Question:

I was running a board, njflyfishing.com and took it down recently to make it a bit more attractive to users passing through.  It’s now back up and I’m using the best (well what I think is the best) Bulletin board software (VBulletin).  Anyone care to give it a try?  I’d like to know what is missing and what I need to make it a more likeable place to visit.  There are no advertisements or popups, I’m not into this to make money, I’m into it because I enjoy flyfishing and computers. Thanks for your help www.njflyfishing.com —–=  Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News  =—– http://www.newsfeeds.com – The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World!  Check out our new Unlimited Server. No Download or Time Limits! —–==  Over 80,000 Newsgroups – 19 Different Servers!  ==—–

Response:

Ok, I know it was ugly..  I’ve done some work to it over the weekend. I’ll be adding photo’s, river conditions, hatch information, and other stuff.  anyone feel like contributing ?   I could use a board moderator or two although at the time being, there is not much to moderate. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I was running a board, njflyfishing.com and took it down recently to make it a bit more attractive to users passing through.  It’s now back up and I’m using the best (well what I think is the best) Bulletin board software (VBulletin).  Anyone care to give it a try?  I’d like to know what is missing and what I need to make it a more likeable place to visit.  There are no advertisements or popups, I’m not into this to make money, I’m into it because I enjoy flyfishing and computers. Thanks for your help www.njflyfishing.com —–=  Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News  =—– http://www.newsfeeds.com – The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! Check out our new Unlimited Server. No Download or Time Limits! —–==  Over 80,000 Newsgroups – 19 Different Servers!  ==—–

—–=  Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News  =—– http://www.newsfeeds.com – The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World!  Check out our new Unlimited Server. No Download or Time Limits! —–==  Over 80,000 Newsgroups – 19 Different Servers!  ==—–

Response:

Question:

<delightfully perverse poetry snipped Artfully done, Mr. Connor! It never would have occurred to me to rhyme "succour" and "motherfucker". I lay my sword at your feet.

Could I borrow it to "slay the dragon"?   This abyss is a bit of a trial at times. TL MC

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – …….I refuse to respond to Mike Con again…… Oh, nobody’s EVER gonna remember THIS line! Wolfgang is it just me or have absolutes somehow become…..well, less absolute? Naw, it’s just a matter of abstract perspective…

Some are more abstract than others. MC

Response:

YES SIR!  I read you loud and clear.  You got my attention Nightbutcher!  I consider myself chewed out and you’re right.  I refuse to respond to Mike Con again.. Gosh!  I needed that.

I hear Las Vegas is taking bets on this one right now.

Response:

YES SIR!  I read you loud and clear.  You got my attention Nightbutcher!  I consider myself chewed out and you’re right.  I refuse to respond to Mike Con again.. Gosh!  I needed that.

Thank you — NightStalker Email addy is nightstalker87 at hot(you know).com

Response:

says… Sir, you are apparently attempting to abridge my right of free speech. There are some on here who will take you to task for that.

Not at all – just trying to abridge a pointless and childish contest on ALL sides that is really starting to irritate the rest of the people who lurk here.  You always have the right to speak out against my speaking out (in fact you just did), just as I have the right to tell you and George to shut the hell up and give it a break. Surprising how many psychiatrists we suddenly have on here.  Where were you when you were needed?

Not a psychiatrist, and I was lurking, hoping it would all go away and settle down like real adults. I was not aware of any unduly unsteady motion. Threats of physical violence, or being actually touched with a cursed object, are relatively futile threats. Your kill-file option would seem the more sensible of those available.  Inserting sticks up somebodies rectum ,is then, in your opinion, an adult way of pursuing things? Strikes me as simply shit being pushed the wrong way.

Better than the shit that’s being pushed this way under the guise of rational Usenet posts…..  and that applies to BOTH of you.  I refuse to take sides. "If you dont like it dont read it". Is I believe the standard panacea for all ills, real or perceived, at this present time?

Too true.  I herewith retire back to lurking yet again.  Plonkity plonk…. — NightStalker Email addy is nightstalker87 at hot(you know).com

Response:

<SNIP "If you dont like it dont read it". Is I believe the standard panacea for all ills, real or perceived, at this present time? Too true.  I herewith retire back to lurking yet again.  Plonkity plonk…. — NightStalker Email addy is nightstalker87 at hot(you know).com

My apologies for coming down so heavily on you, for what was in fact a perfectly reasonable post. I am perhaps a trifle oversensitive regarding criticism of my actions at this present time. Being compared to Gehrke, or indeed even being mentioned in the same post,  is also not exactly flattering. It was not my intention to upset an honest poster, who is just sick of shit. I therefore beg your indulgence. Your apparent decision to use a kill-file on something you do not want to see, is eminently sensible. TL MC

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With Red Tags on in fact.  

An Aussie? A New Zealander? ?? Steve

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Sheath the sword, ’twas bound to happen, LR’s come up with a better weapon. Connor and I’ve looked in the abyss, I think it’s best that we fill it with piss. A little Harp, a Weiss Bier, fill the Flagon! Stand on the rim, drown the fucking dragon. the meter needs work, but aren’t those some nice rhymes? Succour – motherfucker. Masterful. I never stop learning from you, Mike.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – <delightfully perverse poetry snipped Artfully done, Mr. Connor! It never would have occurred to me to rhyme "succour" and "motherfucker". I lay my sword at your feet. Could I borrow it to "slay the dragon"?   This abyss is a bit of a trial at times. TL MC

Response:

I’ll have to come over there and insert a bastard rod into two assholes – sideways. With hooks attached.  With Red Tags on in fact.  With Clowser Minnows as droppers even……

ethical. (don’t forget to post a TR on the chromes, have a great trip). — The Halfordian Golfer The deceipt ends with the lure.

Response:

….Gather round good anglers, be bright and perky,

A delight to see you again, sweetie! Sandy — "…the sport and game of angling is the true means and cause that brings a man into a merry spirit, which…makes a flowering age and a long one." ~~ Dame Juliana Berners 1496

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – ….Gather round good anglers, be bright and perky, A delight to see you again, sweetie! Sandy — "…the sport and game of angling is the true means and cause that brings a man into a merry spirit, which…makes a flowering age and a long one." ~~ Dame Juliana Berners 1496

Dear lady, the pleasure is all mine. I am very happy indeed to see you on here. I feared indeed that events might have obliged you to depart.Hope you got some good fishing in during my absence. TL MC

Response:

With Red Tags on in fact.   An Aussie? A New Zealander? ?? Steve

Aussie – Red Tag works well in most conditions in Tasmanian Highland Lakes ) — NightStalker Email addy is nightstalker87 at hot(you know).com

Response:

Hope you got some good fishing in during my absence.

A little, and I have made good progress on my rod collection, too.  <g Fall and early winter mean a great deal of work and little spare time for me, but I emerge again in spring, ready to play.  Hope to get in a day’s fishing here and there on weekends despite the awful schedule. Sandy — "…the sport and game of angling is the true means and cause that brings a man into a merry spirit, which…makes a flowering age and a long one." ~~ Dame Juliana Berners 1496

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Aussie – Red Tag works well in most conditions in Tasmanian Highland Lakes )

  So I’ve heard, but comparing the situation you were going to use them   in and the Highlands … well …  ;-)     Perhaps we’ll hear some of your exploits in the Highlands one of these   days … Steve (bemoaning the fact that ANOTHER Bass Strait crossing looks like being  postponed)

Response:

…….I refuse to respond to Mike Con again…… Oh, nobody’s EVER gonna remember THIS line! Wolfgang is it just me or have absolutes somehow become…..well, less absolute?

Notice the out he left himself there, though. — rbc:  vixen    Fairly harmless remove invalid or hit reply to email. Though I’m very slow to respond. http://www.visi.com/~cyli

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – …….I refuse to respond to Mike Con again…… Oh, nobody’s EVER gonna remember THIS line! Wolfgang is it just me or have absolutes somehow become…..well, less absolute? Notice the out he left himself there, though.

Stick around.  You ain’t seen NUTHIN yet!    :) Wolfgang where else ya gonna get the fourth of july six, seven, eight times a year?

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My commiserations to your unfortunate guests. Must be hell.  Do you allow them to fly your sabres around the studio?  Does that drown out the piano?How many fingers am I holding up? There is a man who sometimes makes, nasty oily stuff, and burns a lot of stakes, He is sadly often seen on here, suffering from chronic verbal diarreah. This of course is very very sad, but things would not be quite as bad, if the asshole did not really stink, or try to sell his stakes and gink. Despite all pleas, he still remains, a curse, like something from the drains, vile and putrid, seemingly beyond chastisement, indulging yet again his lunacy, and aggrandisement. His lies and silly tales are quite beyond the pale, over his poor manners, we must draw a veil, and still, try to believe it if you can, the ignorant boorish oaf thinks he

Question:

With the wife in Vail, Coloradol for a week the last week of Oct…….any info on fly fishing in that area, guides, spots, fly school and such would be most thankful……am a surf fisherman in Texas and havent been fly fishing in some years……we have a Bass Pro Shop here in Dallas Ft Worth area to get gear and such that I havent visited yet or may I say I was busy in other departments……thanks for any help….

Here are parts of a conversation that I had with someone earlier. We also fished a river up from Vail.  You go west on I-70 from Vail then turn south on the highway to Mintern (or Leadville), you’ll parallel a stream way below you in the canyon.  At about Red Cliff the stream reaches the highway and mellows out.  There’s a little picnic area we parked at and fished upstream

This stretch of water (the Eagle) was fantastic on 8/2-6, when I had the good fortune to be fishing it with a couple of friends. I used to live in Aspen and had fished the Roaring Fork and over in Frying Pan, but the fishing was never as good as the 5 days we had around Vail. I guess it helped that my freind had been guiding in the valley for about five years. I was told to pick up some emerging caddis at the local outfitter, and hardly took them off (except to do some nymphing). Caught my first cut on the Eagle just below the rod and gun club’s property off of highway 6. Anyway, I had to make a comment when I heard that I almost you on the river.

Response:

With the wife in Vail, Coloradol for a week the last week of Oct…….any info on fly fishing in that area, guides, spots, fly school and such would be most thankful……am a surf fisherman in Texas and havent been fly fishing in some years……we have a Bass Pro Shop here in Dallas Ft Worth area to get gear and such that I havent visited yet or may I say I was busy in other departments……thanks for any help….

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Question:

Tim, Bad move guy.  PLEASE, never send a picture to a newsgroup. Huh ? alt.flyfishing accepts binaries in its charter.

He said ‘newsgroup’<g. — Charlie…

Response:

alt.flyfishing accepts binaries in its charter.

as does alt.binaries.pictures.fishing. — TimW, Halfordian Golfer "A Cash Flow Runs Through It…" "Guilt replaced the creel…" B.M.P.I.A.

Response:

Wayne reprimands in message: Tim, Bad move guy.  PLEASE, never send a picture to a newsgroup…

- Hmmmm….. and *I* was thinking about sending a few photos of Sharon Stone on the Upper Delaware River on a hot muggy August afternoon when the mercury hit 95 wearing a *wet* ROFF t-shirt and a big smile. – Oh well…. Tony Ritter Narrowsburg, New York

Response:

Tim, Bad move guy.  PLEASE, never send a picture to a newsgroup. Huh ? alt.flyfishing accepts binaries in its charter. He said ‘newsgroup’<g.

Ouch! That’s gonna leave a mark…

Response:

Wayne reprimands in message: Tim, Bad move guy.  PLEASE, never send a picture to a newsgroup… – Hmmmm….. and *I* was thinking about sending a few photos of Sharon Stone on the Upper Delaware River on a hot muggy August afternoon when the mercury hit 95 wearing a *wet* ROFF t-shirt and a big smile. – Oh well….

Send ‘em to George. He could use the company…

Response:

Wayne reprimands in message: Tim, Bad move guy.  PLEASE, never send a picture to a newsgroup… – Hmmmm….. and *I* was thinking about sending a few photos of Sharon Stone on the Upper Delaware River on a hot muggy August afternoon when the mercury hit 95 wearing a *wet* ROFF t-shirt and a big smile. – Oh well…. Tony Ritter Narrowsburg, New York

        post or die, yankee devil! wayno – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –

Response:

Forget it Wayno!  You wouldn’t like her.  She just lays there! — Wayne To Fish is Human…To Release Divine!

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – post or die, yankee devil! wayno

Response:

Forget it Wayno!  You wouldn’t like her.  She just lays there!

Ever seen Basic Instinct?  Michael Douglas called her "the fuck of the century".  And he get’s around, from what I hear. — Levi Life is anything that dies when you stomp on it.                                                         — Dave Barry

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Forget it Wayno!  You wouldn’t like her.  She just lays there!

        in a display of courage that has been a lifetime hallmark, i am willing to give her a shot. wayno

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– Hmmmm….. and *I* was thinking about sending a few photos of Sharon Stone on the Upper Delaware River on a hot muggy August afternoon when the mercury hit 95 wearing a *wet* ROFF t-shirt and a big smile.

What, who, huh? BTW, I once mistakenly looked up www.teeny.com thinking it was Jim Teeny’s web site.  For the record, it’s www.teeny-nymph.com. Mu

Response:

Mu Young Lee sets us straight: What, who, huh? BTW, I once mistakenly looked up www.teeny.com thinking it was Jim Teeny’s web site.  For the record, it’s www.teeny-nymph.com.

- Which shouldn’t be confused with: alt.teeny.nymphs 8)* – Sorry….couldn’t resist.

Response:

Tim, Bad move guy.  PLEASE, never send a picture to a newsgroup.  Ask any who wish to view it to contact you directly and ship it individually.  Some of our members pay per usage on the connection.  If my Queensland buddy in Brisbane gets wind of this he may take a break from "swimming the bar" and hunt you down just for the sport.  Damn near declared ‘roos endangered in parts of Australia because of his over-eagerness! — Wayne To Fish is Human…To Release Divine!

Response:

Tim, Bad move guy.  PLEASE, never send a picture to a newsgroup.

Huh ? alt.flyfishing accepts binaries in its charter. — TimW, Halfordian Golfer "A Cash Flow Runs Through It…" "Guilt replaced the creel…" B.M.P.I.A.

Response:

Question:

Hi Indy; I live in Wisconsin.  While some folks here may disapprove of fishing for gills on the redds, it’s certainly not true of all of us.  Most of the people I know do it.  The limit for bluegills has been reduced to 25 per day in Wisconsin; still more than enough, I think.  I can’t fault anything else you have to say on the subject, but personally I prefer to use lighter tippet…2 or 3 lb.  I believe it spooks the fish less and makes it easier to use tiny flies effectively.  I also like to gut and scale the fish rather than filleting because you always lose some of the meat when you fillet, and I want it all!

Response:

Hi Indy; I live in Wisconsin.  While some folks here may disapprove of fishing for gills on the redds, it’s certainly not true of all of us.  Most of the people I know do it.  The limit for bluegills has been reduced to 25 per day in Wisconsin; still more than enough, I think.  I can’t fault anything else you have to say on the subject, but personally I prefer to use lighter tippet…2 or 3 lb.  I believe it spooks the fish less and makes it easier to use tiny flies effectively.  I also like to gut and scale the fish rather than filleting because you always lose some of the meat when you fillet, and I want it all!

Hi Wolfgang, I sometimes go to 4 lb. but that 2 to 3 lb. line breaks too often on big gills, especially here in Florida.  I had to go to my 8 weight fly rod and 6 lb. leader just to get those big ones out of the weeds. The lighter leader just doesn’t get it.  Those big gills are bedding here right now, by the way, and I’m going out this morning.  Fried a mess of fillets on Sunday night.  Tres bon!  There are some excellent big bluegill holes in Badger State up in Douglas Co. where I formerly lived.  Sorry I got the ‘gill limit wrong.  Things change.  Best wishes. — Don Jordan "The Real Indiana Jones" http://realindy.com

Response:

Hi all. Just wondering when do you like to fish for gills. I live in West Michigan.  Please give me a tip. Thank you.

Response:

my best gills are caught in mid may to end of june

Response:

Anytime, anywhere!  Here in Wisconsin (and in Michigan, I believe) there is no closed season on bluegills.  A lot of people like to fish for them through the ice and they get a lot of them that way.  Personally, I don’t care for hard water fishing…too cold standing out on the ice…but to each his own.  I started fly fishing about fifteen years ago and quickly discovered that it is THE best method for catching bluegills; they LOVE bugs.  The best fishing is in the early mornings and late evenings during the spawning season.  Bluegills are very aggressive about protecting their redds.  I have seen them come up off the nest and bite ducks who happened to swimming nearby.  Apparently even small bugs are seen as a threat and are vigorously attacked.  For reasons unknown to me the average size of fish I catch is considerably greater during the spawn too.  Maybe because it’s the biggest that do most of the breeding.  Here in Southern Wisconsin the gills spawn early, starting sometime in May most years, though it varies a bit according to the weather.  When I lived up in the central part of the state a few years ago it was usually late May or early June.  And of course, in the northern reaches of WI and MI it will be later yet. The hot fishing lasts until the beginning of the hot weather of summer, at which time things taper off somewhat, though there are still days when the action can be phenomenal. All in all, I think the best policy is to get out and fish whenever possible.  Regardless of all other considerations, the people who catch the most fish are the ones who spend the most time fishing.  If you have never used a fly rod for bluegills, do so as soon as possible!  It’s about the most fun I’ve ever had without being naked, and as a matter of fact…..uh…..hm….maybe we won’t go there. Good luck. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi all. Just wondering when do you like to fish for gills. I live in West Michigan.  Please give me a tip. Thank you.

Response:

I grew up in LaPorte, Indiana (somewhat close to West Michigan). In LaPorte, we have a lot of lakes.  I don’t live there now unfortunately or I’d be fishing every weekend! When I grew up, my father, grandfather and I used to fish all the time…we caught bluegill and perch from March all the way through to October.  The best times seemed to be spring and fall. And, we found that the best nearly always tended to be worms dug up from the garden or there were times when grubs were the best. Ted Hi all. Just wondering when do you like to fish for gills. I live in West Michigan.  Please give me a tip. Thank you.

Response:

Hi all. Just wondering when do you like to fish for gills. I live in West Michigan.  Please give me a tip. Thank you.

Hi Trudude, The absolute very best time to catch bluegill is when they are bedding. I know some guys up north may abhor this practice, but it is the standard approach everywhere from Illinois to Florida.  They bed in shallow water and their nests are usually visible.  The most fun is to catch them on a fly rod.  If you’re in a lake with huge gills in the 10 plus inch category, you will want at least a no.5 weight rod and at least 6 lb. test leader.  I like small poppers and foam body spiders,,,green, white, black, yellow.  Sometimes a sinking fly will work better.  I have had great sucess on a standard trout nymph with just a tiny, tiny bit of weight on it.  If you aren’t a fly guy, get an ultralight spinning outfit and cast 1/32nd jigs or 1/32nd oz. spinner baits.  If you’re a live bait guy, crickets are best during spawn, but anything will work.  Redworms when it is slow, on the bottom. Go to http://realindy.com/Previous.htm  read about casting jigs and spinners for bluegill.  Good pix too. Bluegill spawn from Florida to Ontario, beginning in April in the South, but probably peak out in May/June at your lattitude with emphasis on June.  They are the most active during the full moon. Bluegill are far and away the best eating fish extant, in my opinion, and most ‘gill anglers like them filleted rather than beheaded,scaled and gutted, etc.  There are no bag limits on them in the South, but Wisconsin had a 50-fish limit when I lived there. Catching big bluegill on light tackle is the most fun I have every year, and that’s counting fly fishing for trout in the Rockies and muskies in northern Wisconsin.  A 10-inch bluegill puts up an incredible fight and if you ever hit those 11 and 12 inch hogs, buddy they will flat whip your butt! I hope you catch a big mess of ‘em this spring.  Happy dining! — Don Jordan "The Real Indiana Jones" http://realindy.com

Response:

Sorry about the 2 messages, but, bluegill aren’t hard to catch, as a matter of fact they’re quite easy.

When they’re biting. There are times when they’re just not interested. —  << << << << << << << <<  << << << << << << << <<

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About you r bluegill fishing.

Response:

Sorry about the 2 messages, but, bluegill aren’t hard to catch, as a matter of fact they’re quite easy. That’s just about the only thing I catch. All you have to do is find a school of bluegill, put a bobber on and a small jig. (Make sure your bobber is situated right. They feed by the bottom or in the middle of the water). cast out in the school and wait. ( oh yes I forgot the most important part : Hook a Berkley "smelly" plastic worm on the jig. they come in swirly tails and grug. use the swirly tails.

Response:

Question:

– Now booking Cape Cod, MA inshore fly fishing wading trips for stripers for the 97 season. I supply all tackle and flies as well as casting instructions if needed. If you don’t score stripers, I don’t get paid. Fair enough? $125/single $200/two anglers for a full day wading trip. Email me http://www.flyfishing-the-salt.com. Email references given upon request. Good fishing…Ted Bobetsky

Response:

– Now booking Cape Cod, MA inshore fly fishing wading trips for stripers for the 97 season. I supply all tackle and flies as well as casting instructions if needed. If you don’t score stripers, I don’t get paid. Fair enough? $125/single $200/two anglers for a full day wading trip. Email me http://www.flyfishing-the-salt.com. Good fishing…Ted Bobetsky

Response:

Question:

The water is still fairly high in the park, but with some work you should do well. I would take caddis (several sizes 12-18, and colors) – mosquitos , adams, also grey and brown hackle peacocks.       For nymphs, almost anything (pt, prince, beadhead hare’ ears, etc. will do nicely. Fish the road water between the campgrounds and road’s end and walk up (2 mi. ) to bubb’s creek and fish both it and the south fork in that area.   cal Buz’s Flyshop in Visalia and talk to Mickey or Larry for latest reliable info  - 209-734-1151 — good fishing. Hank Urbach  and hunting partners Rainbow’s Eagle River Buck SH Rainbow Mac’s Starry Sky JH             Hill’s Ferry Hunting Retriever Club, CA

Response:

I’m going to be camping in Kings Canyon National Park in mid-august near the South Fork of the Kings River and wonder if anyone has any fly pattern recommendations for this river or any of the creeks nearby or if their is a fly shop in the Fresno area you could direct me to. Thanks for your help in advance, Bob

Response:

I’m going to be camping in Kings Canyon National Park in mid-august near the South Fork of the Kings River and wonder if anyone has any fly pattern recommendations for this river or any of the creeks nearby or if their is a fly shop in the Fresno area you could direct me to.

 Bob… I fished the So. Fk. of the Kings Thurs. & Fri. and it was fishing great. In another 2 weeks the flows will come down a little and it should be even better.  The best flies are a grey Deer Hair Caddis in #10 or 12 and a Western Coachman, a local fly that is basically a short bodied peacock Trude, #12 or 14.  Around sundown a Blue Dun Parachute size 14 or 16 is also effective.  Occasionally just before dark in the flat runs there can be a hatch of #16-18 light Cahill or PMD although a #16 Blue Dun Parachute seems to work just fine in that situation.   There is a ff section in Herb Bauer Sporting Goods in Fresno where you can get good advice if you don’t talk to anyone under retirement age, but they don’t carry the flies you really need.  The best shop is Buz’s Fly Shop in Visalia.  Larry Goates who works there has fished the Kings all his life and guides there almost every week.   Have a great trip. …Dick

Response:

Hiya Bob, I the Kings was one of my favorite rivers when I was living in Fresno.  What you *need* to carry in your box are as follows: Blue Dun #12-16 (I prefer parachute) light cahill #14-16 various ants, both red and black, #14-18 tan/olive caddis #14-16 GRHE #12-16 PT nymph #14-18 The above flies should keep you catching fish anywhere on the river.  BTW, I’ve never seen a "full blown" blue dun hatch on the kings, but for some reason these flies are irresistable to the fish.  I’m not sure about the water flow right now, but august/sept usually has fairly low water- sneak up on the pools! There are a some fly shops in Fresno, either Heubner’s sports or Bauer’s (on Blackstone)- I think those were the names……  Bauer’s is bigger, with a larger selection, but IMHO Huebner’s has better flies. Best- Hans — "The worst monotonous drone coming from a lectern or the most eye-splitting textbook written in turgid English is nothing in comparison to the psychological Sahara that starts right in your bedroom and spurns the horizon."         -Joseph Brodsky, from "In praise of Boredom"          delivered as a commencement address at Dartmouth College. Hans T.H. Beernink, Department of Biochemistry, University of Vermont

