Question:

"Bass Boss"  wrote…  Stop for a few seconds to light a cigarette or something, with my fly or a lure just dangling in the water right beside me and the fish (smallmouth bass) will swim right up and take the fly or lure.

Shhh!  That’s a fishn’ secret! I’ve noticed that all kinds of crap goes floating down the stream, some of it, such as puffy seeds, looks a lot like my fly.  Some insects, like water striders, get totally ignored.  Your fly has to stand out as something the fish really does want to eat.  When your fly is hanging motionless in a moving stream, it is already standing out as something different.  Impart a little twitch and that could do it. I’ve caught many fish after making a really bad cast, and just pulling the line in to give it another shot.  Whack!  It’s a somewhat guilty pleasure, as at that point I was only trying to get some line in to make a better cast. Timothy Juvenal

Response:

Heh…I remember the first smally I caught right here by my home in the Kishwaukee river…I had my first fly rod and was trying to cast..with no instruction, what a mess. I had this big clump of line all tangled about me with the end of the line like 20 feet away; I was doing my best to untangle myself..I finally got the mess figured out and low and behold there was a little smally at the end. By no means the biggest..heck..coulde of been the smallest, but no matter what; he was the most memorable. My first fish on a fly rod. Hell, a few months later I finally even figured out how to cast! Tim Apple

Response:

This is what Ragnar up at Great Slave Lake refers to as a "Big Fish Maneuver".  Lighting a cigarette, digging out a sandwich, but the real killer is setting the rod down and pissing over the side of the boat.  A sure fire technique for getting a strike on a slow day. Chas – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – That is something that never ceases to amaze me. I could cast to fish all day long and not get a bite. Stop for a few seconds to light a cigarette or something, with my fly or a lure just dangling in the water right beside me and the fish (smallmouth bass) will swim right up and take the fly or lure.And I mean I’ve actually had fish swim right up between my legs to take a fly. Trying to imitate that out where one would cast to is pretty hard. With the current flowing, how can one stop a fly in the river, just pause it for a few seconds, so the fish will take it? To be able to put a fly in their face and keep it there just long enough to make them eat it. If it goes on by, they won’t touch it. But to hang for a few seconds…       Iv’e actually had fish take a fly that got snagged on a rock. They’ll just swim right up and pick it off the rock. But to cast to these fish and let the fly drift… They don’t want it. Amazing sometimes…

Response:

Hi Jamie and Group I often fish Shad on the same pool as Jamie. The Lahave is a Salmon River so you must use unweighted flies and get them down. Makes for interesting fishing. One evening in June I was standing in the river, water to my knees fishing shad when a dragon fly light on my waders. About 12 – 15 in above water level. I was admiring its colors when the water brobe and a nice Bass jumped up and grabby it riight there. Talk about needing to go ashore to tie on flies. It hit me quite hard but susprise was the biggest thing. See you all in June at the Shad Hole Paul – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – That is something that never ceases to amaze me. I could cast to fish all day long and not get a bite. Stop for a few seconds to light a cigarette or something, with my fly or a lure just dangling in the water right beside me and the fish (smallmouth bass) will swim right up and take the fly or lure.And I mean I’ve actually had fish swim right up between my legs to take a fly. Trying to imitate that out where one would cast to is pretty hard. With the current flowing, how can one stop a fly in the river, just pause it for a few seconds, so the fish will take it? To be able to put a fly in their face and keep it there just long enough to make them eat it. If it goes on by, they won’t touch it. But to hang for a few seconds…       Iv’e actually had fish take a fly that got snagged on a rock. They’ll just swim right up and pick it off the rock. But to cast to these fish and let the fly drift… They don’t want it. Amazing sometimes… <    <    <    <    <    <    <    <    <    <    < <    <    <    <    <    < Joe, Thanks for the info on the flies. If you could please take a picture of the fly you described I would be very grateful. I fish my flies on a floating line. I cast directly across the current and let it swing down, watching closely for any "slow downs". Once the line is fully extended downstream I raise the road about 3 feet then slowly drop it in a continuous rhythm. Very similar to jigging with spinning gear and a heavy spoon. I stop pulsing the rod to take up line about every 6 feet. Actually, I’ve caught many just holding my leader and dangling the flies to fish holding in front of me. They have no fear of a man standing relatively still in the river. This is a great way to see what they prefer. Thanks Joe. Get me that picture! — Regards, Jamie  8^) http://users.andara.com/~jbheim I’m trying to put together a gallery of these flies. If any of you have any flies that you have used successfully let me know please. I’m looking for originals as well as standards. I have a few at my site now if any one would like to have a look. Here (MD) there’s been one "magic bullet" fly for hickory shad year after year, & I’ll try to remember to take a pic for you.  (Simple tie:  #8 hook, tinsel body, red & yellow marabou wing, red thread head) Oddly enough, last spring during the run, I couldn’t catch shit on it. The guy upstream from me was killin’ ‘em on a little green number, about size 10, similar to the bead head dart on your page. Interestingly, the Eel River flies look ver similar, if not identical, to the Lazer Egg (http://www.angelfire.com/wa/salmonid/fly48.html) steelhead fly. Out of curiosity, how do you fish yours?  Sinking line? Sink tip?   Dead drift?   Swing? Joe F. already thinking ahead to April

Response:

See you there Paul. Your story reminds me of a few times I’ve seen smallies jump on shore after dragonflies. The smaller ones are so aggressive they are almost suicidal. — Regards, Jamie  8^) http://users.andara.com/~jbheim – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Jamie and Group I often fish Shad on the same pool as Jamie. The Lahave is a Salmon River so you must use unweighted flies and get them down. Makes for interesting fishing. One evening in June I was standing in the river, water to my knees fishing shad when a dragon fly light on my waders. About 12 – 15 in above water level. I was admiring its colors when the water brobe and a nice Bass jumped up and grabby it riight there. Talk about needing to go ashore to tie on flies. It hit me quite hard but susprise was the biggest thing. See you all in June at the Shad Hole Paul That is something that never ceases to amaze me. I could cast to fish all day long and not get a bite. Stop for a few seconds to light a cigarette or something, with my fly or a lure just dangling in the water right beside me and the fish (smallmouth bass) will swim right up and take the fly or lure.And I mean I’ve actually had fish swim right up between my legs to take a fly. Trying to imitate that out where one would cast to is pretty hard. With the current flowing, how can one stop a fly in the river, just pause it for a few seconds, so the fish will take it? To be able to put a fly in their face and keep it there just long enough to make them eat it. If it goes on by, they won’t touch it. But to hang for a few seconds… Iv’e actually had fish take a fly that got snagged on a rock. They’ll just swim right up and pick it off the rock. But to cast to these fish and let the fly drift… They don’t want it. Amazing sometimes… <    <    <    <    <    <    <    <    <    < < <    <    <    <    <    < Joe, Thanks for the info on the flies. If you could please take a picture of the fly you described I would be very grateful. I fish my flies on a floating line. I cast directly across the current and let it swing down, watching closely for any "slow downs". Once the line is fully extended downstream I raise the road about 3 feet then slowly drop it in a continuous rhythm. Very similar to jigging with spinning gear and a heavy spoon. I stop pulsing the rod to take up line about every 6 feet. Actually, I’ve caught many just holding my leader and dangling the flies to fish holding in front of me. They have no fear of a man standing relatively still in the river. This is a great way to see what they prefer. Thanks Joe. Get me that picture! — Regards, Jamie  8^) http://users.andara.com/~jbheim I’m trying to put together a gallery of these flies. If any of you have any flies that you have used successfully let me know please. I’m looking for originals as well as standards. I have a few at my site now if any one would like to have a look. Here (MD) there’s been one "magic bullet" fly for hickory shad year after year, & I’ll try to remember to take a pic for you.  (Simple tie: #8 hook, tinsel body, red & yellow marabou wing, red thread head) Oddly enough, last spring during the run, I couldn’t catch shit on it. The guy upstream from me was killin’ ‘em on a little green number, about size 10, similar to the bead head dart on your page. Interestingly, the Eel River flies look ver similar, if not identical, to the Lazer Egg (http://www.angelfire.com/wa/salmonid/fly48.html) steelhead fly. Out of curiosity, how do you fish yours?  Sinking line? Sink tip? Dead drift?   Swing? Joe F. already thinking ahead to April

Response:

That is something that never ceases to amaze me. I could cast to fish all day long and not get a bite. Stop for a few seconds to light a cigarette or something, with my fly or a lure just dangling in the water right beside me and the fish (smallmouth bass) will swim right up and take the fly or lure.And I mean I’ve actually had fish swim right up between my legs to take a fly. Trying to imitate that out where one would cast to is pretty hard. With the current flowing, how can one stop a fly in the river, just pause it for a few seconds, so the fish will take it? To be able to put a fly in their face and keep it there just long enough to make them eat it. If it goes on by, they won’t touch it. But to hang for a few seconds…       Iv’e actually had fish take a fly that got snagged on a rock. They’ll just swim right up and pick it off the rock. But to cast to these fish and let the fly drift… They don’t want it. Amazing sometimes… <    <    <    <    <    <    <    <    <    <    < <    <    <    <    <    <

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Joe, Thanks for the info on the flies. If you could please take a picture of the fly you described I would be very grateful. I fish my flies on a floating line. I cast directly across the current and let it swing down, watching closely for any "slow downs". Once the line is fully extended downstream I raise the road about 3 feet then slowly drop it in a continuous rhythm. Very similar to jigging with spinning gear and a heavy spoon. I stop pulsing the rod to take up line about every 6 feet. Actually, I’ve caught many just holding my leader and dangling the flies to fish holding in front of me. They have no fear of a man standing relatively still in the river. This is a great way to see what they prefer. Thanks Joe. Get me that picture! — Regards, Jamie  8^) http://users.andara.com/~jbheim I’m trying to put together a gallery of these flies. If any of you have any flies that you have used successfully let me know please. I’m looking for originals as well as standards. I have a few at my site now if any one would like to have a look. Here (MD) there’s been one "magic bullet" fly for hickory shad year after year, & I’ll try to remember to take a pic for you.  (Simple tie:  #8 hook, tinsel body, red & yellow marabou wing, red thread head) Oddly enough, last spring during the run, I couldn’t catch shit on it. The guy upstream from me was killin’ ‘em on a little green number, about size 10, similar to the bead head dart on your page. Interestingly, the Eel River flies look ver similar, if not identical, to the Lazer Egg (http://www.angelfire.com/wa/salmonid/fly48.html) steelhead fly. Out of curiosity, how do you fish yours?  Sinking line? Sink tip?   Dead drift?   Swing? Joe F. already thinking ahead to April

Response:

I’m trying to put together a gallery of these flies. If any of you have any

flies that you have used successfully let me know please. I’m looking for originals as well as standards. I have a few at my site now if any one would like to have a look. Here (MD) there’s been one "magic bullet" fly for hickory shad year after year, & I’ll try to remember to take a pic for you.  (Simple tie:  #8 hook, tinsel body, red & yellow marabou wing, red thread head) Oddly enough, last spring during the run, I couldn’t catch shit on it.   The guy upstream from me was killin’ ‘em on a little green number, about size 10, similar to the bead head dart on your page. Interestingly, the Eel River flies look ver similar, if not identical, to the Lazer Egg (http://www.angelfire.com/wa/salmonid/fly48.html) steelhead fly. Out of curiosity, how do you fish yours?  Sinking line? Sink tip?   Dead drift?   Swing? Joe F. already thinking ahead to April

Response:

Joe, Thanks for the info on the flies. If you could please take a picture of the fly you described I would be very grateful. I fish my flies on a floating line. I cast directly across the current and let it swing down, watching closely for any "slow downs". Once the line is fully extended downstream I raise the road about 3 feet then slowly drop it in a continuous rhythm. Very similar to jigging with spinning gear and a heavy spoon. I stop pulsing the rod to take up line about every 6 feet. Actually, I’ve caught many just holding my leader and dangling the flies to fish holding in front of me. They have no fear of a man standing relatively still in the river. This is a great way to see what they prefer. Thanks Joe. Get me that picture! — Regards, Jamie  8^) http://users.andara.com/~jbheim

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’m trying to put together a gallery of these flies. If any of you have any flies that you have used successfully let me know please. I’m looking for originals as well as standards. I have a few at my site now if any one would like to have a look. Here (MD) there’s been one "magic bullet" fly for hickory shad year after year, & I’ll try to remember to take a pic for you.  (Simple tie:  #8 hook, tinsel body, red & yellow marabou wing, red thread head) Oddly enough, last spring during the run, I couldn’t catch shit on it. The guy upstream from me was killin’ ‘em on a little green number, about size 10, similar to the bead head dart on your page. Interestingly, the Eel River flies look ver similar, if not identical, to the Lazer Egg (http://www.angelfire.com/wa/salmonid/fly48.html) steelhead fly. Out of curiosity, how do you fish yours?  Sinking line? Sink tip?   Dead drift?   Swing? Joe F. already thinking ahead to April

Response:

Jamie, Just gotta say, thats a pretty smally on your page, you take the photo yourself? The color is great. Tim Apple

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Joe,

Response:

Thanks Tim,     I can’t claim that pic however. I got that off the web a couple of years ago. It was on a site that just had pictures of differen’t fish. No caption or anything. I fell in love with it right away. — Regards, Jamie  8^) http://users.andara.com/~jbheim

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Jamie, Just gotta say, thats a pretty smally on your page, you take the photo yourself? The color is great. Tim Apple Joe,

Response:

Question:

Since it seems my employeer is blocking post’s to UseNet – it is a little old but . . .

Neat report.  Sounds like you already had a chance to fly fish some quality water.  Tight lines. Mu

Response:

Nice TR, Marshall. Sounds like you had a pretty good guide.

Response:

Merced River:   This is the river that flows right through the middle of Yosemite, and gets heavy fishing pressure in the summer.  The guide I hired took us down below where most of the crowd fish.

Marshall, it was very close to there that I decided to take up fly fishing more seriously!  I had dabbled a little, but I was spinning on this particular trip to Yosemite.  I saw some trout in a feeding lane in a small clear pool, and there was no way I could catch them on my little spinner. It drove me nuts.  I decided then and there I was going to flyfish and next time I see some fish like those, I’m gonna get ‘em, dammit!  Fun trip.  I hiked down a trail (Tuolomne?) and ran into a couple guys camping who had a massive wild brown they caught on a Rapala in a deep canyon section.  Yup, different techniques are best for different conditions

Response:

Since it seems my employeer is blocking post’s to UseNet – it is a little old but . . . My first TR, so here goes . . . Location:  Merced River – Yosemite National Park, CA            Off Hwy 140, 1 mile below the 120/140 stop sign Elevation: 4,000 ft Date/Time: Saturday, Nov. 4th, 2001 [11am-4:30pm] Pictures located at: http://homepage.mac.com/mkrasser/PhotoAlbum4.html This is still my freshman year of flyfishing, [I started last Aug. 2001 on the Big Wood River in Sun Valley, ID.  Followed by a trip in Sept to the Feather River [Ca], 5 weeks ago I was at Putah Creek, [Ca], 4 weeks ago the Russian River [Ca], and 2 weeks ago a trip on the Klamath River [Ca] (K.R. pictures included at above web location). A quick Mini-TR on the Kamath,  the Salmon fishing was hot!  BUT, since we were NOT using flies I will not detail the 20 fish we caught and released [barbless hooks and roe] we did keep 2 for the smoker. I will mention the Steelhead that we were targeting with flies in the fast water . . . I forgot to "bow to the fish" do I need to say more? I lost the nice 6-7 pounder (guide est.) when it jumped for joy.  I had another major slam that I missed [using a mossback fly] as well.  We did manage to catch/release several nice native trout in our quest for Mr. Steelhead [top lft picure]. Merced River:   This is the river that flows right through the middle of Yosemite, and gets heavy fishing pressure in the summer.  The guide I hired took us down below where most of the crowd fish. This was mega-pocket water!!!  This late in the year, the water level is rather low and is super clear [16 ft leaders, ouch].  Lucky for us, the valley received a light rain the Wed. before our arrival, so the system received a last minute boost before winter.  Anyway, we were climbing over bus size granite boulders and rock hopping cross-stream, to get the perfect angle for the pockets.   I should mention that I dragged my wife along on her first flyfishing outing this day.  I was hoping that I could provide here with a positive experience on this trip, but according to the guide . . . this time of year, and on this river, a PHD is required.  The guide was very hands on and worked with both of us to get the technique down, but he tended to want to do most of the casting himself [we could hold the rod under his hand, though].  Using this technique, he was able to get her hooked into a nice bright orange native male – I was too far away to snap a photo   Even on this cool November day [30's rising to the mid 60's] there was a Baetis and Caddis hatch happening.  When we arrived at the first pool, our guide went nuts – there were at least 5 trout rising to the hatch at the head of the pool and at least one was a brown.   He worked with both of us at this pool, and we both missed our strikes – we then headed up stream to rest these fish.  And found others just as eager to miss our flies as well. I could just NOT see the sz18 Baetis fly in the pocket water.  Cool a swirl, guide say’s ah that was your fly he was swirling at!   We then went back down to pool #1 for try #2 at the fish – same result.  So we headed back upstream again.   We climbed up on this huge boulder and butt dragged to look over the edge – wow TWO 18-20 inchers directly below us.  Hmmm the Guide forgot to warn my wife as to why he and I were moving this way . . . so she walked right up to the edge and said, "oh look – fishies", and they said, "oh look human – goodbye".  Luckly this boulder was so huge it was in 2 zip codes, so they crawled [see pic: guide w/wife] to the head of the rock, and worked that pool. They just could not get the distance needed from here, so the guide and I moved down to water level and I missed another nice one.   We split sides here and I headed to a pool on the left and they headed to what looked like a prime pool.  With the guide’s assistance, BAM – she hooked-up and landed the bright male [14 incher].  On that note we headed back down to pool #1 again [my wet leg and all <grin].   The fish were happily slurping up the emergers and this time I connected.  As my wife pointed out . . . mine was not as big or as pretty as her’s [whatever].  We then hopped in our 4×4’s and headed downstream to what would be prime pocket water for me.   The guide worked a little more with my wife on her casting, but he was not quite patient enough [in my opinion], and I could tell she was getting bored and frustrated.   She said, go on ahead – I’ll rest here – ya right . . . she whipped out her knitting from her backpack and that was the end of that.   The guide and I headed into the land of small pocket water [I was casting rather well un-assisted by now - the guide was surprised - I was one with the line].  Interesting note that probably has no bearing on my flycasting targeting – but I was a deadly bait caster from my Table Rock Lake days – growing up in Missouri – I could flip that plastic worm or jig-n-pig right were I wanted it in the fallen/flooded timber at rather great distances [no use here in California].   Anyway,  I pulled 2 nice ones out of the first pocket just above the main pool and missed another 3 as well.  We figured they had moved up out of the still water to feed.  I was using a caddis pattern [that I could see] for these puppies.   We moved on up to one more small pocket, and the guide made me call where the strike would occur [he nailed it exactly in the previous pocket].  I called it, but after 4 casts and no take – the guide said let’s go home – must not be there.  One more cast I pleaded and that one did it – right where I called it <grin.   As the light started to fade we walked back to our vehicles and called it a day, in this land of giant rocks and golden sunlight. Sorry for the length, Marshall

