Question:

These thoughtful posts from Tara are just too good to allow to fade from usenet. Since Tara set them not to be archived, I’ve copied them here to protect them for posterity. MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Hogwasher/2.6.1 (Macintosh) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Newsgroups: rec.outdoors.national- parks,rec.backcountry,rec.outdoors.fishing.fly,alt.wolves X-No-Archive: yes Lines: 73 NNTP-Posting-Host: 209.226.237.31 X-Trace: news20.bellglobal.com 1023508397 209.226.237.31 (Fri, 07 Jun 2002 23:53:17 EDT) Organization: Bell Sympatico Path: e3500-atl1.usenetserver.com!newsfeeds-atl2!news- out.visi.com!hermes.visi.com!upp1.onvoy!msc1.onvoy!onv oy.com!sunqbc.risq.qc.ca!torn!webster!nf1.bellglobal.c om!nf2.bellglobal.com!news20.bellglobal.com.POSTED!not-for-mail Xref: usenetserver.com rec.outdoors.national-parks:143809 rec.backcountry:254050 rec.outdoors.fishing.fly:328244 alt.wolves:135493 atl1.usenetserver.com) – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Bingo! Yippee!  You win! So youa re actively and vigorously working at protecting the Tom Benos of the world. Ya think?  Well, I guess I’m not going to get too worked up over it.  I mean, how many of them can there be?  I don’t believe I’ve ever encountered the name Beno before……I’d be much surprised if there’s more than a couple dozen Tom Benos on the planet.  And, given how unlikely it is that they share much more than a name, I suspect that giving all of them my active and vigorous support would pretty much be a wash in the long run, don’t you? Thanks for the support! Uh…..you’re welcome…….I guess…….um…….are you a Tom Beno? E-mail his ISP and complain about the illegal and unconstitutional harassment techniques of the far right extremists trying to take away his right of free speech! Rise up and smite the oppressors!  Dirty filthy cowards, all of them… Dan Evidence be damned!  I’m gonna go way out on a limb here and give long odds that you and the rest of the Tom Benos think you got something to say. Wolfgang whattya say boys and girls……who wants to win a shiny new nickel?      :)

Reading all of this – all of this – I am overwhelmed with the sheer pettiness of all of you. ALL of you.  What a waste of time, what a waste of lives. Do none of you have nothing better to do with your time.  Do any of you ever stand back and look at what you write and actually see yourselves. "I’ll do what I want because my way is the right way. And I’ll do what is right because you are wrong!" "And I’ll fix you, ha ha!"  Do you not see that all of you are right and all of you are at the same time wrong?  Nah, you don’t. Your attitude, both sides, is why we have the mess we do.  This is why this world, it’s politics and it’s results are, and continue to be a mess   This is not the way to clean it up or change it. It’s only a way to perpetuate it. I sit back and look at this and I see that Tom, at least has a cause, a purpose and we need that. We need crusaders. But when it becomes a matter of oneupmanship or one of school yard childishness, there is no hope of change. What to do?  Has anyone ever known what to to. I sometimes think it’s simply going to be a struggle forever.   In the history of the world the only ones who have truly changed anything are those who have always been unwilling to resort to the tactics I see here. You, all of you are the grain of sand that is the universe. What kind of universe do you want it to be. Tara Just my 2 cents. MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Hogwasher/2.6.1 (Macintosh) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Newsgroups: rec.outdoors.national- parks,rec.backcountry,rec.outdoors.fishing.fly,alt.wolves X-No-Archive: yes Lines: 112 NNTP-Posting-Host: 216.208.65.191 X-Trace: news20.bellglobal.com 1023515054 216.208.65.191 (Sat, 08 Jun 2002 01:44:14 EDT) Organization: Bell Sympatico Path: e3500-atl1.usenetserver.com!newsfeeds-atl2!btnet- peer1!btnet!news.maxwell.syr.edu!sunqbc.risq.qc.ca!torn !webster!nf1.bellglobal.com!nf2.bellglobal.com!news20.b ellglobal.com.POSTED!not-for-mail Xref: usenetserver.com rec.outdoors.national-parks:143811 rec.backcountry:254061 rec.outdoors.fishing.fly:328261 alt.wolves:135495 atl1.usenetserver.com) Tom is not a crusader, he’s a nuisance. I’m sure that you also welcome into your home every person that has a religous message to share. And isn’t that the ultimate crusade?

Ahhh, Jeff, notice how you searched for and of course, found the one thing you could find to perpetuate and continue the madness. And also notice (you won’t, however), how you brought it into a new twist to perpetuate the argument.  But, I’m not arguing, and I will not continue (no matter what idiotic responses come from what I’ve said) to post here anymore on this topic. Tara Bye buy. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Bingo! Yippee!  You win! So youa re actively and vigorously working at protecting the Tom Benos of the world. Ya think?  Well, I guess I’m not going to get too worked up over it.  I mean, how many of them can there be?  I don’t believe I’ve ever encountered the name Beno before……I’d be much surprised if there’s more than a couple dozen Tom Benos on the planet.  And, given how unlikely it is that they share much more than a name, I suspect that giving all of them my active and vigorous support would pretty much be a wash in the long run, don’t you? Thanks for the support! Uh…..you’re welcome…….I guess…….um…….are you a Tom Beno? E-mail his ISP and complain about the illegal and unconstitutional harassment techniques of the far right extremists trying to take away his right of free speech! Rise up and smite the oppressors!  Dirty filthy cowards, all of them… Dan Evidence be damned!  I’m gonna go way out on a limb here and give long odds that you and the rest of the Tom Benos think you got something to say. Wolfgang whattya say boys and girls……who wants to win a shiny new nickel?      :) Reading all of this – all of this – I am overwhelmed with the sheer pettiness of all of you. ALL of you.  What a waste of time, what a waste of lives. Do none of you have nothing better to do with your time.  Do any of you ever stand back and look at what you write and actually see yourselves. "I’ll do what I want because my way is the right way. And I’ll do what is right because you are wrong!" "And I’ll fix you, ha ha!"  Do you not see that all of you are right and all of you are at the same time wrong?   Nah, you

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Dang!  You know, I think she’s right.

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Yeah, she may be right, but in the end, isn’t her responding to them just more of the same?  And isn’t my response to her responding to them just more of the same? …Whoa, too much thinking makes Kurt’s head spin.  I’m going to go sit down now.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Dang!  You know, I think she’s right.

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Question:

All the other Waynes that hang out around here seem to like it also. Welcome! Big Dale

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I went down the the small lake that is near my house. I have just started fly fishing and this was my 3rd time. I stuffed a few thing in the pockets of my jeans, threw on tennis shoes and scrammed. I tied on a small white popper and worked the shoreline along the dam. Only fished for about an hour but caught 2 small bass and a bluegill all on that small popper. They were small but they were fun to catch!! I released them all. I think I like this fly fishing !! wayne

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  I went down the the small lake that is near my house. I have just started fly fishing and this was my 3rd time. I stuffed a few thing in the pockets of my jeans, threw on tennis shoes and scrammed. I tied on a small white popper and worked the shoreline along the dam. Only fished for about an hour but caught 2 small bass and a bluegill all on that small popper. They were small but they were fun to catch!! I released them all. I think I like this fly fishing !!

Congratulations on the success.  Sorry to hear you have been afflicted with the fly fishing virus.  Once hooked, there is no turning back <g — Warren Findley Shut up and fish! For Yellowstone Clave info: http://www.geocities.com/troutbum_mt/

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I just saw "Wayne" and continued to read.  I then realized that it was a new Wayne (and welcome to you).  Unfortunately, this means its time to cull the Wayne’s.  As a matter of fact, when we do, I want a jacket made from one. Yeah, thats right, Wayne’s coating.         Frank "There’s only two of us" Reid

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I went down the the small lake that is near my house. I have just started fly fishing and this was my 3rd time. I stuffed a few thing in the pockets of my jeans, threw on tennis shoes and scrammed. I tied on a small white popper and worked the shoreline along the dam. Only fished for about an hour but caught 2 small bass and a bluegill all on that small popper. They were small but they were fun to catch!! I released them all. I think I like this fly fishing !! wayne

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Yes, there is a wayne and a wayno….maybe he could be the bounding wayne? john

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I just saw "Wayne" and continued to read.  I then realized that it was a new Wayne (and welcome to you).  Unfortunately, this means its time to cull the Wayne’s.  As a matter of fact, when we do, I want a jacket made from one. Yeah, thats right, Wayne’s coating.

Can’t spell?  Wains.  grin — Don Thompson Another Thompson Scion – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –         Frank "There’s only two of us" Reid I went down the the small lake that is near my house. I have just started fly fishing and this was my 3rd time. I stuffed a few thing in the pockets of my jeans, threw on tennis shoes and scrammed. I tied on a small white popper and worked the shoreline along the dam. Only fished for about an hour but caught 2 small bass and a bluegill all on that small popper. They were small but they were fun to catch!! I released them all. I think I like this fly fishing !! wayne

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Question:

Certainly does sound as if you were snorting something or other! A most attractive Aardvark lives just across the way, and being polite I sometimes stop, to pass the time of day. she has some awkward habits though, she likes snorting ants, but when you find aardvarks attractive, this just tightens up your pants. One takes more care in ones appearance, sports dentures and toupee and a surgically lengthened nose of course, is a real hit right away. I really wanted to be an orca, but my paltry fishing skills will not suffice, its very difficult to cast with fins as well, and the operation has its price. And so I am stuck with aardvarks, and am sometimes moved to prose, when a large and  juicy termite is sucked loudly up my nose, this often makes my poor eyes water, and you need a lot of wipes, zebras have it better, but its just too hard to transplant stripes. I have been approached by possums too, invited to their lair, but I think this may be mainly due, to my artificial hair, Gummy bears have also been sniffing around of late, but I just take out my dentures then, and leave them on the plate. This discourages such advances, and is really quite a lark, but when I forget to put them in again, it upsets my aardvark. I am proud of my proboscis now, it cost a pretty penny too, the only disadvantage now, is that I live in the local zoo. TL MC — "If you have tried everything you know, and nothing works, then perhaps it is time to accept that you don

Question:

I have a Penn 4-ARG and St croix 12 wt rod to sell. Where can I post it?

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I have a Penn 4-ARG and St croix 12 wt rod to sell. Where can I post it?

    on ebay.  or, if you are lucky, on a fly fishing newsgroup, if you can find one. wayno

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You can post short private ads for personal gear on here, and on other groups. You can also post on e-bay to auction the stuff. TL MC — "In order to achieve what is possible, one must constantly attempt the impossible" http://www.mikeconnor.de

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have a Penn 4-ARG and St croix 12 wt rod to sell. Where can I post it?

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    on ebay.  or, if you are lucky, on a fly fishing newsgroup, if you can find one.

Or as Forty might say, "ebay ukyoufay." –Steve

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I think you just did. Regards from Montreal John Brkich

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Question:

At $6000 for a pair, you are paying a lot up front, I think. I think I am going to self insure them. — Ron White Check out HAMMER the 30′ sportfisherman I am building http://www.concentric.net/~knotreel/

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Bare in mind, "Extended Warranties" are the biggest scam going.  That’s just not my opinion, ask anyone who sell’s cars. It seems you always hear about the (1) guy who was really glad he bought the "Extended Warranty", what you don’t hear is the (100) others who paid a lot of money for nothing. Extended Warranties are like any other insurance and the odds are always greatly in favor of the insurer …not the insured.  Think about it ….if Extended Warranty programs weren’t such a juicy pie, why do you find everyone and their grandmother trying to sell them. Your best warranty is to know what the hell your buying in the first place and don’t buy junk! Dennis, WI

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – At $6000 for a pair, you are paying a lot up front, I think. I think I am going to self insure them. — Ron White Check out HAMMER the 30′ sportfisherman I am building http://www.concentric.net/~knotreel/

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Ron, IMHO, buy the best and most comprehensive plan you can.  These motors today are very unreliable and you will be in the shop for repairs worth thousands of dollars every year. I was at my mechanics the other day.  A tourney fisherman was going to miss out on a tournament because parts for his 2000 225 Optimax wouldn’t be available until sometime in October.  Seems the demand for parts is outstripping supply. Just my observations.

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I had decided to for go the Mercury extended warranty due to a $6000 cost to cover both of my 2000 225HP Optimaxs. My dealer offers an alternate plan thru Pinnacle for about half that of Mercury’s. Does anybody have any experience with Pinnacle extended warranty plans for big outboards? — Ron White Check out HAMMER the 30′ sportfisherman I am building http://www.concentric.net/~knotreel/

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Ron, I don’t have knowlege about the coverage PINNACLE offers, but the extended warranty I got from Mercury covers ALL internally lubricated parts, both engine and outdrive (O.K. I have the 4.3L I/O, different coverage for the outboards I guess).  Seemed a good deal to me for the money..about $800 for 2 more years. Mike

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  Ron, you might want to check with your dealer about that extended warranty.  When we bought our boat this past spring the dealer told us about a program(?) that Mercury was/is running.  It may have something to do with the volume of business our dealer does with Merc.  The dealer was given about $9k of Mercury’s money that he could use anyway he wanted.  Now, we bought the boat in Canada (we live in the U.S.), so it may not apply in your situation.  Anyway, our dealer offered to extend the warranty to five years for both motors and outdrives (hell, anything on the boat from Mercury) for $500 U.S.  Needless to say we wrote the check on the spot!  Normally I have no use for extended warranties, but this was too good a deal to pass up. Never hurts to inquire. Good luck. Keith McGregor 2000 Doral 300SE – Sweet E

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I had decided to for go the Mercury extended warranty due to a $6000 cost to cover both of my 2000 225HP Optimaxs. My dealer offers an alternate plan thru Pinnacle for about half that of Mercury’s. Does anybody have any experience with Pinnacle extended warranty plans for big outboards? — Ron White Check out HAMMER the 30′ sportfisherman I am building http://www.concentric.net/~knotreel/

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=it is, that issue is not your concern.  Your concern is simply to ask what =will the outlay of $787.50 do for you.  It matters not to you that ten =different boaters will tell you they’ve never had a breakdown.  What matters =is the consequences to you if you do.  I’ve heard the argument that the And this is key.  For instance, on my first boat, corrosion damage wasn’t covered.  So, when the starter rusted from the inside out, I had to pay for it.  Now, I bought from a decent dealer, so they didn’t charge labor, and I paid for a new starter.  Good deal, considering how hard it was to remove.  It was difficult because the bolts holding the starter on rusted and broke.  I think they had to do lots of drilling (4.3L OMC Cobra). So, if 2.5 years from now, the riser rusts through and fills the engine with water and destroys it, do you have coverage?  I’m not saying you don’t, but that you should check.  Corrosion damage on a boat engine means much more than some rust on the outside of the engine.  What happens if you wrap a fishing line around the prop shaft, cut the outdrive seals, get water in the drive and damage the gears?  This is the kind of stuff that damages equipment.  And, of course, what if you hit something.  But, damage to your boat caused by hitting something is often covered under your insurance. Also, make sure you know who is providing the coverage.  Is it a fly by night company?  Or Merc itself?  Or a quality dealer? How new is the design of the equipment?  5.0L motors and Alpha I drives have been around a long time.  Ficht (sp?) and Optimax are much newer and probably have design flaws. Mike

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – It is hard to believe but my first year of boating is almost over. Wow that was fast. Mercury says I bought the boat on Oct. 28 and they are offering an extended warranty. The details are: 2 Year    $472.50 3 Year    $640.50 4 year    $787.50 I have a 5.0 Mercruiser. My question is, should I even consider this? It seems that extended warranties are just an incredible revenue generator for the companies but with being new to this maybe this is warranted. I use the boat maybe two or three times a week at most. I think I have put about 35-40 hours on the boat this summer. Thanks in advance for any advise you have. Ron Ron, here’s some food for thought about your warranty decision.  First, lets discuss the reasons you’ve heard why you shouldn’t buy it:  The most common reason is that the product is too profitable for the company who offers the warranty and/or the dealer who sells it to you.  Of course it is a profitable product.  Would you expect them to offer anything less?  Your boat was a profitable product when it was sold to you as well.  Maybe it is even an outrageously profitable product.  No matter how obscenely profitable it is, that issue is not your concern.  Your concern is simply to ask what will the outlay of $787.50 do for you.  It matters not to you that ten different boaters will tell you they’ve never had a breakdown.  What matters is the consequences to you if you do.  I’ve heard the argument that the warranty will limit its payout to the cost of replacing the engine/outdrive. I don’t really know the exact cost, I but feel very certain that the cost of replacing your drivetrain would be well in excess of $10,000.  If that’s the best the product did, with a base cost of $787.50, I’d say you should do so well with your other investments.  A major engine or drive failure can easily run $5-6k.  It takes almost nothing to go wrong that wouldn’t cost you more than $787.50.  We are talking boat repair prices here. My recommendation is to focus on your feelings on this one.  Ignore what the $787.50 does for Mercury’s bottom line.  Be concerned with your bottom line. What you are buying with the warranty is called a stop-loss.  Simply put, it means that for the next four years, it can’t get any worse than $787.50.  It really is just that simple.  It is the only issue you need to focus on.  Do you like having that net underneath you?  Or do you enjoy the thrill of life without one?  How well do you sleep?  Base your decision with that in mind. There is no way to quantify the chances of you recouping your cost back. Two other thoughts to consider:  If you buy the warranty, and you should decide to sell the boat during the warranty period, you have also bought a stop loss for the potential buyer of your boat.  If you’ve never bought or sold in the used market, you have no idea how powerful an asset that warranty can be as a sales incentive.  There is no reason to think that the remaining term on the warranty wouldn’t be worth the full $787.50 to a buyer who doesn’t know you from Adam and doesn’t know the history of the boat.  It puts you a leg up on the competition.  Even if you like living without a net, your buyer might not, especially with a used boat.  Also, consider that you are buying your coverage directly from Mercury, not an after market company.  That means that any Mercury authorized warranty facility will honor that warranty without hesitation.  For $787.50, I think its a steal. Russ Of course, all this assumes the company, whatever company (insurance or manufacturer), doesn’t fight actually HONORING this extended warranty.  We can always refuse to fix it and call it "water ingestion" or some other hole in the contract big enough to drive a Feadship through…… If you’re going to buy a contract, take the contract HOME and READ IT CAREFULLY.  Mark out all the huge holes with a magic marker, you know, where it says they don’t HAVE to fix it if they don’t want to.  Take the modified contract back to the dealer and get him, as representative of the company, to initial all the contractual changes. If he says he can’t, mail the contract back to the company and ask THEM to initial the contractual changes.  This way, you’ll at least get a contract that will actually force them to fix the boat, without you having to kiss their corporate asses and be a buddy-buddy with the dealer. READ THE CONTRACT, very carefully.  Look at all the "outs" their lawyers have written into it.  It can happen to you…it has me. Larry….Yamaha Y.E.S. contract.  Not worth the paper it’s printed on in ‘97.  They had no intention of ever honoring it.

You should follow your own advice, Larry. Next time you buy a home computer, read the specs. That way, you won’t have to moan about how you were–once again–screwed. — Harry Krause – - – - – - – - – - – - Hey!  You can’t commit suicide with Ex-Lax!

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – It is hard to believe but my first year of boating is almost over. Wow that was fast. Mercury says I bought the boat on Oct. 28 and they are offering an extended warranty. The details are: 2 Year    $472.50 3 Year    $640.50 4 year    $787.50 I have a 5.0 Mercruiser. My question is, should I even consider this? It seems that extended warranties are just an incredible revenue generator for the companies but with being new to this maybe this is warranted. I use the boat maybe two or three times a week at most. I think I have put about 35-40 hours on the boat this summer. Thanks in advance for any advise you have. Ron Ron, here’s some food for thought about your warranty decision.  First, lets discuss the reasons you’ve heard why you shouldn’t buy it:  The most common reason is that the product is too profitable for the company who offers the warranty and/or the dealer who sells it to you.  Of course it is a profitable product.  Would you expect them to offer anything less?  Your boat was a profitable product when it was sold to you as well.  Maybe it is even an outrageously profitable product.  No matter how obscenely profitable it is, that issue is not your concern.  Your concern is simply to ask what will the outlay of $787.50 do for you.  It matters not to you that ten different boaters will tell you they’ve never had a breakdown.  What matters is the consequences to you if you do.  I’ve heard the argument that the warranty will limit its payout to the cost of replacing the engine/outdrive. I don’t really know the exact cost, I but feel very certain that the cost of replacing your drivetrain would be well in excess of $10,000.  If that’s the best the product did, with a base cost of $787.50, I’d say you should do so well with your other investments.  A major engine or drive failure can easily run $5-6k.  It takes almost nothing to go wrong that wouldn’t cost you more than $787.50.  We are talking boat repair prices here. My recommendation is to focus on your feelings on this one.  Ignore what the $787.50 does for Mercury’s bottom line.  Be concerned with your bottom line. What you are buying with the warranty is called a stop-loss.  Simply put, it means that for the next four years, it can’t get any worse than $787.50.  It really is just that simple.  It is the only issue you need to focus on.  Do you like having that net underneath you?  Or do you enjoy the thrill of life without one?  How well do you sleep?  Base your decision with that in mind. There is no way to quantify the chances of you recouping your cost back. Two other thoughts to consider:  If you buy the warranty, and you should decide to sell the boat during the warranty period, you have also bought a stop loss for the potential buyer of your boat.  If you’ve never bought or sold in the used market, you have no idea how powerful an asset that warranty can be as a sales incentive.  There is no reason to think that the remaining term on the warranty wouldn’t be worth the full $787.50 to a buyer who doesn’t know you from Adam and doesn’t know the history of the boat.  It puts you a leg up on the competition.  Even if you like living without a net, your buyer might not, especially with a used boat.  Also, consider that you are buying your coverage directly from Mercury, not an after market company.  That means that any Mercury authorized warranty facility will honor that warranty without hesitation.  For $787.50, I think its a steal. Russ

Of course, all this assumes the company, whatever company (insurance or manufacturer), doesn’t fight actually HONORING this extended warranty.  We can always refuse to fix it and call it "water ingestion" or some other hole in the contract big enough to drive a Feadship through…… If you’re going to buy a contract, take the contract HOME and READ IT CAREFULLY.  Mark out all the huge holes with a magic marker, you know, where it says they don’t HAVE to fix it if they don’t want to.  Take the modified contract back to the dealer and get him, as representative of the company, to initial all the contractual changes. If he says he can’t, mail the contract back to the company and ask THEM to initial the contractual changes.  This way, you’ll at least get a contract that will actually force them to fix the boat, without you having to kiss their corporate asses and be a buddy-buddy with the dealer. READ THE CONTRACT, very carefully.  Look at all the "outs" their lawyers have written into it.  It can happen to you…it has me. Larry….Yamaha Y.E.S. contract.  Not worth the paper it’s printed on in ‘97.  They had no intention of ever honoring it.

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It is hard to believe but my first year of boating is almost over. Wow that was fast. Mercury says I bought the boat on Oct. 28 and they are offering an extended warranty. The details are: 2 Year    $472.50 3 Year    $640.50 4 year    $787.50 I have a 5.0 Mercruiser. My question is, should I even consider this? It seems that extended warranties are just an incredible revenue generator for the companies but with being new to this maybe this is warranted. I use the boat maybe two or three times a week at most. I think I have put about 35-40 hours on the boat this summer. Thanks in advance for any advise you have. Ron Share what you know. Learn what you don’t.

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My two cents worth. I believe it is worth it. I am getting it for my Merc 250hp outboard. $1900 for 3 years. Cheap when you think of shop hour charges and parts. Ask your dealer about his past worst case of how many hours to fix a nasty problem. Good Luck

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I have been boating for 13 years and I am on my 3rd vessel and all of them have had Mercruiser engines and outdrives and I have never ever had a problem that needed repairs either under warranty or outside of the warranty period. I have twin Mercs now on my new Maxum and declined the extended warranty…it is a revenue grabber..but I have peace of mind knowing my vessel has Mercs…I’ll not use anything else. Nshore – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – It is hard to believe but my first year of boating is almost over. Wow that was fast. Mercury says I bought the boat on Oct. 28 and they are offering an extended warranty. The details are: 2 Year    $472.50 3 Year    $640.50 4 year    $787.50 I have a 5.0 Mercruiser. My question is, should I even consider this? It seems that extended warranties are just an incredible revenue generator for the companies but with being new to this maybe this is warranted. I use the boat maybe two or three times a week at most. I think I have put about 35-40 hours on the boat this summer. Thanks in advance for any advise you have. Ron Share what you know. Learn what you don’t.

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I have a 1994 5.7 EFI by Volvo.  The extended warranty was approx. $1,500, $750 of that being a sales commission to the dealer.  I did not buy the warranty and have never had any warranty or non warranty work done on the engine.  All I did was scheduled maintenance which is not covered. Most of the "insurance" policies limited the total coverage or payout during the policy period to the total replacement cost of the engine, so if you have a real lemon of an engine, they will only repair it till your total claims reach the replacement costs of the engine.  It is a very very profitable insurance policy for the dealer and warranty company. — Jim 1994 Regal 256 for sale – see ad at http://www.classifieds2000.com/cgi-cls/ad.exe?P61+C189+A0+R1127049+Q2… 4 To see pictures of the boat’s layout visit: http://www.regalboats.com/htm/boats_commodore_258.shtml

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have been boating for 13 years and I am on my 3rd vessel and all of them have had Mercruiser engines and outdrives and I have never ever had a problem that needed repairs either under warranty or outside of the warranty period. I have twin Mercs now on my new Maxum and declined the extended warranty…it is a revenue grabber..but I have peace of mind knowing my vessel has Mercs…I’ll not use anything else. Nshore It is hard to believe but my first year of boating is almost over. Wow that was fast. Mercury says I bought the boat on Oct. 28 and they are offering an extended warranty. The details are: 2 Year    $472.50 3 Year    $640.50 4 year    $787.50 I have a 5.0 Mercruiser. My question is, should I even consider this? It seems that extended warranties are just an incredible revenue generator for the companies but with being new to this maybe this is warranted. I use the boat maybe two or three times a week at most. I think I have put about 35-40 hours on the boat this summer. Thanks in advance for any advise you have. Ron Share what you know. Learn what you don’t.

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Ron: My "new" boat is in its second season, and I just signed up for a 5 year comprehensive coverage, including the 5.7 L Mer-Cruiser and all components on the boat (Sea Ray). This is far from cheap, representing about 2% of the entire cost of the new boat, but for peace of mind, and a comfortable feeling about Sea Ray response to date, I decided to go for it. My decision is also partly based on my lack of strong mechanical skills. Marty in NJ

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Ron: My "new" boat is in its second season, and I just signed up for a 5 year comprehensive coverage, including the 5.7 L Mer-Cruiser and all components on the boat (Sea Ray). This is far from cheap, representing about 2% of the entire cost of the new boat, but for peace of mind, and a comfortable feeling about Sea Ray response to date, I decided to go for it. My decision is also partly based on my lack of strong mechanical skills. Marty in NJ

It’s all a gamble, of course, but, if *one* serious thing goes wrong with your engine when the standard warranty expires, your extended warranty will pay for itself. It’s also a good thing to have at trade or selling time. In NE Florida, it is damned hard to sell a rig if the engine doesn’t have at least a year or two left on extended warranty. — Harry Krause – - – - – - – - – - – - Democracy can withstand anything but democrats.

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – It is hard to believe but my first year of boating is almost over. Wow that was fast. Mercury says I bought the boat on Oct. 28 and they are offering an extended warranty. The details are: 2 Year    $472.50 3 Year    $640.50 4 year    $787.50 I have a 5.0 Mercruiser. My question is, should I even consider this? It seems that extended warranties are just an incredible revenue generator for the companies but with being new to this maybe this is warranted. I use the boat maybe two or three times a week at most. I think I have put about 35-40 hours on the boat this summer. Thanks in advance for any advise you have. Ron

Ron, here’s some food for thought about your warranty decision.  First, lets discuss the reasons you’ve heard why you shouldn’t buy it:  The most common reason is that the product is too profitable for the company who offers the warranty and/or the dealer who sells it to you.  Of course it is a profitable product.  Would you expect them to offer anything less?  Your boat was a profitable product when it was sold to you as well.  Maybe it is even an outrageously profitable product.  No matter how obscenely profitable it is, that issue is not your concern.  Your concern is simply to ask what will the outlay of $787.50 do for you.  It matters not to you that ten different boaters will tell you they’ve never had a breakdown.  What matters is the consequences to you if you do.  I’ve heard the argument that the warranty will limit its payout to the cost of replacing the engine/outdrive. I don’t really know the exact cost, I but feel very certain that the cost of replacing your drivetrain would be well in excess of $10,000.  If that’s the best the product did, with a base cost of $787.50, I’d say you should do so well with your other investments.  A major engine or drive failure can easily run $5-6k.  It takes almost nothing to go wrong that wouldn’t cost you more than $787.50.  We are talking boat repair prices here. My recommendation is to focus on your feelings on this one.  Ignore what the $787.50 does for Mercury’s bottom line.  Be concerned with your bottom line. What you are buying with the warranty is called a stop-loss.  Simply put, it means that for the next four years, it can’t get any worse than $787.50.  It really is just that simple.  It is the only issue you need to focus on.  Do you like having that net underneath you?  Or do you enjoy the thrill of life without one?  How well do you sleep?  Base your decision with that in mind. There is no way to quantify the chances of you recouping your cost back. Two other thoughts to consider:  If you buy the warranty, and you should decide to sell the boat during the warranty period, you have also bought a stop loss for the potential buyer of your boat.  If you’ve never bought or sold in the used market, you have no idea how powerful an asset that warranty can be as a sales incentive.  There is no reason to think that the remaining term on the warranty wouldn’t be worth the full $787.50 to a buyer who doesn’t know you from Adam and doesn’t know the history of the boat.  It puts you a leg up on the competition.  Even if you like living without a net, your buyer might not, especially with a used boat.  Also, consider that you are buying your coverage directly from Mercury, not an after market company.  That means that any Mercury authorized warranty facility will honor that warranty without hesitation.  For $787.50, I think its a steal. Russ

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Simple question, Ron…… Can you afford to fix it if it breaks? If Yes, to hell with warranties.  If they thought it was going to break expensively, they sure as hell wouldn’t let you off the hook for a few hundred bucks, would they.  Take you chances. If No, you’re strapped for cash and couldn’t afford a $2000 repair bill if it lunches….Insurance isn’t so bad, even IF they are making a killing selling it, which they ARE! You decide….. I buy very little insurance unless I think there is a disaster in the making….like house insurance, boat insurance, etc….that would wipe me out.  Breaking a V-8 and paying off the Mastercard I used to pay for it is MUCH cheaper than paying thousands for bogus insurance you’re going to have to fight with insurance bureaucrats to get them to pay.  NOONE ever refuses my MasterCard!! Larry….I’l fix it. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -It is hard to believe but my first year of boating is almost over. Wow that was fast. Mercury says I bought the boat on Oct. 28 and they are offering an extended warranty. The details are: 2 Year    $472.50 3 Year    $640.50 4 year    $787.50 I have a 5.0 Mercruiser. My question is, should I even consider this? It seems that extended warranties are just an incredible revenue generator for the companies but with being new to this maybe this is warranted. I use the boat maybe two or three times a week at most. I think I have put about 35-40 hours on the boat this summer. Thanks in advance for any advise you have. Ron Share what you know. Learn what you don’t.

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Question:

Yep, the Lindners have sold In-Fisherman to Primedia Inc. on Tuesday according to John Husar in his column in todays Chicago Tribune. Thoughts? Jay — I’d rather be chasing walleye’s at Tenmile Lake!

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If this means the Lindners tv presentations, thier style of presenting a full spectrum of fishing for ALL the various fish, the style and content of thier magazine, will all be changed or discarded,then yes,it’s truly a sad day for  thier thousands of fans.                                               ~ The Saint                                                        

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hell yeah its sad but all their magazines books and videos will be worth something in the future im keeping mine!!!                                      

Question:

Looking for any information on working Bamboo?–

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Looking for any information on working Bamboo?–

If you know any soldiers who have had experience in tropical jungle country they should know quite a lot about the use of bamboo.   Two genders  -  male and female – the male being smaller in diameter and more solid than the female which cam be of large diameter but hollw with relatively thin walls.   Chairs are more often made from Rattan which grows in conditions similst]r to bamboo and has very sharp spikes amongst its leaves.   That is about all I can tell you as I have only used it within the jungle scene using a khukri to cut it and split it to make beds, tables and the like.   The hollow inside the female variety is good for cooking rice or stuffing with explosive. — Charles (Joe) Stahelin Huddersfield, West Yorkshire, UK

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Looking for any information on working Bamboo?– If you know any soldiers who have had experience in tropical jungle country they should know quite a lot about the use of bamboo.   Two genders  -  male and female – the male being smaller in diameter and more solid than the female which cam be of large diameter but hollw with relatively thin walls.   Chairs are more often made from Rattan which grows in conditions similst]r to bamboo and has very sharp spikes amongst its leaves.   That is about all I can tell you as I have only used it within the jungle scene using a khukri to cut it and split it to make beds, tables and the like.   The hollow inside the female variety is good for cooking rice or stuffing with explosive.

Please do not forget its use as an ersatz mortar tube. Propped up at an angle and lashed to another piece of bamboo which had been lashed horizontally between two trees. To this day I cannot figure out how they managed to get the trajectories so close!

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I have seen bamboo laminates (3-ply) used for flooring recently.  According to the literature I read, it is actually harder than Red Oak, and makes a very interesting floor due to the very fine grain, or what resembles grain, and the nodes seem to be spaced very uniformily.  I have no idea how they remanufacture the finished product, but I am assuming they use the Timber type which grows 60+feet in a season.  I’d be interested to know how they mill it, etc..  Good luck. . .

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Intermediate Technology Publications publishes a book entitled:         Building with Bamboo: A handbook , Second Edition It is 88 pages and costs 9 pounds.  It discusses preparing bamboo for construction use, joints, and common building practices.  Please email me if you want more information re: publisher address, etc. Sorry, I discarded the original poster’s name and address. Douglas Stockman

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I have seen bamboo laminates (3-ply) used for flooring recently. According to the literature I read, it is actually harder than Red Oak, and makes a very interesting floor due to the very fine grain, or what resembles grain, and the nodes seem to be spaced very uniformily.  I have no idea how they remanufacture the finished product, but I am assuming they use the Timber type which grows 60+feet in a season.  I’d be interested to know how they mill it, etc..  Good luck. . . Bamboo’s actually a very fast growing species of grass, grows something like 1-2" per day.  It’s a light weight, excellent material for things like kite frames or construction scaffolding.  I’ve seen pics in Nat. Geo. of Taiwanese construction crews using the stuff for scaffolds reaching 10-12 stories above ground.  It can be worked by splitting, planing, and scraping.

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I’m new to the group…So far I like what I see.. I am looking for 2" diameter or larger bamboo to use for door frame and window frame in a special project. I searched all of my suppliers here in the Southeast. Closest I got was fresh stalks from the Atlanta Zoo. I would like something that was already cured. I would appreciate a suppliers name and number. Thanks in advance. David Holec Exhibit Manager SciTrek – Science and Tecnology Adventure Atlanta GA

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Hello, My dad has some contacts in Japan and could get some Japanes bamboo (larger diameter), but probably wouldn’t be cost effective unless you wanted a large amount. There is a forum about bamboo at www.woodfibre.com.  You might want to pose the same question there and they should be able to help. Don Yasaki HH & NK Co., Ltd.   Kings Mtn., NC Kiln-dried Hardwoods – Sawmill Direct Prices tel (704) 739-6914             fax (704) 739-7336 http://www.unc.edu/~dyasaki – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’m new to the group…So far I like what I see.. I am looking for 2" diameter or larger bamboo to use for door frame and window frame in a special project. I searched all of my suppliers here in the Southeast. Closest I got was fresh stalks from the Atlanta Zoo. I would like something that was already cured. I would appreciate a suppliers name and number. Thanks in advance. David Holec Exhibit Manager SciTrek – Science and Tecnology Adventure Atlanta GA

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Try these two URL’s: http://www.bamboo.org/abs/ http://www.communety.com/mintec/welcome.html Keith Bohn b2d – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I’m new to the group…So far I like what I see.. I am looking for 2" diameter or larger bamboo to use for door frame and window frame in a special project. I searched all of my suppliers here in the Southeast. Closest I got was fresh stalks from the Atlanta Zoo. I would like something that was already cured. I would appreciate a suppliers name and number. Thanks in advance. David Holec Exhibit Manager SciTrek – Science and Tecnology Adventure Atlanta GA

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Does anyone have ideas or plans for making things out of Bamboo trees? – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –

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Does anyone have ideas or plans for making things out of Bamboo trees?

Sure. I make split bamboo flyfishing rods. By the way bamboo is more properly called a plant, not a tree. Darryl Hayashida

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Does anyone have ideas or plans for making things out of Bamboo trees?

No plans unfortunately, but look at some books dealing with late 19th century furniture design – in England and America there was a craze (Japonisme) for anything with an Asian aesthetic and faux (and real) bamboo chairs, cabinets, hall trees and such were briefly "all the rage".  Most of this furniture was painted in black, gold, white, or other color combinations… Kevin

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Does anyone have ideas or plans for making things out of Bamboo trees?

        Bamboo is a grass not a tree.  It is a plant but that is too general a term.         I do not know of any books of making things with bamboo.  I a sure I have never seen one.         I will through in this piece of advice from experience.  Do NOT try to blast a driveway through a bamboo hedge with explosives.  This is a ver bad move.         Riley

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Sure. I make split bamboo flyfishing rods. By the way bamboo is more properly called a plant, not a tree.

Try a grass.

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Does anyone have ideas or plans for making things out of Bamboo trees?

Fly rods!!!  Try FWW #34:68.  Hoagy B. Carmichael (Stardust’s son) wrote a great book on making them. Also, you can build scaffolding with it.  Check out building construction in Indonesia, and other SE Asian countries. mccs

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Does anyone have ideas or plans for making things out of Bamboo trees?

Actually, bamboo is a pretty versatile building material. My projects recently have  jinvolved making tables out of bamboo. The legs and table-top base are made using normal lengths of bamboo. The surface of the table-top is made by splitting the bamboo longitudinally to make about inch thick panels which can be nailed to the table-top base. My attempts so far have been a bit rough, but the result is not too bad. Cheers, Brendan. — C.S. Dept., James Cook University,        Phone:  (077) 815085. Townsville, QLD, 4811.  Australia.        There’s only one catch – Catch 22.

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Does anyone have ideas or plans for making things out of Bamboo trees?

Sure. I make split bamboo flyfishing rods. By the way bamboo is more properly called a plant, not a tree. Darryl Hayashida

There is almost nothing you can’t make out of bamboo.  It’s a whole technology all by itself.  You should be able to find several good books in your library. Miles Hollister

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Sure. I make split bamboo flyfishing rods. By the way bamboo is more properly called a plant, not a tree.

It is indeed not a tree, but I believe you meant that it is a grass, not that it is a plant (which is of course true.) The fact that it is a grass accounts for the strange chambered structure, as well as its astonishing growth rate. (I read these things in a recent industrial design magazine discussing bamboo’s usefulness, growth worldwide. Sorry, don’t remember the title.) Karl

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Question:

I want to get a book that contains fly fishing knots for both fresh and salt water use. I know that lefty kreh and mark sosin have a book out called practical fishing knots and practical fishing knots II. What is the difference between these books. which one is better for fly fishing knots? any response would be appreciated.                                 Dave

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Practical Fishing Knots II is the 2nd edition of Practical Fishing Knots. It’s an excellent book. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I want to get a book that contains fly fishing knots for both fresh and salt water use. I know that lefty kreh and mark sosin have a book out called practical fishing knots and practical fishing knots II. What is the difference between these books. which one is better for fly fishing knots? any response would be appreciated. Dave

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No offense to Lefty and Mark, they are tops. However, their books on knots, while best sellers are sort of twisted. Just try tying a Bimini twist for the first time with one knee as stated in their instructions. You can get better basic info for the majority of knots for free by writing Ande Monofilament, 1310 53rd St. West Palm Beach, FL 33407…. Much better instructions. Bob Elliott, Rochester, NY (no connection to Ande) – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I want to get a book that contains fly fishing knots for both fresh and salt water use. I know that lefty kreh and mark sosin have a book out called practical fishing knots and practical fishing knots II. What is the difference between these books. which one is better for fly fishing knots? any response would be appreciated.                                 Dave

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 Knots on the Web (Peter Suber) is a great site with eveything you could ever want to know about all kinds of knots.  It’s one of those pages that makes you say "WOW, I had no idea THIS many people were fascinated by KNOTS!"   From there, you can find specific pages that meet your needs and interests.  Try using your browser to search the page for the word "fish" if you don’t feel like scan the page manually for fishing-related knot pages.  There are several that are fly fishing-specific. In case your news reader doesn’t support html, the URL is: http://www.earlham.edu/~peters/knotlink.htm Hope it helps, Joe Bollinger – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I want to get a book that contains fly fishing knots for both fresh and salt water use. I know that lefty kreh and mark sosin have a book out called practical fishing knots and practical fishing knots II. What is the difference between these books. which one is better for fly fishing knots? any response would be appreciated.                                 Dave

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Question:

Hi Dave, Hear is another stream flow site, it covers the whole US: http://h2o.usgs.gov/swr/ Once you get to that page, then you select a state and from there…? Tight Lines Al Beatty BT’s Fly Fishing Products Bozeman, MT (96 catalog)

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: Anyone heard how the Deschutes is doing now?  I know a month ago the : rains had the flow way up.  Has it calmed down?  Anyone catching fish : there? : Regards, :       Bill

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Anyone heard how the Deschutes is doing now?  I know a month ago the rains had the flow way up.  Has it calmed down?  Anyone catching fish there? Regards,    Bill

Hi Bill, Just out last Sunday on the Deschutes. It has calmed down alot since I first went out last month. I got a 17-inch native redside on a stonefly nymph. Alot of the bank vegitation has been either washed away or knocked down. I would say about 60% of it is gone. But I have bee fishing it three times in the last month and have had great succes on nymphs. I have seen very little hatch activity. The river flow now is about 5,000 cfs which is usually the max that you want to be fishing. Ideal is 3,000-4,000 cfs. You can call the PGE fish line at 503-464-7474 which will give you flow info on the Deschutes, Sandy, and Clackamas rivers. Right now the story on the D is nymphs and riffles. Good Luck Dan Root Portland, Oregon

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Anyone heard how the Deschutes is doing now?  I know a month ago the rains had the flow way up.  Has it calmed down?  Anyone catching fish there?

Just talked to Cy Happy at Ray’s River Dories who floated the river on the 13th and 14th from Warm Springs to Maupin.  Flows were 5700cfs, the visibility was good at about 3 feet.  No visible hatches but Cy reported good fishing with stonefly nymphs. He mentioned that the fish were active and strong and showed few apparent effects from the strong stream flows earlier. He also cautioned boatmen that the river is different from before.  For example, there is a new large boulder in Whitehorse that has already claimed at least one boat

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Anyone heard how the Deschutes is doing now?  I know a month ago the rains had the flow way up.  Has it calmed down?  Anyone catching fish there? Regards,         Bill

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Anyone heard how the Deschutes is doing now?  I know a month ago the rains had the flow way up.  Has it calmed down?  Anyone catching fish there? Regards,        Bill

Check out this USGS website–gives you streamflow stats every half-hour, fresh from space.   http://wwworegon.wr.usgs.gov/rt dir/realtime/data/man.14103000.html (Work back from here for stats on other rivers.)

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Question:

You bet! I’m Mike Jackson and I’m headed back to the 59th parallel, North Seal River flowage, in far northern Manitoba this summer. I was there last year in late July and my friend and I caught hundreds of pike between 25 and 30 lbs.  I am certain this is the year we will catch pike over 30 lbs., either on a fly rod, spoons, bucktails or surface baits. I am an outdoor writer in the Chicago area. I also host an outdoor radio talk show every week and travel around Canada looking for monster pike. This fantastic fishing is at Gangler’s Steven’s-Nicklin Lake 5-star outpost camp. We’ll stay overnight in Winnipeg, Manitoba Fri., Aug. 16. At around 6:30 Sat. morning, we’ll board Gangler’s private jet and fly to Lynn Lake, Manitoba. From there, we’ll transfer to  a twin-engine float plan which takes us to the Steven’s-Nicklin outpost. We’ll be into trophy pike by late morning. This 5-star outpost outshines many of the main lodges I’ve visited over the last 30 years. This beautiful location boasts two new oversized cabins with two separate bedrooms each, for parties of 4. There’s a full kitchen, bathroom, living room, with couches and screened porch in each cabin. All food is included. 24 hour electricity and a camp manager is on hand as well. I have room for 8 people the week of Aug. 16-24. The cost for 7 days of trophy pike, lake trout and grayling angling is $1,995. That includes airfare from Winnipeg.  There are always bargain flights available to Winnipeg from many locations in the midwest. The hotel and the flight to Winnipeg are the only added expense. If you’re interested, call Gangler’s Lodges, 1-800-23-LODGE and tell them you want go fishing with Mike Jackson the week of Aug. 16-24. This is the fresh water pike trip of a lifetime!                                   ******

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=You bet! =I’m Mike Jackson and I’m headed back to the 59th parallel, North =Seal River flowage, in far northern Manitoba this summer. I was Sigh, another ad….. Keep the ads out of these newsgroups, dude! =there last year in late July and my friend and I caught hundreds =of pike between 25 and 30 lbs.  I am certain this is the year we I personally doubt that you caught _hundreds_ of pike between 25 and 30 lbs, but none over 30 pounds. If there were that many just under 30 there would also have been some over 30, methinks. You could also say that hundreds of pike under 30 pounds but none sofar _over_ 30 seems to indicate that those waters don’t hold any bigger pike than that, possibly because there isn’t enough food for them to grow any bigger….. [snip] =If you’re interested, call Gangler’s Lodges, 1-800-xx-xxxxx and =tell them you want go fishing with Mike Jackson the week of Aug. =16-24. This is the fresh water pike trip of a lifetime! Nah. If you _really_ want to have a go at monster pike you should go to Sweden. Some of the best, if not _the_ best pike fishing in the world can be found among the hundreds of islands in the archipelago east of Stockholm (in the brackish coastal waters of the Baltic Sea). The current record pike is over 60 pounds, and a number of 45-pounders are caught every year….. — S.Wendel

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