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Question:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hey does anybody have any experience good/bad with these waders?  They look interesting but are they worth it?  And yes, Gore-Tex does work underwater. Hi Jorge- I trust you mean Simm’s Gore-Tex Micro Fiber. I have several pair including a protoype three seasons old. I’m in them just about every day and wear ‘em hard. I walk railroad tracks in 90 degree sun and wade waist deep with ice in the guides. They have yet to let me down.   In short, the micro fibers are great. Maybe better than great. I love them and have not put on neoprenes since. Because they expell moisture (where neoprene doesn’t) the *percieved* temperature is warmer in Gore-Tex than in neoprenes where the air is damp. Your best insulation is from layering fleece, Capilene, etc under a wader rather than depending on 3 or 4mm of neoprene anyway.   Gravel will grind in your shoes and the Micro-Fiber WILL leak in the feet unless you wear neoprene outer socks (provided with the waders). The water that migrates between the socks and the Gore-Tex allows even the feet to breath. Magic.       BEWARE! New models will soon be available with built in neoprene feet. These are convenient to wear (no messing with the neoprene outer sock) but despite what Simms, Orvis or anyone else say, the moisture laden air does NOT migrate up into your legs to be "breathed away". You WILL have wet feet. I have Micro-Fibers both with and without the built in neoprene feet. I’ll spend a minute putting on the extra sock any day to have dry feet!   I’m on the Simms technical advisory panel and work very closely with the company. To hopefully let you know my assesments are honest, let  me say:  Stay away from the Simms Cordura waders. They have a history of leakage problems. Also, I will tell you that Simms has had a very hard time meeting consumer demand and you might have a tough time finding your waders. Also, if you get a leak in your $300.00+ waders, it will take *at least* a month (based on history- their new plant opens next week and maybe this will speed things up) to get them repaired by Simms. You can not fix them at home. There. Now go out and buy a pair with my urging and enjoy! They *ARE* worth it.   Tight lines! Ralph —

  Ralph   Not to be contrary ,but I,ve have buddies that say after a few hours on the river they are soaked from within. Could this be condensation that does not "osmose" through the fabric fast enough ?   Harry  { I looking as well )

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 Ralph  Not to be contrary ,but I,ve have buddies that say after a few hours on the river they are soaked from within. Could this be condensation that does not "osmose" through the fabric fast enough ?

Hi Harry! Contrary? I think not, You asked a good question.    The greater the temperature "differential" (inside the wader vs outside the wader) the better Gore-Tex works. Walking around on a hot day will not only work up a sweat but will not provide much of a "differential" and the Gore-Tex won’t work.  If you’ve worked up a sweat then wade into cold water you’ll be dry in a few minutes. Gore-Tex down jackets and sleeping bags fail miserably because the down is such an efficient insulator the temp differential is minimal.    My guess is that your friends are fishing in very warm water or they have pin hole leaks (a big problem with the Simms *Cordura* Gore-Tex waders. If they are Cordura, have your friends throw them through the wash. The open weave of the Cordura traps very small stickers that poke nearly invisible holes into the Gore-Tex membrane. Very often the wash will soften and dislodge the stickers and the holes will reseal themselves).     Check to see they are using Gore-Tex. Some of the other "waterproof/breathable" materials aren’t as breathable as Gore-Tex and at least one is very prone to clogging with body oils. (All waterproof/breathble fabrics work best when kept relatively clean. Be sure to run them through the drier after they’ve been cleaned, this rejuvenates the water repellent coating applied to the outer fabric.)    Tight lines, Ralph —

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Just a question on the topic of Gortex Waders….. Do they provide any bouyancy, ala neoprene?  My buddy fell into the McKenzie last Saturday and was washed downstream about 150 ft. in about three minutes.  He survived because he was in neoprene and he remembered that they would provide bouyancy.  He lost his rod, but he lived to tell the story. Charley

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Just a question on the topic of Gortex Waders….. Do they provide any bouyancy, ala neoprene?  My buddy fell into the McKenzie last Saturday and was washed downstream about 150 ft.

When Gortex snow suits came out I quickly concluded they were for rich folks who don’t ski a lot.  Those who ski a lot tear up ski clothing, and can’t afford to purchase new gortex every season. By analogy, in my humble opinion, gortex waders are for rich folks who don’t really fish a lot.  My neopremes are so patched up they look like they have leprosy.  I can’t afford new gortex every season. — -Wayne Trzyna

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Just a question on the topic of Gortex Waders….. Do they provide any bouyancy, ala neoprene?  My buddy fell into the McKenzie last Saturday and was washed downstream about 150 ft. When Gortex snow suits came out I quickly concluded they were for rich folks who don’t ski a lot.  Those who ski a lot tear up ski clothing, and can’t afford to purchase new gortex every season. By analogy, in my humble opinion, gortex waders are for rich folks who don’t really fish a lot.  My neopremes are so patched up they look like they have leprosy.  I can’t afford new gortex every season. — -Wayne Trzyna

Wayne  I tied 20 doz. flies for my last pair. Scotts, they lasted 4 years, even in the acid water of the Lower Sac.   Harry

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Wayne, :gortex waders are for rich folks who don’t really fish a lot.  My :neopremes are so patched up they look like they have leprosy.  I can’t :afford new gortex every season. I disagree.  I think that Gortex waders are for those of use who fish so much when it is hot that we would shorten our lifespans without them.  I would typically sweat at least two quarts up in South Park in my neoprenes.  I still sweat in my Goretex, but not nearly as much, because my bodies system actually works with the Goretex.  It’s also great to be able to take off your waders and not feel like you’ve had a bath.  I think that the only alternative to Goretex is to wade wet (which I love to do) but this doesn’t offer as much temperature variability as the Goretex. And that water in S. Park can be quiet cold.  Besides, they make patch kits for Goretex too..

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Harry, I am skeptical of anyone who is associated with a product. I don’t call that contrary,  just smart.  Their credibility is an inverse ratio to their financial involvement.

   The question is: Is there anyone out there who has used the Simms GoreTex waders for a year or so that would go back to using anything else?    I’m only an occasional fisherman, but I’ve had my older type Simms for three years and wouldn’t consider going back to neoprene or ‘lightweights’.  Given the other costs of this sport, I think these waders are pretty good value of the money. — Lloyd Fortney —Opinions are mine—

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  I’m only an occasional fisherman, but I’ve had my older type Simms for three years and wouldn’t consider going back to neoprene or ‘lightweights’.  Given the other costs of this sport, I think these waders are pretty good value of the money. — Lloyd Fortney —Opinions are mine—

Actually, I am convinced there is a place for both.  I absolutely love gore tex for 75% of my fishing.  However, yesterday I was fishing in some pretty cold water and wished i had had on neoprene about the time my feet turned blue. Mike Ray

Response:

Hey does anybody have any experience good/bad with these waders?  They look interesting but are they worth it?  And yes, Gore-Tex does work underwater.

Response:

Hey does anybody have any experience good/bad with these waders?  They look interesting but are they worth it?  And yes, Gore-Tex does work underwater.

Hi Jorge- I trust you mean Simm’s Gore-Tex Micro Fiber. I have several pair including a protoype three seasons old. I’m in them just about every day and wear ‘em hard. I walk railroad tracks in 90 degree sun and wade waist deep with ice in the guides. They have yet to let me down.    In short, the micro fibers are great. Maybe better than great. I love them and have not put on neoprenes since. Because they expell moisture (where neoprene doesn’t) the *percieved* temperature is warmer in Gore-Tex than in neoprenes where the air is damp. Your best insulation is from layering fleece, Capilene, etc under a wader rather than depending on 3 or 4mm of neoprene anyway.    Gravel will grind in your shoes and the Micro-Fiber WILL leak in the feet unless you wear neoprene outer socks (provided with the waders). The water that migrates between the socks and the Gore-Tex allows even the feet to breath. Magic.        BEWARE! New models will soon be available with built in neoprene feet. These are convenient to wear (no messing with the neoprene outer sock) but despite what Simms, Orvis or anyone else say, the moisture laden air does NOT migrate up into your legs to be "breathed away". You WILL have wet feet. I have Micro-Fibers both with and without the built in neoprene feet. I’ll spend a minute putting on the extra sock any day to have dry feet!    I’m on the Simms technical advisory panel and work very closely with the company. To hopefully let you know my assesments are honest, let  me say:  Stay away from the Simms Cordura waders. They have a history of leakage problems. Also, I will tell you that Simms has had a very hard time meeting consumer demand and you might have a tough time finding your waders. Also, if you get a leak in your $300.00+ waders, it will take *at least* a month (based on history- their new plant opens next week and maybe this will speed things up) to get them repaired by Simms. You can not fix them at home. There. Now go out and buy a pair with my urging and enjoy! They *ARE* worth it.    Tight lines! Ralph —

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Question:

I’m sure Jason will remember you and that fish for the rest of his life. After all the "political" discussions on this group, your post came through loud and clear. Thanks for sharing it with us. Bob

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John, Thanks for the story.  We can all take lessons from it.

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It was damned quiet off Kennebunkport yesterday morning. Rain fell steadily and large banks of fog rolled off Mount Agamenticus to the SW, as well as off Cape Porpoise to the North. The VHF was silent. No boats in sight anywhere. 2 miles out my 17′ Invader drifted slowly as I sent cast after cast out in search of the blues. They weren’t there either. I motored in towards Walker’s Point, casting towards the rocks, hoping for that big migratating cow striper. She wasn’t there either. Mid morning the sun broke through, the boats came out and I knew it was time to leave. I can never stop fishing, so after docking I started making roll casts off the swim platform. On the first of these I saw a striper come out from under the dock opposite me and take the small deceiver. It was a small one, but fun for sure. I caught a motion from the corner of my eye and turned to see Jason, the 8 year old from the slip next door. Jason, like me, is possessed by fish. Every time I go to the marina he’s there, looking into the depths for a glimpse of a striper or catching sand eels or crabs. The kid loves fish. One arm was in a cast, one of those accidents we all have. The other held a sandwich. Another roll casts produced another fish, this one felt considerably larger, and I passed the rod to Jason. He fought the fish well for a kid with a cast and a sandwich, but a last minute head shake gave the first round to the stripers. It was enough,though, to make him an instant addict. "Finish your sandwich, then pick out the fly that will get your first striper" I told him. He picked a 2/0 white and blue deceiver and held it out to me confidently. It didn’t take many casts before his fly hooked into a good schoolie. I reeled quickly to get the fish on the reel, then jammed the fighting butt between the buckles on his life vets, propped his encasted hand on the rod blank and put his good hand on the reel. A small crowd formed to cheer him on as the schoolie darted and dove. Finally we saw leader, and I grabbed it and pulled his prize out. He held it briefly, then we released it and it swam back under the dock as the crowd cheered. We didn’t catch any more fish, as the water dropped below 2′, but the kid was airborne all day. He sorted my flies into two piles, good ones and bad ones. An instant fly connoisseur, he placed most of my creations in the bad pile :- "I bet this one would work on mackeral" he said, picking out a tiny #4 blonde type pattern. We spent the afternoon talking of fish and fishing, and after washing the boat down and heading for my truck I realized that I’d finally found something more fun that fishing. As I headed toward the driveway Dan, the dockmaster, called out to me. He too is a fly fisherman, and watched the day’s events. "That was fun wasn’t it ?" he asked, and I told him yeah it was great. "Could it be that he reminds you of someone you know ?" he winked. I went home and dug up my lighter 8 weight, looking forward to the casting lessons soon to come.                                                 jc

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Question:

I guess little things in life please me; last weekend while tying some flies with a friend, his father showed us the trick of how to tie the head of a Muddler Minnow. I had always marvelled at these seemingly intricate flies and wondered "How in the world do you tie this?".

Pete,      Cool, huh?  As Scott indicates in response to this same posting, spinning deerhair is a basic technique that’s been around a long time. You can also spin other materials such as wool (woolhead sculpins) tow yarn (glow bugs) or any hollow animal hair.      Back in high school I reluctantly began tying commercially for local fly shops and a large mailorder firm.  I tried to stick mostly to custom tying because it didn’t get as boring (I would tie dozens of a pattern and color rather than grosses) and I made better money. Excellent spending (fishing) money for a teen by the way.  Anyway, I tied tons of muddlers.  Popular fly.  To form the head on a muddler you shouldn’t need to spin more than one clump of hair.  First, always use a heavier than normal thread when spinning hair.  Cut a suitable sized clump and stack the tips (even the hair tips).  These tips will form your muddler’s collar.  Make two loose wraps of thread around the hair and hook with the tips of the hair positioned to form the collar (usually about half way down the hook shank).  Begin to tighten your thread to flare the hair and wrap through the flared deerhair. Tie off and trim the flared butt ends and some of the tip ends of the deerhair.  The muddler should take less than 5 minutes to tie plus it’s a great fly.  I think you’ll find this method for muddler heads quicker, easier, and neater.  Have fun tying! John

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I guess little things in life please me; last weekend while tying some flies with a friend, his father showed us the trick of how to tie the head of a Muddler Minnow. I had always marvelled at these seemingly intricate flies and wondered "How in the world do you tie this?". The trick is that you take deer hair and wrap it to the hook near the head, splitting the length of the hair in 2.  As you let go of the deer hair, it fans out in a perpendicular fashion to the hook.  After wrapping several bunches of deer hair to the hook, the previous bunches get pushed backwards.  Then you just trim away the bulk of the dear head and sculpt the head of the muddler minnow. Its quite simple !  What a revelation!  I tied my 1st muddler and it looked AWESOME.                                                         pete                                                                            |_    

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Its quite simple !  What a revelation!  I tied my 1st muddler and it looked AWESOME.

The "trick" you describe is pretty much standard practice (its called hair spinning and is described in many fly tying books).. You did say in your original message that you were just trimming the hair to shape the head..  After you trim, you can use a match (or lighter if youre careful) to further refine the head’s shape.. Scott —             |                UUCP: ..!uunet!plains!wilken       |               | WWW page -= http://www.cs.ndsu.nodak.edu/~wilken |

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