Question:

Willi writes: Didn’t know fly fishing required discipline. I’m not a very disciplined person.

Nor am I.  <g  By "three disciplines" I mean dries, nymphs, and streamers ( I consider an emerger to by a dry and a wet to be fished like a streamer or nymph). Dave, You don’t live in Maine do you? Just found a piece of heaven there?

No, I live in the People’s Republic of Massachusetts.  I have found *several* heavens in Maine and it is the main reason (no pun intended) that I bought the RV. Dave

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1. What time of year is your favorite for fishing? 2. What time of the year provides the best fishing? My guess is that there will be some regional differences and differences depending on the species. My answers: I fish mainly in Colorado for trout. 1. Fall  2. Late prerunoff

In my corner of New England it would be: 1. June 2a. (quantity of fish) June 2b (size of fish) October George Adams "From the rockin’ of the cradle to the rollin’ of the hearse, the goin’ up was worth the comin’ down." ___Kris Kristofferson "The Pilgrim/Chapter 33"

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Forgot to add, Willi: We have *big* brookies in Maine.  The largest caught on the Rapid was 27 3/4 inches (on a #12 Goddard).  If you know where they are and what they want, 3 – 5 pounders can be common (remember the iddybiddies that Bruce H. tied at the SJ Clave?? <g)   Also, there are some landlocks that are just plain hawgs.  I took one on the Kennebec this past October that was only 22 inches long, but it had to be around 5 pounds — it was thick around the waist, not unlike me.  <g Dave

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…well, not to be a contrarian little big man, but i’ve yet to discover an unfavorite time of year for fishing the backwoods nc streams…still, to the point, imo and limited experience, the best catching is in april-may and in my birth/re-birth month of october… jeff – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – My thread on September weather has caused a debate about Fall fishing. Here’s a question for everyone. 1. What time of year is your favorite for fishing? 2. What time of the year provides the best fishing? My guess is that there will be some regional differences and differences depending on the species. My answers: I fish mainly in Colorado for trout. 1. Fall  2. Late prerunoff Willi

Response:

Forgot to add, Willi: We have *big* brookies in Maine.  The largest caught on the Rapid was 27 3/4 inches (on a #12 Goddard).  If you know where they are and what they want, 3 – 5 pounders can be common (remember the iddybiddies that Bruce H. tied at the SJ Clave?? <g)   Also, there are some landlocks that are just plain hawgs.  I took one on the Kennebec this past October that was only 22 inches long, but it had to be around 5 pounds — it was thick around the waist, not unlike me. <g Dave

For those that have not been to the Rapid River, don’t bother! I was there, courtesy of the nefarious Pirate of ROFF, earlier this year. The accomadations are paltry; the scenery pedestrian; the fishing, just so-so, and the company, well, let’s not go there… Suffice to say, the fewer people ripped off by spending their time and money on this place, the better for me and Dave…err… I mean… well…err.., the better for them all!!! <GBOSEG Danl See you there next year, Dave….

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Willi In Maine on the Rapid, it would be late May to late June.  The first main hatch has come off when the water temp hits 53 degrees.  It is usually only in the mid 60s by the end of June.  However, if it get above 70, fishing is iffy. Fall fishing would be September on the Rapid, and October on the Kennebec.  All three disciplines can be used successfully. Dave

Same as Dave – late May – early June and September for trout – June for pike – mid-summer for smallies and panfish – fall for chinook, late fall and early spring for steelhead but mid-winter as well when temps permit – mid summer for largemouth – mid summer for carp – like I said, if the water isn’t hard . . . Peter Visit The Streamer Page at http://home.cogeco.ca/~pcharles/streamers/index.html

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William Loehman wrote… 1. What time of year is your favorite for fishing?

1st choice, Late Aug. thru Sept. out west (Rockies) during hopper time. 2nd choice, Anytime out west. 3rd choice, anytime anywhere. 2. What time of the year provides the best fishing?

Anytime except during a really long hot spell in the midwest.   Joel Axelrad **DFD**

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My favorite time in this part of the Rockies is the fall…usually mid-late September and into October.

<snipped a bunch Tim,  where do you live again?  Colorado? — Warren www.geocities.com/troutbum_mt

Response:

My thread on September weather has caused a debate about Fall fishing. Here’s a question for everyone. 1. What time of year is your favorite for fishing? 2. What time of the year provides the best fishing? My guess is that there will be some regional differences and differences depending on the species. My answers: I fish mainly in Colorado for trout. 1. Fall  2. Late prerunoff

Where I live (central Idaho, in the Sawtooth Mountains) the fishing season begins in March and April for steelhead. Very unethical, but lots of fun nevertheless. Fishing is closed in May on the running water, but you can catch some nice bull trout at the inlets of lakes. June is runoff season. The specific time and duration varies wildly, depending on the snowpack and the weather. In late June and early July you can get very good cutthroat fishing, with suitably sparse salmonfly hatches. The cutthroat are moving into the headwaters to spawn. I suppose that fishing for them is unethical, as well, but so be it. This continues into August, depending on the weather. As the summer progresses the fishing becomes more problematical. The past two years have been low water, high temperature drought years. Finding the fish can be hard. They tend to be found downstream of cold-running springs and tributaries. Starting in late summer the chinook start running. We haven’t had a chinook season in Stanley for a few years, but there were a lot of them this year. The word is that we’ll have a season this year, so I’ll probably try it. Frankly, I prefer trout. Very late summer and fall is the season for the high lakes. It’s a butt-buster to get there, but often enough it’s worth it. After about the middle of October I have to travel somewhere else to fish.

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during years when there is lots of water, i like late august on a certain stream i know when the isonychias start coming off and every big trout in the stream waits for the bugs in shallow water…wahoo!!!…mostly may/june is best here under normal conditions…i love september for trips to the mountain west…the colours are best, the crisp temperatures suit my temperment and the trout are plenty active…. Eugene somewhere in ontario

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – My thread on September weather has caused a debate about Fall fishing. Here’s a question for everyone. 1. What time of year is your favorite for fishing? 2. What time of the year provides the best fishing? My guess is that there will be some regional differences and differences depending on the species. My answers: I fish mainly in Colorado for trout. 1. Fall  2. Late prerunoff Where I live (central Idaho, in the Sawtooth Mountains) the fishing season begins in March and April for steelhead. Very unethical, but lots of fun nevertheless. Fishing is closed in May on the running water, but you can catch some nice bull trout at the inlets of lakes. June is runoff season. The specific time and duration varies wildly, depending on the snowpack and the weather. In late June and early July you can get very good cutthroat fishing, with suitably sparse salmonfly hatches. The cutthroat are moving into the headwaters to spawn. I suppose that fishing for them is unethical, as well, but so be it. This continues into August, depending on the weather. As the summer progresses the fishing becomes more problematical. The past two years have been low water, high temperature drought years. Finding the fish can be hard. They tend to be found downstream of cold-running springs and tributaries. Starting in late summer the chinook start running. We haven’t had a chinook season in Stanley for a few years, but there were a lot of them this year. The word is that we’ll have a season this year, so I’ll probably try it. Frankly, I prefer trout. Very late summer and fall is the season for the high lakes. It’s a butt-buster to get there, but often enough it’s worth it. After about the middle of October I have to travel somewhere else to fish.

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during years when there is lots of water, i like late august on a certain stream i know when the isonychias start coming off

I’m bad on Latin, is there a common name for the fly? Is the hatch restricted to that given stream? and every big trout in the stream waits for the bugs in shallow water…wahoo!!!..

Nothing more fun than a hatch that moves the big fish into shallow feeding stations. Willi

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… for fishing the backwoods nc streams…best catching is in april-may

Been there.  Done it.  Concur. and in my birth/re-birth month of october…

Ditto. Ditto. Ditto. jeff

Late November through early March, I prefer NZ or Chile. Wolfgang

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1. What time of year is your favorite for fishing? 2. What time of the year provides the best fishing?

Here in Tennessee, I prefer now through the dead of winter.  I think that time provides me as good fishing as any other time…mostly because I suck so bad at it, so I don’t see a difference!  Seriously, I’d take now through February over any other time here. Bruce Thomsen

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1. What time of year is your favorite for fishing? 2. What time of the year provides the best fishing? My answer for both 1 & 2 (for trout & summer steelhead in Oregon, Washington & Idaho) is September and October.  I often wish that the conditions of early October lasted 6 mos.

Bob, I wish you’d quit telling people this.  I know we like to kid that there’s no good fishing here, but if you actively disseminate this sort of misinformation, it could cause real harm.  Some poor Floridian or Californian might spend all his hard-earned vacation money to come here when you "recommend" and miss the really good fishing in, oh, say, February. JR (who is speaking ONLY about Oregon and understands the Sept/Oct fishing in WA and ID really IS fantastic) http://www.visitid.org/   Idaho Tourism ("Great Potatoes, Tasty Destinations") http://www.tourism.wa.gov/ Washington Tourism ("A Little Trip to the Extraordinary")

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My thread on September weather has caused a debate about Fall fishing. Here’s a question for everyone. 1. What time of year is your favorite for fishing? 2. What time of the year provides the best fishing?

Well now, that is an excellent question.  Willi?  I cannot name just one time of year, because it depends so much on what major fly fishing celebrity I’m fishing with and upon which continent I am on.  Also, weather fishing bamboo or not effects the answer. One of my fondest memories is flying Lee Wolf down to Argentina in my MIG-27.  We went in October because the autumn time is so beautiful in Argentina in the fall.  It was one of HIS last seasons and he asked me to do him this little favor and of course I obliged, my good friend. My fly had become tattered from catching so many large browns (they have teeth like crocodiles down there) that I killed and field dressed a cockaburra with my Swiss army knife, given to me by my deer friend George Harvey Oswald.  I cut urine-stained fur from this female, and this natural fiber orangey-gray shade is the ONLY color and material that the fall-spawning large browns down there will hit on.  I redressed my fly. Most people don’t realize you can do this, but I have done things you can only dream about.  And you know?  On the very first cast I landed a huge hen on 11x tippet.  (Several months ago, with the decreasing diameter tippet they were making now, I predicted they would come up with this, and they did.  It is too difficult to work with for most fishermen though, we don’t recommend it for normal fishing.) Lee looked at me holding that fat trophy and he said to me "George" he said, "I think that is one of the largest, most beautiful native browns I’ve ever seen, if not a record."  As I returned the 36 lb. monster safely to her home, I noticed a look of contentment and serenity on Lee’s face that I had never noticed before.  I now knew he would die a happy man, and this journey had been worthwhile.  It must be said, fall, is my favorite time.  That is all the time I have to answer your question at this time.  Good question Willi.  We enjoyed the diversion.

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My thread on September weather has caused a debate about Fall fishing.

Good for a laugh. Missing George already are ya? Willi

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My thread on September weather has caused a debate about Fall fishing. Here’s a question for everyone. 1. What time of year is your favorite for fishing?

I like spring, because everything is headed in the "right direction".  Water is cold but getting warmer, days are getting longer, hatches are getting more heavy.  The whole world is waxing rather than waning.

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<awesome gibberish snipped aruhdean, izzat you?  Just don’t go so far into GG’s head that you can’t find your way out.  Leave a trail of bread crumbs, or something. Kevin maybe a trail of gink…

Response:

Fall fishing would be September on the Rapid, and October on the Kennebec.  All three disciplines can be used successfully.

Didn’t know fly fishing required discipline. I’m not a very disciplined person. Dave, You don’t live in Maine do you? Just found a piece of heaven there? Willi

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My favorite time in this part of the Rockies is the fall…usually mid-late September and into October. The weather is cooler, and the fish are pretty hungry before the winter. There are bwo hatches. With the water low and clear, it can be pretty technical and challenging. But, we catch fish on dries even as late as mid-October. As far as the best fishing…..usually I find it is best when the water clears just after runoff, about early July. Less technical due to the higher and faster water, but the water is still pretty cool so the fish are active. But, to be honest, we can allways seem to find times and places when the fishing will be good. Tim Lysyk – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – My thread on September weather has caused a debate about Fall fishing. Here’s a question for everyone. 1. What time of year is your favorite for fishing? 2. What time of the year provides the best fishing? My guess is that there will be some regional differences and differences depending on the species. My answers: I fish mainly in Colorado for trout. 1. Fall  2. Late prerunoff Willi

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – My thread on September weather has caused a debate about Fall fishing. Here’s a question for everyone. 1. What time of year is your favorite for fishing? 2. What time of the year provides the best fishing? My guess is that there will be some regional differences and differences depending on the species. My answers: I fish mainly in Colorado for trout. 1. Fall  2. Late prerunoff Willi

In the GWN, anytime the water isn’t hard. Peter Visit The Streamer Page at http://home.cogeco.ca/~pcharles/streamers/index.html

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Willi writes: My thread on September weather has caused a debate about Fall fishing. Here’s a question for everyone. 1. What time of year is your favorite for fishing? 2. What time of the year provides the best fishing? My guess is that there will be some regional differences and differences depending on the species. My answers: I fish mainly in Colorado for trout. 1. Fall  2. Late prerunoff Willi

In Maine on the Rapid, it would be late May to late June.  The first main hatch has come off when the water temp hits 53 degrees.  It is usually only in the mid 60s by the end of June.  However, if it get above 70, fishing is iffy. Fall fishing would be September on the Rapid, and October on the Kennebec.  All three disciplines can be used successfully. Dave

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My thread on September weather has caused a debate about Fall fishing. Here’s a question for everyone. 1. What time of year is your favorite for fishing? 2. What time of the year provides the best fishing?

1. Definitely fall (okay, indian summer) 2. For me personally? I do pretty good in pre-runoff also, usually the March Brown and/or Skwala hatch as well as streamer fishing before the melt hits. I do think that early July has some of the best fishing of the year around here (only around 3000 to 4000′ MSL). Usually, PMD’s, Green Drakes and plenty of caddis as well as reasonable thunderstorms to provide some cloud cover so it’s not just constant bright sun (man, I hate that). — Brian D. Nelson Diamond N Outfitters, Missoula, Montana www.diamondnoutfitters.com

Response:

My thread on September weather has caused a debate about Fall fishing. Here’s a question for everyone. 1. What time of year is your favorite for fishing? 2. What time of the year provides the best fishing? My guess is that there will be some regional differences and differences depending on the species. My answers: I fish mainly in Colorado for trout. 1. Fall  2. Late prerunoff Willi

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1. What time of year is your favorite for fishing? 2. What time of the year provides the best fishing?

My answer for both 1 & 2 (for trout & summer steelhead in Oregon, Washington & Idaho) is September and October.  I often wish that the conditions of early October lasted 6 mos. Bob Weinberger

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Question:

To make things interesting, well actually I just need some patterns to tie, but what are your favorite patterns for the following: 1) BWO pattern 2) Green Drake pattern 3) Caddis pattern 4) Salmon fly pattern 5) Hopper pattern 6) Nymph 7) Streamer PMD pattern Thanks, Warren

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Well here’s my list. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text —— Original Message —– Newsgroups: rec.outdoors.fishing.fly Sent: Saturday, March 17, 2001 10:58 PM To make things interesting, well actually I just need some patterns to tie, but what are your favorite patterns for the following: 1) BWO pattern   – SR2 emerger 2) Green Drake pattern – Parachute Green Drake. 3) Caddis pattern – DRY – CDC & Elk hair.  Nymph – Green rock worm. Emerger – CDC & Biot. 4) Salmon fly pattern – Improved Sofa Pillow or Stimulator. 5) Hopper pattern – Joe’s Hopper 6) Nymph – All purpose – GRHE, or PT 7) Streamer – Black Woolybugger or Wool head muddler. PMD pattern – PMD comparadun. Thanks, Warren Bob Weinberger

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Question:

Hi all, I will be in Lake Placid next week, anyone know the conditions/hatches on the west branch? Thanks! Bob

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A few of us fished it last weekend. The river was fishing rather well. In the evening there were tricos, LARGE stoneflies and small yellow stones with a few caddis. Stop into Fran Betters shop and ask what the river is doing. He is usually tying up flies to match the hatch. Paul

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi all, I will be in Lake Placid next week, anyone know the conditions/hatches on the west branch? Thanks! Bob

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Paul Goodwin writes: A few of us fished it last weekend. The river was fishing rather well. In the evening there were tricos, LARGE stoneflies and small yellow stones with a few caddis. Stop into Fran Betters shop and ask what the river is doing. He is usually tying up flies to match the hatch. Paul Hi all, I will be in Lake Placid next week, anyone know the conditions/hatches on the west branch? Thanks! Bob

Yes, the river was fishing quite well.  Took some nice browns on cream colored nymps fished deep and slow.  Some surface activity — tricos and emerging midges.  Fran Betters will sell you some flies that you do not have in your fly box.  <g Dave LaCourse

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Two report pages: http://www.ausablewulff.com/updates.html http://www.ausableriversportshop.com/conditions.htm Obviously the first is out of date, so email or call from the home page.  The second is obviously more up-to-date, but I have to comment on something interesting there.  On the ausableriversportshop.com home page, it says "…the Conditions page – it will give you an honest, accurate account of what’s happening on the river today."  Well, how honest is that?  At the top it says "Today is Friday August 11."  That is, that’s what it says for *you*, if you’re reading it today, Aug 11.  But that’s not what it says for me, because I was doing a little playing with my computer and changed the date (for a different reason).  Point being, they imply the page is updated each day, but in fact it just picks that date up from whatever the current date is set to on your computer! Regards, Jeff

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I was in Syracuse for the TU convention. I heard mixed reports on the Ausable. Some good; some not so good. Al << Hi all, I will be in Lake Placid next week, anyone know the conditions/hatches on the west branch? Thanks! Bob

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Question:

Another Lousy Day in Paradise might be a good read for him.  Another other ideas brewing out there?

Since you live where you do, may I suggest that you bring him a couple of books by Tom McGuane. I think he is a local suthor for you. One of my favorites is Outside Chance, but I understand he has a new one out that is just as good if not better. Big Dale  

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Warren, Nice story, you can learn a lot from the old timers. One of the best friends I have in my chapter of TU is 84 years old. He drives 30 miles to meetings & has lots of history to share. He builds beautiful hand made nets for our banquet that helps us make some money for our conservation projects. He came to last fall’s fishing outing & I took him under my wing. We couldn’t get to the best spots because he needs a double knee replacement but we managed to find a spot were he slid down on his butt. On the way up I took his equiptment & then helped pull him up the bank. We didn’t catch any fish but had a great time anyway. Joan Stoliar one of the owners of the  company Folstaf wading staff is involved with Project Access which builds handicapped fishing access in the Catskills. One day every spring she enlists the aid of some TU chapters & a couple of other fishing clubs to help rebuild the ramps (they sometimes get washed out during the winter). We also plant willows to help shade some of the banks. Check this site for forther info: http://www.projectaccess.com/ We are all going to need help getting down to the river when we get older (not too far down the road for me) & I hope there will be some other fisherman willing to help maintain access. Sol

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<snipped Big Dale’s recommendation Thanks for the info.  I will look into getting a copy and reading it first to see if he will enjoy it Warren X#-[

Trout Dwellers Unite! Western Conclave Guru For info: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/sp_ROFF_people/wclave/wclave.html

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Sol, You gave me an idea.  Perhaps I can buy him a year membership in FFF here in Livingston.  I have been meaning to join myself.  It would give him something to do if he isn't already a member.  I think I might offer to take him out fishing too.  We probably won't catch many fish, but I am sure that the trip will be fun anyways.  Thanks for the link, I will check it out this weekend when I have more time. Warren X#-[

Trout Dwellers Unite! Western Conclave Guru For info: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/sp_ROFF_people/wclave/wclave.html

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<snip I'm still trying to sort some things out in my head.  I don't know why this struck me as hard as it did, but I think I am going to make this a little routine.  Hopefully I will be able to give this guy something to look forward to and someone to talk to every now and then.  If that is all I can do, then I will do what I can.  Who knows, maybe it will be just the thing to keep this old guy going for a little longer or at least bring a little happiness to his life.  I only wish I could find another outlet like roff for him to participate in to help fill the vast void.

Warren, Nice gesture. I hope when your angling days are done you will find someone as thoughtful to help you through that final phase of your fishing life. Perhaps he may best be able to continue his fishing through you. What better gift could you possibly give him than the friendship of a fellow angler? Kiyu

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Listen to his stories.  Type them up.  Print 'em out.  Take some pictures of his favorite spots.  Ask to borrow some of his old photos and scan them.  Put together a little booklet of his stories along with scanned photos and have a print shop bind it up.  That'd make a nice gift. Mu

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- Hide quoted text -- Show quoted text - Warren Great post. Don't feel too sorry for the guy; just be aware that it comes to us all, if we are lucky. And for sure he is getting out there and enjoying the water and the sport in the only way still available to him. Buy the stuff if its a good deal and you can use it. Thats a way to show respect. The worst approach is to ignore him. Enuf seriousness. An alternative approach on handling this scenario it is to first scout out the situation. Then when he is crossing a field or some other exposed place, quarter in from behind. Drive your teeth into his Achilles tendon, throwing your weight to the right in a rolling motion. As he comes down, release your bight and spin out of the way, taking care to avoid his flailing kicks. Now back off and assess the situation to make sure he actually did fall to the right, in which case no repositioning is necessary ; quarter quickly in from infront and behind to the neck. Definitely reposition if he has fallen to the left. Take the best booty for yourself, its your right, but be sure to share with the rest of the group in order of their help on other hunts. Dave

Warren, Make a print out of David Snedeker's post (above) and show it to the old chap. If He has any SOH, he will probably pee his pants. It might be the best laugh he's had in ages! Tight Lines, Tony Deacon

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Warren, A few options come to mind. You could take him lake fishing; no steep banks or currents to contend with, and if you're in the right place at the right time, the fishing can be spectacular. If he's not interested in stillwaters, and you can afford the rod fees, take him to Armstrongs, or somewhere similar. Again, great fishing and much easier to navigate than the Yellowstone river. (BTW, I don't think TBone would be bugged a bit by your idea of bringing your friend a fresh-caught fish or two. In a similar situation, he'd probably do the same thing. It's a tradition as old as fishing itself.) -- Rusty Hook Laramie, Wyo Before you buy.

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<snip After three days of reading the replys, the original message finally shows up on my server.  Nice story Warren. -- Levi Trample the weak Hurdle the dead

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BTW, I don't think TBone would be bugged a bit by your idea of bringing your friend a fresh-caught fish or two.

I know.  I bet he will actually get a kick out of *me* keeping fish. Warren X#-[

Trout Dwellers Unite! Western Conclave Guru For info: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/sp_ROFF_people/wclave/wclave.html

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Today I was fishing some of the channels of the Yellowstone that I frequent.  I started fishing around 3 and stopped around 7.  When I got back to the truck and was taking off my waders an old timer pulled up and started to ask me how the fishing was.  We ended up talking for close to an hour. Seems this gentleman had fished these channels long before I was even born.  We both shared a love for these channels and think of them as favorite stretches. Needless to say,  we had a common bond despite the vast difference in years so a conversation was not difficult to keep going.   After talking to the guy for about 30 minutes I started to get kind of sad. Joe said (his name was Joe) that he had stopped fishing in the last couple of years because he was too old and couldn't get around good enough anymore.   He had to give up fly tying as well because he can't sit for long periods of time.  He still drives along the river and checks up on his favorite spots I guess just for something to do.   Or maybe it is just his way of still having some kind of contact with fly fishing.  Either way it was sad to see. It really got me to thinking  about what happens when one becomes too old to fish.  I am guessing that he is all alone because he said that he gave some of his rods to his nephews who don't fish so the rods are just sitting in a basement.  Gave me the impression that his wife and kids are deceased if he ever was even married and had kids.  This man was telling me stories about fishing this area back in the 50's and 60's and so it was quite interesting aside from the pitty factor I was feeling. We began talking about the cost of equipment and materials and how expensive things were now compared to before the increase in popularity of fly fishing. He said that he used to by custom made bamboo rods for $60 with $10 extra for modifications to the specs, ect.  Anyways, since he isn't tying anymore he said he would give me a bunch of his tying hooks and would part with some of his gear and tying materials for pretty cheap.  It wasn't that he was trying to sucker me into buying all of his stuff so he could have some pocket money, I think he just wanted to see it go to a nice home. He told me where to find him so next Friday I think I am going to pay him a visit after I get done fishing in the morning.  It was kind of funny, he said to just go to the apartment complex that he lives in and ask for "Joe the fisherman on the 3rd floor."   Since he has to buy his fish from the store now, I think I will take him a couple of fresh caught trout as a gift. I feel obliged to go and visit him, not so much to buy anything he has, but just so he can keep up on what things are like out on his old haunt.  He was really interested in what the channels are like now.  He can't go and see for himself  so he was asking me all kinds of questions.  I could tell that he loved fishing very much and loved this area just as much if not more.  At one point during the conversation I could swear that he started to get a tear in his eye. When I got home the whole event really started to sink in.  I started to think about what I am going to do when I reach the age that I can no longer participate in this "hobby" that we all love so much.  It really has me wondering what happens when you devote so much of your life to something and then get to a point that you are unable to do what you love to do  anymore.  I can only hope that I never have to face this dilema.  But if I do, I hope to that I will have someone to talk to and maybe bring me a fish once in awhile. I just wish there was something I could do like take him fishing even just once more. Warren X#-[

Trout Dwellers Unite! Western Conclave Guru For info: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/sp_ROFF_people/wclave/wclave.html

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Today I was fishing some of the channels of the Yellowstone that I frequent.  I started fishing around 3 and stopped around 7.  When I got back to the truck and was taking off my waders an old timer pulled up and started to ask me how the fishing was.  We ended up talking for close to an hour.

        (snip)         nice sentiments, warren.         the answer to the question is photography. wayno

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Warren.. Thanks for that moving story you shared.  My father, who taught me to flyfish, is now paralyzed from the waist down.  He waits for me to report on the last trip, what flies I have last tied, and what the streams were like. The streams are firmly fixed in his mind.  He knows every spot of which I speak.  My mother also reports that when he sleeps she often sees his casting arm going back and forth, and sometimes his hand making the familiar circular motion of an experienced fly tier. I like to think he is on his favorite steam or at his bench.  I suspect he is. Maybe these are things we ought to remember when we are tempted to take verbal shots at each other.  It puts it all in perspective.  It matters not what rod or reel we use, or the degree of our skill.  Let us enjoy each other and the sport we love even though every last one of us is at times a bit odd.  Let us also hope that when each of us age, which God willing we will, and then our time to depart comes, that this God in his grace provides a place to toss a fly and fish our favorite haunt.

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[snip] When I got home the whole event really started to sink in.  I started to think about what I am going to do when I reach the age that I can no longer participate in this "hobby" that we all love so much.

[snip] You’ll do what this gentleman did. You’ll find a good home for it. Paul

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Hmm….not exactly the sort of post I look for in the morning with my coffee. I mean the comics are what I read first in the newspaper, ya know? But it is the sort of thing, that to be a part of, creates a memory….john

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Today I was fishing some of the channels of the Yellowstone that I frequent.  I started fishing around 3 and stopped around 7.  When I got back to the truck and was taking off my waders an old timer pulled up and started to ask me how the fishing was.  We ended up talking for close to an hour. Seems this gentleman had fished these channels long before I was even born. We both shared a love for these channels and think of them as favorite stretches. Needless to say,  we had a common bond despite the vast difference in years so a conversation was not difficult to keep going. After talking to the guy for about 30 minutes I started to get kind of sad. Joe said (his name was Joe) that he had stopped fishing in the last couple of years because he was too old and couldn’t get around good enough anymore. He had to give up fly tying as well because he can’t sit for long periods of time. He still drives along the river and checks up on his favorite spots I guess just for something to do.   Or maybe it is just his way of still having some kind of contact with fly fishing.  Either way it was sad to see. It really got me to thinking  about what happens when one becomes too old to fish.  I am guessing that he is all alone because he said that he gave some of his rods to his nephews who don’t fish so the rods are just sitting in a basement.  Gave me the impression that his wife and kids are deceased if he ever was even married and had kids.  This man was telling me stories about fishing this area back in the 50’s and 60’s and so it was quite interesting aside from the pitty factor I was feeling. We began talking about the cost of equipment and materials and how expensive things were now compared to before the increase in popularity of fly fishing. He said that he used to by custom made bamboo rods for $60 with $10 extra for modifications to the specs, ect.  Anyways, since he isn’t tying anymore he said he would give me a bunch of his tying hooks and would part with some of his gear and tying materials for pretty cheap.  It wasn’t that he was trying to sucker me into buying all of his stuff so he could have some pocket money, I think he just wanted to see it go to a nice home. He told me where to find him so next Friday I think I am going to pay him a visit after I get done fishing in the morning.  It was kind of funny, he said to just go to the apartment complex that he lives in and ask for "Joe the fisherman on the 3rd floor."   Since he has to buy his fish from the store now, I think I will take him a couple of fresh caught trout as a gift. I feel obliged to go and visit him, not so much to buy anything he has, but just so he can keep up on what things are like out on his old haunt.  He was really interested in what the channels are like now.  He can’t go and see for himself  so he was asking me all kinds of questions.  I could tell that he loved fishing very much and loved this area just as much if not more.  At one point during the conversation I could swear that he started to get a tear in his eye. When I got home the whole event really started to sink in.  I started to think about what I am going to do when I reach the age that I can no longer participate in this "hobby" that we all love so much.  It really has me wondering what happens when you devote so much of your life to something and then get to a point that you are unable to do what you love to do  anymore. I can only hope that I never have to face this dilema.  But if I do, I hope to that I will have someone to talk to and maybe bring me a fish once in awhile. I just wish there was something I could do like take him fishing even just once more. Warren X#-[ Trout Dwellers Unite! Western Conclave Guru For info: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/sp_ROFF_people/wclave/wclave.html

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Why not spend time brinigng him along on trips while introducing some new people to th s port.

I was thinking of that and the float idea as MC suggested, but there are two problems.  The first is that he said he can’t even walk down a bank because he can’t get back up since his legs are so weak now.  Second, he can’t sit for long periods of time.  I suggested that he try some bait fishing, but I think he almost took it as an insult, although he was kind and pretended he didn’t hear.  He is pretty old and I doubt he can wade anymore even with help and the area is very rocky and slippery.  I don’t think I would like to take on the liability of taking him out like that. I guess the best I can do for now is bring him a fish every now and then (Oh god, wait until TBone hears this :-}), buy some of his gear, and tell him what things were like.  In the future, maybe a float trip when I get a boat built. Something short with lots of stops would probably be ok. I’m still trying to sort some things out in my head.  I don’t know why this struck me as hard as it did, but I think I am going to make this a little routine.  Hopefully I will be able to give this guy something to look forward to and someone to talk to every now and then.  If that is all I can do, then I will do what I can.  Who knows, maybe it will be just the thing to keep this old guy going for a little longer or at least bring a little happiness to his life.  I only wish I could find another outlet like roff for him to participate in to help fill the vast void. Maybe I can take him some books to read.  Trout Bum and Another Lousy Day in Paradise might be a good read for him.  Another other ideas brewing out there? Other than quartering him and taking all the loot that is (Thanks Dave S, I’ll let you know how it goes). Warren X#-[

Trout Dwellers Unite! Western Conclave Guru For info: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/sp_ROFF_people/wclave/wclave.html

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Buy his gear if you like it and can afford it, and take him fishing if you can.  The best bet is a boat trip. He will probably be pleased to see his gear go to somebody who will use and look after it. TL MC — "In order to achieve what is possible, one must constantly attempt the impossible" http://www.mikeconnor.de

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Why not spend time brinigng him along on trips while introducing some new people to th s port. You will accomplish 3 things, make the gentleman happy, propogate the love of the sport in others, and really get some pleasure for yourself by doing it. Regards from Montreal John Brkich

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Warren Great post. Don’t feel too sorry for the guy; just be aware that it comes to us all, if we are lucky. And for sure he is getting out there and enjoying the water and the sport in the only way still available to him. Buy the stuff if its a good deal and you can use it. Thats a way to show respect. The worst approach is to ignore him. Enuf seriousness. An alternative approach on handling this scenario it is to first scout out the situation. Then when he is crossing a field or some other exposed place, quarter in from behind. Drive your teeth into his Achilles tendon, throwing your weight to the right in a rolling motion. As he comes down, release your bight and spin out of the way, taking care to avoid his flailing kicks. Now back off and assess the situation to make sure he actually did fall to the right, in which case no repositioning is necessary ; quarter quickly in from infront and behind to the neck. Definitely reposition if he has fallen to the left. Take the best booty for yourself, its your right, but be sure to share with the rest of the group in order of their help on other hunts. Dave

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Question:

Patagonia supports many environmental groups.  I’m not sure if they support an anti hunting group, since the owner of the company is an avid fisherman himself.  I’m sure they would let you know if asked. Anyway you are correct about their products, they are the best! Forrest FlyFishingREVIEW http://www./flyfishingreview.com Does anybody know the politics of the Patagonia Corp? I read or heard something a couple of years ago that Patagonia is a financial contributor to some anti hunting groups. I have not been able to verify this information. I hope it is incorrect as Patagonia makes some of the best flyfishing and outdoor gear that I have seen but I will not use or purchase anything from groups that suppport anti hunting. Any info is appreciated. bruce

Share what you know. Learn what you don’t.

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Does anybody know the politics of the Patagonia Corp? I read or heard something a couple of years ago that Patagonia is a financial contributor to some anti hunting groups. I have not been able to verify this information. I hope it is incorrect as Patagonia makes some of the best flyfishing and outdoor gear that I have seen but I will not use or purchase anything from groups that suppport anti hunting. Any info is appreciated. bruce

No, this is definitely not true at all. The atmosphere of any company inevitably reflects the personality of owners/leaders. The Patagonia brass are a brassy bunch, that like elk hunting, whiskey bottles and a good smoke every now and then. — /* Sandy Pittendrigh                  –oO0  * http://www.nervana.montana.edu/~sandy  */

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No, this is definitely not true at all. The atmosphere of any company inevitably reflects the personality of owners/leaders. The Patagonia brass are a brassy bunch, that like elk hunting, whiskey bottles and a good smoke every now and then.

  Well, this is not definitely not true at all–if that makes any sense. Patagonia supports a number of environmental and conservation groups some of which may or may not include an anti-hunting component.  The bottom line, nevertheless, is that Patagonia, on top of making the best outdoor gear on the market, should be lauded in their continual efforts to be a corporate good citizen.  Patagonia is active in fisheries restoration (the Big Hole grayling restoration project, to name just one Montana project) and wilderness preservation, as well as promoting recycling and alternative materials usage.  Patagonia makes a commitment to annually donate a certain percentage of their profits to their various causes.  I have no qualms (even though I often can’t really afford it) buying Patagonia even if it costs a little more, because I know that they’re making an effort to have a postive impact on things like fisheries and habitat that I value.  (No, I don’;t, nor have I ever worked for the company.) Share what you know. Learn what you don’t.

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Does anybody know the politics of the Patagonia Corp? I read or heard something a couple of years ago that Patagonia is a financial contributor to some anti hunting groups. I have not been able to verify this information. I hope it is incorrect as Patagonia makes some of the best flyfishing and outdoor gear that I have seen but I will not use or purchase anything from groups that suppport anti hunting. Any info is appreciated. bruce

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Hmmm… you could ask them.   They have a web site at www.patagonia.com (who’d have figured THAT out?).   Me, I can’t afford that stuff anyway; but if I worried too much about single-issue politics of every company I did business with, it’d be a race between starving and freezing to death. .02, Joe F. who meant to boycott grapes, but never got around to it. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Does anybody know the politics of the Patagonia Corp? I read or heard something a couple of years ago that Patagonia is a financial contributor to some anti hunting groups. I have not been able to verify this information. I hope it is incorrect as Patagonia makes some of the best flyfishing and outdoor gear that I have seen but I will not use or purchase anything from groups that suppport anti hunting. Any info is appreciated. bruce

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Question:

Really nice fly shop in Schroon Lake. Friendly, helpful shopkeeper. Adirondacks is God’s country. One warning, get repellent… the blackflies are big and hungry. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I am planning a trip to New York’s Adirondacks this July and wonder if anyone had info on fishing in the area.  I have never been there but understand there are tons of rivers.  I’ll be in the Old Forge area near the Moose River (just west of Raquette Lake).  Any info on fly shops, public access to rivers and the hatches I might expect to see in late July would be appreciated. Thanks. Steve

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I am planning a trip to New York’s Adirondacks this July and wonder if anyone had info on fishing in the area.  I have never been there but understand there are tons of rivers.  I’ll be in the Old Forge area near the Moose River (just west of Raquette Lake).  Any info on fly shops, public access to rivers and the hatches I might expect to see in late July would be appreciated. Thanks. Steve

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Question:

We have 3 balloons off the back of the boat with live bait fishing for Kings.

Can anybody tell me what this means? I’m not being able to picture the balloon part. Nets? Actual balloons? Just curious–thanks. Mart

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We have 3 balloons off the back of the boat with live bait fishing for Kings. Can anybody tell me what this means? I’m not being able to picture the balloon part. Nets? Actual balloons? Just curious–thanks. Mart

Sure. He’s using partially inflated balloons as "corks" to float his live baits within a certain range of the top of the water. The balloons are easy to see and when a smoker takes the bait and runs, the balloon goes under. This is a common tactic for bass fishermen, too. They’ll attach a nice live shiner to a hook, tie a balloon a couple of feet above it and let the bass gobble the shiner and take the balloon under. Balloons also present one with a way to take advantage of wind or current. There’s also kite fishing. — Harry Krause – - – - – - – - – - – - Ignorance or Apathy?  I don’t know and I don’t care.

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Path: lobby01.news.aol.com!newstf02.news.aol.com!portc03.blue.aol.com!newsfeed.

cwix.com!4.1.16.34!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.gtei.net!wn3feed!world net.att.net!135.173.83.225!attworldnet!newsadm – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Newsgroups: rec.boats Organization: AT&T WorldNet Services Lines: 12 NNTP-Posting-Host: 12.77.208.219 X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Classic example, I’m out on Pasco #1 off Tarpon Springs, Florida today.  We have 3 balloons off the back of the boat with live bait fishing for Kings. What pulls up behind us?  Yes a Trophy, your average dimwit, amateur within inches of our balloons.  After I had a couple of choice words with the captain (retard) we pulled off to a better area….with no Trophys around and managed to bag two keeper grouper.  So you see now why I JUST LOVE TROPHYS Rob

Rob, If he were driving a Hatteras or other mega, overpriced boat, would his move have been any more acceptable?  No, of course not. I had an Ocean Alexander skipper drift into my boat that was moored and unattended.  He hit it rail to rail and neither boat sustained much damage but do I hate Ocean Alexander boats because of it?  Not hardly. Focus your anger at the novice who didn’t know what he was doing, not at his fine, quality made, very reliable, structurly sound, efficient and absolutely beautiful boat!!! Bill Landsborough "A fool finds no pleasure in understanding but delights in airing his own opinions." Proverbs 18:2

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Or even know how to put it on.

Excellent Nathan! Capt. Gary S. Colecchio West Palm Beach, Florida "Lie ? Me ? Never!  No, no, no, the truth is far too much fun !" – Captain Hook

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By the way, there is a downside to using balloons. Many of them are discarded in the water and unfortunately some sea creatures that eat jellyfish (like turtles) snarf them down and can’t digest them. They die. This used to happen with condoms, I suppose, but no turtle with a brain would go near any of those disease-laden wrappers.

Or even know how to put it on.

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Thank you. I appreciate your willingness to supply me with helpful information despite my occasional indignation at your whimsical contrarian nature. I have observed this civil trait in you repeatedly and I respect it. I think balloons and kites are beyond me, though I do like to picture showing up at my normal fishing spots with such equipment, and fastening on a fly, worm, little minnow, or kernel of corn. Mart

By the way, there is a downside to using balloons. Many of them are discarded in the water and unfortunately some sea creatures that eat jellyfish (like turtles) snarf them down and can’t digest them. They die. This used to happen with condoms, I suppose, but no turtle with a brain would go near any of those disease-laden wrappers. — Harry Krause – - – - – - – - – - – - Gee, I wonder what this key does.

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Thank you. I appreciate your willingness to supply me with helpful information despite my occasional indignation at your whimsical contrarian nature. I have observed this civil trait in you repeatedly and I respect it. I think balloons and kites are beyond me, though I do like to picture showing up at my normal fishing spots with such equipment, and fastening on a fly, worm, little minnow, or kernel of corn. Mart

Mart, Believe it or not, they even sell different sized kites to use depending on the wind conditions!  I don’t bother with kites, but I’ve been fishing with a guy who does and it works quite well. What Harry didn’t mention is you use the kite while drifting.  BTW, shore fishermen also use kites to get their bait out farther than they can cast… Depending on the direction the wind is blowing, of course.  :) Dennis

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Sure. He’s using partially inflated balloons as "corks" to float his live baits within a certain range of the top of the water… Thanks. Same idea as the little still fishing plastic/cork/wood bobbers we sometimes use up here, only bigger and inflatable? Yes. But much more visible. It’s hard to see many corks or floats out in the ocean where the waves are. Also, by only partially inflating, a part of it slides under the water easier… There’s also kite fishing. I’ll bite on the kite: real up in the air kites? Or fishing for hawks? Mart You run out a fishing kite and then attach your fishing line with a live bait on the line. The kite keeps the bait at the surface, making those friendly struggling sounds, attracting fish. But the bait also has access to the water and can breathe. It works very well for surface feeders.

Thank you. I appreciate your willingness to supply me with helpful information despite my occasional indignation at your whimsical contrarian nature. I have observed this civil trait in you repeatedly and I respect it. I think balloons and kites are beyond me, though I do like to picture showing up at my normal fishing spots with such equipment, and fastening on a fly, worm, little minnow, or kernel of corn. Mart

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Sure. He’s using partially inflated balloons as "corks" to float his live baits within a certain range of the top of the water… Thanks. Same idea as the little still fishing plastic/cork/wood bobbers we sometimes use up here, only bigger and inflatable?

Yes. But much more visible. It’s hard to see many corks or floats out in the ocean where the waves are. Also, by only partially inflating, a part of it slides under the water easier… There’s also kite fishing. I’ll bite on the kite: real up in the air kites? Or fishing for hawks? Mart

You run out a fishing kite and then attach your fishing line with a live bait on the line. The kite keeps the bait at the surface, making those friendly struggling sounds, attracting fish. But the bait also has access to the water and can breathe. It works very well for surface feeders.

Response:

Sure. He’s using partially inflated balloons as "corks" to float his live baits within a certain range of the top of the water…

Thanks. Same idea as the little still fishing plastic/cork/wood bobbers we sometimes use up here, only bigger and inflatable? There’s also kite fishing.

I’ll bite on the kite: real up in the air kites? Or fishing for hawks? Mart – - – - – - – - – - – - "One morning when the wind was from the west, Stuart put on his sailor suit and his sailor hat, took his spyglass down from the shelf, and set out for a walk, full of the joy of life and the fear of dogs."

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Classic example, I’m out on Pasco #1 off Tarpon Springs, Florida today.  We have 3 balloons off the back of the boat with live bait fishing for Kings. What pulls up behind us?  Yes a Trophy, your average dimwit, amateur within inches of our balloons.  After I had a couple of choice words with the captain (retard) we pulled off to a better area….with no Trophys around and managed to bag two keeper grouper.  So you see now why I JUST LOVE TROPHYS Rob

Maybe he wanted to transfer his flag to your boat in case his began to sink? — Harry Krause – - – - – - – - – - – - Accordion: a bagpipe with pleats.

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Classic example, I’m out on Pasco #1 off Tarpon Springs, Florida today.  We have 3 balloons off the back of the boat with live bait fishing for Kings. What pulls up behind us?  Yes a Trophy, your average dimwit, amateur within inches of our balloons.  After I had a couple of choice words with the captain (retard) we pulled off to a better area….with no Trophys around and managed to bag two keeper grouper.  So you see now why I JUST LOVE TROPHYS Rob

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Question:

Hi Group, Gretchen & I just returned from the Eugene, OR Fly Tying Expo. What a great show and bunch of people. We met some great folks from these newsgroups as well as many others not part of ROFF or ROFFT. There were about 150 fly tiers with 80 demonstrating at any given time.

I would like to have gone, but I don’t have a car at the moment. As always it’s great to be back home. I had to shovel for almost an hour to get the car OUT of the garage when we left for OR, it was sure nice to return home and not have to shovel my way back in. I guess spring is just around the corner, at least here in Montana. It was also great to see green grass and flowers in OR — a nice break from the snow.

Yeah, I think spring is here.  Just in the past couple of weeks the daytime highs have jumped from the 50’s to the 60’s.  Hatches should be on soon. -Burton — L. Burton Hawley           2330 NW Hummingbird Corvallis, OR

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Yeah, I think spring is here.  Just in the past couple of weeks the daytime highs have jumped from the 50’s to the 60’s.  Hatches should be on soon. I just now noticed a huge swarm of those little ‘flying ants’ that make bike rides so much fun.  Spring’s definitely getting close, isn’t it?

Actually on my last bike ride out in Kings Valley the other day I saw a couple of mayflies.  Eleven days of 55+ temperature and those big stones will start crawling to shore. Say Al, I noticed Billings had a record high of 75 yesterday.  Nice! -Burton — L. Burton Hawley         2330 NW Hummingbird Corvallis, OR

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Hi Group, Gretchen & I just returned from the Eugene, OR Fly Tying Expo. What a great show and bunch of people. We met some great folks from these newsgroups as well as many others not part of ROFF or ROFFT. There were about 150 fly tiers with 80 demonstrating at any given time. As always it’s great to be back home. I had to shovel for almost an hour to get the car OUT of the garage when we left for OR, it was sure nice to return home and not have to shovel my way back in. I guess spring is just around the corner, at least here in Montana. It was also great to see green grass and flowers in OR — a nice break from the snow. — Tight Lines ….. Al Beatty BT’s Fly Fishing Products http://www.btsflyfishing.com Tiemco quality hooks, under $6.00 pkg/50

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Yeah, I think spring is here.  Just in the past couple of weeks the daytime highs have jumped from the 50’s to the 60’s.  Hatches should be on soon.

I just now noticed a huge swarm of those little ‘flying ants’ that make bike rides so much fun.  Spring’s definitely getting close, isn’t it? Oh!  There’s another thread on this, but I did see a male W.Bluebird the weekend of the 8th while riding out to Oak Creek gate!  Gorgeous little things. BTW, Al, glad you enjoyed your trip.  Did you get a chance to fish at all? Dave DeLacey Corvallis, Or. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – -Burton — L. Burton Hawley           2330 NW Hummingbird Corvallis, OR

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Brrr, all this talk of shoveling snow makes me feel cold just thinking about it!! The Brown Trout season opened over here in the UK on Saturday and we had a few, just a few, hours of sunshing about mid-day. After an hour of sun a few fish remembered how to take a tiny green olive off the top..what a joy to see, it seems to have been a long dark winter. Thought it was too good to last, its been raining and a cold northerly wind has swept down from Scandinavia ever since. But the Daffodils and Primroses are showing so it won’t be long. regards…russ writes Hi Group, Gretchen & I just returned from the Eugene, OR Fly Tying Expo. What a great show and bunch of people. We met some great folks from these newsgroups as well as many others not part of ROFF or ROFFT. There were about 150 fly tiers with 80 demonstrating at any given time. As always it’s great to be back home. I had to shovel for almost an hour to get the car OUT of the garage when we left for OR, it was sure nice to return home and not have to shovel my way back in. I guess spring is just around the corner, at least here in Montana. It was also great to see green grass and flowers in OR — a nice break from the snow.

– Russell Symons M.I.P.D

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The show was very successful, and we set attendance and sales records almost across the board.  Thanks to all those who demonstrated and attended. If you have suggestions for improving the show, let me know. Sorry I couldn’t hook up with the internet crowd – too busy with the video corner and beginners corner. V.P. Conservation      | http://porky.turbonet.com/orcfff/ | Home Page Oregon Council FFF     | (USA) (503) 753-4276              | Voice-mail Top Alerts    - 97/03/01 FFF Alert: Federal Government Considers Coho’s Future    - 97/03/12 ORC Signon: HB 2003 Undermines Camp Creek Decision    - 97/03/12 FF Alert: Belly Boat Legislation (Nevada)

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Al…anything new and exciting that you saw at the show???? Barry Brown – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Group, Gretchen & I just returned from the Eugene, OR Fly Tying Expo. What a great show and bunch of people. We met some great folks from these newsgroups as well as many others not part of ROFF or ROFFT. There were about 150 fly tiers with 80 demonstrating at any given time. As always it’s great to be back home. I had to shovel for almost an hour to get the car OUT of the garage when we left for OR, it was sure nice to return home and not have to shovel my way back in. I guess spring is just around the corner, at least here in Montana. It was also great to see green grass and flowers in OR — a nice break from the snow. — Tight Lines ….. Al Beatty BT’s Fly Fishing Products http://www.btsflyfishing.com Tiemco quality hooks, under $6.00 pkg/50

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Question:

I think the biggest advantage of barbless hooks is its easier to get them out of your clothes, waders, and skin :<

drying patch, fly box and the other tunnels into the spiritual plane. TimW

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – : : Umm… Bud?  Isn’t Sedona, like, in the desert? : I don’t want to condone the spam-like message to "SAVE SEDONA" but : thought : I’d comment about the surrounding area. Sedona is about 5000′ elevation : and : to the north sits Oak Creek Canyon. The creek can produce some nice fish : (17" rainbow caught last weekend) and 18" browns caught earlier this : year. I’m amazed by this.  I’ve only been there in summer(once) and winter(once) but each time there was *so much* activity in the stream by little humans that I didn’t believe it was a viable fishing spot for anything larger than 10 inches. Is it possible you caught planted stock?  Is it possible you are engaging in the oldest fishing pastime and stretching things a wee bit? : A 10 mile drive up the canyon will put you in the largest ponderosa pine : forest : in the U.S. at about 7000′ elevation (Yes it does snow in Arizona!!!). : Living only : 30 minutes away from the creek makes it a popular after work flyfishing : spot for : me. I wasn’t putting the area down, only trying to tone down the rhetoric which follows many tourist centers:  "We have everything, and it’s great!" I love the Sedona area for what it is… a wonderful desert area fairly close to respectable (if picked clean) mountains.  The area surely has much to offer, but my limited experience suggests it is not a destination fly fishing area.  I admit, I fished the lower parts of the creek, and there, the water seemed too warm to support large fish.  (Perhaps I should fact the fact I can only catch larger fish in water I know.)  I’m surprised to learn the humans haven’t scared the fish away. —

Rick, I’m not claiming Oak Creek is place to go catch large fish on a regular basis. In fact, 8 to 10 inch fish are the norm. On those rare occasions, some larger fish can be caught.  No way as far as planted stockers go (we affectionately call those things finless wonders here in AZ). I’ve been known to stretch the truth on some occasions. This weekend (at Oak Creek) I landed a brown that I thought went 15". Actual measurement was just over 14" (using the lettering on my flyrod). Even if I was off on the other fish a 17" brown and 16" rainbow aren’t bad for Oak Creek. As far as people pressure goes you’re right. I’ve had some tough days due to the number of tourists, hikers, swimmers, etc on the creek. So I fish it real early and stay away from the campgrounds (6am – 10am I didn’t see a soul on the creek this weekend). If you ever wander through Sedona again stop by the store at Don Hoel’s cabins. They have some pictures from the 1960’s to the late 1980’s showing browns in the 21-25 inch range. There may not be alot of those big hogs in Oak Creek now-a-days but I know where a few lay. Jeff Anderson http://www.woolybugger.com

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: : Umm… Bud?  Isn’t Sedona, like, in the desert? : I don’t want to condone the spam-like message to "SAVE SEDONA" but : thought : I’d comment about the surrounding area. Sedona is about 5000′ elevation : and : to the north sits Oak Creek Canyon. The creek can produce some nice fish : (17" rainbow caught last weekend) and 18" browns caught earlier this : year. I’m amazed by this.  I’ve only been there in summer(once) and winter(once) but each time there was *so much* activity in the stream by little humans that I didn’t believe it was a viable fishing spot for anything larger than 10 inches. Is it possible you caught planted stock?  Is it possible you are engaging in the oldest fishing pastime and stretching things a wee bit? : A 10 mile drive up the canyon will put you in the largest ponderosa pine : forest : in the U.S. at about 7000′ elevation (Yes it does snow in Arizona!!!). : Living only : 30 minutes away from the creek makes it a popular after work flyfishing : spot for : me. I wasn’t putting the area down, only trying to tone down the rhetoric which follows many tourist centers:  "We have everything, and it’s great!" I love the Sedona area for what it is… a wonderful desert area fairly close to respectable (if picked clean) mountains.  The area surely has much to offer, but my limited experience suggests it is not a destination fly fishing area.  I admit, I fished the lower parts of the creek, and there, the water seemed too warm to support large fish.  (Perhaps I should fact the fact I can only catch larger fish in water I know.)  I’m surprised to learn the humans haven’t scared the fish away. — Rick T. Rick Fletcher   –   http://www.chem.uidaho.edu/~fletcher/ Associate professor of chemistry  |  That’s Idaho, not Iowa.    | ad hominem University of Idaho               |  Upper Left Hand Corner.    | ad hominem Moscow, ID 83844-2343             |  No, I don’t grow potatoes. | ad hominem

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: there, the water seemed too warm to support large fish.  (Perhaps I should : face the fact I can only catch larger fish in water I know.)  I’m : surprised to learn the humans haven’t scared the fish away. I forgot to mention the obvious: I stand corrected. — Rick T. Rick Fletcher   –   http://www.chem.uidaho.edu/~fletcher/ Associate professor of chemistry  |  That’s Idaho, not Iowa.    | ad hominem University of Idaho               |  Upper Left Hand Corner.    | ad hominem Moscow, ID 83844-2343             |  No, I don’t grow potatoes. | ad hominem

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: there, the water seemed too warm to support large fish.  (Perhaps I should : face the fact I can only catch larger fish in water I know.)  I’m : surprised to learn the humans haven’t scared the fish away. I forgot to mention the obvious: I stand corrected.

and those neoprenes show every bulge too… ohhh…COrected…! My mistake ! TimW

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – : : Umm… Bud?  Isn’t Sedona, like, in the desert? : I don’t want to condone the spam-like message to "SAVE SEDONA" but : thought : I’d comment about the surrounding area. Sedona is about 5000′ elevation : and : to the north sits Oak Creek Canyon. The creek can produce some nice fish : (17" rainbow caught last weekend) and 18" browns caught earlier this : year. I’m amazed by this.  I’ve only been there in summer(once) and winter(once) but each time there was *so much* activity in the stream by little humans that I didn’t believe it was a viable fishing spot for anything larger than 10 inches. Is it possible you caught planted stock?  Is it possible you are engaging in the oldest fishing pastime and stretching things a wee bit?

Is it possible you were huffin’ some Sedona Red ? TimW

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Umm… Bud?  Isn’t Sedona, like, in the desert?

I don’t want to condone the spam-like message to "SAVE SEDONA" but thought I’d comment about the surrounding area. Sedona is about 5000′ elevation and to the north sits Oak Creek Canyon. The creek can produce some nice fish (17" rainbow caught last weekend) and 18" browns caught earlier this year. A 10 mile drive up the canyon will put you in the largest ponderosa pine forest in the U.S. at about 7000′ elevation (Yes it does snow in Arizona!!!). Living only 30 minutes away from the creek makes it a popular after work flyfishing spot for me. That’s my 2cents worth. Jeff Anderson http://www.woolybugger.com

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Umm… Bud?  Isn’t Sedona, like, in the desert?<

Yee who doesn’t know shouldn’t open his mouth.  Seeing is believing. dp

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: !!! SAVE SEDONA !!! : HELP US SAVE SEDONA : If you support Fishing Opportunities, Umm… Bud?  Isn’t Sedona, like, in the desert? — Rick T. Rick Fletcher   –   http://www.chem.uidaho.edu/~fletcher/ Associate professor of chemistry  |  That’s Idaho, not Iowa.    | ad hominem University of Idaho               |  Upper Left Hand Corner.    | ad hominem Moscow, ID 83844-2343             |  No, I don’t grow potatoes. | ad hominem

Rick, Visit Sedona someday and you will find a lovely little desert town with a very nice river running through it (to borrow a phrase).   Besides, anyone who lives in "Moscow" should not cast stones at other places.   Dave — Dave http://avery.med.virginia.edu/~dcb/home.html David C. Benjamin, Ph.D., Professor               Office (804) 924-2631 Beirne B. Carter Center for Immunology Research   Lab    (804) 982-1679 MR4 Box 4012, University of Virginia Health       FAX    (804) 924-1221 Sciences Center, Charlottesville, VA 22908        Email

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: !!! SAVE SEDONA !!! : HELP US SAVE SEDONA : If you support Fishing Opportunities, Umm… Bud?  Isn’t Sedona, like, in the desert?   — Rick T. Rick Fletcher   –   http://www.chem.uidaho.edu/~fletcher/ Associate professor of chemistry  |  That’s Idaho, not Iowa.    | ad hominem University of Idaho               |  Upper Left Hand Corner.    | ad hominem Moscow, ID 83844-2343             |  No, I don’t grow potatoes. | ad hominem

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!!! SAVE SEDONA !!! Thank you for taking the time to read my post … I REALLY NEED YOUR HELP! My name is Rama and I am the owner of the only REAL bikeshop (Mountain Bike Heaven) in Sedona AZ and I need your help! The local Forest Service folks are having their final meeting at 9AM tomorrow morning (9/4) to accept final public input on the new management plan =93Ideas for the Future=94. One of the proposals included in the =93Ideas for the Future=94 are more lands trades within our surrounding area.  Here=92s the way it works, the Forest Service gives a chunk of our local Forest to a developer and the developer hands them cash and a deed to some unknown piece of land.  Of course, the Forest Service always tells us these =93deals=94 are always for the =93best interests=94 of all concerned parties.   The problem is they (USFS) keep trading away all our local hiking, biking, equestrian and nature opportunities. WE DONT NEED ANY MORE DEVELOPMENT! Our local infrastructure is already at the boiling point trying to cope with too much growth: no sewers, no roads, no phones … HELP US SAVE THE FORESTS! HELP US SAVE SEDONA If you support Hiking Opportunities, If you support Biking Opportunities, If you support Camping Opportunities, If you support Climbing Opportunites, If you support Fishing Opportunities, If you support Equestrian Opportunities, If you support any Outdoor Opportunity, If you like Sedona, If you like Arizona If you like the Forest, If you like Nature … Write your own letter or copy and mail the passage below.  I will take your email to the meeting tomorrow and we will show the Forest Service that we don=92t want anymore land trades.  Thanks for your help. Dear Forest Service Folks, I am opposed to ALL land trades in and around the Sedona area.  Please register my opinion and take it into consideration as you construct your =93Ideas for the Future=94 …         Name …         Age …         State …         City …         Country … Thanks for your Support!   Thanks for your help! RAMA BTW … when you=92re in Sedona stop by my shop "Mountain Bike Heaven" in West Sedona and say Hi! If I have some time maybe we can go for a ride. Wait, I have regularly scheduled FREE group rides on Wed, Sat and Sun — I can always ride then … Have Fun! is at http://www.ibike.com/mountainbikeheaven/index.htm

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Question:

Any info on possibilities of small lake or stream fishing here. I have heard there’s some bass possibilities here.

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There are lots of ponds with LM and Peacock bass in them.  I’ve personally only caught them on a spinning rod, but there’s no reason they wouldn’t take flies.  There may be some bass or other interesting creatures in the larger streams.  There sure are a lot of them on Kauai, and there are some nice flats areas that ought to be fishable for Ulua (Trevally) and their younger brothers, Papio.–Crashjibe

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Only stream fishing when i was there ran through Kokee State Park.  Purely "put & take" trout.  Definite for Peacock.  Don’t expect to find ANY gear there, though.

I fished some of the freshwater reservoirs in cane fields (get a permit…they’re free from the sugar co.). Largemouth and peacock a’plenty *:) I thought I remember reading where Kokee has a very short fishing season….did I remember right?

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