Question:

Hello Everyone,  I’m gearing up to do a bit of small lake fishing next week.  I really haven’t done much lake fly fishing over the past few years so I’m not real sure what to bring along for patterns.  Can anyone suggest some good "general" patterns for exploration on high mountain lakes? TIA

Response:

Hello Everyone,  I’m gearing up to do a bit of small lake fishing next week.  I really haven’t done much lake fly fishing over the past few years so I’m not real sure what to bring along for patterns.  Can anyone suggest some good "general" patterns for exploration on high mountain lakes? TIA

These are the flies I use over here in Scotland on hill lochs :- http://www.ftscotland.co.uk/flyindex.html especially the "Dry fly", "Hill Loch Nymph" and "Iron Blue Wetfly". — Don`t Worry, Be Happy       Sandy —       Website:-  http://www.ftscotland.co.uk     IRC:- Sandyb in #rabble  uk3.arcnet.vapor.com Port:6667      #Rabble Channel Website:- http://www.ftscotland.co.uk/rabble              ICQ : 41266150

Response:

These are the flies I use over here in Scotland on hill lochs :- http://www.ftscotland.co.uk/flyindex.html especially the "Dry fly", "Hill Loch Nymph" and "Iron Blue Wetfly".

Thanks for the link Sandy!  It’s good to see someone talk about fly fishing around here…. — Opinions are like assholes.  Everyone’s got one. … and they all stink!

Response:

Thanks for the link Sandy!  It’s good to see someone talk about fly fishing around here….

Yeah, beats the hell out of gratuitous insults, don’t it? Opinions are like assholes.  Everyone’s got one.

makes you superfluous, huh? … and they all stink!

We are pleased to bow to your authority. Wolfgang o.k., who wants to ask how someone comes to know so much about rectal redolence?

Response:

Thanks for the link Sandy!  It’s good to see someone talk about fly fishing around here…. Yeah, beats the hell out of gratuitous insults, don’t it?

Opinions are like assholes.  Everyone’s got one. makes you superfluous, huh?

… and they all stink! We are pleased to bow to your authority.

— Opinions are like assholes.  Everyone’s got one. … and they all stink!

Response:

Question:

I just knew it!  If I expanded on Zimmerman’s type of humor I would raise a lot of bottom dwellers.

Boy, how sad to try and push that one over. Good Mo-o-orning!  VietNam!

Sadly, you’re much more Bruno Kirby than Robin Williams.

Response:

Sadly, you’re much more Bruno Kirby than Robin Williams.

Jeff, old pal, I’m just George.

  george.vcf

1K Download

Response:

I am a pathetic ass.  But I’m a hell of a fly fisherman!

George, hell just called and said to come back. ginksux

Response:

I have a friend who once fished with you, he said you were a good fisherman. That friend is the best fisherman I know, matter of fact one of the people you speak of knowing mentioned his skills in one of his books, but to talk to him about fishing, not once will he tell how good he is. Good fishermen don’t have to brag about how good they are and in the overall scheme of things, it is just not that important George. Wayne

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I am a pathetic ass.  But I’m a hell of a fly fisherman!

Response:

Wayne, you’re so correct and I agree 100%.  I didn’t realize I ever gave that impression or did that.  I’ve made a note of your constructive suggestion. Thanks, George – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have a friend who once fished with you, he said you were a good fisherman. That friend is the best fisherman I know, matter of fact one of the people you speak of knowing mentioned his skills in one of his books, but to talk to him about fishing, not once will he tell how good he is. Good fishermen don’t have to brag about how good they are and in the overall scheme of things, it is just not that important George. Wayne I am a pathetic ass.  But I’m a hell of a fly fisherman!

  george.vcf

1K Download

Response:

I am a pathetic ass.  But I’m a hell of a fly fisherman! – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Yup, You got us… However,  I suspect that if I wrote that "Gherke is a Pathetic Ass" not a single soul would rise to your defense How does that feel.. I just knew it!  If I expanded on Zimmerman’s type of humor I would raise a lot of bottom dwellers.  Besides, look how good his name looks strung out almost 20 times in the longest thread Steve has seen regarding himself in a long time. It takes a master to kick start this group out of its duldrums. mend . . . *sigh* . . . staring at drift . . . twitch! Good Mo-o-orning!  VietNam! Mr.G. "george, who is stir frying dog meat . . ." :  )

  george.vcf

1K Download

Response:

yah, you’re right.  *sigh* – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – George Gehrke : "george, who is stir frying dog meat . . ." Don’t eat it, George.  Cannibalism is illegal.

  george.vcf

1K Download

Response:

George Gehrke : "george, who is stir frying dog meat . . ."

Don’t eat it, George.  Cannibalism is illegal.

Response:

Yup, You got us… However,  I suspect that if I wrote that "Gherke is a Pathetic Ass" not a single soul would rise to your defense How does that feel..

