Question:

A couple of young ladies from the college are taking Mac Browns fly fishing class  and they want to come over an talk about the size of rods.

The instructor probably told them "There’s nothing like holding a nice, stiff rod in your hands."  (Direct quote by the way from an instructor I heard several years ago.) Regards, Jeff

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They will probably want to put article in school newspaper  after Big Dale and I meat with them  and offer sage adventure suggestions.

        after you and big dale "meat" with them, their next stop will undoubtedly be the district attorney’s office.  you know about your miranda rights and my phone number, don’t you?       Was going to kill Old Bob { the burro] today but he must of pooped out during the night. I chased the buzzards away this morning and my  squaw is  hanging parts on trees outside to cure. Chili will be ready for everyone Tuesday night. Indian Joe  Wilmington NC

        my god.  my first meal at the clave is likely to be the last meal of my life.         wayno, serious as a cerebral hemmorrage – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –

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out during the night. I chased the buzzards away this morning and my squaw is  hanging parts on trees outside to cure. Chili will be ready for everyone Tuesday night.  Indian Joe  Wilmington NC

IJ, looking forward to the chili!  If I see anything along the road on the way down which might compliment the fixin’s I’ll be sure and scrape it up and throw it in the trunk.  Now, no more of those "my rod is bigger’n your rod"  "is not" "is too" "is not" "is too" discussions. After all, size doesn’t matter, its the technique! — Wayne To fish is human….To release Divine! Before you buy.

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It was touch and go for quite a while with my plans changing daily, but now all has come to a final resolution and I will be able to attend the "MAY CLAVE". I will miss the BBQ but will be there for the CHILI. Plan to leave Monday morning and arrive in Foscoe early afternoon. I have also finally fully recovered from a bout with the Chernobyl computer virus that wiped out my HD. Really looking forward to meeting, fishing and learning. jim

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 Really looking forward to meeting, fishing and learning. jim

        so, obviously, you have post-clave plans.  but we’re happy to have you, anyway. wayno – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –

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so, obviously, you have post-clave plans.   wayno

Who could pass up a chance to meet "The rain man" (Ken) or fish with local "Legends" (Walt and Jeff) and learn to "Tie a flat turkey" (Dave La) My other option was hemorrhoid surgery…..it was a tough decision. jim

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Taking ‘em out or putting ‘em in?                 Frank Reid – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – My other option was hemorrhoid surgery…..it was a tough decision. jim

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Really looking forward to meeting, fishing and learning. jim    so, obviously, you have post-clave plans.  but we’re happy to have you, anyway.

You beat me to the punchline – it was begging for it, wasn’t it? Regards, Jeff

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So Jim, you’re saying you have to choose between assholes? <bseg Frank Church – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – so, obviously, you have post-clave plans.   wayno Who could pass up a chance to meet "The rain man" (Ken) or fish with local "Legends" (Walt and Jeff) and learn to "Tie a flat turkey" (Dave La) My other option was hemorrhoid surgery…..it was a tough decision. jim

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 Really looking forward to meeting, fishing and learning. jim         so, obviously, you have post-clave plans.  but we’re happy to have you, anyway. wayno

…the first bit of learnin will be trying to find clave central… i’m lookin forward to the stories of the misguided and lost, i.e., those who thought it’d be easy locating mill ridge because it’s across the road from the orvis shop… my bet is most will never even notice the orvis shop.  course, me and tom and waldo know right where to go, and we’ll keep the food warm and the beer chilled…HAHAHA… btw wayno…talked with jim last night…he didn’t sound like he was gonna come up. i told him he and JB could stay at my place for the weekend…you might need to nudge him some more. jeff

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so, obviously, you have post-clave plans.   wayno Who could pass up a chance to meet "The rain man" (Ken) or fish with local "Legends" (Walt and Jeff) and learn to "Tie a flat turkey" (Dave La) My other option was hemorrhoid surgery…..it was a tough decision. jim

hell, jim…you can get that little problem taken care of at the clave, too. just listen for the banjo music… jeff

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btw wayno…talked with jim last night…he didn’t sound like he was gonna come up. i told him he and JB could stay at my place for the weekend…you might need to nudge him some more.

Tell him Forty grew a ponytail and is calling himself "Fort Pamlico"<g. — Charlie…

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btw wayno…talked with jim last night…he didn’t sound like he was gonna come up. i told him he and JB could stay at my place for the weekend…you might need to nudge him some more. Tell him Forty grew a ponytail and is calling himself "Fort Pamlico"<g. — Charlie…

…already told jim that forty claimed he could outfish him and beat him arm wrestling while chugging wild turkey…but your suggestion just might do it… jeff

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btw wayno…talked with jim last night…he didn’t sound like he was gonna come up. i told him he and JB could stay at my place for the weekend…you might need to nudge him some more. Tell him Forty grew a ponytail and is calling himself "Fort Pamlico"<g. — Charlie…

        what a riot.  but, otoh, why don’t *you* tell him that.  i’ll just wait in the car. wayno

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Rained out tennis last night so I read the 600 posts on roff.  Sounds  like we will be discussing microsoft spam  and doctors sticking fingers up your ass  during the evening clave sessions. A couple of young ladies from the college are taking Mac Browns fly fishing class  and they want to come over an talk about the size of rods.  They will probably want to put article in school newspaper  after Big Dale and I meat with them  and offer sage adventure suggestions.        Was going to kill Old Bob { the burro] today but he must of pooped out during the night. I chased the buzzards away this morning and my  squaw is  hanging parts on trees outside to cure. Chili will be ready for everyone Tuesday night.  Indian Joe  Wilmington NC

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Question:

I just stumbled on to a great new stream a half hour from my cabin. I’m not telling where it is, of course. (If anyone wants to visit the Stanley area I’ll show it to you.) This is a nearly perfect mountain meadow creek — nice slow dry-fly water — which is a change of pace from the fast-flowing freestone rivers that dominate the landscape here. It has a lot of wildlife, too, which I like. As I walked to the creek there were three Swainson’s hawks in the air and I spooked a pair of Sandhill Cranes and a deer. The walking is treacherous because of numerous beaver projects. There wasn’t another soul in sight. The problem is that I didn’t catch any fish. I saw plenty, though. They came in two sizes: tiny and humongous. It was a problem keeping the tiny ones from spoiling the float to the humongous ones. There were many trout holding near the bank that must have been four pounds and up, easy. They rejected every offering. I crawled on my belly to the bank to avoid spooking them (which is ridiculously easy to do on this creek — spooking, I mean), and basically went through my fly boxes. I’d like to think they just weren’t feeding because a big thunderstorm was moving in. I just watched them for awhile and they didn’t look like they were feeding. This creek is now my project. It’s difficult sight fishing for large prey. BTW, on the drive home, over the pass, I saw that it had snowed. Snow on August 4! — Those who say do not know; those who know do not say. — Lao Tsu, who must have been a fisherman. something bogus to avoid spam)

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I just stumbled on to a great new stream a half hour from my cabin. I’m not telling where it is, of course. (If anyone wants to visit the Stanley area I’ll show it to you.) This is a nearly perfect mountain meadow creek — nice slow dry-fly water — which is a change of pace from the fast-flowing freestone rivers that dominate the landscape here. It has a lot of wildlife, too, which I like. As I walked to the creek there were three Swainson’s hawks in the air and I spooked a pair of Sandhill Cranes and a deer. The walking is treacherous because of numerous beaver projects. There wasn’t another soul in sight. The problem is that I didn’t catch any fish. I saw plenty, though.

Today I figured out how to fish this creek. It was great! It fished real well with #8 hoppers during the heat of the afternoon. I walk along the high banks looking for big fish. They seem to hang out together in groups of about 2 to 4 or so, but you also see single fish. If there are small fish around there are never any big fish. There must be a lot of cannibalism going on. (I’ll have to try some streamers next time.) Once I see them they’ve almost certainly seen me and have spooked, no matter how careful I am. In fact, sometimes I deliberately spook them because they’re holding in an undercut bank where I can’t see them. Then I have to wait five minutes or so, well back from the bank. After they’ve rested I creep to the bank about 40 feet upstream from them and present the fly downstream. These fish don’t seem to be all that selective about flies and this place is very lightly fished (I’ve never seen anyone there), but the water is perfectly clear and smooth and 7x tippets are called for. It seemed to be best when there was a bit of a breeze to make ripples on the surface. I got my three best cutthroats of the season today. The largest was maybe 20". Well, OK, 19". Also saw a Peregrine Falcon real close. — Those who say do not know; those who know do not say. — Lao Tsu, who must have been a fisherman. something bogus to avoid spam)

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I just stumbled on to a great new stream a half hour from my cabin.

(terrific little narrative snipped) I got my three best cutthroats of the season today. The largest was maybe 20". Well, OK, 19". Also saw a Peregrine Falcon real close. — Those who say do not know; those who know do not say. — Lao Tsu, who must have been a fisherman. something bogus to avoid spam)

    god, wulffie, what a world you live in.  congratulations. wayno

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Question:

I have taken up fly fishing in the past year and have purchased a couple of Loomis rods. One is a GL3 #8 and one a GL4 #5. I am now considering a purchase of a used IMX 10#. The IMX was a dicontinued by the time I came along. Was this a high end rod for Loomis? What would it be compared to that is in production today? How will the action compare to my GL3 8#? I appreciate any input. Thanks. Larry

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At one time IMX were the high end of Loomis’ line. They were the precursor of the GL4. I believe the material is still the same, 3rd. generation graphite. I don’t think you’d go wrong by buying an IMX. Tom. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have taken up fly fishing in the past year and have purchased a couple of Loomis rods. One is a GL3 #8 and one a GL4 #5. I am now considering a purchase of a used IMX 10#. The IMX was a dicontinued by the time I came along. Was this a high end rod for Loomis? What would it be compared to that is in production today? How will the action compare to my GL3 8#? I appreciate any input. Thanks. Larry

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At one time IMX were the high end of Loomis’ line. They were the precursor of the GL4. I believe the material is still the same, 3rd. generation graphite. I don’t think you’d go wrong by buying an IMX.

I agree.  In fact, I think the IMX graphite was the best combination of strength and speed that Loomis had. Mark Faulkner

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Larry asked Was this a high end rod for Loomis? What would it be compared to that is in production today? How will the action compare to my GL3 8#? I appreciate any input.

Larry I don’t know what you plan to use the IMX 10 weight for, but I have one in a 8 1/2 foot model. It is a very specialized rod. I think it is stiffer than a GLX and I know that it is much stiffer than my GL3. I would say that it is more similar to a Sage RPLX than anything else I have ever used. It would be great for Northern Pike or casting around the coast in a severe wind. It is also perfect for casting hugh  bass flies at Lake Fork, but as you can guess it will test the durability of your casting arm. It realy wears me out quicker than any other rod I have ever owned. Big Dale

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Larry: I forgot something in my earlier post. The selection of fly lines is more limited in the 10 weight size than some others.The one I prefer is made by Cortland in an bright red called a Pike/Muskie taper.I hate the color, but love the way it casts and it excells for big flies. Big Dale

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Larry asked Was this a high end rod for Loomis? What would it be compared to that is in production today? How will the action compare to my GL3 8#? I appreciate any input. Larry I don’t know what you plan to use the IMX 10 weight for, but I have one in a 8 1/2 foot model. It is a very specialized rod. I think it is stiffer than a GLX and I know that it is much stiffer than my GL3. I would say that it is more similar to a Sage RPLX than anything else I have ever used. It would be great for Northern Pike or casting around the coast in a severe wind. It is also perfect for casting hugh  bass flies at Lake Fork, but as you can guess it will test the durability of your casting arm. It realy wears me out quicker than any other rod I have ever owned.

In the larger rod sizes at least, Loomis GLX is faster than IMX, and IMX is similar to GL4. GL3 is the slow rod of this bunch. I fished a 9.5′ 9W IMX over stripers for many years. Quite fast – you definitely have to make the rod flex to get the most out of it, but if you do, it’s a cannon. /daytripper

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Question:

I am new to fly fishing, and can only cast about 20 Feet.  I want to cast a fly tied on a 1/0 hook.  Basic tips on casting welcome.

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from One newbie to another?? Take a couple of casting lessons from the local fly shop and then work on catching the fish that only SIT 20 feet away.. I have caught more 20 feet from shore than wading out into the middle of the damn river or stream!. Be patient and listen to the wise ones that write and lurk here<G they have helped me out a ton and patience grasshopper is the name of the game Pierre – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I am new to fly fishing, and can only cast about 20 Feet.  I want to cast a fly tied on a 1/0 hook.  Basic tips on casting welcome.

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I always tell beginning casters to watch their backcast (among other things). Let the line straighten behind you before beginning your forward cast. This seems to be a big help in getting a feel for the rhythm. Kevin

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Question:

I just noticed in his new book, "A Pirate Looks At Fifty," that Jimmy Buffett seems to be an avid flyfisherman. Anyone know any good stories about Jimmy and flyfishing? Is he strictly a saltwater fisherman? Or does he ever go after trout? (The mountains don’t seem to be his style!) Better yet…has anyone ever tried to go fishing with him? (We flyfishermen might be able to get a little closer to him than the ordinary Parrothead! <grin) Scott Wilkinson Quasi-Parrothead

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Jimmy Buffett used to live in Aspen and may still have a place there.  I think he moved there after his time in Key West.  He wanted to be around guys who liked girls. DP – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I just noticed in his new book, "A Pirate Looks At Fifty," that Jimmy Buffett seems to be an avid flyfisherman. Anyone know any good stories about Jimmy and flyfishing? Is he strictly a saltwater fisherman? Or does he ever go after trout? (The mountains don’t seem to be his style!) Better yet…has anyone ever tried to go fishing with him? (We flyfishermen might be able to get a little closer to him than the ordinary Parrothead! <grin) Scott Wilkinson Quasi-Parrothead

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: Jimmy Buffett used to live in Aspen and may still have a place there.  I : think he moved there after his time in Key West.  He wanted to be around : guys who liked girls. Thanks for keeping us posted. — Rick T. Rick Fletcher   –   http://www.chem.uidaho.edu/~fletcher/ Associate professor of chemistry  |  That’s Idaho, not Iowa.    | ad hominem University of Idaho               |  Upper Left Hand Corner.    | ad hominem Moscow, ID 83844-2343             |  No, I don’t grow potatoes. | ad hominem

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Scott, Only stories I know of Jimmy are shrimping, jubilees, mullet in Mobile bay, and drinks at Judge Roy Bean’s. -Adam

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I just noticed in his new book, "A Pirate Looks At Fifty," that Jimmy Buffett seems to be an avid flyfisherman. Anyone know any good stories about Jimmy and flyfishing? Is he strictly a saltwater fisherman? Or does he ever go after trout? (The mountains don’t seem to be his style!) Better yet…has anyone ever tried to go fishing with him? (We flyfishermen might be able to get a little closer to him than the ordinary Parrothead! <grin) Scott Wilkinson Quasi-Parrothead

Hi Scott, I was fishing in the Keys about 10 years ago fishing with a friend, Steve Chapell, who lives on Marathon Key. One evening he showed me a poor video copy of a movie that was made by a group of Key West fly fishers? He said a prince from Spain?, Guy Valdeen(sp) was partly responsible for the short film. Jimmy did the sound tack for the movie. It showed fly fishers casting to tarpon with beautiful music and then would it would switch to wild music with a party boat. The deck was covered with blood from killing fish. Bill Kiene Kiene’s Fly Shop Sacramento,CA,USA 800/4000FLY www.kiene.com

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Jimmy used to hang around with Harrison, McGuane, Fonda and that bunch in the keys and in Livingston, Mt.  I’m sure he has been exposed to both fresh and saltwater flyfishing.  He also reportedly has the quail bug. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I just noticed in his new book, "A Pirate Looks At Fifty," that Jimmy Buffett seems to be an avid flyfisherman. Anyone know any good stories about Jimmy and flyfishing? Is he strictly a saltwater fisherman? Or does he ever go after trout? (The mountains don’t seem to be his style!) Better yet…has anyone ever tried to go fishing with him? (We flyfishermen might be able to get a little closer to him than the ordinary Parrothead! <grin) Scott Wilkinson Quasi-Parrothead

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I just noticed in his new book, "A Pirate Looks At Fifty," that Jimmy Buffett seems to be an avid flyfisherman. Anyone know any good stories about Jimmy and flyfishing? Is he strictly a saltwater fisherman? Or does he ever go after trout? (The mountains don’t seem to be his style!) Better yet…has anyone ever tried to go fishing with him? (We flyfishermen might be able to get a little closer to him than the ordinary Parrothead! <grin)

Not sure about Jimmy Buffet and Flyfishing but I’ve also heard that Marilyn Manson is an avid angler.  Anyone know whether Marilyn is into flyfishing? Anyone care to post any amusing anecdotes concerning Marilyn and fish? Thanks.