Response:

Question:

   Good fortune, Oh yes.  Now , I know that you and your friend are just checking to see what kind of answers you get here, but I offer this anyway.  Looking around at the following should get you going.    I now buy almost everything from Clemens Tackle, (610) 395 5119, www.clemenstackle.com   Dick French there is extremely knowledgable.  They list other rod wrappers than the Pacific Bay rod wrapper in their catalog and they have good quality in everything needed.  Get their catalog and ask about the RodCrafter’s Journal.  They also have some books you’ll want and video tapes maybe you’ll want later.    Both of the above have run seminars around the country each year but I don’t know anything about that.      Cabela’s "Tackle Craft" catalog  lists the Flex Coat line which looks good too.  Also a list of books and videos.    The best way and the fastest way to get a look at rod building is to go to www.flyanglersonline.com  click on rodbuilding and view the excellent twelve chapter on-line book on rod building.  It really gave me a jump start and I still refer to it.    Fishing with a rod that I built is extremely satisfying.  Almost as satisfying as fishing with my kids and grandkids using rods into which I put all the extra care that is not in a production rod.  Right now I’m thinking about a couple of new rods…  No it is not an addiction…  I could quit any time…  besides I have to build that spinning rod for my daughter-in-law, too.   —

A few days ago I mentioned to a friend (who used to own a fly shop) that I was planning to build some flyrods this winter. He asked me if I had the equipment I needed. I didn’t. He graciously gave me several pieces of useful looking equipment and some materials, including a number of cork grips and a very nice reel seat. I have only a dim notion of what some of this equipment is for. You can see a photo of the stuff at: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/stuff-web.jpg The long device with the aluminum base is obviously meant for wrapping and drying rods. It has two settings: a constant, slow speed labeled "dry", and a variable speed controlled by a foot pedal labeled "wrap". The large motor on the right is for shaping cork grips. The long things standing up in the background are specialized rattail files for reaming grips, I suppose. I don’t really know what the two devices in the middle (above the grips) and the clamp in the back of the photo are for, but I’ll figure it out. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks, Mark, if you happen to be reading this. I guess I’ll actually have to build those rods now. No excuses. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/

Response:

Steve,    The thing on the lower left is the foot pedal/reostat. Next to it, above the grips, is a conventional rod wrapper (learn to use it, it’s the most useful devise in the picture). Next to it is a thread holder accessory to the power wrapper. It  has the capacity to hold multiple thread spools, for fancy-shmancy wrapping. The lathe like device is a power wrapper, best used for production (sloppy looking) rod building. The only thing I’d use it for is drying, on the low speed setting. The big thing in the lower right corner is used to shape cork grips, after they’ve been glued up on the devise that’s leaning against the wall on the left. The things leaning against the wall on the right are tapered reamers, for enlarging the ID of the finished cork grip.   Hope this helps. E-mail me if you need instructions on how to use any of this junk.             Charlie

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – If anyone could give me some information about how to use this thing I’d appreciate it. The guy who gave it to me can’t find the manual, if there ever was one. The manufacturer is Pacific Bay, Inc., Placentia, CA. The current PacBay catalog lists their address as:         Pacific Bay International, Inc.         165 Business Park Loop         Sequim, WA 98382         (360) 683 – 2080         (360) 683 – 2234 (Fax) They are pretty nice folks at PacBay, I’m sure they can find an instruction book for you.  The list price on that thing is $338, if you were wondering.

Thanks for the information, Kevin. This rod wrapper had so much dust on it that it must have been in my friend’s garage for many years. I despaired of finding a manual. I’ll call PacBay on Monday. Kevin If you can’t figure out how to use it, just box it all up and ship it to me.

I’m afraid you’ll have to come here to use it. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/

Response:

could the black thing be a thread holder for the rod wrapper? does it attach to the wrapper somewhere?

Bingo. The black thread holder has three rollers (with ball bearings) that butt up against the rod wrapper in such a way that the thread is in exactly the right position. There’s also a metal bar with three machine screws, and I have absolutely no idea what it’s for. It doesn’t seem to fit anything on the rod wrapper or the thread holder. I’ve put three more photos on the web:         http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/p1.jpg         http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/p2.jpg         http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/p3.jpg The first one shows the motor, the chuck in the open position, the thread holder in position, two of the three roller mechanisms, and the mysterious metal plate. The second photo is a little closer up. The third photo shows the rollers that are under the thread holder, and the rod wrapper chuck in the closed position. If anyone could give me some information about how to use this thing I’d appreciate it. The guy who gave it to me can’t find the manual, if there ever was one. The manufacturer is Pacific Bay, Inc., Placentia, CA. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/

Response:

not that I’ve ever used such fancy equipment but……. in http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/stuff-web.jpg The thing against the back wall with the wood pieces joined by threaded rod is for pressing together individual cork rings that have been put on the rod (or a dowel if you are making the grip separately) while the glue dries. The large motor on the right, I believe, is for turning the rod or the dowel with the cork rings so you can shape them.  It can also be used as a lathe to shape a wood insert for a reel seat.   I have no idea what the metal bar with three machine screws is used for. http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/p1.jpg You got your hands on some nice equipment. Want to make me a custom rod? Willi

Response:

Bingo. The black thread holder has three rollers (with ball bearings) that butt up against the rod wrapper in such a way that the thread is in exactly the right position. There’s also a metal bar with three machine screws, and I have absolutely no idea what it’s for. It doesn’t seem to fit anything on the rod wrapper or the thread holder.

I think it is a thread tensioning bar.  Can you add a pic of what I suspect is a wooden wrapping fixture, and a close-up of the bar, and particularly, its fittings/screws – are they "pulley wheels" or just nuts and bolts? If anyone could give me some information about how to use this thing I’d appreciate it.

How do you mean "how to use it?"  Do you mean rod-finishing in general, or the specifics of this set-up?  If you mean the particulars of this set-up, it doesn’t appear to be anything tricky or "non-standard," but if you mean rod-finishing in general, that’s quite a bit of info.  Anything in particular? TC, R – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -The guy who gave it to me can’t find the manual, if there ever was one. The manufacturer is Pacific Bay, Inc., Placentia, CA.

Response:

There’s also a metal bar with three machine screws, and I have absolutely no idea what it’s for. It doesn’t seem to fit anything on the rod wrapper or the thread holder.

Sort of a PS – It appears there are three holes of similar spacing near the edge of the wooden fixture.  Do these actually line up with the bar? R

Response:

If anyone could give me some information about how to use this thing I’d appreciate it. The guy who gave it to me can’t find the manual, if there ever was one. The manufacturer is Pacific Bay, Inc., Placentia, CA.

The current PacBay catalog lists their address as:         Pacific Bay International, Inc.         165 Business Park Loop         Sequim, WA 98382         (360) 683 – 2080         (360) 683 – 2234 (Fax) They are pretty nice folks at PacBay, I’m sure they can find an instruction book for you.  The list price on that thing is $338, if you were wondering. Kevin If you can’t figure out how to use it, just box it all up and ship it to me.

Response:

A few days ago I mentioned to a friend (who used to own a fly shop) that I was planning to build some flyrods this winter. He asked me if I had the equipment I needed. I didn’t. He graciously gave me several pieces of useful looking equipment and some materials, including a number of cork grips and a very nice reel seat.

Wow, you are lucky.  That’s top notch stuff.  Sorry I can’t help – I’ve never actually used that stuff  (What I mean you gear whores, of course, is that I don’t make enough rods to go to the trouble of buying that stuff. Affordability is not the issue when you are at one with the industry – when you are content in your consumerism – when you… well, you know.)

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – A few days ago I mentioned to a friend (who used to own a fly shop) that I was planning to build some flyrods this winter. He asked me if I had the equipment I needed. I didn’t. He graciously gave me several pieces of useful looking equipment and some materials, including a number of cork grips and a very nice reel seat. I have only a dim notion of what some of this equipment is for. You can see a photo of the stuff at:    http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/stuff-web.jpg The long device with the aluminum base is obviously meant for wrapping and drying rods. It has two settings: a constant, slow speed labeled "dry", and a variable speed controlled by a foot pedal labeled "wrap". The large motor on the right is for shaping cork grips. The long things standing up in the background are specialized rattail files for reaming grips, I suppose. I don’t really know what the two devices in the middle (above the grips) and the clamp in the back of the photo are for, but I’ll figure it out. Any help would be appreciated.

Steve, I suspect the long, threaded rods and blocks (there are two blocks, no?) is a cork clamp, and the two things in the middle are thread holders/wrapping jigs/parts.  From what I can see, I’d guess the black one is a holder for use on the larger jig/dryer, and the wooden looking one is a stand-alone wrapping jig, but ???.  Can you post close-ups of them? TC, R

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could the black thing be a thread holder for the rod wrapper? does it attach to the wrapper somewhere? . .Walter .

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – A few days ago I mentioned to a friend (who used to own a fly shop) that I was planning to build some flyrods this winter. He asked me if I had the equipment I needed. I didn’t. He graciously gave me several pieces of useful looking equipment and some materials, including a number of cork grips and a very nice reel seat. I have only a dim notion of what some of this equipment is for. You can see a photo of the stuff at: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/stuff-web.jpg The long device with the aluminum base is obviously meant for wrapping and drying rods. It has two settings: a constant, slow speed labeled "dry", and a variable speed controlled by a foot pedal labeled "wrap". The large motor on the right is for shaping cork grips. The long things standing up in the background are specialized rattail files for reaming grips, I suppose. I don’t really know what the two devices in the middle (above the grips) and the clamp in the back of the photo are for, but I’ll figure it out. Any help would be appreciated. Steve, I suspect the long, threaded rods and blocks (there are two blocks, no?) is a cork clamp, and the two things in the middle are thread holders/wrapping jigs/parts.  From what I can see, I’d guess the black one is a holder for use on the larger jig/dryer, and the wooden looking one is a stand-alone wrapping jig, but ???.  Can you post close-ups of them? TC, R

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Response:

A few days ago I mentioned to a friend (who used to own a fly shop) that I was planning to build some flyrods this winter. He asked me if I had the equipment I needed. I didn’t. He graciously gave me several pieces of useful looking equipment and some materials, including a number of cork grips and a very nice reel seat. I have only a dim notion of what some of this equipment is for. You can see a photo of the stuff at:         http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/stuff-web.jpg The long device with the aluminum base is obviously meant for wrapping and drying rods. It has two settings: a constant, slow speed labeled "dry", and a variable speed controlled by a foot pedal labeled "wrap". The large motor on the right is for shaping cork grips. The long things standing up in the background are specialized rattail files for reaming grips, I suppose. I don’t really know what the two devices in the middle (above the grips) and the clamp in the back of the photo are for, but I’ll figure it out. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks, Mark, if you happen to be reading this. I guess I’ll actually have to build those rods now. No excuses. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/

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Boy you certainly did luck out.  That is some professional level equipment he gave you. Its hard to really tell from the picture, but the real seat and the handles also seem to be of very high quality. You’ve correctly identified most of the equipment.  The two devices in the middle (above the grips) and the clamp in the back of the photo are for gluing together cork rings for building your own handles. Have fun. Using a rod you put together yourself gives much of the same satisfaction one gets from fooling tough trout with flies you tied yourself. Bob Weinberger

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – A few days ago I mentioned to a friend (who used to own a fly shop) that I was planning to build some flyrods this winter. He asked me if I had the equipment I needed. I didn’t. He graciously gave me several pieces of useful looking equipment and some materials, including a number of cork grips and a very nice reel seat. I have only a dim notion of what some of this equipment is for. You can see a photo of the stuff at: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/stuff-web.jpg The long device with the aluminum base is obviously meant for wrapping and drying rods. It has two settings: a constant, slow speed labeled "dry", and a variable speed controlled by a foot pedal labeled "wrap". The large motor on the right is for shaping cork grips. The long things standing up in the background are specialized rattail files for reaming grips, I suppose. I don’t really know what the two devices in the middle (above the grips) and the clamp in the back of the photo are for, but I’ll figure it out. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks, Mark, if you happen to be reading this. I guess I’ll actually have to build those rods now. No excuses. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/

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Question:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – My son will be turning 8 in a few months and has begun showing interest in our sport.  Does anyone have any suggestions for a good beginners set-up. I want something that will last, but doesn’t break the bank.  I’d consider a rod and reel combo up to $200.  We normally fish small trout rivers and since we live in So.Cal. most of our fishing requires extensive traveling, often on any airplane, i.e. a three or four piece.  For example we will be hitting the Battenkill in Vermont this summer.  Anybody’s 2 cents are welcome.  Thanks, Todd My feeling is that you would be better making short trips to "put and take" ponds or similar, and fishing with worms etc if necessary. Eight year olds rarely possess the attention span required for intensive fly-fishing, and their success rate is accordingly low. This leads to frustration, and reduces interest even further, and may result in them giving up. Take him somewhere where he will catch fish. It does not matter how.  Do not fish yourself, devote your time and attention to him, but without crowding him.  let HIM fish, do not take the rod off him when he hooks a fish, show him how to cast, bait up etc, and then LEAVE HIM ALONE.  Constant barrages of advice are useless, and defeat the object of the exercise. Answer questions, and demonstrate if necessary but only when asked. Take a fly-rod along and the gear ( yours, not a "kid-rig" ), and show him how it works for a short while.   He will soon get the idea.  The main thing is, he MUST CATCH FISH, and he MUST NOT GET THE FEELING THAT HE IS BEING FORCED TO DO SOMETHING. TL MC

Good advice, if you feel you must start with fishing.  I had probably been casting for a year or more before I started fishing with a flyrod.  I fished, just not with a flyrod.  It was made into a game, with practice flies and ring targets on my Grandfather’s casting lawn. It taught me proper and varied technique, as well as patience.  IIRC, once I started fishing, this training seemed to also help with the "not catching anything" problem so often attributed to the disinterest of younger anglers – I could at least try to be accurate, and try various casts and techniques.  Eventually, I could catch as many fish as the older anglers.   As to what I started on, the first rod was an old fiberglass 8ft. 2 or 3 weight which had first been my mother’s "training rod" in her youth. After I had casting and rod care reasonably down, I was pretty much allowed to use whatever, within reason, but tended not to fool with rods that were someone’s _personal_ rod(s).   If I were you, I would just get a smallish (under 6 and no more than 8.5 feet), cheap (even used) rod, glass or graphite, it doesn’t matter at this point, of medium-ish action.  If you need to buy an additional reel, the cheapest reel I could find (a Martin 61, perhaps), and a decent, but not top-of-the-line, WF line of proper weight.  I would use small-ish bucktail "whiffs" or cut the entire bend and most of the shank from streamers (get really bright, bushy ones – overdressed commercial ties are actually better here).  Also, get inexpensive tapered leaders, at least in the beginning. I would then begin casting (not fishing) lessons if you are knowledgable _and_ patient enough.  Be honest with yourself in this regard.  If you aren’t BOTH, find someone who is – you and the child will come out better and happier.  If the child wants to go cast, let them.  Some say it is difficult to break bad habits once learned, but it even more difficult to learn without doing, IMO, and kids, unfettered, tend to fare alright in this regard.  Of course, YMMV. TC, R

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My son will be turning 8 in a few months and has begun showing interest in our sport.  Does anyone have any suggestions for a good beginners set-up.  I want something that will last, but doesn’t break the bank.  I’d consider a rod and reel combo up to $200.  We normally fish small trout rivers and since we live in So.Cal. most of our fishing requires extensive traveling, often on any airplane, i.e. a three or four piece.  For example we will be hitting the Battenkill in Vermont this summer.  Anybody’s 2 cents are welcome.  Thanks, Todd

Response:

My son will be turning 8 in a few months and has begun showing interest in our sport.  Does anyone have any suggestions for a good beginners set-up.  I want something that will last, but doesn’t break the bank.  I’d consider a rod and reel combo up to $200.  We normally fish small trout rivers and since we live in So.Cal. most of our fishing requires extensive traveling, often on any airplane, i.e. a three or four piece.  For example we will be hitting the Battenkill in Vermont this summer.  Anybody’s 2 cents are welcome.  Thanks, Todd

Todd, You might want to check out Cabela’s.  Several people on this newsgroup have bought these and have been happy with them as near as I can tell.  I had the opportunity to try one out last summer and found it to be better than I expected.  They aren’t expensive and will fall well below your $200 price range, Cabela’s backs their products very well, and they are decent rods.  What I didn’t like about them was that some of the components aren’t high quality, but they work.  I didn’t like the reel seat or grips, but the rod did perform nicely and the blank is a far better than I imagined it would be.  Overall, I would give the rod a passing grade and found it to cast extremely well.  I have been toying with the idea of buying one myself as a pack rod since my Sage met an untimely end.  (If anyone finds it on the bottom of the Yellowstone, can you return it?) <g Here is an url for you to look at: http://www.cabelas.com/texis/scripts/store/+/CatalogDisplay/displayPO… — Warren Findley Shut up and fish! For Yellowstone Clave info: http://www.geocities.com/troutbum_mt/YNP.html

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Todd, You might want to check out Cabela’s.  

