Question:

And if you look up the word "gink" in the dictionary, you will find it means "peculiar fellow".  PecuLIAR fits to a tee.

The Dictionary.com definition is (look it up if you don’t believe me): "A man, especially one regarded as foolish or contemptible." That’s about right, I’d say. –Steve

Response:

 Gink, is a trademarked word.  You have made a serious error. Edited typing error:  mad = made All’s Fair With Fur or Feather gg

Response:

No, as a matter of fact. All’s Fair With Fur or Feather gg

Response:

gink, is a trademarked word.  You have mad a serious error. He doesn’t get "mad". He gets "stabby"…

Splork!

Response:

Gink, is a trademarked word.  You have made a serious error.

Sounds like trouble in River City! to gink or not to gink, is that the question?

Response:

to gink or not to gink, is that the question?

http://www.emerchandise.com/images/p/WUB/pdBKWUB0015.jpg — Charlie…

Response:

Welcome back George.  I have always read your post and find them interesting. Things have been pretty dull without you. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I regard Bates book on streamers a George Gehrke

Response:

Thank you BJ.  I’m sitting here in Key West with nothing much to do, on business so I have a little time to write.  I’ll be going to Marathon tomorrow over the key bridges.  I might consider taking a little time off to hunt some permit or bone fish. Anyhow, thank you again, George Gehrke All’s Fair With Fur or Feather gg

Response:

to gink or not to gink, is that the question? http://www.emerchandise.com/images/p/WUB/pdBKWUB0015.jpg — Charlie…

LOL Dr. Suess can’t be wrong!

Response:

Steve writes: to gink or not to gink, is that the question? http://www.emerchandise.com/images/p/WUB/pdBKWUB0015.jpg — Charlie… LOL Dr. Suess can’t be wrong!

And if you look up the word "gink" in the dictionary, you will find it means "peculiar fellow".  PecuLIAR fits to a tee.   Dave

Response:

Hi George, Have you seen Norm Norlander tie at one of the shows?  He is pretty wild with that vise. I told him if he came to my shop and tied every day, boy we could sell some vises. — Bill Kiene Kiene’s Fly Shop http://www.kiene.com 800/4000FLY USA toll free

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I regard Bates book on streamers a classic for modern times mainly because the materials are logged accurately.  I find myself going back to Bates tying instructions more and more since I purchased the NOR Vise because with it, the materials are spun better and the shapes are well honed due to this rotary’s smooth nature.  Self control can’t be better. Somehow, I enjoy the names of such streamers as "The Black Nosed Dace, The Alaskan Mary Ann, or the classic Mickey Finn," which are explained in perfect detail without being bastardized by modern short cuts or tying techniques which can have a half dozen or more un-original opinions on how to tie the classics.  It’s sacrilege and the new versions of such flies changed in print really makes the art of fly tying these classics a polluted sport. Now, don’t misunderstand me between what I like and dislike when it comes to relieving fly tying material pressures upon the creatures of our realm.  For instance, there just isn’t enough Polar Bears to go around to supply the fur to tie enough Alaskan Mary Ann’s should the Streamer Fly Fishing Public rediscover just how deadly a fly this old mainstay is.  Besides being beautiful just to look at, The Alaskan Mary Ann isn’t known very well today.  If it wasn’t for the fact that the majority of today’s fly fishermen are just as happy to use an artificial substitute to replace the iridescent qualities of Polar Bear Hair, it wouldn’t be a good idea to state this flies praises. Consider, for instance, that one has to kill one, very large, very wild, very remote living, very uncooperative, animal that wants to do just one thing.  Eat you! Is it any wonder that any of us (self included)should be able to figure something else out jus to tie ONE FLY out of one very unusual hide?  The price is just too, too much. However!  Some of us still have some Polar Bear from over fifty years ago and with us, the original Alaskan Mary Ann still lives, via Bates’ versions taken directly from his wonderful classic. Polar Bear is a very difficult fur to duplicate artificially because some of it has a certain gold tinge to it.  I’ve been able to duplicate that in the series of fly tying materials we manufacture. Blending colors can only be best done if you have a sample (and it must be a good sample) from the past.  That said, there are some people in this world who have fly samples tied by Bates and his signature of a fly can be a treasure beyond words.  Rarely is this possible. Whenever I can, I like getting a fly tied by someone who’s tying signature I admire and respect.  Today’s Masters,  such as Dan Byford of Zonker fame is possibly the finest, individual tier I’ve known in my lifetime, along with Dave Whitlock and unsung to most, is the fact that Ernest Schwiebert has magic, artistic hands, when it comes to duplicating that which he loves most and knows most of, entomology beyond your wildest dreams.  What a talent!  I could go on about those who know how to best tie specific flies they have dedicated their lives explaining such as Doug Swisher, for example.  We are blessed by books.  Frankly, in my opinion, fly fishing in America in the last fifty years has produced some of the finest minds ever to enter and entertain the sport.  Some, who still are alive and ongoing to this day are heads and shoulders with such greats of our past as the same individual that gave us "The Quill Gordon". To become a fly fisherman and to be known "as a fly fisherman" is not a gift that is just handed to us.  It requires work and if not years of work, for some its a lifetime of study and dedication.  If any of us thought we knew it all, most would stop fly fishing for it would then become boring, would it not? My life as a fly fisherman is a world in which I’m surrounded by books. Most often I’m afield and learning by doing.  Sometimes, I will sit down and write a short article so as to give back a little of what I’ve learned, if just a wit, a little of that cloak which surrounds me . . . which is my life. So it is, I am in Key West wondering why I’m here without a fly rod? Sometimes we go brain dead and annoy ourselves at the glee of others. George Gehrke

Response:

I regard Bates book on streamers a classic for modern times mainly because the materials are logged accurately.  I find myself going back to Bates tying instructions more and more since I purchased the NOR Vise because with it, the materials are spun better and the shapes are well honed due to this rotary’s smooth nature.  Self control can’t be better. Somehow, I enjoy the names of such streamers as "The Black Nosed Dace, The Alaskan Mary Ann, or the classic Mickey Finn," which are explained in perfect detail without being bastardized by modern short cuts or tying techniques which can have a half dozen or more un-original opinions on how to tie the classics.  It’s sacrilege and the new versions of such flies changed in print really makes the art of fly tying these classics a polluted sport. Now, don’t misunderstand me between what I like and dislike when it comes to relieving fly tying material pressures upon the creatures of our realm.  For instance, there just isn’t enough Polar Bears to go around to supply the fur to tie enough Alaskan Mary Ann’s should the Streamer Fly Fishing Public rediscover just how deadly a fly this old mainstay is.  Besides being beautiful just to look at, The Alaskan Mary Ann isn’t known very well today.  If it wasn’t for the fact that the majority of today’s fly fishermen are just as happy to use an artificial substitute to replace the iridescent qualities of Polar Bear Hair, it wouldn’t be a good idea to state this flies praises. Consider, for instance, that one has to kill one, very large, very wild, very remote living, very uncooperative, animal that wants to do just one thing.  Eat you! Is it any wonder that any of us (self included)should be able to figure something else out jus to tie ONE FLY out of one very unusual hide?  The price is just too, too much. However!  Some of us still have some Polar Bear from over fifty years ago and with us, the original Alaskan Mary Ann still lives, via Bates’ versions taken directly from his wonderful classic. Polar Bear is a very difficult fur to duplicate artificially because some of it has a certain gold tinge to it.  I’ve been able to duplicate that in the series of fly tying materials we manufacture. Blending colors can only be best done if you have a sample (and it must be a good sample) from the past.  That said, there are some people in this world who have fly samples tied by Bates and his signature of a fly can be a treasure beyond words.  Rarely is this possible. Whenever I can, I like getting a fly tied by someone who’s tying signature I admire and respect.  Today’s Masters,  such as Dan Byford of Zonker fame is possibly the finest, individual tier I’ve known in my lifetime, along with Dave Whitlock and unsung to most, is the fact that Ernest Schwiebert has magic, artistic hands, when it comes to duplicating that which he loves most and knows most of, entomology beyond your wildest dreams.  What a talent!  I could go on about those who know how to best tie specific flies they have dedicated their lives explaining such as Doug Swisher, for example.  We are blessed by books.  Frankly, in my opinion, fly fishing in America in the last fifty years has produced some of the finest minds ever to enter and entertain the sport.  Some, who still are alive and ongoing to this day are heads and shoulders with such greats of our past as the same individual that gave us "The Quill Gordon". To become a fly fisherman and to be known "as a fly fisherman" is not a gift that is just handed to us.  It requires work and if not years of work, for some its a lifetime of study and dedication.  If any of us thought we knew it all, most would stop fly fishing for it would then become boring, would it not? My life as a fly fisherman is a world in which I’m surrounded by books. Most often I’m afield and learning by doing.  Sometimes, I will sit down and write a short article so as to give back a little of what I’ve learned, if just a wit, a little of that cloak which surrounds me . . . which is my life. So it is, I am in Key West wondering why I’m here without a fly rod? Sometimes we go brain dead and annoy ourselves at the glee of others. George Gehrke