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Never heard of Marilyn Mason – where does she live?

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Not sure about Jimmy Buffet and Flyfishing but I’ve also heard that Marilyn Manson is an avid angler.  Anyone know whether Marilyn is into flyfishing? Anyone care to post any amusing anecdotes concerning Marilyn and fish?

What, he bites the heads off the trout? -Marcus

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Never heard of Marilyn Mason – where does she live?

*HE* is a shock rocker.  Very wierd looking, angry music, etc etc.  The teenagers adore him. check out http://www.marilyn-manson.net/  for scary pictures and stuff.

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Never heard of Marilyn Mason – where does she live?

He dwells in your worst nightmares….

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My worst nightmare is about many raising fish and the wrong fly!!

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If I need to see something scary, I check out my mirror (especially in the early AM.)

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*HE* is a shock rocker.  Very wierd looking, angry music, etc etc.  The teenagers adore him. check out http://www.marilyn-manson.net/  for scary pictures and stuff.

I’ve heard this freak was a nerdy kid on some TV show that was modestly popular 6 or 7 years ago.  As for checking out a site about this geek…think I’d rather step on a nail. Patrick

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I heard that Jimmy has a place out in the hamptons in LI, NY and owns a 20′ Hewes flats boat!! He flyfishes for stripers and everything! Capt. Paul

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I’ve seen a picture of Buffett standing on a partially sunken (and rusted out ship) with what appears to be a fly rod with yellow fly line in his hand. I think this picture is on the box set…….

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In his book, "In Search of Joe Merchant" he talks about flyfishing for bonefish.  Believe that he did also inthe book "Margaritaville". Herb

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I heard that Jimmy has a place out in the hamptons in LI, NY and owns a 20′ Hewes flats boat!! He flyfishes for stripers and everything! Capt. Paul

In his book that just came out, "A Pirate Looks at Fifty", he talks about flyfishing a lot.  The guy’s a fanatic!!  He even went flyfishing in Costa Rica (for blue marlin!).

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Question:

A great knot.  I use it for building leaders and for joining tippets.  Easy to tie, and very strong.  I loop it three times on both pieces. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -One knot that you don’t see much of for line-to-line connections is the double or "back-to-back" uni-knot.  Has anybody tried this one besides me? Tinca

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Not sure I recall uni-knots exactly, but I use what I was taught to call "double-grinners" (british term) which may be the same thing. Bulkier than blood-knot but against steelhead they help me.   Easy to tie – after the 600-th time.           -rork.

: A great knot.  I use it for building leaders and for joining tippets.  Easy : to tie, and very strong.  I loop it three times on both pieces. : One knot that you don’t see much of for line-to-line connections is the : double or "back-to-back" uni-knot.  Has anybody tried this one besides : me? : Tinca

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Not sure I recall uni-knots exactly, but I use what I was taught to call "double-grinners" (british term) which may be the same thing. Bulkier than blood-knot but against steelhead they help me.   Easy to tie – after the 600-th time.

How bout some instructions for the colonists Lou B

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Well give the bleeding unit-knot instructions first  :) Really, I was gonna describe it but it is hard to describe knots for me: Double Grinner:     wrap the tag end of strand a around b, about 3-5 times (not so important, just gets some twist set-up).  Bring the tag end back to the start of the wraps – this makes a loop which you now put the tag end through 3-5 times (smaller lines=more times).  You are making the second set of wraps in the same direction and handedness as the first set.    That makes one half of the knot, do the same for the other half as for any knot in the fisherman’s/blood-knot family.  Pull the two ends tight againt each other.  I partially tighted each side first – they "turn inside out" like lotsa other monofilament knots.  I think it’s mentioned in "The trout and the fly".  - also a colonist. Soon out in paper-back:     my decription of the modified Krey’s-improved bimini-twist……

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One knot that you don’t see much of for line-to-line connections is the double or "back-to-back" uni-knot.  Has anybody tried this one besides me?

This is the knot I always use. I also use the Uni(Duncan Loop) for my terminal connection. I have rarely had any problems with breakage at the terminal connection and the only time I have had a break at the tippet/leader was in breaking off a snag. I can not imagine any weakening with the Uni-knot joining the two pieces of line. With the wraps snugging up it seems to be very secure. Also, it is easy! regards, jw        J. Webb (Preferred)    |    Atlanta Mac User Group         jwebb *AT* netdepot *DOT* com |joe_webb *AT* atlmug *DOT* org

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nothing to beat the uni knot for any thing – greta knot for night fishingas you can tie it with your eyes closed. One knot that you don’t see much of for line-to-line connections is the double or "back-to-back" uni-knot.  Has anybody tried this one besides me?

– Tinca

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I’ve done my own tests on several knots, and I really don’t know where this nonsense about the blood knot being stronger than surgeons comes from. None of my tests have ever shown this, and most books I’ve seen confirm this. One knot that you don’t see much of for line-to-line connections is the double or "back-to-back" uni-knot.  Has anybody tried this one besides me?

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I’ve done my own tests on several knots, and I really don’t know where this nonsense about the blood knot being stronger than surgeons comes from. None of my tests have ever shown this, and most books I’ve seen confirm this. One knot that you don’t see much of for line-to-line connections is the double or "back-to-back" uni-knot.  Has anybody tried this one besides me? I’ve done my own tests on several knots, and I really don’t know where this nonsense about the blood knot being stronger than surgeons comes from. None of my tests have ever shown this, and most books I’ve seen confirm this. One knot that you don’t see much of for line-to-line connections is the double or "back-to-back" uni-knot.  Has anybody tried this one besides me?

Yeah, I use the uni-knot all the time Bryce

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Mark asks: Hello, Does anyone have any suggestions for  a good strong relatively easy to tie knot for attaching a tippet to a leader.  I know the traditional barrel and double surgens knots.  The problem I’ve been having, which is quite irritating, is the knot that attaches the tippet is weaker than the one attaching the fly, so when I hang up the tippet breaks off  as well as the fly.  When I’m nymph fishing I feel like I spend a great amount of time standing in the creek attaching new tippets.  I switched to a Filson knot to attach the fly to the tippet since I found it was stronger than a clinch knot. I hate the idea of switching to a weaker terminal knot just to save having to retie the tippet each time I hang up, which as you know can be lot.    Has anynone else had this experience and what is the solution.   Thanks, Mark Watson

Mark, I feel there is another issue maybe, buried in here….. that is the *quality* of how one ties a knot….  A poorly tied knot is much weaker than it should be.   I feel several of the knots mentioned ought to get you out of your problem, yet from the post …. seems that doesn’t occur….. makes me think there is a "hidden variable"…. that is the quality of the knot itself and not the design of the knot…..   For "barrel" or blood knots a couple of things… never tie with more than one or 2 thousands difference in the diameters of the leader end and the tippet… otherwise use the loop or the surgeon’s knot…. make the starter set of windings of the blood knot even and unkinked with the two ends pointing in opposite directions.   Wet the total bundle (good ole spit)  and smoothly but firmly pull them taut.   clip excess ends. In teaching this knot to others I have found many who try to pull the knot taut without wetting it or with the preloops not neat and unkinked….   Pratice at home with light tippet and test with a scale until you achieve about 90 % consistently for several knots… Good luck, Alan Alan E. Hoover       to quote one of my favorite authors: "Fly fishing is such great fun, it really ought to be done in bed"  John Voelker, aka Robert Traver

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Mark asks: Hello, Does anyone have any suggestions for  a good strong relatively easy to tie knot for attaching a tippet to a leader.  I know the traditional barrel and double surgens knots.  The problem I’ve been having, which is quite irritating, is the knot that attaches the tippet is weaker than the one attaching the fly, so when I hang up the tippet breaks off  as well as the fly.  When I’m nymph fishing I feel like I spend a great amount of time standing in the creek attaching new tippets.  I switched to a Filson knot to attach the fly to the tippet since I found it was stronger than a clinch knot. I hate the idea of switching to a weaker terminal knot just to save having to retie the tippet each time I hang up, which as you know can be lot.    Has anynone else had this experience and what is the solution.   Thanks, Mark Watson

So much good information has come from this post that I hate to even introduce this, but does anyone else other than me use a little dab of Zap-A-Gap on the knots just to make sure? It’s a cyanoacrylate glue much like crazy glue and only takes a few seconds to dry. Maybe it’s a crude remedy but I got tired of losing the fly, tippet, and even more so the fish. — Frank Tosczak

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  There are several terminal mono knots that are "100% strength" knots   (e.g. Trilene knot).     I’ve never seen a test of the trilene knot that rated it 100% – but   it maybe stronger than either a blood or double surgeon. the best you can get out of a blood knot (6 or more barrels) is around 75%.  Surgeon’s is better.  The trilene and I believe the double turle are supposed to be full strength.

FWIW I checked my copy of Lefty kreh/ Mark Sosin’s Pratical Knots II ; the improved clinch was reported to test out at no better than 95%, the Trilene was listed as ’stronger’ than an improved clinch. A Palomar knot was said to be near 100%. The double surgeon loop or it’s half brother the double surgeon were both reported to provide near 100%. The only full 100% knots listed were the doubled loops such as the Bimini twist and the snelled hooks beloved of bait fishers. Ralph H

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  FWIW I checked my copy of Lefty kreh/ Mark Sosin’s Pratical Knots II ;   the improved clinch was reported to test out at no better than 95%, the   Trilene was listed as ’stronger’ than an improved clinch. A Palomar knot was   said to be near 100%. The double surgeon loop or it’s half brother the double   surgeon were both reported to provide near 100%.

Ok, so the trilene knot is 95% strength according to your source. My source says full-strength.  There is no difference between these claims.  Experimental uncertainty would easily cover such a trivial difference. As for the double surgeon’s knot, I really don’t think it is even close to 100%.  If it were, is that to say that the "triple surgeon’s" knot is redundant?  I can easily be wrong.  But the flyfisherman article I recall claimed that the best line-to-line knots are still <90% – including the double surgeons etc.  Again, I could easily be wrong.  My own experience with all these line-to-line knots confirms that they are weaker than terminal knots.  But who am I to argue with Lefty kreh eh? Anyway, I don’t get too worried about all this.  I use =8lb test and the only time I ever break my line is when I screw up and do something dumbassed on a fish or when I get snagged.  I don’t think that my 14′ 9wt rod is even capable of breaking 8lb test line. By the way, for anyone interested, the virtual flyshop (www.flyshop.com I think) has a nice set of drawings on how to tie any of the knots mentioned in this discussion. cheers,         -tgades (a good-old 6-barrel bloodknot aficionado) — Tony Gades. Seattle, WA.  USA http://weber.u.washington.edu/~tgades http://weber.u.washington.edu/~tgades/Fishing/fish_page.html email: replace the "this_address_is_wrong" with "tgades"

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –   the double surgeon should be stronger than the knot to the fly if tied   properly. Be sure to wet the knot tighten slowly and DO NOT tighten apply the   final tightening pull to the tag ends only to the main line. Tightening the   tag ends binds the main line and considerably weakens the knot.   Ralph H There are several terminal mono knots that are "100% strength" knots (e.g. Trilene knot).  While strong, I don’t think I’ve seen results of tests of any line-to-line knots (including the double surgeon) that can do 100%. cheers,        -tgades

I’ve never seen a test of the trilene knot that rated it 100% – but it maybe stronger than either a blood or double surgeon. By the way welcome back, how was your trip to the balmy south. Ralph H

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I’ve used the barrel knot for years with a Turl (sp?) Knot for fly connection and it’s always worked well.  Is it that you don’t want to tie a barrel knot???  Or that your barrel knot is breaking?   Or that you are using a knot to connect the fly that is a stronger knot than the barrel knot?

The basic problem is that the knot the knot I’ve been using to attach the fly (a filson knot) is much stronger than any barrel or double surgeons I’ve been able to tie.  Previously I always used a clinch knot for the fly, but I found a stronger knot for the terminal end, so I was hoping to find one for the tippet/leader junction.    (I also dislike tying the barrell knot especially in the late evening when fish are rising all around and its hard to see) I could solve my problem by switching back to a weaker knot to attach the fly.  From the sound of some of the other posters that sounds like the way to go, but I was hoping that someone would have a better solution. Thanks again, Mark Watson

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’ve used the barrel knot for years with a Turl (sp?) Knot for fly connection and it’s always worked well.  Is it that you don’t want to tie a barrel knot???  Or that your barrel knot is breaking?   Or that you are using a knot to connect the fly that is a stronger knot than the barrel knot? Barry Hello, Does anyone have any suggestions for  a good strong relatively easy to tie knot for attaching a tippet to a leader.  I know the traditional barrel and double surgens knots.  The problem I’ve been having, which is quite irritating, is the knot that attaches the tippet is weaker than the one attaching the fly, so when I hang up the tippet breaks off  as well as the fly.  When I’m nymph fishing I feel like I spend a great amount of time standing in the creek attaching new tippets.  I switched to a Filson knot to attach the fly to the tippet since I found it was stronger than a clinch knot. I hate the idea of switching to a weaker terminal knot just to save having to retie the tippet each time I hang up, which as you know can be lot.    Has anynone else had this experience and what is the solution. Thanks, Mark Watson

I use a loop to loop connection, with a loop knot the name of which I can’t recall, but it’s in lefty kreh and mark sosin’s knot book.  I use a clinch knot for the fly connection, and that almost always breaks first.  Even if it doesn’t, the knot that breaks is the tippet side of the loop to loop, so I just make a new tippet, and attach it, with no overall leader length loss.  Works great, you should try it. — Andrew Brunette

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   There are several terminal mono knots that are "100% strength" knots    (e.g. Trilene knot).  While strong, I don’t think I’ve seen results of    tests of any line-to-line knots (including the double surgeon) that    can do 100%.        cheers,                -tgades       I’ve never seen a test of the trilene knot that rated it 100% – but   it maybe stronger than either a blood or double surgeon.

the best you can get out of a blood knot (6 or more barrels) is around 75%.  Surgeon’s is better.  The trilene and I believe the double turle are supposed to be full strength.   By the way welcome back, how was your trip to the balmy south.

The Antarctic field season (nov,dec,jan) was very good and productive, though the weather was poor this year and we spent a total of 30+days waiting for flights in the field. The fishing in NZ (24Jan-5Mar) was excellent once again.  After 4 years in a row fishing for a month or more in NZ, it seems more and more fun.  I’ll likely be heading back once again next year.  I’ll let you know when I scan in a few pics from the 98 NZ season.  I caught some tremendous browns this year.  I still have a few pictures from last year:         http://weber.u.washington.edu/~tgades/Fishing/NZ/NZ_97.html Since I’ve been home I’ve hooked 2 steelhead, landed 1.  I scanned a picture of this beautiful native hen.  It is at the top of my fish page:         http://weber.u.washington.edu/~tgades/Fishing/fish_page.html cheers,         -tgades — Tony Gades. Seattle, WA.  USA http://weber.u.washington.edu/~tgades http://weber.u.washington.edu/~tgades/Fishing/fish_page.html email: replace the "this_address_is_wrong" with "tgades"

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  the double surgeon should be stronger than the knot to the fly if tied   properly. Be sure to wet the knot tighten slowly and DO NOT tighten apply the   final tightening pull to the tag ends only to the main line. Tightening the   tag ends binds the main line and considerably weakens the knot.   Ralph H

There are several terminal mono knots that are "100% strength" knots (e.g. Trilene knot).  While strong, I don’t think I’ve seen results of tests of any line-to-line knots (including the double surgeon) that can do 100%. cheers,         -tgades — Tony Gades. Seattle, WA.  USA http://weber.u.washington.edu/~tgades http://weber.u.washington.edu/~tgades/Fishing/fish_page.html email: replace the "this_address_is_wrong" with "tgades"

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Hello, Does anyone have any suggestions for  a good strong relatively easy to tie knot for attaching a tippet to a leader.  I know the traditional barrel and double surgens knots.  The problem I’ve been having, which is quite irritating, is the knot that attaches the tippet is weaker than the one attaching the fly, so when I hang up the tippet breaks off  

the double surgeon should be stronger than the knot to the fly if tied properly. Be sure to wet the knot tighten slowly and DO NOT tighten apply the final tightening pull to the tag ends only to the main line. Tightening the tag ends binds the main line and considerably weakens the knot. Ralph H

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Hello, Does anyone have any suggestions for  a good strong relatively easy to tie knot for attaching a tippet to a leader.  I know the traditional barrel and double surgens knots.  The problem I’ve been having, which is quite irritating, is the knot that attaches the tippet is weaker than the one attaching the fly, so when I hang up the tippet breaks off  as well as the fly.  When I’m nymph fishing I feel like I spend a great amount of time standing in the creek attaching new tippets.  I switched to a Filson knot to attach the fly to the tippet since I found it was stronger than a clinch knot. I hate the idea of switching to a weaker terminal knot just to save having to retie the tippet each time I hang up, which as you know can be lot.    Has anynone else had this experience and what is the solution.   Thanks, Mark Watson

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -knot for attaching a tippet to a leader.  I know the traditional barrel and double surgens knots.  The problem I’ve been having, which is quite irritating, is the knot that attaches the tippet is weaker than the one attaching the fly, so when I hang up the tippet breaks off  as well as the fly.  When I’m nymph fishing I feel like I spend a great amount of time standing in the creek attaching new tippets.  I switched to a Filson knot to attach the fly to the tippet since I found it was stronger than a clinch knot. I hate the idea of switching to a weaker terminal knot just to save having to retie the tippet each time I hang up, which as you know can be lot.    Has anynone else had this experience and what is the solution.   Thanks, Mark Watson

Hi Mark. Depending on how much time I have, I’ll use the Blood Knot or the Double Surgeon’s Knot. The Blood Knot takes longer to tie, but is stronger, so I use it when I’m rigging before I go to the river. If I’m on the stream and I get a wind knot that I can’t untie very close to the tippet/leader knot, they I’ll cut off my existing tippet and use a Double Surgeon’s Knot to put a new one on. That’s just what I use. Bryce    

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I’ve used the barrel knot for years with a Turl (sp?) Knot for fly connection and it’s always worked well.  Is it that you don’t want to tie a barrel knot???  Or that your barrel knot is breaking?   Or that you are using a knot to connect the fly that is a stronger knot than the barrel knot? Barry – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello, Does anyone have any suggestions for  a good strong relatively easy to tie knot for attaching a tippet to a leader.  I know the traditional barrel and double surgens knots.  The problem I’ve been having, which is quite irritating, is the knot that attaches the tippet is weaker than the one attaching the fly, so when I hang up the tippet breaks off  as well as the fly.  When I’m nymph fishing I feel like I spend a great amount of time standing in the creek attaching new tippets.  I switched to a Filson knot to attach the fly to the tippet since I found it was stronger than a clinch knot. I hate the idea of switching to a weaker terminal knot just to save having to retie the tippet each time I hang up, which as you know can be lot.    Has anynone else had this experience and what is the solution. Thanks, Mark Watson

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Question:

Does anyone have any place they recommend avoiding in the Bahamas for one reason or another… safety? crowds? pollution? Thanks! Patrick

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Does anyone have any place they recommend avoiding in the Bahamas for one reason or another… safety? crowds? pollution?

Nassau, for the three reasons mentioned. — DAVe & Skoshi, ‘69 Stamas 26′ http://personal.mia.bellsouth.net/mia/d/r/drsi/

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Does anyone have any place they recommend avoiding in the Bahamas for one reason or another… safety? crowds? pollution?

How ’bout that endless expanse of white sand gliding by just inches below your keel…  Y’know, The Bottom.  Definitely, avoid the bottom.

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I will NEVER go back to Nassau! – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Does anyone have any place they recommend avoiding in the Bahamas for one reason or another… safety? crowds? pollution? How ’bout that endless expanse of white sand gliding by just inches below your keel…  Y’know, The Bottom.  Definitely, avoid the bottom.

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Does anyone have any place they recommend avoiding in the Bahamas for one reason or another… safety? crowds? pollution? Thanks! Patrick

Nassau for sure!

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The northernmost Abacos seemed a tad dreary… of course it’s all relative; fishermen find Walker’s Cay a piscatorial paradise- scuba & beachcombing too. Norman’s Cay was a smuggling hotspot in the ’80s, but appears to be under control… now pilots fly there for fishing, scuba & gourmet food, not ‘business’.  Bimini & points south ditto. When cruising anywhere truly remote, tho, a bit of disgression is a good idea. Trimtab Does anyone have any place they recommend avoiding in the Bahamas for one reason or another… safety? crowds? pollution? Thanks! Patrick

Before you buy.

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All the places I go

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<snip – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – This is a case of advice that is misguided, and when one generalizes with "Never", they are failing to consider that numerous "lake" type vessels have made quite successful voyages to and through the Bahamas, simply by selecting the weather conditions appropriate to their vessel.  Obviously when a norther is blowing against the Stream, or the winter trades are at their best, even well found cruising designs find it wiser to remain in port, but to simply recommend against this voyage under any conditions, is to be out of touch with the reality of what frequently occurs with great success.  Pick your weather, ang go!  With the shoal draft, and large accomodations, a house boat can be a wonderful cruising design for the Bahamas, with the obvious necessity to carry adequate fuel. Good Cruising, 73 — Sean Holland NP2AU S/V Spindrift

You know in all the posts on this subject, nobody has thought to ask our intrepid boater just how fast his houseboat can go.  If he can wring 20kts out of it wihtout straining, it’s only a 2.5 or 3 hour crossing … more than enough time if he waits for the weather.  He can strap a liferaaft to the stern, tank up with gas, turn on his GPS, get out his charts and be in the Bahamas in time for lunch if he starts out at 0830!  The posters talking about leaving at night in order to get to port at the destination in the daylight are talking about doing 5 or 6 kts, not 15 or 20. If he really wants to know, he should take the boat offshore a ways to see how it reacts in ocean swells in the kind of weather he wants to cross in.  If he has trouble, he can head back; if he isn’t intent on crossing, he’ll head back anyway.  You’ll never know until you try it. Colin S.

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There are houseboats in the Virgin Islands and I’m sure they weren’t built there.

Sure there are; and they may have island hopped in good weather to get there.  Or they may have come as deck cargo on a freighter. I’m not trying to rain on your parade; but safety comes first, for both you and your crew. You worked hard all your life to enjoy your retirement.  Don’t become a U.S. Coast Guard statistic. Jim Md.

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Previously in response to a request for info on taking a house boat to the Bahamas someone said: You’re pushing the envelope friend.  In no case should a houseboat be taken offshore.   If you want to go to the Bahamas, buy an airline ticket. There are houseboats in the Virgin Islands and I’m sure they weren’t built there.

This is a case of advice that is misguided, and when one generalizes with "Never", they are failing to consider that numerous "lake" type vessels have made quite successful voyages to and through the Bahamas, simply by selecting the weather conditions appropriate to their vessel.  Obviously when a norther is blowing against the Stream, or the winter trades are at their best, even well found cruising designs find it wiser to remain in port, but to simply recommend against this voyage under any conditions, is to be out of touch with the reality of what frequently occurs with great success.  Pick your weather, ang go!  With the shoal draft, and large accomodations, a house boat can be a wonderful cruising design for the Bahamas, with the obvious necessity to carry adequate fuel. Good Cruising, 73 — Sean Holland NP2AU S/V Spindrift

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This is a case of advice that is misguided, and when one generalizes with "Never", they are failing to consider that numerous "lake" type vessels have made quite successful voyages to and through the Bahamas, simply by selecting the weather conditions appropriate to their vessel.  Obviously when a norther is blowing against the Stream, or the winter trades are at their best, even well found cruising designs find it wiser to remain in port, but to simply recommend against this voyage under any conditions, is to be out of touch with the reality of what frequently occurs with great success.  Pick your weather, ang go!  With the shoal draft, and large accomodations, a house boat can be a wonderful cruising design for the Bahamas, with the obvious necessity to carry adequate fuel.

I agree that is is silly, if not rude, to tell a prospective motor boater or sailer to "buy an airplane ticket," but I still think that taking a houseboat across the Gulf Stream is, well, not smart.  To cross the stream under the best conditions, one must leave Florida in the evening in order to cross the bar at Bimini or go into the canal at Grand Bahama in daylight (and don’t Bahamas’ customs rules require daylight entry?)  Not all water-borne hazard will be spotted at night, and for an inexperienced captain, large cargo ships can be a real hazard; a flat bottom houseboat is not the vessel for maneouvering in shipping lanes. Also, the weather can never be predicted with the kind of reliability that would allow one to cross the Gulf Stream in a houseboat, particularly in winter, the main crusing time; and again, the deep water passages between the westerly cays and Nassau require better.   That "lake type sailboats" often venture to the Bahamas succesfully is merely an argument by ancedote, and so a dangerous one.  There are many, many, many cruisers anchored (right now!) in Elizabeth Harbor, off Georgetown, who got there on sheer luck alone.

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – This is a case of advice that is misguided, and when one generalizes with "Never", they are failing to consider that numerous "lake" type vessels have made quite successful voyages to and through the Bahamas, simply by selecting the weather conditions appropriate to their vessel.  Obviously when a norther is blowing against the Stream, or the winter trades are at their best, even well found cruising designs find it wiser to remain in port, but to simply recommend against this voyage under any conditions, is to be out of touch with the reality of what frequently occurs with great success.  Pick your weather, ang go!  With the shoal draft, and large accomodations, a house boat can be a wonderful cruising design for the Bahamas, with the obvious necessity to carry adequate fuel. I agree that is is silly, if not rude, to tell a prospective motor boater or sailer to "buy an airplane ticket," but I still think that taking a houseboat across the Gulf Stream is, well, not smart.  To cross the stream under the best conditions, one must leave Florida in the evening in order to cross the bar at Bimini or go into the canal at Grand Bahama in daylight (and don’t Bahamas’ customs rules require daylight entry?)  Not all water-borne hazard will be spotted at night, and for an inexperienced captain, large cargo ships can be a real hazard; a flat bottom houseboat is not the vessel for maneouvering in shipping lanes. Also, the weather can never be predicted with the kind of reliability that would allow one to cross the Gulf Stream in a houseboat, particularly in winter, the main crusing time; and again, the deep water passages between the westerly cays and Nassau require better. That "lake type sailboats" often venture to the Bahamas succesfully is merely an argument by ancedote, and so a dangerous one.  There are many, many, many cruisers anchored (right now!) in Elizabeth Harbor, off Georgetown, who got there on sheer luck alone.

Another opinion:  A few years ago those of us who made 5 knots or less felt we should cross at night, so that if we missed the Bahamas altogether we would have all day to find the island we were looking for.  With GPS that is no longer necessary.  Easiest crossing is 50 NM from Lake Worth to West End  on Grand Bahama Island.  Anchor in Lake Worth until you are sure of settled weather with wind from the west.  I have waited as long as 10 days for the right conditions.  There will be other boats waiting out weather.  Often a group of boats cross together.  It is a comfort to cross with other boats.  The entrance to the marina at West End is tricky.  I have gone in there at least ten times, and I still worry about it. From West End on around as far as Little Harbor there are short hops and numerous anchorages.  I don’t recommend the stretch from Little Harbor to Eleuthera in a houseboat. I haven’t hear of a restriction on entering the Bahamas at night.  Go in and either anchor or dock, raise the yellow "Q" flag and don’t get off the boat until Customs arrives.

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Anchor in Lake Worth until you are sure of settled weather with wind from the west.  I have waited as long as 10 days for the right conditions. If the wind is out of the west, ahead of a cold front, wouldn’t you expect it to clock through NW then North as the front passes?  Not a good time to be in the stream. John L. Miller

Yes, sometimes the window is only about 4 hours from the time the wind picks up from the west (almost *always* in advance of a cold front) to the time it swings around to a 30 knot+ northerly gale.  Against the fast north- flowing Gulf Stream, the sea conditions become unbelievably bad with any breeze from the north. I’d ship the houseboat if I were you.  The Bahama banks would be a wonderful place for a boat like that, but getting it there across the Gulf Stream is quite a big risk. Dan

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 This is a case of advice that is misguided, and when one generalizes with "Never", they are failing to consider that numerous "lake" type vessels have made quite successful voyages to and through the Bahamas, simply by selecting the weather conditions appropriate to their vessel.

I said never and I meant never.  Houseboats are not designed for offshore work under any circumstances.  Talking about ideal wind and sea conditions is nonsense.  We are not explorers, we are pleasure boaters;   and there is no reason to place any person aboard in danger with a vessel which can only operate in ideal wind and sea conditions. The insurance companies share this view, I believe. Ask what the premium increase will be for a houseboat taken offshore.   Jim Md.

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Anchor in Lake Worth until you are sure of settled weather with wind from the west.  I have waited as long as 10 days for the right conditions.

If the wind is out of the west, ahead of a cold front, wouldn’t you expect it to clock through NW then North as the front passes?  Not a good time to be in the stream. John L. Miller

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Anchor in Lake Worth until you are sure of settled weather with wind from the west.  I have waited as long as 10 days for the right conditions. If the wind is out of the west, ahead of a cold front, wouldn’t you expect it to clock through NW then North as the front passes?  Not a good time to be in the stream. John L. Miller

Absolutely true! An Irwin 45 named "Sandy Lanes" that took off ahead of me in the westerlies before a strong cold front, wound up being driven ashore on the west side of Gun Cay! I waited until after the front passed when light southerlies began to blow and had no problem. — J.A. Rogers Sailaway Cruising Club http://www.cqws.com/zone1/sailaway/

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One of the respondents to Horace’ query stated: : You’re pushing the envelope friend.  In no case should a houseboat be : taken offshore.  I might try it if I was a Haitian boat person; but : fortunately, I’m not. : : If you want to go to the Bahamas, buy an airline ticket. Depends on the houseboat, doesn’t it?  For shoal water cruising, a smaller houseboat, with less draft, would be far more appropriate than many of the offshore keelboats currently pussyfooting around the banks. Even a craft as large as Horace’s houseboat would be vastly preferable to a similar sized keelboat, if one wanted to follow the barrier reef down Andros Is. On the other hand, a craft as well-powered as Horace’s houseboat shouldn’t have problems finding an appropriate window of time, in which to cross the Straits of Florida safely. He’ll probably have greater problems finding a mooring at port of entry (grin). If I did it, I’d want a smaller boat with less than 2′ of draft, even if it were substantially slower.  But hell, if you’ve got the boat, and the desire (and the money)… Go for it, Horace! It should be a real adventure! Good Cruising, —      Bob Martin

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The boat is 60×14 with 22" of freeboard and a 42" draft. She has twin 228HP MercCruser outdrives and a fuel capacity of 175 Gals. Cruise speed at 1500RPM is about 8 knots with 21 knots at full speed. I plan to install Radar and GPS before the trip. Am I crazy or do you think this is possible ? What would you recommend ?

You’re pushing the envelope friend.  In no case should a houseboat be taken offshore.  I might try it if I was a Haitian boat person; but fortunately, I’m not. If you want to go to the Bahamas, buy an airline ticket. YOu should keep that nice houseboat in sheltered waters.  And there are plenty of sheltered waters that are perfect for you.  How about the ICW from New England to Fla?  How about the Erie Canal, the nicest fresh water cruise on the planet?  How about the Mighty Mississipp? Good Luck. Jim Md.

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You’re pushing the envelope friend.  In no case should a houseboat be taken offshore.  I might try it if I was a Haitian boat person; but fortunately, I’m not. If you want to go to the Bahamas, buy an airline ticket.

There are houseboats in the Virgin Islands and I’m sure they weren’t built there. — J.A. Rogers Sailaway Cruising Club http://www.cqws.com/zone1/sailaway/

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Ed: I’m in the process of rebuilding, from the hull up, a 60ft houseboat with the ultimate purpose of curising to the Bahamas from the closest point in Florida when I retire in six years. I’ve talked to a couple of people who say this is possible, if I pick the right time of year and watch the weather carefully. The boat is 60×14 with 22" of freeboard and a 42" draft. She has twin 228HP MercCruser outdrives and a fuel capacity of 175 Gals. Cruise speed at 1500RPM is about 8 knots with 21 knots at full speed. I plan to install Radar and GPS before the trip. Am I crazy or do you think this is possible ? What would you recommend ?

There was a rig which moored in Daytona Beach for a while.  On a small river barge type hull was a white frame building with a sign "Marine Research Laboratory" (It allowed anchoring in places where people might otherwise object.)  Around the perimeter of the barge were trailer hitch balls.  The owner supposedly took it to the Bahamas using a "tug" consisting of an open runabout with a large outboard.  He had a short tower frame on the tug with another trailer hitch ball and an A-frame with three female hitchs on the corners.  By repositioning the frame he could pull, push, or run along side.  He did spend some time waiting for just the right weather conditions. I think your houseboat is several cuts above this in surviveability, but yes, the word crazy does come to mind.  Crazy is fine as long as you don’t expect someone else to bail you out. Roger —

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You’re pushing the envelope friend.  In no case should a houseboat be taken offshore.  I might try it if I was a Haitian boat person; but fortunately, I’m not. If you want to go to the Bahamas, buy an airline ticket. There are houseboats in the Virgin Islands and I’m sure they weren’t built there.

I second that!  A houseboat on the Gulf Stream is courting suicide, and there ARE some deep water passages to be made within the archipelago. Don’t do it, especially as a novice. Go, but with a good keel and skeg beneath you.

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You’re pushing the envelope friend.  In no case should a houseboat be taken offshore.  I might try it if I was a Haitian boat person; but fortunately, I’m not. If you want to go to the Bahamas, buy an airline ticket. There are houseboats in the Virgin Islands and I’m sure they weren’t built there. — J.A. Rogers Sailaway Cruising Club http://www.cqws.com/zone1/sailaway/

There might be places that you could go through once you are there.  I think a lot of large freight (cars etc) go by local freighters.  That approach should get your boat there. I crossed the Gulf stream with a perfect forcast.  By the time I was 2 hours out, I was seeing the worst continuous conditions that I had ever seen in 30 years of sailing. We are all masters of our vessels despite what anyone says.  I would give this all little thought though. Hans Paabor Rocinante I Scarborough, Ontario With great power comes great responsiblity (Spiderman)

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I mentally swapped the critical specs of your houseboat and was thinking it draws 22” and has 42” of freeboard when I wrote advising you to Go For It! Considering you have almost no spare freeboard and are a bit deeper than I believed, I should qualify my answer: You probably should not go in winter, when the weather is quite changeable (and the forecasts are therefore less reliable). Keeping in mind that safe anchorages may sometimes be 30-40 miles (i.e.four-six hours) apart, if the wind springs up suddenly the resulting sea might be too much for your boat. The Banks can develop a very steep chop. I don’t know how well houseboats drive into head seas but I suspect, not too well. You should find out first-hand before going. Dead calm conditions are, I’m told,  common in late spring and summer (save for the odd hurricane, but that’s another story).  At any rate, take a liferaft or Whaler type dinghy and a handheld VHF. And, of course, insure the vessel. Byron

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If anyone is contemplating cruising in Bahamas, I may be able to help. While I have not been to each cay, I have cruised throughout the island nation, from Walker’s Cay on the north to Long Island in the southern region. This year I am going south thru southernmost Bahamas to Turks & Caicos, despite news of major drug running and politicians’ alleged

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Ed: I’m in the process of rebuilding, from the hull up, a 60ft houseboat with the ultimate purpose of curising to the Bahamas from the closest point in Florida when I retire in six years. I’ve talked to a couple of people who say this is possible, if I pick the right time of year and watch the weather carefully. The boat is 60×14 with 22" of freeboard and a 42" draft. She has twin 228HP MercCruser outdrives and a fuel capacity of 175 Gals. Cruise speed at 1500RPM is about 8 knots with 21 knots at full speed. I plan to install Radar and GPS before the trip. Am I crazy or do you think this is possible ? What would you recommend ? Thanks Ron Brown

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If anyone is contemplating cruising in Bahamas, I may be able to help. region. This year I am going south thru southernmost Bahamas to Turks & Caicos, despite news of major drug running and politicians’ alleged

In 16 years cruising in the Bahamas, drug running and politicians have been the least of my worries or problems.  They are simply not an issue for the average cruiser, and there are fewer drugs to encounter in the islands than on your average midtown street corner back in the states. Just returned from a fast passage from Ft. Lauderdale to Provo, (T&C), and the only problems encountered were related to the vessel, rather than politics or recreational pharmacy products. Good Sailing, 73,  Sean — Sean Holland NP2AU S/V Spindrift

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Go for it! Weather is key but the crossing from Miami to Gun Cay or Bimini should only take you a few hours (it’s 50nm or thereabouts). You will want to cross during a period of winds <12kts out of a southerly quadrant. You should experience chop no more than a foot or two over an easy swell. We spent a winter cruising the Bahamas in a 36′ sailboat. So long as you pick your weather carefully and hole up in one of the many protected anchorages during frontal passages, you should have no problem. Additionally, your shoal draft will open up many anchorages denied sailboats. So you should be able to avoid any unpleasantness. I would urge you to buy a short-wave receiver like the Grundig Yacht Boy 400 to get USCG weathercasts on NMN and to tune into the Bahamas marine net, as well as the big picture weather outlook from "Herb" on 12.359 at 2000 UCT. You may have to be very patient to get favorable conditions for operating in the NW Providence Channel; if it’s wintertime, you probably don’t want to operate in the northern half of the Bahamas (Abacos) as they get some very nasty weather indeed. Good luck! Byron Westerly ketch "Vela"

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Question:

I want to take just a moment to thank the people who tried to connect for the Wednesday evening chat session.  Unfortunately, FlyFishAmerica’s Web Page Chat option just didn’t work quite the way we wanted it to.   I hurriedly configured an alternate means but unfortunately not everyone had Java enabled browsers.  So in the interim until the folks at FlyFishAmerica can come up with an alternate means of chatting we will connect via IRC Client Software.  In other words you will need mIRC, WsIRC for IBM Clones, or Homer and IRcle for Mac’s. In configuring set your irc server to: 206.230.8.18, on port 6667. We will chat Wednesday Feb 5, at 18:00 MST or 20:00 Eastern Joe

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I want to take just a moment to thank the people who tried to connect for the Wednesday evening chat session.  Unfortunately, FlyFishAmerica’s Web Page Chat option just didn’t work quite the way we wanted it to. I hurriedly configured an alternate means but unfortunately not everyone had Java enabled browsers.  So in the interim until the folks at FlyFishAmerica can come up with an alternate means of chatting we will connect via IRC Client Software.  In other words you will need mIRC, WsIRC for IBM Clones, or Homer and IRcle for Mac’s. In configuring set your irc server to: 206.230.8.18, on port 6667. We will chat Wednesday Feb 5, at 18:00 MST or 20:00 Eastern JoeForgive me for being computer illiterate, but, what is and irc server?  

Where do you get it?  Is it software?  More info. please. John

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connect via IRC Client Software.  In other words you will need mIRC, WsIRC for IBM Clones, or Homer and IRcle for Mac’s. In configuring set your irc server to: 206.230.8.18, on port 6667. We will chat Wednesday Feb 5, at 18:00 MST or 20:00 Eastern JoeForgive me for being computer illiterate, but, what is and irc server?   Where do you get it?  Is it software?  More info. please. John

John if you are using an IBM Clone then go to http://www.tucows.com and in the area for text chat download a program called mIRC.  It is pretty easy to set up.  mIRC will allow you to connect to IRC (Internet Relay Chat)

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I want to take just a moment to thank the people who tried to connect for the Wednesday evening chat session.  Unfortunately, FlyFishAmerica’s Web Page Chat option just didn’t work quite the way we wanted it to. connect via IRC Client Software.   In other words you will need mIRC,WsIRC for IBM Clones, or Homer and IRcle for Mac’s. In configuring set your irc server to: 206.230.8.18, on port 6667. We will chat Wednesday Feb 5, at 18:00 MST or 20:00 Eastern JoeForgive me for being computer illiterate, but, what is and ircserver? Where do you get it?  Is it software?  More info. please. John if you are using an IBM Clone then go to http://www.tucows.com and in the area for text chat download a program called mIRC.  It is pretty easy to set up.  mIRC will allow you to connect to IRC (Internet Relay Chat)

Hello all… Sorry for the troubles we had before but they are now behind us. I re-wrote the FlyFishAmerica.com chat area, it has been fixed, it supports a lot more users and is wicked fast. It does not require any downloading or special software and is based on SERVERside Java which does not even require a Java enabled browser. Bob Stewart http://www.flyfishamerica.com/chat/chat.html

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I guess this question is for Al Beatty as much as everyone else.   Are we gonna try to chat Wed. evening again?

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I guess this question is for Al Beatty as much as everyone else. Are we gonna try to chat Wed. evening again?

Hi Joe Why don’t you start the chat and I’ll join in if I can. I have a fly tying class to teach and I’m not sure how long it will take. By the way I sure like your IRC server you showed me yesterday, it was great. Thanks much for sending me the soft ware. Good Tying &…. (the bobbin is on the way). — Tight Lines Al Beatty BT’s Fly Fishing Products Bozeman, MT http://www.flyshop.com/Expo/Specialty/BTsPdcts/index.html

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Where is the chat session going to be held from now on? John

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John: It is up in the air right now…..FFAmerica is in the process of working on their chat section ontheir page.  Til then try in your irc client to connect to: Server: 206.230.8.18 Port: 6667 Channel #FlyTyer Wednesday’s at 8:00pm EST – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Where is the chat session going to be held from now on? John

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Question:

Is flyfishing a sport or is it recreation? How about assigning it to a ng about addictions? BobE.

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Is flyfishing a sport or is it recreation? How about assigning it to a ng about addictions? BobE.

The answer is "Yes". This is what I always considered this ng to be about…Addiction…Capital "A"… Dennis

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Question:

I’ve been looking at the drift boats kits online from Greg Boats and Ray’s Dories. Has anybody built one of these boats for fly fishing? How did the building go, any tips? Also, who did you buy the kit from? Any info would be appreciated.

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Check out Greg Tatman’s kits.  I built the 12′ river pram.  After all said and done it cost a little over a grand to build and fully outfit. While a 2 person boat, it fishes best as one person rig.  Stable as well as maneuverable.  It fishes the steelhead rivers here on the Olympic Peninsula and Snake River drainages just fine. I would select it again in a heartbeat.  It came with a good set of instructions and when I got stumped, Greg was glad to answer questions.  It took about 4 months of week ends, maybe 80 hours. I do not have the number at hand, but call information and ask for Tatman Boats in Springfield Oregon. Bart Phillips

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I’ve been looking at the drift boats kits online from Greg Boats and Ray’s Dories. Has anybody built one of these boats for fly fishing? How did the building go, any tips? Also, who did you buy the kit from? Any info would be appreciated.

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I built a Don Hill Drift Boat a 16 ft. Guide Boat, it is a great kit comes complete with video and instructions. The boat took about 120 hrs to build and Don has a 1- 800 Number if you have any questions. He and his staff aim to please the customer and if I was going to build another boat it would be his. Also Greg Tatman used to work for Don before going into business. Call Don Hill @ 1- 800878 – 5488 and tell him you heard about him from Kent Anderson in Nashville Tn. fly fishing

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I built a Don Hill Drift Boat a 16 ft. Guide Boat, it is a great kit comes complete with video and instructions.

Whadja pay ? — TimW Halfordian Golfer

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Thanks for the info. I’ll give him a call. Where do you use your boat in Nashville. I’m in KY.

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I am interested in building a drift boat.  If anybody has any information or experiences with drift boat kits I would appreciate any input.

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be careful. i had a drift boat, and i sold it.  it was very hard to do.  i actually cried as it left the driveway and turned the corner into someone else’s flyfishing reality. the problem was..the driftboat haunted me.  i would be leaving for work and it would be in the driveway saying "tim..how can you go off to work and leave me all alone in the driveway…". or, i’d be heading off on a wading adventure or with the belly boat and it would cry…"tim…how could you ?". and then, of course i’d feel guilty and this in turn would lead to a fishless day (happened a lot, actually). approach this driftboat thing with care my friend… Tim Walker

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Strongly suggest that anyone thinking about building a drift boat contact the Wooden Boat Shop in Seattle, and purchase a set of Tracy O’brien’s plans.  This plan set tells how to build a stitch and glue hull, which has no frames to trip over or take up space, is far stronger, and has fiberglass/epoxy chines, which is where the damage gets done.  I have built both a Don Hill (which is a lovely boat, BTW) and an O’Brien, and the O’brien is much sweeter.   Stitch and glue is a technique where you sew the plywood panels together with iron wire, brace the panels into shape, and then treat the seams with first a fillet of epoxy soaked sawdust and then epoxy soaked fiberglass tape.  This creates an extremely strong hull, and uses no ribs.  This gives you an open floor, which means nothing to trip over, and no floorboards to catch your fly line.  BIG advantage. You can buy a finished boat of this style by contacting Creekside Outfitters in Issaquah, WA.  They have somebody selling the hulls for about $1700.  Better to build yourself and have the pleasure.  Also, much as in rod building, by doing it yourself, you can use neat woods and get the extra cosmetic pleasure for minimal costs. Take care with the woods that you use.  Suggest that you get Hoadley’s book on hardwoods and use that to drive your materials selection

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: be careful. : the problem was..the driftboat haunted me.  i would be leaving for : work and it would be in the driveway saying "tim..how can you go : off to work and leave me all alone in the driveway…". I guess Tim hears a lot of voices.  I think we are the ones who should be careful. Ignore the voices, Tim.  They are only in your head.  Really. — Rick T. Rick Fletcher   –   http://www.chem.uidaho.edu/~fletcher/ Assistant professor of chemistry  |  That’s Idaho, not Iowa.    |  These University of Idaho               |  Upper Left Hand Corner.    |  opinions Moscow, ID 83844-2343             |  No, I don’t grow potatoes. |  are mine.

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: Strongly suggest that anyone thinking about building a drift boat contact : the Wooden Boat Shop in Seattle, and purchase a set of Tracy O’brien’s : plans.  This plan set tells how to build a stitch and glue hull, which : has no frames to trip over or take up space, is far stronger, and has : fiberglass/epoxy chines, which is where the damage gets done.  I have : built both a Don Hill (which is a lovely boat, BTW) and an O’Brien, and : the O’brien is much sweeter.   Andrew, just how difficult are the techniques and effort required to do a good job?  Special tools, techniques, etc…? Thanks. — Rick T. Rick Fletcher   –   http://www.chem.uidaho.edu/~fletcher/ Assistant professor of chemistry  |  That’s Idaho, not Iowa.    |  These University of Idaho               |  Upper Left Hand Corner.    |  opinions Moscow, ID 83844-2343             |  No, I don’t grow potatoes. |  are mine.

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My fly fishing buddy just bought a new drift boat for fishing the Green River. Unfortunately we have not been able to find any information on how to navigate the river well.  We don’t have much trouble when rowing backwards but when the boat is turned around to go through the rapids it is difficult to steer. We haven’t been able to find books, instruction, or anything else to make this any easier.  Has anyone had experience doing this?  Can you suggest any publications to assist us. Thanks! Jeff Dinsdale

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Call 1-800-541-9498 (Frank Amato Publications) Ask for "Floating Whitewater Rivers". This book should get you on the right track.

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I have a rule which has served me well. Never go down a river unless:     a) you have gone down it with someone who knows the river         and     b) you specifically intended to learn the river from that person. Rule number 2:  Always put the plug in before launching. Have fun!

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