…or, e-mail my good friend walt winter at ezflyfish.com.  he’ll give you good advice and sell you a good product within your price range.  i dislike cabela’s… jeff

Response:

My son will be turning 8 in a few months and has begun showing interest in our sport.  Does anyone have any suggestions for a good beginners set-up. I want something that will last, but doesn’t break the bank.  I’d consider a rod and reel combo up to $200.  We normally fish small trout rivers and since we live in So.Cal. most of our fishing requires extensive traveling, often on any airplane, i.e. a three or four piece.  For example we will be hitting the Battenkill in Vermont this summer.  Anybody’s 2 cents are welcome.  Thanks, Todd

My feeling is that you would be better making short trips to "put and take" ponds or similar, and fishing with worms etc if necessary. Eight year olds rarely possess the attention span required for intensive fly-fishing, and their success rate is accordingly low. This leads to frustration, and reduces interest even further, and may result in them giving up. Take him somewhere where he will catch fish. It does not matter how.  Do not fish yourself, devote your time and attention to him, but without crowding him.  let HIM fish, do not take the rod off him when he hooks a fish, show him how to cast, bait up etc, and then LEAVE HIM ALONE.  Constant barrages of advice are useless, and defeat the object of the exercise. Answer questions, and demonstrate if necessary but only when asked. Take a fly-rod along and the gear ( yours, not a "kid-rig" ), and show him how it works for a short while.   He will soon get the idea.  The main thing is, he MUST CATCH FISH, and he MUST NOT GET THE FEELING THAT HE IS BEING FORCED TO DO SOMETHING. TL MC

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Take him somewhere where he will catch fish. It does not matter how.  Do not fish yourself, devote your time and attention to him, but without crowding him.  let HIM fish, do not take the rod off him when he hooks a fish, show him how to cast, bait up etc, and then LEAVE HIM ALONE.  Constant barrages of advice are useless, and defeat the object of the exercise.

I introduced my daughter to fishing at a little plunge pool in Montana’s Bob Marshall Wilderness. This was carefully planned out. I knew from a previous trip that the little trout in this pool were so eager that they’d jump into the air to get the fly before it landed. If a fly managed to make it to the surface it would last only a few seconds. She caught a fish immediately. As luck would have it, the fish was hooked in the eye, and she was so grossed out she wouldn’t fish any more. The next summer we took a raft trip down the Middle Fork of the Salmon, which is a fishing dream trip. I bought her a Cabella’s Three Forks 3 weight combo and she never even used it, despite my broad hints. Oh well. At least I had Three Forks combo to lend to Warren when he forgot to bring his rod to Jack Creek. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/

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Question:

I fear you might have a problem riding the horse in the stream itself, if it shies for some reason you might be thrown.  

That’s always a possibility, even if I’m not fishing. If you have no intention of landing the fish, then you will at least have no problems with fish splashing about close, and possibly frightening the horse.   You might have problems with the noise the horse makes frightening the fish, or perhaps you can "muffle" the hooves in some way, without causing the horse to lose traction. Presumably the horse is shod?

Yes, he’s shod. Horses are actually very good at wading in freestone rivers — much better than people are. They’re tall, they have four long legs, they’re heavy, and their weight is high (not underwater, like much of ours when we wade). I cross streams frequently while mounted without problems. Does not sound much like "stealthy" fly-fishing either.  Up on a horse in the stream, in places where horses are not common, you are liable to frighten most fish long before you get within casting range, although this might not be the case.  

That’s true, but I’d also be up high where I could more easily spot fish. There’s so much noise in these freestone streams that you can wade with a fair amount of ruckus without spooking the fish. let us know how you get on.

Will do. The idea here isn’t really to catch fish, of course. It’s just to try this to be able to say I’ve done it. I’m looking for the right setup — early evening, sun and wind at my back, riffles with pocket water, and plenty of dumb fish. There’s a perfect spot just upstream from my pasture on the Salmon river. Unfortuanately, a highway goes right by there, so I might cause an sensation. This is just the sort of thing what would get people talking around here. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/ something bogus to avoid spam)

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Willi can attest to the fact that I did an incredible hopping/dancing routine in a slippery Madison riffle when a fish came straight at me and swam through my legs.  (Yeah, it was a whitefish… so?)  If you put tassles on your horse and braided its mane, I’d pay good money to see a horse do the same thing.

No tassles and braids, Jeff. This is Idaho. You don’t baby horses or take them to the hairdresser here. There’s a horse in my rented pasture (not mine) that had a serious case of ear mites, and probably other parasites as well. He was really suffering and was weak and listless. Since so one was doing anything about it I gave him a dose of Ivermectin (recommended by folks in rec.equestrian) just before I left for the Western Clave. When I returned about 10 days later the mites were gone and he was feeling and looking good. I took him on a long ride up to Sulpher Creek and he did just fine, except it’s like fighting the Devil to get the bridle over his ears. He’ll get over that. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/ something bogus to avoid spam)

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Don’t laugh. I’m serious. The next logical step is actually fishing FROM THE HORSE!         i’m really worried about wolfgang.  at this point, there have been a dozen responses to this post, and he remains silent.         could someone check the e.r.’s in milwaukee? wayno, always thinking of his friends.

Ahem….yes….sorry about the delay.  It’s been a rather busy week for me.  I’ve been engaged in monitoring ROFF’s collective blood pressure using my own patented remote telemetry device.  Oddly enough it appears that the numbers increase significantly in direct proportion to the frequency of my participation.  Still working on whether the relationship is causal or merely coincidental.  Will keep everyone posted on results. Have also been deeply engaged in an investigation of population genetics as manifested in boorish behavior on small mountain streams.  Fascinating study! As to the point under consideration in this thread, why anyone would consider doing anything on a horse’s back other than perhaps parking a bus, completely escapes me.  That said, if memory serves, I seem to recall seeing photos in some of the fishing rags a few years ago, when I still paid attention to them, of people doing exactly what Steve is contemplating.  I believe there were some ads for outfitters who take people out on fishing trips specifically to fish while mounted upon the backs of these ungainly and treacherous brutes.  Sorry I can’t give any more details but my memory of the references is rather dim as I was at that time deeply engrossed in the consideration of a plan to get nymphs to the bottom of deep pools without using hazardous lead weights by clasping the fly firmly in my teeth and diving headlong into the pools with a medium sized anvil tied securely to my neck.  Sadly, I must report that this plan never came to fruition as I was unable to devise a reliable method for retrieving the anvils which, as I’m sure everyone knows, are in short supply due to the distressing habit of "collectors" buying them up at auctions and yard sales to be used as lawn ornaments. However, now that I think about it, I suppose that a steel shod horse has from horse hair lines to using the entire beast…..waste not, want not, eh?  Or would that be considered bait casting? FWIW Wolfgang "Something’s happening here….."

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rw,   One of my wildest rides occurred when mounting a horse with a fishing rod in hand. Ernie

A mare no doubt. Peter

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  One of my wildest rides occurred when mounting a horse with a fishing rod in hand. Ernie A mare no doubt. Peter

Ernie "Stud" Harrison seems to take a little "different" view of dealing with animals.  I shudder to think of what would happen if Ernie took up Mike’s Camel suggestion.  Reminds me of a Foreign Legion story; there was a new officer assigned to a remote French Foreign Legion post…… — Wayne (saving the rest of the story for the Smallie Clave this weekend) To fish is human….To release Divine! Before you buy.

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As to the point under consideration in this thread, why anyone would consider doing anything on a horse’s back other than perhaps parking a bus, completely escapes me.  

Why would anyone consider climbing up a waterfall while wearing wading boots and carrying a flyrod? That said, if memory serves, I seem to recall seeing photos in some of the fishing rags a few years ago, when I still paid attention to them, of people doing exactly what Steve is contemplating.  I believe there were some ads for outfitters who take people out on fishing trips specifically to fish while mounted upon the backs of these ungainly and treacherous brutes.

I’ve wanted to try this ever since I saw the movie "Jeremiah Johnson". Johnson (played by Robert Redford) was starving in the winter, and he was desperately trying to catch fish with his bare hands. As he was pathetically flopping around in the freezing creek he looked up to see a mounted Indian wading, carrying a full stringer of trout he’s shot with a bow and arrow. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/ something bogus to avoid spam)

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I’ve wanted to try this ever since I saw the movie "Jeremiah Johnson". Johnson (played by Robert Redford) was starving in the winter, and he was desperately trying to catch fish with his bare hands. As he was pathetically flopping around in the freezing creek he looked up to see a mounted Indian wading, carrying a full stringer of trout he’s shot with a bow and arrow.