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I just knew it!  If I expanded on Zimmerman’s type of humor I would raise a lot of bottom dwellers.  Besides, look how good his name looks strung out almost 20 times in the longest thread Steve has seen regarding himself in a long time. It takes a master to kick start this group out of its duldrums. mend . . . *sigh* . . . staring at drift . . . twitch! Good Mo-o-orning!  VietNam! Mr.G. "george, who is stir frying dog meat . . ." :  )

Response:

I just knew it!  If I expanded on Zimmerman’s type of humor I would raise a lot of bottom dwellers.  Besides, look how good his name looks strung out almost 20 times in the longest thread Steve has seen regarding himself in a long time. It takes a master to kick start this group out of its duldrums. mend . . . *sigh* . . . staring at drift . . . twitch! Good Mo-o-orning!  VietNam! Mr.G. "george, who is stir frying dog meat . . ." :  )

  george.vcf

1K Download

Response:

Question:

Hello, I am just getting into saltwater fly fishing after moving from a landlocked state to the Chesapeake Bay area.  Does anyone have any suggestions for a basic fly selection to get me started?  Thanks. Shannon

Response:

Clousers, deceivers, sand eel and a few shrimp patterns. There are more here: http://home.adelphia.net/~dmosthenes/ TL MC — "Where fishing is concerned, most anglers are basically manic excessives" http://www.mikeconnor.de – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello, I am just getting into saltwater fly fishing after moving from a landlocked state to the Chesapeake Bay area.  Does anyone have any suggestions for a basic fly selection to get me started?  Thanks. Shannon

Response:

Shannon,     I always like to go to the local experts when I get to a new place.  If you are fishing the Chesapeake, then you can’t go wrong with http://www.joebruce.com/  Its my favorite shop and Joe is well know for his ability to find and land fish.  I live in Severn, MD but I only moved here in June of last year.  The knowledge I’ve gained from the locals is incredible.  BTW, we not only have some incredible saltwater action, but the fresh water (browns, brookies, rainbows and smallies) is all around you.       Frank Reid

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello, I am just getting into saltwater fly fishing after moving from a landlocked state to the Chesapeake Bay area.  Does anyone have any suggestions for a basic fly selection to get me started?  Thanks. Shannon

Response:

Question:

Hi John, there is a great deal of help available on the net.  A couple of these sites should be of considerable help to you with basic stuff. Most of them have specific beginners sections.  If you have trouble with any of the terms etc, then just post to the group again, somebody will help you. Here are the URL

Question:

I set the hook and landed a beautiful brookie.  Someone once told me that trout are like women — find out what they want and give it to them!  Well, I found out what they wanted and  caught several more before leaving for dinner.   On Thursday there were 15 people at the island — mostly locals.  Fishing was tough.  I fished all my "spots" using the caddis with the emerger dropper, and caught a few fish.  I used an old trick – jiggling the Goddard caddis, and landed several nice salmon.  The brookies would not take a moving fly, but the salmon seemed to love it. I arrived at the island Friday morning to be greeted with a hefty hail from none other that ROFF’s very own Salmon Fly.  Paul emerged from the woods on the far side of the third current just as I was stepping out of the boat.  I made a mad dash to the wing dam and "my" spot before he could get there.  <g He fished his way over and a half hour later we took a break and talked for awhile.  He was catching fish and I was too, so we were happy.  It started to rain and I switched to a caddis nymph.  On the second or so cast my line stopped like it ran into a stone wall.  Fish!  I set the hook and could tell it was a big fish.  I told Paul I thought it was a big brookie.  Then I saw the yellow flash and knew it was a big fish, but not a brookie or a salmon.  A four pound sucker had taken my fly.  This was not a good thing, especially with Paul fishing next to me laughing.  I would not report such a catch, but Paul was there, saw the whole thing.  Soon the skies opened and it poured like hell for an hour or so.  Fishing was not good. The dam keeper lowered the water flow to 900 cfs, the "ideal" flow.  It usually takes a day for the fish adjust to a change in the water flow.  I took a nice 18 inch brookie out of the head of the pool (were the 23 inch trout was taken), and some small (10 – 14 inch) salmon before calling it a day. The lake is full and hopefully will remain so throughout the season.  Last year, they recorded a water temp in September of 72 degrees — the highest ever recorded.  Normal temp should be no higher than 66, with 62 the norm.  Here’s hoping the clave has good water come September!!!!! Our trip home on Saturday morning was uneventful.  We arrived home to a cavalcade of color — all of Jo’s rhododendron and mountain laurel were in full bloom.  And the lawn looks like a hay field!  Tomorrow’s another day. And then on Monday I head back to the Rapid, hoping the damn keeper hasn’t increased the flow. Dave LaCourse

Response:

… Here’s hoping the clave has good water come September!!!!!

As clavemeister you’re obligated to do more than "hope", damnit. Hell, Waldo put the triple whammy "no rain" mojo in the mail to Wolfgang knowing that we were riding down together and you saw what happened at Waldo’s Spring Fling. Get busy workin’ on that weather, Chief. Nice trip report. Trip reports are my favorite read, thank you, sir. — Ken Fortenberry

Response:

Forty writes: Get busy workin’ on that weather, Chief.

We *want* rain to fill the lake.  But if the new owners of the dams do not know how to run their flow properly, all the rain in the world ain’t gonna help. Waldo’s got a mojo, huh? Forgot in the report: Two moose (one going in, one out), two deer, 1 eagle, 1 osprey, and a whole bunch of loons and ducks.  And it was cold:  40 degrees *in the cabin* on Tuesday morning! Dave LaCourse

Response:

 Dave,  I went "hunting" last week Got two rolls of Elk.One roll at about 40 yds.The other varies from 80-200 yds.Another roll of mountain goat. More fun than sittin home thinking about my ills. —  Don Thompson  Zoomie(BushBug)  ACA#3460  TLCB#335  Any Time, Any Place  Pull the chocks, lets get this kite in the air.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Forty writes: Get busy workin’ on that weather, Chief. We *want* rain to fill the lake.  But if the new owners of the dams do not know how to run their flow properly, all the rain in the world ain’t gonna help. Waldo’s got a mojo, huh? Forgot in the report: Two moose (one going in, one out), two deer, 1 eagle, 1 osprey, and a whole bunch of loons and ducks.  And it was cold:  40 degrees *in the cabin* on Tuesday morning! Dave LaCourse

Response:

Waldo’s got a mojo, huh?

that’s what the ladies down at pappy’s tell me… just returned from dinner at the Texas Roadhouse with Marie & IJ. Joe said he owed Jeffie a steak but he’d rather buy me one… I ordered that big 16 oz. Ribeye…. thanks Jeff…tater and salad were good also IJ and I fished the S. Toe today…. IJ was catching fish left and right where wuffie couldn’t nary a rise….. the water is at least a foot and a half lower than when trip, ken, wolf, and i went there during the clave. if we don’t get some serious rain soon, i might as well pack up the trout gear until fall. I caught a bunch (& missed a bunch) also including a spectacularly colored brookie of about 10-12 inches. All mine were caught on a size 14 black foam beetle. Man that’s a great summertime pattern. I fished the same fly the whole day and it’s none the worse for wear. we didn’t even fish upper wilson’s…. water was so low it was disheartening. great report dave…..congrats on the suckah …. see ya in september. walt

Response:

Waldo’s got a mojo, huh? that’s what the ladies down at pappy’s tell me…

        oh, for god’s sake.  let’s get back to reality…  if we don’t get some serious rain soon, i might as well pack up the trout gear until fall.

        that’s strange.  last week when dash riprock and i were up on eagle and snowbird, it was all we could do to wade.  high, murky water, and rains morning and night.  i kept thinking forty was fishing just ahead of us. I caught a bunch (& missed a bunch) also including a spectacularly colored brookie of about 10-12 inches. All mine were caught on a size 14 black foam beetle. Man that’s a great summertime pattern. I fished the same fly the whole day and it’s none the worse for wear.

        yeah, and a little prince nymph as a dropper puts the beetle in the film.  killer rig in low water.         waldo:  let’s slap the piggy week after next.  i got to try a case this coming week, but then a couple play days open up. wayno – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –

Response:

Waldo’s got a mojo, huh?

Correction:  Waldo HAD a mojo.  I got it now and you bastards ain’t gonna see it cuz I can’t make the fall ball.  Will save it for next spring and will only use it THEN if I get an iron clad guarantee that I will be treated better than I was this year.  To whit; Waldo, I want to see fish in the south Toe!  And I want to see some of these alleged Brookies y’all claim to have down there. Wolfgang who is beginning to feel petulant

Response:

So I guess the Upper Creek exercise regiment was not good enough for you! Opie     –Petulant and Frenzied, I’m in a petulant frenzy–

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Waldo’s got a mojo, huh? Correction:  Waldo HAD a mojo.  I got it now and you bastards ain’t gonna see it cuz I can’t make the fall ball.  Will save it for next spring and will only use it THEN if I get an iron clad guarantee that I will be treated better than I was this year.  To whit; Waldo, I want to see fish in the south Toe!  And I want to see some of these alleged Brookies y’all claim to have down there. Wolfgang who is beginning to feel petulant

Response:

Wolfgang who is beginning to feel petulant

Well, I guess that is better than when you were flatulent <g Warren X#-[

Trout Dwellers Unite! Western Conclave Guru For info: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/sp_ROFF_people/wclave/wclave.html

Response:

Question:

<SNIPPED.  They are always very good and very quick reponses.  Do you sit at your computer all day just waiting for ROFF posts?:) Tim

No, but I do log in about twice daily usually, and at times when most posters elsewhere have long since gone to bed, so it may appear that my responses are pretty quick.  I sometimes spend quite a while doing other work on the computer, and log in even more often though. TL MC

Response:

[snip] So give em a brake or just keep on driving that jeep util you find a suitable wall..

Metaphorically speaking, of course… /daytripper ("I Brake For Newbies")

Response:

Lighten up, have a cool one and relax a bit.  It is not about gear or ego’s fellas. Mike

Thanks Mom…..errrr Mike….I almost forgot what it was "all about"….now as soon as I get done doin’ the dishes, startin another load of clothes and takin out the garbage.. if I have your permission, I’ll suck down that cold one before I kick another cat down the driveway….. Jeez….I’m sure glad we have our Jiminy Cricket around today!! Larry #:)#

Response:

