synthetic that is used which safeguards Polar Bears from further hunting just to tie that first fly. It simply makes sense that synthetics be allowed and especially when some of them make it difficult to tell the difference between them and the real thing.  We are here to learn and we are here to contribute to a finer world of fly fishing through helping each other and wildlife in general as best we can. Anyhow, this will be Rofft’s place in the sun where dreams, reality, and the final product are shown and preserved for all mankind.  We want to know what you look like and we want your stories and thoughts.  It makes no difference if you can spell or not.  Its your enthusiasm that counts. The above layout of flies can be submitted one fly at a time but each tier should have a chance to include what is important at their pace for each fly takes thought and it is, as I’ve always said, "A contemplative man’s sport." I expect to reach "A Thousand & One" fly patterns in time.  I want YOU to be part of what fly fishing is about to you and hopefully that you will share a little of it with others.  I  hope some of you like this idea, can use it to promote quality concepts and who are willing to donate a little of your time to help others . . . all over the world. This generation of Roffian Tiers needs to be preserved for the future. I want you to be part of it.  I bar no man of sport. — George Gehrke Mr. Gink  

Question:

JB said..   Speaking of which, I’d be interested in any observations you might   care to share on inverted spin recovery.  JB Long time since I’ve been spinning in anything other than a car Paul. Thank god for that (given what you "drive" nowdays…) Take out an "l" for email reply

Response:

It took a lot of practice, and I seem to remember some pretty awful results, but I eventually got it down. In the end I decided not to use it in the display, as the only people who would appreciate it were other pilots (and most would simply be glad they weren’t in the aircraft with me). I could only do it in one direction too. Going the other way, the inverted fuel tank would run out of gas before I could make it past roughly 270

Question:

Check with Fish First Fly shop in Chico. 167 E 3rd St. Chico CA 95928 Tel (530) 343-8300 Fax (530) 343-8934 Their web site is www.fishfirst.com

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I just resently moved to Chico and I love to flyu fish.  I’m don’t know where any good local fishing spots are near by.  If anyone could help me with some streams to fish and some flys to use here in Butte County I would appreciate it Thank you.

Response:

I just resently moved to Chico and I love to flyu fish.  I’m don’t know where any good local fishing spots are near by.  If anyone could help me with some streams to fish and some flys to use here in Butte County I would appreciate it Thank you.

Response:

Question:

Hi Likely to visit BC in Aug 2001. Have read a magazine article on pink salmon fishing, which sounds good. Is it really, or is this just magazine hype? Fishing on Harrison and Vedder rivers. Any advice on fishing, flies etc. much appreciated. Chris

Response:

Haven’t experienced it, but apparently if you look up "crowded" in an illustrated dictionary, there’s a picture of the Vedder. JR – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Likely to visit BC in Aug 2001. Have read a magazine article on pink salmon fishing, which sounds good. Is it really, or is this just magazine hype? Fishing on Harrison and Vedder rivers. Any advice on fishing, flies etc. much appreciated.

Response:

Hi Likely to visit BC in Aug 2001. Have read a magazine article on pink salmon fishing, which sounds good. Is it really, or is this just magazine hype? Fishing on Harrison and Vedder rivers. Any advice on fishing, flies etc. much appreciated. Chris

Chris, I lived in Alaska for a few years and Pacific Salmon fishing in BC should be about the same.  Try not to target Pink Salmon is you intend to eat what you catch.  Pink Salmon, especially after 3 minutes in fresh water, is barely about one step below most cat food.  In August, you may be able to get some early Silver/Coho Salmon which fight like a bastard and are excellent eating.  Whatever you do, don’t bother eating any Pink Salmon caught in fresh water. Most of the Salmon fishing I did with a fly rod was done with egg pattern flies.  This is about the only type of fly to use.  Dry flies would be an entire waste of time, and streamers wouldn’t be as effective.  A double-egger on a long-shank size 6 hook is good, these are commercially available and I wouldn’t bother tying my own.  They are certainly not works of art by any stretch of the imagination and will probably be worn out after half a dozen or so fish. Salmon rivers are usually subjected to a significant amount of fishing pressure, so you might not be all alone when you fish.  The general technique was a simple roll cast and drift.  Over and over and over. Some lead 12-24" from the ‘fly’, enough to keep the lead bouncing off of the bottom, is generally required to be successful.  If possible, fishing in tidal areas on incoming tides is best. Good luck, and enjoy your trip. Tom G Before you buy.

Response:

It’s not hype. Hit the runs just right and you can hook 2 or 3 dozen fish in a few hours. The Harrison alone supports runs exceeding a million fish. The best fishing is from the last week of Sept into the 1st half of Oct. Flies are simple. Size #8 of bright pink or cerise. A sparse wing of bucktail or synthetic. A bright body of tinsel. Use a sink tip or a mono-core line. If you need additional advice email me at: – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Likely to visit BC in Aug 2001. Have read a magazine article on pink salmon fishing, which sounds good. Is it really, or is this just magazine hype? Fishing on Harrison and Vedder rivers. Any advice on fishing, flies etc. much appreciated. Chris

Response:

For several years we have gone to Vancouver Island about that time and fished  for pinks, and coho.  We have taken to using the fly rods for pinks and either trolling or casting flies from the boat in the bays.  Last trip 3 of us had over 30 pinks in an hour on the fly rods.  Pink and red hootchies in the smallest size worked well for trolling and egg flies when casting. There were so many at times that they fought over the flies. I second the motion on eating them. Don’t if they have been in fresh water at all and they aren’t very good still in salt either. Ted – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Likely to visit BC in Aug 2001. Have read a magazine article on pink salmon fishing, which sounds good. Is it really, or is this just magazine hype? Fishing on Harrison and Vedder rivers. Any advice on fishing, flies etc. much appreciated. Chris Chris, I lived in Alaska for a few years and Pacific Salmon fishing in BC should be about the same.  Try not to target Pink Salmon is you intend to eat what you catch.  Pink Salmon, especially after 3 minutes in fresh water, is barely about one step below most cat food.  In August, you may be able to get some early Silver/Coho Salmon which fight like a bastard and are excellent eating.  Whatever you do, don’t bother eating any Pink Salmon caught in fresh water. Most of the Salmon fishing I did with a fly rod was done with egg pattern flies.  This is about the only type of fly to use.  Dry flies would be an entire waste of time, and streamers wouldn’t be as effective.  A double-egger on a long-shank size 6 hook is good, these are commercially available and I wouldn’t bother tying my own.  They are certainly not works of art by any stretch of the imagination and will probably be worn out after half a dozen or so fish. Salmon rivers are usually subjected to a significant amount of fishing pressure, so you might not be all alone when you fish.  The general technique was a simple roll cast and drift.  Over and over and over. Some lead 12-24" from the ‘fly’, enough to keep the lead bouncing off of the bottom, is generally required to be successful.  If possible, fishing in tidal areas on incoming tides is best. Good luck, and enjoy your trip. Tom G Before you buy.

Response:

I second the motion on eating them. Don’t if they have been in fresh water at all and they aren’t very good still in salt either. Ted

a saltwater pink salmon is fine to eat.  it is milder and less oily than coho.  the thing you must do is bleed the fish and get it on ice pronto… and eat it the same day. in the saltwater fisheries i fish, pinks are just by-catch during coho fishing. in august on the west coast of van. island the coho should be running pretty good.  while i fish the offshore waters between washington and van. island… i can bet the offshore fishing all down the west coast of the island will be pretty damn good… especially if next season resembles this past coho season.  i’m pretty sure there will also be some pink salmon fishing along many of the islands beaches. as for whether pinks are just magazine hype, it depends on who you ask.   cb

Response:

Question:

We are going on a backpacking excursion through SE Asia (Thailand, Cambodia, Vietnam, Malaysia, Indonesia, China, Brunei, Singapore) for about 6 months. We think that we would like to have a very open itinerary, i.e.-fly to Bangkok, get around however we see fit, and then fly home whenever we’ve had enough. Our options seem to be an open-jaw to a central place like Bangkok, or one of the around-the-world type flights (which may be too restrictive for us). We’re planning everything else well, but are having trouble deciding how to actually fly. Any help or ideas out there? There are so many bucket shops offering deals, it becomes overwhelming. Thanks for all the help we’ve recieved from this newsgroup! Kevin Oppenheimer, D.V.M. and Sandy Raders, D.V.M. To reply by email, please remove "NOSPAM" from address Once you go Mac, you’ll never go back. "The curious thing about fishing is that you never want to go home. If you catch something, you can’t stop. If you don’t catch anything, you hate to leave in case something might bite."

Question:

I agree…I’ll never forget …I sent a friends brother a joke and of course the header contained all the addresses and names of other friends….this guy ’s brother sent everyone of them ads for his vitamins etc….I was very up[set that this guy would take advantage.. But people will do anything for a buck and fly fishing is no exception!

Response:

rummy,                                                                                  I think they all do it everywhere!It ain’t just here!From   Mr. G to me. (don’t confuse us though)Whether it’s proper or not I’m not sure !Oh by the way if your planning a trip to the Smokies I live here & I’m a guide & fltyer who specializes in southern appalachian patterns if you need any contact me at

Response:

What’s your point! Wayne to fish is human…to release divine (junk snipped)  comments on the above would be very interesting. Tom Montauk Point

Response:

Anybody notice how many more ads are appearing on this site in the guise of good ol boy conversation. Everything from folksy advise and down home humor from tackle store owners who just happen to include their address and phone number to a guy trying to push his fly line and wax as a gesture of frienship to us all.   No matter how you cut it, they are commercial solicitations for business.   Is this what we want?  Is this the future of this site?  If this is what the majority wants its fine with me but it is a sure bet if this type of folksy ill-disguised  hustling continues unabated, it will eventually take over. comments on the above would be very interesting. Tom Montauk Point

Hi Tom:         Two of the people that I have the most respect for, on this group, are Bill Kiene and Al Beatty. Al’s been gone mostly since taking a job with Hoffman Hackle and that was our loss, especially in the area of tying techniques. Bill’s been a great source of info regarding product and destinations. I’ve never seen a post from either of them that they didn’t offer some valuable information often to questions that they’ve answered many times over the last few years.         Tag lines can also give some basis for credability in an uncontrolled medium that has more than it’s share of poor information. Bill knows what product passes through his store and how satisfied his clients are with that product. In a retail position he also handles and uses a lot more stuff than most of us are familiar with or will use in several years. When someone asks about travel destinations or lodges he can offer some good objective information as someone that’s been to a number of different places, rather than a guy that made one trip several years ago. The guy that went to Mexico once can offer some helpful info based on his trip but the guy I really want to hear from is the one who has been there at several different times, seasons and locations. He’s got the experience to compare one place or time from another.         I’ve been guiding in Southwest Alaska for several years and lived on the Kenai Peninsula prior to that. I generally restrict my responses to guestions of those areas,and when I do respond I’ll usually include the name of the lodge where I work.         I’ve been on this group since 93 and I post very little and read perhaps 10% of the threads here each day. I lost my interest a long time ago in answering another thread on the best way to tie on a dropper or how to cast with lead. I do however have a lot of respect for guys like Bill and Al that have offered  a lot of very good and objective information over the years and I’ve never seen them hyping themselves or their products. Jim McGrath

Response:

amazingly witty words: Anybody notice how many more ads are appearing on this site in the guise of good ol boy conversation. Everything from folksy advise and down home humor from tackle store owners who just happen to include their address and phone number to a guy trying to push his fly line and wax as a gesture of frienship to us all.   No matter how you cut it, they are commercial solicitations for business.   Is this what we want?  Is this the future of this site?  If this is what the majority wants its fine with me but it is a sure bet if this type of folksy ill-disguised  hustling continues unabated, it will eventually take over. comments on the above would be very interesting. Tom Montauk Point

I feel there are two types of advertising.  On the one side there is the advertising that is actually benifitial to the consumer (and I don’t mean by the product being advertised).  For example, television commercials pay for the programing seen on the t.v., banners on websites allow for certain websites to remain open, etc.   Then there is the unacceptable (in my opinion) advertising.  For example, junk mail (I hate it), road side billboards (I hate ‘em even more), and spam (I REALLY hate this!).  This type of advertising does not provide the consumer with anything in return for the advertising. Now I bring up the point I want to make, Mr. G.  Where does he fall in these catagories?  Well, I feel that he (other than the accidental mass mailing) falls within the former.  He advertises in this group but, he also contributes more than probably 75% of the people that read ROFF.  Personally, I don’t like the advertising (I hate almost every form of it) but I feel that since Mr. G contributes so much to this group, he has earned the right to advertise (if you don’t like it, don’t read his posts). Brian (the slightly drunk and pondering) Hailey

Response:

 ….    Two of the people that I have the most respect for, on this group, are Bill Kiene and Al Beatty. Al’s been gone mostly since taking a job with Hoffman Hackle and that was our loss, especially in the area of tying techniques. Bill’s been a great source of info regarding product and destinations. …..

I talked to Al last night at the San Meteo Show and yes he is up to his neck in Hoffman feathers. He doesn’t read hear much or for that matter even post. He said he could be reached at the boards at the flyhop.com, mainly because he is the main judge of all the tying contests that Hoffman sponsors. — Doug Knight                                     metalfab<atpacbell.net Junk e-mail, solicitation, sales, products and services gladly accepted at $500.00 per mailing and billed directly to your ISP.

Response:

Very good point. The question is what can we do about it? It’s fine and dandy foe someone to advertize a personal sale of a rod, reel or other item he has no use for, but to push their commercial goods on this newsgroup is really cheap! Advertise in one or all of the many publications available. I’m sure more sales will come of that and less flyfishers will be offended. We need this space to share, inquire and discuss our hobby & sport. I don’t have the time or inclination to navigate through so much spam to find an interestig message. Get off our turf! – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Anybody notice how many more ads are appearing on this site in the guise of good ol boy conversation. Everything from folksy advise and down home humor from tackle store owners who just happen to include their address and phone number to a guy trying to push his fly line and wax as a gesture of frienship to us all.   No matter how you cut it, they are commercial solicitations for business.   Is this what we want?  Is this the future of this site?  If this is what the majority wants its fine with me but it is a sure bet if this type of folksy ill-disguised  hustling continues unabated, it will eventually take over. comments on the above would be very interesting. Tom Montauk Point

Response:

Tom your right that this is an interesting issue. I’d be interested to hear what other think as well. There is no question that get rich quick and send money message (or those promoting sex sites) are not appropriate for this board but what about those message that are related to fly fishing. I mean this is a fly fishing board and posts whether promoting a fly fishing product or a fly fishing site I think should be allowed and welcomed as this is related to the topic of the newsgroup right? Much like a fly fishing magazine you have great articles editorials, heck in resources like events listed and among all those great articles and resource you have ad related to the topic of the magazine promoting products and services related to fly fishing. It would be one thing to have someone post everyday saying the same thing its another thing when someone posts once a week or twice a month about something related to fly fishing that others might enjoy right? How does everyone feel about this. I’m very interested in others views as this has become a continuing problems for business owners, site owners, and newsgroup viewers as well as the general public related to spam message and unsolicited email and such. Thanks for bring this up Tom it was a good idea to get everyone talking about this. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Anybody notice how many more ads are appearing on this site in the guise of good ol boy conversation. Everything from folksy advise and down home humor from tackle store owners who just happen to include their address and phone number to a guy trying to push his fly line and wax as a gesture of frienship to us all.   No matter how you cut it, they are commercial solicitations for business.   Is this what we want?  Is this the future of this site?  If this is what the majority wants its fine with me but it is a sure bet if this type of folksy ill-disguised  hustling continues unabated, it will eventually take over.  comments on the above would be very interesting. Tom Montauk Point

Response:

Anybody notice how many more ads are appearing on this site in the guise of good ol boy conversation. Everything from folksy advise and down home humor from tackle store owners who just happen to include their address and phone number to a guy trying to push his fly line and wax as a gesture of frienship to us all.

Yeah, I know how you feel. It used to bum me out too until I downloaded SpamOff!  (the usenet nntp filtering software that removes spam on the fly) from http://www.spamoff.com !   No matter how you cut it, they are commercial solicitations for business.   Is this what we want?  Is this the future of this site?  

It’s not what I want! In fact I think it’s high time we took charge of this situation.  A good first step is probably downloading SpamOff! from http://www.spamoff.com Maybe if none of us read their stupid ads they’ll go away! If this is what the majority wants its fine with me but it is a sure bet if this type of folksy ill-disguised  hustling continues unabated, it will eventually take over.

Sometimes I feel like it already has! Or I used to, anyway, in the pre-SpamOff! days. The days before some kind soul pointed me toward http://www.spamoff.com where I found the usenet nntp filtering software that removes spam on the fly.  comments on the above would be very interesting.

Actually there might be some more comments on one of my favorite WWW discussion forums, http://www.spamoff.com, there’s a message board on these types of issues on that site. (PS: While you’re there you might want to download a FREE demo version of SpamOff! It’s the usenet nntp filtering software that removes spam on the fly!)

Response:

Anybody notice how many more ads are appearing on this site in the guise of good ol boy conversation. Everything from folksy advise and down home humor from tackle store owners who just happen to include their address and phone number to a guy trying to push his fly line and wax as a gesture of frienship to us all. Yeah, I know how you feel. It used to bum me out too until I downloaded SpamOff!  (the usenet nntp filtering software that removes spam on the fly) from http://www.spamoff.com !

Is this a spam for SpamOff? BTW, I couldn’t find a DNS entry for that URL. Maybe their server is down, or maybe they no longer exist.

Response:

Yeah, I know how you feel. It used to bum me out too until I downloaded SpamOff!  (the usenet nntp filtering software that removes spam on the fly) from http://www.spamoff.com ! Is this a spam for SpamOff? BTW, I couldn’t find a DNS entry for that URL. Maybe their server is down, or maybe they no longer exist.

It was a joke…or at least that’s what I took it to be. Cute though.      - Ken — "Time is but the stream I go a-fishin in. I drink at it, but while I drink I see the sandy bottom and detect how shallow it is. It’s thin current slides away, but eternity remains."     – H.D. Thoreau

Response:

        Two of the people that I have the most respect for, on this group, are Bill Kiene and Al Beatty. Al’s been gone mostly since taking a job with Hoffman Hackle and that was our loss, especially in the area of tying techniques. Bill’s been a great source of info regarding product and destinations. I’ve never seen a post from either of them that they didn’t offer some valuable information often to questions that they’ve answered many times over the last few years.

snip Jim – I agree completely.  Has the sun returned yet up there? mark Faulkner

Response:

Smokey,     I come down to the smokey’s 3 or 4 times a year (sometimes I fish the motor trail on the north end of the park) Maybe we can hook up a time or two this year if the price is right ! Good Luck David – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – rummy,          I think they all do it everywhere!It ain’t just here!From   Mr. G to me. (don’t confuse us though)Whether it’s proper or not I’m not sure !Oh by the way if your planning a trip to the Smokies I live here & I’m a guide & fltyer who specializes in southern appalachian patterns if you need any contact me at

Response:

(the usenet nntp filtering software that removes spam on the fly) from http://www.spamoff.com !

If you have spam on the fly, wouldn’t that be considered bait fishing?? Inquiring minds want to know. George Adams

Response:

Anybody notice how many more ads are appearing on this site in the guise of good ol boy conversation. Everything from folksy advise and down home humor from tackle store owners who just happen to include their address and phone number to a guy trying to push his fly line and wax as a gesture of frienship to us all.   No matter how you cut it, they are commercial solicitations for business.   Is this what we want?  Is this the future of this site?  If this is what the majority wants its fine with me but it is a sure bet if this type of folksy ill-disguised  hustling continues unabated, it will eventually take over.  comments on the above would be very interesting. Tom Montauk Point

Response:

Question:

Where can I buy some fly fish?

Response:

Where can I buy some fly fish?

You can buy some really "fly" fish at the Homeboy ShoppingClub.  They gots the flyest and the most freshest fish they is Homey! — Gordon Churchill Flyfish NC http://www.planet-nc.com/flyfishnc/ Striped Bass on the Roanoke River, Hybrids on Jordan Lake, Largemouths on surface.  Pickup and dropoff in Research Triangle Park

Response:

: Where can I buy some fly fish? I tell you what… you come over and paint my ceiling, Mike, and I’ll give you some fly fish. — Rick T. Rick Fletcher   –   http://www.chem.uidaho.edu/~fletcher/ Associate professor of chemistry  |  That’s Idaho, not Iowa.    | ad hominem University of Idaho               |  Upper Left Hand Corner.    | ad hominem Moscow, ID 83844-2343             |  No, I don’t grow potatoes. | ad hominem

Response:

Where can I buy some fly fish?

On the waterfront at Oistins, Barbados.  Delicious fried. — |  Donald Phillipson, 4180 Boundary Road, Carlsbad Springs,  | |        Ontario, Canada, K0A 1K0, tel. 613 822 0734         |

Response:

Question:

  Newsgroups: rec.outdoors.fishing.fly  Organization: ARG!   We were coming to Oregon this spring, me and my tourist dollars.   We’re heading to Washington state now.     TimW

We have a couple sections of fly-only in this state too.  Of course, like Oregon it amounts to about 0.0001% of the total, but there is some fly only water here too. e.g.         -Canyon section of upper Kalama         -N. Fork Stillaguamish (15 April – 31 Nov).         -Pass Lake In the case of the N.Fork Stilly, it is open for all tackle 1/2 the year (winter) and fly only in the summer.  This regulation dates back to a group of steelhead flyfishers who were way ahead of their time back in the 30’s and 40’s.  I fish this river quite a bit. The amount of garbage that accumulates each winter on the stilly is obscene.  By the end of the summer, it is mostly gone.  You don’t have to be a "rocket scientist" to figure out what is going on here. Our all-tackle rivers are filled with garbage.  The per-capita contribution of flyfishers is orders of magnitude less than that of the all-tackle group.  In many cases, the claims about the different methods of fishing, and their impact on the fish and surrounds is not without basis. Call me "elitist", but I am simply relating absolutely demonstrable fact from my area of experience. -tgades

Response:

Oregon:    I think that you are ignoring (insensitive?) the fact that for anadromous species such as steelhead that flyfishers and the baitfishers work the streams differently.  In general, flyfishers work runs by casting and stepping down until all the water is covered.  The baitfishers tend to line up and park in one spot at fairly close intervals and preclude flyfishers from working runs (at least polite flyfishers which predominate here in Oregon).  I fished last weekend and was able to find only a single run that I could fish.  

I think the NG would greatly benefit if anglers at large would refrain from judging the reg’s outside of areas they are well familiar with. Being from BC I know what to say! Drift/spin fishing sometimes deliberately push flyfishers out of runs by parking themselves in a run. Load the whole run shoulder to shoulder and you and I may as well go home. I’ve also been cheesed by some who when I talk of the need for C&R on west coast streams that simply aren’t fertile enough to support more than a few hundred adult steelhead chastise me for fishing there at all. However I’ve been able ti bite my tongue and stay polite. Ask a few questions 1st then venture an opinion folks!       Ralph H

Response:

Wait a sec, Bill.  If this was about a ’seriously declining fishery’ (guessing the N.Umpqua,) why allow any fishing at all?  Is fishing for those natives with a flyline of some kind easier on them than using the same fly on a drift rig?  And why change all of the new regs to protect one stretch of one river? responds to some of these questions).  I have heard that some of the fly fishers in the area have voiced concern about the use of sink tips and weighted flies.  Some say it is a dry fly vs wet/weighted fly flap, but clearly the take with dries (regardless of C&R) would be far smaller than is now the case.

Well, sure, but if the goal is to reduce take, why not just go ahead and shut the whole fishery down? The amazing thing is that Bill & Co. can claim that flyfishers are the only fishers that should be allowed to harass what they themselves admit is a depressed stock.  If that isn’t arrogance, I don’t know what it is.   The coordination of the FF’ing organizations that fought this thing is pretty damned impressive, but it was still a tantrum as far as I can tell. Your comment about this being the only stretch of water now limited to fly fishing equipment is mistaken.

Actually, I never said it was the only fly-only water.  I’m not sure what bit you’re referinig to, so: Above, I was asking why the ‘coalition’ that fought for the old regs to be reinstatedon all original fly water if it was only the N.Umpqua fish they were worried about (and I was only assuming Bill *was* talking about the N.Ump.) Below, you’ll find what was meant to be a bit of sarcasm; as in, the old fly-only regulations themselves were the ’seriously declining fishery’ in question, and not the N.Ump or wherever.  Didn’t make much sense, I guess Dave DeLacey Corvallis, Or. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Maybe you meant that the ‘fly-only’ deal was a seriously declining fishery. Or maybe I don’t know enough about the issues, either.  Would you mind filling me in? Dave DeLacey

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  Newsgroups: rec.outdoors.fishing.fly   I’m surprised that those three waters are the only ff only in the state.   I was under the impression (from my spincast days of yore) that there   were others.

Sorry to mislead.  I think that there are a couple others beside the Stilly, Kalama and Pass Lake, but I have not ever fished them.  I think that there are a couple little lakes and also a section of the Yakima? -tgades

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –   Newsgroups: rec.outdoors.fishing.fly  Organization: ARG!   We were coming to Oregon this spring, me and my tourist dollars.   We’re heading to Washington state now.   TimW We have a couple sections of fly-only in this state too.  Of course, like Oregon it amounts to about 0.0001% of the total, but there is some fly only water here too. e.g.         -Canyon section of upper Kalama         -N. Fork Stillaguamish (15 April – 31 Nov).         -Pass Lake

Just took a quick look at the regs from ‘96 – right away found at least one more water (Long Lake, Ferry Co.), plus an entry in the Statewide General Definitions at the front of the book: <<<<<<<<<<< "Fly Fishing Only"- In "Fly Fishing Only" waters an angler may only use the folowing tackle: a fly with a barbless single hook, hooks 1/2" or smaller when measured from point to shank, a conventional fly line (other line may be used for backing and leader if it is attached to a [sic] least 25′ of conventional fly line). An angler may not use the following: a fixed spool reel, weight attached to the leader or line [better load up the copper wrap on those nymphs, dudes!], bait, or monofilament leader that has a breaking strength of more than twelve pounds. Also found… McDowell Lake Bayley Lake July 5 – Oct. 31 Aeneas Lake …just in a quick look, and if you fish in Washington, you know that finding anything in that regs book is like spotting a smolt in the middle of the Elwah at flood stage. There are probably quite a few more. Hey, I found another grossly elitist reg in this book! Lake after lake is designated "Juvenile Only"! As a certified over-15-year-old, I want to know why our public waters are being set aside for the pleasure of a select few!  I’m going to give those bureaucrats down in Olympia a piece of my mind! Now if I could just find the number for F&W somewhere in this 120-page regs guide… Allen

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However I think tackle restrictions have to make sense and can’t be based solely on someones prejudice or bias. One thing I’ve gained from this and

That makes sense to me! other threads from you Jon, Tim W and Charlie Q is that I’m thinking more about these questions and not making mind up solely on someones ingrained bias that I’m better

Question:

-I’d like to go for trout in summertime in the mountains. -maybe somebody know a lodge for rent, nice places (colorado?) -and other useful tips?

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-I’d like to go for trout in summertime in the mountains. -maybe somebody know a lodge for rent, nice places (colorado?) -and other useful tips?

Clara: Explore TroutNet.  You’ll find all you requested and more. Have fun. Go trout fishin’. Bob O…<<…<<…<<….

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The Durango area in SW Colo has numerous great trout streams (San Juan, Dolores, Los Pinos, Animas, Florida rivers). For an upscale place to stay, with outstanding golf course, horse back riding, etc, try the Tamarron Hilton (800-678-1000), and call Duranglers Fly Shop (970-385-4081) for information and the best fly fishing guides in the area. For a more rustic small cabin, with kitchen facilities etc, located right on a fantastic trout stream (Florida River) call The O-Bar-O Guest Cabins through Durango info

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Question:

I have a baitcasting technique question. I have been a fly fisherman for some time.  I recently added spinning gear and lakes to my fishing portfolio and have REALLY enjoyed it! This xmas I moved to a baitcasting reel (Inexpensive Abu Garcia reel available via Cabelas), and a nice IM7 Cabelas baitcasting rod. I have no baitcasting fishermen friends.  So, I am on my own. I read the instructions and started practicing casting.  Backlash city. All the time.  One cast — then 30 minutes of fusing — then cutting of line and one more cast…and so on. I want to get this, but think I must be misinterpreting something. The instructions with my reel tell me to adjust the manual brake and then the magnetic brake so the lure will move about 10 inches when I jiggle the rod.  Ok…I can do that. But, the question is….."what is the role of your thumb when you are casting.  That is, do you use your thumb to lightly put pressure on the reel/line while you are casting?  Or, do you take your thumb completely away while the lure is in the air and only use your thumb to suddenly brake when the cast hits water or whatever?  Are these mechanical brakes supposed to do the job themselves?  Or, am I to actively use my thumb the hole time the cast in in progress? HELP I know this is a stupid question, but I have no baitcasting gurus around here who can help me.  My only advice so far from my other fishing buddies is to go back to my spinning gear.

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Quoting johng from a message in rec.outdoors.fishing  jo Path:  jonews1.delphi.com!news.delphi.com!news2.near.net!howland.reston.ans.net!e  jo Organization: Duke’s Fuqua School of Business  jo Lines: 28  jo NNTP-Posting-Host: piscator.fsb.duke.edu  jo X-Newsreader: WinVN 0.92.3  jo I read the instructions and started practicing casting.  Backlash city.  jo All the time.  One cast — then 30 minutes of fusing — then cutting of  jo line and one more cast…and so on. Start out with easy lob type casts, until you get your hand to eye coordination down pat. The thumb is used primarily when you see the lure touch down, at this point the reel is still spinning, it doesn’t know that the lure isn’t still going.  jo I want to get this, but think I must be misinterpreting something.  jo The instructions with my reel tell me to adjust the manual brake and  jo then the magnetic brake so the lure will move about 10 inches when I  jo jiggle the rod.  Ok…I can do that. While you are learning I would suggest you turn the magnets all the way up and tighten the manual brake a little more, until you get used to it. Also don’t cast INTO the wind, that will cause problems every time. You may also want to cast a heavier lure while you are learning, it helps.  jo But, the question is….."what is the role of your thumb when you  jo are casting.  That is, do you use your thumb to lightly put pressure on  jo the reel/line while you are casting?  Or, do you take your thumb  jocompletely away while the lure is in the air and only use your thumb  joto suddenly brake when the cast hits water or whatever? Its really a little of both, as you gain experience you will learn to "feather" your cast with your thumb, and then stop the reel when the lure reaches the target.  jo Are these  jomechanical brakes supposed to do the job themselves?  Or, am I to  joactively use my thumb the hole time the cast in in progress? See above.  jo HELP I know this is a stupid question, but I have no baitcasting  jogurus around here who can help me.  My only advice so far from my  joother fishing buddies is to go back to my spinning gear. Also if its cold out the line will stiffen up and cause some problems. Remember to keep the handles up and make easy casts to start with. Once you get used to it you’ll wonder why you didn’t do it a long time ago…<G BTW: What model reel? Some cheapies will never cast well. Its not a stupid question, at all, its just a learning process. Good luck. Greg….

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I find that if you cast as far as you can then strip out a small amount of line add a small strip of tape <not very sticky tape can keep your backlashes from going deep down into the spool and causing you a lot of problems. The tape will come off if you happen on that BIG DAWG! and he pulls out the line past the tape.   but the best thing to do is practice practice practice and when you see that jig hit the water put the brakes on .

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For years I’ve done this.  hold the rod straight out in front of you. tighten the center nob on the LEFT hand side of the real.  This is not the magnetic anti- backlash on the Right hand side of the reel.  Hit the free spool button or thumbbar release, as if you were getting ready to cast.  Turn the LEFT hand nob Away from you (loosen) just until the weight on the end of your line starts dropping.  try casting.  If you have a magnetic anti-backlash on the right hand side, you may then loosen the LEFT hand nob a little more and compensate as needed with the magnetic adjustment.  this works fine on reels without a mag helper, but you will be able to achieve more distance by fine tuning if you have a mag adjustment.  Do this whenever you switch to a different weight. Andy S.

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: I have a baitcasting technique question. : I read the instructions and started practicing casting.  Backlash city. : All the time.  One cast — then 30 minutes of fusing — then cutting of : line and one more cast…and so on. Well, if it’s any comfort that’s how I spent my first day of practice. The trick on the thumb is to control the speed of the reel given a particular line, the rigging weight, and the wind. My advice: keep gentle pressure at all times and try and slow the cast gradually so that your lure/bait drops majestically where you want it to go. It’ll beome second nature, I promise. Then, once it is second nature, you’ll never have a backlash again. What you get then are called professional overcasts. <g Here’s a tip. Reel off enough line to cover the distance you intend to be casting. Put a strip of tape across the line on the reel at that point. Any backlash will at least stop at the tape.

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I agree with practicing at home, however, when I first picked up a baitcaster, I was told that if you could cast a 1/4 oz. plug without overrun and with accuracy, you have won half of the battle.  Of course, your rod would have to be able to throw a 1/4 oz. plug (ie: be rated for it).  I have found that once I learned this, I not only learned the technique, but gained confidence as well.  I was even throwing rooster tails with my reels and catching fish.   One more thing, be sure to keep your spool control as tight as you can when first practicing.  I also think that casting the 1/4 oz. plug let me loosen the spool more after while and I was able to throw farther and with reasonable accuracy.  But this was only after a few weeks of practice.  Try it.  Just my $0.02. Just be patient and practice at home, not on the water. I suggest a lure weight of at least 1/2 ounce for starters with a rod designed for lures from 1/4 – 3/4 ounces.  The heavier the lure the easier it is to cast without backlash. I would also suggest a line rated at no more than 12 pound test, larger line backlashes easier.  Good luck and trust me, the practice is well worth it.

– Andrew R. Gherna                 |   Eastern Illinois University      |  "Keep them mowing blades sharp"

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