Question:

Finally hauled the boat down to Manor Lake yesterday, met my partner at 6 AM, and backed down the ramp & started the big motor.  It was its usually cranky self, taking several stalls & restarts to get rumbling.  Backed it off the trailer & then it stalled again…never to restart on this day again .  Oh well, so I dropped the troller & went fishing.  Caught 6 kinds of fish, including my first dozen bass of the season (up to 3#) on 3 & 5" Husky Jerks.  But the motor thing definately put a damper on this beautiful day. The fly wheel spins, though it doies sound alittle rougher than usual.  It was suggested to me that the plugs were probably just fouled, what do you guys think?  Oh yea, when I pulled out (no fun w/o the big engine) & lowered the motor for it to drain, some dark gas (smelled like gas anyway) can out of the prop.  HELP! Warren

Response:

Sounds like bad gas, and you flooded the motor.  may be a bad needle valve in the carb, or junk sticking the valve. Bill

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Finally hauled the boat down to Manor Lake yesterday, met my partner at 6 AM, and backed down the ramp & started the big motor.  It was its usually cranky self, taking several stalls & restarts to get rumbling.  Backed it off the trailer & then it stalled again…never to restart on this day again .  Oh well, so I dropped the troller & went fishing.  Caught 6 kinds of fish, including my first dozen bass of the season (up to 3#) on 3 & 5" Husky Jerks.  But the motor thing definately put a damper on this beautiful day. The fly wheel spins, though it doies sound alittle rougher than usual.  It was suggested to me that the plugs were probably just fouled, what do you guys think?  Oh yea, when I pulled out (no fun w/o the big engine) & lowered the motor for it to drain, some dark gas (smelled like gas anyway) can out of the prop.  HELP! Warren

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Sounds like you’ll be riding in the back of my boat Warren…..

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Warren it could have been worse…..you could have a mashed up baby finger! Still better than me!!  My water is still hard and closed!   Humph! —                             Steve from Stony

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Sounds like you’ll be riding in the back of my boat Warren…..

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After de-winterizing your big motor, why wouldn’t you put on the water muffs and fire that big bad girl up to just to get her juices flowing again and to see if you needed to change those plugs?  Hate it when the engines gives me a hard time at the launch.  But we have all been there at least once in our lives! Hope everything is minor! — Craig

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        Yep….You flooded her out, Warren. And why didn’t you change the plugs!? I put fresh ones in at the start of every season, and keep last years’ (after cleaning and re-gapping, if need be) for spares in the boat at all times….         You can attempt to spray carb cleaner down the throats of the carbs once you DO have it running in your driveway with the water muffs on it, and see if you can clear them out a bit. You may need starting fluid to get her to light off, tho.          Starting fluid is another useful thing to carry, so that if you flood an engine out, you can dry the cylinders out with it, as well as plugs. A squirt in each cylinder, motor it over to blow out the gas/starting fluid, insert fresh plugs (or dried out ones) and fire it up….         When was the last time you did a carb cleaning/overhaul? For optimum performance, I’d recommend one every 3-5 years. All it takes to melt a hole in one of your pistons is to have a bit of debris/gunk in the carb, get it stuck in the main jet, and lean the cylinder out at max power…. been there, done that….. baaaaad craziness.         B3– Robert E. Longshore

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I hear ya, in retrospect I should have….AH!  The hell with it Craig.  I had a stiffy to get out there, and I know you’ve been there! Warren

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – After de-winterizing your big motor, why wouldn’t you put on the water muffs and fire that big bad girl up to just to get her juices flowing again and to see if you needed to change those plugs?  Hate it when the engines gives me a hard time at the launch.  But we have all been there at least once in our lives! Hope everything is minor! — Craig

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You’re a good pal Bob, THANKS.  You do realize that it BETTER start when I change those plugs.  My boat’s going into its 4th year, never had the carbs cleaned.  Didn’t know I had to to be honest.  Any recommendations for spark plugs? Warren – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –         Yep….You flooded her out, Warren. And why didn’t you change the plugs!? I put fresh ones in at the start of every season, and keep last years’ (after cleaning and re-gapping, if need be) for spares in the boat at all times….         You can attempt to spray carb cleaner down the throats of the carbs once you DO have it running in your driveway with the water muffs on it, and see if you can clear them out a bit. You may need starting fluid to get her to light off, tho.          Starting fluid is another useful thing to carry, so that if you flood an engine out, you can dry the cylinders out with it, as well as plugs. A squirt in each cylinder, motor it over to blow out the gas/starting fluid, insert fresh plugs (or dried out ones) and fire it up….         When was the last time you did a carb cleaning/overhaul? For optimum performance, I’d recommend one every 3-5 years. All it takes to melt a hole in one of your pistons is to have a bit of debris/gunk in the carb, get it stuck in the main jet, and lean the cylinder out at max power…. been there, done that….. baaaaad craziness.         B3– Robert E. Longshore

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I knew you guys’d get me smiling… W2 – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Warren it could have been worse…..you could have a mashed up baby finger! Still better than me!!  My water is still hard and closed!   Humph! —                             Steve from Stony Sounds like you’ll be riding in the back of my boat Warren…..

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Question:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I am new to this sport and am puzzled by the practice of tieing 2 ft. of tippet to a leader then cutting the tippet ever shorter as you change flies. Why not just put 2 ft. of tippet "leader" on each fly, with a loop on the other end and engage it to a loop in the end of the leader?  Is the disturbance of two intertwined loops 2 ft. from the fly any greater than a surgeon’s knot?  Will the intertwined loops break? Ken (to reply via email remove "zz" from address) Intertwined loops "will" have a tendancy to cut each other.

Learn to use a palomar knot.  They are easier and faster to tie than the clinch and improved clinch knots, and stronger too.  The only setback is that the line must go through the eye of the hook twice, which can be rather tricky on some smaller flies.  I’ve often wondered why more people don’t use this knot. TimeRanger is absolutely correct: intertwined loops WILL cut each other under stress.  When pulled they will effectively form a kink in each loop which will be MUCH weaker than the surrounding line.  They’ll hold up just fine until you’ve got a fish or a snag and then you’ll lose both fly and tippet material. Tom Before you buy.

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Learn to use a palomar knot.  They are easier and faster to tie than the clinch and improved clinch knots, and stronger too.  The only setback is that the line must go through the eye of the hook twice, which can be rather tricky on some smaller flies.  I’ve often wondered why more people don’t use this knot.