Be careful when bowfishing.  When I was a kid I went bowfishing for carp with my father and uncle.  My uncle shot at a fish and the line wrapped around his finger as he shot.  His finger was essentially only held together by the fingernail.  We rushed him to the hospital and they sewed it all back together, but it wasn’t a pretty sight. I know I’ve never gone since then and I seriously doubt if either of them have.  Still makes me cringe 10-15 years later just thinking about it. Happy lunchtime reading,      - Ken —     "I was gratified to be able to answer promptly,       and I did.  I said I didn’t know."     — Mark Twain

Response:

 There’s so much noise in these freestone streams that you can wade with a fair amount of ruckus without spooking the fish.

    with all due respect, steve, i will put you and that goddam horse at the mouth of hazel creek, give you your choice of equipment, and give you one hundred dollars for every fish you can catch from dawn to dark.  in return, you will pay me a thousand bucks if you fail to bring a fish to hand.  shit, the rainbows in hazel creek will spook a hundred yards in both directions if audrey hepburn’s ghost slips on an orange slider!     wayno, who is put in mind of the shotgunned killdeer of the tejas.

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The problem is what to do with the fish when I hook it. My plan is to cut the hook bends off of dry flies and just fish for rises. Does this sound totally crazy?

How about using a net with a 6′ handle? But if that’s too much work, you might just consider paying someone to fish for you–you can just watch from a distance on horseback and that way you’ll have at least one hand free to make calls on your satellite phone. –Steve

Response:

How about using a net with a 6′ handle? But if that’s too much work, you might just consider paying someone to fish for you–you can just watch from a distance on horseback and that way you’ll have at least one hand free to make calls on your satellite phone.

If he’d hunt from it too, and wear a fur coat, PETA could just focus on him and leave everyone else alone (especially if he bought the Wienermobile to tow his horse trailer to the stream)<g. — Charlie…

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If he’d hunt from it too, and wear a fur coat, PETA could just focus on him and leave everyone else alone (especially if he bought the Wienermobile to tow his horse trailer to the stream)<g. — Charlie…

Arlo could trot behind fitted up with an antler tied to his head like the dog in Grinch Who Stole Christmas! — Wayne To fish is human….To release Divine! Before you buy.

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If he’d hunt from it too<

You know the old joke – "can I shoot off this horse?"  "Sure."  Guy comes back all beat up, wants his money back.  Seller reminds him, "I said you could shoot OFF him, not ON him!" <g

Response:

Don’t laugh. I’m serious. The next logical step is actually fishing FROM THE HORSE!

        i’m really worried about wolfgang.  at this point, there have been a dozen responses to this post, and he remains silent.         could someone check the e.r.’s in milwaukee? wayno, always thinking of his friends.

Response:

rw,    One of my wildest rides occurred when mounting a horse with a fishing rod in hand. Ernie

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Don’t laugh. I’m serious. When I got my horse in June he was afraid of flyrods. Thought they were whips, I suppose. He’s over that now. I can mount and ride him with a flyrod. It’s really fun to ride from hole to hole, dismounting for a few casts, sticking around if there’s action, and moving on if there’s not. There’s lots of water around here where you can do that without disturbing anyone. The next logical step is actually fishing FROM THE HORSE! I want to eliminate this dismounting and tying up bullshit. I know places where I could wade upstream (mounted, of course) and cast to lots of riffles, pocket water, and shoreline, kind of like a drift boat in reverse. The problem is what to do with the fish when I hook it. My plan is to cut the hook bends off of dry flies and just fish for rises. Does this sound totally crazy? — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/ to something bogus to avoid spam)

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True….a rod in hand is definitely not very romantic…..john – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – rw,   One of my wildest rides occurred when mounting a horse with a fishing rod in hand. Ernie Don’t laugh. I’m serious. When I got my horse in June he was afraid of flyrods. Thought they were whips, I suppose. He’s over that now. I can mount and ride him with a flyrod. It’s really fun to ride from hole to hole, dismounting for a few casts, sticking around if there’s action, and moving on if there’s not. There’s lots of water around here where you can do that without disturbing anyone. The next logical step is actually fishing FROM THE HORSE! I want to eliminate this dismounting and tying up bullshit. I know places where I could wade upstream (mounted, of course) and cast to lots of riffles, pocket water, and shoreline, kind of like a drift boat in reverse. The problem is what to do with the fish when I hook it. My plan is to cut the hook bends off of dry flies and just fish for rises. Does this sound totally crazy? — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/ to something bogus to avoid spam)

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I hope someone is around with a camera<g. I wonder how the horse will like fish jumping and splashing next to it, not to mention the line tangled around its legs…

Willi can attest to the fact that I did an incredible hopping/dancing routine in a slippery Madison riffle when a fish came straight at me and swam through my legs.  (Yeah, it was a whitefish… so?)  If you put tassles on your horse and braided its mane, I’d pay good money to see a horse do the same thing. Regards, Jeff

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can you image the affect of a bad sinktip cast whipping across its rump?

I believe the technical term is "yee haw"<g. — Charlie…

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A camel might be a better idea. Puts a whole new perspective on fishing with humpys !:) TL MC — "If you have tried everything you know, and nothing works, then perhaps it is time to accept that you don

Question:

<SNIP IT’S OVER.  LET IT DIE. This Rupe thing is ripping up apart.  There are ROFFians on both side of the fence and each group will never totally agree with each other.  That’s okay. We can either continue bickering back and forth with nothing ever being resolved or we can just decide to be silent on the issue.  I choose silence. There are so many other things to talk about.

<SNIP Vern, you were a little over-zealous in your support of this action, and I did warn you that it might get ugly, and to be perhaps a little more circumspect. I am not censuring you in any way, you did what you believed was right, and in a good cause.  You stood up for something you believed in, and you have every right to be proud of it.  Do not let anybody else try to persuade you otherwise.  ROFF is made up of a lot of people, the vast majority are perfectly well aware that what was done was the correct thing to do, irrespective of any hair-splitting debates which may occur as an aftermath. I assume the fact that some of your letters are being touted as "hate-mail" etc is unsettling you. Don’t worry about it, there is nothing in those letters which could upset anybody at all with any sense. Simply the request to the sponsors to withdraw their support. You should see my mail !  I did not realise there were so many dangerous nutcases supporting the killing of Indians, I even got mail from some people claiming to be Indians, saying they supported old Rupe.  They really must be nuts. It will take more than something of this nature to "rip ROFF apart".  Try to calm down a bit.  Go fishing ! Tight lines ! Mike Connor

Response:

I look at it a little different.  Yes, I was one of the more loud voices. However, I don’t believe anyone wanted FAOL to disappear.  I know I didn’t. Additionally, they don’t have to.  No one’s asking for that.  FAOL is a good web-site that has a lot of good information on it.  We only wanted the last article from Rupe removed.  That’s all.  It was a moral issue.  We took action regarding a possible resolution.  The longer FAOL resisted the more public anger grew.  That’s just normal. Now that the life of FAOL is in question, it’s like dancing on a dying friend.  I don’t see any glory or pride in this.  Furthermore, it’s not necessary.  With the new information about the possible demise of FAOL, the continued debate that has no resolution becomes meaningless.  If a resolution was possible, that would be different because the debate would have purpose.  There is no resolution and there will never be a resolution to the continued treads.  I then ask, why do the threads continuing?  What does everyone want from continuing the debate? Vern – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I totally agree.  I’ve even thought about leaving ROFF for a week or two until all the Rupe threads die out. IT’S OVER.  LET IT DIE. This Rupe thing is ripping up apart.  There are ROFFians on both side of the fence and each group will never totally agree with each other.  That’s okay. We can either continue bickering back and forth with nothing ever being resolved or we can just decide to be silent on the issue.  I choose silence. There are so many other things to talk about. There’s nothing you, I, or anyone can do at this point.  What FAOL chooses to do from here on out is up to themselves.  Everything up to this point is history.  I exhort you, let’s just continue with the ffing.  Please. I must say I’m a little bit disappointed in you on this one Vern.  In the first place, the Rupe thing is hardly ripping us apart.  There have been many threads on ROFF which generated a lot more fireworks than this one.  In fact, I’ve found the debate on this one to be remarkably civilized.  This is nothing compared to what goes on in the ubiquitous C&R vs C&K threads.  Hell, even a debate about the definition of ‘meniscus’ can get uglier than this. Secondly, if I’m not mistaken, yours was one of the first and loudest voices calling for action against FAOL.  Mind you, I don’t disapprove of your action; I quite agree that something needed to be done and heartily commend you for taking a lead in informing the sponsors of what was happening.  But it seems to me at this late date that for you to call an end to the whole process, when you were so instrumental in initiating it is a bit disingenuous, especially in light of the fact that Mike has been taking the vast majority of the heat. Again, I don’t have a problem with the action you took, but I am surprised at how little any of the critics had to say to you directly about it.  Now it looks as though you’re trying to duck out while everyone is still focused on Mike’s role and you have escaped unscathed. In short, you were instrumental in stirring up this hornets’ nest, it doesn’t look good for you to be too critical of those who pay attention to the hornets.

Response:

Hi Guys, I have read with interest many of the posts regarding Ole Rupe.  I also read his article.  I have also participated in many free speech arguments in my day.  Some included very competitive national moot court competitions during law school.  I felt it was unnecessary for me to add another $.02 worth of opinions since arguments on the many faceted side of this issue have already been made and made and…..  I just did not want to continue to perpetuate this NON FLY FISHING discussion.  I have seen, heard and made many of these arguments in the past.  (So, I started this non fly fishing discussion with a dab of fishing included) <g. Just FYI, at the present time of approximately 10:35 AM in California, there were 114 and counting posts in the To Whom it may Concern thread and 41 and counting on the FAOL Closure thread.  Whew, what passion! I have read many with interest, and it has been an education for me to see how many articulate and passionate individuals are out there in the fishing world.  I applaud you all for your stands on all sides of the issue. Continue to enjoy those threads, but I have a different motivation regarding the time I spend in ROFF notwithstanding my Mea Culpa re email postage stamps.  Oops, there goes my credibility! To give you a flavor of what we are usually discussing, the fly fishing out here in California is wonderful!  In the Central Valley, we are having a very late autumn.  The leaves on the trees are turning to their fall time brilliant yellows, reds and fire oranges.  I am fishing in light Orvis breathable waders and a light shirt under my fly vest.  The Kings River is producing with reluctance, but it does not matter one iota to me.  Being there is enough for me.  For the first time in my short fly fishing ‘career’ I have tied and caught fish on a size 24 Trico Spinners.  Who would have thunk it?  I still can’t believe my eyes when a 16" fish is caught on such a small bug! Nymphing has been my passion of late though.  I broke off 2 good fish using 6X tippet with a Prince Nymph due to my lack of skill in working fish.  I learned fishing in the early ’90’s going for bass.  I can’t seem to lighten up.  I sometimes still have want to SET THE HOOK.  Hopefully, time and practice will correct this fault. The best part is that I did not consider Old Rupe while I was there on the Kings River. Pete

Response:

I totally agree.  I’ve even thought about leaving ROFF for a week or two until all the Rupe threads die out. IT’S OVER.  LET IT DIE. This Rupe thing is ripping up apart.  There are ROFFians on both side of the fence and each group will never totally agree with each other.  That’s okay. We can either continue bickering back and forth with nothing ever being resolved or we can just decide to be silent on the issue.  I choose silence. There are so many other things to talk about. There’s nothing you, I, or anyone can do at this point.  What FAOL chooses to do from here on out is up to themselves.  Everything up to this point is history.  I exhort you, let’s just continue with the ffing.  Please. Vern – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Guys, I have read with interest many of the posts regarding Ole Rupe.  I also read his article.  I have also participated in many free speech arguments in my day.  Some included very competitive national moot court competitions during law school.  I felt it was unnecessary for me to add another $.02 worth of opinions since arguments on the many faceted side of this issue have already been made and made and…..  I just did not want to continue to perpetuate this NON FLY FISHING discussion.  I have seen, heard and made many of these arguments in the past.  (So, I started this non fly fishing discussion with a dab of fishing included) <g. Just FYI, at the present time of approximately 10:35 AM in California, there were 114 and counting posts in the To Whom it may Concern thread and 41 and counting on the FAOL Closure thread.  Whew, what passion! I have read many with interest, and it has been an education for me to see how many articulate and passionate individuals are out there in the fishing world.  I applaud you all for your stands on all sides of the issue. Continue to enjoy those threads, but I have a different motivation regarding the time I spend in ROFF notwithstanding my Mea Culpa re email postage stamps.  Oops, there goes my credibility! To give you a flavor of what we are usually discussing, the fly fishing out here in California is wonderful!  In the Central Valley, we are having a very late autumn.  The leaves on the trees are turning to their fall time brilliant yellows, reds and fire oranges.  I am fishing in light Orvis breathable waders and a light shirt under my fly vest.  The Kings River is producing with reluctance, but it does not matter one iota to me.  Being there is enough for me.  For the first time in my short fly fishing ‘career’ I have tied and caught fish on a size 24 Trico Spinners.  Who would have thunk it?  I still can’t believe my eyes when a 16" fish is caught on such a small bug! Nymphing has been my passion of late though.  I broke off 2 good fish using 6X tippet with a Prince Nymph due to my lack of skill in working fish.  I learned fishing in the early ’90’s going for bass.  I can’t seem to lighten up.  I sometimes still have want to SET THE HOOK.  Hopefully, time and practice will correct this fault. The best part is that I did not consider Old Rupe while I was there on the Kings River. Pete

Response:

Take it easy, Vern. We’ve had similar blow-ups here before, but eventually everyone chills out… About a week ago – at least a couple of days before Mike’s first post wrt RAOL, I responded to someone (I think it was Jon Cook) that the extended period of Peace On ROFF "was just the calm before the next storm". I had no idea I’d be THAT correct! /daytripper (ROFF is cyclical ;^) – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I totally agree.  I’ve even thought about leaving ROFF for a week or two until all the Rupe threads die out. IT’S OVER.  LET IT DIE. This Rupe thing is ripping up apart.  There are ROFFians on both side of the fence and each group will never totally agree with each other.  That’s okay. We can either continue bickering back and forth with nothing ever being resolved or we can just decide to be silent on the issue.  I choose silence. There are so many other things to talk about. There’s nothing you, I, or anyone can do at this point.  What FAOL chooses to do from here on out is up to themselves.  Everything up to this point is history.  I exhort you, let’s just continue with the ffing.  Please.

Response:

I totally agree.  I’ve even thought about leaving ROFF for a week or two until all the Rupe threads die out. IT’S OVER.  LET IT DIE. This Rupe thing is ripping up apart.  There are ROFFians on both side of the fence and each group will never totally agree with each other.  That’s okay. We can either continue bickering back and forth with nothing ever being resolved or we can just decide to be silent on the issue.  I choose silence. There are so many other things to talk about. There’s nothing you, I, or anyone can do at this point.  What FAOL chooses to do from here on out is up to themselves.  Everything up to this point is history.  I exhort you, let’s just continue with the ffing.  Please.

I must say I’m a little bit disappointed in you on this one Vern.  In the first place, the Rupe thing is hardly ripping us apart.  There have been many threads on ROFF which generated a lot more fireworks than this one.  In fact, I’ve found the debate on this one to be remarkably civilized.  This is nothing compared to what goes on in the ubiquitous C&R vs C&K threads.  Hell, even a debate about the definition of ‘meniscus’ can get uglier than this. Secondly, if I’m not mistaken, yours was one of the first and loudest voices calling for action against FAOL.  Mind you, I don’t disapprove of your action; I quite agree that something needed to be done and heartily commend you for taking a lead in informing the sponsors of what was happening.  But it seems to me at this late date that for you to call an end to the whole process, when you were so instrumental in initiating it is a bit disingenuous, especially in light of the fact that Mike has been taking the vast majority of the heat.  Again, I don’t have a problem with the action you took, but I am surprised at how little any of the critics had to say to you directly about it.  Now it looks as though you’re trying to duck out while everyone is still focused on Mike’s role and you have escaped unscathed. In short, you were instrumental in stirring up this hornets’ nest, it doesn’t look good for you to be too critical of those who pay attention to the hornets.

Response:

snip<

No sweat, Vern.   This is just one of those discussions that helps bring another dimension to the faceless names here.   Nobody really gets too pissed off, and we get to learn a little bit about each other.   It’s not really a bad thing; it’s what we seem to be.   And after it’s over, we’re still friends (mostly <g).   Nobody would put any of this ahead of a day on the water.   Aside from a waste of bandwidth, it’s harmless, and sometimes fun. Joe F.

Response:

In short, you were instrumental in stirring up this hornets’ nest, it doesn’t

look good for you to be too critical of those who pay attention to the hornets.< As I said initially, I was out of town, missed the start.   Hmmm, Vern, eh?   Should I start all over again?  <g

Response:

Ah, yes, fishing!

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – <SNIP IT’S OVER.  LET IT DIE. This Rupe thing is ripping up apart.  There are ROFFians on both side of the fence and each group will never totally agree with each other.  That’s okay. We can either continue bickering back and forth with nothing ever being resolved or we can just decide to be silent on the issue.  I choose silence. There are so many other things to talk about. <SNIP Vern, you were a little over-zealous in your support of this action, and I did warn you that it might get ugly, and to be perhaps a little more circumspect. I am not censuring you in any way, you did what you believed was right, and in a good cause.  You stood up for something you believed in, and you have every right to be proud of it.  Do not let anybody else try to persuade you otherwise.  ROFF is made up of a lot of people, the vast majority are perfectly well aware that what was done was the correct thing to do, irrespective of any hair-splitting debates which may occur as an aftermath. I assume the fact that some of your letters are being touted as "hate-mail" etc is unsettling you. Don’t worry about it, there is nothing in those letters which could upset anybody at all with any sense. Simply the request to the sponsors to withdraw their support. You should see my mail !  I did not realise there were so many dangerous nutcases supporting the killing of Indians, I even got mail from some people claiming to be Indians, saying they supported old Rupe.  They really must be nuts. It will take more than something of this nature to "rip ROFF apart".  Try to calm down a bit.  Go fishing ! Tight lines ! Mike Connor

Response:

You’re my man, Ken. I got your back.

Ditto.  In spades.

Response:

To Debate is interesting and often educational, to Argue, name call and belittle is not…

Is so.   Ignorant Twerp.      

Response:

Wolfgang the bully, writes:

<<Is so.   Ignorant Twerp.       Boy, I’m glad you did tell ol Jim to BMAIAL.  I have that one.  Even use it in my address for anti-spam.  Don’t know what I would do without it.  <g Dave L.

Response:

David, This is so off the mark that I really got a good laugh out of your post.  One thing I have never been accused of is to be a closet anything, or to hide behind anyone.  My wife would really get a kick out of this (BG).  We have a good friend living on Bainbridge Island, and my impression of the place is that a lot of spoiled aging yuppies lived there.  I’m afraid that you have reinforced that image in my mind. Ken, I expected more from someone with an edu address.  "Frogboy"??  (LOL).  I guess it fits that the edu address goes with living in a very sheltered environment. You want to use the word fuckin and you have to use ***’s??  As far as hard-earned flyfishing dollars, you should try to make your living in the real world (G). Kermit – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Ken Oh they take it seriously. They’re the closet racist’s who provide a respectable chorus line to guys like Rupe, and love to hide behind well meaning folks who honestly wonder where the free speech line is, or who are honest political conservatives. The dead giveaway is that they have no bottom line. Ive run into them before here in the NW,  home of the Aryan Nations. They know that murderous remarks like Rupe’s are important because they intimidate minorities from participation in many activities and forums. Its very effective and a lot less risky that acting out their bullshit at work, bombing a church or killing someone on a dark road. They are gutless. They are wacko’s. But they are not stupid. Dave I am bothered by the article, but I would not have taken it seriously anyway.  But I am much more bothered by the pc mob mentality that I witnessed here.  I don’t feel that there is anything to be very proud off here. Blow it out yer ass, frogboy. Just because you’re too f***in’ stupid to take seriously the most vile and vicious racial epithet that can be hurled at Native Americans is no reason to demean the many good people of ROFF that are QUITE proud that this little piece of racist garbage is no longer sponsored by good companies competing for our hard earned flyfishing dollars. — Ken Fortenberry

Response:

Now I just have to figure out how to suspend a reference line over my head next time out on the pond or a lake… Michael Era

Question:

Going to be in Denver for a meeting during the second week of July. Want to know if anyone would point me at some closeby fly fishing. Wade fishing if possible but not essential. I don’t expect any secret places, but just a general idea of someplace that I can relax for a couple of days after the meeting…… Any input is appreciated Frank

Response:

frank the orvis shop in boulder can point you to rocky mountain national park. a guide, shawn, took me to the roaring for some greenback cutthrot fishing. walt

Response:

There’s not too much decent fly fishing nearby denver but you might want to try the s. platte river where it goes into chattfield reservoir.  Ask anybody when you get here, everybody knows where chattfield is. Good luck!-Tim – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Going to be in Denver for a meeting during the second week of July. Want to know if anyone would point me at some closeby fly fishing. Wade fishing if possible but not essential. I don’t expect any secret places, but just a general idea of someplace that I can relax for a couple of days after the meeting…… Any input is appreciated Frank

Response:

follow I-70 to Silverthorne and fish the Blue river.  Plenty of places to stay and some good fishing. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Going to be in Denver for a meeting during the second week of July. Want to know if anyone would point me at some closeby fly fishing. Wade fishing if possible but not essential. I don’t expect any secret places, but just a general idea of someplace that I can relax for a couple of days after the meeting…… Any input is appreciated Frank Another thought: About 2 1/2 hours north of denver on I-25, just outside of Fort Collins is the Poudre Canyon, follow the Poudre River on Highway 14 up the canyon.  Great fly-fishing abounds everywhere and there is cabins for rent all along the way.-Tim in Denver Share what you know. Learn what you don’t.

Response:

Going to be in Denver for a meeting during the

second week of July. Want to know if anyone would point me at some closeby fly fishing. Wade fishing if possible but not essential. I don’t expect any secret places, but just a

general idea of someplace that I can relax for a couple of days after the meeting…… Any input is appreciated Frank Another thought: About 2 1/2 hours north

of denver on I-25, just outside of Fort Collins is the Poudre Canyon, follow the Poudre River on Highway 14 up the canyon.  Great fly-fishing abounds everywhere and there is cabins for rent all along the way.-Tim in Denver Share what you know. Learn what you don’t.

Response:

Question:

Sure its early!  Everybody else its still working off the holidays…. Anybody with nformation drop a note. Who’s up for some flyfishing afterwards? Ciao! Blair

Response:

Sure its early!  Everybody else its still working off the holidays…. Anybody with nformation drop a note. Who’s up for some flyfishing afterwards? Ciao! Blair

We have a snall US and Canadian contingent going down there for the race. Training has been quite interesting for me over the winter months (I don’t know if I can put myself up to this again!). I think there is one person in our contingent who might bring the flyfishing gear. As for me, I don’t know if flyfishing is up my alley…bungee jumping is more like it! See you down there.                           |26      | IMC’96: 10:36:37          |   Fe   |   IMNZ, IMC ‘99 IMC’97: 10:42:53          |        |                  "THE BEST ELEMENT OF RACING"

Response:

Sure its early!  Everybody else its still working off the holidays…. Anybody with nformation drop a note. Who’s up for some flyfishing afterwards? Ciao! Blair We have a snall US and Canadian contingent going down there for the race. Training has been quite interesting for me over the winter months (I don’t know if I can put myself up to this again!). I think there is one person in our contingent who might bring the flyfishing gear. As for me, I don’t know if

I’m not a flyfisherman, so take this with a grain of salt.  I’m pretty certain that you can hire all the gear form the fishing guides/boatmen at Taupo.  Seems crazy to lug even more gear across the world!  Though, I suppose a rod could go in the bike box Jeff – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – flyfishing is up my alley…bungee jumping is more like it! See you down there.                           |26      | IMC’96: 10:36:37          |   Fe   |   IMNZ, IMC ‘99 IMC’97: 10:42:53          |        |                  "THE BEST ELEMENT OF RACING"

Response:

Question:

Someone asked me to finish this story <snip

You have some imagination there Mr. G., I bet your wife is waiting for the season to open…*G* Great job, I enjoyed it……

Response:

Someone asked me to finish this story <snip You have some imagination there Mr. G., I bet your wife is waiting for the season to open…*G* Great job, I enjoyed it……

THIS BASICALLY IS A STORY BASED ON A TRUE EVENT.  Only the size of the Fish has been exaggerated. Mr. G And I am so pleased you enjoyed it Mr Busted. again,

Response:

Someone asked me to finish this story I wrote a few months ago.  So here it is, finished.  He was smart enough to ‘ask the question’  The answer is in this dear, wonderful, almost completely true, story that took place in the Bitterroot Valley in Montana.  I hope everyone enjoys it. A TROUBLED MORNING  or (Duckling Advice) So, there we all were, gathered around for our early morning donuts and coffee.  John lived out South of Hamilton going towards Darby.  He had this neat little spread and a pond that was fed by the Bitterroot River . . . and the pond had ducks on it.  One of the Mallard females had little, yellow baby ducklings.  "They

Question:

Thinking of taking the family to Fla for a week in Feb.  I would appreciate any suggestions for a flyfisher (me) and two non-fishers (my wife and 6 yr. old daughter).  We’ve done the Keys and were thinking of the West coast, maybe Sanibel???

Response:

Strongly encourage you to investigate Gasparilla Island/Boca Grande.  I traveled there before becoming a fly fisherman and love the place because it is the antithesis of high-rise condo beach resorts.  To me it feels like most of FL must have been in the early part of this century.  If you want the fast lane go somewhere else.  For geographic perspective, Gasparilla is roughly two offshore islands north of Sanibel. Boca Grande claims to be the tarpon capital of the world.  Don’t know how much local boosterism that relies on, but judging by the number of fishing guides something’s going on under water.  As I said I haven’t fished there, but have since investigated because I plan to return.  I’ll try to answer any specific questions you may have. Jeff – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Thinking of taking the family to Fla for a week in Feb.  I would appreciate any suggestions for a flyfisher (me) and two non-fishers (my wife and 6 yr. old daughter).  We’ve done the Keys and were thinking of the West coast, maybe Sanibel???

Response: