Question:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello Wilfred, glad you enjoyed the site.  To your question:    Shooting heads are actually nothing more than pieces of fly-line whose weight is matched as exactly as possible to the rod.  They are normally made by using a normal DT line, from one to two sizes heavier than the recommended line weight for the rod, and cutting this to a suitable length. Which line you choose to start with depends on the intended purpose of the finished head. Any given rod, including fly-rods, will cast best of all when loaded with a specific weight.  Shooting heads are based on this principle.  Once you find the "optimum" weight for your rod, then you can weigh the result, and any line of this actual weight may be cast well with this rod, or indeed even a piece of lead of the same weight. There are of course physical limitations to the length of line etc, but within fairly wide parameters the above holds true.  Again, within certain parameters, the length, diameter, and other line characteristics are quite immaterial, only the actual weight is important. "Ready made" shooting heads are not normally as good as the ones you make up yourself, as they rarely match the rod properly, which rather defeats the object of the exercise. In order to make up a shooting head for any particular rod, the procedure is as follows: Obtain a DT line one size heavier than the recommended line weight, ( if there are two numbers on your rod, i.e. #5/7 ) then use a number seven DT. It is immaterial whether one uses a floater or a sinker, or any other type of line, however, for your particular purpose, ( deep fishing ), a high density sinking line is the only really suitable choice to start with. Put this line on your rod, and then cast it normally without using any hauling etc.  Do not try to cast more than about forty feet maximum, as this may overload the rod, and even damage it.    When you are casting effortlessly and well, with say 30 to 40 feet of line outside the rod tip, ( this will vary considerably dependent on the rod used ), then take a marking pen, lay the rod down, and mark the line at the rod tip. You have just found the ideal line weight for your rod.   Cut the line at this point. Attach your backing line to where the line was cut, ( 20 LB flat nylon monofil, for instance, such as "amnesia", although normal monofil will also work, but has a tendency to tangle more) with a needle knot or similar, ( I prefer loops, see below). Now, using a double haul, ( the technique is described on my site ), you should be able to shoot a great deal of this backing without any trouble or effort at all.  With practice, even extreme distances may be reached. One hundred foot casts are no problem at all, and a great deal more may be reached with practice.  The technique is to lay out the backing on a level surface, or use a line tray or similar, aerialise the head, execute a double haul, and allow the backing to shoot. For your specific purpose, I would actually advise getting a DT line two sizes heavier than your rod recommendation. The procedure is then the same, but your shooting head will be a lot shorter, as the line is heavier to start with. Do not try to aerialise more than thirty feet of this line, it will damage your rod. A "short"  heavy head is more advantageous for deep fishing, as it sinks more rapidly, and also more uniformly.  This may mean that your "head" is only twenty -five feet long.  This is slightly more difficult to cast, but it is better for your purpose. One does have the advantage that one is constantly casting a piece of line of the same length and weight, and once this is learned, there is never any need to alter ones timing etc.  This is quite easy with a little practice. You do not say which flies you would like to use, but normally for this purpose, largish streamers and similar flies are used. The rig described will carry quite large heavy flies fairly easily. The trick now is to cast the line out, and start "counting down" in seconds, retrieve, when you get a take, then you know the fish are at this depth, and on subsequent casts you simply count the same number of seconds before starting your retrieve.   You do not of course know the actual depth you are fishing at, but this is not necessary, and it would do you little good to know it anyway. There are quite a few problems associated with very deep fly-fishing, not the least of which is finding the fish.  Large lakes and similar bodies of water invariably have what is known as a "thermocline" at some specific depth, which varies with the weather etc. This is a distinct separation line between relatively "warm" surface water, and relatively "cold" water.  The temperature difference may be quite considerable, and the fish may be on one side or the other of the thermocline,  if you are not fishing in the correct zone, you will catch nothing at all, a few inches deeper or higher, and you may get a bagfull. The "countdown" method allows you to find this depth fairly quickly. It is rarely necessary to fish even close to the bottom in such deep lakes, as there are very few fish there at all, if any.   Most of the deep lakes I fish in Summer, ( in Winter, there is no thermocline as such, for various physical reasons, this of course assumes that your "Winter" is cold ), generally have fish ( and large ones ! ) at between 25 and 50 feet, and these fish invariably feed on shoals of baitfish. On very large lakes, you can "trail" this rig behind the boat at slow speed, paying out backing to control the depth.  The more backing out, and the slower the speed, the deeper you fish.  This may help you to find the fish before you tire yourself out casting!  Use a larger reel than you normally would, with plenty of backing line. At the very least one hundred and fifty yards.  If you get hooked into a ten pounder or more it will give you a hell of a fight usually, and very long unstoppable runs are fairly typical of such fish. If you do not have enough backing, they will simply break you. The best flies are invariably streamers as I said, and you should use larger ones.  Most of my "standards" are at least three inches long, and sometimes larger. The leader you use can simply be a piece of normal monofil line, I invariably use a ten foot length of ten pound nylon.  "Turnover", and "presentation" are not factors in this type of fishing, in the sense that the "presentation" takes place under water at considerable depth, and any casting finesse on the surface is superfluous. This is not an elegant method of fishing, but it is extremely effective. If you find that even this rig gets down too slowly ( unlikely but possible ), then obtain a length of "lead core" line, follow the procedure described for making up a shooting head, but use the lead core line to do this. Only use a short piece of this to start casting with, and be careful, a whack in the back of the head from this stuff will quite possibly knock you out, and if it hits the rod it may shatter it.  This rig is a real pig to cast, as the timing is extremely critical, but it will get down deep and fast, and more and more people are using such rigs for fishing in deep water, especially in the ocean.  Personally I prefer the more "normal" high density sinker, as it is more pleasant to use. For fishing at depths in excess of say thirty or forty feet, there is no real alternative to a high density head, or lead core line.  You will doubtless be surprised at how long it takes such a line to sink as well.  If you want to try this, then simply cast out, and wait for the line to hit bottom.  You will feel this when it happens, the backing line will "go slack". If you want to increase your fishing depth, then after casting, pay out backing as required until you reach your previously determined "count down" depth. This also helps the line to sink in a more or less horizontal plane, and prevents the line hanging "straight down" under the boat, which makes for bad presentation. The fish you are attempting to imitate rarely swim vertically, and a horizontal presentation is invariably more succesfull. For "trailing " behind the boat ( this method is often called "trolling", which is however incorrect ), the lead core line may be superior, especially as casting is not then necessary. Just pay line out as required. To close, if you wish to experiment with shooting heads, then I would advise you to buy "mill ends" from the following address.  These are cheap, and of excellent quality, and one can make up a whole range of heads for various purposes for very little money.  I have used these for years.  You can make up two shooting heads from a DT line, and you can use the odd thirty feet which is left over from the middle for other experiments, or making up other custom lines, like sink tips, intermediates etc. I use "shooting heads" almost exclusively, for all my fishing, and I am very happy with them. I can change lines at will, simply by looping a new head onto my backing, even when "normal" trout stream fishing etc. I carry up to ten heads coiled in a wallet in my jacket pocket, and I can immediately react to any changes in water or weather etc, simply by looping on a new head Mullarkey & Sons 184-185 Waterloo Street, Burton-on-Trent, Staffs DE14 2NQ England You can pay by credit card, order by phone,  ( I believe they are working on a web-site as well )  the service is excellent, and many of the other products are worth taking a look at as well. Their phone number is  01283   566777  ask them to send you a catalogue. I have no connection with them by the

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Response:

Ooops !  This post was actually a mistake, it was a reply to an e-mail which I once again accidentally posted to ROFF.  Oh well never mind, if it was of any help to you. I am sure nobody will mind.   I will have to avoid posting when I am tired out in future. TL MC — "In order to know what is possible one must constantly attempt the impossible" http://www.mikeconnor.de Excellant Post – Very informative.  I have been cutting double tapered

lines

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I used to cut double tapers in half for small stream fishing but quit when my son came back from the Lamar River in Yellowstone one Fall and complained about only having hip boots and 1/2 Double Taper Line. Seems the trout were feeding just out of reach and he thought I had endangered the family jewels. Ernie

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Excellant Post – Very informative.  I have been cutting double tapered lines in two for years, mostly because I am cheap and use only half a line most of the time anyway.   Your method of tuning the line is brilliant. This fall I will have a section of 10 weight on the old Ugly Stick up on the Ho. I use to have a size G-A "spinning taper"  ( made to fly fish with a spinning rod )  that I used on a nine weigh.  It  was 14′ long and worked very well but I haven’t seen one for years.  I have been using a weight forward line and never have been really thrilled with them. Thanks again   BJ Conner Hello Wilfred, Mike "In order to know what is possible one must constantly attempt the impossible" http://www.mikeconnor.de —–Urspr

Question:

Today I finally found the time to head up to Boone and fish for trout. It had been nearly two months since my last visit. Fortunately, I was able to bring along an ex-ROFFian celebrity guest which had the added bonus of providing Waldo a bit of motivation to join us for the day. I think I can safely speak for all of three us when I say that we had a great time. After taking care of a few errands in the area, Celebrity Guest and I met Waldo at his house at about 9:30am and headed to the Watauga. We decided to fish the delayed harvest section for a while as we waited for the sun to come out and (hopefully) bring the fish to the surface. As it turns out, the fish never did really get into the swing of taking dry flies, so we (well, those of us with no scruples anyway) were relegated to fishing with nymphs. The stockers were unusually picky and much more of a challenge than normal. Not a bad thing at all, but in the end we did manage to catch a respectable number of fish. At about noon we headed to a wild stream that has quickly become one of my very favorite places on earth to fish. The water was running high and *cold* but relatively clear. I was actually glad that I had let Celebrity Guest borrow my nice breathable waders and that I had chosen to wear my neoprene backups. We fished some absolutely stunning stretches of water. Despite the fact that I’m practically only half the age of my fishing partners, I was the only one to take a spill. I didn’t get wet, but I did manage quite a shin shiner. Once again, dry flies did not produce (although Waldo and Celebrity Guest stuck to their dry fly guns with seasoned determination) but a few fish could be had here and there in the deep pools with small Prince nymphs and a couple of–ahem–sinkers. It’s interesting how different things are at this time of year than they were last year at this time. The water is much higher and colder which has likely delayed the dry fly action by several weeks. Or maybe that has nothing to do with it; who knows. Despite the predictions of rain showers, the weather was great. An almost eery cold front pushed its way into the area right as we were breaking down our gear (at about 3:30pm) and by 4:00pm it was butt cold outside. A good day on the stream and the company was most excellent. Can’t wait to do it again… –Steve

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  Um, I need a ruling on the above: is it White Fish that he’s fucking, or is he a White Fucker who preys on fish?

Jeff preys on white fish.  What he did with them after that is still his little secret <g HTH. — Warren Findley "The vice or virtue of any form of angling lies not in the method but in the man." Author Hugh Falkus

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Sure, but just in a sarcastic manner…. Shut up  white fish fucker!

Um, I need a ruling on the above: is it White Fish that he’s fucking, or is he a White Fucker who preys on fish? /daytripper (Thanks in advance

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So if I designate myself as the "Best fly fisherman to ever live" will you guys start referring to me as that?

Sure, but just in a sarcastic manner….

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Sure, but just in a sarcastic manner….

Shut up  white fish fucker! — Warren Findley "The vice or virtue of any form of angling lies not in the method but in the man." Author Hugh Falkus

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Ya really think Zimbo’s breathables would fit the dwarf?  

Maybe they cut one leg off of Waldo’s old waders and made him hop from boulder to boulder. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/

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Well hell’s bells, are you going to tell us who it is? It was Vern Ursenbach.

Cool! I always thought Vern was perfectly proportioned to fish those little NC streams. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/

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Ya really think Zimbo’s breathables would fit the dwarf?   (You wouldn’t believe how many times I had to rewrite that to avoid some sicko double-entendre.   e.g. Do you think Vern would fit in Zimbo’s

waders?) I am sure he could reside in one leg of Zimbo’s waders very comfortably <g — Warren Findley "The vice or virtue of any form of angling lies not in the method but in the man." Author Hugh Falkus

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"Paul Goodwin" wrote I do believe that if he was goint to tell us he would have.    So it must have been the dwarf.

Ya really think Zimbo’s breathables would fit the dwarf?   (You wouldn’t believe how many times I had to rewrite that to avoid some sicko double-entendre.   e.g. Do you think Vern would fit in Zimbo’s waders?) Joe F.

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Charlie Wilson: "Paul Goodwin" wrote I do believe that if he was goint to tell us he would have.   So it must have been the dwarf.

<splork  But I missed the computer!!! <g Dave

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It was Vern Ursenbach. You are joking right? Hell yeah he’s joking. It was the American Sportsman.

Oh, you mean Curt Gowdy

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It was the company that I help start (The American Sportsman’s Club" OR it is "The American Sportsman’s Series" that was directed by my good friend, who recently died, Burr Smidt who lives on Manasee Road in Sarasota Florida.  He has done a lot of production works that were outstanding, especially those done with his wife, Renee’ Valenti Smidt. The American Sportsman was a popular Television Series twenty years ago. Guests included Bing Crosby, and many other Hollywood American Sportsmen.  It was THE PREMIER Outdoors Program all others try to top. None have done it to date Warren. George     Hell yeah he’s joking. It was the American Sportsman. WhoTF is the American Sportsman? — Warren Findley "The vice or virtue of any form of angling lies not in the method but in the man." Author Hugh Falkus

– (C) George Gehrke 2001 http://www.gink.com/shopcart/index.html     fine bamboo flyrods & blanks

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GROSS! George was using that tag for a while last year. So if I designate myself as the "Best fly fisherman to ever live" will you guys start referring to me as that? Why does it remind me of the old saying "You can hope in one hand, crap in the other and see which one gets filled first" ?.?.?.? — Warren Findley "The vice or virtue of any form of angling lies not in the method but in the man." Author Hugh Falkus

– (C) George Gehrke 2001 http://www.gink.com/shopcart/index.html     fine bamboo flyrods & blanks

Response:

    Hell yeah he’s joking. It was the American Sportsman.

WhoTF is the American Sportsman? — Warren Findley "The vice or virtue of any form of angling lies not in the method but in the man." Author Hugh Falkus

Response:

George was using that tag for a while last year. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –     Hell yeah he’s joking. It was the American Sportsman. WhoTF is the American Sportsman? — Warren Findley "The vice or virtue of any form of angling lies not in the method but in the man." Author Hugh Falkus

Response:

George was using that tag for a while last year.

So if I designate myself as the "Best fly fisherman to ever live" will you guys start referring to me as that? Why does it remind me of the old saying "You can hope in one hand, crap in the other and see which one gets filled first" ?.?.?.? — Warren Findley "The vice or virtue of any form of angling lies not in the method but in the man." Author Hugh Falkus

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It was Vern Ursenbach. You are joking right?

    Hell yeah he’s joking. It was the American Sportsman.

Response:

It was Vern Ursenbach. You are joking right?

You’ll have to ask Mr. Wilson about that… –Steve

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"Paul Goodwin" wrote I do believe that if he was goint to tell us he would have.   So it must have been the dwarf.

Somehow I doubt Mrs. Dwarf would let him roam that far. /daytripper (My money’s on wayno…)

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Well hell’s bell’s, are you going to tell us who it is?

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I do believe that if he was goint to tell us he would have.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Well hell’s bell’s, are you going to tell us who it is?

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"Paul Goodwin" wrote I do believe that if he was goint to tell us he would have.

   So it must have been the dwarf.

Response:

Well hell’s bells, are you going to tell us who it is?

It was Vern Ursenbach. –Steve

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It was Vern Ursenbach.

You are joking right?

Response:

<snipped nice TR for space? Glad you had a good time.  Perhaps you can broker a deal for their extra water to help fill up our rivers and resevoirs to keep California in electricity this summer. Was Wayno the celebrity guest? <g — Warren Findley "The vice or virtue of any form of angling lies not in the method but in the man." Author Hugh Falkus

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Question:

  I am happy to report that there are exceptionally courteous fisherman out there too. Paul

_____  To notice, is impressive Paul.  There is hope! — Mr.G http://www.gink.com/shopcart/index.html

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There have been a few threads on GDA’s (I think we have a new TLA) lately and some of the tales pale in comparison to some I have run into. I am happy to report that there are exceptionally courteous fisherman out there too. Paul

I guess it’s akin to one unhappy customer who tells 20 people of their bad experience with company xyz and the hundreds of perfectly satisfied customers who tell nobody.  By and large sportsmen/women are a genial bunch and the good far out number the few well, not so good….I guess the exceptions are the ones that stand out and get noticed.  I’ll have to remember to thank my oil delivery man next time I see him. I’m fairly new to newsgroups (this is only the second one I subscribed to) so if this is a stupid question, and I have this sinking feeling it is, feel free to laugh…..but, what is a TLA? Natty

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[snippage] I’m fairly new to newsgroups (this is only the second one I subscribed to) so if this is a stupid question, and I have this sinking feeling it is, feel free to laugh…..but, what is a TLA?

A "Three Letter Acronym", of course…

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A "Three Letter Acronym", of course…

Duh.  See, I knew it was a stupid question. Natty

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"Salmon_Fly" wrote… On Saturday Dave Price an I fished the Ausable in NY. While we were fishing a stretch above the no-kill area I heard a noise behind me and a someone stepped out of the woods and stood at the edge of the River. I was a little bummed because I had intended to work my way upstream. But there was enough room for two people to come in and fish between myself and where Dave was.

Yadda, yadda, yadda… Did you guys fish your bamboo rods? –Steve

Response:

"Salmon_Fly" wrote…

[snip] Yadda, yadda, yadda… Did you guys fish your bamboo rods? –Steve

Don’t ask stupid questions… of course we did. Dave and I met Saturday morning at one of my favorite fishing spots. As we were getting ready another guy was leaving and when we asked how he did and he grumbled somethng about getting skunked. We get down to the river and Dave has a fish on the first cast. I landed a couple small bows before the waders would have done more good over my head. We decided to take the trip up to the Ausable. We fished 4 spots in the afternoon and didn’t see a fish. We broke for dinner around 4:30 and went back out. One of the spots that we saw earlier in the day was vacant so we decided to fish that. I saw a few fish jump clear of the water chasing something but couldn’t get them interested in anything. Then as the sun went down I got my first brown on a #4 stimulator. There were a few more short strikes on it but no more fish. I then tried a fly that Day Tripper came up with. First cast I had a strike 2nd cast I landed another brown about 16". I ended up with 8 browns, two in the 12" range, five in the 16" to 18" and the last one of the evening was about 22". Dave was fishing with a 7′ 3pc that he built on a Leonard taper It was the first time out for that rod. I was fishing a 6′ 9" 2pc that I built based on a Cattanach taper. Paul

Response:

There was another fisherman about 75 yds below me. Paul

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Well, I concede that it is strange, pleasant and nice to experience courteous behavior…..but why didn’t he just disturb the water ‘below’ you…..not that I would have thought of suggesting same had it been me….john …makes for a nice day, eh? On Saturday Dave Price an I fished the Ausable in NY. While we were fishing a stretch above the no-kill area I heard a noise behind me and a someone stepped out of the woods and stood at the edge of the River. I was a little bummed because I had intended to work my way upstream. But there was enough room for two people to come in and fish between myself and where Dave was. The gentleman stood there for 10 min or better not moving and I just kept casting. When it was obvious that the fish weren’t interested in the fly I pulled it in to change it. It was then he spoke up and asked if he could cross the river upstream from me. I said be my guest and went back to picking the next selection. When he was about half way across the river I said to him that he was only the second person that ever bothered to ask permission and thanked him. When I went back to fishing I noticed that he was gone. He was crossing the river to hike into a remote section of the river. He wasn’t going to fish were we were, he was asking permission to disturb the water upstream from me.  There have been a few threads on GDA’s (I think we have a new TLA) lately and some of the tales pale in comparison to some I have run into. I am happy to report that there are exceptionally courteous fisherman out there too. Paul

Response:

On Saturday Dave Price an I fished the Ausable in NY. While we were fishing a stretch above the no-kill area I heard a noise behind me and a someone stepped out of the woods and stood at the edge of the River. I was a little bummed because I had intended to work my way upstream. But there was enough room for two people to come in and fish between myself and where Dave was. The gentleman stood there for 10 min or better not moving and I just kept casting. When it was obvious that the fish weren’t interested in the fly I pulled it in to change it. It was then he spoke up and asked if he could cross the river upstream from me. I said be my guest and went back to picking the next selection. When he was about half way across the river I said to him that he was only the second person that ever bothered to ask permission and thanked him. When I went back to fishing I noticed that he was gone. He was crossing the river to hike into a remote section of the river. He wasn’t going to fish were we were, he was asking permission to disturb the water upstream from me.  There have been a few threads on GDA’s (I think we have a new TLA) lately and some of the tales pale in comparison to some I have run into. I am happy to report that there are exceptionally courteous fisherman out there too. Paul

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Well, I concede that it is strange, pleasant and nice to experience courteous behavior…..but why didn’t he just disturb the water ‘below’ you…..not that I would have thought of suggesting same had it been me….john …makes for a nice day, eh?

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -On Saturday Dave Price an I fished the Ausable in NY. While we were fishing a stretch above the no-kill area I heard a noise behind me and a someone stepped out of the woods and stood at the edge of the River. I was a little bummed because I had intended to work my way upstream. But there was enough room for two people to come in and fish between myself and where Dave was. The gentleman stood there for 10 min or better not moving and I just kept casting. When it was obvious that the fish weren’t interested in the fly I pulled it in to change it. It was then he spoke up and asked if he could cross the river upstream from me. I said be my guest and went back to picking the next selection. When he was about half way across the river I said to him that he was only the second person that ever bothered to ask permission and thanked him. When I went back to fishing I noticed that he was gone. He was crossing the river to hike into a remote section of the river. He wasn’t going to fish were we were, he was asking permission to disturb the water upstream from me.  There have been a few threads on GDA’s (I think we have a new TLA) lately and some of the tales pale in comparison to some I have run into. I am happy to report that there are exceptionally courteous fisherman out there too. Paul

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Question:

What happened to my original thread?

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What is a boobie? Buzzer?

Hi Michael, A Booby is a particular type of lure, I’m surprised no-one has described one sooner. Take for example a Black Booby. Hook            Long shank #10 Tail            Black marabou Body            Black chenille with silver rib   Hackle          Black cock The Booby bit           Two polystyrene/ ethafoam beads about 3/16" diam tied at the eye of the hook. The beads are encased in a small piece of nylon stocking and tied in with a figure of 8 whipping (better still a piece of surgical rubber such as condom rubber – waterproof see!) Fished on a very short leader, about 18" with a fast sink line. Allow to sink to the bottom and retrieve slowly. Takes can be vicious. As a method of fishing, I agree with one contributor to this thread, it is boring, but just the thing when you want a bit of a rest to sip that single malt. — Bill http://www.graigroad.demon.co.uk

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<snip questions answered by Michael 3. Why does my Airflo 7000 floating line start to sink?

Probably a bit dirty. Clean it with a very mild detergent solution, rinse well then treat it with Mucilin. 6. … How about Boobies?

Don’t know anything about UK boobies, but here in the states if you want boobies, especially the gorgeous, perky young ones, it’s best to troll with a late model sports car. — Ken Fortenberry

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Nice one!

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Sometimes you just don’t know the depth to fish. In that case I use a sinking line (they sink at different rates, so make certain you know your line). On the first few casts I’ll let it sink for 5 seconds before I start retrieving. I then go to 10 seconds and so forth until I find the correct depth.  Not as scientific as some methods,  but it usually works if you have enough patience. DLH – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – 1. Any general rules for depth  (when I cant see the fish) Depth will primarily depend on what the fish are feeding on, and the temperature of the water.  On a hot summer day, you often get a layer of very warm water on top, and cool water underneath.  In winter you get the opposite effect.  Fish will therefore be deep.  (How deep will depend on lake and feeding behavior).  While in early spring, optimum temperatures will be in the top layer, as in late fall.  At some times of the year, fish can be anywhere in the water column. 2. Any general hotspots Generally fish hang out where there is 1) food; 2) optimum temperature; 3) protection from predators.  Typical hotspots include: — in spring fed lakes, in summer, springholes where cool water enters the lake, producing optimum temperatures — inlets, where incoming streams wash in food and/or produce optimum temperatures — drop offs which provide deep water protection with easy access to shallows holding bait fish for food. 3. Why does my Airflo 7000 floating line start to sink? Beats me. 4. How do I guess what colour buzzer etc to use? Is a buzzers a streamer/bucktail?  Try to check out baitfish in lake. If you can’t determine, start with something close to the bottom color, e.g. brown, olive. 5. Does the size of fly depend on lake size? Not necessarily. 6. Is it easier to catch with a lure/ streamer than nymph or buzzer? How about Boobies? What is a boobie? Buzzer? Michael — www.geocities.com/yosemite/falls/3363 Share what you know. Learn what you don’t.

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Don’t know anything about UK boobies, but here in the states if you want boobies, especially the gorgeous, perky young ones, it’s best to troll with a late model sports car.

Cash works as well as the sports car Ken, and its a great deal less bulky, but somehow I’ve managed to lose the manual on how to acquire either.  Can you help me out here?

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… I’ve managed to lose the manual on how to acquire either.  Can you help me out here?

Buy low, sell high. Hope this helps. — Ken Fortenberry

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1. Any general rules for depth  (when I cant see the fish)

Use a weigted nymph or streamer ( lure )  and "count down"  until you get a strike.  Technique is cast, count until bottom is felt, retrieve. Cast again, count minus ten ad retrieve etc.  This works best with sinking lines, but will also wortk with nymphs etc on a very long leader. 2. Any general hotspots

Around sunken hedges and similar, it takes a while to get to know the hotspots on stillwaters.  One tip though, do not fish with the wind at your back just because it is comfortable. Fish into the wind, and try the margins first before wading in etc. If the prevailing wind has been in the same direction for some time lots of surface food etc will be very close to the bank opposite to the direction the wind is blowing. A woolly bugger or wormfly or stick fly drawn over the stones etc especially in a slight wave right in the margins is usually successful. Dont forget to try dry flies, Chew and Blagdon are noted for the good surface activity. Hoppers, and similar are a good bet. 3. Why does my Airflo 7000 floating line start to sink?

It may be dirty, clean it with warm soapy water. Most things from Airflo are rubbish, includng their lines and rods. Buy a Cortland !!!!!!! 4. How do I guess what colour buzzer etc to use?

Try black first, then brown , then green then red, or fish a team to start with and use the one that gets the most hits. It is also possible to see buzzers hatching, take a small pair of binoculars along, and scan the water carefully. The shucks from the last hatch will ofetn be floating in the margins, and also check the spiders webs on the bushes in the area, these will have example of the last hatches stuck in them. Saves a lot of guesswork. Also you can ask one of the regulars, they are usually happy to help. Just dont clump up like a bloody elephant and disturb anyones fishing. Wait if necessary until they stop for a smoke or something. 5. Does the size of fly depend on lake size?

No, it depends on the size of the natural which you wish to imitate. Lake size is immaterial. Buzzers vary in size considerably, but sizes 12 14 and 16 are common. A snipe and purple and a partridge and orange are also excellent buzzer imitations, and catch remarkably well. 6. Is it easier to catch with a lure/ streamer than nymph or buzzer? How about Boobies?

Depends what you mean by easy. Lure fishing means continuous long casting with basically a fish imitation. It is sometimes very successful, sometimes not.  Buzzers ( midge pupae, Chironomid = non biting midges )  are usually fished static, or at least evyr slowly indeed,in the surface film. Booby fishing is usually quite deadly, technique = sinking line, short leader, no more than three feet, and down to ten inches. Cast sinking line out, allow to sink to bottom, retrieve in short pulls which causes the foam headed booby to dive towards the bottom like a fry heading for shelter. Bright fluorescent boobies work well for rainbows, more sober colours, black brown etc for browns. The technique is effective but boring. Tight lines ! Mike Connor

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<snip questions answered by Michael 3. Why does my Airflo 7000 floating line start to sink? Probably a bit dirty. Clean it with a very mild detergent solution, rinse well then treat it with Mucilin.

Hi Ken, I would beg to differ, you should on no account treat modern floating lines with Mucilin, this will damage the coating. If a dressing is required Cortland line dressing is about the best. TL MC

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Hi Ken, I would beg to differ, you should on no account treat modern floating lines with Mucilin, this will damage the coating. If a dressing is required Cortland line dressing is about the best.

Hmm. There are two Mucilins. The red Mucilin is mostly animal fat and has never hurt any of my lines so far as I can tell. The green Mucilin is a silicone paste and I’m not familiar with it. I find the Cortland to be somewhat hard to apply because it tends to clump up and make a mess. Have you tried the PZ Plasticiser ? I haven’t but it sounds good. — Ken Fortenberry

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<SNIPPED Have you tried the PZ Plasticiser ? I haven’t but it sounds good. — Ken Fortenberry

Hi Ken, I spoke to the former president of Cortland not long ago on this very subject. He confirmed that dressings, other than those recommended by the manufacturer, should be avoided.  At one time it was of no particular consequence, as long as you avoided petrochemical derivatives and one or two chemicals like DEET, and some suntan lotions  or similar. Nowadays the line coatings are so complex that it is best to avoid dressings at all if you are not sure what to use. The possibilites are in the meantime endless, even not taking things like albolene,  rain-x, vaseline,   and God knows what else into account, I do not use these, simply because I do not know what is in them, and what effect it may have on my line. I do not doubt for one second that some of them work very well.  The Cortland dressing is the best I have found up to now, I wash my lines after every outing in warm soapy water, let them dry,to the floaters I then apply a thin coat of the Cortland stuff by pulling the line slowly through the applicator and buff it off again using a soft cloth.  Never had a problem, and I have some lines that are well over ten years old and still in regular use. I have some even older ones as well, but they are a bit stiff, so I dont use them anymore. Some pastes contain solvents besides the dressing, this will at first do no obvious harm to the line, but after a while the plasticizers will be leeched out and small cracks will start to appear, shortly after that the line becomes useless.  I have seen lines damaged very badly after only being used a dozen times, it was not always possible to find out why, and may in fact have been faulty lines occasionally, but in the main the damage was due to incorrect line dressing or contamination, and on several occasions heat stress, or fume damage ( line left in boot [trunk] of car with petrol [gas] tanks etc ), fine grit adhering to some line dressings will also damage a line very quickly indeed, which would not happen if there was no dressing on it. I can see no point in buying a nice expensive line and then using some cheap dressing of largely unknown content and efficiency on it.  I dont put olive oil in my car engine either, although this would work, and be cheaper, but with what effects and for how long ? I buy the best engine oil I can get which the manufacturer recommends. While it is probable that the potential damage done by certain products is minimal, why take the chance ?  For the same reason I dont use the plasticizer products, they contain solvents which contain the plasticizers, and these may have a deleterious effect on the line with time. The plasticizer content in most modern products is designed to last the normal useful life of the product, it is unlikely that additives will extend this useful life by much if at all. The plasticizers added at manufacture are an integral component  of the plastic, those added at a later stage will only affect the surface of the line if at all, deep penetration would require a transport medium such as a solvent, and there you have "catch 22" again. I know a guy who uses bacon fat to treat his line and his leaders and his flies when necessary, and he swears the "flavour" helps as well, he may be right, but I think I will stick to my method for the time being. Tight lines ! Mike Connor

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it’s dirty….clean it with a soft soap..treat it with cortland or airflo dressin, and wallah…as new. the airflo 7000ts is a fine and genuine hi-tech fly line for y2k and beyond. if you ain’t fished it… your loss. a blatant advertisement brought to you by the likes of that dastardly self promoter, laurie and jo wooer, dahlwhinnie sipper this fine eve (thanks t.), and general rascal, wataugan walt… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – <snip questions answered by Michael 3. Why does my Airflo 7000 floating line start to sink? Probably a bit dirty. Clean it with a very mild detergent solution, rinse well then treat it with Mucilin. Hi Ken, I would beg to differ, you should on no account treat modern floating lines with Mucilin, this will damage the coating. If a dressing is required Cortland line dressing is about the best. TL MC

– Ezflyfish.com                 Blue Ridge Book Gallery Quality Gear & Service        Used & Out-of-Print Books http://www.ezflyfish.com      http://www.abebooks.com/home/BLUEBOOKS P.O. Box 5112  Banner Elk, NC 28604 (828)963-5001

Response:

1. Any general rules for depth  (when I cant see the fish) 2. Any general hotspots 3. Why does my Airflo 7000 floating line start to sink? 4. How do I guess what colour buzzer etc to use? 5. Does the size of fly depend on lake size? 6. Is it easier to catch with a lure/ streamer than nymph or buzzer? How about Boobies? Thanks in advance

Response:

1. Any general rules for depth  (when I cant see the fish)

Depth will primarily depend on what the fish are feeding on, and the temperature of the water.  On a hot summer day, you often get a layer of very warm water on top, and cool water underneath.  In winter you get the opposite effect.  Fish will therefore be deep.  (How deep will depend on lake and feeding behavior).  While in early spring, optimum temperatures will be in the top layer, as in late fall.  At some times of the year, fish can be anywhere in the water column. 2. Any general hotspots

Generally fish hang out where there is 1) food; 2) optimum temperature; 3) protection from predators.  Typical hotspots include: — in spring fed lakes, in summer, springholes where cool water enters the lake, producing optimum temperatures — inlets, where incoming streams wash in food and/or produce optimum temperatures — drop offs which provide deep water protection with easy access to shallows holding bait fish for food. 3. Why does my Airflo 7000 floating line start to sink?

Beats me. 4. How do I guess what colour buzzer etc to use?

Is a buzzers a streamer/bucktail?  Try to check out baitfish in lake. If you can’t determine, start with something close to the bottom color, e.g. brown, olive. 5. Does the size of fly depend on lake size?

Not necessarily. 6. Is it easier to catch with a lure/ streamer than nymph or buzzer? How about Boobies?

What is a boobie? Buzzer? Michael — www.geocities.com/yosemite/falls/3363 Share what you know. Learn what you don’t.

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Question:

The only question I can answer for you involves your sea-run cutt question.  I fish for sea runs and coastal cutts here in Western Washington, muddlers  and buggers do work fairly well, but then again they work well on all trout. Some sea run and coastal cutt streamer patterns I enjoy are; Knudsens Spider in yellow or orange, The Spruce Fly, The Alexandria, and according to a book I own there is a cutt pattern for Oregon rivers called the Purple Joe(tail; scarlet hackle fibres; butt; hot orange floss; body purple chenile; hackle; badger hen; wing; 4 badger hackles.) All of the streamer patterns should be tied in sizes 4-10. I have found that sea runs like bright colors like steelhead patterns, just in smaller sizes.  My favorite colors for cutts are yellow, orange, and red. Depending on how far you are from the coast also can impact what flies to use. The further upstream you are the likely the fish will have keyed onto nymphs and dries. I have found the most success with elk hair caddis patterns by fishing them upstream as a dry, and then either waking the fly over the hole or sinking and swinging the fly through the hole like a wet.  Believe it or not but I have caught a lot of fish on the swing and by bringing a sunken elk hair back for another cast with quick six inch strips. One last bit of info regarding buggers and muddlers, I have had the best luck with yellow wooly worms with red tails. Any other questions please feel free to e-mail me with them. Good Luck, Keith

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Hey, folks.  I’m going back home to Oregon for a few weeks this month, and after a few days on the Deschutes I was planning on fishing the Fall River for a day and then looking for some sea-run cutt’s over on the coast, probably the Trask.  I’d take my eight-weight and go back to the Deschutes, but my time late in the visit is going to be very constrained. Any info on how the Fall has been fishing?  I’ll be there around the 16th or 17th.   Also, I have had very little experience (and less success) fishing coastal streams for cutt’s.  I’m told buggers and muddlers, in muted tones, are good.  Any other suggestions? TIA, David Brande

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Question:

I have a General Sikorski clematis and from what I’ve found I think it should be pruned to the first bud from the end of the plant in Feb or March but wanted to see if anyone can verify that for me.  Thanks. Ed

  General Sikorski is a type II clematis that blooms mainly on old growth.  As such it never needs serious pruning, but in early spring, just as it starts to leaf out, it would profit from having the dead ends clipped off back to the first (top) good leaf bud.  You might want to spread and tie up the ends at about this time as well.  After the first heavy bloom, the Carroll Garden’s catalog recommends a light pruning to increase secondary flower production later in the season on new growth.  I presume this means clipping off some of the growing ends just after a leaf to divert resources to flowers, but I never get around to doing it on my type II. — Lloyd Fortney http://www.phy.duke.edu/~fortney/ has links to my garden, flower, flyfishing, and travel JPEG images as well as teaching, research, and stuff like that

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I have a General Sikorski clematis and from what I’ve found I think it should be pruned to the first bud from the end of the plant in Feb or March but wanted to see if anyone can verify that for me.  Thanks. Ed The Melo Family Ed, Carolyn, Alyson and Lauren Pickering Valley Service Unit (Girl Scouts) http://www.voicenet.com/~edmelo/pvsu.html

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Question:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –  Rainbows and cutts will interbreed in the wild, but it’s a little more complicated than that.  For example, they won’t interbreed where they evolved together in the same river because they occupy different niches and spawn differently (West slope cutts and redband rainbow exist together in several rivers).  However, if you introduce rainbow into waters where cutthroats are native and rainbow are not, such as the Madison, they will interbreed.  Such is the danger of stocking. I don’t normally like to see stocking in rivers that support wild trout, but if the rainbows (non-native planted in the 30’s) are done for in the Madison, and they want to re-introduce the native west slope cutthroat from pure strain stocks (which they believe they have), it would be nice to have the native fish back in the Madison.  

Hi Dan, Glad to see you back on the group. The Montana fish and game people I’ve talked with also advised that the cutthroat spawn in the tributaries where there is not whirling disease and stay there for a couple of years before returning to the main river. In that time their skeletal structure grows from grissle to bone — their skeleton is supposed to be only effected by the disease when it is in the grissle state. Rainbows on the others hand spawn in the tributaries and return to the main river soon after while their skeletal structure is still grissle. Have a great 1997. — Tight Lines Al Beatty BT’s Fly Fishing Products Bozeman, MT (97 materials catalog) http://www.flyshop.com/Expo/Specialty/BTsPdcts/index.html

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 Rainbows and cutts will interbreed in the wild, but it’s a little more complicated than that.  For example, they won’t interbreed where they evolved together in the same river because they occupy different niches and spawn differently (West slope cutts and redband rainbow exist together in several rivers).  However, if you introduce rainbow into waters where cutthroats are native and rainbow are not, such as the Madison, they will interbreed.  Such is the danger of stocking.

The Montana DFW page ( http://fwp.mt.gov/ ) has some great info on the project.   The impression I get is that even though cutts and bows will cross breed when stocked together, they don’t expect much in the way of cross breeding because there are so few rainbows left in the Madison. I don’t normally like to see stocking in rivers that support wild trout, but if the rainbows (non-native planted in the 30’s) are done for in the Madison, and they want to re-introduce the native west slope cutthroat from pure strain stocks (which they believe they have), it would be nice to have the native fish back in the Madison.  the areas they are talking about re-stocking with Cutts is being checked for the prescence of tubifex worms (carriers of whirling disease) and thought to have low quantities of both tubifex worms and infected rainbows. The question then becomes how much stocking is enough, and how long will it take to develop wild natives from the hatchery natives.   Of course, they could just leave it alone and let the brown trout take over, but then they aren’t as easy to catch as the cutts.                                          Hmmmmm,                                               Dan Dan Gracia                                                               Orvis West Coast Fly Fishing Schools If you kill that big fish you can’t catch ‘em again.  So what if they eat other fish?  If you kill the big ones there will only be little ones left (funny how that works!).

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Al, Thanks for sharing this information with us.  This is indeed very interesting.  Here in Oregon we have a lot of native cutthroat and they are great to fish.  They will attack a fly like it’s the last morsel on earth.  The hatcheries like to stock them (they are hardier) as well as a cross they produce with rainbow they call a cutbow.  I wonder if the cutts and rainbow would cross in the Madison.  I don’t know if they will cross in the wild.  we have streams that contain both.  If they did where would the young grow?

  Rainbows and cutts will interbreed in the wild, but it’s a little more complicated than that.  For example, they won’t interbreed where they evolved together in the same river because they occupy different niches and spawn differently (West slope cutts and redband rainbow exist together in several rivers).  However, if you introduce rainbow into waters where cutthroats are native and rainbow are not, such as the Madison, they will interbreed.  Such is the danger of stocking. Rob Gregoire                                                        | Pocatello, Id              

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  There is a plan afoot to stock the Madison  with Westslope Cutt’s . Visit     http"//fwp.mt.gov/    and take a look. Sounds good so far … any thoughts ? if so, CC to   Dave Hagengruber   Harry

Hi Harry I know there will be those against the plan but after a long conversation with a Montana fish biologist I’m supporting the plan.  What he shared with me was very encouraging based on a whole lot of information I can not put in here but basically this is it in a very boiled down version: Cutthroat trout spawn in small tributaries and REMAIN there for a couple of years (while their bones turn from grissle to real bone). Rainbows spawn in the tributaries and return to the main river while their bones are still grissle rather than bone. Supposedly whirling disease attacks the fish while their skeletal structure is still grissle. This is a short version of a several hour discussion with the folks that seem to know a heck of a lot more than I do. Will it work? I have no ideas but the stuff they shared with me sounded good at least. — Tight Lines Al Beatty BT’s Fly Fishing Products Bozeman, MT (97 materials catalog) http://www.flyshop.com/Expo/Specialty/BTsPdcts/index.html

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  There is a plan afoot to stock the Madison  with Westslope Cutt’s . Visit     http"//fwp.mt.gov/    and take a look. Sounds good so far … any thoughts ? if so, CC to   Dave Hagengruber I’ll take cutt’s in montana over bows, browns and brookies any day of the week.  They belong there, right ? TimW

I agree, they where there years back, just like the Grayling. I do not know if the plan will work but I like the idea of "something" being done to try and combat WD.   Hm  

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  There is a plan afoot to stock the Madison  with Westslope Cutt’s . Visit     http"//fwp.mt.gov/    and take a look. Sounds good so far … any thoughts ? if so, CC to   Dave Hagengruber   Harry

Response:

 There is a plan afoot to stock the Madison  with Westslope Cutt’s . Visit     http"//fwp.mt.gov/    and take a look. Sounds good so far … any thoughts ? if so, CC to   Dave Hagengruber  Harry

   Sorry, fat fingers, the URL is    http://fwp.mt.gov/      Harry  ( Nice page in any event g< )

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  There is a plan afoot to stock the Madison  with Westslope Cutt’s . Visit     http"//fwp.mt.gov/    and take a look. Sounds good so far … any thoughts ? if so, CC to   Dave Hagengruber

I’ll take cutt’s in montana over bows, browns and brookies any day of the week.  They belong there, right ? TimW

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –   There is a plan afoot to stock the Madison  with Westslope Cutt’s . Visit     http"//fwp.mt.gov/    and take a look. Sounds good so far … any thoughts ? if so, CC to   Dave Hagengruber I’ll take cutt’s in montana over bows, browns and brookies any day of the week.  They belong there, right ? TimW I agree, they where there years back, just like the Grayling. I do not know if the plan will work but I like the idea of "something" being done to try and combat WD.  Hm  

Ain’t WHIRLING DISEASE somethin them square dancer get when they dance too long? DJones

Response:

While stocking always sounds like a good idea, fact is that it was stocking hatchery fish that brought whirling disease into existing populations. There is also the matter of genetic intergression if one stocks fish from another watershed into another where a native stock already exists.  If the Madison is completely devoid of cutts, intergression would not be a problem; however if any native fish remain, their genes will be lost when the new stock takes over. — Don Jordan POB 2357 Chiefland, FL 32644 http://ripserv.com/indyjones

Its my understanding that the rainbow below Quake Lake were restocked after the earthquake because of fisk kill resulting from the landslide at Quake Lake.  Can some of you Montanans with long memories shed any light on this? Jim

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While stocking always sounds like a good idea, fact is that it was stocking hatchery fish that brought whirling disease into existing populations. There is also the matter of genetic intergression if one stocks fish from another watershed into another where a native stock already exists.  If the Madison is completely devoid of cutts, intergression would not be a problem; however if any native fish remain, their genes will be lost when the new stock takes over. — Don Jordan POB 2357 Chiefland, FL 32644 http://ripserv.com/indyjones

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While stocking always sounds like a good idea, fact is that it was stocking hatchery fish that brought whirling disease into existing populations.

No, Don.    What brought whirling disease into existing populations was stocking SICK hatchery fish.  Stocking per se is not the problem. that is not to say, however, tht it is the solution either.  I think that it is not. But, although I am generally opposed to stocking hatchery fish in rivers where there are wild populations, I have become convinced this idea withthe cutts may be worth a try.  I had most of my reservations addressed by the excellent coverage of the project on the Montana FW&P web page.  You really ought to check it out.  I can’t give you the exact address, but you should be able to get to it.  Let me know if you cannot, and I will get it for you. There is also the matter of genetic intergression if one stocks fish from another watershed into another where a native stock already exists.  If the Madison is completely devoid of cutts, intergression would not be a problem; however if any native fish remain, their genes will be lost when the new stock takes over.

I am not a biologist, but I do not believe this will be a problem. Take a look at the discussion I just cited.  As I stated, I generally am not a supporter of stocking in wild trout waters, an even stronger opponent is Dick Vincent whose 1970’s study led to the cessation of stocking in Montana rivers.  He is in favor of the proposed project with the cutts.  That says a lot to me. Lyman Lyman G. Hughes Dallas, TX Ennis, MT

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snip   I had most of my reservations addressed by the excellent coverage of the project on the Montana FW&P web page.  You really ought to check it out.  I can’t give you the exact address, but you should be able to get to it.   Lyman G. Hughes snip

Montana’s web page addres is:  http://www.fwp.mt.gov/ – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Dallas, TX Ennis, MT

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  There is a plan afoot to stock the Madison  with Westslope Cutt’s . I’ll take cutt’s in montana over bows, browns and brookies any day of the week.  They belong there, right ? TimW

I think you are right.  The cutthroat are always native it seems in our most inaccessible waters in the west.  So they surely belong.  A damn great fighter too. -Burton

Response:

  There is a plan afoot to stock the Madison  with Westslope Cutt’s . Cutthroat trout spawn in small tributaries and REMAIN there for a couple of years (while their bones turn from grissle to real bone). Rainbows spawn in the tributaries and return to the main river while their bones are still grissle rather than bone. Supposedly whirling disease attacks the fish while their skeletal structure is still grissle. This is a short

Al, Thanks for sharing this information with us.  This is indeed very interesting.  Here in Oregon we have a lot of native cutthroat and they are great to fish.  They will attack a fly like it’s the last morsel on earth.  The hatcheries like to stock them (they are hardier) as well as a cross they produce with rainbow they call a cutbow.  I wonder if the cutts and rainbow would cross in the Madison.  I don’t know if they will cross in the wild.  we have streams that contain both.  If they did where would the young grow? -Burton

Response:

Its my understanding that the rainbow below Quake Lake were restocked after the earthquake because of fisk kill resulting from the landslide at Quake Lake.  Can some of you Montanans with long memories shed any light on this? Jim

Good question.  I don’t know the answer specifically, but stocking was fairly common in the Madison until Dick Vincent’s study showed that stocking actually was detrimental to the wild trout fishery.  I believe that study was in the early 70’s.   The quake was in ‘59, so what you suggest is possible. Lyman Lyman G. Hughes Dallas, TX Ennis, MT

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –   There is a plan afoot to stock the Madison  with Westslope Cutt’s . I’ll take cutt’s in montana over bows, browns and brookies any day of the week.  They belong there, right ? TimW I think you are right.  The cutthroat are always native it seems in our most inaccessible waters in the west.  So they surely belong.  A damn great fighter too. -Burton

Burton    "point your browser to"         http://fwp.mt.gov/      Nice page, good info   HM

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – cross they produce with rainbow they call a cutbow.  I wonder if the cutts and rainbow would cross in the Madison.  I don’t know if they cross in the wild.  we have streams that contain both.  If they Rainbows and cutts will interbreed in the wild, but it’s a little more complicated than that.  For example, they won’t interbreed where they evolved together in the same river because they occupy different niches and spawn differently (West slope cutts and redband rainbow exist together in several rivers).  However, if you introduce rainbow into waters where cutthroats are native and rainbow are not, such as the Madison, they will interbreed.  Such is the danger of stocking. Rob Gregoire

Ah so, that’s what I suspected.  Thanks for the response Rob.  I know the McKenzie River had redsides and cutthroat both, but the cutts are only found in the lower reaches of the river.  There are rainbows in the lower part of the river, but I have never caught a cutt in the upper rainbow rich region. Merry Christmas to all and Happy New Year, -Burton

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Question:

Can anyone who fishes the Westfield River in Massachusetts give me some information on where to fish the river and access points? Thanks in advance—-Bob

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Can anyone who fishes the Westfield River in Massachusetts give me some information on where to fish the river and access points?

Some of the better flyfishing can be had below Chesterfield Gorge on the East Branch. The waters from the Gorge downstream to the Knightville Dam (~7 miles?) is all C&R/Artificials only. Take Rt. 112 north from Rt 20 in Huntington to Rt 143 west, then keep an eye out for the Gorge parking lot/access road. You can drive ~ a mile down a dirt road below the gorge to a gate, or leave your car in the lot at the top of the dirt road (last time I was there it cost $1 for the whole day). Lots of deep pools broken up by long runs. Fish this early in the season as it’ll warm up by mid-June… Cheers! /dave <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< < Digital Equipment Corp.       Alpha Server Engineering < <     "What doesn’t kill you…will hurt like heck!"     < <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

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Question:

I read in Sunday’s Muskegon Chroncle, and have heard through FlyFishing Magazine, that the Muskegon is a potential wealth of fishing.  Can anybody elaborate on that? And give me direction to where the best place is to access the river.  I live in Muskegon, but access to the river is by boat only.  I read that Newago is the place.  Please stay tuned in July for my Michigan FlyFishing WWW Page. http://www.novagate.com/novasurfers/bscheere/bc.html (you can access my trial page now). Thanks, Ben

You can contact Blair Shaw, owner of the Tarry Motel in Baldwin, MI, for info on the Muskegon.  Blair is a good guide.  I was steelhead FFishing with him on the Muskegon this past spring with his new jetboat.  It was my son’s first time out and he landed his first steely that cold rainy day. You can reach Blair at 616-745-3137.  Tell him Matt gave you his number.

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says… I read in Sunday’s Muskegon Chroncle, and have heard through FlyFishing Magazine, that the Muskegon is a potential wealth of fishing.  Can anybody elaborate on that? And give me direction to where the best place is to access the river.  I live in Muskegon, but access to the river is by boat only.  I read that Newago is the place.  Please stay tuned in July for my Michigan FlyFishing WWW Page. http://www.novagate.com/novasurfers/bscheere/bc.html (you can access my trial page now). Thanks, Ben

Please note my correct Email: Thanks, BEN

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I read in Sunday’s Muskegon Chroncle, and have heard through FlyFishing Magazine, that the Muskegon is a potential wealth of fishing.  Can anybody elaborate on that? And give me direction to where the best place is to access the river.  I live in Muskegon, but access to the river is by boat only.  I read that Newago is the place.  Please stay tuned in July for my Michigan FlyFishing WWW Page. http://www.novagate.com/novasurfers/bscheere/bc.html (you can access my trial page now). Thanks, Ben

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5/29: River high, but not unworkably high.  Not bad shape except for the current.  Went plunking in one of my favorite holes ( north of the Santiam R. confluence) for chinook.  20+ lb fish on by 11:30a, and lost in a keystone cops netting scenario (you can’t net your own fish, so ya gotta use the guy who’s available).  Good news is that my fish was the first one hooked in that hole in 4 days.  10 oz anchor weight, 2 rigs: #2 watermelon wing-bobber (sparkly wings) on bottom, #2 red tiger wing bobber on top (shorter leader, sparkly wings).  Natural sand shrimp on both.  Fish took the watermelon.  Had another hit later, but gear was fouled and he just ate the shrimp.  Watermelon again.  People using single rigs had no luck.  One person later landed a 10 lb’r: bright hen Chinook. 5/30 – 6/3: Raining, even higher water.  Inland rivers including the Willamette running high and out of shape.  Coastal rivers dropping. 6/4: No rain.  Inland rivers still very high.  Coastal rivers now too low.  Heard that fishing has been reasonably good in holes known for producing in high water…I only know of one. We’ll be fishing again this weekend.  Plunking for Chinook is what we plan.  Normally I drift, but last weekend was a father-in-law trip and this weekend is a (novice) brother trip… Later, Brian D. — Computer/Vision Engineer, Hewlett Packard (Corvallis, Oregon)

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – 5/29: River high, but not unworkably high.  Not bad shape except *Stuff deleted* days.  10 oz anchor weight, 2 rigs: #2 watermelon wing-bobber (sparkly wings) on bottom, #2 red tiger wing bobber on top (shorter leader, sparkly wings).  Natural sand shrimp on both.  Fish took the watermelon.  Had another hit later, but gear was fouled and he just ate the shrimp.  Watermelon again.  People using single rigs had no luck.  One person later landed a 10 lb’r: bright hen Chinook. 5/30 – 6/3: Raining, even higher water.  Inland rivers including the Willamette running high and out of shape.  Coastal rivers dropping. 6/4: No rain.  Inland rivers still very high.  Coastal rivers now too low.  Heard that fishing has been reasonably good in holes known for producing in high water…I only know of one. We’ll be fishing again this weekend.  Plunking for Chinook is what we plan.  Normally I drift, but last weekend was a father-in-law trip and this weekend is a (novice) brother trip… Later, Brian D. — Computer/Vision Engineer, Hewlett Packard (Corvallis, Oregon)

Brian, Why the heck are you still posting from your College account?  I thought things were going well enough at Corvallis that HP could afford a logon for almost everyone, even new hires. What is with this bait fishing.  Put that crap away and get your fly rod back out.  Find some good fly fishing spots so you can take me fishing if you ever get out there. BTW: Dave took VSI and is now working at and guiding for the Angler’s Covey. Regards, Bryan Remember:  Fishing is NOT a matter of life and death.               It is much more important than that! Bryan Call (719)590-5772  |All opinions expressed here are mine & mine alone. Hewlett-Packard Co.       |  But then, I’ve never let that stop me before.     P.O. BOX 2197             |    Many men go fishing all their lives without Colorado Springs, Co 80901|    knowing that it is not fish they are after.

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