Response:

gink, is a trademarked word.  You have mad a serious error.

Pissed off a Muppet? — Charlie…

Response:

Gehrke wrote (I think): Some, who still are alive and ongoing to this day are heads and shoulders with such greats of our past as the same individual that gave us "The Quill Gordon".

Ah…Theodore Gordon.  Articulate, knowledgeable, a pleasure to read his notes and letters even after almost 100 years. Of course, he DID tend to fish with more than one fly on the line at a time.  

Response:

gink, is a trademarked word.  You have mad a serious error.

He doesn’t get "mad". He gets "stabby"…

Response:

Besides being beautiful just to look at, The Alaskan Mary Ann isn’t known very well today.  If it wasn’t for the fact that the majority of today’s fly fishermen are just as happy to use an artificial substitute to replace the iridescent qualities of Polar Bear Hair, it wouldn’t be a good idea to state this flies praises.

Sure it would be proper, almost, even close to prefeckion, to state, or even to sing the praises of just such a fly’s if it weren’t for the fact that the iridescent qualities of your writings are standing kneecaps and testicles with the giants who, for way of example, gave us "Natural Born Killers," and the song from the Brady Bunch or thought Clint Eastwood could (or should) sing….you know, the "classics." Sometimes we go brain dead and annoy ourselves at the glee of others.

Uh-huh…you, Prince Charles and Camilla, I suppose… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -George Gehrke

Response:

[snip] Sometimes we go brain dead and annoy ourselves at the glee of others. George Gehrke

SOMETIMES?

Response:

gink, is a trademarked word.  You have mad a serious error. Mr. George Gehrke All’s Fair With Fur or Feather gg

Response:

gink, is a trademarked word.  You have mad a serious error.

Me mad… never. I’m quite easy going. However, Go blow it up your arse. Note the live/dead indications from the US Patent and trademark data base: Word Mark GINK Goods and Services IC 028. US 022 023 038 050. G & S: dolls. FIRST USE: 19971101. FIRST USE IN COMMERCE: 19971101 Mark Drawing Code (1) TYPED DRAWING Serial Number 75234905 Filing Date February 3, 1997 Filed ITU FILED AS ITU Published for Opposition November 4, 1997 Registration Number 2219512 Registration Date January 19, 1999 Owner (REGISTRANT) JIM HENSON COMPANY, INC., THE CORPORATION NEW YORK 117 EAST 69 ST. NEW YORK NEW YORK 10024 Assignment Recorded ASSIGNMENT RECORDED Attorney of Record LAWRENCE E APOLZON Type of Mark TRADEMARK Register PRINCIPAL Live/Dead Indicator LIVE Word Mark GINK Goods and Services (CANCELLED) IC 028. US 022. G & S: FLY FLOATANT (FLY DRESSING USED IN FLY FISHING). FIRST USE: 19730000. FIRST USE IN COMMERCE: 19730301 Mark Drawing Code (1) TYPED DRAWING Serial Number 73808656 Filing Date June 23, 1989 Published for Opposition November 14, 1989 Registration Number 1763001 Registration Date April 6, 1993 Owner (REGISTRANT) GEHRKE, GEORGE E. INDIVIDUAL UNITED STATES DRAWER 705 HAMILTON MONTANA 59840 Attorney of Record WILLIAM E. WEST Prior Registrations 1110612;1253453 Type of Mark TRADEMARK Register PRINCIPAL Live/Dead Indicator DEAD Cancellation Date October 11, 1999 Word Mark G GINK Goods and Services (EXPIRED) IC 001. US 006. G & S: Fly Floatant (Fly Dressing Used in Fly Fishing). FIRST USE: 19730301. FIRST USE IN COMMERCE: 19730301 Mark Drawing Code (3) DESIGN PLUS WORDS, LETTERS, AND/OR NUMBERS Design Search Code 260111 260117 Serial Number 73344349 Filing Date February 2, 1982 Published for Opposition July 19, 1983 Registration Number 1253453 Registration Date October 11, 1983 Owner (REGISTRANT) Gehrke; George E. d.b.a. Gehrke Enterprises INDIVIDUAL UNITED STATES Holman Rd. & County Rd. 120 Salida COLORADO 81201 Attorney of Record Cathy A. Ptolemy Type of Mark TRADEMARK Register PRINCIPAL Live/Dead Indicator DEAD Word Mark GEHRKE’S GINK Goods and Services (CANCELLED) IC 028. G & S: NO GOODS/SERVICES STATEMENT ON TRAM Mark Drawing Code (1) TYPED DRAWING Serial Number 81021616 Filing Date 0000 Registration Number 1021616 Registration Date September 30, 1975 Owner (REGISTRANT) Fly Fisherman’s Bookcase, Inc., The UNKNOWN Croton-on-Hudson NEW YORK Register PRINCIPAL Live/Dead Indicator DEAD Cancellation Date February 23, 1982

Response:

Question:

btw, here in nc, we call it the sidearm, m*****f*****g rhodo cast.

hee hee hee.  OK honest show of hands, who’s finally ripped off a rhodo branch that was getting in their way?? Regards, Jeff

Response:

Guilty! Cut it off, walk away and hope it doesn’t grow back before you return.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – btw, here in nc, we call it the sidearm, m*****f*****g rhodo cast. hee hee hee.  OK honest show of hands, who’s finally ripped off a rhodo branch that was getting in their way?? Regards, Jeff

Response:

Yea, I do that all the time.. it’s, uhh, on purpose, yea that’s it.. It’s amazing how well this works.. if I only had the ability to do this at will. My errant cast strung like a close line along the willows. I tried flipping the line off the willows and in the process, the fly dropped into the lie, the fish took, jumped the log and brok

– -Mark  –  Particle Salad/ Noom Room Studio  http://home.earthlink.net/~psalad  mp3 songs:  http://www.mp3.com/particlesalad

Response:

Some times we have to let the fish win — NOT!  Next time out, try a well weighted Dupont spinner.  Works every time.                     Frank Reid P.S. For those unfamiliar with the vernacular, a Dupont spinner is so-named because the pricipal manufacturer is the Dupont explosives division.  One can normally be obtained from "Crazy Lefty," the guy that works in the explosives bunker at your neighborhood rock quary for a small price. Warning:  an overuse of false casting while using one may be hazardous to your health. sportsmanship snipped – – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – The fish is still there, I still try for it, but I think that’s the closest I’m going to get.

Response:

I first noticed it out of the corner of my eye, a dimple under some overhanging willows. <good story snipped

Ah, the old willow cast.   Thanks for a good one. Joe F.

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I first noticed it out of the corner of my eye, a dimple under some overhanging willows. Looking closer, I saw the steady, patterned rise of a fish.  I moved into position down and across from the fish and surveyed the situation. The fish was feeding in some very shallow water and was protected by dense willows above and a log protruding from the bank just upstream from his lie. I thought that maybe a side arm cast would keep the fly low enough to clear the willows and somehow land in the small slow water feeding area behind the log. I cast, snagged the willow, broke off my fly and put down the fish. Each time there were surface feeding fish about, I would find this fish methodically sipping in his hole. For awhile, I tried to come up with something new each time I passed his lie. I tried downstream casts, but the current would either push my fly past the small area where he fed or pile it up and snag the log. During hopper season, I tried skipping a hopper into his lie but caught willows and bark. I tried my crude imitations of pile casts and curve casts but the drift would never bring the fly into his feeding lane. I bushwhacked through the thick willows on the bank where he fed, hoping to try dapping, but long before I got into position, he was put down. When I reached out to extricate the flies I had lost in the willows from my past futile attempts, I was tempted to do some trimming but that didn’t seem too sporting. I had tried everything I could think of to get a fly to this fish. I probably could have somehow swung a streamer or nymph under the log and taken the fish, but it was a consistent, steady surface feeder and I was determined to meet it on these terms. I felt the side arm cast I first tried came the closest to getting the fly where it needed to be. Each time I passed its lie I would give it a shot. I mostly caught willows, but once in a while I would get a cast in where it belonged but the current always grabbed the tippet, dragged the fly and put down the fish. After each failure, I would go upstream to a shallow run to catch a couple easy fish to appease myself. One day, after fishing the run and getting ready to head home, I looked downstream noticed the fish was again rising. I was probably 40 feet away. I have trouble hitting an area the size of a Buick at this distance, much less one the size of a pie pan lying under some willows, but what the hell, one last cast. I hauled my three weight and let a cast go. My errant cast strung like a close line along the willows. I tried flipping the line off the willows and in the process, the fly dropped into the lie, the fish took, jumped the log and broke me off. The fish is still there, I still try for it, but I think that’s the closest I’m going to get. Willi

a nice read…thanks.  btw, here in nc, we call it the sidearm, m*****f*****g rhodo cast. to make it even more challenging, as if the bizarre twists of the branches and leaves aren’t enough, at certain times of the year, the rhodos have a sticky substance at the flower heads of the branches which is stronger than any commercial glue.  put your fly or leader in it and it’s generally easier just to cut the tippet. jeff

Response:

I first noticed it out of the corner of my eye, a dimple under some overhanging willows. Looking closer, I saw the steady, patterned rise of a fish.  I moved into position down and across from the fish and surveyed the situation. The fish was feeding in some very shallow water and was protected by dense willows above and a log protruding from the bank just upstream from his lie. I thought that maybe a side arm cast would keep the fly low enough to clear the willows and somehow land in the small slow water feeding area behind the log. I cast, snagged the willow, broke off my fly and put down the fish. Each time there were surface feeding fish about, I would find this fish methodically sipping in his hole. For awhile, I tried to come up with something new each time I passed his lie. I tried downstream casts, but the current would either push my fly past the small area where he fed or pile it up and snag the log. During hopper season, I tried skipping a hopper into his lie but caught willows and bark. I tried my crude imitations of pile casts and curve casts but the drift would never bring the fly into his feeding lane. I bushwhacked through the thick willows on the bank where he fed, hoping to try dapping, but long before I got into position, he was put down. When I reached out to extricate the flies I had lost in the willows from my past futile attempts, I was tempted to do some trimming but that didn’t seem too sporting. I had tried everything I could think of to get a fly to this fish. I probably could have somehow swung a streamer or nymph under the log and taken the fish, but it was a consistent, steady surface feeder and I was determined to meet it on these terms. I felt the side arm cast I first tried came the closest to getting the fly where it needed to be. Each time I passed its lie I would give it a shot. I mostly caught willows, but once in a while I would get a cast in where it belonged but the current always grabbed the tippet, dragged the fly and put down the fish. After each failure, I would go upstream to a shallow run to catch a couple easy fish to appease myself. One day, after fishing the run and getting ready to head home, I looked downstream noticed the fish was again rising. I was probably 40 feet away. I have trouble hitting an area the size of a Buick at this distance, much less one the size of a pie pan lying under some willows, but what the hell, one last cast. I hauled my three weight and let a cast go. My errant cast strung like a close line along the willows. I tried flipping the line off the willows and in the process, the fly dropped into the lie, the fish took, jumped the log and broke me off. The fish is still there, I still try for it, but I think that’s the closest I’m going to get. Willi

Response:

Question:

Bob, Great stuff, loved the mental picture of you thanking the fish! David

(rest of great tale snipped) – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –   I paused just long enough to thank the fish for contributing to my initiation into this odd fellowship, and sent it back to foraging.

Response:

Hi Bob – Great report! Brings to me memories of my first trout in Montana almost thirty years ago from the same area. It was caught on a spinning rig, but that in no way reduced the thrill for me. The trout jumped and put up a good fight, and though it was only a small fish, what a gas it was. Thanks for the report and rekindling those precious moments, and here’s to many more of the same for you -Charlie Miller

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – A week and a half ago, I had a business trip that took me to Billings, MT for about a week.  Not wanting to squander an opportunity, I packed snip Bob Card

Response:

Bob, Great story.  The neat thing about fly fishing is not necessarily catching the fish.  It’s the experience being outdoors and just living the moment. Catching a fish is always a rush though no matter what big or little (although there’s a little more adrenlin with a larger fish). Also, trust your own instincts on picking out flies. I fished Henry’s Fork in Idaho last summer and must of bought $50 worth of flies that were recommended to me and overall didn’t have much success. I picked out a renegade fly on my own and that one worked!  I couldn’t match the hatch but I could match the catch! Regards, Eric

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – A week and a half ago, I had a business trip that took me to Billings, MT for about a week.  Not wanting to squander an opportunity, I packed the most basic of my fly-flinging gear, and set out with high hopes, trying to keep in mind all that I’ve gleaned from your exchanges in the past several months. With a couple days of "free" time, I did a little advance scouting, visited the local fly guy, and developed a plan.  I left early Sunday morning, driving through Red Lodge, and out to the spots on the West Fork (Rock Creek) that were suggested to me as starting places.  Brief version: lots of walking, lots of casting, a few that actually looked and felt right, and a wonderful morning of enjoying sun, trees, water, and recharging.  after a few hours of "casting practice", floating elk hair caddis and parachute adams into and through "fishy" spots, I finally felt a tug when a small trout grabbed the fly downstream just before I was to cast it.  Before I could do anything about it, he (or she) declined the fight, and disengaged from the hook, on which I had pinched the barb. I drove downstream a bit, fished several other spots, and then moved northwestward, back toward I-90.  Stopping along the way, I cast in a few places on the Stillwater, with no bites (that I noticed).  With darkness closing, I headed back to Billings for some dinner and rest before another day of work. Monday afternoon, I charged westward again, to Columbus and a small fly shop not far from the freeway.  The animated woman deftly tying small adams with pink indicators quickly steered me away from the hoppers I was eyeing, and recommended some blonde humpies, and a couple of larger patterns with bright yellow hues.  She also gave me a good idea for a place to walk in and find some spots that I would surely have to myself. Taking her advice, I collected the flies, and headed out to the access point, which I had actually found and tried the day before (with no success, of course).  Wading upstream, I cast to every spot that looked fishy, and many that did not, using first the small caddis with yellow underside and then the larger blonde humpy.  Finally, I watched in amazement as the fly disappeared in a swirl.  Somehow maintaining sanity, I waited the merest of moments before lightly tugging the rod and feeling the charge of energy from the other end of the line.  The fight (if you can call it that) was brief, the fish was small and unremarkable, except for the remarkable fact that it was the first fish I had convinced to scarf up a fly and stay connected long enough to come face to face with me.  I paused just long enough to thank the fish for contributing to my initiation into this odd fellowship, and sent it back to foraging.  Further casting resulted only in more practice so, again with darkness closing, I walked back to the car and headed back to the city.  I sat with my jeans still soaked to the knees and ate in the Mackenzie River Pizza Company in Billings, rewarding myself with a slice of raspberry cheesecake. From some perspectives, not a spectacular tale of fishing.  However, for a new initiate, a most memorable outing indeed.  Some things I learned: 1. With free advice, you get what you pay for.  Purchasing some flies, floatant, leaders, or other minor necessities, a rapport can often be established with the local pusher which may result in a more successful effort. 2. A topographical map, such as the state atlas/gazeteer published by Delorme can be very helpful indeed. 3. (learned before, but frequently forgotten) sometimes not catching fish is a good day fishing. Thanks, all for the continued comments, debate, humor, etc. that make this place such a good place in which to hang. Bob Card

Response:

<excellent trip report snipped Congratulations Bob and thanks for the great story.  One little bit of advice though…..next time throw in a line or two about your own impeccable taste in intoxicating beverages and a few disparaging comments on the so-called taste of your brethren.  This always jazzes up a story nicely!

Response:

Nice post Bob, Keep it up and soon you won’t be able to count em : ) I personally just lie to myself either way. Tim Apple

Response:

A week and a half ago, I had a business trip that took me to Billings, MT for about a week.  Not wanting to squander an opportunity, I packed the most basic of my fly-flinging gear, and set out with high hopes, trying to keep in mind all that I’ve gleaned from your exchanges in the past several months. With a couple days of "free" time, I did a little advance scouting, visited the local fly guy, and developed a plan.  I left early Sunday morning, driving through Red Lodge, and out to the spots on the West Fork (Rock Creek) that were suggested to me as starting places.  Brief version: lots of walking, lots of casting, a few that actually looked and felt right, and a wonderful morning of enjoying sun, trees, water, and recharging.  after a few hours of "casting practice", floating elk hair caddis and parachute adams into and through "fishy" spots, I finally felt a tug when a small trout grabbed the fly downstream just before I was to cast it.  Before I could do anything about it, he (or she) declined the fight, and disengaged from the hook, on which I had pinched the barb. I drove downstream a bit, fished several other spots, and then moved northwestward, back toward I-90.  Stopping along the way, I cast in a few places on the Stillwater, with no bites (that I noticed).  With darkness closing, I headed back to Billings for some dinner and rest before another day of work. Monday afternoon, I charged westward again, to Columbus and a small fly shop not far from the freeway.  The animated woman deftly tying small adams with pink indicators quickly steered me away from the hoppers I was eyeing, and recommended some blonde humpies, and a couple of larger patterns with bright yellow hues.  She also gave me a good idea for a place to walk in and find some spots that I would surely have to myself. Taking her advice, I collected the flies, and headed out to the access point, which I had actually found and tried the day before (with no success, of course).  Wading upstream, I cast to every spot that looked fishy, and many that did not, using first the small caddis with yellow underside and then the larger blonde humpy.  Finally, I watched in amazement as the fly disappeared in a swirl.  Somehow maintaining sanity, I waited the merest of moments before lightly tugging the rod and feeling the charge of energy from the other end of the line.  The fight (if you can call it that) was brief, the fish was small and unremarkable, except for the remarkable fact that it was the first fish I had convinced to scarf up a fly and stay connected long enough to come face to face with me.  I paused just long enough to thank the fish for contributing to my initiation into this odd fellowship, and sent it back to foraging.  Further casting resulted only in more practice so, again with darkness closing, I walked back to the car and headed back to the city.  I sat with my jeans still soaked to the knees and ate in the Mackenzie River Pizza Company in Billings, rewarding myself with a slice of raspberry cheesecake. From some perspectives, not a spectacular tale of fishing.  However, for

a new initiate, a most memorable outing indeed.  Some things I learned: 1. With free advice, you get what you pay for.  Purchasing some flies, floatant, leaders, or other minor necessities, a rapport can often be established with the local pusher which may result in a more successful effort. 2. A topographical map, such as the state atlas/gazeteer published by Delorme can be very helpful indeed. 3. (learned before, but frequently forgotten) sometimes not catching fish is a good day fishing. Thanks, all for the continued comments, debate, humor, etc. that make this place such a good place in which to hang. Bob Card

Response:

Good post, Bob, and quite full of wisdom. Congrats! /daytripper

[good story shortened] – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -From some perspectives, not a spectacular tale of fishing.  However, for a new initiate, a most memorable outing indeed.  Some things I learned: 1. With free advice, you get what you pay for.  Purchasing some flies, floatant, leaders, or other minor necessities, a rapport can often be established with the local pusher which may result in a more successful effort. 2. A topographical map, such as the state atlas/gazeteer published by Delorme can be very helpful indeed. 3. (learned before, but frequently forgotten) sometimes not catching fish is a good day fishing. Thanks, all for the continued comments, debate, humor, etc. that make this place such a good place in which to hang.

Response:

A week and a half ago, I had a business trip that took me to Billings, MT for about a week.  Not wanting to squander an opportunity, I packed the most basic of my fly-flinging gear, and set out with high hopes, trying to keep in mind all that I’ve gleaned from your exchanges in the past several months.

<snip Thanks, all for the continued comments, debate, humor, etc. that make this place such a good place in which to hang.

Bob: That was a great post.  You’ve got the routine down pat, now.  You just need more opportunity. If your work ever brings you to Utah, give a shout.  I know a stream or two where you might be able to get your *third* trout Bob Before you buy.

Response:

Allright Bob Card. You are now a confirmed odd feller, and by the authority usurped by me I now and forever more delare you one more friend of the angle, a fly fisher well met, set, sealed and approved. It just gets better and better. Congratulations. Seriously. Dave Someone had to do it, what with half the official greeting committee probably self medicated this late in the day.

Response:

Great story and some important lessons learned. sf

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – A week and a half ago, I had a business trip that took me to Billings, MT for about a week.  Not wanting to squander an opportunity, I packed the most basic of my fly-flinging gear, and set out with high hopes, trying to keep in mind all that I’ve gleaned from your exchanges in the past several months. With a couple days of "free" time, I did a little advance scouting, visited the local fly guy, and developed a plan.  I left early Sunday morning, driving through Red Lodge, and out to the spots on the West Fork (Rock Creek) that were suggested to me as starting places.  Brief version: lots of walking, lots of casting, a few that actually looked and felt right, and a wonderful morning of enjoying sun, trees, water, and recharging.  after a few hours of "casting practice", floating elk hair caddis and parachute adams into and through "fishy" spots, I finally felt a tug when a small trout grabbed the fly downstream just before I was to cast it.  Before I could do anything about it, he (or she) declined the fight, and disengaged from the hook, on which I had pinched the barb. I drove downstream a bit, fished several other spots, and then moved northwestward, back toward I-90.  Stopping along the way, I cast in a few places on the Stillwater, with no bites (that I noticed).  With darkness closing, I headed back to Billings for some dinner and rest before another day of work. Monday afternoon, I charged westward again, to Columbus and a small fly shop not far from the freeway.  The animated woman deftly tying small adams with pink indicators quickly steered me away from the hoppers I was eyeing, and recommended some blonde humpies, and a couple of larger patterns with bright yellow hues.  She also gave me a good idea for a place to walk in and find some spots that I would surely have to myself. Taking her advice, I collected the flies, and headed out to the access point, which I had actually found and tried the day before (with no success, of course).  Wading upstream, I cast to every spot that looked fishy, and many that did not, using first the small caddis with yellow underside and then the larger blonde humpy.  Finally, I watched in amazement as the fly disappeared in a swirl.  Somehow maintaining sanity, I waited the merest of moments before lightly tugging the rod and feeling the charge of energy from the other end of the line.  The fight (if you can call it that) was brief, the fish was small and unremarkable, except for the remarkable fact that it was the first fish I had convinced to scarf up a fly and stay connected long enough to come face to face with me.  I paused just long enough to thank the fish for contributing to my initiation into this odd fellowship, and sent it back to foraging.  Further casting resulted only in more practice so, again with darkness closing, I walked back to the car and headed back to the city.  I sat with my jeans still soaked to the knees and ate in the Mackenzie River Pizza Company in Billings, rewarding myself with a slice of raspberry cheesecake. From some perspectives, not a spectacular tale of fishing.  However, for a new initiate, a most memorable outing indeed.  Some things I learned: 1. With free advice, you get what you pay for.  Purchasing some flies, floatant, leaders, or other minor necessities, a rapport can often be established with the local pusher which may result in a more successful effort. 2. A topographical map, such as the state atlas/gazeteer published by Delorme can be very helpful indeed. 3. (learned before, but frequently forgotten) sometimes not catching fish is a good day fishing. Thanks, all for the continued comments, debate, humor, etc. that make this place such a good place in which to hang. Bob Card

Response:

Question:

If your Business or Organization is involved with products or services directed to those having interest in Fly Fishing topics, Rx F Fish will glady provide your company with a Free Business Listing on its pages for the benefit of its viewers.   This information is available to our viewers from our On-Line Searchable Database on the Site Information Page at Rx F Fish.  Our web site is located at: http://www.rxffish.com/ Some limitations apply as to the types of businesses our database will accomodate so, be sure to read the comments on the forms page before submitting the information.  The forms page is located at: http://www.rxffish.com/data_input.htm Just send us your information and we’ll handle the rest. Thank You. Trent Roberson Rx F Fish — For your good health, Fly Fish    A datasource about Fly Fishing Topics           http://www.rxffish.com           Free Business Listings Companies serving the Fly Fishing Industry      http://www.rxffish.com/index2.htm           Affordable Web Services   Site Design — Hosting — Image Editing           http://www.flashport.net

Response:

Question:

George, also help me. when no one else did. I put up a post. (no one answered) George replied on a private E-mail.  and I thank you again. George keep it up.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Hey George All I want to say is that George gave me a break when I was struggling on this newsgroup.  I have only been on a week or so and therefore I am now getting a feel for it. Where were all you guys when I had a query, come on ‘Live And Let Live’ George helped me out and I appreciate that. Stop arguing….Lets Fish Pete Derbyshire, England ______ I want to make this perfectly clear to everyone.  Wayne Chan made the same mistake that I made a few weeks ago.  Mr. Chan is a dear, sweet man and he is a Chinese American who deals in Bamboo.  Mr Chan wrote me a letter and hit the wrong carbon button because the letter was supposed to go to a second party also.  You guessed it, he blew it! Just two minutes ago, I finished explaining to Mr. Wayne Chan his error and how everyone is furious at me (which is all right) but I am concerned about sincere people leaving due to a misunderstanding.  This man, Mr. Wayne Chan, is terribly sorry.  The man is about in tears for all the orders this will cost me and the change in heart regarding my name and place in ROFF. I am NOT a spammer and neither is Mr. Chan.  Two like errors have occurred and shit happens in life.  I will go so far as to say if there is anyone in this world that wants me to pay for a week’s worth of their ROFF time because of any spams resulting from this one time error, I will pay it.  I will be responsible.  Just figure out how many minutes X the rate and I will cover any hardship anyone in ROFF has suffered.  I can’t do any better then that. I would like to also state to this beautiful group that I will not tolerate anyone trying to black mail this group or this person. Some of you have known me my entire fly fishing career.  I don’t lie and I don’t do mean things.  We all make errors.  But we are surrounded by individuals that envy us and who want to destroy us.  This is the time for all of us to come together. I want to tell everyone in public here that I am not the bad guy here and that I do not want Mike Connor or anyone to leave this wonderful chat room.  There is too much history surrounding us.  Your real enemy is Ken Fortenberry and his plant in this group.  Stop and think ladies and gentlemen.  Do your all really think I would do such a thing to hurt anyone here?  Who is the new blood that arrived recently that suddenly, we have these kinds of problems? Mike, I love you, we all love you.  Don’t leave.  None of us here did this too you.  How could we?  Why would we want too? Anyone that wants to talk to me personally, may call me collect in the next six hours.  I’ll pay for the phone bill.  Everyone that is, except Ken Fortenberry. All of this is bullshit, and no one here is perpetuating it.  Believe this.  I am a friend.  If you don’t believe that, then anyone who says they won’t use my products because they believe I’m doing this can go to hell.  I will not admit to something I am not guilty of.  I am innocent.  I deserve the benefit of the doubt. Sincerely, George Gehrke/American Sportsman (Now excuse me for about a half hour because I’m going to talk to my attorney about stalkers and black mailers) —

Question:

<<I’ve fished using spinning geart since I was a child.  On a backpacking trip in the White Mountains I saw people fly fishing and it looked like fun. In July I bought the "LL Bean Guide to Fly Fishing", an 8′6" 5/6 weight fly rod and reel.  I’ve been practiced casting on grass and working up my courage to try it for real. I’ve gotten some grief from some friends who have said, "I may use worms, but at least I catch fish." Martin, welcome to the world of fly fishing.  I hope you find it as enjoyable as many of us do (Okay, I admit it, I am a fly fishing junkie!).  It sounds like you are off to a good start and that you are paying attention to the teaching aids you have purchased. There are probably three bits of wisdom I can pass on to you.   #1.  You have to put your time in with fly fishing.  The more time you spend on the water, the better you will be. #2.  Don’t be afraid to make mistakes.  Even the best fly fisherman occasionally turns his line into a rats nest or loses a fish.   #3.  Don’t be concerned with the ignorant who believe that you can’t catch fish on a fly.   Given enough time and practice, you will be able to outfish them and will have a lot more fun doing it! Have fun! Mike

Response:

Hi Martin,  Be sure and take time to enjoy this learning phase of your fly-fishing career. Many is the time I’ve wished I could go back and start again. There is no joy like your first nymph-caught trout in a river or your first fish of any kind or method. Enjoy the learning and welcome to the ranks. Jim – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’ve fished using spinning geart since I was a child.  On a backpacking trip in the White Mountains I saw people fly fishing and it looked like fun. In July I bought the "LL Bean Guide to Fly Fishing", an 8′6" 5/6 weight fly rod and reel.  I’ve been practiced casting on grass and working up my courage to try it for real. I’ve gotten some grief from some friends who have said, "I may use worms, but at least I catch fish." Last night I went to a pond near my house at dusk, tied on a wooly bugger and caught two sunfish in about 30 minutes.  Normally a sun fish would be a disappointment, but it was a challenge figuring out how to get the line tight so I could fight it off the real.  Plus I’m more confident that I would catch a bigger fish now. My loop control is so-so.  Sometimes I’ll get a perfect cast, othertimes the line splashes down on the water in a pile.  Gotta work on that.

Response:

Good for you. You’ll find fly fishing to be an art while you friends "just go fishing". And, look at it this way, you were on the water and they weren’t.  You caught a fish that day and they didn’t.  You have accomplished something new and exicting and they didn’t. Have fun with it and it’ll treat you good. Bob Moss Landing, Ca. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’ve fished using spinning geart since I was a child.  On a backpacking trip in the White Mountains I saw people fly fishing and it looked like fun. In July I bought the "LL Bean Guide to Fly Fishing", an 8′6" 5/6 weight fly rod and reel.  I’ve been practiced casting on grass and working up my courage to try it for real. I’ve gotten some grief from some friends who have said, "I may use worms, but at least I catch fish." Last night I went to a pond near my house at dusk, tied on a wooly bugger and caught two sunfish in about 30 minutes.  Normally a sun fish would be a disappointment, but it was a challenge figuring out how to get the line tight so I could fight it off the real.  Plus I’m more confident that I would catch a bigger fish now. My loop control is so-so.  Sometimes I’ll get a perfect cast, othertimes the line splashes down on the water in a pile.  Gotta work on that.

Response:

Hi Martin, Wellcome to the world of flyfishing. Indeed you made a good start. If I can help you by sending some flies to you let me know what pattern(s) you’d like to have and I’ll see what I can fix for you! Hans van der Stroom -snip- – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Last night I went to a pond near my house at dusk, tied on a wooly bugger and caught two sunfish in about 30 minutes.  Normally a sun fish would be a disappointment, but it was a challenge figuring out how to get the line tight so I could fight it off the real.  Plus I’m more confident that I would catch a bigger fish now.

Response:

Don’t give up. The eventual payoff is well worth the effort, though it will take some time. Keep on practicing, find a good fly shop, patronize it and learn what you can from the owner. If you have a friend who can show you some things you will be way ahead, else read and get some videos. Consider a guide too.  Some day you will leave the bait fishermen in the dust, and the quality of the flyfishing experience can’t be beat, IMHO. Rick

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I’ve fished using spinning geart since I was a child.  On a backpacking trip in the White Mountains I saw people fly fishing and it looked like fun. In July I bought the "LL Bean Guide to Fly Fishing", an 8′6" 5/6 weight fly rod and reel.  I’ve been practiced casting on grass and working up my courage to try it for real. I’ve gotten some grief from some friends who have said, "I may use worms, but at least I catch fish."

Response:

I’ve fished using spinning geart since I was a child.  On a backpacking trip in the White Mountains I saw people fly fishing and it looked like fun. In July I bought the "LL Bean Guide to Fly Fishing", an 8′6" 5/6 weight fly rod and reel.  I’ve been practiced casting on grass and working up my courage to try it for real. I’ve gotten some grief from some friends who have said, "I may use worms, but at least I catch fish." Last night I went to a pond near my house at dusk, tied on a wooly bugger and caught two sunfish in about 30 minutes.  Normally a sun fish would be a disappointment, but it was a challenge figuring out how to get the line tight so I could fight it off the real.  Plus I’m more confident that I would catch a bigger fish now. My loop control is so-so.  Sometimes I’ll get a perfect cast, othertimes the line splashes down on the water in a pile.  Gotta work on that.

Response:

Question:

I’m looking to buy an economical 4-piece 6 wt fly rod. Does anyone have recommendations? I see Cortland does one, the CL series. Does anyone have experience with these? Thanks for any help. Simon

Response:

I’m looking to buy an economical 4-piece 6 wt fly rod. Does anyone have recommendations? I see Cortland does one, the CL series. Does anyone have experience with these? Thanks for any help. Simon

Check out the St Croix Imperial 4 pc 5/6 or 6/7. Either one will set you back $150 and well worth the price. Frank Church Elkhart, IN

Response:

Yes.   Check out Fenwick.  I own a FF756-4 that’s 4 piece glass 6 weight.  Comes with a nice bag and case for $100.  but you might think about the GFS70ML-4 HMG graphite spin-fly rod at $115. Buena suerte, Lou Lampe

Response:

Simon, I bought an 8wt from http://www.brazosflyfishers.com/ Lauren and her husband were wonderful at helping i the selection.  I highly recommend these nice folks. Cheers, Mitch – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’m looking to buy an economical 4-piece 6 wt fly rod. Does anyone have recommendations? I see Cortland does one, the CL series. Does anyone have experience with these? Thanks for any help. Simon

Response:

What ever you decide, may I suggest that you cast the rod before buying. Having been at this game for 60 plus years, I still think that the biggest mistake that people make is buying by brand name rather than choosing the rod that complements their casting style. Best of luck. J.

Response:

I’m looking to buy an economical 4-piece 6 wt fly rod. Does anyone have recommendations? I see Cortland does one, the CL series. Does anyone have experience with these? Thanks for any help. Simon

Hi, Not all the Cortland CL 4 piece rods cast well. The 8′ #4/5 with a #5 and the 8′6" #4/5 with a #5 both are pretty good for $110 with an aluminum tube. You might also try the 8′6" #5/6 with a #6 line. The 9′ #5/6 and the 9′ #6/7 are both pretty ‘cluby’ or ‘boardy’. St. Croix has some pretty good 4 piece rods at around $150. They come in 9′#5/6 and 9′#6/7 in 4 piece with a Cordura covered plastic tube. If you can get up to the $200 to $300 range, Sage, Loomis, Scott and T&T have some real great casting 3 and 4 piece rods that are lighter than the Cortland, St. Croix or Redington. Bill Kiene Kiene’s Fly Shop Sacramento,CA,USA 800/4000FLY www.kiene.com

Response:

I’m looking to buy an economical 4-piece 6 wt fly rod. Does anyone have recommendations? I see Cortland does one, the CL series. Does anyone have experience with these? Thanks for any help. Simon

I recently bought a St. Croix Imperial 9′ 5/6 4pc rod and highly recommend it. It cost $150. Not sure how that compares to the price on the Cortland.

Response:

I’m looking to buy an economical 4-piece 6 wt fly rod. Does anyone have recommendations? I see Cortland does one, the CL series. Does anyone have experience with these?

Fsihed a demo Redington Red Start 5/6 wgt yesterday – a great rod for the $$$. Rod, reel, line, backing & leader, plus jazzy hard case that holds rod w/mounted reel only $199 (with lifetime guarantee). My regular rod is a Sage,  but I liked the Redington a lot. Try one! Kent Edmonds Flyfishing West Georgia & Beyond http://kje.home.mindspring.com

Response:

look at st croix. their imperial line has nice 4 pc rods for about $130. I’ve got a 4/5 which i like a lot, though it casts better as a 5 than a four. I’ve never had any problem taking it on planes either. gc – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’m looking to buy an economical 4-piece 6 wt fly rod. Does anyone have recommendations? I see Cortland does one, the CL series. Does anyone have experience with these? Fsihed a demo Redington Red Start 5/6 wgt yesterday – a great rod for the $$$. Rod, reel, line, backing & leader, plus jazzy hard case that holds rod w/mounted reel only $199 (with lifetime guarantee). My regular rod is a Sage,  but I liked the Redington a lot. Try one! Kent Edmonds Flyfishing West Georgia & Beyond http://kje.home.mindspring.com

Response:

I own a Cortland and LOVE it . I have compared it to a Reddington and there is no comparison for the money,the Reddington is a cheap looking rod with the guides just tacked on , the cork looks bad , no winding check and so on . KW – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’m looking to buy an economical 4-piece 6 wt fly rod. Does anyone have recommendations? I see Cortland does one, the CL series. Does anyone have experience with these? Fsihed a demo Redington Red Start 5/6 wgt yesterday – a great rod for the $$$. Rod, reel, line, backing & leader, plus jazzy hard case that holds rod w/mounted reel only $199 (with lifetime guarantee). My regular rod is a Sage,  but I liked the Redington a lot. Try one! Kent Edmonds Flyfishing West Georgia & Beyond http://kje.home.mindspring.com

Response:

I’m looking to buy an economical 4-piece 6 wt fly rod. Does anyone have recommendations? I see Cortland does one, the CL series. Does anyone have experience with these?

I recently was given a Redington 5wt 9′ and it is truly a great rod to work with light action and amazing to use.. it is like a divining rod in your hands learn to use it properly and you cannot go wrong plus the lifetime guarantee is another great part of the bargain, Pierre

Response:

look at st croix. their imperial line has nice 4 pc rods for about $130. I’ve got a 4/5 which i like a lot, though it casts better as a 5 than a four. I’ve never had any problem taking it on planes either.

I recently looked at both the Redington RedStart and the St. Croix Imperial in a 5/6 weight at the local fly shop.  Went in with St. Croix as my intended choice because my current rod is a St. Croix Pro Graphite (operating on the principle of "My mind is made up – stop confusing me with facts" .  The guy in the shop encouraged me to cast both of ‘em using the same line & reel.  Wound up getting the Redington.  I found the Imperial was softer than I’m comfortable with, or conversely that I just liked the feel of the RedStart better.  I recommend that you cast at least a couple different rods before you make your choice.  Even if the rod you find you like best costs 20 bucks more, well…20 bucks isn’t much to pay to be happy, and it’s not much to have in your pocket if you’re not happy.  Your mileage may vary. — Bob Jarvis Mail address hacked to foil spammers!

Response:

Question:

I will be in Dayton Ohio this summer and wonder if there is any flyfishing to be had.  I am thinking smallies more than trout but I am not particularly picky.  Any hatches to match during summer (such as white fly) ?  Any good streams and access points ? Flyshops in the area ? Any info greatly appreciated, tight lines, Mark

Response:

Mark- The StillWater just NW of Dayton has (I am told) great smallies.  The Mad, which is N/NE of Dayton has Trout but the bad spring has kept take light. Sorry I don’t have any details, I’m just getting started w/this Fly stuff. Good luck

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I will be in Dayton Ohio this summer and wonder if there is any flyfishing to be had.  I am thinking smallies more than trout but I am not particularly picky.  Any hatches to match during summer (such as white fly) ?  Any good streams and access points ? Flyshops in the area ? Any info greatly appreciated, tight lines, Mark

Response:

Question:

I am an avid flyfisherman, both streams and lakes (mostly lakes). I am 17 years old and try to go fishing as much as possible.  What I wanted to know is if there are any decent dry damselfly patterns out there.  I have seen a few with extended deer hair bodies, polypropylene wings, and parachute hackles, but I also wanted to know if there where any other patterns for this insect.  I have not yet seen any dry dragonfly patterns, so I want to know about them as well.  Although I personally don’t prefer dry fly fishing on stillwaters but, it can be very succesful at times. Scott Laliberte . —    ___       __  ____    ___  /    (__/ /    /   /      |  Student of Computing Science, SFU

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I am an avid flyfisherman, both streams and lakes (mostly lakes). I am 17 years old and try to go fishing as much as possible.  What I wanted to know is if there are any decent dry damselfly patterns out there.  I have seen a few with extended deer hair bodies, polypropylene wings, and parachute hackles, but I also wanted to know if there where any other patterns for this insect.  I have not yet seen any dry dragonfly patterns, so I want to know about them as well.  Although I personally don’t prefer dry fly fishing on stillwaters but, it can be very succesful at times. Scott Laliberte . —    ___       __  ____    ___  /    (__/ /    /   /      |  Student of Computing Science, SFU

I’ve been told that the reason for the lack of dragon fly dry imitations is because the fish only take them in mid flight, not sitting on the water (when is the last time you saw a dragon sitting on the water?).  With damsels, I tie an extended deer hair parachute adams in both blue (for the female) and tan (for the male), and have gotten limited success.  My most interesting catch was when a natural mounted my dry and tried to copulate with it in mid cast!  I’ve had my best luck fishing waters laden with damsels using a yellow marabou nymph.  Basically, it looks like a long AP, but tied with palmered marabou for a body instead of dubbing.  Good luck. . Lenny Bloksberg . .

Response:

Philippe Laliberte) writes: any dry damsel patterns?

Look in the book "Tying Dry Flies"  by R. Kaufmann. Has a  "braided butt damsel" using braided leader butt for the extended body. These flies are also available in the Kaufmann catalog. I have an example of this fly in front of me now and it is a fine rendition. After hatching, adult damsels are often blown onto the water where the trout feast on them.

Response:

I am an avid flyfisherman, both streams and lakes (mostly lakes). I am 17 years old and try to go fishing as much as possible.  What I wanted to know is if there are any decent dry damselfly patterns out there.  I have seen a few with extended deer hair bodies, polypropylene wings, and parachute hackles, but I also wanted to know if there where any other patterns for this insect.  I have not yet seen any dry dragonfly patterns, so I want to know about them as well.  Although I personally don’t prefer dry fly fishing on stillwaters but, it can be very succesful at times.

  The best pattern I’ve found is the Borger damsel which has a body made of braided leader material which you dye with pantone markers (blue or brown & black).  Tie this on the hook then tie on a post of crystal flash (blue or brown) then wind a big grizzly hackle on this post papachute style.  Now dub on a short body and eyes if you want them then pull the hackle to the back so it splays 180 deg. in the rear, pull down the post and tie it off like a nymph wing case.     You can’t tell this thing from a real bug on the water and I’ve had males try and mate with my blue imitations.   Tim

Response:

Philippe Laliberte) writes:

<I am an avid flyfisherman, both streams and lakes (mostly lakes). I am 17 years old and try to go fishing as much as possible.  What I wanted to know is if there are any decent dry damselfly patterns out there. Curtis: Have been fly fishing for trout and bass for 20 years. I think I’ve seen some big fish hit damselfly nymphs, but cannot confirm it. I know I have never observed a big fish rise for a damselfly dry. I’ve tied several different patterns myself and have copied Dave Whitlock and R. Kaufmann patterns without success. Personally, I think it is a waste of time to focus on damselfly dry patterns. If anyone disagrees, please let me know. I’d appreciate insights based on observations. Thanks…Bob Elliott. Rochester, NY

Response:

Last summer I landed 2 22"+ trout on adult damsels and hooked 2 other fish that easily went 26" on them too,  loosing one when my reel fell apart after all my line and 1/2 my backing was gone.  Big fish gulp damsels at the right time and they do work. Tim – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Curtis: Have been fly fishing for trout and bass for 20 years. I think I’ve seen some big fish hit damselfly nymphs, but cannot confirm it. I know I have never observed a big fish rise for a damselfly dry. I’ve tied several different patterns myself and have copied Dave Whitlock and R. Kaufmann patterns without success. Personally, I think it is a waste of time to focus on damselfly dry patterns. If anyone disagrees, please let me know. I’d appreciate insights based on observations. Thanks…Bob Elliott. Rochester, NY

Response:

Curtis: Have been fly fishing for trout and bass for 20 years. I think I’ve seen some big fish hit damselfly nymphs, but cannot confirm it. I know I have never observed a big fish rise for a damselfly dry. I’ve tied several different patterns myself and have copied Dave Whitlock and R. Kaufmann patterns without success. Personally, I think it is a waste of time to focus on damselfly dry patterns. If anyone disagrees, please let me know. I’d appreciate insights based on observations. Thanks…Bob Elliott. Rochester, NY

Bob, I have seen fish jump out of the water a good foot for a damselfly sitting on some grass.   This happened at a lake near Cody Wyoming.  These trout would swim all around you in about 1 to 3 ft. of water.  They would sit and eye the damselfly for a second or two and then spring out of the water for the insect.  It was really quite interesting watching this fish do this and of course I did not have any damselfly patterns with me. Tim Trujillo

Response:

What I wanted to know is if there are any decent dry damselfly patterns out there. Curtis: Have been fly fishing for trout and bass for 20 years. I think I’ve seen some big fish hit damselfly nymphs, but cannot confirm it. I know I have

I cannot compete with you regarding years fished, but I have to disagree. patterns without success. Personally, I think it is a waste of time to focus on damselfly dry patterns. If anyone disagrees, please let me know. I’d appreciate insights based on observations. Thanks…Bob Elliott.

If you would go to any Western lake in British Columbia or Alberta, damselflies are your "bread and butter" flies.  Especially on trophy lakes in BC.  Many of times, especially on widy days that’s the only fly the big trout (20" plus) will take.  It’s quite nice watching these about 1 inch long, slender creatures wiggle and struggle on their journey just to be taken with a VERY AGGRESSIVE splash. Not too complicated to tie, one of the best patterns is from G. Borger’s Designing Trout Flies.  The only modification I’ve made is that I’m using seal in a dubbing loop instead of recommended hackle.  Of course, the fly has to have an action, so tying it on a dry fly hook is better than nymph hook (the new Accupoint from Mustad is just great!).  Fish it just on or couple inches below the surface with jerky, short strips. Respectfully J.K.

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Question:

Why they are fishing with a bamboo shaped rod and not with an original ??

Modern graphite rods can cast considerably farther than bamboo, and the long false-casts made the casting scenes more dramatic, especially to non-flyfisher folks. They are much better and softer than these plastic rods.

Thats a strong statement.   Fish and fishing-waters come in all shapes, sizes, and characteristics.   There is hardly one best rod. You can serve the fly much softer…

Nice when needed, but what about techniques that require hard presentations? Also (an example), many steelhead rivers in the pacific northwest are large and fast – soft presentations are a don’t care, but long casts with potentially large flies are very useful. … and for some special technics I don’t know the name in english (when you have to feel the bite …

Nymphing?   Hard or soft, don’t care.   Sensitive, do care! … or you want to lead the fly against the flow) …

Many "swinging" techniques including wet fly swings, greased-line, lifts, etc.  It’s very debatable whether soft or hard is better. In Germany most of the good fly-fisher are fishing with bamboo-rods. What is it in USA ??

Many serious fly fisherman I know own bamboo (often lots of), but most only use them for "mood" or nostalgic moments, usually accompanied by a pipe or cigar, and possibly some whisky. I certainly enjoyed casting three different bamboo rods, and have my sights on buying some bamboo, but right or wrong, am spoiled and won’t give up my graphite. Thomas Gilg

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Some technical things in the movie were done beautifully.  Powell made bamboo shaped graphite rods to look like the originals,  and even matched all of the rod decorations, windings, etc., and the special lines that would show up on film were spectacular.   Why they are fishing with a bamboo shaped rod and not with an original ??

The main reason seems to be that the original Montague 8 1/2" 4 1/2 oz bamboos are now very rare and *very* valuable.  In the movie they only used Montagues for close ups and for shots where they needed the slower action of the cane rod.  They did not want to break any rods when playing buckets full of rocks or even when fighting "Fernando", the model fish. Denbigh

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| They are much better and softer than these plastic rods. | | Thats a strong statement.   Fish and fishing-waters come in all shapes, | sizes, and characteristics.   There is hardly one best rod. | | You can serve the fly much softer… | | Nice when needed, but what about techniques that require hard presentations? | | Also (an example), many steelhead rivers in the pacific northwest are | large and fast – soft presentations are a don’t care, but long casts | with potentially large flies are very useful. Yes you are right. Here in Germany we dont’t have these large fast rivers and no steeelhaeds. We have small rivers with with good natural grayling and trout populations. So for this ‘fine’ fishing I think they are the best choice because of their soft and special action that you can’t reach with artificial rods. | | … and for some special technics I don’t know the name in english (when | you have to feel the bite … | | Nymphing?   Hard or soft, don’t care.   Sensitive, do care! Yes, it’s a kind of nymphing. | … or you want to lead the fly against the flow) … | | Many "swinging" techniques including wet fly swings, greased-line, | lifts, etc.  It’s very debatable whether soft or hard is better. For wet fly it’s O.K.. But I mean for dry fly you need a in your words ’sensitive’ (excuse my english) rod and a good technik to imitate a fly running up the stream. Otherwise your fly is diving like a submarine. | | In Germany most of the good fly-fisher are fishing with bamboo-rods. | What is it in USA ?? | | Many serious fly fisherman I know own bamboo (often lots of), but most | only use them for "mood" or nostalgic moments, usually accompanied by | a pipe or cigar, and possibly some whisky. | | I certainly enjoyed casting three different bamboo rods, and have my | sights on buying some bamboo, but right or wrong, am spoiled and won’t | give up my graphite. | | Thomas Gilg Sure it has something nostalgic, maybe I am nostalgic too. I think you will agree with me when I say flyfishing is more than a hi-tec sport and not only the facts make you (and me) to buy a bamboo rod. And as longer I fish it’s more the fish in the water which fascinates me than the fish in my bag. It’s like the last sentence in Sherley Mc Lanes roman. In German it’s "Ich werde von Wassern verfolgt.". In english it has to be something like this: "I am followed by waters."       Olaf <Olaf Lindner                      | Technical University of Berlin    

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etc. It’s like the last sentence in Sherley Mc Lanes roman. In German it’s "Ich werde von Wassern verfolgt.". In english it has to be something like this: "I am followed by waters."       Olaf

My soul cringes at the thought of Shirley McLane (sp?) writing about fly fishing.  A River Runs Through It was written by *Norman* Maclean. Shirley M. is a weird US actress with strong views on her previous lives; Norman M. was very different. Incidentally, in the original he wrote "haunted" not "followed." Denbigh

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Olaf Lindner writes: A friend of mine has 15 bamboo-rods, all made by Bjarne Fries probably the best bamboo-rod builder in the world each about 1200$.

Olaf if your friend had graphite instead of bamboo he could probable cover the same range of fishing situations with 6 to 8 rods at rather than 15.  Graphite has greater latitude.  He’d also have $12,000 to go to New Zealand.  I know where I’ll spend my money.

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| | Olaf if your friend had graphite instead of bamboo he could probable cover | the same range of fishing situations with 6 to 8 rods at rather than 15.   That’s true but the point is not the range of fishing situations than the specia l action of a well built split cane rod. I see that this is a very dificult theme and at the end a personal decision. | Graphite has greater latitude.  He’d also have $12,000 to go to New Zealand.  I know | where I’ll spend my money. Hope you have fun. Olaf (Excuse me about the mistake with the names ‘Sherley’ and ‘Norman’. I don’t know  who it (Sherley) is (I only heard the name sometimes in the TV) but it sounds t errible.) — <Olaf Lindner                      | Technical University of Berlin    

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Why they are fishing with a bamboo shaped rod and not with an original ??

Thomas J. Gilg’s response to Olaf Lindner is right on the mark.  The only thing I can add is that bamboo rod’s are wonderful for small eastern spring creeks with lot’s of brush overhead.  Maybe Olaf is faced with kind of situation.   One other thought is that not every bamboo rod is good.  I’ve cast lots of junk.  Good rods seem to start at around $1000 (new or old).  The collection craze has recently driven the price of bamboo rods out of sight good and bad.  I’ve seen people at shows pay +$400 for a machine made japanese piece of junk.  I just can’t justify paying +$1000 for a rod that for all it’s beauty will be out performed by a rod of 1/3 to 1/2 the price.

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Some technical things in the movie were done beautifully.  Powell made bamboo shaped graphite rods to look like the originals,  and even matched all of the rod decorations, windings, etc., and the special lines that would show up on film were spectacular.  

Why they are fishing with a bamboo shaped rod and not with an original ?? They are much better and softer than these plastic rods. I got my first Spilt Cane rod on a Fly-Fishing congress in Germany these Spring for 800,- DM (about 500$). A friend of mine has 15 bamboo-rods, all made by Bjarne Fries probably the best bamboo-rod builder in the world each about 1200$. O.K. I agree with you when you say that’s crazy but Most people who have fished with one of these rods they will never again take these plastics. You can serve the fly much softer and for some special technics I don’t know the name in english (when you have to feel the bite or you want to lead the fly against the flow) they are probably the best choice because they are so soft and have and have a very special action. In Germany most of the good fly-fisher are fishing with bamboo-rods. What is it in USA ?? Olaf — <Olaf Lindner                      | Technical University of Berlin    

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