I don’t really think there’s anything special about the palomar knot, or the turle knot, other than the fact they specifically call for going through the eye twice.  You can tie other basic knots by going through the eye twice.  The clinch knot works fine for example.  Put the line through the eye, then over (or under, depending on up or down eye) the shank just behind the eye, then back through the eye.  Art Lee called it the Tweed Clinch I think.  I found it works just fine with the uniknot as well.  Makes a cool knot. Regards, Jeff

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I don’t really think there’s anything special about the palomar knot, or the turle knot, other than the fact they specifically call for going through the eye twice.  ……  What makes it quite special for me is that it is one  of the very few knots that I can tie reasonably quickly  without wearing my reading glasses.  greg.

What are the smallest hook-size flies that you use? — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/ something bogus to avoid spam)

Response:

I am new to this sport and am puzzled by the practice of tieing 2 ft. of tippet to a leader then cutting the tippet ever shorter as you change flies. Why not just put 2 ft. of tippet "leader" on each fly, with a loop on the other end and engage it to a loop in the end of the leader?  Is the disturbance of two intertwined loops 2 ft. from the fly any greater than a surgeon’s knot?  Will the intertwined loops break? Ken (to reply via email remove "zz" from address)

LOL…I almost could get a headache thinking about it! I assume that if you’re new to the sport you probably don’t have a lot of flies (yet!).   I probably take several thousand with me on a trip, and am carrying up to several hundred at any one time (including the various sizes).   It’s not unusual for me to have thirty or forty drying on my vest by the end of a day.   Where are all those leaders going to go?  They sure won’t fit into the small fly boxes that I carry, and the leaders flapping around while the flies are drying on my vest might get a bit bothersome. Tippet size:  though tippet size is generally determined by fly size, at times you may want to go down (spooky fish in crystal water) or up (monsters breaking off, and not selective about tippet size).   Would you have extras tied to take care of any eventuallity? Line memory:  you probably already are having to run the tippet through your fingers on ocassion, to get out the loops.   If you have tight little coils of tippet attached to the flies for any length of time – say a few months – you’re likely to see that problem increased many-fold.   If you don’t coil the line, you’ll have to have some sort of 2′ long fly box for the leaders to stay straight. Casting problems: back when I started, we tied our own leaders, using different sized leader material, graduating down to smaller sizes, for good ‘turn over.’   All the knots in the leader made for some interesting tangles, at times, especially in windy conditions.  The invention of the one-piece tapered leader was quite a boon for many of us.  Now you want to start adding more loops and knots? But go ahead and try it and get back to the board with your results. Who knows, you might find a solution that will be the next big step in fly fishing.  After all, they laughed at Orville and Wilbur, too… Best of luck. Max Before you buy.

Response:

I am new to this sport and am puzzled by the practice of tieing 2 ft. of tippet to a leader then cutting the tippet ever shorter as you change flies. Why not just put 2 ft. of tippet "leader" on each fly, with a loop on the other end and engage it to a loop in the end of the leader?  Is the disturbance of two intertwined loops 2 ft. from the fly any greater than a surgeon’s knot?  Will the intertwined loops break? Ken (to reply via email remove "zz" from address)

Response:

I am new to this sport and am puzzled by the practice of tieing 2 ft. of tippet to a leader then cutting the tippet ever shorter as you change flies. Why not just put 2 ft. of tippet "leader" on each fly, with a loop on the other end and engage it to a loop in the end of the leader?  Is the disturbance of two intertwined loops 2 ft. from the fly any greater than a surgeon’s knot?  Will the intertwined loops break? Ken (to reply via email remove "zz" from address)

Your idea will work just fine.  Probably the best knot to use is Lefty Kreh’s nonslip loop – it is plenty strong for what you are suggesting. The joined loops have never spooked fish in my experience.  Just let me warn you that it won’t be quite as efficient as you might think.  Even loops cut and weaken after awhile, so you will need to retie your loop every now and then.  Retying the loop will eat up quite a bit of leader, and putting tippet on all those flies will sure put a dent in that $9 roll of fluorocarbon  (sp?). If you do give this procedure a try I would recommend (for most western dry fly/nymph applications) using about a 7 1/2 leader tapered to 2X, and then looping in about a 2-3 foot piece of either 3X or 4X. I still use this procedure sometimes myself, but in general I am content just to tie the water knot (4 turn surgeons knot).   The connection is strong, clean, and simple, and efforts to prolong leader life are pretty well doomed from the start.  If you go ahead and try your procedure for a while, I would really like to hear how it goes for you. John.

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I am new to this sport and am puzzled by the practice of tieing 2 ft. of tippet to a leader then cutting the tippet ever shorter as you change flies. Why not just put 2 ft. of tippet "leader" on each fly, with a loop on the other end and engage it to a loop in the end of the leader?  Is the disturbance of two intertwined loops 2 ft. from the fly any greater than a surgeon’s knot?  Will the intertwined loops break?

Ignoring for a moment the fact that the typical flyfisherman may carry hundreds of flies, people won’t do this because it requires foresight. How many times have you guys been furiously changing flies to cast to a rising fish, and you find out that the fly you want to use has a little knot of tippet in the eye? Either that, or the barb isn’t bent down. Or the hook isn’t sharp. Whatever, it’s precious seconds lost. A rational angler would make sure all his flies were ready to go before he hits the stream. I just snip off the old fly and toss it back in the box in whatever condition it’s in. Actually, Ken, since you’re new to the sport I expect it takes you quite awhile to tie surgeon’s knots and clinch knots (or whatever you use). With practice you’ll get much faster. That’s actually a big step, because as you get faster the idea of changing flies and tippets won’t be as loathesome, so you’ll experiment more and probably catch more fish. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/ something bogus to avoid spam)

Response:

I am new to this sport and am puzzled by the practice of tieing 2 ft. of tippet to a leader then cutting the tippet ever shorter as you change flies. Why not just put 2 ft. of tippet "leader" on each fly, with a loop on the other end and engage it to a loop in the end of the leader?  Is the disturbance of two intertwined loops 2 ft. from the fly any greater than a surgeon’s knot?  Will the intertwined loops break? Ken (to reply via email remove "zz" from address)

Intertwined loops "will" have a tendancy to cut each other.  

