Question:

Have you done this walk up Hazel as an overnighter?  It has been my experience that what is a six hour walk with a fly rod is a whole different critter than hiking in with a backpack, tent, etc.  At any rate, I’m in if the sceduling can be worked out.  Any idea what the actual mileage is?

never done it…they wouldn’t let you fish up there FOR 25 YEARS!  why would i walk that far *not* to fish…  now that it’s open to fishing, i’m yearning to take a look at the water.  i’m thinking it’s 8-10 miles up to the walkers creek, proctor creek area based on my map. the cascade is about 13 miles… but maybe someone who’s a hiker and been in there can tell us –  and…the trail is a flat road, much easier walking than snowbird.  there are carts with big wheels…  can’t we do 8 miles in 6 hours? btw…i’m still wet-wading in october… neoprenes seem a bit much for carolina fall fishing. I agree about the neoprenes but my one experience fishing with you in October suggests that wading wet could be a bit iffy……

yeah, but that’s why we’ll be carryin the lightweight goretex <g.  it’s when you’re done fishin that the wetness and the evening chill gets you… the days are great, unless it rains. it’s o.k. if you’re naturally numb from the waist down

i can’t help it if you’re easily numbed… those of us with sturdy scrotum and "turtle" reflex find it invigorating… but for those of us who are of the neck up persuasion

…hmm, thought ee cummings described them as boston women… it would come down to a choice between walking on our hands or perhaps wearing lightweights.      :)

damn…if only i’d known what might have occurred if i’d gotten the lightweights instead of the socks… jeff (makin a note) – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Have you done this walk up Hazel as an overnighter?  It has been my experience that what is a six hour walk with a fly rod is a whole different critter than hiking in with a backpack, tent, etc.  At any rate, I’m in if the sceduling can be worked out.  Any idea what the actual mileage is? never done it…they wouldn’t let you fish up there FOR 25 YEARS!  why would i walk that far *not* to fish…  now that it’s open to fishing, i’m yearning to take a look at the water.  i’m thinking it’s 8-10 miles up to the walkers creek, proctor creek area based on my map. the cascade is about 13 miles… but maybe someone who’s a hiker and been in there can tell us –  and…the trail is a flat road, much easier walking than snowbird.  there are carts with big wheels…  can’t we do 8 miles in 6 hours?

"Got Speed Bumps?"

Response:

no speed bumps so far…but i’ve only been up about 3 miles.  i’ve been told wayno’s had the park rangers drive him up the road, so maybe he can describe upper hazel. i believe you could do it no problem.  didn’t you go up a ways when wayno hit his big rainbow? jeff – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – "Got Speed Bumps?"

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Have you done this walk up Hazel as an overnighter?  It has been my experience that what is a six hour walk with a fly rod is a whole different critter than hiking in with a backpack, tent, etc.  At any rate, I’m in if the sceduling can be worked out.  Any idea what the actual mileage is? never done it…they wouldn’t let you fish up there FOR 25 YEARS!  why would i walk that far *not* to fish…  now that it’s open to fishing, i’m yearning to take a look at the water.  i’m thinking it’s 8-10 miles up to the walkers creek, proctor creek area based on my map. the cascade is about 13 miles… but maybe someone who’s a hiker and been in there can tell us –  and…the trail is a flat road, much easier walking than snowbird.  there are carts with big wheels…  can’t we do 8 miles in 6 hours?

Shit, Tripper can do eight miles in six hours on a flat road in a big wheel cart……um……well, if Petah is pushing it. btw…i’m still wet-wading in october… neoprenes seem a bit much for carolina fall fishing. I agree about the neoprenes but my one experience fishing with you in October suggests that wading wet could be a bit iffy…… yeah, but that’s why we’ll be carryin the lightweight goretex <g.  it’s when you’re done fishin that the wetness and the evening chill gets you… the days are great, unless it rains.

I LOVE rain…..it’s warmer than the creek! it’s o.k. if you’re naturally numb from the waist down i can’t help it if you’re easily numbed… those of us with sturdy scrotum and "turtle" reflex find it invigorating…

Uh…….remind me not to watch you bathe up there…..o.k.?      :( but for those of us who are of the neck up persuasion …hmm, thought ee cummings described them as boston women…

I’ll have to defer to mr. harrison vis mr. cummings…..they speak the same language. it would come down to a choice between walking on our hands or perhaps wearing lightweights.      :) damn…if only i’d known what might have occurred if i’d gotten the lightweights instead of the socks…

Oh yeah, they’re indispensable, as Mr. Tup so eloquently put it. jeff (makin a note)

Uh huh, about a fourth register E if mine ear doth not deceive me. Wolfgang who would recommend a good geographer to explain the nice distinction between flat and level.    :)

Response:

On my topo map this looks to be a pretty ambitous trip. Approximately 13.5 miles and 2000 feet of elevation. Early in May my son and I walked up to the campsite at the confluence of Hazel and Sugar Fork. It’s about 5.6 miles by the trail and 425 feet vertically from the lake. Had a full pack with pasta and dehydrated meals for two days, tent, sleeping bag, thermarest, primus stove, waders, wading boots, rod, vest, etc. And one can of St. Louis’ best beer.  I figure the pack weighed at least 30 lbs. It seemed much heavier. The fishing apparatus added more weight (total = 40?) and hassle. Furthermore, I was pretty sadly out of shape. Having listed all those excuses, it took between four and five hours to make the trip. That included several stops along the way to admire the creek. You all have been on the trail before – it’s a gentle grade and fairly easy walk if you don’t try to take your entire net worth in equipment. But a 13 or 14 mile walk with full pack and fishing gear is a fairly major undertaking. Wet wading in Smoky mountain streams in October takes more fortitude than I have. I’m numb enough from the waist down already, and it gets worse every year. Bob

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – …well, this appears to be the beginnings of yet another fine idea. i suggest you take charge of it, establish some proposed dates, and we’ll set up a new thread to see what develops. if zimbo is still hereabouts, perhaps he’ll post the dates of his gathering – i’m gonna be in the smokies the week of oct 19-26th with rachel – the 21st is her birthday. i can probably manage a 3-day camping trip either before that week or at the latter part of that week, or i can take a 4 day weekend thursday-sunday at another time. the park service provides some carts we can use to roll supplies up the trail if anyone wants or needs to bring some special stuff. Have you done this walk up Hazel as an overnighter?  It has been my experience that what is a six hour walk with a fly rod is a whole different critter than hiking in with a backpack, tent, etc.  At any rate, I’m in if the sceduling can be worked out.  Any idea what the actual mileage is? btw…i’m still wet-wading in october… neoprenes seem a bit much for carolina fall fishing. I agree about the neoprenes but my one experience fishing with you in October suggests that wading wet could be a bit iffy……it’s o.k. if you’re naturally numb from the waist down but for those of us who are of the neck up persuasion it would come down to a choice between walking on our hands or perhaps wearing lightweights.      :) Wolfgang

Response:

"Got Speed Bumps?" no speed bumps so far…but i’ve only been up about 3 miles.  i’ve been told wayno’s had the park rangers drive him up the road, so maybe he can describe upper hazel. i believe you could do it no problem.  didn’t you go up a ways when wayno hit his big rainbow?

I know we went past the "town", maybe a mile or two up the road from there. It wasn’t a hard hike up to wherever we ended up. otoh, we nearly had to have a certain Boy Lawyer airlifted out of there after he caught a WAY-too-big-for-Hazel-Creek rainbow… /daytripper (You think he had the Rangers "salt" the creek for ‘im, too?

Response:

…nothing like a week in graham county to confirm i’ve wasted the better part of my life down here in the crowded flatlands of coastal nc… a situation i hope to correct in the next year or two. anyway, it was an incredible week of fiSSSSHing 5 of my favorite streams in nc, S[******], S[nowbird], S[assafrass], S[anteetlah], and H[azel], briefly recounted as follows: Saturday – rachel and i arrived at the snowbird house, bought some groceries, and settled in… well, sorta.  i was busy getting the fishing stuff settled on the table, rachel did the practical stuff – unpacked clothes and groceries. just before dark (it didn’t get dark until after 9), i walked the 10 feet to the stream out back and fished the two runs that always yield a fish or two – yup, still happenin! two rainbows on an ehc…one was the typical 8 incher caught in the deeper cut of the main current where wolfgang snapped a picture or two of me in   an evening stupor last october; the other was a nice 12 inches or more, caught by "bowling" the fly downstream about 50 feet around the bend of a deeper, quiet pool. satisfied the week was properly started, i ambled outta the stream, back up the gentle bank to a well-prepared spaghetti dinner and a chilly beer. thus began my week’s adventure of solitary fishing in some of the best streams in the smokies  …         SUNDAY – fished S.[******], the stream that yielded those 3 big rainbows last october.  arrived around 9 am, parked in the same place as last year.  the road was a bit worse, but manageable.  this was my day of paying proper devotion and respect – so, after humbly thanking all the spirits and deities, and making a silent oath not to break that commandment about the lord’s name, a kinder, gentler, easier-goin jeff set out up the road to the spot wally and i stopped in our october frenzy, the soul-filling gift of zimbo’s 6′ bamboo rod & the abandoned socks of wolfgang at the ready for a full day in the stream. didn’t see or hear another person the entire day.  S[******]is at about 3000 feet elevation at this point, and it’s headwaters are near a bald which is above 5000 feet. getting to it requires a drive up a steep, narrow grade of dirt and rocks for a mile or so until the road becomes unmanageable with a vehicle… the upper stretch is a rutted, rocky path only 4-wheelers can traverse safely.   from the point i entered the stream, until the pool i quit, with the exception of one pocket, i either caught a fish or had one rise to the fly. except for several brookies, all were rainbows of the usual size with a few approaching or just at ten inches.   size 14 and 16 ehc and parachute adams never failed to attract a fish. after a while, i started playing around with various dry flies just to see what would happen – color didn’t matter, but the size did. though they’d come up and look at the #12 stimulator, i guess it just looked a bit too big to tangle with, or it was easier to distinguish as a phony bug…i don’t know. but switch off to a smaller fly and no problem.  THE HIGHLIGHT – near the close of the day, once the leader had gotten cut back from all the fly changing, as a lark i tied on a flashy green and black bugger i had acquired from a mail order outfit in england a few years ago. i was at one of the deeper pools with a nice froth of white water formed by the stream falling from the pool above. casually tossed the bugger into the froth, let it sink a bit, twitched it back towards me and, damn…what’s this…quite a different feel… jeezusfuckingchri…(ok, i confess… i never was too good at keeping that particular commandment)… it was an honest 12" brookie (spec)- the biggest wild nc brook trout i’ve ever caught! fat, heavy, and healthy looking. what a day!  fellas, seeing a 12" spec in nc is an experience akin to seein pj in a tuxedo dancin a waltz at the terpsichorean ball in raleigh. … unique, if ya get my drift. …i continued up a few more pools with the bugger, catching rainbows, until i pulled out around 5 pm, then walked up the road for 30 minutes or so just exploring a bit…yup, there’s still a lot of water left for the next trip. [cont.]

Response:

Marvelous TR, Jeff. Hope you don’t keep us waiting too long for the next installment in the series! I’m sitting here in sultry Missouri reading your TR and listening to a segment on CBS Sunday Morning about the rhododendrons blooming in the appalachians. In fact, they juxtaposed that segment with a segment about subway musicians in New York. My GPS tells me that it’s 430 miles to my favorite spot on Snowbird. But my bank account tells me the office is a hell of a lot closer. Congratulations on having a wife who puts up with your fishing!! Bob

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – …nothing like a week in graham county to confirm i’ve wasted the better part of my life down here in the crowded flatlands of coastal nc… a situation i hope to correct in the next year or two. anyway, it was an incredible week of fiSSSSHing 5 of my favorite streams in nc, S[******], S[nowbird], S[assafrass], S[anteetlah], and H[azel], briefly recounted as follows: Saturday – rachel and i arrived at the snowbird house, bought some groceries, and settled in… well, sorta.  i was busy getting the fishing stuff settled on the table, rachel did the practical stuff – unpacked clothes and groceries. just before dark (it didn’t get dark until after 9), i walked the 10 feet to the stream out back and fished the two runs that always yield a fish or two – yup, still happenin! two rainbows on an ehc…one was the typical 8 incher caught in the deeper cut of the main current where wolfgang snapped a picture or two of me in   an evening stupor last october; the other was a nice 12 inches or more, caught by "bowling" the fly downstream about 50 feet around the bend of a deeper, quiet pool. satisfied the week was properly started, i ambled outta the stream, back up the gentle bank to a well-prepared spaghetti dinner and a chilly beer. thus began my week’s adventure of solitary fishing in some of the best streams in the smokies  … SUNDAY – fished S.[******], the stream that yielded those 3 big rainbows last october.  arrived around 9 am, parked in the same place as last year.  the road was a bit worse, but manageable.  this was my day of paying proper devotion and respect – so, after humbly thanking all the spirits and deities, and making a silent oath not to break that commandment about the lord’s name, a kinder, gentler, easier-goin jeff set out up the road to the spot wally and i stopped in our october frenzy, the soul-filling gift of zimbo’s 6′ bamboo rod & the abandoned socks of wolfgang at the ready for a full day in the stream. didn’t see or hear another person the entire day.  S[******]is at about 3000 feet elevation at this point, and it’s headwaters are near a bald which is above 5000 feet. getting to it requires a drive up a steep, narrow grade of dirt and rocks for a mile or so until the road becomes unmanageable with a vehicle… the upper stretch is a rutted, rocky path only 4-wheelers can traverse safely.   from the point i entered the stream, until the pool i quit, with the exception of one pocket, i either caught a fish or had one rise to the fly. except for several brookies, all were rainbows of the usual size with a few approaching or just at ten inches.   size 14 and 16 ehc and parachute adams never failed to attract a fish. after a while, i started playing around with various dry flies just to see what would happen – color didn’t matter, but the size did. though they’d come up and look at the #12 stimulator, i guess it just looked a bit too big to tangle with, or it was easier to distinguish as a phony bug…i don’t know. but switch off to a smaller fly and no problem.  THE HIGHLIGHT – near the close of the day, once the leader had gotten cut back from all the fly changing, as a lark i tied on a flashy green and black bugger i had acquired from a mail order outfit in england a few years ago. i was at one of the deeper pools with a nice froth of white water formed by the stream falling from the pool above. casually tossed the bugger into the froth, let it sink a bit, twitched it back towards me and, damn…what’s this…quite a different feel… jeezusfuckingchri…(ok, i confess… i never was too good at keeping that particular commandment)… it was an honest 12" brookie (spec)- the biggest wild nc brook trout i’ve ever caught! fat, heavy, and healthy looking. what a day!  fellas, seeing a 12" spec in nc is an experience akin to seein pj in a tuxedo dancin a waltz at the terpsichorean ball in raleigh. … unique, if ya get my drift. …i continued up a few more pools with the bugger, catching rainbows, until i pulled out around 5 pm, then walked up the road for 30 minutes or so just exploring a bit…yup, there’s still a lot of water left for the next trip. [cont.]

Response:

… it was an honest 12" brookie (spec)- the biggest wild nc brook trout i’ve ever caught! fat, heavy, and healthy looking. what a day!

Not too shabby at all

Response:

…well, this appears to be the beginnings of yet another fine idea. i suggest you take charge of it, establish some proposed dates, and we’ll set up a new thread to see what develops. if zimbo is still hereabouts, perhaps he’ll post the dates of his gathering – i’m gonna be in the smokies the week of oct 19-26th with rachel – the 21st is her birthday. i can probably manage a 3-day camping trip either before that week or at the latter part of that week, or i can take a 4 day weekend thursday-sunday at another time. the park service provides some carts we can use to roll supplies up the trail if anyone wants or needs to bring some special stuff.

Have you done this walk up Hazel as an overnighter?  It has been my experience that what is a six hour walk with a fly rod is a whole different critter than hiking in with a backpack, tent, etc.  At any rate, I’m in if the sceduling can be worked out.  Any idea what the actual mileage is? btw…i’m still wet-wading in october… neoprenes seem a bit much for carolina fall fishing.

I agree about the neoprenes but my one experience fishing with you in October suggests that wading wet could be a bit iffy……it’s o.k. if you’re naturally numb from the waist down but for those of us who are of the neck up persuasion it would come down to a choice between walking on our hands or perhaps wearing lightweights.      :) Wolfgang

Response:

Naw – that coven is down close to Stecoah.  Sometimes it meets in Bryson City depending on which politician is in town. This is way the hell too far in the boondocks.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –  i’m thinking – we need to hike and camp near the cascade falls on hazel creek…who knows what a placid soul might discover up there. anyone interested? i hear tell that there’s a unsavory rattlersnake worshippin’ coven up in those parts…. –waldo d;^)

Response:

Naw – that coven is down close to Stecoah.  Sometimes it meets in Bryson City depending on which politician is in town. This is way the hell too far in the boondocks.

naaaahh bob, yer thinkin’ ufduh dolly parton mandolin strummin’ coppahead group that meets at tooties every udduh toosday. weird group, dancin widda coppaheads to 9-5… weird stuff but well worth da show if ya can drop in on toosday evenins…. whatever da hell ya do…. don’t go into the kitchen….bad, really bad mojo. duh group way up on hazel, well, bone creek pickahs. days banjo and jug tootin’ fellahs…… meanest dirty rotten sob’s you’d ever wanna come across….. hell, ask wayno, he’ll tell ya  d;^) –waldo, workin’ way too late….

Response:

Hell, Waldo, I don’t know if you’re thinking of the last Snowbird ROFF clave in the second case, or a stockholders meeting here, in the first case, both of which I missed but both of which sound familiar based on reports from observers . . .

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Naw – that coven is down close to Stecoah.  Sometimes it meets in Bryson City depending on which politician is in town. This is way the hell too far in the boondocks. naaaahh bob, yer thinkin’ ufduh dolly parton mandolin strummin’ coppahead group that meets at tooties every udduh toosday. weird group, dancin widda coppaheads to 9-5… weird stuff but well worth da show if ya can drop in on toosday evenins…. whatever da hell ya do…. don’t go into the kitchen….bad, really bad mojo. duh group way up on hazel, well, bone creek pickahs. days banjo and jug tootin’ fellahs…… meanest dirty rotten sob’s you’d ever wanna come across….. hell, ask wayno, he’ll tell ya  d;^) –waldo, workin’ way too late….

Response:

Never one to flinch from doing my duty for God and Country. October would be a fine time – even late October. If we could tie it in with Zimbo’s soiree that would be great. I feel like I made a three-day trip up Hazel in 2 days early in May. A six-hour walk up and a five-hour walk down didn’t leave much fishing time in two days. I’d agree three days is the minimum unless you really groove on walking. Also, if one has to walk five miles while wearing neoprenes, it’s more comfortable in October than in May. And by late October the bears should be doing their final snacking before settling in for the winter! Bob

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – as you’ve probably heard, they’ve opened portions of hazel that have been closed to all fishing for 25 years – as an experiment to see if the fisherman actually affects the brook trout population in any meaningful way.  i believe it is our duty to participate in this grand experiment … but, it will require at least 3 days.  the hike in will be 6 hours at least…  if there’s any interest, it’s time to start planning.  i don’t know who is going where in october – zimbo floated a blue ridge gathering, i’ll be in the smokies with rachel the week of oct. 20. anyway, let me know if you’ve got a preference as far as dates and we’ll see what develops. jeff Jeff – I’d like to join up on such an expedition if it was planned well in advance. It’s an all-day drive for me, like it probably is for you. I would make a several-day trip of it and combine two or three days on Hazel with some other fishing – maybe on the Tellico river downhill from McDaniel Bald or on one of the creeks in the Snowbird/Santeetlah area. Bob //snip// i’m thinking – we need to hike and camp near the cascade falls on hazel creek…who knows what a placid soul might discover up there. anyone interested? jeff

Response:

…well, this appears to be the beginnings of yet another fine idea. i suggest you take charge of it, establish some proposed dates, and we’ll set up a new thread to see what develops. if zimbo is still hereabouts, perhaps he’ll post the dates of his gathering – i’m gonna be in the smokies the week of oct 19-26th with rachel – the 21st is her birthday. i can probably manage a 3-day camping trip either before that week or at the latter part of that week, or i can take a 4 day weekend thursday-sunday at another time. the park service provides some carts we can use to roll supplies up the trail if anyone wants or needs to bring some special stuff. btw…i’m still wet-wading in october… neoprenes seem a bit much for carolina fall fishing. jeff – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Never one to flinch from doing my duty for God and Country. October would be a fine time – even late October. If we could tie it in with Zimbo’s soiree that would be great. I feel like I made a three-day trip up Hazel in 2 days early in May. A six-hour walk up and a five-hour walk down didn’t leave much fishing time in two days. I’d agree three days is the minimum unless you really groove on walking. Also, if one has to walk five miles while wearing neoprenes, it’s more comfortable in October than in May. And by late October the bears should be doing their final snacking before settling in for the winter! Bob as you’ve probably heard, they’ve opened portions of hazel that have been closed to all fishing for 25 years – as an experiment to see if the fisherman actually affects the brook trout population in any meaningful way.  i believe it is our duty to participate in this grand experiment … but, it will require at least 3 days.  the hike in will be 6 hours at least…  if there’s any interest, it’s time to start planning.  i don’t know who is going where in october – zimbo floated a blue ridge gathering, i’ll be in the smokies with rachel the week of oct. 20. anyway, let me know if you’ve got a preference as far as dates and we’ll see what develops. jeff Jeff – I’d like to join up on such an expedition if it was planned well in advance. It’s an all-day drive for me, like it probably is for you. I would make a several-day trip of it and combine two or three days on Hazel with some other fishing – maybe on the Tellico river downhill from McDaniel Bald or on one of the creeks in the Snowbird/Santeetlah area. Bob //snip// i’m thinking – we need to hike and camp near the cascade falls on hazel creek…who knows what a placid soul might discover up there. anyone interested? jeff

Response:

Good stuff Jeff. That certain Southern Style creeps in to all your writing. When you return from the HF you’ll be changed slightly bruce h

Response:

Good stuff Jeff. That certain Southern Style creeps in to all your writing. When you return from the HF you’ll be changed slightly

Yep, before you know it, you will be wearing big hats and cowboy boots, and have a three inch circle worn into your ass pocket by the Cope tin.  You will be driving a full- size American pickup truck with a gun rack and a Labrador retriever (or two) in back, and you won’t even unhitch the boat trailer to go to the grocery store.  Where, btw, you will be buying Rainier beer and beef, not chardonnay and green vegetables.  Your favorite rod will be a nine foot six or seven weight graphite, not the 6 foot bamboo.  Your fly vest will contain as many Woolly Buggers as anything else, and you will wear your waders into even the best restaurants. You will bitch about how the out-of-staters are ruining everything, even though you were one recently.  You will have NRA stickers on your truck, and will vote Republican religiously, even if the GOP candidate is a drooling idiot. The trout you catch will average 18 inches no matter how big they really were.  You will start conversations with "Cold enough for you?" "Hot enough for you?" "Seen any salmonflies yet?" or "Got your elk yet?" depending on the season. I could keep this up all day. Just remember to get some 130 gr. bullets for your .270, and eat the parsley, because it’s the only vegetable you’re getting. Kevin, part-time Montanan

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Great, well written report Jeff damn…what’s this…quite a different feel… jeezusfuckingchri…(ok, i confess… i never was too good at keeping that particular commandment)… it was an honest 12" brookie (spec)- the biggest wild nc brook trout i’ve ever caught! fat, heavy, and healthy looking. what a day!  fellas, seeing a 12" spec in nc is an experience

Congrats, beautiful fish! It may be the best Brookie you ever catch in NC! Willi

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When you return from the HF you’ll be changed slightly bruce h

… um…, uh oh. … not sure i catch yer drift there, pardner.   trust that ain’t wayno-speak…unless, of course, "bruiser" is the descriptive pseudonym for a henry’s fork working lady, in which case, i bruise quite easily.  <g however, just from looking at rw’s photos and some of the web sites for hf, i’m feeling a metamorphosis coming on already. looking forward to it all… jeff – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –

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Congrats, beautiful fish! It may be the best Brookie you ever catch in NC!

thanks…easily the "best" so far, although the ones wolfgang and i made acquaintance with up at the middle falls pool last october were pretty spec-tacular. … still, i plan to keep hunting for that next best one as long as i’m upright and forward moving. i’m thinking – we need to hike and camp near the cascade falls on hazel creek…who knows what a placid soul might discover up there. anyone interested? jeff

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Kevin wrote.Yep, before you know it. snip. Priceless…Thanks Kevin. Big Dale

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Congrats, beautiful fish! It may be the best Brookie you ever catch in NC! thanks…easily the "best" so far, although the ones wolfgang and i made acquaintance with up at the middle falls pool last october were pretty spec-tacular. … still, i plan to keep hunting for that next best one as long as i’m upright and forward moving. i’m thinking – we need to hike and camp near the cascade falls on hazel creek…who knows what a placid soul might discover up there. anyone interested? jeff

Does sound like a beautiful fish alright – I bet there’ll be a few more buggers and streamers in your future. Peter Visit The Streamer Page at http://home.cogeco.ca/~pcharles/streamers/index.html

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Jeff – I’d like to join up on such an expedition if it was planned well in advance. It’s an all-day drive for me, like it probably is for you. I would make a several-day trip of it and combine two or three days on Hazel with some other fishing – maybe on the Tellico river downhill from McDaniel Bald or on one of the creeks in the Snowbird/Santeetlah area. Bob

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – //snip//  i’m thinking – we need to hike and camp near the cascade falls on hazel creek…who knows what a placid soul might discover up there. anyone interested? jeff

Response:

 i’m thinking – we need to hike and camp near the cascade falls on hazel creek…who knows what a placid soul might discover up there. anyone interested?

i hear tell that there’s a unsavory rattlersnake worshippin’ coven up in those parts…. –waldo d;^)

Response:

as you’ve probably heard, they’ve opened portions of hazel that have been closed to all fishing for 25 years – as an experiment to see if the fisherman actually affects the brook trout population in any meaningful way.  i believe it is our duty to participate in this grand experiment … but, it will require at least 3 days.  the hike in will be 6 hours at least…  if there’s any interest, it’s time to start planning.  i don’t know who is going where in october – zimbo floated a blue ridge gathering, i’ll be in the smokies with rachel the week of oct. 20. anyway, let me know if you’ve got a preference as far as dates and we’ll see what develops. jeff – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Jeff – I’d like to join up on such an expedition if it was planned well in advance. It’s an all-day drive for me, like it probably is for you. I would make a several-day trip of it and combine two or three days on Hazel with some other fishing – maybe on the Tellico river downhill from McDaniel Bald or on one of the creeks in the Snowbird/Santeetlah area. Bob //snip// i’m thinking – we need to hike and camp near the cascade falls on hazel creek…who knows what a placid soul might discover up there. anyone interested? jeff

Response:

Question:

Fly fishing woman wanted…. I’m a 41, slim, intelligent  (I hope) Australian male, who’s gainfully employed, passionate about life, the universe, travel & fly fishing. You – hopefully similar to the above & relax – no need to know how to scale or gut fish, as I let them go to catch another day.

Response:

Fly fishing woman wanted….

Well, best of luck to ya, mate — but if anybody offers to meet with you while wearing a pink satan evening gown, run like hell… In the meantime, you might want to do a Google search for Angie the Fishing Goddess. Kevin, Roffian matchmaker

Response:

Thank you Kevin Pink’s never been my favourite color anyway

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Fly fishing woman wanted…. Well, best of luck to ya, mate — but if anybody offers to meet with you while wearing a pink satan evening gown, run like hell… In the meantime, you might want to do a Google search for Angie the Fishing Goddess. Kevin, Roffian matchmaker

Response:

In the meantime, you might want to do a Google search for Angie the Fishing Goddess.

She’s married and having a baby. — Warren change addy to yahoo for email Henry’s Fork Clave info and Bozeman, MT fishing info http://www.geocities.com/troutbum_mt3/HFclave.html

Response:

Fly fishing woman wanted…. I’m a 41, slim, intelligent  (I hope) Australian male, who’s gainfully employed, passionate about life, the universe, travel & fly fishing. You – hopefully similar to the above & relax – no need to know how to scale or gut fish, as I let them go to catch another day.

You forgot "Send picture of rod"…;-) Wish You luck, having a partner with the same interest would make life a lot easier, trust me… (are You going fishing again…, I never get out anything…) Stefan

Response:

In the meantime, you might want to do a Google search for Angie the Fishing Goddess. She’s married and having a baby.

She has friends! — I fly fish so therefore I am.

Response:

Make sure she will clean the fish! — Fly Fisherman With a Furless Naked Cat named Dub.

Response:

She’s married and having a baby.

Orvis Boy?

Response:

Orvis Boy?

Yep. — Warren change addy to yahoo for email Henry’s Fork Clave info and Bozeman, MT fishing info http://www.geocities.com/troutbum_mt3/HFclave.html

Response:

Question:

Just as using a strike indicator is unethical, so should the use of any artifical means of  applying a substance to help keep your fly float as well. Many good flyfisherman that I have seen use a floating device not so much as to act as an indicator for strikes, but to simply keep their nymph at a proper distance to the bottom, and be able to correctly judge that their float is drag free. Pretty simple concept that any knowledgeable fisherman should be able to understand and appreciate. By the way, is that little "oil spill" that surrounds a fly covered with floatant  toxic?

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Just as using a strike indicator is unethical, so should the use of any artifical means of  applying a substance to help keep your fly float as well. Many good flyfisherman that I have seen use a floating device not so much as to act as an indicator for strikes, but to simply keep their nymph at a proper distance to the bottom, and be able to correctly judge that their float is drag free. Pretty simple concept that any knowledgeable fisherman should be able to understand and appreciate. By the way, is that little "oil spill" that surrounds a fly covered with floatant toxic?

Response:

Just as using a strike indicator is unethical, so should the use of any artifical means of  applying a substance to help keep your fly float as well.

Just as unethical as it is to use a dry fly?  I mean what is that after all but an indicator? — Warren Findley "The vice or virtue of any form of angling lies not in the method but in the man." Author Hugh Falkus

Response:

Just as using a strike indicator is unethical, so should the use of any artifical means of  applying a substance to help keep your fly float as well. Many good flyfisherman that I have seen use a floating device not so much as to act as an indicator for strikes, but to simply keep their nymph at a proper distance to the bottom, and be able to correctly judge that their float is drag free. Pretty simple concept that any knowledgeable fisherman should be able to understand and appreciate. By the way, is that little "oil spill" that surrounds a fly covered with floatant  toxic?

When you really get down to it, Bruce, just between you and me, every kind of fishing that people other than you and I do is unethical. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/

Response:

Many good flyfisherman that I have seen use a floating device not so much as to act as an indicator for strikes, but to simply keep their nymph at a proper distance to the bottom, and be able to correctly judge that their float is drag free.

Righto, Smedley.

Response:

I’ll second that. Not trying to ruff too many feathers tonight, just wanted to make a point. I’ll await a response from any Master of fly flotant, and another question. Is it allowable to dress the last several inches of your fly line to keep it floating higher, to help with strike detection?  Pretty simple concepts, but virtually one and the same. I find it hard to imagine that anyone could go opposite directions on the same concept, unless of course they didn’t have a strike indicator to market.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Just as using a strike indicator is unethical, so should the use of any artifical means of  applying a substance to help keep your fly float as well. Many good flyfisherman that I have seen use a floating device not so much as to act as an indicator for strikes, but to simply keep their nymph at a proper distance to the bottom, and be able to correctly judge that their float is drag free. Pretty simple concept that any knowledgeable fisherman should be able to understand and appreciate. By the way, is that little "oil spill" that surrounds a fly covered with floatant  toxic? When you really get down to it, Bruce, just between you and me, every kind of fishing that people other than you and I do is unethical. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/

Response:

If you manage to troll-up a strike from our self-proclaimed Master Baiter, ask him how he feels about fly goop that is laced with fish oil… /daytripper (Whoops! Sorry about that imagery – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’ll second that. Not trying to ruff too many feathers tonight, just wanted to make a point. I’ll await a response from any Master of fly flotant, and another question. Is it allowable to dress the last several inches of your fly line to keep it floating higher, to help with strike detection?  Pretty simple concepts, but virtually one and the same. I find it hard to imagine that anyone could go opposite directions on the same concept, unless of course they didn’t have a strike indicator to market. Just as using a strike indicator is unethical, so should the use of any artifical means of  applying a substance to help keep your fly float as well. Many good flyfisherman that I have seen use a floating device not so much as to act as an indicator for strikes, but to simply keep their nymph at a proper distance to the bottom, and be able to correctly judge that their float is drag free. Pretty simple concept that any knowledgeable fisherman should be able to understand and appreciate. By the way, is that little "oil spill" that surrounds a fly covered with floatant  toxic? When you really get down to it, Bruce, just between you and me, every kind of fishing that people other than you and I do is unethical. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/

Response:

[snipped] By the way, is that little "oil spill" that surrounds a fly covered with floatant  toxic?

That would be "Polyunsaturated Gerhke". /daytripper (Hell yes, it’s toxic!

Response:

I’ll second that. Not trying to ruff too many feathers tonight, just wanted to make a point. I’ll await a response from any Master of fly flotant, and another question. Is it allowable to dress the last several inches of your fly line to keep it floating higher, to help with strike detection?  Pretty simple concepts, but virtually one and the same. I find it hard to imagine that anyone could go opposite directions on the same concept, unless of course they didn’t have a strike indicator to market.

Well, assuming that this isn’t a complete troll… Sorry, I’m no "Master of fly flotant," but am I permitted to ask questions?  How does this rather interesting theory address silk lines, gut leaders, and the "fathers and mothers" of the sport?  Or are you saying that it’s "unethical" if one were to "dress" something simply to help with strike detection? TC, R – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Just as using a strike indicator is unethical, so should the use of any artifical means of  applying a substance to help keep your fly float as well. Many good flyfisherman that I have seen use a floating device not so much as to act as an indicator for strikes, but to simply keep their nymph at a proper distance to the bottom, and be able to correctly judge that their float is drag free. Pretty simple concept that any knowledgeable fisherman should be able to understand and appreciate. By the way, is that little "oil spill" that surrounds a fly covered with floatant  toxic? When you really get down to it, Bruce, just between you and me, every kind of fishing that people other than you and I do is unethical. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/

Response:

Just as using a strike indicator is unethical, so should the use of any artifical means of  applying a substance to help keep your fly float as well. Many good flyfisherman that I have seen use a floating device not so much as to act as an indicator for strikes, but to simply keep their nymph at a proper distance to the bottom, and be able to correctly judge that their float is drag free. Pretty simple concept that any knowledgeable fisherman should be able to understand and appreciate. By the way, is that little "oil spill" that surrounds a fly covered with floatant  toxic?

Holy Shit….a *direct* hit. Ya know…that fly line is pretty much a 90 foot bobber when it comes down to it. Well done. — Halfordian Golfer

Response:

Does the turned up nose  and image of snobby fisherman come to mind…does here. Wonder if because I fish for a non trout  species such as catfish, warm and cold water species out here rates the same… Time to lose the pipe the tweeds and get with the program. Its year 2000 not 1900.  By the way though, if your preferences are without go right ahead. Your post was good for laugh here on an otherwise dreary saturday while we wait for the ice to melt so we can go wet a fly……with our strike indicators and all, ha ha

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Just as using a strike indicator is unethical, so should the use of any artifical means of  applying a substance to help keep your fly float as well. Many good flyfisherman that I have seen use a floating device not so much as to act as an indicator for strikes, but to simply keep their nymph at a proper distance to the bottom, and be able to correctly judge that their float is drag free. Pretty simple concept that any knowledgeable fisherman should be able to understand and appreciate. By the way, is that little "oil spill" that surrounds a fly covered with floatant  toxic?

Response:

Just as using a strike indicator is unethical, so should the use of any artifical means of  applying a substance to help keep your fly float as well. Many good flyfisherman that I have seen use a floating device not so much as to act as an indicator for strikes, but to simply keep their nymph at a proper distance to the bottom, and be able to correctly judge that their float is drag free. Pretty simple concept that any knowledgeable fisherman should be able to understand and appreciate. By the way, is that little "oil spill" that surrounds a fly covered with floatant  toxic?

I do more nymphing than dry fly fishing,  and generally don’t bother  with floatants (except for the mucilin for my leader).  Nor do I bother with sinkants either.  I certainly don’t use the bite indicators,  as the leader is quite sufficient.  I don’t bother with a dry fly dropper,  as it is a general pain.  I do like to use the singular fly though,  as I fish primarily on small streams and sighting fish is the intended order of affairs.  One accurate fly is all that is required,  and it usually tends to be sub-surface. I would not like to say any bad words about the practice of using bite indicators,  though I would say that I’d never like to use them.  I like to fish using a greased leader  in comparison,   either of which are perfectly justified depending upon the relative viewpoint.

Response:

Many good flyfisherman that I have seen use a floating device not so much as to act as an indicator for strikes, but to simply keep their nymph at a proper distance to the bottom, and be able to correctly judge that their float is drag free. Righto, Smedley.

NOT SO.  As long as you use only the free leader and fly line with no additional attachments, you are nymph fishing freely and fairly.  One does NOT USE INDICATORS to determine how deep a run is.  If you’re ticking along the bottom close enough, your nymph will come up with a caddis case on the barb or moss or both. I’m going to have to hold a "How To Dead Drift a Nymph" at the Western Conclave I suppose.  I’ll even do it free of charge.  You guys can use the money saved to buy some really good beer instead of that Bud Puke. zingggg! Did you get the #32 Sir Connelly?? — Mr.G. http://www.gink.com "the saga continues"

Response:

I’m going to have to hold a "How To Dead Drift a Nymph" at the Western Conclave I suppose.  I’ll even do it free of charge.  You guys can use the money saved to buy some really good beer instead of that Bud

Puke. LMAO!  You are going to be taking a lesson in how to get spanked by me using a strike indicator on my home water!  Perhaps I will give you some lessons after you spend all of your time rerigging your set up to get a decent drift through a constantly changing depth!  You might as well just start calling me Daddy now, George <g — Warren Findley "The vice or virtue of any form of angling lies not in the method but in the man." Author Hugh Falkus

Response:

I’m going to have to hold a "How To Dead Drift a Nymph" at the Western Conclave I suppose.  

I was going to give this clave a pass, to avoid the August YNP crowds, but I might change my mind just to watch you teaching nymphing to a group of ROFFians. I’ll even do it free of charge.  

Hell, I’d even pay. JR

Response:

I’m going to have to hold a "How To Dead Drift a Nymph" at the Western Conclave I suppose.  I’ll even do it free of charge.  You guys can use the money saved to buy some really good beer instead of that Bud Puke. LMAO!  You are going to be taking a lesson in how to get spanked by me using a strike indicator on my home water!  Perhaps I will give you some lessons after you spend all of your time rerigging your set up to get a decent drift through a constantly changing depth!  You might as well just start calling me Daddy now, George <g

He’ll be calling you Daddy by long distance, ‘cuz he won’t show…

Response:

It is not the floatant that is unethical, but the line, leader and tippet that are.

Response:

He’ll be calling you Daddy by long distance, ‘cuz he won’t show…

I don’t know.  I am starting to wonder. . . . .  He has assured me that he will and I hope he does.  If I am in a good mood, I might even give him some pointers and a pocket full of strike indicators to use <g — Warren Findley "The vice or virtue of any form of angling lies not in the method but in the man." Author Hugh Falkus

Response:

NO Indicators Warren.   — (C) George Gehrke 2001 http://www.gink.com/shopcart/index.html     fine bamboo flyrods & blanks

Response:

Why on earth is this stuff ‘unethical’? We fish. We catch. We eat. The food chain works. Just how far up your ass is your head stuck? regards, eric pearson – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Just as using a strike indicator is unethical, so should the use of any artifical means of  applying a substance to help keep your fly float as well. Many good flyfisherman that I have seen use a floating device not so much as to act as an indicator for strikes, but to simply keep their nymph at a proper distance to the bottom, and be able to correctly judge that their float is drag free. Pretty simple concept that any knowledgeable fisherman should be able to understand and appreciate. By the way, is that little "oil spill" that surrounds a fly covered with floatant  toxic?

Response:

Why on earth is this stuff ‘unethical’? We fish. We catch. We eat. The food chain works. Just how far up your ass is your head stuck?

We fish. We catch. We release. We dump all over the next guy who catches the fish, should it survive. — visit my web site: http://home.earthlink.net/~royalwulff/

Response:

Obviously not as far up as yours if you couldn’t understand that I was being satirical. We fish, we catch, we eat, and the stocking truck brings more "quality" fish. Have fun, and hope you choke on a bone while alone.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Why on earth is this stuff ‘unethical’? We fish. We catch. We eat. The food chain works. Just how far up your ass is your head stuck? regards, eric pearson Just as using a strike indicator is unethical, so should the use of any artifical means of  applying a substance to help keep your fly float as well. Many good flyfisherman that I have seen use a floating device not so much as to act as an indicator for strikes, but to simply keep their nymph at a proper distance to the bottom, and be able to correctly judge that their float is drag free. Pretty simple concept that any knowledgeable fisherman should be able to understand and appreciate. By the way, is that little "oil spill" that surrounds a fly covered with floatant  toxic?

Response:

NO Indicators Warren.  

But plenty of "Dr. Gink" brand fish oil…

Response:

But plenty of "Dr. Gink" brand fish oil…

You would think he would support indicators since they would require the use of his product. . . . — Warren Findley "The vice or virtue of any form of angling lies not in the method but in the man." Author Hugh Falkus

Response:

I do care how money is created.  Greed at the cost of breaking fly fishing standards of old doesn’t interest me.  I would rather hold the standard of fly fishing ethics up, not lower them. To Wit:  "I might as well do it because everyone else does." To Wit:  "If I don’t clear cut this national forest, some one else will." To Wit:  "I’m not going to return this wallet because the owner doesn’t know I have it." To Wit:  "I use a tree stand because it works and I want the advantage." To Wit:  "Let’s crucify Jesus Christ because mobs are right."  (and they did) To Wit:  "When Jesus drove the money changers away, it proved he was a loser" To Wit:  "All people will give into corrupt concepts if it involves losing money." You would think, since 90% of the time trout feed UNDER WATER, fly fishermen would keep the playing field level, wouldn’t you? Each year, there are more and more fly fishermen and less waters to share.  If you don’t believe what the future is being held out for all you Roffians, go to the Big Horn this year.  There isn’t a fish there that you cannot call, "Scarface".  Fair chase doesn’t exist astream with indicators.  Sure, Gink is the thing to use on all indicators.  It doesn’t mean I have to give up a view in terms of wildlife’s best interests above my own.   I have never fished with an indicator in my entire life.  It’s a matter of personal choice in my humble opinion. But plenty of "Dr. Gink" brand fish oil… You would think he would support indicators since they would require the use of his product. . . .  

(C) George Gehrke 2001 http://www.gink.com/shopcart/index.html     fine bamboo flyrods & blanks

Response:

Question:

I will be visiting a friend (who has recently moved to Salt Lake City) during the last weekend in August.  We would like to do some fly-fishing but are unsure of the waters in the area.  From what I understand, the Green is a 3+ hour drive, and that seems like a bit much for a one day outing.  What local rivers/streams are there around SLC?  Any particular shop we should check with to find our about conditions, patterns, etc…?  Any advice would be appreciated — Tom

Response:

There are a number of great rivers and streams within an hour’s drive of Salt Lake.  You could try the Provo, Ogden, and Weber rivers.  Ask your friend about the nearest Angler’s Inn for more information.  There are several in the valley. You can also check the Utah Fish Finder for current fly fishing conditions at:     http://www.utahfishfinder.com/flyfishing.shtml Fishing reports here are updated weekly. Rich Utah Fish Finder http://www.utahfishfinder.com – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I will be visiting a friend (who has recently moved to Salt Lake City) during the last weekend in August.  We would like to do some fly-fishing but are unsure of the waters in the area.  From what I understand, the Green is a 3+ hour drive, and that seems like a bit much for a one day outing.  What local rivers/streams are there around SLC?  Any particular shop we should check with to find our about conditions, patterns, etc…?  Any advice would be appreciated — Tom

Response:

Question:

Wait a minute!  The Deschutes River is NOT near Portland, Oregon.   It’s gotta be a 3-4 hour drive, at least.  And it’s not that easy to fish from shore.  What about smaller streams on the slopes of Mt Hood or an hour or so west of Portland near Vernonia/Mist or down in Yamhill County (seem to remember some creeks in there near McMinnville – Yamhill River?)?  Anyway, if you consider total travel time, a 3-hour drive is fairly long way to go for an hour or two of fishing.  Where do busy Portlanders REALLY go?

I can make it from McMinnville to Maupin in less than three hours, less from portland. IMHO it is worth the drive, but it does make it a long day. There are some nice small streams out here in Yamhill County. They hold mostly small wild cutthroat and hatchery rainbow. They also get very low in summer and I usually stop fishing them by mid June. I would stay away from the main Yamhill River, unless you are into warmwater fish and don’t mind raw sewage. The upper forks of the Yamhill have small cutthroat and can be fun but nothing great. Tight Lines, Jay Whitworth

Response:

Wait a minute!  The Deschutes River is NOT near Portland, Oregon. It’s gotta be a 3-4 hour drive, at least.  And it’s not that easy to fish from shore.  What about smaller streams on the slopes of Mt Hood or an hour or so west of Portland near Vernonia/Mist or down in Yamhill County (seem to remember some creeks in there near McMinnville – Yamhill River?)?  Anyway, if you consider total travel time, a 3-hour drive is fairly long way to go for an hour or two of fishing.  Where do busy Portlanders REALLY go? — Ken Brown Satis elequontiae, sapientiae parum.

Seriously, people.  Hit the coastal streams.  The searun cutthroat are in and many streams have summer steelhead as a bonus.  But seriously, my son and I target the cutthroat.  They are the best fly rising fish in the state–yes we fish on top–and it is not a 3 hour drive.   And if the fish are not cooperating–there is the beach, maybe the jetties, and a whole smorgasbord of good cafes and restaurants. Paul

Response:

The Deschutes is not 3 hours from Portland. It usually takes me less than two hours to get to Maupin where there is aproximately 25-30 miles of outstanding bank fishing for steelhead and Trout. (And plenty of whitefish if you are nymphing.)

Response:

Wait a minute!  The Deschutes River is NOT near Portland, Oregon. It’s gotta be a 3-4 hour drive, at least.  And it’s not that easy to fish from shore.  What about smaller streams on the slopes of Mt Hood or an hour or so west of Portland near Vernonia/Mist or down in Yamhill County (seem to remember some creeks in there near McMinnville – Yamhill River?)?  Anyway, if you consider total travel time, a 3-hour drive is fairly long way to go for an hour or two of fishing.  Where do busy Portlanders REALLY go? — Ken Brown Satis elequontiae, sapientiae parum.

Busy Portlanders aren’t real fisherpeople.  Real fisherpeople go to the …… Mike in PDX "When the trout are lost, smash the state."                           Tom McGuane

Response:

: Busy Portlanders aren’t real fisherpeople.  Real fisherpeople go to …. Anywhere in Idaho? (Except Leitheiser… he bailed out.  Don’t really blame him, it’s tough to come back to Oregon waters after getting spoiled by all those big Cutts.) — Rick T. Rick Fletcher   –   http://www.chem.uidaho.edu/~fletcher/ Associate professor of chemistry  |  That’s Idaho, not Iowa.    | ad hominem University of Idaho               |  Upper Left Hand Corner.    | ad hominem Moscow, ID 83844-2343             |  No, I don’t grow potatoes. | ad hominem

Response:

I’ll be in the Portland, OR area the end of June – beginnig of July.  I’d appreciate suggestions on places to fish for 2 days (Sat and Sun).  I’ll have a car and don’t have to return to Portland Sat nite.. Thanks in advance for your help. Martin

Response:

I’ll be in the Portland, OR area the end of June – beginnig of July.  I’d appreciate suggestions on places to fish for 2 days (Sat and Sun).  I’ll have a car and don’t have to return to Portland Sat nite.. Thanks in advance for your help. Martin You may want to try the coastal streams–a lot closer than the Deschutes

and the searun cutthroats are the most wonderful fly rod fish you can find.  A friend of mine is a guide.  If you want to, call Glenn Young at (503) 642-4570. A secret–these fish are active surface takers!!!!! Let me know if you go and how you do. Paul

Response:

The Deschutes River – where else.  Call Kaufmann’s Streamborn in Portland for information on the Deschutes and guides (if you want or need one).

Response:

Wait a minute!  The Deschutes River is NOT near Portland, Oregon.   It’s gotta be a 3-4 hour drive, at least.  And it’s not that easy to fish from shore.  What about smaller streams on the slopes of Mt Hood or an hour or so west of Portland near Vernonia/Mist or down in Yamhill County (seem to remember some creeks in there near McMinnville – Yamhill River?)?  Anyway, if you consider total travel time, a 3-hour drive is fairly long way to go for an hour or two of fishing.  Where do busy Portlanders REALLY go? — Ken Brown Satis elequontiae, sapientiae parum.

Response:

writes: Wait a minute!  The Deschutes River is NOT near Portland, Oregon.   It’s gotta be a 3-4 hour drive, at least.  And it’s not that easy to fish from shore.

Whoa!  The Deschutes is about 100 miles from Portland via very good freeways.  This makes it about an hour and a half to an hour and three quarters travel time.  As for fishing from shore, you can’t legally fish from a boat unless you are disabled amd have the proper permits.  I’ll agree that you do have to wade it to flyfish, but that’s true of most any stream!

Response:

Question:

I am looking for a new or secondhand Hardy #4 fly reel to match a Loomis #4 IMX rod. Marquis #4 or #5 , Golden Prince 5/6 or JLH Ultralite #4 or #5. Any info will be of great help. Thanks

Response:

I am looking for a new or secondhand Hardy #4 fly reel to match a Loomis #4 IMX rod. Marquis #4 or #5 , Golden Prince 5/6 or JLH Ultralite #4 or #5. Any info will be of great help. Thanks

Contact Timeless Tackle in Edinburgh Scotland at 44-131-667-1407 or FAX 44-131-662-4215.  They deal in used and antique fishing gear and their list always seems to have a large selection of Hardy equipment. Ken Barry

Response:

Question:

Could someone help me with some info on the patterns which would be best for fishing the Muskegon or Au Sable rivers in Michigan in 2-3 weeks.  We are going to Grand Haven to visit my family for 2 weeks and I would like to get some fishing in.  I tie my own, so if you can suggest any conventional pattern, or give me a short description for local patterns I would be eternally grateful. Thanks, Jack Holton Denver, CO "Rasthedog"

Response:

Look up the "white-gloved Howdey" in Caucci and Nastasi’s book, Hatches II. I use size 14.  The book also has hatch charts that can really help. Could someone help me with some info on the patterns which would be best for fishing the Muskegon or Au Sable rivers in Michigan in 2-3 weeks.  We are going to Grand Haven to visit my family for 2 weeks and I would like to get some fishing in.  I tie my own, so if you can suggest any conventional pattern, or give me a short description for local patterns I would be eternally grateful. Thanks, Jack Holton Denver, CO "Rasthedog" Regards, John Sirmans

Response:

Could someone help me with some info on the patterns which would be best for fishing the Muskegon or Au Sable rivers in Michigan in 2-3 weeks.  We

Call Steve Southard, owner of the fly factory in Grayling MI at (517) 348-5844.  He should be able to give you some info.  Rusty Gates also has a nice shop up there, but I don’t have his number handy. . Lenny Bloksberg . .

Response:

Rusty Gates phone #: 517-348-8462; Johnson’s Pere Marquette Lodge 616-745-3972. All three places (incl. the Fly Factory) should also be able to provide you with a guide if you are unfamiliar with the water. have fun – should be plenty of salmon in the waters in mid-Sept.

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Organization: IQuest Network Services X-Newsreader: WinVN 0.91.6 (AnnRMiller) says: Rusty Gates phone #: 517-348-8462; Johnson’s Pere Marquette Lodge 616-745-3972. All three places (incl. the Fly Factory) should also be able to provide you with a guide if you are unfamiliar with the water. have fun – should be plenty of salmon in the waters in mid-Sept.

There are a couple web sites you might try: http://www.novagate.com/~bscheere/bens.html (Ben’s flyfishing corner, contains info on PM, Ausable, Muskegon and Kalamazoo rivers) http://oeonline.com/~rmarsh/fishpg.html (Ricks flyfishing page, contains info on Ausable) For hatches you’ll probably see BLO, trico’s and caddis. Tight lines, Bob

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Question:

Would any one know where I could get info on fly hatches in Northern Ontario? Jason

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I don’t although I’ve tried to some degree. It seems not many of the locals (most of which are natives depending on how far north you are talking about) are avid fly-fishing types. I’m going to do some wild brookie fishing in N. Ontario in June, so if you find any specifics please pass it on and I’ll do the same. Thanks…….

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Would any one know where I could get info on fly hatches in Northern Ontario?

There’s nothing in print:  but lots of people would say you don’t need to match the hatch or carry more than: –muddlers, all sizes –big visible dry for broken water –big white moth alias spinner –small upwing dun –small caddis —  |          Donald Phillipson, 4180 Boundary Rd., Carlsbad         |  |        Springs, Ont., Canada K0A 1K0; tel: (613) 822-0734       |  |  "What I’ve always liked about science is its independence from |  |  authority"–Ontario Science Centre (name on file) 10 July 1981 |

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Question:

I might be heading out to Hong Kong – it’s a business trip, but there’s ALWAYS time for fly-fishing. Anyone got any ideas of what the fishing is like out there ? Thanks in advance, Doug

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Sorry Doug, I lived there for 10 years and the only fishing I did was in Australia. Some people dangle bits of meat in the harbour and get the occasional bite from something equally disgusting. The fishing is offshore and long gone Simon Hallett

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I wouldn’t bother, Doug.  I’m a keen fisher myself but I quickly gave up trying during my years out there. Christian Zoega Jessen |   Zoega Virksomhedsr

Question:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – (Montgomery, Noel D.) writes: Hammond) writes… | | I have had no luck with SSS as an insect repellant.  If | it works for you great.  If you haven’t tried it before, | I’d bring muskol or cutters or whatever your favorite | brand containing 95-100% deet. | | I was curious to see how SSS and Muskol compared because I would rather use a non-deet repellant.  So during one trip I did in the middle of Algonquin Park (it was very hot and there were tons of nice, big mosquitoes) I did a test.  I put SSS on the bare skin of one arm and Muskol on the other. They worked equally well for about a half an hour and then the SSS lost its effectiveness.  The Muskol lasted for hours.  I usually bring both and use the Muskol  on my clothes and hat .  The SSS is too labour intensive having to put it on too often to be effective when the bugs are really bad. – Lori (ps sorry to whoever(I think it was Steve Hammond) I accidently e-mailed this  post to … Hit the wrong button!)

Saw something sometime recently (how’s that for a solid start?) that SSS isn’t really a repellent at all.  It’s oily, so it coats the skin and the mosquitoes can’t get to the skin … or because of it’s scent, the mosquitoes can’t smell the blood. It might work at first, but once perspiration dilutes it and/or washes it away, you would be without protection.

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I have had no luck with SSS as an insect repellant.  If it works for you great.  If you haven’t tried it before, I’d bring muskol or cutters or whatever your favorite brand containing 95-100% deet. I go to the army surplus store and buy a little plastic squeeze bottle of army issue incent repellant.  I believe it’s 90% deet. I’ve been using the same bottle for three seasons.  It cost me about $2.  It works. —

I used that stuff when I was in the USAF…dissolved the vinyl steering wheel in my jeep too.  Left neato fingerprints on anything plastic. Anyway, it did work.  I also read an article once that said the most affective concentration of DEET was about 30%.  This was an Army study, so maybe the latest Army-issue stuff only has about 30% DEET in it.  I buy any brand with about that much in it and they seem to work fine.  I like the stinky ones…reminds me of when I was a kid and going camping, kinda like when you smell sun tan lotion and you remember when you were a kid going to the beach.. Brian — Brian Dixon, Machine Vision Engineer, Hewlett Packard (Corvallis, Oregon)

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After 14 mosquito-free years in Southern California, I get to move to Massachusetts for grad school…  Any mosquitoes there?

Well, I don’t believe the mosquitos are that bad, but up north you have an evil creature called the black fly.  Never encountered one, but from what I hear they’re worse than any mosquito bite. Mosquitos are bad, but I’ll walk into a cloud of mosquitos any day over a cloud of no-see-ums!         Mark — <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< Mark Crafts                                                   Melbourne FL

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After 14 mosquito-free years in Southern California, I get to move to Massachusetts for grad school…  Any mosquitoes there? Well, I don’t believe the mosquitos are that bad, but up north you have an evil creature called the black fly.  Never encountered one, but from what I hear they’re worse than any mosquito bite. Mosquitos are bad, but I’ll walk into a cloud of mosquitos any day over a cloud of no-see-ums!

A few years back, I went Pike fishing in the Adirondacks.  When I went back to the house, there were about 20 one inch trails of dry blood on my face. I was told that "black flies" were the culprits.  Are these the same critters that we’re talking about here?        Mark — <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< Mark Crafts                                                   Melbourne FL

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Saw something sometime recently (how’s that for a solid start?) that SSS isn’t really a repellent at all.  It’s oily, so it coats the skin and the mosquitoes can’t get to the skin … or because of it’s scent, the mosquitoes can’t smell the blood. Just so you win future trivial pursuit games, I think the current consensus is that mosquitos home in on the CO .                                             2

I think they follow CO2 trails, but home in on heat for the kill. How else can you explain the mosquito bite on my ankle? After 14 mosquito-free years in Southern California, I get to move to Massachusetts for grad school…  Any mosquitoes there?

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I have had no luck with SSS as an insect repellant.  If it works for you great.  If you haven’t tried it before, I’d bring muskol or cutters or whatever your favorite brand containing 95-100% deet.

I go to the army surplus store and buy a little plastic squeeze bottle of army issue incent repellant.  I believe it’s 90% deet. I’ve been using the same bottle for three seasons.  It cost me about $2.  It works. — John Fereira Viacom Cable Pleasanton, CA

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Saw something sometime recently (how’s that for a solid start?) that SSS isn’t really a repellent at all.  It’s oily, so it coats the skin and the mosquitoes can’t get to the skin … or because of it’s scent, the mosquitoes can’t smell the blood.

Just so you win future trivial pursuit games, I think the current consensus is that mosquitos home in on the CO .                                              2         Mark — <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< Mark Crafts                                                   Melbourne FL

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| Saw something sometime recently (how’s that for a solid start?) that SSS | isn’t really a repellent at all.  It’s oily, so it coats the skin and the | mosquitoes can’t get to the skin … or because of it’s scent, the mosquitoes | can’t smell the blood. | | It might work at first, but once perspiration dilutes it and/or washes it away, | you would be without protection. | Actually, I put very little on so that is absorbs into the skin and your skin isn’t oily at all.  I thought I heard that it had citronella  (the stuff they make bug candles with) in it but I’m not sure.

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I have had no luck with SSS as an insect repellant.  If it works for you great.  If you haven’t tried it before, I’d bring muskol or cutters or whatever your favorite brand containing 95-100% deet.   Steve —  Scientific Computing Division            /* /  _][     National Center for Atmospheric Research, Boulder, CO     ____

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I have had no luck with SSS as an insect repellant.  If it works for you great.  If you haven't tried it before, I'd bring muskol or cutters or whatever your favorite brand containing 95-100% deet.

Yes, my ex-neighbor the entomologist (bug-man) said that SSS does nothing for mosquitos.  DEET is the way to go.  He did say that it works for very small biting insects like black flies because it drowns them.  Steve -- Scientific Computing Division            /* /  _][     National Center for Atmospheric Research, Boulder, CO     ____

Noel Montgomery

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| | I have had no luck with SSS as an insect repellant.  If | it works for you great.  If you haven’t tried it before, | I’d bring muskol or cutters or whatever your favorite | brand containing 95-100% deet. | | I was curious to see how SSS and Muskol compared because I would rather use a non-deet repellant.  So during one trip I did in the middle of Algonquin Park (it was very hot and there were tons of nice, big mosquitoes) I did a test.  I put SSS on the bare skin of one arm and Muskol on the other. They worked equally well for about a half an hour and then the SSS lost its effectiveness.  The Muskol lasted for hours.  I usually bring both and use the Muskol  on my clothes and hat .  The SSS is too labour intensive having to put it on too often to be effective when the bugs are really bad. – Lori (ps sorry to whoever(I think it was Steve Hammond) I accidently e-mailed this   post to … Hit the wrong button!)

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