Fly Fishing Fisherman Wiki » Fly Fishing Flies

Nymph swap update

admin — Fri, 27 Dec 2002 00:00:00 +0000

Question:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Stan, I’m tracing my package via the internet, an option I didn’t have with the batch that got lost, since I sent that one with ordinary mail. Anyway, the package has already left Sweden and is flewn over the Atlantic Ocean this very minute. With a bit of luck it should arrive on Friday. Them flies are getting to be really expensive, I mean, they were tied twice and sent twice. If only I could say that I was a good tier it might have made sense, but since I said I would send flies I felt I had to give it another try.

I, for one, appreciate the "stand-by-your-commitment" attitude you display. — TL, Tim . . .and you aren’t going to make your money back based on the ones *I* tied.

Response:

/Roger If I were into fly fishing and related stuff to make money, with my approach I’d be named a bankrupt idiot. =)

Response:

Nothing to report really, nothing has arrived since Monday. As far as I can tell, here’s the latest tally: Already received: *Scott Seidman: tungsten-beaded sulfur nymph *Stan Gula: Zug Bug variant *Tim Johnson: PT nymph *Svend Tang-Petersen: poxy back general mayfly *Randy Kane: flash back PT *John Whiteley: Sawyer PT *Stephen Welsh: Peacock and Possum *Wolfgang: Plain vanilla GRHE *Joe Fleischman: GRW *Jim Rahn: ‘The Generic’ *Shawn Armstrong: Gold Bead Head Cress Bug *Hans van der Stroom: Ritz D Waiting for: Rocktrout(aka Bouncer): Mountain Midge Roger Ohlund: caddis pupae, with beadhead Clark Reid: unknown Herman Nijland: suspender polder nymph Paul Goodwin: a surprise Bouncer, what’s your status? Does anybody have his email address? Roger feels his package is lost (he mailed it 3 weeks ago) and will be sending another set by package courier instead of post. Next Thursday is Thanksgiving and I’m going to be tied up with transportation, shopping and chef duties most of the week so it looks like we will wait until Saturday at least. I’ll check in then and we can decide what to do about missing flies. On Saturday we can decide the ultimate cutoff date, but I propose that we need to (at come point) distribute the ones I’ve received, and all participants, whether their delivery is here or not, should get a set. Any late arriving flies will be donated to 2003 claves or other worthy cause at my discretion. One set will be saved for Tim Apple, and at least one set will be donated to Dave LaCourse’s friend in Maine. –Stan

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Nothing to report really, nothing has arrived since Monday. As far as I can tell, here’s the latest tally: Already received: *Scott Seidman: tungsten-beaded sulfur nymph *Stan Gula: Zug Bug variant *Tim Johnson: PT nymph *Svend Tang-Petersen: poxy back general mayfly *Randy Kane: flash back PT *John Whiteley: Sawyer PT *Stephen Welsh: Peacock and Possum *Wolfgang: Plain vanilla GRHE *Joe Fleischman: GRW *Jim Rahn: ‘The Generic’ *Shawn Armstrong: Gold Bead Head Cress Bug *Hans van der Stroom: Ritz D Waiting for: Rocktrout(aka Bouncer): Mountain Midge Roger Ohlund: caddis pupae, with beadhead Clark Reid: unknown Herman Nijland: suspender polder nymph Paul Goodwin: a surprise Bouncer, what’s your status? Does anybody have his email address? Roger feels his package is lost (he mailed it 3 weeks ago) and will be sending another set by package courier instead of post. Next Thursday is Thanksgiving and I’m going to be tied up with transportation, shopping and chef duties most of the week so it looks like we will wait until Saturday at least. I’ll check in then and we can decide what to do about missing flies. On Saturday we can decide the ultimate cutoff date, but I propose that we need to (at come point) distribute the ones I’ve received, and all participants, whether their delivery is here or not, should get a set. Any late arriving flies will be donated to 2003 claves or other worthy cause at my discretion. One set will be saved for Tim Apple, and at least one set will be donated to Dave LaCourse’s friend in Maine. –Stan

Sounds good to me, Stan, tho I’m in no rush personally. These nymphs in no way resemble anything I’ll be fishin with in Dec! Let’s put off the real decision till the Tues or Wed after Thanksgiving, if you don’t mind, to give travellers a chance to get home, and holiday mail lags a chance to catch up. I have no trouble with the everyone whos in gets a set thing, whether flies show or not. Makes the latecoming flies collectors items, and a challenge to complete your set! Kind of like baseball cards when I was a kid. — Scott Reverse first field of address to reply

Response:

I thought it was wayno and/or Wolfgang that had this, er, problem. — TL, Tim

Response:

Stan, I’m tracing my package via the internet, an option I didn’t have with the batch that got lost, since I sent that one with ordinary mail. Anyway, the package has already left Sweden and is flewn over the Atlantic Ocean this very minute. With a bit of luck it should arrive on Friday. Them flies are getting to be really expensive, I mean, they were tied twice and sent twice. If only I could say that I was a good tier it might have made sense, but since I said I would send flies I felt I had to give it another try. /Roger Still have my fingers crossed though, one never knows where the mail might fail.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have heard from Herman and Roger that their flies are on the way.

Response:

One more time… Here we are two weeks past the deadline, and still waiting. Clark’s flies arrived today (and I spilled them all over my kitchen floor) but there are still two non-US entries missing in the mail, and two US entries just plain missing in action. I have heard from Herman and Roger that their flies are on the way. Since I’ll be very busy this week and I can’t do the packaging and mailing until Sunday anyway, I’m going to wait until then. I really want to give Roger and Herman a chance because I think these non-US flies are worth the wait. Salmonfly and Bouncer, this is your last notice – if you’re in contact me. On Sunday I start packaging. –Stan (nymphs everywhere)

Response:

Nothing to report really, nothing has arrived since Monday. As far as I can tell, here’s the latest tally:

Well heck; if’n I’d known I had this much time I’d have tied better flies. Joe F.

Response:

Gotta love a fly called "Trout Crack." Pretty soon, you’re on the stuff solid, rarely sleeping, breaking close family ties, sleeping outdoors, and waking up with week-old stubble and a wicked hangover. My stubble is more like 25 years old, but that sure sounds familiar.

Yeah, that was Penns Clave #1 — Scott Reverse first field of address to reply

Response:

Here’s a (bad) picture of the full set so you can get a dim idea what’s coming. http://gula.org/images/flies.jpg Gotta love a fly called "Trout Crack."

It’s not funny. At first you just have a little on a recreational basis. Pretty soon, you’re on the stuff solid, rarely sleeping, breaking close family ties, sleeping outdoors, and waking up with week-old stubble and a wicked hangover. — TL, Tim Of course, you could just be at a ‘clave.

Response:

My stubble is more like 25 years old, but that sure sounds familiar.

Response:

They start going out today. All the preaddressed containers are going out in an hour. The others, where I have to write addresses, are going tomorrow. Here’s a (bad) picture of the full set so you can get a dim idea what’s coming. http://gula.org/images/flies.jpg Hope you all are enjoying the holidays!

Good job, swapmeister pro tem — Scott Reverse first field of address to reply

Response:

Here’s a (bad) picture of the full set so you can get a dim idea what’s coming. http://gula.org/images/flies.jpg

Gotta love a fly called "Trout Crack." Frank Reid

Response:

Shut Up and Fish…

admin — Mon, 11 Nov 2002 00:00:00 +0000

Question:

Response:

Willi, consider the other stuff out available on ROFF lately to campare with. You haven’t made much of a case. Riverman does better than HWMNBN2 in the TR department but can’t keep from joining his buddy in the elitist leftwing garbage he spews. Frankly, riverman doesn’t impress me in either the trip report department or his opinions. I see nothing useful in either. Scott’s TR with the Scouts far outdoes riverman’s disconnected ramblings. — Wayne To Fish is Human…To Release Divine! – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I think that Riverman’s reports have been some of the best stuff on ROFF in a while. Willi

Response:

I disagree, and found riverman’s "ramblings" to be interesting reading. That doesn’t have to reflect that I agree or disagree with the positions, just that I find it interesting. — TL, Tim

Response:

That spells and it out and confirms what I just wrote. Look at your taste in everything else! — Wayne To Fish is Human…To Release Divine!

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I found riverman’s "ramblings" to be interesting reading. just that I find it interesting. — TL, Tim

Response:

Frankly, riverman doesn’t impress me in either the trip report department or his opinions. I see nothing useful in either.

So quit reading them. Myron’s a good guy and I have enjoyed his reports as well as his company. — Charlie…

Response:

I was fishing yesterday. Today, I work. And, tomorrow, and Wednesday, etc. until the weekend. Then, I fish, again. It is an easy enough pattern to follow. And yet, yes, I am at my computer today. Sometimes you get to read some good yarnspin about fishing here that makes the Monday through Friday go a little quicker. I just don’t see all the need for the bitching and whining. So, if it makes sense, I’ll post what I did this weekend. I’ll probably get slammed, but at least I won’t be bitchin’. enjoy. Scott

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Amazing how the semi-professional trolls sense an opportunity and jump into ROFF from time to time. Even more amazing is how the elitist shitheads like HWMNBN2 and his alterego, riverman, jump in to attempt to mold responses to their own view of the world. What make it especially sad is their only view comes from something somebody in the liberal press told them to think last week. Just keep in mind Scott, if you were fishing you wouldn’t be typing away on your computer. Cool and rainy here today but I would still be in the mountains fishing if I didn’t have museum work to do. Between armloads of exhibit material coming inside, I just stopped in to see what ROFF was doing today. Just like a soap opera, same ol’ same ol’. — Wayne To Fish is Human…To Release Divine! That thread titled ROFF SPLIT UP is a real flamer. Are yall gonna talk or fish? Scott

Response:

I disagree. I don’t think he is a good guy and I don’t enjoy his reports which is why I don’t read them, just excerpts when someone references them. Of course, I’ve never considered your taste exemplary either. Choc. — Wayne To Fish is Human…To Release Divine!

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Frankly, riverman doesn’t impress me in either the trip report department or his opinions. I see nothing useful in either. So quit reading them. Myron’s a good guy and I have enjoyed his reports as well as his company. — Charlie…

Response:

That spells and it out and confirms what I just wrote. Look at your taste in everything else! — Wayne To Fish is Human…To Release Divine! I found riverman’s "ramblings" to be interesting reading. just that I find it interesting.

Hmmm, interesting snipping. By design? — TL, Tim BTW, my taste looks okay to me. Many here would agree.

Response:

Of course, I’ve never considered your taste exemplary either.

Oh well, I suppose I can deal with that. — Charlie…

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Willi, consider the other stuff out available on ROFF lately to campare with. You haven’t made much of a case. Riverman does better than HWMNBN2 in the TR department but can’t keep from joining his buddy in the elitist leftwing garbage he spews. Frankly, riverman doesn’t impress me in either the trip report department or his opinions. I see nothing useful in either. Scott’s TR with the Scouts far outdoes riverman’s disconnected ramblings. — Wayne To Fish is Human…To Release Divine! I think that Riverman’s reports have been some of the best stuff on ROFF in a while. Willi

Careful, Wayne– two different "Scotts" are posting lately. I assure you, I’m the original, and this is my first post on this thread!! As for leftwing, as opposed to one nifty Bush joke, I think I’ve been pretty even tempered lately. — Scott Reverse first field of address to reply

Response:

As for leftwing, as opposed to one nifty Bush joke, I think I’ve been pretty even tempered lately.

Unless you’re referring to my recent use of the word jacknut I was being somewhat pro-gun there, though so it doesn’t get added to my bleeding heart posts! — Scott Reverse first field of address to reply

Response:

Willi, consider the other stuff out available on ROFF lately to campare with. You haven’t made much of a case. Riverman does better than HWMNBN2 in the TR department but can’t keep from joining his buddy in the elitist leftwing garbage he spews. Frankly, riverman doesn’t impress me in either the trip report department or his opinions. I see nothing useful in either. Scott’s TR with the Scouts far outdoes riverman’s disconnected ramblings. I think you just don’t like him. I found his African reports were VERY interesting. Now we have HWMNBN2? I’ll be dammed (it is a fishing group) if I know who you’re referring to. Willi

Response:

So quit reading them. Myron’s a good guy and I have enjoyed his reports as well as his company. Myron!!!!!!! No wonder he goes by riverman. Willi

Response:

Read the parts needed when others comment, particularly when relative to my posts. — Wayne To Fish is Human…To Release Divine! – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I disagree. I don’t think he is a good guy and I don’t enjoy his reports which is why I don’t read them, just excerpts when someone references them. Of course, I’ve never considered your taste exemplary either. Choc. Well, if you don’t read them how in the hell can you comment on them? Willi

Response:

No intent to imply you relate to the riverman, HWMNBN2 leftist geoup, Scott. Besides, telling the Scotts apart is sometimes as difficult as telling the Waynes or even the Franks apart! — Wayne To Fish is Human…To Release Divine!

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Careful, Wayne– two different "Scotts" are posting lately. I assure you, I’m the original, and this is my first post on this thread!! As for leftwing, as opposed to one nifty Bush joke, I think I’ve been pretty even tempered lately. — Scott Reverse first field of address to reply

Response:

Easy one Willi, HWMNBN2 is Wayno’s buddy fortenberry…ooops! Sorry for mentioning the name and apologies to all the distaff readers for the using such disgusting language! — Wayne To Fish is Human…To Release Divine! – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Willi, consider the other stuff out available on ROFF lately to campare with. You haven’t made much of a case. Riverman does better than HWMNBN2 in the TR department but can’t keep from joining his buddy in the elitist leftwing garbage he spews. Frankly, riverman doesn’t impress me in either the trip report department or his opinions. I see nothing useful in either. Scott’s TR with the Scouts far outdoes riverman’s disconnected ramblings. I think you just don’t like him. I found his African reports were VERY interesting. Now we have HWMNBN2? I’ll be dammed (it is a fishing group) if I know who you’re referring to. Willi

Response:

Yeah, i knew you’d be crushed. — Wayne To Fish is Human…To Release Divine!

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Of course, I’ve never considered your taste exemplary either. Oh well, I suppose I can deal with that. — Charlie…

Response:

Easy one Willi, HWMNBN2 is Wayno’s buddy fortenberry…ooops! Sorry for mentioning the name and apologies to all the distaff readers for the using such disgusting language!

Ouch! Being named AFTER someone that he refers to as "the village idiot" must hurt. Willi

Response:

Blah blah blah

What the hell are you talking about Wayne? Did you forget to put the foil in your hat this morning? Kevin

Response:

That thread titled ROFF SPLIT UP is a real flamer. Are yall gonna talk or fish? Scott

Response:

Amazing how the semi-professional trolls sense an opportunity and jump into ROFF from time to time. Even more amazing is how the elitist shitheads like HWMNBN2 and his alterego, riverman, jump in to attempt to mold responses to their own view of the world. What make it especially sad is their only view comes from something somebody in the liberal press told them to think last week. Just keep in mind Scott, if you were fishing you wouldn’t be typing away on your computer. Cool and rainy here today but I would still be in the mountains fishing if I didn’t have museum work to do. Between armloads of exhibit material coming inside, I just stopped in to see what ROFF was doing today. Just like a soap opera, same ol’ same ol’. — Wayne To Fish is Human…To Release Divine!

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – That thread titled ROFF SPLIT UP is a real flamer. Are yall gonna talk or fish? Scott

Response:

… Are yall gonna talk or fish?

Why yes, yes we are. — Ken Fortenberry- that’s the royal "we" for all the nitpicky nitwits

Response:

Fat Alberts at Cape Lookout N.C. The hot spot of flyfishing–Sizzling runs into your backing- 10 to 20 Albies before you are too tired of chasing,or they had busted enough of your tackle or knucles that you couldN’t get another fly in the water.–Indian Joe replies —– We were on water bu 7AM (early bird gets worm?]) Good boat Regulator 21 rigged for FF–good guide–rained the day before so we went outside IN OPEN OCEAN to find clear water’. Had to go over Lookout bar in big waves so got a good salt water shower—chased birds [they look like they found so0mething] and listened to radios of other guides for FIVE hours in mild waves until one guy radios -I,v got them they are all over water!!! All boats race farther into the ocean but by time we all arrived the (fish) had gone down. our guide continued to hunt and we begin to hit small pods of feeding fish. He put us just about on them and we weakly cast into pods –fish took our flies -ran into backing – then we reeled them in—sort of like work- but when guide lifted them into boat-we took necessary picture–everyone slapped everyone and said [GOOD FISH] [sort of like bass guys on TV] and we roared off to catch up with another pod. throw fly in water-good fish -slapp etc. I caught a couple on spinning tackle and only differece from fly rod your pole did not bend as much!! As darkness threatened we headed in–after TEN hours in an open boat bouncing around I handed my guide a check and thought NEXT TIME YOU WILL HAVE TO PAY ME TO GO

Response:

Hiked for an hour uphill to a stream with 6 inch fish I couldn’t keep by law even if I wanted. Stumbled over rocks and tore a hole in my waders on brush. Caught 6 skinny fish with no resistance at all on a 3 wt. rod and 6X tippet. This kind of fishing stinks. Hiked into a so-called trout creek with 30 other guys standing in the water up and down the creek about 30 yards apart. Everyone fished the water in his immediate vicinity. Caught nothing but enough rocks to lose my flys on. After a couple of hours of zero catch fishing I slogged back to the car to find a bunch of grouches bitching about exactly the same thing. This kind of fishing stinks. Walked 30 yards from my car on a flat sand beach only to find a bunch of spin fishermen catching stripers all around the bridge pilings. Couldn’t get close enough to get a single cast off. I had to stand out in the dark away from the bridge and flail away for hours in featureless ocean only to catch the occasional Grey trout. They call them weak fish and their fruitless struggle against a 9 wt. showed them to be aptly named. Got sand in my gear. Caught no stripers. Went home. This kind of fishing stinks. This fly fishing stuff really sucks and anybody who does it is wasting his time. Fly fishing really stinks. — Wayne To Fish is Human…To Release Divine!

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Fat Alberts at Cape Lookout N.C. The hot spot of flyfishing–Sizzling runs into your backing- 10 to 20 Albies before you are too tired of chasing,or they had busted enough of your tackle or knucles that you couldN’t get another fly in the water.–Indian Joe replies —– We were on water bu 7AM (early bird gets worm?]) Good boat Regulator 21 rigged for FF–good guide–rained the day before so we went outside IN OPEN OCEAN to find clear water’. Had to go over Lookout bar in big waves so got a good salt water shower—chased birds [they look like they found so0mething] and listened to radios of other guides for FIVE hours in mild waves until one guy radios -I,v got them they are all over water!!! All boats race farther into the ocean but by time we all arrived the (fish) had gone down. our guide continued to hunt and we begin to hit small pods of feeding fish. He put us just about on them and we weakly cast into pods –fish took our flies -ran into backing – then we reeled them in—sort of like work- but when guide lifted them into boat-we took necessary picture–everyone slapped everyone and said [GOOD FISH] [sort of like bass guys on TV] and we roared off to catch up with another pod. throw fly in water-good fish -slapp etc. I caught a couple on spinning tackle and only differece from fly rod your pole did not bend as much!! As darkness threatened we headed in–after TEN hours in an open boat bouncing around I handed my guide a check and thought NEXT TIME YOU WILL HAVE TO PAY ME TO GO

Response:

Proficient: The Most Difficult Skill

admin — Fri, 18 Oct 2002 00:00:00 +0000

Question:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I would rate line control as the most difficult, especially when nymphing. When the fish are rising, you don’t have to be able to read water. There are other satellite skills worth mentioning: fly tying rodbuilding photography writing story telling teaching tree/plant/bird/animal identification map reading bullshitting/evasiveness sleuthing/gleaning info from other fishermen Any others?

ROFF survival skills are in need if one is not internet impaired. Flyfish

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – A discussion in another thread got me to thinking. Which of the skills involved in angling with a fly requires the most effort to achieve proficiency ? A (incomplete, feel free to add your own) list of skills includes: Casting Line control Reading water Wading without doing a "Reid" Fly selection Convincing SWMBO to let you go fishing in the first place Of all these "skills" I believe reading water is the most difficult to become proficient at. And casting, I would rate casting as the easiest. Give me 20 minutes and I can teach someone to cast well enough to fish.

I agree that the reading of the water (& fish within) is the most challenging (and rewarding) aspect of fly angling, though I won’t necessarily concur that it is the most "difficult". Reading the water is more or less an experience related thing, and you have to have experienced the occasion to be able to learn from it. However, that being said, some people are more observant than others, and will learn something about a specific thing from a singular exposure to the observation of whatever that thing might be. The slower learners might have to observe the phenomena many times before fully understanding it. Perhaps "difficult" should encompass the degree of pure ability of eyesight that is required to master the reading of the water & fish, as that is the key limiting factor of the human body & its application to flyfishing? Keen sight and observation and a willingness to learn are the key elements in reading a water (for me that water is a troutstream). Regards, Michael.

Response:

Patience was a worthy addition, which would go hand in hand with memory – remembering past lessons learned and forgotten. …after that I would go into fly selection which is greatly tied to entomology and presentation..perhaps a dash of line control. ….but then I don’t know squat, I just like to fish…john

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – A discussion in another thread got me to thinking. Which of the skills involved in angling with a fly requires the most effort to achieve proficiency ? A (incomplete, feel free to add your own) list of skills includes: Casting Line control Reading water Wading without doing a "Reid" Fly selection Convincing SWMBO to let you go fishing in the first place Of all these "skills" I believe reading water is the most difficult to become proficient at. And casting, I would rate casting as the easiest. Give me 20 minutes and I can teach someone to cast well enough to fish. — Ken Fortenberry

Response:

Patience. Steve

Response:

I would add . . . Accepting that the fish are doing what the fish are doing, and not what I would want them to be doing, AND then. . . using appropriate rig and technique accordingly. …

Exactly correct. If the fish are not taking dry flies I accept that and use the appropriate rig, a can of cold Budweiser and a spliff. The "technique" is called "listening to the river sing sweet songs". I am not, as our esteemed correspondent from Sweden would suggest, totally clueless about nymphing. I will confess to having done it, as recently as on the Muskegon and on the San Juan, to provide ROFFian references. But anymore, fishing is more important than catching fish, and I’ll stick to dries if it’s OK with ya’ll. — Ken Fortenberry

Response:

Line control, aka presentation. George Adams "All good fishermen stay young until they die, for fishing is the only dream of youth that doth not grow stale with age." —- J.W Muller

Response:

Casting

Nope, you can teach a monkey how to cast a fly line. Line control

That’s the winner. I can’t believe how many avid ff’ers just don’t get it. I fish with lots of guys who’ve mastered all the other skills mentioned, but they just don’t seem to comprehend "dead drift". Reading water

Important, but most guys seem to learn how to read the water years before they can make a proper presentation. Wading without doing a "Reid"

Anybody with normal bipedal skills should be able to wade well enough to catch fish, but on a heavily fished river, a better wader has more opportunities. Fly selection

A close second. Willi is often called the "troutmaster" and I believe this is why. The guy always has the right pattern; sometimes I’ll wade over to see what he’s using and I’m usually amazed, when I’m wading back to my spot I say to myself "Why didn’t I think of that?" Not as important as line control, however. Unless it’s a "moving pattern" (streamers, skittering caddis, et al) the fish won’t bite it if it’s dragging. Convincing SWMBO to let you go fishing in the first place

Got rid of beta version. Current wiff says I don’t fish enough.

Response:

A discussion in another thread got me to thinking. Which of the skills involved in angling with a fly requires the most effort to achieve proficiency ?

As a newbie to fly fishing who has recently completed his first full season, the skill that most eludes me is line control, particularly where multiple and conflicting currents are involved. While it isn’t pretty, I can cast well enough—as Ken writes—to catch fish. I am able to read water well enough to locate the most obvious lies, and fly selection is an area in which I am improving. Line control, though? Good God! I was badly humbled on the Owens River a couple of weeks ago while casting little caddis dries to rising fish. Enough said. While I can practice some of the other "skills" away from the water, I need to have my line laying across the current in a real river to really be able to understand everything that comes into play with controlling the line. As an aside that might be more appropriate for ROFFT, the next skill I want to start learning is tying my own flies. I’m leaning towards an inexpensive vise and tool kit (Thompson A plus tools), picking up materials as I go. If somebody wants to enlighten me as far as other options go, I’m more than willing to listen. Many thanks. Cheers, Bill

Response:

A (incomplete, feel free to add your own) list of skills includes:

knowing when to check the hook point on yer yella humpy

Response:

i have a funny feeling that the responses will be conditioned to a large extent by the kind of water one usually fishes. for example, my first choice is "line control", both in and out of the water. that selection is driven because, as you well know, one must be able to cast in very confined conditions above the water, and mend like a magician *on* the water, to catch good fish in the mountains of north carolina. tangentially, one’s wading abilities (including agility, strength, and stamina) are very, very important on streams such as snowbird, hazel, and the nanty. the two talents bisect at some point, since the ability to acquire a position from which a particular run or pocket can be accessed more easily than a point at which one merely steps off the bank may reduce the need for difficult mending chores. finally, the least important for me is fly selection. where i come from, if you read water (which has always, strangely, come easy for me) well, and can achieve a drag free float, it usually doesn’t make a damn bit of difference what is on the end of the tippet. yfitons wayno

Response:

Charlie Wilson writes:

Response:

Im my case, I think casting is the most difficult. I find that line control becomes easy when I am casting accurately and well.

Response:

I would add . . . Accepting that the fish are doing what the fish are doing, and not what I would want them to be doing, AND then. . . using appropriate rig and technique accordingly. Its existential. And common, I suspect, to folks addicted to surface strikes. Dave

Response:

You’re on the right track… The key is picking the flies you want to tie, and buying that material. Even more important is to actually learn some basic techniques: starting the thread, whip or half hitch finish, basic dubbing, and proportions. You can get that from books, but it’s better to actually watch somebody. Your local flyshop, TU or FFF chapter probably runs formal or informal classes during the winter. Now is the time to check!

Response:

For myself, I’d vote line control. I regularly fish "big" water that requires casting beyond the main channel into pockets. In these scenarios the fly often is presented on near still water, while the line is drifting in rapid water. I find it difficult to mend 20′ of line in a current without pulling the fly out of the still water.

Response:

Have to agree with you. I will hopefully fish till the day I get to old cast a fly and still not be able to know what is under the surface. Tried reading books and it just doesn’t seem to be retained. I think that it is probably only learned over time, or at the side of an experienced teacher. The rest of the list is relatively easy to learn, especially the ‘Reid’ reference, turns out I only fell twice (this year) but did it with style. :) jim An hour on the river adds a day to your life. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – A discussion in another thread got me to thinking. Which of the skills involved in angling with a fly requires the most effort to achieve proficiency ? A (incomplete, feel free to add your own) list of skills includes: Casting Line control Reading water Wading without doing a "Reid" Fly selection Convincing SWMBO to let you go fishing in the first place Of all these "skills" I believe reading water is the most difficult to become proficient at. And casting, I would rate casting as the easiest. Give me 20 minutes and I can teach someone to cast well enough to fish. — Ken Fortenberry

Response:

Reading water Wading without doing a "Reid" Of all these "skills" I believe reading water is the most difficult to become proficient at. And casting, I would rate casting as the easiest. Give me 20 minutes and I can teach someone to cast well enough to fish. — Ken Fortenberry

I’ve been Reiding the water for years. It is indeed a difficult skill to master unless you are born to it (What?! You think you just fall into like a lottery winner?). Seriously, I do agree that reading the water is up there, but it is second to fly selection. Yeh, when the rain is holding the slate drakes on the surface and you could cast a chunk of charcoal out there and get a 26" fish, its easy. When the sun is high, no wind, no hatch, but you see the fish rolling deep and trying to figure them out is definately a knack. — Frank Reid Reverse email to reply

Response:

Of all these "skills" I believe reading water is the most difficult to become proficient at. And casting, I would rate casting as the easiest. Give me 20 minutes and I can teach someone to cast well enough to fish.

Well enough to catch _some_ fish, anyway. There will always be other fish in difficult locations, and you could spend a lifetime refining your casting skills to the point where you can make the perfect presentation to every fish in the stream. Likewise, tying on a Wooly Worm and just letting it drift in the current will almost always catch _some_ fish, but a more refined approach will usually get more fish. Again, you could spend a lifetime trying to improve your skills. This, I think, really goes to the heart of what makes fishing interesting. Almost anybody can succeed at it to some degree, but you can always improve. If you could ever really _master_ it, it wouldn’t be any fun anymore. The game of Tic-Tac-Toe is amusing for children, but after a while they realize that there is only a small number of possible strategies, and then the game isn’t any fun to play anymore. Chess has finitely many possible strategies as well, but it the number is so large and the game so complex that probably no human will ever completely master the game. Kevin

Response:

"Reading the water"-skill is something that comes with spending a lot of time fishing and as such should be ranked high. Apart from that I would add correct presentation of different flies. Seeing that you may be a master dry fly fisherman and know absolutely nothing about nymphing, I would say that learning to present a fly correctly in any streamside situation takes a lot of different knowledge and experience. — Tight lines! / Roger Daytime engineer Lifetime flyfisherman If you feel like it, visit http://home.bip.net/angler/ for info on flyfishing in Sweden

Response:

Agreed, although I certainly would rank myself as "proficient". I’d rank "Line control" as number two. — TL, Tim

Response:

A discussion in another thread got me to thinking. Which of the skills involved in angling with a fly requires the most effort to achieve proficiency ? A (incomplete, feel free to add your own) list of skills includes: Casting Line control Reading water Wading without doing a "Reid" Fly selection Convincing SWMBO to let you go fishing in the first place Of all these "skills" I believe reading water is the most difficult to become proficient at. And casting, I would rate casting as the easiest. Give me 20 minutes and I can teach someone to cast well enough to fish. — Ken Fortenberry

Response:

I would rate line control as the most difficult, especially when nymphing. When the fish are rising, you don’t have to be able to read water. There are other satellite skills worth mentioning: fly tying rodbuilding photography writing story telling teaching tree/plant/bird/animal identification map reading bullshitting/evasiveness sleuthing/gleaning info from other fishermen Any others?

Response:

I vote for setting the hook / striking (not listed). My success rate would skyrocket if I hooked 1/2 the fish that "take" or rise. Seems I’m either too slow or too fast most of the time. Jim Ray

Response:

Well, the two with the ";-)" aren’t really FFing skills per se (probably indicated by the ";-)" ) and wading isn’t a universal requirement of FFing, even taking it as a "skill" of FFing – however, if one wades, do so safely is important. I’d agree that "reading water" (or "fishing in the right place at the right time," or whatever one wishes to call it) is the most difficult because it is the only one over which the angler has only limited control in the time one fishes, and no control over the "water" itself (well, other than on private water, and even then, the control is not complete). With casting, the angler has the control, and "casting well enough to fish," if defined as getting a fly in the general area one wishes, isn’t that difficult, esp. with shorter casts. I would add to the list three more skills, with first being perhaps the most important skill: learning how to fight and release a fish, even if you rarely release. It, like casting, is very easy to learn, yet is probably the most-neglected skill for most anglers. If angling is a sport, learn to be sporting first and foremost – this relates, IMO, to my third addition, below. The second is presentation – "casting well enough to fish," again, if defined as getting a fly to the general area desired, is not all there is to FFing, and an "ugly" cast with a delicate presentation is often more effective than a "textbook" (aerial/distance portion) cast that finishes by landing like a cinder block on a logging chain tossed from a truck. Granted, that is a bit extreme as a "perfect" cast should present fairly well, but the point remains that "casting" involves a number of "steps" that 20 minutes of instruction won’t teach completely for all situations. The third "skill" (admittedly stretching "skill" a bit, but…) being that of the ability to select appropriate tackle: heavy enough for the quarry while remaining enjoyable – no 3-wt. trout setups after salmon, etc., appropriate to the angler in terms of need, budget, experience, skill, etc. – going into debt for a 1000.00-plus USD setup will not make you a better angler, and anyone who tries to convince you otherwise has more problems than fishing – you CAN catch many species on any number of 100.00USD or less setups, be they new "X-Mart Specials," Cabela’s "kits," tag sale/flea market finds, etc. OTOH, if the only thing that limits your purchasing ability is an outfitter’s inventory and your skill and experience is such that you wish to take advantage of the diminishing returns of "better" tackle, then getting whatever you wish is completely understandable, and, appropriate to the quarry and location – under-lined, under-backed Martin "X-Mart" specials are inappropriate when bonefishing, etc. TC, R

Response:

Parachute-style Flat Caddis

admin — Thu, 03 Oct 2002 00:00:00 +0000

Question:

George somebody (can’t remember his last name) once told me to

I can’t imagine anyone named George flaming anyone in this manner.

Response:

George somebody (can’t remember his last name) once told me to I can’t imagine anyone named George flaming anyone in this manner.

I’m shocked! SHOCKED! I tells ya! /daytripper (Could never happen here

Response:

There’s an old Western pattern, The Rio Grande Trude, that’s VERY similar to your Pass Lake. It was somewhat of a standard some twenty years ago, but you seldom see it anymore. There was a guy that specialized in the fly and caught some very big fish in waters that generally demand very small flies. One of the reason the fly is so good is that it fishes well dry, damp or wet. Willi

Help me out here. Isn’t the Rio Grande Trude basically a Royal Trude with out the red thread on the body? If so I keep several of those in my fly box. The Royal Trude is my favorite fly on my favorite stream. However, if the fishies are being fussy and not taking it, I will try the Rio Grande (or at least what I am thinking is Rio Grande) and sometimes I will start catching fish with it. It seems odd to me that that small of a change in the fly (no red body thread) will make that much difference. Also, if they are taking the Royal they won’t touch the Rio Grande. Russell

Response:

"pittendrigh" < George somebody (can’t remember his last name) once told me to It was funny. In fact, thanks George. I needed that.

Sorry, I can’t help myself here Sandy… was it the telling you needed or did you actually do it and discover you needed it? c):-) Clark

Response:

Very interesting. Peacock herl is fascinating stuff. There are many materials with a vast range of uses in fly tying, but peacock herl is a true standout among them. It is the only material I know of which virtually guarantees that flies incorporating it will catch fish……there’s just something magic about it. I have never encountered a fly using peacock herl that is not a good fish catcher. That said, I find it a bit odd to see it in a dry fly. Herl, by its very nature, floats like a brick. Unlike many feathers, it is not the least bit hydrophobic…..quite the contrary, it wicks up water so effectively that it is difficult to make it float, even with the best of floatants. Never having seen this fly in action, I would suspect that the wing stays on the surface while the body is submerged. While this sort of arrangement often makes it hard to keep a fly floating at all, thus causing no end of frustration, it is often VERY appealing to fish. My own favorite Pass Lake works on the same principle. I tie it with a chenille body (equally problematic in dry flies) which will occasionally allow the fly to sit on the surface for a short while but inevitably causes the entire body to sink through the meniscus, leaving the wing (at best) to keep the whole damned thing from sinking. Both trout and panfish frequently find this irresistible. My guess is that the fly Harry posted is going to float LESS well than your Pass Lake. CDC does float but not well enough to hold the weight of a soaked peacock body. Like you stated through, that’s not necessarily a bad thing. There’s an old Western pattern, The Rio Grande Trude, that’s VERY similar to your Pass Lake. It was somewhat of a standard some twenty years ago, but you seldom see it anymore. There was a guy that specialized in the fly and caught some very big fish in waters that generally demand very small flies. One of the reason the fly is so good is that it fishes well dry, damp or wet. Willi

Response:

Yeah you’re right, I over reacted and apologize to Sandy.

Not necessary, and not a problem. I did say "it’s interesting how ideas get invented multiple times," didn’t I? Anyway, if you want to play on the internet it helps to have a thick skin. Words come right off the tips of people’s fingertips, and, as such, are easily interpreted in multiple, unintended ways. George somebody (can’t remember his last name) once told me to It was funny. In fact, thanks George. I needed that.

Response:

I just made a new set of step-by-step tying instructions for the world famous ‘Flat Caddis’ This is a fly I’ve been tying for years. It’s an attempt an anatomically more accurate version of the Troth Elk Hair Caddis. This fly does lie flat to the water, like a real caddis fly. And I enjoy tying it. Does it catch more fish than an Elk Hair Caddis? I can’t honestly say yes. It certainly does just as well however, and it floats like a cork. There is something about horizontally oriented parachute hackles that does a better job of floating a dry fly than traditional hackles. http://montana-riverboats.com/pages/pages.php?page_title=FlatCaddis

Response:

I just made a new set of step-by-step tying instructions for the world famous ‘Flat Caddis’

I also like this fly better than a traditional EHC but I like an EHC with no hackle in the body and a traditional hackle, full but slightly undersized, best. I also tie the wing slightly longer than normal. When tied that way, the fly rides the water "full of life" and you can easily give the fly some lifelike action which I think is often a trigger for fish. I also fish an EHC with no hackle at all. It floats reasonably well when totally dry but is most effective down in the film or slightly sunken. Willi

Response:

I just made a new set of step-by-step tying instructions for the world famous ‘Flat Caddis’ I also like this fly better than a traditional EHC but I like an EHC with no hackle in the body and a traditional hackle, full but slightly undersized, best.

I’ve always like the pattern you describe too, Willi, but I’ve never thought of it as simply a variant EHC. I’m pretty sure it has a name of its own but that name escapes me. Anybody? Wolfgang

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I just made a new set of step-by-step tying instructions for the world famous ‘Flat Caddis’ I also like this fly better than a traditional EHC but I like an EHC with no hackle in the body and a traditional hackle, full but slightly undersized, best. I’ve always like the pattern you describe too, Willi, but I’ve never thought of it as simply a variant EHC. I’m pretty sure it has a name of its own but that name escapes me. Anybody? Wolfgang

I think this style was first made popular by Ralph Cutter and his e/c caddis http://www.troutflies.com/go.mv?ID=e/c and Bob Brooks Headlight caddis http://www.troutflies.com/go.mv?ID=headlite Harry

Response:

The above patterns are similar to the Flat Caddis Pittendrigh described. The pattern I was describing may have a name, but it evolved for me from a pattern described by Wright that from what I remember, he called a Skittering or Fluttering Caddis. He used spade hackle tips for the wings (some other tiers used mink hairs) that were tied in in three bunches. These materials are hard to get and the wing was hard to tie "right" so the fly would have action and good flotation. I substituted elk/deer hair for the wing. Over time, I lengthened the wing and used more turns of hackle but with a hackle one size smaller than "usual." This makes for a fly that skitters and hops on the surface very easily. Willi

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I also like this fly better than a traditional EHC but I like an EHC with no hackle in the body and a traditional hackle, full but slightly undersized, best. I’ve always like the pattern you describe too, Willi, but I’ve never thought of it as simply a variant EHC. I’m pretty sure it has a name of its own but that name escapes me. Anybody? Wolfgang I think this style was first made popular by Ralph Cutter and his e/c caddis http://www.troutflies.com/go.mv?ID=e/c and Bob Brooks Headlight caddis http://www.troutflies.com/go.mv?ID=headlite The above patterns are similar to the Flat Caddis Pittendrigh described. The pattern I was describing may have a name, but it evolved for me from a pattern described by Wright that from what I remember, he called a Skittering or Fluttering Caddis. He used spade hackle tips for the wings (some other tiers used mink hairs) that were tied in in three bunches. These materials are hard to get and the wing was hard to tie "right" so the fly would have action and good flotation. I substituted elk/deer hair for the wing. Over time, I lengthened the wing and used more turns of hackle but with a hackle one size smaller than "usual." This makes for a fly that skitters and hops on the surface very easily. Willi

I’ve been tying caddis in this style for nearly twenty years and the idea was not original. It was taught to me by the Malignant Dwarf who, if memory serves, learned it from someone else when he began twenty or more years before. Sorry Harry, but what I’m thinking of (and what I believe Willi is describing) doesn’t look much like either of the flies on the pages you cited. Wolfgang

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I just made a new set of step-by-step tying instructions for the world famous ‘Flat Caddis’ I also like this fly better than a traditional EHC but I like an EHC with no hackle in the body and a traditional hackle, full but slightly undersized, best. I’ve always like the pattern you describe too, Willi, but I’ve never thought of it as simply a variant EHC. I’m pretty sure it has a name of its own but that name escapes me. Anybody? Wolfgang

I’ve always heard them called Skittering Caddis. There is a version at http://www.hawkeyeflyfishing.com/Fly_patterns/Drys/D15.html ,though the version I prefer has no palmered hackle on the body, but a dense short conventional hackle in front of the wing. BTW I have used a larger version of this fly (light wire size 6 salmon/steelhead hook) to good effect on steelhead this time of year – also effective on trout during the October Caddis hatch Bob Weinberger

Response:

"William Loehman/Susan Schwarz" I also like this fly better than a traditional EHC but I like an EHC with no hackle in the body and a traditional hackle, full but slightly undersized, best. I also tie the wing slightly longer than normal. When tied that way, the fly rides the water "full of life" and you can easily give the fly some lifelike action which I think is often a trigger for fish. I also fish an EHC with no hackle at all. It floats reasonably well when totally dry but is most effective down in the film or slightly sunken.

I like similar styles and particularly like an EHC with a cdc hackle instead of the traditional. Very effective on spring creeks. Clark

Response:

I think this style was first made popular by Ralph Cutter and his e/c caddis http://www.troutflies.com/go.mv?ID=e/c and Bob Brooks Headlight caddis http://www.troutflies.com/go.mv?ID=headlite Harry

Hello Harry: Yes, those flies are interesting: basically the same fly as mine. My proportions are different, and I don’t bother with a dubbed body, but basically it’s the same. Every idea seems to get invented multiple times. I got email from an historian the other day (among other things, he’s tracking down a reference to flies taken along on the Lewis and Clark expedition). Anyway one thing led to another. I mentioned to him I first showed the Flat Caddis to Gary LaFontaine in 1981, at a fly fishing demonstration Gary put on at Dave Kumlein’s Bozeman Orvis shop. Gary liked that fly, and offered to ‘help me get it published.’ In retrospect, I was a fool not to take him up on that.

Response:

Your right I was looking at the Pittendrigh pattern…. how ’bout this one? http://www.troutflies.com/pictures/flys/spent_caddis/spent_caddis.shtml – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I also like this fly better than a traditional EHC but I like an EHC with no hackle in the body and a traditional hackle, full but slightly undersized, best. I’ve always like the pattern you describe too, Willi, but I’ve never thought of it as simply a variant EHC. I’m pretty sure it has a name of its own but that name escapes me. Anybody? Wolfgang I think this style was first made popular by Ralph Cutter and his e/c caddis http://www.troutflies.com/go.mv?ID=e/c and Bob Brooks Headlight caddis http://www.troutflies.com/go.mv?ID=headlite The above patterns are similar to the Flat Caddis Pittendrigh described. The pattern I was describing may have a name, but it evolved for me from a pattern described by Wright that from what I remember, he called a Skittering or Fluttering Caddis. He used spade hackle tips for the wings (some other tiers used mink hairs) that were tied in in three bunches. These materials are hard to get and the wing was hard to tie "right" so the fly would have action and good flotation. I substituted elk/deer hair for the wing. Over time, I lengthened the wing and used more turns of hackle but with a hackle one size smaller than "usual." This makes for a fly that skitters and hops on the surface very easily. Willi I’ve been tying caddis in this style for nearly twenty years and the idea was not original. It was taught to me by the Malignant Dwarf who, if memory serves, learned it from someone else when he began twenty or more years before. Sorry Harry, but what I’m thinking of (and what I believe Willi is describing) doesn’t look much like either of the flies on the pages you cited. Wolfgang

Response:

Anyway one thing led to another. I mentioned to him I first showed the Flat Caddis to Gary LaFontaine in 1981, at a fly fishing demonstration Gary put on at Dave Kumlein’s Bozeman Orvis shop. Gary liked that fly, and offered to ‘help me get it published.’ In retrospect, I was a fool not to take him up on that. IMO, it just a matter of marketing in terms of how a "new" fly name gets recognized and is largely just an ego thing. It seems to me that it is the person responsible for making a particular pattern popular that gets the naming "right", not necessarily the "first" person to tie it. IMO, there are very few unique flies that come out. Most are just minor variations. With the number of tiers out there, virtually all of these variations have been tried by some tiers. Not to criticize your pattern, but I find it highly unlikely that you were the first person to use the elk hair tag as a post for a parachute. Actually, I could give a shit and would be happy to call it the pittendrigh flat wing caddis. Your reaction reminds me of Andy Kim becoming pissed off because other people were using a thread body for their midge nymphs and calling them something other than "Yong" something. Willi

Response:

Your right I was looking at the Pittendrigh pattern…. how ’bout this one? http://www.troutflies.com/pictures/flys/spent_caddis/spent_caddis.shtml That’s the right "style". I like a skinnier body, shorter denser hackle and a longer wing. Willi

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Gary put on at Dave Kumlein’s Bozeman Orvis shop. Gary liked that fly, and offered to ‘help me get it published.’ In retrospect, I was a fool not to take him up on that. Your reaction reminds me of Andy Kim becoming pissed off because other people were using a thread body for their midge nymphs and calling them something other than "Yong" something. Willi, I’ve never read that sort of atitude into Sandy’s posts, and don’t really see it in this one. Sandy puts up detailed patterns and tying instructions for basically altruistic reasons (as far as I can tell). I have always appreciated his posts and his ROFF presence. To me his comment above was a simple honest statement of having had a chance to accept help from a very well-known person and for some reason passing it up.

Yeah you’re right, I over reacted and apologize to Sandy. I also value his input here and on ROFFT and think that he does have some very innovative ideas especially in his use of foam. I was on Andy Kim’s website the other night and read his rants and……. The naming of flies and credit for designing them has always seemed like a weird thing to me. It seems to me to be more fame or ego or money or advertising related than substance. There are very few truly new patterns. Most are just SLIGHT modifications of other patterns being used. EVERY tier that has been tying for any length of time routinely ties his own patterns whether purposeful or inadvertent. Few patterns remain true to the original. More significant to me is when someone comes up with the idea for incorporating new materials into a fly or coming up with new techniques for tying or creating a new style of fly. But who knows who was the first person to use CDC on a fly or beadheads or foam or epoxy or who was the first to use a parachute hackle or dubbing twist or ……. If some famous person in the golden retriever world liked your work and offered to put a plug in for you, wouldn’t you feel the same way?

No Willi

Response:

…. how ’bout this one? http://www.troutflies.com/pictures/flys/spent_caddis/spent_caddis.shtml

Yep, that’s the one I had in mind. Interesting body in the photo. Herl? Wolfgang

Response:

Here is a variation using CDC http://www.troutflies.com/rofft/cdc/downwing.shtml – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Your right I was looking at the Pittendrigh pattern…. how ’bout this one? http://www.troutflies.com/pictures/flys/spent_caddis/spent_caddis.shtml That’s the right "style". I like a skinnier body, shorter denser hackle and a longer wing. Willi

Response:

Here is a variation using CDC http://www.troutflies.com/rofft/cdc/downwing.shtml

Tie that in black and you just might have a winner for the Bighorn.

Response:

I do tie it in black, I would show you ‘cepting my new DC has not made it to my door. I made the mistake of buying it over the net from what c/net describes as 4 star rated seller(good rating). I did get one after 10 days, plugged it in and the LED read "system error". The manual says send back to Nikon if this error shows up. Back to the seller it went…now they tell me all of the Nikons they have are defective… I asked for my money back after three weeks of hassles and BS. I do not believe a thing these dudes say now , pity I have spent hula bucks with them in the past. No more, the sales manager would not even return my calls. BuyRiteDigital….beware – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Here is a variation using CDC http://www.troutflies.com/rofft/cdc/downwing.shtml Tie that in black and you just might have a winner for the Bighorn.

Response:

…. how ’bout this one? http://www.troutflies.com/pictures/flys/spent_caddis/spent_caddis.shtml Yep, that’s the one I had in mind. Interesting body in the photo. Herl? Wolfgang

Yep that be herl… you should reinforce the stuff though, rope it, or a thread rib. I find this bug works well on the Yellowstone for some reason. Cutts eat it, but then, they eat lots of things most of the time

Response:

…..Herl? Yep that be herl… you should reinforce the stuff though, rope it, or a thread rib. I find this bug works well on the Yellowstone for some reason. Cutts eat it, but then, they eat lots of things most of the time

Response:

Soft Hackle Panfish (and a Bouns! :-)

admin — Tue, 10 Sep 2002 00:00:00 +0000

Question:

With the 4 wt. line repaired, a new leader tied up, and an assortment of new flies to try, it was back to the pond this afternoon. Had to leave work early to get some estimates on windshield repair after a gravel truck "rocked" me Monday evening, leaving a couple nasty chips in the windscreen. Bloody hell. Got that taken care of (at least the estimating and insurance claim part), and had a few hours left to worry the panfish with my latest offerings. At the tying bench, I rigged up some mosquito larvae, and three each of partridge and red, partridge and orange, and partridge and yellow soft hackles in #12. It was supposed to be light wind today, and I suppose by ND standards it was (10-15 mph and a bit gusty). Enough though to make casting the 4 wt. a bit interesting. Taking a look at the water as I rigged up, I didn’t see any surface action, even in the sheltered areas. Did note several "stalkers", hanging about a foot below the surface. They would slowly rise at intervals, gently taking some tiny stuff on its way to the surface. Hmmm, could be interesting… Decided that since it’d been rather cool and cloudy for several days past, perhaps a brighter colour would be in order. Split the difference and tied on a partridge and orange. A couple casts near a stalker had it charge the soft hackle and I brought the first fish to hand. Promising start. The fish were holding along a shade line about 25-30 ft. out. Delicate and accurate casting required, lest one put them down. The 4 wt. really shone here, even with having to deal with the wind. Of course, I *did* manage to put them down on more than one occasion, but left to their own devices for 5 minutes or so, they’d take up station again. This was quite a fascinating exercise — casting to these stalking fish. If I dropped the fly within about 3-4" of their nose, they’d usually make a grab for it. If it was closer than that, it’d spook the fish, and it’d go down. Much further than 5" from their nose, and they’d be disinclined to chase it, often as not. Dragging the fly through the strike zone would induce some fish to strike and others to follow. Some would follow for a considerable distance, say 10-15′+ before they either decided it looked good enough to eat (the less frequent case), or that it was something "fishy", and break off persuit. Never could tell what would happen. At least one fish came off his stalking station some three feet to whack the P&O with authority. Others needed several casts more or less in front of their nose before they would either go down or give the fly a taste test. Very visual fishing, and great fun! Had one crappie take the P&O as well, and got him in close before he executed an LDR. I worked the stalkers for quite a while before they finally went down to stay, and I moved to another part of the pond. Here, I found cruisers working quite close to shore along with the suspending stalkers. Flipped into a shade edge near where some of the stalkers were working, and got thumped, followed by a more vigorous than usual pull. Most of the bluegill I’d been getting had been in the 7-8" range, with a few around 9", but this fish pulled like a freight train, relatively speaking. Fought this fish for a couple minutes before bringing him up. A real bull bluegill, measuring an honest 11", and biggest I’ve seen out of the pond! Indeed, one of the larger ones I’ve *ever* taken on *any* tackle, let alone on a fly rod. That was really neat, but what followed was even better. I noticed a rainbow cruising in the shade near the shoreline, and made a cast to it. Haven’t had any great luck on the stocked rainbows, but this was about to change… My cast went a bit beyond him, and off to one side. Starting a slow retrieve, I could see him change direction and make a bee-line toward the fly. This is usually where they come up on it, and go "pbbbbtttt" at me. Not this time! He came right up to the fly, and in a whink the fly was gone. Set the hook, and had the little beggar on the line! He put on a good show with two nice jumps before I finally brought him to hand. The tape said 11 3/4", and I was doing a happy dance for *finally* outwitting one of those finicky rainbows. Deep intense green over the back, and nice colour on the sides to boot. Very pretty fish. On the other hand, it wasn’t exactly what one would call fat. Looked more like an oversized, colourful smelt, save for the typical salmonid head. Suspect the forage base in the pond, which is near 100% insect life from what I’ve been able to observe, isn’t sufficient to fatten them up. Had another rainbow follow the P&O and take a nip at it, but didn’t hook him up. Went back to working bluegill, and wound up with a good number more brought to hand before I finally called it a day. Quit counting bluegill after 50 fish caught and released, but would guess the total for the three hour session at 65-75 fish. All on the same P&O soft hackle, which now is pretty well shredded, needless to say. The trout was a nice bonus, after more than a few frustrating attempts and a couple near misses trying to bring one to hand. Been quite a while since I’ve caught trout while actually fishing for them. The last time I did was quite memorable. One of my younger brothers and a friend of his wanted me to show them how to flyfish. We went up to a trout lake, launched the boat, and messed around with spoons and such for some of the other species in the lake with no luck. Brother starts to get on my case about fly fishing. I rigged up the 7 wt., tied on a bead head GRHE, looked for a likely spot to make a cast, and launched my line. Strip… strip… strip.. *wham*, fish on! After a brief fight, brought a nice, fat 15" rainbow to hand. Unhooked the fish, put it in the livewell for a well-deserved trout dinner, unstrung and cased my rod, turned to brother and said "that, dear brother, is how you fly fish.". I *did* work with him and his friend on casting, etc., but they didn’t catch cold, let alone any fish, and he lost interest in flyfishing shortly thereafter. Indeed, he pretty well lost interest in fishing period, and took up golf instead. Oh well, I tried! Todd

Response:

assortment of new flies to try, it was back to the pond this afternoon.

Thanks for another great pond trip report. i sure am enjoying your shareing your series of adventures at the pond. Big Dale

Response:

Emu Feathers

admin — Tue, 03 Sep 2002 00:00:00 +0000

Question:

I feel so….used…

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hey, I think Don might have had an ulterior motive for the question about emu feathers – he’s got them for sale on that www.canflyfish.com.au website! They’re not as nice as ostritch. and not remotely as rare as mu feathers, which are located only in semi-baja california, and are extracted at great risk to the collector. yfitons wayno Any fly tyers out there tried Emu Feathers? Yep. Wolfgang anybody else?

Response:

They’re not as nice as ostritch.

Sure, a simple question simply answered, and right away somebody has to go technical! :) Wolfgang who knows that’s it’s really a matter of how much ya got to cover.

Response:

Hey, I think Don might have had an ulterior motive for the question about emu feathers – he’s got them for sale on that www.canflyfish.com.au website!

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – They’re not as nice as ostritch. and not remotely as rare as mu feathers, which are located only in semi-baja california, and are extracted at great risk to the collector. yfitons wayno Any fly tyers out there tried Emu Feathers? Yep. Wolfgang anybody else?

Response:

Any fly tyers out there tried Emu Feathers? — Don Cantrell Cantrell Fly Fishing http://www.canflyfish.com.au Hand crafted flies, and selected fly tying materials

Response:

Any fly tyers out there tried Emu Feathers?

Yep. Wolfgang anybody else?

Response:

They’re not as nice as ostritch.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Any fly tyers out there tried Emu Feathers? Yep. Wolfgang anybody else?

Response:

They’re not as nice as ostritch.

and not remotely as rare as mu feathers, which are located only in semi-baja california, and are extracted at great risk to the collector. yfitons wayno – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Any fly tyers out there tried Emu Feathers? Yep. Wolfgang anybody else?

Response:

Leaders Part II: Knotless vs. Knotted

admin — Mon, 19 Aug 2002 00:00:00 +0000

Question:

they tend to be much more durable than the store-bought variety, and cost about 50 cents apiece. Home-made leaders cost me about a dime apiece, if that. I can tell that you haven’t bought store-bought leaders in quite a while. Willi

Response:

I have been reading about the advantages/disadvantages of leader material. The author of the book I’m reading seemed to indicate that manufactured knotless leaders can have a variability in performance because of the way the leader is tapered. Knotted leaders gives more control of the proportions on the leader formulas to ensure the taper is more accurate. Also, there is the flexibility of using different types of leader material to customize the leader to the fishing conditions. Like using a stiffer leader material on the butt and middle sections and more supple material on the presentation end of the leader. He also gets into the types of knots and whether or not "hinging" occurs and what impact that has on the transfer of energy from the rod to the line to the fly. Is there a preference by you guys whether or not you tie your own leaders or go with the ready-made pre-tapered leaders? Thanks, Eric p.s. Thanks for the response on the tippet post. A lot of good info there.

Response:

I personally don’t really have a preference either way. I do find in some rivers where algae is a problem the need to constantly clear the knots on the leader of the weed or algae to be a pain, but then I have to do that with the tippet knot anyway. In this day and age of convenience I find the range of tapered leaders now offered covers all of the fishing situations I do and it’s simple. I have a heavy piece of butt section needle knotted to the fly line, I attach a commercial leader to that and a tippet to the end of it and go fishing. Tying your own leaders can be fun, but I find the fun soon wears off. Umpqua have a phenomenal range of different leaders. check out their web site if you are interested, even if you don’t purchase your leaders their various different designs will give you some ideas for your own. Clark

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have been reading about the advantages/disadvantages of leader material. The author of the book I’m reading seemed to indicate that manufactured knotless leaders can have a variability in performance because of the way the leader is tapered. Knotted leaders gives more control of the proportions on the leader formulas to ensure the taper is more accurate. Also, there is the flexibility of using different types of leader material to customize the leader to the fishing conditions. Like using a stiffer leader material on the butt and middle sections and more supple material on the presentation end of the leader. He also gets into the types of knots and whether or not "hinging" occurs and what impact that has on the transfer of energy from the rod to the line to the fly. Is there a preference by you guys whether or not you tie your own leaders or go with the ready-made pre-tapered leaders? Thanks, Eric p.s. Thanks for the response on the tippet post. A lot of good info there.

Response:

I almost always make my own because I think it’s easy and like you said I can use whatever material I want. I can whip up a leader or fix one in a couple minutes out on the stream. I don’t think there’s as much difference between some of these leader formulas as the creators imply, but still it’s nice to know you can quickly make changes to your leader once you know the basics of how they work and how to tie the knots.

Response:

In this day and age of convenience I find the range of tapered leaders now offered covers all of the fishing situations I do and it’s simple. I have a heavy piece of butt section needle knotted to the fly line, I attach a commercial leader to that and a tippet to the end of it and go fishing. Tying your own leaders can be fun, but I find the fun soon wears off.

Sounds like you’re tying your own leaders the way it is. Borger’s Uni-body leader is no more complicated than that.

Response:

[...] I don’t think there’s as much difference between some of these leader formulas as the creators imply…

Agreed. There are more variations in leader formulae than Heinz has pickles and ketchup. :-) I’ve been using the simple formula in Kreh’s and Sosin’s "Practical Fishing Knots", and for 90% of the fishing I do, it works about as well as anything. but still it’s nice to know you can quickly make changes to your leader once you know the basics of how they work and how to tie the knots.

I think that’s the beauty of tying your own. You can tweak your leader to the conditions and the characteristics of the fly you’re using and refine the presentation to what you need. Sometimes this can really pay off. Of course, other times, the leader configuration doesn’t matter a whit. Todd

Response:

Perhaps so, so but in reality, that is the correct way to use store bought leaders with the butt section bit being the only real optional part. Tippet should always be added pretty much. Clark

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – In this day and age of convenience I find the range of tapered leaders now offered covers all of the fishing situations I do and it’s simple. I have a heavy piece of butt section needle knotted to the fly line, I attach a commercial leader to that and a tippet to the end of it and go fishing. Tying your own leaders can be fun, but I find the fun soon wears off. Sounds like you’re tying your own leaders the way it is. Borger’s Uni-body leader is no more complicated than that.

Response:

I prefer tying my own because a) it can get you back into rising fish faster, and b) the flexibility you mention above. He also gets into the types of knots and whether or not "hinging" occurs and what impact that has on the transfer of energy from the rod to the line to the fly.

I haven’t noticed any hinging with the double surgeon’s knot, and I think the presentation is comparable either way. I’m sure some strength is lost, as it is with any knot, but I haven’t lost any more fish with the hand-tied than with the store-bought. — TL, Tim

Response:

Slightly off topic, but what book are you reading? Jim Ray

Response:

Is there a preference by you guys whether or not you tie your own leaders or go with the ready-made pre-tapered leaders?

I find the disadvantages of knots in leaders too great for dry fly fishing (viz. bits of flimsy mono catching on the knots.) I use a tapered leader tapered to a heavier weight – say four pounds – then tie a tippet of a lighter weight – say three pounds – maybe two or three feet. And then there’s a couple of feet of heavy mono attached to the line, with a loop in it. Keep cutting the tippet down till there’s no more, then add another. L

Response:

The book is titled "Drag-Free Drift Leader Design and Presentation Techniques for Fly Fishing" by Joseph A. Kissane. There’s an associated CD Rom that does leader calculations by Steven B. Schweitzer. He’s cofounder of the Global Flyfisher website. The book is actually pretty good. The author is an engineer so it’s written in a technical writing style and is very detailed in parts. Sometimes I feel like I’m reading a physics textbook. I’m an analyst by profession so I like to understand things. Sometimes I think it’s better not knowing whether my leader is hinging or not. Like one guy posted on the Leaders & Tippet thread that goes something like this: "I just tie it that way and it works. Don’t know why." I think that’s all that counts. Eric

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Slightly off topic, but what book are you reading? Jim Ray I have been reading about the advantages/disadvantages of leader material. The author of the book I’m reading seemed to indicate that manufactured knotless leaders can have a variability in performance because of the way the leader is tapered. Knotted leaders gives more control of the proportions on the leader formulas to ensure the taper is more accurate. Also, there is the flexibility of using different types of leader material to customize the leader to the fishing conditions. Like using a stiffer leader material on the butt and middle sections and more supple material on the presentation end of the leader. He also gets into the types of knots and whether or not "hinging" occurs and what impact that has on the transfer of energy from the rod to the line to the fly. Is there a preference by you guys whether or not you tie your own leaders or go with the ready-made pre-tapered leaders? Thanks, Eric p.s. Thanks for the response on the tippet post. A lot of good info there.

Response:

Hi Eric, I would say that today that about 90% of the fly fishers use knotless tapered leaders for trout. Why? Well, probably the same reason about 90% of the fly fishers buy flies? They don’t have the time or the skill. Actually, many anglers use knotless leaders for trout because they don’t want all those knots for stuff to catch on. Lots of very sophisticated fly fishers use tapered knotless leader, but they modify them a bit. Years ago we all tied our own leaders because the only ones you could buy were not too good. I still tie my own leaders for steelhead and salt water. I think everyone that wants to tie their own leaders, tie their own flies and build their own rods should do so because it is fun and can be very educational. After you tie your own knotted leaders and play with them to see how they work, you can use knotless tapered leaders and do some adjusting on them to get them to work just fine. — Bill Kiene Kiene’s Fly Shop Sacramento, CA, USA www.kiene.com

Response:

I used knotless leaders for the first year or two that I fly fished, and they worked well enough, but I think my own leaders work even better. Having stuff catch on the knots is a minor to nonexistent "problem," or at least it is in the places I normally fish. When it does happen, removing the moss or whatever is pretty quick and simple. It only takes a few minutes to make a leader from scratch, and these leaders have, IMO, several important advantages. I can give it exactly the taper I want, I can use different kinds of monofilament in different parts of the leader (stiffer at the butt, softer at the tippet, for instance), and when rebuilding the leader at streamside, I know exactly where I am in the taper by following the knots. The toughest part is learning to tie a good blood knot, and it only takes a few leaders to get the hang of that. I tie my own flies for similar reasons. I can use exactly which materials I want, and modify or create patterns as I see fit, they tend to be much more durable than the store-bought variety, and cost about 50 cents apiece. Home-made leaders cost me about a dime apiece, if that. — Rusty Hook Laramie, Wyoming

Response:

What a "Right On" remark to make. Great! Actually, many anglers use knotless leaders for trout because they don’t want all those knots for stuff to catch on.

Not, IMHO, anything but a cop out reason. Doesn’t hold water because it is "The Fly" which must be kept clean at all times. After you tie your own knotted leaders and play with them to see how they work, you can use knotless tapered leaders and do some adjusting on them to get them to work just fine.

Bill? I really think you’re a savvy kind of shop owner and the majority of your advice is super. But I have to say this about tapered leaders. From Brand to Brand, there is nothing as consistant in fly fishing than the consistant inconsistant tapers of tapered leaders. The ONLY WAY to be assured of a sharp turn over and absolute control for the SERIOUS fly fisherman is to tie their own, or better put, roll their own leaders. It is rare that anything catches knots in hand tied leaders, not unless the water is full of dissideous moss and junk and even then, a tapered leader still has a minimum of two or three knots involved. I truely dislike tapered leaders because they are heat melted from a single large diameter butt section and pulled to a longer taper, not unlike pulling warm bubble gum out of one’s mouth. No two strings or pull are the same. Never! I take my fly fishing much too seriously not to tie my own. It is an art form just like fly tying. Why would anyone deny themselves of this pleasure when it comes to "The Ways of a Trout?" I just can’t fathom the mind set that uses tapered leaders. George Gehrke "who always rolls his own" – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –

Response:

Hi Bill, I haven’t tried tying my own leaders yet but would like to. The knots in the leader seem to be the biggest drawback. When I went with guide on Henry’s Fork, he set up "our rig" with a set up he tied himself. I wished I had paid closer attention to what he had done. We had a full day of great fishing and even for us rookies we could make decent casts (albeit not very far casts). I buy the pre-made leaders and tie a tippet on the end. They work well enough but the presentation is poor about half the time. I’ve tinkered with cutting off certain parts and adding tippet where I think it might work better. This trial and error approach does not always produce great results. I don’t get out as often as I like so I like to make the best of it when I do. I mostly fish high mountain lakes and as you probably know conditions can change rather quickly. If the day starts out warm and sunny, the leader has some nice flex to it. Have the sun go behind the clouds and the wind kick up the leader gets stiff and my tippet will wrap around it like a rope on a tether ball pole. Of course, that’s when the fishing starts to get hot and I’m there with a mess on the end of my fly line. Thanks, Eric

Response:

Ontario rivers

admin — Wed, 10 Jul 2002 00:00:00 +0000

Question:

I’ve got three buddies that want to go with me to the lower part of Ontario to Walleye fish and to do some river/stream trout fish. I’ve been looking a little bit for a place that can suit all our needs but can’t seem to find one. Anyone got some suggestions? Thanks Matt

Response:

Typing with left hand here . . . Grand River – upper section, smallmouth & carp – upper mid-section,- mostly brown trout, occasional smallie, pike, and carp – middle section, smallmouth, some pike and carp, steelhead (in season). – lower section, smallmouth, pike, pickerel (walleye), gar pike, carp, mooneye (in season), chinook (in season), steelhead (in season). – lower section can be navigated by power boat; canoe and drift boat for the rest – don’t go over any weirs – it hurts. That should get you started. More to follow when both hands are working . . . Peter Visit The Streamer Page at http://home.cogeco.ca/~pcharles/streamers/index.html

Response:

Typing with left hand here . . .

(snip) More to follow when both hands are working . . .

How did you do the caps?? Your nose? riverman

Response:

Typing with left hand here . . . (snip) More to follow when both hands are working . . . How did you do the caps?? Your nose? riverman

No, my . . . never mind . . . CAPSLOCK ON, CAPSLOCK OFF, or just stretched out the pinkie Peter Visit The Streamer Page at http://home.cogeco.ca/~pcharles/streamers/index.html

Response:

Typing with left hand here . . . (snip) More to follow when both hands are working . . . How did you do the caps?? Your nose?

Oh man, you just HAD to ask, didn’t you?! Wolfgang shiny new nickel says it ain’t his nose. :(

Response:

– lower section, smallmouth, pike, pickerel (walleye), gar pike, carp,

Pickerel aren’t walleye on this side of the boder, Peter. I think they used to be, but the more rigorous border checks since 9/11 make it tougher to travel on a false passport! Scott

Response:

– lower section, smallmouth, pike, pickerel (walleye), gar pike, carp, Pickerel aren’t walleye on this side of the boder, Peter. I think they used to be, but the more rigorous border checks since 9/11 make it tougher to travel on a false passport! Scott

I know, I know. It’s made the education of our southern neighbours in the use of proper piscine terminology in the Queen’s English, so much more difficult. These things are sent to try us. (Imagine calling a pike, a pickerel? What is this world coming to? And a walleye? Whoever heard of walls having eyes, let alone, swimming?) Peter Visit The Streamer Page at http://home.cogeco.ca/~pcharles/streamers/index.html

Response:

I know, I know. It’s made the education of our southern neighbours

wtf is a "neighbour"? yfitons wayno (damn brits never have been able to spell.)

Response:

I know, I know. It’s made the education of our southern neighbours wtf is a "neighbour"? yfitons wayno (damn brits never have been able to spell.)

a yank Peter Visit The Streamer Page at http://home.cogeco.ca/~pcharles/streamers/index.html

Response:

Recieved the flies and want to say thanks–for some reason at a clave the guys seem to think I am a fly moocher–actually I am only an art appreciater. took my grandson to brim pond [he is trying to get fly fishing merit badge] put a yellaw on and he caught a brim on his first fly fishing lesson My buddy the newby came down and he caught a bass on one of your purple jobs–he wants to buy a dozen flies. Think the glo glo stuff you put on bottom of fly really works. My trip thru Texas in August turned into a new Zealand trip in December so donm"t know when I will see you but wanted you to know that BIG DALE flies are a big hit in Carolina. Indian Joe McIntosh

Response:

merit badge] put a yellaw on and he caught a brim on his first fly fishing lesson My buddy the newby came down and he caught a bass on one of your purple jobs

That is the kind of feedback that I love. The only reason I tie them is for folks to catch fish with them. I can see the grin on your face from here as your grandson caught a brim on one. Big Dale

Response:

That is the kind of feedback that I love. The only reason I tie them is for folks to catch fish with them.

Well BD, I was lucky enough to win some of your flies at two separate claves and I think I have told you before how much I have enjoyed them, but if not, I am now.

Response:

Actually, walleye are often called "yellow pike", not pickerel, and at one time there was a strain called "blue pike" in the lower Niagara.

There’s some talk that the blue pike isn’t extinct. If it wasn’t packed, I find the literature review I have, done by MNR on all of the peer reviewed stuff on pickerel (walleye) and I’m pretty sure that there is one that mentions the blue pike. It’s also know as the blue pickerel here (figures, eh?) http://www.nativefish.org/BluePike/ Just one more to add to our legacy. BTW, I’ve also heard of walleye/pickerel/yellow pike being referred to as pikeperch. It’s seems mostly a European usage – same as zander. blue pikeperch n : variety inhabiting the Great Lakes [syn: blue pike, blue pickerel , blue walleye, Strizostedion vitreum glaucum] Peter Visit The Streamer Page at http://home.cogeco.ca/~pcharles/streamers/index.html

Response:

BTW, I’ve also heard of walleye/pickerel/yellow pike being referred to as pikeperch. It’s seems mostly a European usage – same as zander. blue pikeperch n : variety inhabiting the Great Lakes [syn: blue pike, blue pickerel , blue walleye, Strizostedion vitreum glaucum]

Where does Northern Pike fit into this? I’ve tried eating Northerns several times (once in Montana, once in Finland) and the local Finnish slang of ‘mudfish’ certainly applies to the bland taste. However, in Riga, Pikeperch was a local delicacy. I never ventured to try it, figuring it was a desperation food. riverman

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – BTW, I’ve also heard of walleye/pickerel/yellow pike being referred to as pikeperch. It’s seems mostly a European usage – same as zander. blue pikeperch n : variety inhabiting the Great Lakes [syn: blue pike, blue pickerel , blue walleye, Strizostedion vitreum glaucum] Where does Northern Pike fit into this? I’ve tried eating Northerns several times (once in Montana, once in Finland) and the local Finnish slang of ‘mudfish’ certainly applies to the bland taste. However, in Riga, Pikeperch was a local delicacy. I never ventured to try it, figuring it was a desperation food. riverman

It gets confusing as pike get called all sorts of names south of the border, but north, it’s all pike – northern, (Esox lucius) and what is known as chain pickerel south of the border (Esox niger) or chain pike in the GWN. Then there’s grass pike (Esox americanus vermiculatus) which is also known as grass pickerel plus a few other names, you know where. Then there’s the muskie – Muskellunge (Esox masquinongy). BTW, fresh pike is very tasty. Anything with an Esox genius is in the pike family. Apparently the word Esox means pike so who knows where the pickerel part came from. Peter Visit The Streamer Page at http://home.cogeco.ca/~pcharles/streamers/index.html

Response:

Most of us up North here in the Midwest go for Walleye as the major game fish. I find it okay to eat, but Northern Pike is delicious. I’d guess it depends on the habitat you find it in and the food it’s been eating, as with venison. Might also matter how quickly and well it’s cleaned, too. I slightly to greatly overcook it, so that might make a difference, too. Local nickname for Notherns when I was a kid was ’snakes.’ — rbc: vixen Fairly harmless remove invalid or hit reply to email. Though I’m very slow to respond. http://www.visi.com/~cyli

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Most of us up North here in the Midwest go for Walleye as the major game fish. I find it okay to eat, but Northern Pike is delicious. I’d guess it depends on the habitat you find it in and the food it’s been eating, as with venison. Might also matter how quickly and well it’s cleaned, too. I slightly to greatly overcook it, so that might make a difference, too. Local nickname for Notherns when I was a kid was ’snakes.’ — rbc: vixen Fairly harmless remove invalid or hit reply to email. Though I’m very slow to respond. http://www.visi.com/~cyli

Response:

Speaking of walleyes ,"Cyli", Thursday I caught two of them in the old river channel between the dam and the powerhouse just north of your campsite on the Wisconsin R.. I also took 7 bass including one that had to push 4 lbs. All on a bunny leech variation called a "Koch’s Lamprey" and all within an hour and forty five minutes. You’ve got to head back this way soon. Nice bass! What kind of line were you using to get at the Walleyes? Usually they’re too deep to get them on fly gear. I fished with a guy a couple of times that was "crazy" about getting a big Walleye on a fly. The lower section of the Miracle Mile has a Walleye run in the Spring. I fished upstream for trout and he would troll the more placid water downstream with a clouser on a sink tip behind his bellyboat. He literally trolled all day hoping to get a Walleye. It took him a dozen trips before he got one. He said it weighed 10 pounds! VERY determined guy. Willi

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Nice bass! What kind of line were you using to get at the Walleyes? Usually they’re too deep to get them on fly gear. I fished with a guy a couple of times that was "crazy" about getting a big Walleye on a fly. The lower section of the Miracle Mile has a Walleye run in the Spring. I fished upstream for trout and he would troll the more placid water downstream with a clouser on a sink tip behind his bellyboat. He literally trolled all day hoping to get a Walleye. It took him a dozen trips before he got one. He said it weighed 10 pounds! VERY determined guy. Willi

Believe it or not I was using a floating fly line with a 9′ leader. It was also at noon with nary a cloud in the sky. Go figure. The fish were stacked up below a small chute leading into a very large pool about 300 yards below the open gate of the dam. Were the fish there to hit on injured baitfish being washed down? Possibly. Also the freshwater lampreys the fly was tied to copy die after spawning, maybe I just lucked into a good situation. The lead eyes on the fly put it on the bottom which was maybe 5 or 6 feet. Needless to say, though, the walleyes were a surprise. George Cleveland

Response:

Anything with an Esox genius is in the pike family. Apparently the word Esox means pike so who knows where the pickerel part came from.

Walleye (some call them walleye pike) are in the perch family. No Esox here Scott

Response:

Anything with an Esox genius is in the pike family. Apparently the word Esox means pike so who knows where the pickerel part came from. Walleye (some call them walleye pike) are in the perch family. No Esox here Scott

I know, I just find all the tangling of all the names, interesting. Peter Visit The Streamer Page at http://home.cogeco.ca/~pcharles/streamers/index.html

Response:

I know, I just find all the tangling of all the names, interesting. Peter

The minute ya got em all down, they’ll just change em Scott

Response:

High Mountain Lake Fishing

admin — Thu, 27 Jun 2002 00:00:00 +0000

Question:

Hello Everyone, I’m gearing up to do a bit of small lake fishing next week. I really haven’t done much lake fly fishing over the past few years so I’m not real sure what to bring along for patterns. Can anyone suggest some good "general" patterns for exploration on high mountain lakes? TIA

Response:

These are the flies I use over here in Scotland on hill lochs :- http://www.ftscotland.co.uk/flyindex.html especially the "Dry fly", "Hill Loch Nymph" and "Iron Blue Wetfly". — Don`t Worry, Be Happy Sandy — Website:- http://www.ftscotland.co.uk IRC:- Sandyb in #rabble uk3.arcnet.vapor.com Port:6667 #Rabble Channel Website:- http://www.ftscotland.co.uk/rabble ICQ : 41266150

Response:

These are the flies I use over here in Scotland on hill lochs :- http://www.ftscotland.co.uk/flyindex.html especially the "Dry fly", "Hill Loch Nymph" and "Iron Blue Wetfly".

Thanks for the link Sandy! It’s good to see someone talk about fly fishing around here…. — Opinions are like assholes. Everyone’s got one. … and they all stink!

Response:

Thanks for the link Sandy! It’s good to see someone talk about fly fishing around here….

Yeah, beats the hell out of gratuitous insults, don’t it? Opinions are like assholes. Everyone’s got one.

makes you superfluous, huh? … and they all stink!

We are pleased to bow to your authority. Wolfgang o.k., who wants to ask how someone comes to know so much about rectal redolence?

Response:

Thanks for the link Sandy! It’s good to see someone talk about fly fishing around here…. Yeah, beats the hell out of gratuitous insults, don’t it?

Opinions are like assholes. Everyone’s got one. makes you superfluous, huh?

… and they all stink! We are pleased to bow to your authority.

— Opinions are like assholes. Everyone’s got one. … and they all stink!

Response:

Hey folks need some help here (Seattle)

admin — Thu, 20 Jun 2002 00:00:00 +0000

Question:

You are not going to want to hear this but . . . . . . you are going to have to become a better fisher if you want to catch larger fish in a Westside river within reach of the Seattle metro. Specifically, you will have to learn to work with the seasonal movements of the fish, the seasonal scouring of the rivers, etc. And you will need to learn to fish the Salt for Silvers and Cutts. If you want it easier or to learn faster, hire a guide and fish the Yak, or the Coast with Chris Bellows if he will have you. You will also do better if you walk in more, avoid the most populat places on weekends, become better with the map, stalk and hunt rather than plop and wait. Move. etc. And then there is always going very light and enjoying the small fish. They are mostly natives by the way. In terms of river tactics, focus more on improving your presentation, than acquiring every pattern imaginable. Dave

Response:

The problem you are facing is that the majority of the fish in those west side rivers are sea run and what you are most likely catching is steelhead or salmon smolts. What you want to do is find them on their way back in. The Wynoochee river used to have a pretty good summer steelhead run as well as the Kalama. The North Fork of the Stilliguamish is FF only and has summer runs as well, but it wasn’t much good when I lived over there. Starting in July you can catch sea run cutthroat in the lower section of the Stilly. When I lived there the South Fork of the Stilly was stocked every summer, but I don’t know if they still do that. The pink salmon come up the rivers every other year starting in August and those are a lot of fun on a fly rod. This is the off year I think though. If you have your heart set on trout, you might think about getting a float tube and fishing the lakes. There are some guys who can catch those sea-runs on dry flies (I was never one of them), but for the most part it’s below the surface. Nothing like the eager cutts on dry flies that you are used to. I too grew up in North Idaho/Eastern Washington. Moved to the Seattle area for fifteen years. Got absolutely sick and tired of all the people, so I moved back.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Brief description of situation: I grew up in Northern Idaho, used to fly fish with the folks. We’d go up to the Lochsa, Marble Creek, the St. Maries, etc… We’d fish for native cutthroat, barbless, catch & release. I now live in Seattle. Recently I’ve found myself with lots of free-time (read laid ff ) and a desire to get out in the woods a little. Here’s my problem: A friend and I have gone out fly fishing a number of times and have been nothing but skunked. Not quite completely, I pulled in a lot of 3-4 inchers at the Skookumchuck but other than that we’ve had no luck on Skate creek, the Clear & Muddy forks of the Cowlitz, the Green, Snoqualmie MF and SF… We haven’t seen any surfacing or fish at any of these places other than the Skookumchuck. Now listen, we’re beginners and we know this and do not expect miracles… We also know that the waters of many rivers/streams/creeks are very high right now. But, what we’d really like to do is go somewhere where we stand a decent chance of catching (and releasing) a few nice trout, hell anything over 6 inches will seem gargantuan to us. Can anyone help us? I used to be a native trout snob… It seems they’re a little scarcer here than in Idaho… I know no good fishery needs more pressure here in Western Washington, and I know everyone likes to keep favorites secret… But it’d do my buddy and I world of good to get some positive reinforcement by just catching a few. Are there any currently fishable trout streams in Western Washington? Thanks a million to anyone who responds.

Response:

Brief description of situation: I grew up in Northern Idaho, used to fly fish with the folks. We’d go up to the Lochsa, Marble Creek, the St. Maries, etc… We’d fish for native cutthroat, barbless, catch & release. I now live in Seattle. Recently I’ve found myself with lots of free-time (read laid ff ) and a desire to get out in the woods a little. Here’s my problem: A friend and I have gone out fly fishing a number of times and have been nothing but skunked. Not quite completely, I pulled in a lot of 3-4 inchers at the Skookumchuck but other than that we’ve had no luck on Skate creek, the Clear & Muddy forks of the Cowlitz, the Green, Snoqualmie MF and SF… We haven’t seen any surfacing or fish at any of these places other than the Skookumchuck. Now listen, we’re beginners and we know this and do not expect miracles… We also know that the waters of many rivers/streams/creeks are very high right now. But, what we’d really like to do is go somewhere where we stand a decent chance of catching (and releasing) a few nice trout, hell anything over 6 inches will seem gargantuan to us. Can anyone help us? I used to be a native trout snob… It seems they’re a little scarcer here than in Idaho… I know no good fishery needs more pressure here in Western Washington, and I know everyone likes to keep favorites secret… But it’d do my buddy and I world of good to get some positive reinforcement by just catching a few. Are there any currently fishable trout streams in Western Washington? Thanks a million to anyone who responds. begin 666 wink.gif M^00%/ “`"P““`#P`/`($“`#__P#W[_````".(0]F<0`%B(UIY:GA2 M#[0)0C6(I!.*HSINY%C&L=L]BJ?17<1=_NY$"UWH?HVS1ZG4;“"’Y 3;W5T(&UO