Tim Look Tim, if you don’t ask your learning curve will be slower, so ask. However Grumpy some of us are, if the truth be known most here really like to share what we think we know. And newbies are the future of our sport so you are valued. As to diplomacy, or what some might prefer to think of as courtesy, well that itself is a matter of debate. I for one have a bad attitude toward what I consider pussy footing around, and a fairly sharp tongue. However, I think I can assure you though that even the most ragged and long standing feuds here wash away in the field and when it comes down to support for wise use of our country’s natural resources. If its any comfort there is also a long standing tradition for cussidness among the flyfishing fraternity. I offer Sparse Grey Hackle’s story "the Lotus Eaters" in his book "Fishless Days, Angling Nights" as exhibit 1, wherein he describes the Fly Fishers Club of Brooklyn, ensconced on the Beaverkill after their move from the the Brodhead’s in the last century. As exhibit 2 and 3  I offer the personality of our patron saint, Theodore Gordon himself, and Hewitt, fairly opinionated buggers I think you will agree. Having survived your initial dunking you’ve earned the right to ask anything you please and you will mostly get reasonable responses. Presumptuous, but I remain your humble servant, Dave – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have to agree with you mike. I am very much a "rookie" at this FF game and admittedly don’t post much because I don’t feel I know enough about this wonderful sport to be of help to anybody. I have asked some "newbie" questions and pretty much have received very polite and helpful replies (other than my initial post about an experience I had at a club that had fish feeders installed along the stream, which caused quite a backlash, well deserved though in retrospect). However, I have noticed a decided souring of tempers as of late. I lurk, mainly because I can and have gained many useful tidbits just from reading the posts, but also because I don’t want to be a bother to the regulars by asking a ton of "newbie" questions. After reading some of the recent posts I probably will be even more hesitant in the future. Tim

Response:

The current heat wave must be getting to people.  Of the two posts I read by newbies looking for advice, one guy got his head bit off by somebody on their soapbox about quality vs. price and the other question deteriorated into a thread taking personal jabs at each other and contradicting the previous post. This is not a way to encourage new people to stick around. Lighten up, have a cool one and relax a bit.  It is not about gear or ego’s fellas. Mike

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -The current heat wave must be getting to people.  Of the two posts I read by newbies looking for advice, one guy got his head bit off by somebody on their soapbox about quality vs. price and the other question deteriorated into a thread taking personal jabs at each other and contradicting the previous post. This is not a way to encourage new people to stick around. Lighten up, have a cool one and relax a bit.  It is not about gear or ego’s fellas. Mike

I have to agree with you mike. I am very much a "rookie" at this FF game and admittedly don’t post much because I don’t feel I know enough about this wonderful sport to be of help to anybody. I have asked some "newbie" questions and pretty much have received very polite and helpful replies (other than my initial post about an experience I had at a club that had fish feeders installed along the stream, which caused quite a backlash, well deserved though in retrospect). However, I have noticed a decided souring of tempers as of late. I lurk, mainly because I can and have gained many useful tidbits just from reading the posts, but also because I don’t want to be a bother to the regulars by asking a ton of "newbie" questions. After reading some of the recent posts I probably will be even more hesitant in the future. Tim

Response:

<SNIPPED However, I have noticed a decided souring of tempers as of late. I lurk, mainly because I can and have gained many useful tidbits just from reading the posts, but also because I don’t want to be a bother to the regulars by asking a ton of "newbie" questions. After reading some of the recent posts I probably will be even more hesitant in the future. Tim

Hi Tim, that is extremely unfortunate and was not my intention with my post. I just got a bit ratty at somebody insulting a lot of people for no good reason.  As you  know by now, and indeed mentioned in your post,  just about all questions are answered promptly and politely otherwise, by quite a few people. It would be a shame if we frightened people off, but by the same token, some things are unfortunately worded, and beg all sorts of cutting replies, which are then inevitably forthcoming. Glad to see you hung around anyway. TL MC

Response:

Oh yeah? Well fuck you! My rod is bigger than your rod and costs more, too. Tongue firmly in cheek… WESH – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – The current heat wave must be getting to people.  Of the two posts I read by newbies looking for advice, one guy got his head bit off by somebody on their soapbox about quality vs. price and the other question deteriorated into a thread taking personal jabs at each other and contradicting the previous post. This is not a way to encourage new people to stick around. Lighten up, have a cool one and relax a bit.  It is not about gear or ego’s fellas. Mike

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I have asked some "newbie" questions and pretty much have received very polite and helpful replies (other than my initial post about an experience I had at a club that had fish feeders installed along the stream, which caused quite a backlash, well deserved though in retrospect). However, I have noticed a decided souring of tempers as of late. I lurk, mainly because I can and have gained many useful tidbits just from reading the posts, but also because I don’t want to be a bother to the regulars by asking a ton of "newbie" questions. After reading some of the recent posts I probably will be even more hesitant in the future. Tim

Tim, I am a newbie to this NG so if the old timers are getting cranky you can ask me stuff.  I am not bothered by "newbie" questions and enjoy passing on what I know about fishin. Just don’t listen to anyone after I said my peace! Just jokin’.  There is a ton of resources here to use, don’t feel timid in asking questions.  If you still have questions that need to be answered and don’t want the backlash, feel free to email me.  I am available most of the time and will send you a reply just as soon as I can. Warren

Response:

No…not the heat…. (In the memory Sam Kinisson) "It’s not the heat, it’s the stupid fucking questions posted by stupid fucking newbies. What’s the best fucking floatant ? Who gives a flying fuck, how many kinds of fucking floatant are there ? Are these fucking idiots too fucking stupid just to go to the store and ask ‘em what the best fucking floatant is ? What’s next, what finger should I fucking use to put it on my fucking fly ? The heat ? The heat never wanted to make me drive my jeep into A FUCKING WALL". http://www.rodney.com/gallery/kinn.htm Your pal, — TimW, Halfordian Golfer "A Cash Flow Runs Through It…" "Guilt replaced the creel…"

Response:

<equivocating post snipped Um……come on Tim, why don’t you just tell us how you really feel?

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Hi Tim, that is extremely unfortunate and was not my intention with my post. I just got a bit ratty at somebody insulting a lot of people for no good reason.  As you  know by now, and indeed mentioned in your post,  just about all questions are answered promptly and politely otherwise, by quite a few people. It would be a shame if we frightened people off, but by the same token, some things are unfortunately worded, and beg all sorts of cutting replies, which are then inevitably forthcoming. Glad to see you hung around anyway. TL MC

Hi Mike: yea, I figure I’ll hang around…most of the posts by regulars are pretty comical, even if I don’t know what the hell they’re talking about with all the "inside jokes" around here. BTW, I do appreciate all of your helpful responses to my questions in the past.  They are always very good and very quick reponses.  Do you sit at your computer all day just waiting for ROFF posts?:) Tim

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Tim Look Tim, if you don’t ask your learning curve will be slower, so ask. However Grumpy some of us are, if the truth be known most here really like to share what we think we know. And newbies are the future of our sport so you are valued. As to diplomacy, or what some might prefer to think of as courtesy, well that itself is a matter of debate. I for one have a bad attitude toward what I consider pussy footing around, and a fairly sharp tongue. However, I think I can assure you though that even the most ragged and long standing feuds here wash away in the field and when it comes down to support for wise use of our country’s natural resources. If its any comfort there is also a long standing tradition for cussidness among the flyfishing fraternity. I offer Sparse Grey Hackle’s story "the Lotus Eaters" in his book "Fishless Days, Angling Nights" as exhibit 1, wherein he describes the Fly Fishers Club of Brooklyn, ensconced on the Beaverkill after their move from the the Brodhead’s in the last century. As exhibit 2 and 3  I offer the personality of our patron saint, Theodore Gordon himself, and Hewitt, fairly opinionated buggers I think you will agree. Having survived your initial dunking you’ve earned the right to ask anything you please and you will mostly get reasonable responses. Presumptuous, but I remain your humble servant, Dave

Thanks Dave, I already feel better about this NG! Now could you please tell me: What is the best floatant?  <Just Kidding Tim

Response:

It ain’t the heat — natural cussedness. Of course, heat and violent weather do tend to put the trout down, yielding more frustration. Watch it, or I’ll discorse on "Global Warming" again…. r.m.bies

Response:

<equivocating post snipped Um……come on Tim, why don’t you just tell us how you really feel?

How can you possibly complain about such a linguistically sophisticated post ? TL MC

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Tim, I am a newbie to this NG so if the old timers are getting cranky you can ask me stuff.  I am not bothered by "newbie" questions and enjoy passing on what I know about fishin. Just don’t listen to anyone after I said my peace! Just jokin’.  There is a ton of resources here to use, don’t feel timid in asking questions.  If you still have questions that need to be answered and don’t want the backlash, feel free to email me.  I am available most of the time and will send you a reply just as soon as I can. Warren

Thanks for the generous offer Warren! Tim

Response:

Oh, I suppose you have never had a stupid question.  I guess you were born knowing exactly what is the best floatant.  You know some people don’t have a flyfishing shop right next door and asking here is a great way for people to learn.  So give em a brake or just keep on driving that jeep util you find a suitable wall..

Response:

Question:

George – Can I have some of what your drinking? It’s gotta be good stuff! Nice prose there Georgie… Greg – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I began this journey on a dare.  I don’t even remember who it was.   It was one of you, even two or three, yet, here I am, wondering why I’m here? The fly rod is but a stick.  It is a reaching prest toward trout. Something to dab with, as in days of yore.  The lure of water, fins, and things that fall into water are what closes the chain that draws such as you   and I to feeding fish? We are men of water. I have mused much in my lifetime of how fishing began with sticks.  I have thought of the first hook and I’m sure, in my mind, it has always been hidden in the crotch of a sapling.  A simple affair of early man looking ‘down’ into clear water at big fish, stationary and finning, holding – waiting for food to come their way.  Food, the number one driving force of this planet.  Food, the mother of imagination.  Food, the mistress of fly fishing.  In all time, it only needed a student, willing to learn. I can see myself in another life, ugly, naked, hungry,  looking at such fish.  How it came to be that ‘the light of imagination,’ would turn the sapling, I may have been holding onto, so I could peer out and down a little better, sparked the logic of stripping it of all the limbs except one lower one, branch stub ‘up’ for a snare, to be able to reach down, slowly, moving the stick under such a wild creature and with all the quickness and might I could muster, lift it quickly, impelling and catching it fresh and easy . . . surely was a feat that had to be repeated again and again over the entire history of mankind.  Repeated by others of our reincarnated pasts? Today, I have built a bamboo fly rod plant.  A great river flows in front.  I am torn between its lure and the wand one must have in hand to conquer it.  A line of Osage orange trees line the other side of the road and a few yards beyond that, the Snake River slowly begins to fill with spring run off.  I am a trapped man in love with all that is around him.  Wood, freshly sawed with the dust veins, lay in heaps on the floor – sweetly scenting of pine, prints upon the mind.  This is a place children would remember.  Work benches, take form and the whirling sounds of a large table saw, cross saws, drills and electric screwdrivers whine late into the night.  A man’s dream slowly takes shape.  You can see his commitment to the future and of the many men he thinks about as he builds alone, thoughtful, diligent, steadily he holds on to his beliefs and dreams.  He feel very alone many times, late at night. Already, it is 1:26 AM in the morning.  The rod-guide-winding table has been dyed cherry wood and it has been varnished and now a clear finish dries while I write this.  Today, cutting bevels of sixty degrees each arrived for a new tapering machine.  A Beveler for roughing out Bamboo strips has been ordered and is on its way.  A new and second rod winding machine has been set up and the new table will have two of them.  Late this evening I bought the glue that will hold the Bastard Rods together.  Two cases of rod binding string are on its way, enough to wrap several hundred fly rods.  Planers, drill press, a SouthBend Lathe have bee ordered along with a heating oven.  Daily, hour by hour, week by week this is all I think of.  It is all I do.  I am a man of water. My mind sees pictures into the future.  Of men astream, casting.   If I am lucky, they may be casting a bamboo fly rod . . . a tool of our past, welded in spirit by our human history, flowing like the mane of a horse, that once upon a time was our fly lines. I can visualize another one day sitting in this fly rod shop I’m building, musing,  banding guides in colors sublime.  Green or Blue trimmed in Black or Gold, each wrap a binding makes – the man to his client.  One simple wrap, will go astream to secret places I know not of, but in spirit as the reed swishes softly in a early dawn, many miles away, by another.  We are men of water. The simplicity of thread has much beauty as the simplicity of the Chinese Bamboo does.  The simplicity of cork grown in Portugal by peasants who wait 35 years for its first crop, provides ‘feel,’ yet no one has empathy for those that work from hand to mouth for it.  The story of cane comes not without just dues.  How can something so simple be so cost intensive by involving so many lives?  It is just a stick, right?  How can anything like this be complicated? Up the Sui River  Northwest of Canton on a parcel of land of about 48,000 acres is the only place in the world that Angler Bamboo grows. In all the world, in a nation that crawls with more people then a colony of ants, a peasant gleans the mountain side of mature Tonkin.  He will strip it of leaves and he will drag it to the river.  He will bind it into rafts and then ride it over 230 miles down river.  There, the bamboo is scrubbed in wet beach sand to get rid of white fungus growth and it is stacked in tall bundles, left in the sun for weeks to dry and slowly cure.  Many hands have already handled the pole and so, it is taken to a warehouse where it is heated over charcoal and a bend is straightened out.  Soon, it is culled and cut and shipped to the United States.  Some of it cures now in a loft in my new shop.  That this one pole for a fly rod has traveled nearly 10,000 miles to be here, few of us care not.  It is so simple in form.  So naive in purpose, as to boggle the mind.  It’s destiny is held in my hands, and in that, magic is possible.  Isn’t it said that anything is possible for those who dream? "There’s a Wood Duck Decoy in that there hunk of wood if you know how to carve him out of it." Making a fly rod is a contemplative man’s sport as is the art of fly fishing.  If it isn’t an art form, then it should be.  Only a mindless boar doesn’t appreciate his own past. So it is, I see in the near future – a simple pole being split into eighteen strips, and each designed in a specific place in a fly rod for someone . . . many miles away.  Six sides and two tips filled with glues, varnishes, hardwood inserts, guides for sliding graceful fly lines and for a fly, a man, a trout, and a season.  For a man of water. I am humbled to be just a little part of it.  There is much to think about yet.  I am close to beginning the journey of building.  God help me. —

Question:

Hi.  I’m fairly new to southern Erie County, NY.  I’ve heard that there is nice salmon fishing in Eighteen Mile Creek in the fall, and I’d like to prepare.  Is anyone out here familiar with this water?  I am interested in when, where, and how (with what).  I am fairly familiar with it from Lake Erie to the big fork.  Would really appreciate any advice or even a partner.  (have chests wades and a small 4wd)  Could do either fly/spin/livebait).  Thanks again for any help.                                         Michael Kankiewicz                                         Business / Government Documents                                         Lockwood Memorial Library                                         University at Buffalo

Response:

Hi Mike, I take it you attend U.B since your sending this from the grad library . 18 mile is nit really a good chinook salmon tributary. actually the chinook salmon  population is fairly limited in all of lake erie. You will some coho salmon in 18 and other lake erie tributaries but most of all you will find steelhead. The primary tackle on 18 is egg sacks for steelhead,power bait. I float fish for steelhead with a 13 ft rod and a centerpin float reel as they do in canada. i also fly fish . if you fly fish on 18 i suggest small flies size 8 thru 10 egg sucking leaches,  size 8 glow bugs. at time the current can be slow esp in winter and water gin clear you may want to use a small float for strike indicator.Since your new to the area i suggest you go to the book store to pick up the sanders guide -which will give you all the spots in the area. If your still interest in chinook try oak orachard creek in orleans county,18 mile creek in niagara county or the lower niagara itself–lake ontario has larger population of chinooks-which proably will show up by end of september.If you dont mind taking a long ride say for a weekend there is the salmon river north of syracuse–you proably already know about that RIVERS REPUTATION AS WORLD CLASS. I hope this helps e mail if you have more questions.

Response:

Question:

For nymphing I use an intermediate line.

Is that right?  On rivers as well as lakes?  Seems like line control would be a problem.  Isn’t it? – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – -Burton — L. Burton Hawley         2330 NW Hummingbird Corvallis, OR

Response:

Just my .02 cents worth. A double taper will always roll cast better because of the line structure. On a double taper you are casting (roll) a taper section(larger) vs a wt fwd which will be into running line which is smaller. Tight Loops KenW   —

A double taper will only roll cast better if you roll cast longer than the line belly. Assuming that your rod and your leader are 9ft each, the front taper including the line belly is 36 ft you are talking about a 54ft roll cast! Most trout are caught within a shorter distance. In other words: no advantage for the DT line. The real advantage is that line handling (mending) longer lines is easier and that you can turn around a DT which makes it possible to use a DT line twice as long. The best roll-casting line I found so far is the Wulff Triangle Taper with it’s 36-40ft of tapered line belly (depending on the line weight). Thomas — Thomas Urbig

Response:

I got in on this discussion rather late, so pardon me if I missed something. A double taper will only roll cast better if you roll cast longer than the line belly. Assuming that your rod and your leader are 9ft each, the front taper including the line belly is 36 ft you are talking about a 54ft roll cast! Most trout are caught within a shorter distance. In other words: no advantage for the DT line. The real advantage is that line handling (mending) longer lines is easier and that you can turn around a DT which makes it possible to use a DT line twice as long. The best roll-casting line I found so far is the Wulff Triangle Taper with it’s 36-40ft of tapered line belly (depending on the line weight).

A double-taper is a real asset if you aerialize your roll cast and combine it with a single haul.  This will make a 54′ roll cast easy even on 5 wt. rods.  To do this, you want to make a _small_ backcast so that about 4-5′ of the tip of the line hit the water next to you.   You’ll have a big loop of the line also next to you.  As soon as the last 4-5′ of line hit the water, you start the forward cast and add a single-haul. I live in the Pacific Northwest and out here, spey casting has grown in popularity dramatically.  In the winter, we get a lot of rain and the rivers swell big time, and spey casting allows us to cast a large fly much further with less effort than any other technique.  I use a 14′ 9wt two-handed rod for steelhead and salmon, and with it, 70-100′ roll casts are a breeze.  For this type of work, a double-taper line is needed.  Scientific Anglers makes a Mastery Series Spey/Salmon line that is 120′ long with a 77′ belly.  It works well, but once you get a lot of line out there, it can be more difficult to work with than a double-taper line. (If you’re not familiar with spey casting, it is swinging the rod to reposition the line to make an aerialized roll cast.  It is often done with two-handed rods but can be done with single-handed rods as well.  One of the neatest things about spey casting is that you can make very long casts without a backcast.  This has great application to anglers who don’t have boats.) Spey casting is hard to describe with words, so if you’ve never seen it, borrow or rent a video on it.  Hugh Faulkus and Derek Brown each have excellent videos. Dan

Response:

I essentially use DT’s and shooting heads. In the past few years I have cut the DT’s in two parts, glued a braided loop connector to the butts, and used only one half with a running line. I like this approach for the following three reasons: 1) I can store the other half in large coils,     so when I “reverse” the line I have a nice,      new line, instead of the portion that was      wound up tightly on the reel 2) I can swap the half DT with the shooting head,         the running line is already on the spool 3) Most of my casting is within 1/2 line (I use    long leaders, a 90′ line/2+12′ leader is     roughly 60′ away.    If you need to cast longer than that, the running     line is much better than the second half of         the DT, since it glides much better through         the guides. -Vittorio

Response:

I have WF4F line on a fly reel I received for Christmas (it is well balanced for my Adams Traveler 4 weight rod). Among other things, for my birthday, I received an extra spool for the reel.  My fishing is primarily in the Great Smoky Mountain National Park which means I fish relatively narrow mountain streams with riffles, pocket water and deep swift pools. I like the WF4F but would like some advice on what type of line (DT, ST, F/S, etc.) would be a good choice for the second spool. Any advice?

Response:

I have WF4F line on a fly reel I received for Christmas (it is well balanced for my Adams Traveler 4 weight rod). Among other things, for my birthday, I received an extra spool for the reel.  My fishing is primarily in the Great Smoky Mountain National Park which means I fish relatively narrow mountain streams with riffles, pocket water and deep swift pools. I like the WF4F but would like some advice on what type of line (DT, ST, F/S, etc.) would be a good choice for the second spool. Any advice?

Another floating line, even a double taper, would not be of any great value. Some type of fast sinking, full length line or sinktip might be nice for the deep, faster runs. Orvis makes a very fast sinking #4 line with a  4′ mini-tip. It is a full length, 80′ or more, of floating line with a 4′ section of very fast sinking line on the end. Cortland makes a weight-forward #4 line in full sinking  in a type 3 rate of sink. Not lots of sinking lines are available for the smaller sizes. On some rods, you can overline one size, particularly with sinking lines and get a few more choices. Bill Kiene Kiene’s Fly Shop Sacramento,CA,USA 800/4000FLY

Response:

A double-taper is a real asset if you aerialize your roll cast and combine it with a single haul.  This will make a 54′ roll cast easy even on 5 wt. rods.  To do this, you want to make a _small_ backcast so that about 4-5′ of the tip of the line hit the water next to you.   You’ll have a big loop of the line also next to you.  As soon as the last 4-5′ of line hit the water, you start the forward cast and add a single-haul.

What you describe is an improved roll cast for the one handed rod. This is not only a valuable technique for a 5wt, it even does the job with a 3wt (or even 1wt!). But you can make the job much easier with a WF-line. I use e.g. a 3/4 Wulff Triangle Taper for most of my fishing and with the improved roll cast or spey cast (different techniques, I know!) and a single haul I can almost cast a whole line. That is because you shoot most of the line out which is a domain of the WF line. The disadvantage is that I have to strip in my line to about the back taper of the line belly to make a good cast with the WF which is of course not necessary with the DT line. Should I mention that the Wulff Triangle Taper is really becoming my favourite?! Thomas <valuable stuff about spey casting deleted Dan

– Thomas Urbig

Response:

I have fished the Smokies  and think that a DT 4 line will roll cast much better than the WF 4 in the small confided streams of the area. Snip if you regularly fish the bigger rivers of the area then get one of the mini-sink tips. Thinking of getting one of these myself for my big river trips. Good Luck!

I agree with you completely about the DT.  It never fails to make me laugh when people say they won’t use a DT ’cause you can’t shoot them, and then when you see them cast they false cast all but about 5 feet of their line.  Ooooh, you sure made full use of that WF!  On the minitip though I’m torn.  I have one and it performs and casts very well, but It really lets me down when it comes to fishing a sculpin type fly along the bottom.  I get better depth and longer drifts with my 13 foot type IV 5 weight than with my 6 weight minitip.  For what it does do well though, the minitip is a high quality, VERY long lasting line.  It just isn’t the only sinking tip line you’ll ever need. Phil

Response:

Should I mention that the Wulff Triangle Taper is really becoming my favourite?!

It always has been mine for dry fly fishing.  For nymphing I use an intermediate line. -Burton — L. Burton Hawley         2330 NW Hummingbird Corvallis, OR

Response:

Just my .02 cents worth. A double taper will always roll cast better because of the line structure. On a double taper you are casting (roll) a taper section(larger) vs a wt fwd which will be into running line which is smaller. Tight Loops KenW   —

Response:

For nymphing I use an intermediate line. Is that right?  On rivers as well as lakes?  Seems like line control would be a problem.  Isn’t it?

Yep, I like to get deep fast and have a straight connection to the nymph.   Although my former fishing partner also used intermediates and he like to use a bow in the line as a strike detector.  Personal preference I guess.  What line control problems are you thinking about.  It worked well for us, we caught thousands of fish.  (That was before I stopped and decided to rethink my attitude and purpose re: fishing) -Burton — L. Burton Hawley       2330 NW Hummingbird Corvallis, OR

Response:

        Greg Metzler . I like the WF4F but would like some advice on what type of line (DT, ST, F/S, etc.) would be a good choice for the second spool. Any advice?

I agree with Bill, go with a sink tip.  Orvis, Cortland or Teeny jg

Response:

I have fished the Smokies  and think that a DT 4 line will roll cast much better than the WF 4 in the small confided streams of the area. This is a definite asset on all but the largest rivers. However, if you regularly fish the bigger rivers of the area then get one of the mini-sink tips. Thinking of getting one of these myself for my big river trips. Good Luck!

Response:

Question:

I’m in the market for a good 5 wt. rod and have looked at the GLoomis GL3 and IMX models.  I have not had an opportunity to cast either yet, but was wondering if people thought the IMX was worth the extra bucks. I can pick up a GL3 for $CDN 265 and the IMX for $CDN 395.  What are your thoughts? Paul Keywords:

We’d buy the GL3 for your first (good) rod. It’s tougher, it won’t cast as well but it will certainly send a 90 foot line. The IMX is more expensive and I enjoy the extra punch but I’m not sure you will notice a big difference if you havent done a lot of casting. Dennis & Geroge Altantic Fly Fishing School Brookfield NS, Canada   – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –

Response:

I’m in the market for a good 5 wt. rod and have looked at the GLoomis GL3 and IMX models.  I have not had an opportunity to cast either yet, but was wondering if people thought the IMX was worth the extra bucks. I can pick up a GL3 for $CDN 265 and the IMX for $CDN 395.  What are your thoughts? Paul Keywords:

Response:

Paul, Don’t buy without casting the rod.  And if you cast both and cannot tell the difference, well. . . .   Phone the Loomis Rep and ask how you can try out the rods.  S/he should be happy to oblige.  BTW, if you want to spend money, take a look at T&T or a Scott rod. Cheers – Erik

: I’m in the market for a good 5 wt. rod and have looked at : the GLoomis GL3 and IMX models.  I have not had an opportunity : to cast either yet, but was wondering if people thought the : IMX was worth the extra bucks. I can pick up a GL3 for $CDN 265 : and the IMX for $CDN 395.  What are your thoughts? : Paul : Keywords: — Burnaby, BC

Response: