Question:

Recent tirades accusing folks of severe mushiness in their reminiscing about the dearly departed have led me to assess my feelings toward Mr. Connor now, lest I be so accused of a similar affront to the group’s common sensibilities at a later date. Thus the following: I enjoy Mikes poetry, even though it is often rather acerbic. It is still quite witty, and even sounds like I think poetry ought to sound, that is it rhymes and has a certain meter to it. I appreciate Mike’s technical knowledge of the pastime we all enjoy so much. I have no idea where Mike learned all the stuff he professes (his technical discussions of flylines come to mind), but in general, it seems that he knows what he is talking about, and adds my general knowledge of flyfishing. I think I would enjoy fishing with him some day, although I doubt that would ever happen as it is unlikely I will travel to his neck of the woods at a time when a flyrod should accompany me (plus, there are just so many great places to fish on this side of the great pond). I think I would learn things from him, and I believe I would enjoy his wit and humor. Hopefully, he would enjoy fishing with me as well, although I doubt that there is much he would learn from me, other than how to execute a rather amateurish "Full Reid" from a drift boat. I do not enjoy Mike’s eloquent tirades accusing an increasingly large part of the flyfishing community of being assholes, etc. Frankly, I don’t enjoy the rejoinders from those accused much either. That sort of name calling and language really doesn’t impress me much. I have always thought the English language rich enough that concentration on just a few four letter adjectives misses a wealth of opportunity. I am reminded of that great scene in Roxanne where Steve Martin replies to his tormentor’s "Hey big nose" greeting with a rapid fire list of 20 eloquent alternatives. So there, I’ve said it. No one can accuse me of sentimental mushery after the fact. Jim Ray

Response:

<SNIP So there, I’ve said it. No one can accuse me of sentimental mushery after the fact. Jim Ray

Careful Jim, somebody might accuse you of sentimental mushery before the fact. Just as well for you that I did not die in the meantime!   I fear you would have been in deep doo-doo!!! )) TL MC

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Just as well for you that I did not die in the meantime!   I fear you would have been in deep doo-doo!!! ))

Not really.. it seems the only person opposing such mushing would have been gone at that point…

Response:

Question:

A little update on some info.  I spoke to Jeffrey Cardenas (The Saltwater Angler, www.saltwaterangler.com) and they aren’t doing anything in Abacos currently, but this was suggested (with no comment, good or bad): www.abacoflyfish.com TC, R

LOL! My wife Googled that link up last week. One of the more glossy guide sites I’ve seen, but the prices are in line with the area from other stuff we’ve read… We’re planning on 10 days down there; I figure I’ll use a guide for a day or two and then see how I do on my own. From my admittedly limited experience, if you can see bonefish* the guide is just a boat driver. And the boat rental prices down there are very reasonable… * non-trivial, kinda like those dithered-to-death "stereo images", you either get it, or you utterly don’t. I was lucky and had no problem seeing the bones in Anegada, hopefully the water is as clear and the sand flats as clean in the Abacos… /daytripper (Now if I could just spring free to fish *this* month!)

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Fabulous place Fell and broke my thumb the day before I had 2 days booked with a guide called sawyer ( I Think) – fortunately he had 2 novices waiting to go and who took my cancellation – both had bones 5lb + Enjoy – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -The SO has proposed Green Turtle Cay in the Abacos for our annual island trip next April. She’s been seeing lots of positive bonefishing references so she figures it’s a lock for me to go along with her schemes We’d stay at the Green Turtle Club resort/marina, fwiw. http://www.greenturtleclub.com/ And I’m looking for anyone with any direct experience with the eastern Abaco islands, the Green Turtle Club, and more importantly, the fishing! Anyone out there ever been to this place? Anyone out there do any bonefishing in the Abacos Islands? Thanks for any feedback. /daytripper (got dem bonefishin’ jones

– Charles Reaves

Response:

From my admittedly limited experience, if you can see bonefish* the guide is just a boat driver. And the boat rental prices down there are very reasonable…

They are, but you need to know the area, tides, etc., to avoid a lot of fruitless searching, and avoid tide and wind situations.  Make sure to get charts and pay particular attention to wind and tide directions and tide times. * non-trivial, kinda like those dithered-to-death "stereo images", you either get it, or you utterly don’t. I was lucky and had no problem seeing the bones in Anegada, hopefully the water is as clear and the sand flats as clean in the Abacos…

It is at least as clear as the VI.  I once dropped a lighter off a dock in the Abacos, and it could be seen on the bottom (about 20 plus feet of water – I didn’t realize quite how deep until I got down there <G). I’ve got UW pics of palometa and bones are as clear as anything taken in a perfectly-maintained swimming pool. /daytripper (Now if I could just spring free to fish *this* month!)

Er, you might wanna wait to NEXT month or the spring…<G TC, R

Response:

From my admittedly limited experience, if you can see bonefish* the guide is just a boat driver. And the boat rental prices down there are very reasonable… They are, but you need to know the area, tides, etc., to avoid a lot of fruitless searching, and avoid tide and wind situations.  Make sure to get charts and pay particular attention to wind and tide directions and tide times.

That’s what the first couple of days out with the guide are for… I’ll order up charts, especially given the boat rental, I’ll have a gps and a tide table, and hopefully things will be clear enough after a couple of days out. Granted my shallow experience (<= feeble pun) but fishing for bones isn’t very high on the rocket science scale – there are a couple of key details about bones that quickly narrow down the places one should bother working, and after a few more web hits I’m starting to get the feel for how small and *close* together the Abacos are, so I’m reasonably confident that if there are fish to be had I’ll stumble onto ‘em before too long * non-trivial, kinda like those dithered-to-death "stereo images", you either get it, or you utterly don’t. I was lucky and had no problem seeing the bones in Anegada, hopefully the water is as clear and the sand flats as clean in the Abacos… It is at least as clear as the VI.  I once dropped a lighter off a dock in the Abacos, and it could be seen on the bottom (about 20 plus feet of water – I didn’t realize quite how deep until I got down there <G). I’ve got UW pics of palometa and bones are as clear as anything taken in a perfectly-maintained swimming pool.

Excellent! I might have to spring for an underwater digicam! More toys! /daytripper (Now if I could just spring free to fish *this* month!) Er, you might wanna wait to NEXT month or the spring…<G

end around here. /daytripper (A shrink could buy his next house on my tab…)

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – From my admittedly limited experience, if you can see bonefish* the guide is just a boat driver. And the boat rental prices down there are very reasonable… They are, but you need to know the area, tides, etc., to avoid a lot of fruitless searching, and avoid tide and wind situations.  Make sure to get charts and pay particular attention to wind and tide directions and tide times. That’s what the first couple of days out with the guide are for… I’ll order up charts, especially given the boat rental, I’ll have a gps and a tide table, and hopefully things will be clear enough after a couple of days out.

Weeel, it’s not _quite_ that simple.  You’ve got the potential for 4 foot changes, and it isn’t just knowing where, it’s knowing when and where, and where the fish are moving.  The "no-boat" flats, of course, are easy (and there are a coupla-several miles of these at GTC), but with a bare boat, it can get tricky insofar as being where you want/need to be when.   You might consider renting a boat for one day, you and the wife going for a ride, and getting familiar with things.  Then get a guide for a couple of days, and rent again for a couple of days (or more – check on a weekly rate – if so, you can avoid ferry schedules altogether, weather depending).  Plus, while only natives can officially guide you, anyone can go fishing with you, and if you have boat access the entire trip, meeting a few folks from cruising boats might be productive.  And you might want to take a lighter setup for palometa, etc. (little permits, sorta like saltwater panfish) during bonefish lulls, and take some steel wire, etc. for barracuda (highly recommended for sport and dinner). – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Granted my shallow experience (<= feeble pun) but fishing for bones isn’t very high on the rocket science scale – there are a couple of key details about bones that quickly narrow down the places one should bother working, and after a few more web hits I’m starting to get the feel for how small and *close* together the Abacos are, so I’m reasonably confident that if there are fish to be had I’ll stumble onto ‘em before too long * non-trivial, kinda like those dithered-to-death "stereo images", you either get it, or you utterly don’t. I was lucky and had no problem seeing the bones in Anegada, hopefully the water is as clear and the sand flats as clean in the Abacos… It is at least as clear as the VI.  I once dropped a lighter off a dock in the Abacos, and it could be seen on the bottom (about 20 plus feet of water – I didn’t realize quite how deep until I got down there <G). I’ve got UW pics of palometa and bones are as clear as anything taken in a perfectly-maintained swimming pool. Excellent! I might have to spring for an underwater digicam! More toys!

Fuji makes a disposable UW that actually works pretty good if you just want "quick and easy" – get them in the States.  Also, get a couple of decent but inexpensive masks and snorkels (also in the States) unless you are absolutely a "dry head."  And if you dive, DON’T take anything but Hawaiian slings (with extra tubing) – anything else is a no-no. TC, R

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – That’s what the first couple of days out with the guide are for… I’ll order up charts, especially given the boat rental, I’ll have a gps and a tide table, and hopefully things will be clear enough after a couple of days out. Weeel, it’s not _quite_ that simple.  You’ve got the potential for 4 foot changes, and it isn’t just knowing where, it’s knowing when and where, and where the fish are moving.  The "no-boat" flats, of course, are easy (and there are a coupla-several miles of these at GTC), but with a bare boat, it can get tricky insofar as being where you want/need to be when.  

We’ll be getting the boat for the middle 7 days out of the 10 we’ll be there, looks like a 20-something foot Wellcraft CC with a 150 and t-top. Nice hefty boat – if it ends up high and dry at low tide it won’t be moved, that’s for sure. But we want to be able to roam freely for the duration, we usually take our own boat wherever we go on summer vacations, and it is usually at the center of the best times we have. I’ve been looking at satellite images of the area to the west of the reef through the island chain over to the big island and then on to the Marls, and it looks like flat water everywhere west of the reef would be the rule unless the weather is coming due north/south. You might consider renting a boat for one day, you and the wife going for a ride, and getting familiar with things.  Then get a guide for a couple of days, and rent again for a couple of days (or more – check on a weekly rate – if so, you can avoid ferry schedules altogether, weather depending).  Plus, while only natives can officially guide you, anyone can go fishing with you, and if you have boat access the entire trip, meeting a few folks from cruising boats might be productive.  And you might want to take a lighter setup for palometa, etc. (little permits, sorta like saltwater panfish) during bonefish lulls, and take some steel wire, etc. for barracuda (highly recommended for sport and dinner).

Are there any actual permits/licences one must obtain for fishing – either on foot or in a boat? That’s usually something I forget until the last day – so I’m getting a bit of a jump on things this time… /daytripper (might actually go fishing this weekend! Whoa!

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – That’s what the first couple of days out with the guide are for… I’ll order up charts, especially given the boat rental, I’ll have a gps and a tide table, and hopefully things will be clear enough after a couple of days out. Weeel, it’s not _quite_ that simple.  You’ve got the potential for 4 foot changes, and it isn’t just knowing where, it’s knowing when and where, and where the fish are moving.  The "no-boat" flats, of course, are easy (and there are a coupla-several miles of these at GTC), but with a bare boat, it can get tricky insofar as being where you want/need to be when.   We’ll be getting the boat for the middle 7 days out of the 10 we’ll be there, looks like a 20-something foot Wellcraft CC with a 150 and t-top. Nice hefty boat – if it ends up high and dry at low tide it won’t be moved, that’s for sure. But we want to be able to roam freely for the duration, we usually take our own boat wherever we go on summer vacations, and it is usually at the center of the best times we have.

Heck, with that, you don’t need to worry about no steekin’ ferries…plus, that’ll allow quite a variety of fishing – you might wish to take non-FFing tackle, as well. Are there any actual permits/licences one must obtain for fishing – either on foot or in a boat? That’s usually something I forget until the last day – so I’m getting a bit of a jump on things this time…

You get them at Customs, so you don’t have much of choice, unless you wanna fly over early to get one…<G.  Ask for a "sportfishing permit" – it’s around 20-25USD.  I don’t know the status of the boat you’re renting, and with a guide, or on a Bahamian charter, you don’t need one, but if I were in your shoes, I’d just get the thing and be done with it. Bahamian Customs and other LE bodies can be a weird thing for the first-time tourist, so don’t act amused or surprised at any, er, "simple ways."  Make sure you have a couple of hundred USD in tens and twenties for the various fees, "taxes," etc. (in and out for you both, and I don’t mean bribes – it just speeds things up to have smaller bills at the ready).  Up until recently, "Customs" at the MH airport was a card table with a very friendly guy who always told you that you had nothing to declare, in and out, and to enjoy your stay…<G.  The outers particularly, and the Bahamas in general, are pretty laid back when it comes to sensible tourists who obviously plan on spending money.  My father is there quite often, and the only "trouble" in all the years of our family going was that he was pickpocketed once in Nassau, realized it as it happened, tried to grab the guy, who ran.  He then had to catch up to some folks who also gave chase and caught the guy so they didn’t beat him senseless before the cops came.  They made the guy give back the wallet and apologize in between blows. TC, R – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -/daytripper (might actually go fishing this weekend! Whoa!

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I’ve done both, and am fairly familiar with out islands of the Bahamas. As to the Green Turtle Club itself, the food is good, the dockage reasonable, an we’ve had a good time when we’ve been.

We must have been there at different times. My trip 5 years ago provided horrible overcooked food at typical high prices for the area. Other dining options are limited except for a 3 mile golf cart ride to New Plymouth. On a good day the smoke from the dump goes out to sea while Brendle, the dive boat captain, will hit on anything with a skirt. My favorite place in the area is Hopetown and Elbow Cay with a little more to do and the variety to keep the trip interesting. Some cottage rentals offer an ocean view and a harbor view. I’ve never bonefished the area, but from what I’ve heard a good guide will be a big plus. A good plan is to rent a Boston Whaler and with Elbow Cay smack in the middle you can easily cover a good portion of the Abaco Sea. Marsh Harbor is just west with great diving down at Sandy Cay and an artist colony all the way south (Little Harbor?). Whatever you choose, enjoy the trip and post pics. Drew

Response:

I’ve done both, and am fairly familiar with out islands of the Bahamas. As to the Green Turtle Club itself, the food is good, the dockage reasonable, an we’ve had a good time when we’ve been. We must have been there at different times. My trip 5 years ago provided horrible overcooked food at typical high prices for the area. Other dining options are limited except for a 3 mile golf cart ride to New Plymouth. On a good day the smoke from the dump goes out to sea while Brendle, the dive boat captain, will hit on anything with a skirt.

Are you sure you aren’t thinking of the other "resort" there, the Bluff House?  Of course, as always, YMMV. My favorite place in the area is Hopetown and Elbow Cay with a little more to do and the variety to keep the trip interesting. Some cottage rentals offer an ocean view and a harbor view. I’ve never bonefished the area, but from what I’ve heard a good guide will be a big plus. A good plan is to rent a Boston Whaler and with Elbow Cay smack in the middle you can easily cover a good portion of the Abaco Sea. Marsh Harbor is just west with great diving down at Sandy Cay and an artist colony all the way south (Little Harbor?).

I would agree that basing at Marsh Harbour is _probably_ a better plan for most who are staying on land. TC, R – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Whatever you choose, enjoy the trip and post pics. Drew

Response:

We usually do these trips in April, usually the first week after the "high season".

…and…in your case, that would be when? <g jeff

Response:

We must have been there at different times. My trip 5 years ago provided horrible overcooked food at typical high prices for the area. Other dining options are limited except for a 3 mile golf cart ride to New Plymouth. On a good day the smoke from the dump goes out to sea while Brendle, the dive boat captain, will hit on anything with a skirt. Are you sure you aren’t thinking of the other "resort" there, the Bluff House?  Of course, as always, YMMV.

Nope. I’m speaking of the one right down on the water. Did eat at the Bluff House once, but it was their weekly BBQ. Not bad, but still the options are limited on that end of the cay IMO. Maybe we hit them on a bad week. My favorite place in the area is Hopetown and Elbow Cay with a little more to do and the variety to keep the trip interesting. Some cottage rentals offer an ocean view and a harbor view. I’ve never bonefished the area, but from what I’ve heard a good guide will be a big plus. A good plan is to rent a Boston Whaler and with Elbow Cay smack in the middle you can easily cover a good portion of the Abaco Sea. Marsh Harbor is just west with great diving down at Sandy Cay and an artist colony all the way south (Little Harbor?). I would agree that basing at Marsh Harbour is _probably_ a better plan for most who are staying on land.

But Marsh Harbor doesn’t give you the ocean and diving right off the beach. Hmm. ‘Bout time for another trip…. I’m out of 222s (a good pain reliever). Drew

Response:

A little update on some info.  I spoke to Jeffrey Cardenas (The Saltwater Angler, www.saltwaterangler.com) and they aren’t doing anything in Abacos currently, but this was suggested (with no comment, good or bad): www.abacoflyfish.com TC, R

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I would agree that basing at Marsh Harbour is _probably_ a better plan for most who are staying on land. But Marsh Harbor doesn’t give you the ocean and diving right off the beach. Hmm. ‘Bout time for another trip…. I’m out of 222s (a good pain reliever).

Well, maybe not like the cays, but Marsh Harbour, is, well, a harbor, so there’s plenty of water.  But as you point out, (land)basing from one of the cays limits you in other ways, sometimes not well-taken by those who wish varied activity over a 10-day trip.  From MN, you can easily get to just about anywhere in the Abacos via ferry for a, pardon the pun, day trip, and while Dave fishes, his wife can shop, tour, etc.  - IIRC, she isn’t a fisher?  IOW, from MH, you can just go wherever whatever the first ferry that happens to be handy is going and likely find something, but at the cays, you might have to plan, call/radio, and/or wait, and you can just about do/see all there is to do/see in GTC in about a day and a half if you wish to "go and do." Now, all that said, I would not recommend basing from Treasure Cay (or even bothering to go for more than a half-day) as, IMO, it’s like a mini-Freeport and likely to eventually screw up the immediate surrounding area of Abacos.  Hopefully, it’ll take it in the shorts again, and this time, they’ll tear the whole flockin’ place down and be done with it. As to the codeine pills, I don’t like ‘em or trust ‘em, but ‘tripper oughta love ‘em…<G.  I think you can get a lower-strength Tylenol 3 (Tylenol 2?) in the States with a prescription.  My father swears by them, but all they do for me is make me sleepy. TC, R – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Drew

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Well, maybe not like the cays, but Marsh Harbour, is, well, a harbor, so

To me, Hope Town is prettier with almost the same frequency of ferry service. Now, all that said, I would not recommend basing from Treasure Cay (or

Not even worth the time to even go there. As to the codeine pills, I don’t like ‘em or trust ‘em, but ‘tripper oughta love ‘em…<G.  I think you can get a lower-strength Tylenol 3

Codeine works different on different people. For those who may benefit it is legal to bring in 100 tablets per person. Drew

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Well, maybe not like the cays, but Marsh Harbour, is, well, a harbor, so To me, Hope Town is prettier with almost the same frequency of ferry service. Now, all that said, I would not recommend basing from Treasure Cay (or Not even worth the time to even go there. As to the codeine pills, I don’t like ‘em or trust ‘em, but ‘tripper oughta love ‘em…<G.  I think you can get a lower-strength Tylenol 3 Codeine works different on different people. For those who may benefit it is legal to bring in 100 tablets per person. Drew

I’m surrounded by lightweights!  ;-) From the years of suffering with that damaged disc that was cleaned up this spring I squirreled away enough stuff to whack a herd of rhinos for a week with a multi-colored hail of doses. MMMmmm…doses….! And none of it has that godawful liver-killing should-never-have-passed-muster-with-the-FDA Tylenol. /daytripper (Go big or go home: Oxycodone and Oxycontin rule!  ;-)

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We usually do these trips in April, usually the first week after the "high season". …and…in your case, that would be when? <g jeff

Well…um….that would be…er…well….hmmm…. /daytripper ("Quickly! To the laboratory!")

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The SO has proposed Green Turtle Cay in the Abacos for our annual island trip next April. She’s been seeing lots of positive bonefishing references so she figures it’s a lock for me to go along with her schemes We’d stay at the Green Turtle Club resort/marina, fwiw. http://www.greenturtleclub.com/ And I’m looking for anyone with any direct experience with the eastern Abaco islands, the Green Turtle Club, and more importantly, the fishing! Anyone out there ever been to this place? Anyone out there do any bonefishing in the Abacos Islands? Thanks for any feedback. /daytripper (got dem bonefishin’ jones

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Anyone out there ever been to this place? Anyone out there do any bonefishing in the Abacos Islands? Thanks for any feedback. /daytripper (got dem bonefishin’ jones

    a former law partner of mine has often visited his father’s "cottage" on green turtle cay.  i will try to check with him and report back. yfitons wayno

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Anyone out there ever been to this place? Anyone out there do any bonefishing in the Abacos Islands? Thanks for any feedback. /daytripper (got dem bonefishin’ jones    a former law partner of mine has often visited his father’s "cottage" on green turtle cay.  i will try to check with him and report back. yfitons wayno

Thanks mfitons!

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well now… this sounds like an opportunity for several of us with SOs(note the lack of apostrophe) to get some SO approval… so, when will you and your wife be sponsoring this vacation a/k/a excuse for bonefishing? jeff (who knows somebody who knows somebody thats got an abacos spot) – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – The SO has proposed Green Turtle Cay in the Abacos for our annual island trip next April. She’s been seeing lots of positive bonefishing references so she figures it’s a lock for me to go along with her schemes We’d stay at the Green Turtle Club resort/marina, fwiw. http://www.greenturtleclub.com/ And I’m looking for anyone with any direct experience with the eastern Abaco islands, the Green Turtle Club, and more importantly, the fishing! Anyone out there ever been to this place? Anyone out there do any bonefishing in the Abacos Islands? Thanks for any feedback. /daytripper (got dem bonefishin’ jones

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The SO has proposed Green Turtle Cay in the Abacos for our annual island trip next April. She’s been seeing lots of positive bonefishing references so she figures it’s a lock for me to go along with her schemes We’d stay at the Green Turtle Club resort/marina, fwiw. http://www.greenturtleclub.com/ And I’m looking for anyone with any direct experience with the eastern Abaco islands, the Green Turtle Club, and more importantly, the fishing! Anyone out there ever been to this place? Anyone out there do any bonefishing in the Abacos Islands? Thanks for any feedback.

I’ve done both, and am fairly familiar with out islands of the Bahamas. As to the Green Turtle Club itself, the food is good, the dockage reasonable, an we’ve had a good time when we’ve been.  I glanced at the site, and I’d say it’s pretty representative – in fact, I think I have some pictures taken in the dining room and patio area, and they look a lot like those on the site.   Really, it depends on what you want.  If you want moderate isolation, Green Turtle is fairly so, but not ridiculously so.  If you want a little more to do, and don’t want a boat, you could stay at Marsh Harbour and ferry to the Cays (Green Turtle has a ferry service from MH to GTC, and there are plenty of ferry services around the Abacos). Also, GTC has several other accommodation options, such as cottages and houses, that I see in a newspaper from earlier in the year. The outers are a little different from the "tourist" island areas like Freeport and Nassau, and, IMO, are like no other area in the world.  You have yachts (and I mean YACHTS) that cruise the area, but it is all pretty casual and laid-back.  If you want more info on the area, drop me an email.   IMO, the best deal going in places like the Abacos, USVI/BVI, etc. is to rent a boat (pref. sail, but a trawler if you must) and cruise the islands.  The general area is easy sailing (although you must pay attention to tide times) with lots of areas to visit, dive, fish, party, or whatever.  Room rates run 200.00-plus USD a day, plus taxes, additional charges, meal plans, etc., and for about the same money, you can get a boat – of course, YMMV.  If you are interested, Moorings has a location in MH, or check any of the boating/sailing mags like Motorboating & Sailing, Yachting, Sailing, etc. TC, R PS – FWIW, the members of certain yacht clubs get discounts at many of the clubs in the Bahamas, or at least reciprocation, and that may be worth looking into, if applicable for you. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -/daytripper (got dem bonefishin’ jones

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – The SO has proposed Green Turtle Cay in the Abacos for our annual island trip next April. She’s been seeing lots of positive bonefishing references so she figures it’s a lock for me to go along with her schemes We’d stay at the Green Turtle Club resort/marina, fwiw. http://www.greenturtleclub.com/ And I’m looking for anyone with any direct experience with the eastern Abaco islands, the Green Turtle Club, and more importantly, the fishing! Anyone out there ever been to this place? Anyone out there do any bonefishing in the Abacos Islands? Thanks for any feedback. /daytripper (got dem bonefishin’ jones well now… this sounds like an opportunity for several of us with SOs(note the lack of apostrophe) to get some SO approval… so, when will you and your wife be sponsoring this vacation a/k/a excuse for bonefishing? jeff (who knows somebody who knows somebody thats got an abacos spot)

We usually do these trips in April, usually the first week after the "high season". We’re still shopping around the Abacos but I think Herself has seen enough to make her "half" of the decision… /daytripper (that would be the big half, of course

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – The SO has proposed Green Turtle Cay in the Abacos for our annual island trip next April. She’s been seeing lots of positive bonefishing references so she figures it’s a lock for me to go along with her schemes We’d stay at the Green Turtle Club resort/marina, fwiw. http://www.greenturtleclub.com/ And I’m looking for anyone with any direct experience with the eastern Abaco islands, the Green Turtle Club, and more importantly, the fishing! Anyone out there ever been to this place? Anyone out there do any bonefishing in the Abacos Islands? Thanks for any feedback. I’ve done both, and am fairly familiar with out islands of the Bahamas. As to the Green Turtle Club itself, the food is good, the dockage reasonable, an we’ve had a good time when we’ve been.  I glanced at the site, and I’d say it’s pretty representative – in fact, I think I have some pictures taken in the dining room and patio area, and they look a lot like those on the site.   Really, it depends on what you want.  If you want moderate isolation, Green Turtle is fairly so, but not ridiculously so.  If you want a little more to do, and don’t want a boat, you could stay at Marsh Harbour and ferry to the Cays (Green Turtle has a ferry service from MH to GTC, and there are plenty of ferry services around the Abacos). Also, GTC has several other accommodation options, such as cottages and houses, that I see in a newspaper from earlier in the year. The outers are a little different from the "tourist" island areas like Freeport and Nassau, and, IMO, are like no other area in the world.  You have yachts (and I mean YACHTS) that cruise the area, but it is all pretty casual and laid-back.  If you want more info on the area, drop me an email.   IMO, the best deal going in places like the Abacos, USVI/BVI, etc. is to rent a boat (pref. sail, but a trawler if you must) and cruise the islands.  The general area is easy sailing (although you must pay attention to tide times) with lots of areas to visit, dive, fish, party, or whatever.  Room rates run 200.00-plus USD a day, plus taxes, additional charges, meal plans, etc., and for about the same money, you can get a boat – of course, YMMV.  If you are interested, Moorings has a location in MH, or check any of the boating/sailing mags like Motorboating & Sailing, Yachting, Sailing, etc. TC, R PS – FWIW, the members of certain yacht clubs get discounts at many of the clubs in the Bahamas, or at least reciprocation, and that may be worth looking into, if applicable for you. /daytripper (got dem bonefishin’ jones

"I wouldn’t join a yagt…yauht….BOAT club that would have me as a member!" <attributable_to_someone_noteworthy_I_am_soooo_sure Thanks for the start, Richard. My wife and I enjoyed the heck out of Anegada, population under 100 and which I’d call "severely isolated", compared to Green Turtle Cay – which looks to be fairly teeming with humanity and is a short boat ride to a whole lot of touristy stuff by comparison. But if the fishing is good enough I’ll put up with a lot We had considered the Tiamo resort on south Andros, but someone or something put the wife onto this place, hence the grape vine initiative… I’m not sure that the spousal unit is ready for a week and a half on a boat, though the idea has it’s intrigue. She’s done day sails on schooners and didn’t go green, so there’s a possibility she’ll surprise me. I shall bounce it off Herself and note her first reaction (the only one that counts I plan on at least renting a boat, hopefully a center console in the 20 foot range while we’re wherever we’re going to be. I’ve looked at the rates and they seem more than reasonable ("Wait’ll you see the boat, though!" We had also considered a different place closer to the Marls on the western side of Abaco, but my wife read that the guides that work out of the eastern cays can scoot over to the Marls quickly enough. The scale of these islands escapes me,  seems much smaller than I had imagined. Again, thanks for the feedback, if you have more on the GTC thing I’d appreciate it (as email if you prefer). /daytripper

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Question:

It’s not broken. It must be flaky because it worked for half of them. Paul

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – When I should have been working on my spelling I was tying leaders We know, Paul. Your "c" key is broken. Happens to everyone eventually. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/ something bogus to avoid spam)

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rw,    I hate moss on my leader also, that is one of the reasons I use a Leader Link instead of a loop to attach the leader to the line.  The Blood Knot Machine ties tight knots and the ends can be clipped very close which eliminates most moss catching.  The moss that does cling comes off each time you cast. Ernie "rw" wrote – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I don’t like hand-tied leader with lots of knots. The knots snag on weeds and other debris. Sorry, Ernie.

Response:

When I should have been working on my spelling I was tying leaders

We know, Paul. Your "c" key is broken. Happens to everyone eventually. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/ something bogus to avoid spam)

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I don’t like hand-tied leader with lots of knots. The knots snag on weeds and other debris. Sorry, Ernie. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/ something bogus to avoid spam)

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I tie all my own leaders and the only advice I can give you is pratice, pratice, pratice.

LOL! You go, Paul ;^) /daytripper (I blame myself for never making you spell things correctly…)

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When I should have been working on my spelling I was tying leaders

I tie all my own leaders and the only advice I can give you is pratice, pratice, pratice. LOL! You go, Paul ;^) /daytripper (I blame myself for never making you spell things

correctly…)

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B. Watkins See http://home.earthlink.net/~eharrison241 click on Leader Logic Ernie

Ernie How do you pull the bloodknots tight?  I always seem to end up overheating and pinching the leader no matter how much lube (spit) or how gently I pull.  Must be doing something wrong. Peter

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I tie all my own leaders and the only advice I can give you is pratice, pratice, pratice. I tie them by hand (ie. no tools other than nippers to trim the tags) and I allow 2" of line for the knot and tag and I end up +/- 1/4" for segment length. Paul

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I constructed a hand-made leader, following the guidelines in the Orvis Fly-Fishing Book.  I tied the knots as instructed.  It was quite clunky. Do many of you out there construct your own leaders?  Any tips for a smoother hand-constructed leader and tippet would be appreciated.

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What do you mean by clunky?  Did you try to fish with it?  What knots do they use in that book and how many turns? I constructed a hand-made leader, following the guidelines in the Orvis Fly-Fishing Book.  I tied the knots as instructed.  It was quite clunky. Do many of you out there construct your own leaders?  Any tips for a smoother hand-constructed leader and tippet would be appreciated.

Got questions?  Get answers over the phone at Keen.com. Up to 100 minutes free! http://www.keen.com

Response:

I constructed a hand-made leader, following the guidelines in the Orvis Fly-Fishing Book.  I tied the knots as instructed.  It was quite clunky. Do many of you out there construct your own leaders?  Any tips for a smoother hand-constructed leader and tippet would be appreciated.

Response:

B. Watkins See http://home.earthlink.net/~eharrison241 click on Leader Logic Ernie

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I constructed a hand-made leader, following the guidelines in the Orvis Fly-Fishing Book.  I tied the knots as instructed.  It was quite clunky. Do many of you out there construct your own leaders?  Any tips for a smoother hand-constructed leader and tippet would be appreciated.

Response:

Question:

I can beat that one – I caught a fly that I lost two weeks prior on the Salmon River in upstate NY right in the eye!! – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I once caught a dead raccoon on a nymph…someone had set a steel-jawed trap which got the raccoon by the creek and it had drowned. Strange catches I’ve had, A Swallow who took my dry fly off the surface of the water. This was very interesting, Them little birds put up a pretty good fight. And yes it was catch and release for this critter. On another outing, I caught a Mud Hen, simular to a duck, but with a pointed beak. Caught this critter on the foot on a streamer. Guess we got snagged up together while he was swimming under water. Thought I had hooked into a record fish before the bird came jumping out of the water with my streamer tangled in its feet. Took me right down to the backing and then some before breaking the #5 tippet.

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I once caught a dead raccoon on a nymph…someone had set a steel-jawed trap which got the raccoon by the creek and it had drowned. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Strange catches I’ve had, A Swallow who took my dry fly off the surface of the water. This was very interesting, Them little birds put up a pretty good fight. And yes it was catch and release for this critter. On another outing, I caught a Mud Hen, simular to a duck, but with a pointed beak. Caught this critter on the foot on a streamer. Guess we got snagged up together while he was swimming under water. Thought I had hooked into a record fish before the bird came jumping out of the water with my streamer tangled in its feet. Took me right down to the backing and then some before breaking the #5 tippet.

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I caught a bat on a dry fly after he picked it up off the water.

I, too, hooked a bat on a dry fly – on my back cast. It crash landed under a huge overhanging Sycamore next to a cutbank, and was immediately grabbed by a huge brown trout. This was on the East Branch of the Delaware below Shinhopple. I was about 12 years old at the time. I’m 53 now, and still trying to come up with a recipe for a "batfly" I can actually cast. Regards, Dennis Loveland, CO

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My strangest catch happened when I technically wasn’t even fishing. Years ago, my friend Walt and I and our wives were camping at a high sierra lake and he and I were fishing from a boat. We quit fishing when it got dark and headed back toward camp, and in the total darkness were following the snowbanks visible on shore as reference points. Being this dark, I was being cautious (and cold) and had the motor at a real low speed. As we were slowly moving along, we suddenly heard a thump as something  landed in the boat and began thrashing around. We turned on the flashlight only to find a 10" rainbow had attempted to commit suicide by jumping into the boat. We were both stunned and began laughing and asked each other if we could believe what we just saw happen. Of course, our wives didn’t believe a word of it and accused us of working overtime on a good "fishing tale". To this day Walt and I crack up whenever we talk about it. FS – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – My strangest catch is actually my wife’s. We were bait-fishing for bluegill in Wisconsin twelve years ago (before I learned fly fishing).  She was using a little 3 foot  kid’s rod with a Zebco 202 Jr. reel. She hooked a little bait stealer bluegill about 2 inches long.  as she brought it over the side of the row boat, I saw something out of the corner of my eye flying over the side of the boat, in pursuit of the little bluegill.  It was long and thin with a very large mouth filled with teeth. It landed in between us…right on top of my open tackle box (there is a lesson in that)  and thrashed around. Thinking it a snake, I almost jumped out of the boat!  But it turned out to be a 25 1/2 inch Northern Pike!  Since we caught it "on the fly"  I guess you could call it "fly" fishing. Tight lines…… Ken Wells Saturday when I went fishing, I managed to wrap my leader around a dragon fly while it was going by. I was so astounded I just stood there and watched the dragon fly go around in circles. Finally the dragon fly landed in the stream, and when it did a bass tried to jump on it, but I guess that helped untangle the dragon fly and both bass and dragon fly went on their way. I did catch a lot of nice small mouth bass and panfish too. I know this sounds like a fish story, but it is true.

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I had a similar experience yesterday.  I was casting a wooly bugger to a decent largemouth I had spotted hiding under a tallish bridge.  On my second or third sidearm cast, a swallow went zipping by just in time to have my tippet about 4 inches up from my fly land across its back.  He took my fly 6-7 feet off course before slipping out from under my leader. Come to think of it, that may have been the best fight I had all day. : Saturday when I went fishing, I managed to wrap my leader around a : dragon fly while it was going by. I was so astounded I just stood there : and watched the dragon fly go around in circles. Finally the dragon : fly landed in the stream, and when it did a bass tried to jump on it, : but I guess that helped untangle the dragon fly and both bass and dragon : fly went on their way. : I did catch a lot of nice small mouth bass and panfish too. : I know this sounds like a fish story, but it is true. —                        http://members.tripod.com/~trunculo/index

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Strange catches I’ve had, A Swallow who took my dry fly off the surface of the water. This was very interesting, Them little birds put up a pretty good fight. And yes it was catch and release for this critter. On another outing, I caught a Mud Hen, simular to a duck, but with a pointed beak. Caught this critter on the foot on a streamer. Guess we got snagged up together while he was swimming under water. Thought I had hooked into a record fish before the bird came jumping out of the water with my streamer tangled in its feet. Took me right down to the backing and then some before breaking the #5 tippet.

Response:

Saturday when I went fishing, I managed to wrap my leader around a dragon fly while it was going by. I was so astounded I just stood there and watched the dragon fly go around in circles. Finally the dragon fly landed in the stream, and when it did a bass tried to jump on it, but I guess that helped untangle the dragon fly and both bass and dragon fly went on their way. I did catch a lot of nice small mouth bass and panfish too. I know this sounds like a fish story, but it is true.

John I was fishing off of Bronte pier, chuck clios on a spinning rig.  I was tossing out as far as I could, which produced a big belly of mono in the air.  A seagull flew into the belly and got himself all wrapped up.  I actually had to play him like a fish and land him where a few spectators and I, could cut him loose. I’ve also had seagulls pick up surface plugs, then drop them when I yanked real hard.  Once I also beaned a seagull unintentionally with a red devil, when I was a kid. The seagull problem has drpped off now that I flyfish only, but I’m still waiting for a swallow or bat to pick off my Henryville on the backcast. Peter

Response:

Strange catches I’ve had, A Swallow who took my dry fly off the surface of the water. This was very interesting, Them little birds put up a pretty good fight. And yes it was catch and release for this critter. On another outing, I caught a Mud Hen, simular to a duck, but with a pointed beak. Caught this critter on the foot on a streamer. Guess we got snagged up together while he was swimming under water. Thought I had hooked into a record fish before the bird came jumping out of the water with my streamer tangled in its feet. Took me right down to the backing and then some before breaking the #5 tippet.

I have caught a cormorant (large black sea bird) on a herring cutplug, and a seagull the same way. I have also caught a river otter on a Squamish Poacher pattern on an eight weight. You want to see a good fight! unbelievable! The tough part was trying to get the hook(barbless) out of his nose without getting bit. I couldn’t do it. Fortunately the hook was only caught in a bit of skin on top of his nose and eventually pulled out. He had a sore nose but I don’t think he was any worse for it. I think he’ll have a closer look at any big shrimp in the Thompson river before biting though. I also caught a bat on a Tom Thumb, but thats a different story.

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Saturday when I went fishing, I managed to wrap my leader around a dragon fly while it was going by. I was so astounded I just stood there          <<snip I was fishing off of Bronte pier, chuck clios on a spinning rig.  I was tossing out as far as I could, which produced a big belly of mono in the air.  A seagull flew into the belly and got himself all wrapped up.

       <<snip The seagull problem has drpped off now that I flyfish only, but I’m still waiting for a swallow or bat to pick off my Henryville on the backcast. Peter

I believe I hve related this tale to ROFF before, but two years ago while on the Northwest Branch of the Potomac, I had a bat take a White Wulff on the backcast.  I unknowingly set the hook as I started the rod forward. thinking that I had snagged some vegetation, at first, I was surprised…no alarmed to see this bat suddenly take off out of the water trailing my line.  This certainly got my heart rate up.  Not wanting to drown the poor beast, I made my way to shore and slowly pulled the bat in. It was of course all in a panic, and finally got the line tangled in some low brush, and fell to the ground.  It was a little thing, not much bigger than a golf ball with wings.  Now, I didn’t want the creature to spend have to live with a yard of mono trailing behind, but I didn’t want to get bit either (visions of rabies or some other horrid infection flashed through my mind).  Another fisherman on the scene covered the bat with his net, I clipped and untangled the line, he gently shook the animal out of the net, and we sprinted about 10 yards away.  In a minute or two the bat flew away, and I called it a day. Paul Price, Ph.D. Postdoctoral Fellow Dept. Microbiology and Immunology School of Medicine University of Maryland at Baltimore

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My strangest catch is actually my wife’s. We were bait-fishing for bluegill in Wisconsin twelve years ago (before I learned fly fishing).  She was using a little 3 foot  kid’s rod with a Zebco 202 Jr. reel. She hooked a little bait stealer bluegill about 2 inches long.  as she brought it over the side of the row boat, I saw something out of the corner of my eye flying over the side of the boat, in pursuit of the little bluegill.  It was long and thin with a very large mouth filled with teeth. It landed in between us…right on top of my open tackle box (there is a lesson in that)  and thrashed around. Thinking it a snake, I almost jumped out of the boat!  But it turned out to be a 25 1/2 inch Northern Pike!  Since we caught it "on the fly"  I guess you could call it "fly" fishing. Tight lines…… Ken Wells – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Saturday when I went fishing, I managed to wrap my leader around a dragon fly while it was going by. I was so astounded I just stood there and watched the dragon fly go around in circles. Finally the dragon fly landed in the stream, and when it did a bass tried to jump on it, but I guess that helped untangle the dragon fly and both bass and dragon fly went on their way. I did catch a lot of nice small mouth bass and panfish too. I know this sounds like a fish story, but it is true.

Response:

Saturday when I went fishing, I managed to wrap my leader around a dragon fly while it was going by. I was so astounded I just stood there and watched the dragon fly go around in circles. Finally the dragon fly landed in the stream, and when it did a bass tried to jump on it, but I guess that helped untangle the dragon fly and both bass and dragon fly went on their way. I did catch a lot of nice small mouth bass and panfish too. I know this sounds like a fish story, but it is true.

Never lassoed a dragonfly, but did catch a bat while fishing at night for bass. he didn’t care much for the net when I landed him. dewayne

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I caught a bat on a dry fly after he picked it up off the water.  Wasn’t as nice or brave as the other folks who have posted here.  I cut the thing loose with about 4 feet of line still attached.  I’m pretty sure it drown.  I also nailed a bat with my rod on my forward cast.  THWACK! Scared the heck out of me.  He ended up in the water about 20 feet away. I don’t think he made it either. Brian

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Is this bait fishing ?!!!

 I don’t know – it could be proxy fishing. You were flyfishing when you cast, and you pulled out a fish hooked up on you’re fly. What happened in between casting and landing was entirely up to the fish. To the charge of bait fishing…..Not guilty:-) Regards, — Bill

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writes       Mr. Endicott was clearly flyfishing, and shall be absolved of guilt.        The <bluegill, on the other hand, is in real trouble.

I believe the bluegill was guilty of soliciting! — Bill

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Now, I didn’t want the creature to spend have to live with a yard of mono trailing behind, but I didn’t want to get bit either (visions of rabies or some other horrid infection flashed through my mind).   Paul Price, Ph.D. Postdoctoral Fellow Dept. Microbiology and Immunology School of Medicine University of Maryland at Baltimore

A little knowledge can be a dangerous thing! A lot of knowledge can be terrifying! — Bill

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Never lassoed a dragonfly, but did catch a bat while fishing at night for bass. he didn’t care much for the net when I landed him.

I was talking to some fisher friend in Mid Wales, and one related a tale about fishing for salmon using a bunch of worms.  The tippet was joined to the cast by a large loop to loop and the whole set up was dunked up and down in a deep pool.  On the change of direction from up to down, the loops opened up and a salmon got "lassoed" in one of the loops. You may ask was *that* bait fishing! — Bill

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The seagull problem has drpped off now that I flyfish only, but I’m still waiting for a swallow or bat to pick off my Henryville on the backcast.

 Do you think the seagulls have learned that you spell trouble?…:-) I’ve had bats dive after a small Mepp spinner while evening fishing, but thankfully never hooked one. — Bill

Response:

William Endicott writes:

That story brings about a question: While fishing the local Park pond I hooked a 2 inch Bluegill by mistake. That Bluegill was immediately swallowed by a 6 pound Bass. This has happened previously with the Bass spitting the Bluegill out on the first jump.  However, on this occasion the fly disconnected from the Bluegill and hooked the Bass !!!  I then proceeded to catch the Bass on my 7′ 3wt bluegill rod. Is this bait fishing ?!!! Answer:         Mr. Endicott was clearly flyfishing, and shall be absolved of guilt.           The <bluegill, on the other hand, is in real trouble.

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Sounds like a fish story to me. —                                     Jeff Olsen If you don"t know your rights,                                            you have none. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – William Endicott writes: That story brings about a question: While fishing the local Park pond I hooked a 2 inch Bluegill by mistake. That Bluegill was immediately swallowed by a 6 pound Bass. This has happened previously with the Bass spitting the Bluegill out on the first jump.  However, on this occasion the fly disconnected from the Bluegill and hooked the Bass !!!  I then proceeded to catch the Bass on my 7′ 3wt bluegill rod. Is this bait fishing ?!!! Answer:    Mr. Endicott was clearly flyfishing, and shall be absolved of guilt.      The <bluegill, on the other hand, is in real trouble.

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I have had gar and catfish chase small sunfish I caught.  Haven’t been lucky enough to have a bass chase it. Runt d:P – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – That story brings about a question: While fishing the local Park pond I hooked a 2 inch Bluegill by mistake. That Bluegill was immediately swallowed by a 6 pound Bass. This has happened previously with the Bass spitting the Bluegill out on the first jump.  However, on this occasion the fly disconnected from the Bluegill and hooked the Bass !!!  I then proceeded to catch the Bass on my 7′ 3wt bluegill rod. Is this bait fishing ?!!! Bill — William Endicott Saturday when I went fishing, I managed to wrap my leader around a dragon fly while it was going by. I was so astounded I just stood there and watched the dragon fly go around in circles. Finally the dragon fly landed in the stream, and when it did a bass tried to jump on it, but I guess that helped untangle the dragon fly and both bass and dragon fly went on their way. I did catch a lot of nice small mouth bass and panfish too. I know this sounds like a fish story, but it is true.

Response:

That story brings about a question: While fishing the local Park pond I hooked a 2 inch Bluegill by mistake. That Bluegill was immediately swallowed by a 6 pound Bass. This has happened previously with the Bass spitting the Bluegill out on the first jump.  However, on this occasion the fly disconnected from the Bluegill and hooked the Bass !!!  I then proceeded to catch the Bass on my 7′ 3wt bluegill rod. Is this bait fishing ?!!! Bill — William Endicott – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Saturday when I went fishing, I managed to wrap my leader around a dragon fly while it was going by. I was so astounded I just stood there and watched the dragon fly go around in circles. Finally the dragon fly landed in the stream, and when it did a bass tried to jump on it, but I guess that helped untangle the dragon fly and both bass and dragon fly went on their way. I did catch a lot of nice small mouth bass and panfish too. I know this sounds like a fish story, but it is true.

Response:

That story brings about a question: While fishing the local Park pond I hooked a 2 inch Bluegill by mistake. That Bluegill was immediately swallowed by a 6 pound Bass. This has happened previously with the Bass spitting the Bluegill out on the first jump.  However, on this occasion the fly disconnected from the Bluegill and hooked the Bass !!!  I then proceeded to catch the Bass on my 7′ 3wt bluegill rod. Is this bait fishing ?!!! Bill

Bill:   Of course it’s bait fishing, and you are hereby and herewith summarily dismissed from FFF, TU and all other alphabetized organizations.  By the way, that 2 inch bluegill is right up there with my normal catches.                      Mark Faulkner

Response:

<<That story brings about a question: While fishing the local Park pond I hooked a 2 inch Bluegill by mistake. That Bluegill was immediately swallowed by a 6 pound Bass. This has happened previously with the Bass spitting the Bluegill out on the first jump.  However, on this occasion the fly disconnected from the Bluegill and hooked the Bass !!!  I then proceeded to catch the Bass on my 7′ 3wt bluegill rod. Is this bait fishing ?!!! Bill — William Endicott I had a similar experience on my favorite trout river in British Columbia a few years back.  A thunder storm was rapidly rolling in.  Just before all heck broke loose, the fish started rising like crazy.  I was casting a million miles an hour trying to catch that last fish before I ran for cover.  A little 3 inch trout took the fly and as I was reeling it in, a huge rainbow came out of the water and dove down on it.  He missed the fish but continued to chase it.  I was so mesmerized by the whole event, I didn’t even think to stop reeling and let him take the little fish.  Finally, the big fish turned away about 5 feet from me.   Mike

Response:

That story brings about a question: While fishing the local Park pond I hooked a 2 inch Bluegill by mistake. That Bluegill was immediately swallowed by a 6 pound Bass. This has happened previously with the Bass spitting the Bluegill out on the first jump.  However, on this occasion the fly disconnected from the Bluegill and hooked the Bass !!!  I then proceeded to catch the Bass on my 7′ 3wt bluegill rod. Is this bait fishing ?!!! Bill

Yup.  You’re busted.  Turn in all your FF’ing gear.   Send it to me and I’ll send you a trotline and a good doughball recipe. Bob Scott

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I know this sounds like a fish story, but it is true.

You know the difference between a Fairy Tale and a Fish Story?  Well, the Fairy Tale begins, "Once upon a time", and the Fish Story begins, (holding hands at least two feet apart) "Now this is no shit"! Yippee Tie One On! AuSable1

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Question:

Anyone know of a source for flyfishing clip art?  thanks in Advance

Response:

Anyone know of a source for flyfishing clip art?  thanks in Advance

Check out the Fly & Field website at: http://www.flyfield.com/clipart.htm — Steve Vaughn

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Question:

I’m interested in submitting some pictures for magazines but not sure how to do it.  Anyone know anything about this? bruce

Response:

I’m interested in submitting some pictures for magazines but not sure how to do it.  Anyone know anything about this? bruce

Hi Bruce Most of the magazines I deal with request slides of the topic. One of the things I discovered caused me to start shooting my slide differently. Before working for magazine editors I always shot my slides for inclusion in slide shows and preferred them to be a little denser rather than the opposite. The editors I work with prefer a slide that a bit lighter than what I used to call normal. I now shoot my slides at a lower ASA rating than the film calls for (ASA 400 shot at 375). One way to sell your photo’s is to call the editor, let him know what you have, and arrange to send him/her samples. Good luck. If you want me to look your photo’s over, email me and we’ll see what we can arrange. — Tight Lines Al Beatty BT’s Fly Fishing Products Bozeman, MT (97 materials catalog) http://www.flyshop.com/Expo/Specialty/BTsPdcts/index.html

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Your best bet is to shoot slow speed slide film.  KR64 is the the traditional favorite and you can’t go wrong with this. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’m interested in submitting some pictures for magazines but not sure how to do it.  Anyone know anything about this? bruce

Response:

Bruce The first thing you do is write the magazine you’re interested in–typically the managing editor–and ask for a copy of their editorial guidelines. Some buy most of their pictures from outside sources, many only use pictures shot by the folks writing the story. Just depends. Most will prefer you write a letter describing what you want to sell rather than getting a box of slides–no one wants to be responsible for your slides unless they ask for them. yeah most won’t buy prints but  some will. Once you see rates you may give up on this by the way. Only a relative handful of folks pay enough for pictures to justify owning a camera. Good luck — www.geocities.com/~tarponguide

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: Most of the magazines I deal with request slides of the topic. One of the : things I discovered caused me to start shooting my slide differently. : Before working for magazine editors I always shot my slides for inclusion : in slide shows and preferred them to be a little denser rather than the : opposite. The editors I work with prefer a slide that a bit lighter than : what I used to call normal. I now shoot my slides at a lower ASA rating : than the film calls for (ASA 400 shot at 375). I’m sure my experience with magazine photos is much more limited than Al’s but I agree with the advice about lighter photos… at least I think that is what Al was saying by making the photos less dense.  Dark negs or slides I’ve submitted print up even darker in a magazine.  But I might have Al’s comments wrong, because I underexpose my film to make a lighter slide, which translates into moving the ASA setting on the camera a notch higher (e.g. 425 rather than 400) rather than Al’s suggestion to go lower. Did I miss something Al? — Rick T. Rick Fletcher   –   http://www.chem.uidaho.edu/~fletcher/ Associate professor of chemistry  |  That’s Idaho, not Iowa.    | ad hominem University of Idaho               |  Upper Left Hand Corner.    | ad hominem Moscow, ID 83844-2343             |  No, I don’t grow potatoes. | ad hominem

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Leitheiser) writes: Normally "best" results are obtained with reversal films by overexposing a 1/2 stop or so, ie. shoot a 400 film at EI 350 or so. This keeps the shadows from being too dark…course it depends a bit <<snip   : Most of the magazines I deal with request slides of the topic. One of the : things I discovered caused me to start shooting my slide differently. : Before working for magazine editors I always shot my slides for inclusion : in slide shows and preferred them to be a little denser rather than the : opposite. The editors I work with prefer a slide that a bit lighter than : what I used to call normal. I now shoot my slides at a lower ASA rating : than the film calls for (ASA 400 shot at 375). I’m sure my experience with magazine photos is much more limited than Al’s but I agree with the advice about lighter photos… at least I think that is what Al was saying by making the photos less dense.  Dark negs or slides I’ve submitted print up even darker in a magazine.  But I might have Al’s comments wrong, because I underexpose my film to make a lighter slide, which translates into moving the ASA setting on the camera a notch higher (e.g. 425 rather than 400) rather than Al’s suggestion to go lower. Did I miss something Al? — Rick T. Rick Fletcher   –  

Dense NEAGATIVES "print" lighter…Dense SLIDES "print" darker. I think you guys are meaning to say the same thing but are mixing positives and David Jones

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1) There is a simple way of keeping "exposures" straight when dealing with any camera: bracket your shot: that is shoot three shots, one normal, one a half-stop over exposed and one a half stop underexposed. 2) If you cannot bracket here are some basic guidelines:    For color slides, "open up a stop, especially in clear sunny weather where the shadows will loose their detail quite quickly because they are 2 to three stops darker than sunlight. This is particularly with Kodachrome film, which is processed differently than the E-6 films such as Fuji or Ektachromes. And despite what most people say, no E6 processed film can be as sharp as Kodachrome because of the way it’s processed. 3)  For prints, there is more latitude in overall exposure because some exposure problems can be corrected when printing. 4)  Like Al Beatty, always "open" up a stop for photographs intended for publications. Magazines – and slide shows for that matter – do not like black shadows! Good shooting! 3)

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Bob makes some good suggestions, especially about using a fill-in flash for outdoor slide work with close-up subjects.  Although art departments can "improve" a sloppy slide, I believe editors generally like the slides to be good to begin with….  Helps you get past the gate keeper. Once upon a time, Kodachrome 64 (and to a lesser extent Kodakchrome 25) were standards for outdoor magazine work.  Most outdoor magazine photographers that I knew would set the ASA at one setting under when shooting kodakchrome so as to slightly underexpose the slide and get rich, deep colour tones for printing in magazines. Nowadays, many (if not virtually all) outdoor photographers shooting for magazine publication use one of the modern E-6 films, for example Velvia 50 or Provia 100.  Most shoot this modern E-6 film dead on.  [It has taken me a while to adjust from Kodachrome--expensive in film .] A friend of mine who is a professional outdoor and nature photographer in PEI, will occasionally shoot the Velvia 50 *slightly* over-exposed in order to reduce the contrast (i.e., the surrealistic drenching colours).  I hear that Velvia 50 shoots well "pushed" but have yet to experiment with it. Boy, it sure gives nice results if you get the exposure right! Anyhow, this might all be of historic curiosity value if what I hear is true, in another few years, computer technology will have made slide and other film obsolete! One last thing:  whether for magazine publication, books or slides shows that you put on at your local club, I would encourage everybody to take as nice slides as possible of this your _favourite_ sport.  A good picture is worth a 1000 words and I believe that tasteful, good quality pictures of our favourite outdoor recreation help politically promote this sport and mobilize the political and economic resources to preserve (and if necessary restore) habitat–vital to good sport fisheries. Off my box!

: Been following this thread and thoght I’d throw my two pennies in. I : publish a magazine so I’ve had a smidgeon of experience re reproducing : photos, both slide and prints. : All slides, for that matter even all prints, will be scanned by a computer : operator into Photoshop, where they can be lightened, darkened, made more : contrasty, do color corrections, whatever the art department determines is : necessary preparatory to going to press. My opinion: shoot it normal, just : like you were gonna use it for  slide show. Or if you can afford a lot of : shots, then bracket the shot both sides of normal exposure. : I really like to keep things simple, and shooting normally is the : simplest. Let the art department make any corrections they want or need : and don’t try to do it with altering ASA numbers. If you find that the : photos are coming out dark in the printed magazine, it is because the art : department has not adjusted the contrast or brightness correctly. It’s : generally not the photographers fault. In fact, a good art department can : improve the looks of a bad photo to make it look good, probably as much as : 50% better. : Also, just a suggestion, when shooting outdoors, I use a fill flash on : almost every shot. It makes a world of difference and really gives a three : dimensional feel to the shot. Try it and you’ll see. : Bob Vorel — Burnaby, BC

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: Most of the magazines I deal with request slides of the topic. One of the : opposite. The editors I work with prefer a slide that a bit lighter than : what I used to call normal. I now shoot my slides at a lower ASA rating have Al’s comments wrong, because I underexpose my film to make a lighter slide, which translates into moving the ASA setting on the camera a notch higher (e.g. 425 rather than 400) rather than Al’s suggestion to go lower.

This corresponds, I think, to what I have seen reccomended, i.e., use of a high contrast film.  Underexposure should produce a higher contrast image. -Burton

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I’m sure my experience with magazine photos is much more limited than Al’s but I agree with the advice about lighter photos… at least I think that is what Al was saying by making the photos less dense.  Dark negs or slides I’ve submitted print up even darker in a magazine.  But I might have Al’s comments wrong, because I underexpose my film to make a lighter slide, which translates into moving the ASA setting on the camera a notch higher (e.g. 425 rather than 400) rather than Al’s suggestion to go lower. Did I miss something Al? — Rick T. Rick Fletcher   –   http://www.chem.uidaho.edu/~fletcher/

I believe Al is correct, Rick.  By setting the ASA lower the camera thinks you are using slower film and will open the lens up more, or tell you to open the lens up,to compensate. This will give you a less dense,lighter slide.  TRy it.  I think you’ll like it. Paul

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Been following this thread and thoght I’d throw my two pennies in. I publish a magazine so I’ve had a smidgeon of experience re reproducing photos, both slide and prints. All slides, for that matter even all prints, will be scanned by a computer operator into Photoshop, where they can be lightened, darkened, made more contrasty, do color corrections, whatever the art department determines is necessary preparatory to going to press. My opinion: shoot it normal, just like you were gonna use it for  slide show. Or if you can afford a lot of shots, then bracket the shot both sides of normal exposure. I really like to keep things simple, and shooting normally is the simplest. Let the art department make any corrections they want or need and don’t try to do it with altering ASA numbers. If you find that the photos are coming out dark in the printed magazine, it is because the art department has not adjusted the contrast or brightness correctly. It’s generally not the photographers fault. In fact, a good art department can improve the looks of a bad photo to make it look good, probably as much as 50% better. Also, just a suggestion, when shooting outdoors, I use a fill flash on almost every shot. It makes a world of difference and really gives a three dimensional feel to the shot. Try it and you’ll see. Bob Vorel

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – : Most of the magazines I deal with request slides of the topic. One of the : things I discovered caused me to start shooting my slide differently. : Before working for magazine editors I always shot my slides for inclusion : in slide shows and preferred them to be a little denser rather than the : opposite. The editors I work with prefer a slide that a bit lighter than : what I used to call normal. I now shoot my slides at a lower ASA rating : than the film calls for (ASA 400 shot at 375). I’m sure my experience with magazine photos is much more limited than Al’s but I agree with the advice about lighter photos… at least I think that is what Al was saying by making the photos less dense.  Dark negs or slides I’ve submitted print up even darker in a magazine.  But I might have Al’s comments wrong, because I underexpose my film to make a lighter slide, which translates into moving the ASA setting on the camera a notch higher (e.g. 425 rather than 400) rather than Al’s suggestion to go lower. Did I miss something Al? — Rick T. Rick Fletcher   –   http://www.chem.uidaho.edu/~fletcher/ Associate professor of chemistry  |  That’s Idaho, not Iowa.    | ad hominem University of Idaho               |  Upper Left Hand Corner.    | ad hominem Moscow, ID 83844-2343             |  No, I don’t grow potatoes. | ad hominem

Actually,  to make a slide lighter (thinner, less dense) you expose it more; that is, you set a lower ASA.  That way the camera gives it more exposure.  The same for negatives.  As you give them more exposure the negative itseld gets denser, which when printed results in a lighter print.  All within limits, of course.  Bill Mack

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Normally "best" results are obtained with reversal films by overexposing a 1/2 stop or so, ie. shoot a 400 film at EI 350 or so. This keeps the shadows from being too dark…course it depends a bit on your metering technique.  So many publications are scanning direct from the negative or slide now that it shouldn’t make any difference because of all the digital manipulation (now there is a catchy phrase) that they can do with the original.  Is that what reading how to/where to go complete with illustrations is?  FFing digital manipulation?   – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – : Most of the magazines I deal with request slides of the topic. One of the : things I discovered caused me to start shooting my slide differently. : Before working for magazine editors I always shot my slides for inclusion : in slide shows and preferred them to be a little denser rather than the : opposite. The editors I work with prefer a slide that a bit lighter than : what I used to call normal. I now shoot my slides at a lower ASA rating : than the film calls for (ASA 400 shot at 375). I’m sure my experience with magazine photos is much more limited than Al’s but I agree with the advice about lighter photos… at least I think that is what Al was saying by making the photos less dense.  Dark negs or slides I’ve submitted print up even darker in a magazine.  But I might have Al’s comments wrong, because I underexpose my film to make a lighter slide, which translates into moving the ASA setting on the camera a notch higher (e.g. 425 rather than 400) rather than Al’s suggestion to go lower. Did I miss something Al? — Rick T. Rick Fletcher   –   http://www.chem.uidaho.edu/~fletcher/ Associate professor of chemistry  |  That’s Idaho, not Iowa.    | ad hominem University of Idaho               |  Upper Left Hand Corner.    | ad hominem Moscow, ID 83844-2343             |  No, I don’t grow potatoes. | ad hominem

Mike in PDX "When the trout are lost, smash the state."                           Tom McGuane

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Question:

3M makes a fly line dressing that brings out the natural lubricants in the line itself and puts more on it.  Great Great Great STuff

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writes: Has anybody tried "lard" (yes, I mean pure porky lard for cooking) or any other greasy-oily domestic product?

     In the Bad Old Days of silk lines, commercial line dressings contained lanolin (i.e., mutton fat), but what good lard would do on a vinyl-covered line, I don’t know.  Silicones act like oils but are much less sensitive to changes in temperature (and do not become rancid!)      Wash your line in warm water and mild soap, rinse, then wipe dry with a soft cloth.  You will be surprised how much better a clean line floats and shoots than a dirty one.  – Roger

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Does anybody know of any domestic product we could use to apply on fly lines instead of these expensive silicone products a careful fisherman must buy many times a year in order to protect his line? Has anybody tried "lard" (yes, I mean pure porky lard for cooking) or any other greasy-oily domestic product? Fly fishing is older than "silicone" I believe, so what would ancient fly fishers use on their lines? …of course we know they didn’t use synthetic lines as we do now, but still! I am asking before I try for I am bored by the commercial aspect of fishing.  And I do go fishing every day. If some of you fly fishers out there would kindly give me informations on this by E-Mail, I would gather the answer and publish them in an article here in the NewsGroup.  It might be helpful for all of us. If I get no answer, well next year I’ll know because I’ll try a few tricks. Thanks for reading me.  If you got any answer you can mail ‘em to me (Jean-Pierre) at E-Mail address:

I think that a can of Mucilin is about as much as a mocha? William Kiene Kiene’s Fly Shop Sacramento,CA,USA

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Does anybody know of any domestic product we could use to apply on fly lines instead of these expensive silicone products a careful fisherman must buy many times a year in order to protect his line? Has anybody tried "lard" (yes, I mean pure porky lard for cooking) or any other greasy-oily domestic product? Fly fishing is older than "silicone" I believe, so what would ancient fly fishers use on their lines? …of course we know they didn’t use synthetic lines as we do now, but still! I am asking before I try for I am bored by the commercial aspect of fishing.  And I do go fishing every day. If some of you fly fishers out there would kindly give me informations on this by E-Mail, I would gather the answer and publish them in an article here in the NewsGroup.  It might be helpful for all of us. If I get no answer, well next year I’ll know because I’ll try a few tricks. Thanks for reading me.  If you got any answer you can mail ‘em to me (Jean-Pierre) at E-Mail address:

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Question:

Any places near Stockton, Ca or Sac that anyone has already fished. I’m looking for good places to fly fish for trout. Thanks Bob

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Yes, try the Stanislaus River just East of Oakdale, below Tullock Reservoir.  I was there on Saturday and cought a couple of wild rainbows. All Catch and Release.  The water is high, yet fish are catchable. Doug

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Question:

Hi, I am going to be in Galway, Ireland for a few days and I am thinking about spending one or two of them fishing. I may get a chance to fish the River Courrib (?) for half a day, but I have no idea about anywhere else to go, and many other things, such as: 1. What does a foreigner pay for a permit (?) for a couple of days. 2. Are there any places to fish for free (besides the Gov’t permit mentioned above). 3. What flies might I want to tie up for mid-Sept? Any relevant information would really be appreciated! Thanks, —

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I am going to be in Galway, Ireland for a few days and I am thinking about spending one or two of them fishing. 1. What does a foreigner pay for a permit (?) for a couple of days.

Probably dirt cheap (I found 20 years ago) 2. Are there any places to fish for free (besides

Trout anywhere, salmon nowhere without paying for access (cheap) If there has been recent rain, salmon or seatrout (spate) rivers would be the most fun.  There’s always the Galway River itself, right in the city. In dry weather you can sometimes do OK in hill loughs (need access permit and legs for a long walk). Homework (none recently published): Conor O’Malley’s With a Fishing Rod in Ireland (1975) for geography and T.C. Kingsmill Moore’s A Man May Fish (1960) for folklore and flies (nothing unusual.) —  |          Donald Phillipson, 4180 Boundary Rd., Carlsbad         |  |        Springs, Ont., Canada K0A 1K0; tel: (613) 822-0734       |  |  "What I’ve always liked about science is its independence from |  |  authority"–Ontario Science Centre (name on file) 10 July 1981 |

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Question:

I am looknig for information about formulas for tying my own tapered 5x, 6x, and 7x leaders of 9, 10, and 12 ft lengths.  I have the Orvis fly fishing book, but the section on tying leaders only gives one example and is rather oblique about how to extrapolate to different tippet sizes and lengths.  This book focus most on how you’d modify a 4x leader once you had started fishing.  I would like to tie some long 5, 6, and 7x leaders before I leave home to save time on the stream and so that I don’t have to make minor comprimises on lengths of the tapering sections of the leader once I am already fishing.  The Orvis book suggest a 60-20-20 formula for the 4x leader example, but even this is modified when the author actually starts explaining how to assemble the leader. Any helpful information on this score would be greatly appreciated…even a suggestion of an alternate book source with a good discussion of tippets. good fishing, eel

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Any helpful information on this score would be greatly

appreciated…even a suggestion of an alternate book source with a good discussion of

tippets. Check "The Curtis Creek Manifesto" for an effective, simple, understandable treatment, and McCLane’s Encyclopedia of Fishing for a more authoritative one. If I can remember it, I’ll post the formula from the "Manifesto". Tim

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