Response:

I am new to this sport and am puzzled by the practice of tieing 2 ft. of tippet to a leader then cutting the tippet ever shorter as you change flies. Why not just put 2 ft. of tippet "leader" on each fly, with a loop on the other end and engage it to a loop in the end of the leader?  Is the disturbance of two intertwined loops 2 ft. from the fly any greater than a surgeon’s knot?  Will the intertwined loops break? Ken

Ken, you have just re-invented the snelled hook!  This is the way they actually did it in the old days, back before somebody had the bright idea to put eyes on the hooks.  Of course, the snell was made of gut, which you had to soak with water the day before you went fishing to soften it up, along with your leaders. To see the weakness of this system, consider the fact that the average fly fisherman accumulates flies in his or her fly vest at a rate of approximately 400 per year (after a few years they will start to breed on their own.)  Just think about having to manage all those thousands of bits of string.  I would almost be afraid to open up one of my fly boxes. Kevin

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Because the number of flys carried would cause a massive snarl of tippet. If interested, there is however an answer to the delima. There is on the market a small clip that is so light it floats. tieing it with a loop permits flys to properly oriet themselves and saves tippet tying. You can purchase them at some fly shops or from the Cabelas catalog. John Popp

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I am new to this sport and am puzzled by the practice of tieing 2 ft. of tippet to a leader then cutting the tippet ever shorter as you change flies. Why not just put 2 ft. of tippet "leader" on each fly, with a loop on the other end and engage it to a loop in the end of the leader?  Is the disturbance of two intertwined loops 2 ft. from the fly any greater than a surgeon’s knot?  Will the intertwined loops break? Ken (to reply via email remove "zz" from address)

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Question:

I’ll cook up some wild rice the night before along with a chiffonnade of whatever root vegetables October brings to market in that part of North Carolina and we’ll have a proper feast. A dry reisling would be good but I’m not slavish to the notion of white’s with fish. My latest "find", and all my "finds" are under $15, is the 1996 Syrah from Lonetree winery. Highly recommended and perfect for a crisp fall lunch of fresh trout in the Smokies. http://www.lonetreewine.com/ http://winetoday.com/reviews/0002241.html — Ken Fortenberry

Uhh, Ken how come you only brought Bud when PJ and I accompanied the two of you?  Four’s a crowd?    The next hike up Snowbird better include all the fixin’s.  :) Peter

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peter…you mean you didn’t get any of the coq-au-vin ken whipped up trailside on snowbird?  he assured me he was going to save some for you and pj…the white wine wasn’t that good, so you didn’t miss much there. jeff – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’ll cook up some wild rice the night before along with a chiffonnade of whatever root vegetables October brings to market in that part of North Carolina and we’ll have a proper feast. A dry reisling would be good but I’m not slavish to the notion of white’s with fish. My latest "find", and all my "finds" are under $15, is the 1996 Syrah from Lonetree winery. Highly recommended and perfect for a crisp fall lunch of fresh trout in the Smokies. http://www.lonetreewine.com/ http://winetoday.com/reviews/0002241.html — Ken Fortenberry Uhh, Ken how come you only brought Bud when PJ and I accompanied the two of you?  Four’s a crowd?    The next hike up Snowbird better include all the fixin’s.  :) Peter

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Uhh, Ken how come you only brought Bud when PJ and I accompanied the two of you?  

As you recall, I was trying to "be like Mike" and had the grandmother of all hangovers that day. Bud, and as it happens Wild Turkey and screaming suicidal death rides, are therapeutic in such cases, food definitely is not. — Ken Fortenberry

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Max, Would a fly fishing rod that I can collapse (to fit in or tie to a backpack) just be a waste of time, or would I not notice much difference while casting?

Collapsable rods are a joke for fly fishing.  If you _must_ have compactness, get a 3 or 4 piece fly rod.  But, before you spend the bucks for that, try a trip with your regular 2-pc rod. My backpack has "ski-sleeves" behind the side pockets and I’ve found that I can easily carry an 8 or 9 foot, 2-pc rod with no inconvenience. Has anyone every used these?  Would it be a good backpacking/fly fishing tactic to use a set of these with a set of thin hip waders?

Try a pair of neoprene socks over flyweight waders — and a pair of Tevas.   Any other tips for integrating backpacking and fly fishing into the same outing?

Butter Salt Pepper Lemon juice Aluminum foil My first fly fishing experience was on a backpacking trip to some high Sierra lakes.  Having absolutely no confidence in my ability to catch fish, we packed in a full supply of food. Three days later, we packed out our full supply of food — except for the butter, salt, pepper, lemon juice and aluminum foil.  We’d lucked onto a lake full of brookies on the brink of overpopulation. Absolutely gorged on them. If you expect there’ll still be a fair amount of snow around, add some zip-lock bags, chopped onion & bell peppers and lime juice.  Dice your fish. Mix it with the onion & peppers. Put the mixture in a zip-lock and add plenty of lime juice.  Bury it in a snow bank for several hours.  The French call this raw fish preparation ceviche.  Mmmmm, mmmmm! Wes Peterson

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 The French call this raw fish preparation ceviche.  

What a coincidence ! That’s EXACTLY what the Mexicans call it. — Ken Fortenberry

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 The French call this raw fish preparation ceviche. What a coincidence ! That’s EXACTLY what the Mexicans call it. — Ken Fortenberry

Ken, When I was in Venezuela, the told me it was Peruvian, when I was in Peru, they told me it was Venezuelan. Who knows? Tom — Tom Brown The Signal Group Wake Forest, NC I shall be telling this with a sigh Somewhere ages and ages hence: Two roads diverged in a wood, and I- I took the one less traveled by, And that has made all the difference.             Robert Frost (1874-1963)

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I backpack a lot, and I have recently become addicted to fly fishing.  I would love to integrate the two activities in the same outing.  I have seen the rods that you can collapse.  I have used these types of rods with spinner fishing.  I know that the rod is more important in fly fishing than spinner fishing. Would a fly fishing rod that I can collapse (to fit in or tie to a backpack) just be a waste of time, or would I not notice much difference while casting?

Sage makes some great 5-piece rods, but they’re very expensive. I have a 5-piece 5-weight SP and I love it. Typical of Sage rods, it’s very stiff, but I really couldn’t tell any difference between a 5-piece and a 4-piece. They come with a extra tip, a beautiful, light-weight, 25-inch-long, aluminum rod case, and a lifetime guarantee. One nice thing about these rods is that you can fit them in your carry-on luggage. Sometimes, though, I just take my 2-piece 9-foot Walton Powell and use the PVC rod case as a walking stick! As for wading, if I don’t plan to wade wet I pack my Patagonia breathable waders and lightweight boots. Together, they weigh maybe 3 pounds. Another good investment, if you plan to fish backcountry lakes, would be a lightweight float tube. Bill Kiene recommended the Wood River line to me, and I really like the one I bought — the Summer Breeze model. With a float tube you’re talking about some significant weight, but it’s reasonable for short, easy trips. — something bogus to avoid spam)

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 With Ghee and a light dusting of the flour you can cook up trout meuniere. Hope this helps. — Ken Fortenberry

…ok, ken…fallball…let’s hike the road to nowhere above Noland…you bring the gourmet cookin stuff and i’ll bring…the wine…uh, i’ll also try to catch some trout…looking forward to a streamside meal from chef fortenberry. jeff (in watauga county preparin for an afternoon trout stalkin)

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0] : I backpack a lot, and I have recently become addicted to fly fishing.  I : would love to integrate the two activities in the same outing.  I have seen : the rods that you can collapse.  I have used these types of rods with : spinner fishing.  I know that the rod is more important in fly fishing than : spinner fishing. : Would a fly fishing rod that I can collapse (to fit in or tie to a backpack) : just be a waste of time, or would I not notice much difference while : casting? : I have seen plastic stockings that are designed to fit over a shoe or boot, : and keep the shoes and feet dry.  These were really lightweight, but I’m not : sure if they work. : Has anyone every used these?  Would it be a good backpacking/fly fishing : tactic to use a set of these with a set of thin hip waders? : Any other tips for integrating backpacking and fly fishing into the same : outing? : thanks : Max A lot of rods, perhaps most, from most manufacturers come in 2, 3, and 4 piece versions so you should be able to find a satisfactory rod in your price range. Collapsible rods are junk. The solution I like for wading in the back country is thin hippers with dive booties pulled over them, preferably the kind of booties that dont have zippers. A fanny pack makes a pretty good substitute for a vest. Mike — Michael McGuire                     Hewlett Packard Laboratories  (remove x’s from email if not      Palo Alto, CA 94303-0971   a spammer) Phone: (650)-857-5491              

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you bring the gourmet cookin stuff and i’ll bring…the wine…uh, i’ll also try to catch some trout…

Four miles up Noland from the "road to nowhere" at the confluence of Mill Creek is the abandoned town of Solola Valley. The park service has put in an outhouse, some picnic tables and a hitchin’ rack for those that use horses. We can hike up to Solola Valley, fish the rest of the morning then repair to one of the picnic tables for a streamside lunch. I’ll cook up some wild rice the night before along with a chiffonnade of whatever root vegetables October brings to market in that part of North Carolina and we’ll have a proper feast. A dry reisling would be good but I’m not slavish to the notion of white’s with fish. My latest "find", and all my "finds" are under $15, is the 1996 Syrah from Lonetree winery. Highly recommended and perfect for a crisp fall lunch of fresh trout in the Smokies. http://www.lonetreewine.com/ http://winetoday.com/reviews/0002241.html — Ken Fortenberry

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I’ll cook up some wild rice the night before along with a chiffonnade of whatever root vegetables October brings to market in that part of North Carolina and we’ll have a proper feast. A dry reisling would be good but I’m not slavish to the notion of white’s with fish. My latest "find", and all my "finds" are under $15, is the 1996 Syrah from Lonetree winery. Highly recommended and perfect for a crisp fall lunch of fresh trout in the Smokies.

        goddammit, forty, if you were a chick, i’d leave home for you. wayno – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -http://www.lonetreewine.com/ http://winetoday.com/reviews/0002241.html — Ken Fortenberry

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alright!!!  …reserve a place at the picnic table for me. everyone other than the chef ought to carry at least one bottle of wine for a proper solola valley wine tasting and trout cook…but, if the smokies scotch tasting was a forecast (or backcast) of events, we might need a horse or two to get out of the valley… jeff   – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – you bring the gourmet cookin stuff and i’ll bring…the wine…uh, i’ll also try to catch some trout… Four miles up Noland from the "road to nowhere" at the confluence of Mill Creek is the abandoned town of Solola Valley. The park service has put in an outhouse, some picnic tables and a hitchin’ rack for those that use horses. We can hike up to Solola Valley, fish the rest of the morning then repair to one of the picnic tables for a streamside lunch. I’ll cook up some wild rice the night before along with a chiffonnade of whatever root vegetables October brings to market in that part of North Carolina and we’ll have a proper feast. A dry reisling would be good but I’m not slavish to the notion of white’s with fish. My latest "find", and all my "finds" are under $15, is the 1996 Syrah from Lonetree winery. Highly recommended and perfect for a crisp fall lunch of fresh trout in the Smokies. http://www.lonetreewine.com/ http://winetoday.com/reviews/0002241.html — Ken Fortenberry

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I backpack a lot, and I have recently become addicted to fly fishing. … Any other tips for integrating backpacking and fly fishing into the same outing? Multi piece rods are the way to go. Collapsibles are junk. Get a good 3 or 4 piece rod appropriate for the streams you’ll fish. I’ve heard recommendations here for St. Croix & Cabela’s in the moderate price range, I’m partial to a 3 piece Winston. Leave the vest at home and consolidate flies, leader(s), tippet spool(s), nail clipper, hook hone and thermometer into two pocket size containers. Get a fishing shirt in a neutral color that has two big front pockets with button down flaps big enough to accomodate the two containers mentioned above. For wading I use Teva sandals with a neoprene sock over a silk liner sock and "miracle pants", those nylon hiking/outdoor pants that dry almost instantly. Go to the Indian food store and get a jar of Ghee. It’s clarified butter at a fraction of the price of the backpacker variety. Put some in a small unbreakable container and put that and a bit of flour in with your cook kit. With Ghee and a light dusting of the flour you can cook up trout meuniere.

Agree entirely with the additional suggestions of using a fanny pack.  Not the expensive "fly-fishing" fanny packs that Sage/Simms/et al sell, just some generic one.  And that it’s easy enough to make your own Ghee.  The stuff never spoils so you never have to worry about refrigeration or the heat.  Add a couple spices to your flour ahead of time and you’re good to go. Speaking of which…      - Ken — "During my service in the United States Congress, I took the  initiative in creating the Internet."  - Al Gore

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[snip] I’ve heard recommendations here for St. Croix & Cabela’s in the moderate price range, I’m partial to a 3 piece Winston.

Forty, your predilection for lousy beer is well countered by your taste for fine rods. /daytripper ;^)

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‘grats guys…jeez wine in the apps…. guess ya’ll be geetin sohhffttt… me? ‘morrow…hungover…fishin’ the most beautifil water in the world with pals (wish you were heh) and enjoying this fine art to the fullest… waldo… on the sun spine of g’fatha alright!!!  …reserve a place at the picnic table for me. everyone other than the chef ought to carry at least one bottle of wine for a proper solola valley wine tasting and trout cook…but, if the smokies scotch tasting was a forecast (or backcast) of events, we might need a horse or two to get out of the valley… I don’t have a horse but I expect I could waddle my fat butt up there and *maybe* back<g. Sounds like a great picnic plan. — Charlie…

– Ezflyfish.com                 Blue Ridge Book Gallery Quality Gear & Service        Used & Out-of-Print Books http://www.ezflyfish.com      http://www.abebooks.com/home/BLUEBOOKS P.O. Box 5112  Banner Elk, NC 28604 (828)963-5001

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walt…hah, no doubt marie must be off the mountain visiting somewhere…it’s past one in the morning, yer well-oiled, acting independent and "manlike",and bangin away on the computer. damn, i’m envious. …if you come along in october, you can use the most excellent wine we’ll be bringin as a chaser for yer wine alternatives – you know, that stuff bottled down in the hollars in mason ("Masson"??) jars, dripped fresh from the coils – actually, you and i probably could use a dip in the "couth" tank from time to time <G. jeff (i’ll not whine before it’s time) – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – ‘grats guys…jeez wine in the apps…. guess ya’ll be geetin sohhffttt… me? ‘morrow…hungover…fishin’ the most beautifil water in the world with pals (wish you were heh) and enjoying this fine art to the fullest… waldo… on the sun spine of g’fatha alright!!!  …reserve a place at the picnic table for me. everyone other than the chef ought to carry at least one bottle of wine for a proper solola valley wine tasting and trout cook…but, if the smokies scotch tasting was a forecast (or backcast) of events, we might need a horse or two to get out of the valley… I don’t have a horse but I expect I could waddle my fat butt up there and *maybe* back<g. Sounds like a great picnic plan. — Charlie… — Ezflyfish.com                 Blue Ridge Book Gallery Quality Gear & Service        Used & Out-of-Print Books http://www.ezflyfish.com      http://www.abebooks.com/home/BLUEBOOKS P.O. Box 5112  Banner Elk, NC 28604 (828)963-5001

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        goddammit, forty, if you were a chick, i’d leave home for you. wayno

ROTFLMAO, Wayno Mark Faulkner

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Would a fly fishing rod that I can collapse (to fit in or tie to a backpack) just be a waste of time, or would I not notice much difference while casting?

There are a LOT of multi-piece flyrods that pack down to very managable sizes.  I’ve got a 5pc. Scott rod that can fit INSIDE my daypack and it cost about $200 on clearance.  You don’t need the most expensive rod, just a good tool for the task. Alpine trout do tend to be greedier and so the massive fly selection is not necessary.  Adames, Humpies, mosquitos, Coachmens, Terrestrials (especially ants) keep me in fish all day.  A few nymphs never hurt. I have seen plastic stockings that are designed to fit over a shoe or boot, and keep the shoes and feet dry.  These were really lightweight, but I’m not sure if they work. Has anyone every used these?  Would it be a good backpacking/fly fishing tactic to use a set of these with a set of thin hip waders?

Thin waders, then the bootie, then your Tevas or ratty converse tennies.  If like in the Eastern Sierra, you’re fishing small streams to spooky trout, I spend most of the time on my knees anyway. Any other tips for integrating backpacking and fly fishing into the same outing?

It’s not really that much more stuff to bring.  I started lugging less camera gear and my load lightened immensely. Good Luck Bob

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It’s not really that much more stuff to bring.  I started lugging less camera gear and my load lightened immensely.

Amen about the camera gear. Now I just take disposable cameras. One panoramic and one a normal field-of-view camera. If I’m rafting or doing risky wading I’ll take a waterproof disposable. Actually, you can soak a non-waterproof disposable and the exposed shots will develop fine, as long as the film is dried out before processing. Forget about the rest of the roll, though. The quality of the photos is fine, especially if you’re just going to scan them into a relatively low-resolution digital format. — something bogus to avoid spam)

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For wading I use Teva sandals with a neoprene sock over a silk liner sock and "miracle pants", those nylon hiking/outdoor pants that dry almost instantly.

That’s almost exactly what I do.. although the cold Sierra lakes that I backpack to make it tough to stay in too long.. Go to the Indian food store and get a jar of Ghee. It’s clarified butter at a fraction of the price of the backpacker variety.

That’s EXACTLY what I do.. but, of course, I also pack in a couple of lemons and my own seasoning too.  Worth the weight.. — -Mark/Particle Salad Particle Salad/Noom Room Studio http://home.earthlink.net/~psalad

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Backpacking is the ONLY way to fly!  :) I have a 4-piece rod that I take apart and simply tie to one of the side metal frame pieces of my external frame pack.  I’ve never had trouble, but I wouldn’t take my best rod.. I have a Fenwick spin/fly rod that I take on trips like these so I can reach farther out in the lake (I haven’t packed a float tube yet, though have been considering it lately). My advice.. do it, you won’t regret it! -Mark – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I backpack a lot, and I have recently become addicted to fly fishing.  I would love to integrate the two activities in the same outing.  I have seen the rods that you can collapse.  I have used these types of rods with spinner fishing.  I know that the rod is more important in fly fishing than spinner fishing. Would a fly fishing rod that I can collapse (to fit in or tie to a backpack) just be a waste of time, or would I not notice much difference while casting? I have seen plastic stockings that are designed to fit over a shoe or boot, and keep the shoes and feet dry.  These were really lightweight, but I’m not sure if they work. Has anyone every used these?  Would it be a good backpacking/fly fishing tactic to use a set of these with a set of thin hip waders? Any other tips for integrating backpacking and fly fishing into the same outing? thanks Max

– -Mark/Particle Salad Particle Salad/Noom Room Studio http://home.earthlink.net/~psalad

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<snip Hi Max; Multiple piece rods are fairly popular for backpacking but I’ve always found them somewhat unsatisfactory.  The more pieces you have, the more likely it is that the thing will come apart while casting.  Multiple joints also affect the action of the rod.  I have often carried a standard two piece rod while backpacking and had very little trouble with it.  A 4 1/2 ft. rod case will sometimes catch on low branches or other obstructions but in my experience it has not happened often enough to be considered a major problem. On short trips where weight was not a major consideration I have carried light weight waders and boots.  While this is a very comfortable way to fish I don’t consider the comfort worth the extra weight or space on longer or more arduous trips.  In such cases I bring a pair of Rock Socks or other light weight footwear and wade wet, but I wade wet a lot anyway.  I have found that I’m comfortable in colder water than most of the people I have fished with, so you’ll have to judge for yourself how viable this option is for you. Tight Lines!

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I backpack a lot, and I have recently become addicted to fly fishing. … Any other tips for integrating backpacking and fly fishing into the same outing?

Multi piece rods are the way to go. Collapsibles are junk. Get a good 3 or 4 piece rod appropriate for the streams you’ll fish. I’ve heard recommendations here for St. Croix & Cabela’s in the moderate price range, I’m partial to a 3 piece Winston. Leave the vest at home and consolidate flies, leader(s), tippet spool(s), nail clipper, hook hone and thermometer into two pocket size containers. Get a fishing shirt in a neutral color that has two big front pockets with button down flaps big enough to accomodate the two containers mentioned above. For wading I use Teva sandals with a neoprene sock over a silk liner sock and "miracle pants", those nylon hiking/outdoor pants that dry almost instantly. Go to the Indian food store and get a jar of Ghee. It’s clarified butter at a fraction of the price of the backpacker variety. Put some in a small unbreakable container and put that and a bit of flour in with your cook kit. With Ghee and a light dusting of the flour you can cook up trout meuniere. Hope this helps. — Ken Fortenberry

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I backpack a lot, and I have recently become addicted to fly fishing.  I would love to integrate the two activities in the same outing.  I have seen the rods that you can collapse.  I have used these types of rods with spinner fishing.  I know that the rod is more important in fly fishing than spinner fishing. Would a fly fishing rod that I can collapse (to fit in or tie to a backpack) just be a waste of time, or would I not notice much difference while casting? I have seen plastic stockings that are designed to fit over a shoe or boot, and keep the shoes and feet dry.  These were really lightweight, but I’m not sure if they work. Has anyone every used these?  Would it be a good backpacking/fly fishing tactic to use a set of these with a set of thin hip waders? Any other tips for integrating backpacking and fly fishing into the same outing? thanks Max

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Generally, the ferrule of the rod is stiffer so you may notice the rod has a stiffer action (based on 3 or 4 pieces).  One thing I’ve learned from experience (and I know I will have a lot of opposition here) is that the old fiberglass rods are much more durable than the new graphite rods.  Reason being if your graphite rod drops and hits a rock, you can shatter it and not know it until you take a cast and the rod breaks in half!  Fiberglass doesn’t have this problem.  As an FYI, I’ve also performed the sinful task of attaching a spinning real to the fly rod – works really well if you want options on a trip! – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I backpack a lot, and I have recently become addicted to fly fishing.  I would love to integrate the two activities in the same outing.  I have seen the rods that you can collapse.  I have used these types of rods with spinner fishing.  I know that the rod is more important in fly fishing than spinner fishing. Would a fly fishing rod that I can collapse (to fit in or tie to a backpack) just be a waste of time, or would I not notice much difference while casting? I have seen plastic stockings that are designed to fit over a shoe or boot, and keep the shoes and feet dry.  These were really lightweight, but I’m not sure if they work. Has anyone every used these?  Would it be a good backpacking/fly fishing tactic to use a set of these with a set of thin hip waders? Any other tips for integrating backpacking and fly fishing into the same outing? thanks Max

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Question:

Anybody know of a good spot(s) for flyfishing near Dead Mans’s Flats in Alberta?  I will be going there in August this year. Thanks for your help. Greg

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You can have the whole of the upper Bow river to fish in from Dead Mans Flats as well ..head up to the Limestone quarry on the way to Banff about 30 minutes from Dead Mans……Browns are there to be had as well as rainbows.. take a lunch and enjoy the scenery along the way!!!!! – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Anybody know of a good spot(s) for flyfishing near Dead Mans’s Flats in Alberta?  I will be going there in August this year. Thanks for your help. Greg

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Question:

– Now booking Cape Cod, MA inshore fly fishing wading trips for stripers for the 97 season. I supply all tackle and flies as well as casting instructions if needed. If you don’t score stripers, I don’t get paid. Fair enough? $125/single $200/two anglers for a full day wading trip. Email me http://www.flyfishing-the-salt.com. Email references given upon request. Good fishing…Ted Bobetsky

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– Now booking Cape Cod, MA inshore fly fishing wading trips for stripers for the 97 season. I supply all tackle and flies as well as casting instructions if needed. If you don’t score stripers, I don’t get paid. Fair enough? $125/single $200/two anglers for a full day wading trip. Email me http://www.flyfishing-the-salt.com. Good fishing…Ted Bobetsky

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Question:

I’m Fly-Fishing the Alphabet, and have come up short on rivers beginning with O (probably a temporary oversight), Q, R, and Z. This is admittedly a daffy undertaking, but it’s better than the aimless wanderings of Fly Fishing America.   I  find that I’ve already fished most of the alphabet (Arkansas, Bighorn, Colorado, Dolores, Encampment, Fryingpan, Grande Ronde, Henry’s Fork, you get the picture). An "i" river was a problem, until I remembered the tiny Illinois River in northern Colorado. Any ideas for Q, X and Z? The Quinalt and Quillaute would do. Nice Sea run cutts in there right now.  Steelhead later.

Question!  Is it your goal to fish a stream for each letter of the alphabet or to catch fish from a stream for each letter of the alphabet? I once knew a fisherman who set out to fish every stream and lake in Montana.  Dont’t know if he made it or not but it would be fun trying. So much water, so little time. Jim

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: I once knew a fisherman who set out to fish every stream and lake : in Montana.  Dont’t know if he made it or not but it would be fun : trying. This little suggestion made my heart go floppa-floppa.  Not Montana, but this would be a *great* way to justify the hard trips to the interior of Idaho.   Wow.  Greeeeat suggestion! I have fished many of the "great" rivers of the west.  I don’t think I would miss much at all if I narrowed my focus to the rivers and streams of Idaho.   It would also make me feel better when I’m standing in a stream in the middle of a pasture with my line in the water and a speeding pickup goes cruising by at high speed with five guys screaming out the window and bed "You fool…there’s no fish left in there…"  I’ll have an excuse when they see me in the local tavern later that night. Perfect, a fishing version of Sissy Hankshaw.  I can see it now, casting a puddle because it is a body of water and it is there.  Perhaps my thumb will sprout a flyrod. Cool. — Rick T. Rick Fletcher   –   http://www.chem.uidaho.edu/~fletcher/ Associate professor of chemistry  |  That’s Idaho, not Iowa.    | ad hominem University of Idaho               |  Upper Left Hand Corner.    | ad hominem Moscow, ID 83844-2343             |  No, I don’t grow potatoes. | ad hominem

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the Quinipoxet river flows into the Wachusetts resevoir about 40 miles west of Boston.  it contains stocked brown and some native brook trout. Gerry

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the Quinipoxet river flows into the Wachusetts resevoir about 40 miles west of Boston.  it contains stocked brown and some native brook trout. Gerry

X & Z may require you to travel abroad. Not so bad an idea. George Gehrke/Mr. Gink

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: X & Z may require you to travel abroad. Not so bad an idea. Send me the money from one out of every 100 little bottles you sell and I’ll travel!<g  (That’s all I ask, one out overy hundred.) — Rick T. Rick Fletcher   –   http://www.chem.uidaho.edu/~fletcher/ Associate professor of chemistry  |  That’s Idaho, not Iowa.    | ad hominem University of Idaho               |  Upper Left Hand Corner.    | ad hominem Moscow, ID 83844-2343             |  No, I don’t grow potatoes. | ad hominem

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Quinn River, Nevada.      There are good browns in most of the river, and the fishing is improving. The Quinn River Allotment Management Plan is up for consideration until October 23, copies of which can be had from the Humboldt National Forest, 2035 Last Chance Rd., Elko, NV 89801. Alternative 4 will provide the best future fishing and is the preferred alternative. The river runs along the NV-OR border north of Winnemucca. Jim, Nevada Jim’s Outdoor Sports, Elko, NV Jim, Nevada Jim’s Outdoor Sports, Elko, NV

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I’m Fly-Fishing the Alphabet, and have come up short on rivers beginning with O (probably a temporary oversight), Q, R, and Z.

Try the Quitapahilla outside of Lancaster, PA.  This is still on my "to fish" list so I don’t know how well it fishes.  Directions are available in Dwight Landis’ Trout Streams of PA or Charlie Meck’s Pa Trout Streams and Their Hatches

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: I’m Fly-Fishing the Alphabet, and have come up short on rivers beginning : with O (probably a temporary oversight), Q, R, and Z. : This is admittedly a daffy undertaking, but it’s better than the aimless : wanderings of Fly Fishing America.   I  find that I’ve already fished most : of the alphabet (Arkansas, Bighorn, Colorado, Dolores, Encampment, : Fryingpan, Grande Ronde, Henry’s Fork, you get the picture). : An "i" river was a problem, until I remembered the tiny Illinois River in : northern Colorado. : Any ideas for Q, X and Z? These can all be handled in the PNW, but I’m not telling where.  You will enjoy searching the map, or just use the web and do a search with one of the map services or the Geological Survey. — Rick T. Rick Fletcher   –   http://www.chem.uidaho.edu/~fletcher/ Associate professor of chemistry  |  That’s Idaho, not Iowa.    | ad hominem University of Idaho               |  Upper Left Hand Corner.    | ad hominem Moscow, ID 83844-2343             |  No, I don’t grow potatoes. | ad hominem

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I’m Fly-Fishing the Alphabet, and have come up short on rivers beginning with O (probably a temporary oversight), Q, R, and Z. This is admittedly a daffy undertaking, but it’s better than the aimless wanderings of Fly Fishing America.   I  find that I’ve already fished most of the alphabet (Arkansas, Bighorn, Colorado, Dolores, Encampment, Fryingpan, Grande Ronde, Henry’s Fork, you get the picture). An "i" river was a problem, until I remembered the tiny Illinois River in northern Colorado. Any ideas for Q, X and Z?

The Quinalt and Quillaute would do. Nice Sea run cutts in there right now.  Steelhead later.

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I’m Fly-Fishing the Alphabet, and have come up short on rivers beginning with O (probably a temporary oversight), Q, R, and Z. This is admittedly a daffy undertaking, but it’s better than the aimless wanderings of Fly Fishing America.   I  find that I’ve already fished most of the alphabet (Arkansas, Bighorn, Colorado, Dolores, Encampment, Fryingpan, Grande Ronde, Henry’s Fork, you get the picture). An "i" river was a problem, until I remembered the tiny Illinois River in northern Colorado. Any ideas for Q, X and Z?

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Question:

I’ve fished the Newport area several times, both from a boat and from shore.  Two suggestions: 1) contact The Saltwater Edge (Orvis dealer in Newport).  They are very helpful.  2) Get a copy of "Striper Moon" by J. Kenney Abrames.  It’s got a lot of Newport-area intelligence.  Good luck!

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I fish the Newport area often, what infor do you need?

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Do you know where abouts you plan on fishing?

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Try contacting The Saltwater Edge. http://www.saltwateredge.com

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 I have been scouting from Pawcatuck R. to Westport R. nothing yet. Any day now the fishing fleet should be picking them up in their offshore drift nets. I will check with them this week. rec. outdoors       outdoor adventure

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Plan to fly fish striped bass this spring in Newport,RI.Any pointer-advice?

Would be interested, too. Can you forward messages you get? Thanks in advance,                            Thomas

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Plan to fly fish striped bass this spring in Newport,RI.Any pointer-advice?

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Question:

What to charge for private tying lessons? I have two questions for any fly tying instructors who care to reply. I have been teaching fly tying at a local shop for the past 3 years and I recently was asked to do some private one-on-one lessons. question #1: My friends tell me I do not charge enough for my instruction. What do you charge a beginner for 1.5 hours of instruction. question #2: what would you charge if your student was selling flies to a mail-order company. If you prefer not to reply to the newsgroup, thanks todd seigfried

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What to charge for private tying lessons?

[snip] If you prefer not to reply to the newsgroup,

I would appreciate it if any responders would post the answer here!   Would like to know the answer also.

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question #1: My friends tell me I do not charge enough for my instruction. What do you charge a beginner for 1.5 hours of instruction.

I’m an instructor here in the Chicago area, and the students pay 75.00 for a two-day (total of six hours) seminar.  That’s 12.50 per hour (payed to the fly-shop) but it’s in groups of from four to seven people.  For private lessons I would charge 25.00 per hour. Jack

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Hi Todd, My wife and I make our living as commercial fly tiers in the winter and guides in the summer.  Our price for teaching fly tying PERIOD… is $25.00 per hour, no matter the size of the class or the number of students.  It could be one person or twelve (our maximum). If I had a student who was selling flies to some one else, you ask, "What would I do?" I would try to hire him! Take care!  Good Tying & Tight Lines Al Beatty BT’s Fly Fishing Products Bozeman, MT I have two questions for any fly tying instructors who care to reply. I have been teaching fly tying at a local shop for the past 3 years and I recently was asked to do some private one-on-one lessons.

Please check the message above!  Take Care! Al Beatty

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I think that if you were on a limited budget, like you were in graduate school, you could have everyone chip in a dime per fly to cover the cost of the materials.          Jeff Schaeffer

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Question:

Several fly fishing books for sale: old out-of-print, 1st editions, priced below market value, and in good condition w/clear plastic covers.   Learn from the fly fishing greats, add to your book collection, or start your fly fishing book collection now.  e-mail me if you are interested, during Jan. ‘96 only. Terms: CWO and I pay postage and insurance. JWTrout    1/15/96.

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John, I’d be interested in your list of books for sale. Thanks Simon Hallett

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Question:

       On my recent vacation to New Zealand I read an interesting    article in the NZ Fishing magazine about kite fishing.  This    intrigued me because I fish and fly kites, but not at the    same time.  I was lucky enough to contact the manufacturer    and obtain a catalog of the various rigs available.

Kelly:         I have used a ‘Salmon Rod’ (very heavy action) with #40lb monofilament on an open faced spinning reel with a snap swivel to fly kites with. In a brisk wind, its like catching a large salmon.  Set the drag correctly and the darn kite "runs" just like a fish in a wind gust. Saves your hands reeling in the kite with the rod also. Seriously, it’s fun and very much like fishing. Bob Drongowski

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`Kelly: `       I have used a ‘Salmon Rod’ (very heavy action) with #40lb monofilament `on an `open faced spinning reel with a snap swivel to fly kites with. `In a brisk wind, its like catching a large salmon.  Set the drag `correctly and `the darn kite "runs" just like a fish in a wind gust. `Saves your hands reeling in the kite with the rod also. `Seriously, it’s fun and very much like fishing. `Bob Drongowski I used to do this when I was a kid.  My dad put my kite on a rod, as I was using a spool, went to hand off to a friend and gave my dad a good 200 yard exercise sprint he wasn’t expecting.  I used to love running a short amount of string on a delta kite and run around the neighborhood dive bombing my friends…. swood —        Hunting over in Michigan?  Don’t Despair – NO CLOSED SEASON ON:          opossum, porcupine, weasel, red squirrel, skunk, starlings,         feral pigeons, English sparrows, ground squirrel & woodchuck           Anyway trout season opens the last Saturday this month.

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(Scott Wood) writes: I used to do this when I was a kid.  My dad put my kite on a rod, as I was using a spool, went to hand off to a friend and gave my dad a good 200 yard exercise sprint he wasn’t expecting.  I used to love running a short amount of string on a delta kite and run around the neighborhood dive bombing my friends….

We once built a kite and bought a 2000 yard spool of 6 pound test monofilament to fly it with (we were poor and economized).  We did get the kite all the way out, but we couldn’t see it.  So, we tied it off to a tree, and rode our bikes about a mile away until we spotted it over head.  Then we spent about 4 hours winding all that line back on the spool.   Dean

Response:

| |   On my recent vacation to New Zealand I read an interesting |   article in the NZ Fishing magazine about kite fishing.  This |   intrigued me because I fish and fly kites, but not at the |   same time.  I was lucky enough to contact the manufacturer |   and obtain a catalog of the various rigs available. | |   Has anyone seen or experimented with Kite fishing?   | |                                                   Kelly   It is my understanding that the kite fishing was first used in Southern California in the early 1900’s for bluefin tuna, but was disused after WWII or so when the large bluefin (larger than can be found here today) were wiped out by commercial fishing.  This form of fising was later adopted in Florida primarily for sailfish.   I have just purchased a kite to fish for local bluefin tuna.  The pacific bluefin we have locally are incredibly shy (line, boat, etc).  The kite will allow me to do two things: 1) allow me to get a bait well away from the boat, where the larger 100+ lb fish seem to want to stay, and 2) keep the leader/line mostly out of the water.  The baits are hooked on top and the leader/line ascends vertically from the bait to the kite.  I plan to use the kite while anchored on the offshore banks which are about 100 NM offshore.   Kite fishing has been working wonderfully well for yellowfin tuna at the Revillagegigedos islands (sp), 1000 NM south of San Diego, where the pending all tackle world was caught using a kite a couple of months ago (just shy of 400 lbs). —        _                       Gary Gibson        |_                       PRYORITY I        |                 Metaflow Technologies, Inc.        |__                4250 Executive Square, Suite 300   ____/         /          Voice:  (619) 452-6608 x231

Response:

        On my recent vacation to New Zealand I read an interesting         article in the NZ Fishing magazine about kite fishing.  This         intrigued me because I fish and fly kites, but not at the         same time.  I was lucky enough to contact the manufacturer         and obtain a catalog of the various rigs available.         Has anyone seen or experimented with Kite fishing?                                                           Kelly

Response: