Question:

I fished with a ROFF lurker Sunday, a really good fisherman and tier, and we got rain, snow, and wind.  Both of us caught a few good fish and we enjoyed watching the guides and their sports in the Texas hole.  Two guys in one boat had a foul hooked double.  First time we’d ever seen that one.

I’m assuming you don’t mean my version of a double – foul hooking a fish with *both* my nymphs… ??

Response:

I’m assuming you don’t mean my version of a double – foul hooking a fish with *both* my nymphs… ??

  Man, that’s disgusting.  You need to brush up on your style:)   I caught a fish last year on two nymphs, one fly in each corner of his MOUTH. That’s the way we westerners do things. With a little class.  I’ll bet you tie Parachute Adams’ on treble hooks, too. Snoop — —–= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =—– http://www.newsfeeds.com – The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! —–==  Over 80,000 Newsgroups – 16 Different Servers! =—–

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I’m assuming you don’t mean my version of a double – foul hooking a fish with *both* my nymphs… ??

Wow.  I’ve never seen that one before either! bruce h

Response:

I’m assuming you don’t mean my version of a double – foul hooking a fish with *both* my nymphs… ??   Man, that’s disgusting.  You need to brush up on your style:)   I caught a fish last year on two nymphs, one fly in each corner of his MOUTH. That’s the way we westerners do things. With a little class.  I’ll bet you tie Parachute Adams’ on treble hooks, too.

Yeah, but I’ve noticed that if I leave off the tail, body, wings and even hackle from my treble Adams it snags ‘em just as well.  Frankly, I don’t think the fish can tell the difference…..

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I’m planning on having a really small group at the San Juan December 7-10. You are invited if you are reading this.  Join the Western clique.  We’re really not all that picky 2002 has been a pretty slow year for me, fishing wise, although I’ve had the good fortune to take some good trips and I have caught lots of good fish. Just not as many as expected in many cases.  Fishing, like many other pursuits, can sometimes be improved by managing one’s expectations. Even the San Juan, a veritable aquarium, has been slower than expected on the days I managed to get up there this year.  And while I was in Idaho and Montana, struggling to catch fish and enjoying everyone’s company, the San Juan was rocking, with the fish eating anything, apparently.  Did I mention that Indian Joe is a HOOT? I vowed to make the time to fish the Juan for a weekend or more and really walk around and concentrate on locating concentrations of fish for the December trip.  Of course it’s not too tough in that river but the fish do move around as the conditions change.  And I’ve never even seen the river as low as it’s flowing now as a result of our drought – 350 cfs.  Last weekend I fished Friday afternoon and all weekend. At the Western Clave, Jeff C mentioned to me that he had hoped for visible hatches and working fish and a puzzle to solve.  We really didn’t get it. We were casting to likely water and mostly blind, not casting to visible fish (except the bridges!) or rise forms.  At the San Juan, you can cast to working fish and throw everything in your box at them and not hook anything but the Tamarisk behind you for two hours.  Well, unless your initials are WL that is.  And other times, the fish are visibly feeding, you can identify pretty closely what they’re eating, and lo and behold, a few of them eat your presentations of imitations.  As somebody once said and I’ve repeated often, some days are electric. Friday afternoon was Electric.  Saturday was raining, cold and mostly windy and the fish still ate a good presentation.  I looked up and down the river and saw the other fly fishers waiting for a chance to get a drift or sitting on the river bank waiting it out.  Sunday dawn I was walking across the upper flats, intent on checking out an apparently trapped goose that I had spotted from my truck.  As I got closer and it got a little brighter outside, I could tell it wasn’t a goose.  The shotgun blasts kicked my brain into gear.  Decoy, hunters.  Wow.  I’ve seen a lot of shotgun shells there but I’ve never had a couple of camo guys stand up on the island in front of me and start blasting at some distant ducks.  Even more amazing was the fact that they weren’t bothered by the other twenty or so guys that arrived over the next couple of hours. The baetis hatch Sunday afternoon was really something to behold.  We were at the right place at the right time.  I think there was a debate here some time ago about whether or not cloudy conditions bring out the baetis.  At the San Juan it seems obvious.  I was extremely happy to be there. I fished with a ROFF lurker Sunday, a really good fisherman and tier, and we got rain, snow, and wind.  Both of us caught a few good fish and we enjoyed watching the guides and their sports in the Texas hole.  Two guys in one boat had a foul hooked double.  First time we’d ever seen that one. bruce h

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Question:

Is there any good coastal flyfishing in the Santa Barbara to Monterrey area in the autumn?  Maybe even at thanksgiving?   I’ve heard about good striper fishing in the Bay area, but I don’t know about farther south.   thanks, Plattelines

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Is there any good coastal flyfishing in the Santa Barbara to Monterrey area in the autumn?  Maybe even at thanksgiving?  

Dan Blanton’s board is a good source for ffing the salt in California. Try your question at http://www.danblanton.com/bulletin.html.

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Question:

I am not sure about loading the boat solo.  Its not so much the weight but

I’ve just switched canoes from an Old Town to a handmade wooden one. The wooden one weighs at least 20 pounds less, but is too hard to handle completely well alone in getting it off the truck and back on the sawhorses, so I’ve been paddling for overnights in the tiny Otter, with stuff strapped on deck.  Otter fits in my truck bed on a diagonal.  The new canoe is 18 feet and the fore/aft wobble and so forth and need to try to keep the wood safe is just more work than the weight loss is worth.  I’ll probably be selling it next year. The Old Towns are wonderful.  You don’t have to worry about dents.  I used to take that thing off my car (lousy arm strength) by looking over to my right to be sure there was nothing pointy and tip/flipping it off.  As people would stare, I’d smile and say, "It’s a Old Town." and go get the rest of my gear out of my trunk.  I even used to be able to get it on top of my truck by doing the crawl under, lift bow, set bow on top of truck and shove until it was in the right position. I did that on a well used Old Town for 10 years and it was in about the same shape when I handed it on as it was when I bought it.  Faded more, though, and one long nasty scratch that has to be fixed by the new owner. So go for the Old Town, even a bit heavy, if you don’t mind some unconventional on and off vehicle moves.  I’m 5′4" and out of shape and if I could do it, darn near anyone can.  Oh, yeah, middlel-aged, too.  However, if I could find a 40 pound kevlar at a price I could afford, I’d be on it like a shot. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -the size could get tough.  I carry it myself but its helpful having my son guide the back as I load it on and off.  But that may just be me…your coleman seemed to be heavier. I’m now back in the market and looking for an all-purpose boat to cover the following usage: 65% fishing (with electric or tiny outboard) 30% flatwater paddling (maybe day trips or overnights) 5% "whitewater" (certainly ning more than a class 2+) ty. er) It seems to me that Old Town makes more general purpose boats than the other manufacturers, let me know if I am wrong. Woodbury, MN

—– I only answer my email every few months, on average.   Patience helps.   http://www.visi.com/~cyli

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If I bought a Discovery I’d buy the 169.  Its patterned on their "tripper" which is a great boat.  A friend has the 169 and it seems decent. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Old Town Discovery 160K Old Town Discovery 133K Old Town Discovery 147 (current front runner)

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Try before you buy…saying that… I had the same requirements you had except I also have a requirement of bringing my son along with me.  I went with the Mad River Revelation.  It does everything you want.  Its about 78 pounds, 17ft, and very stable also its expensive.  I fly fish out of it and its very comfortable to have my son in the front and me in the back.  It is amazingly comfortable to paddle over the lakes we fish.  It easily fits four for day trip though I have not tried camping out of it yet.  The electric motor is nice but because we enjoyed paddling it so much we use it only for trolling. I have not tried white water but have heard of others having no problems. I am not sure about loading the boat solo.  Its not so much the weight but the size could get tough.  I carry it myself but its helpful having my son guide the back as I load it on and off.  But that may just be me…your coleman seemed to be heavier. Good luck. John – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Back in the early 80’s I canoed quite a bit.  Yes, I was a teenager, broke and naive, and bought a 15′ Coleman.  (Yada, yada, yada).  I enjoyed that, fished the heck out of it, camped out of it some and ran a few rapids I probably shouldn’t have. I’m now back in the market and looking for an all-purpose boat to cover the following usage: 65% fishing (with electric or tiny outboard) 30% flatwater paddling (maybe day trips or overnights) 5% "whitewater" (certainly ning more than a class 2+) Now I certainly don’t expect to find something that shines at everything. I had originally decided to do something square-sterned but decided that a double-ended boat would be more versatile.  I want to favor fishing since that will be my heaviest usage.  Tracking well under power would be important so I’m assuming a flat or slightly rockeredboat would be appropriate.  I might also row when fishing solo.  I will fish out of it a lot solo so ease of car topping is also important ( I used to do my Coleman alone and I think the 15′ I had was about 85 lbs).  But I want the ability to hold two for fishing comfortably, or hold three on a day or overnight paddle.  I favor plastic boats for cost and durability. I’m hoping the experts here can help. What have I come up with?  My best guesses so far are: Old Town Discovery 160K Old Town Discovery 133K Old Town Discovery 147 (current front runner) It seems to me that Old Town makes more general purpose boats than the other manufacturers, let me know if I am wrong. Let me know what you think. Thanks a lot, Keith Hatfull Woodbury, MN

Response:

Back in the early 80’s I canoed quite a bit.  Yes, I was a teenager, broke and naive, and bought a 15′ Coleman.  (Yada, yada, yada).  I enjoyed that, fished the heck out of it, camped out of it some and ran a few rapids I probably shouldn’t have. I’m now back in the market and looking for an all-purpose boat to cover the following usage: 65% fishing (with electric or tiny outboard) 30% flatwater paddling (maybe day trips or overnights) 5% "whitewater" (certainly ning more than a class 2+) Now I certainly don’t expect to find something that shines at everything.  I had originally decided to do something square-sterned but decided that a double-ended boat would be more versatile.  I want to favor fishing since that will be my heaviest usage.  Tracking well under power would be important so I’m assuming a flat or slightly rockeredboat would be appropriate.  I might also row when fishing solo.  I will fish out of it a lot solo so ease of car topping is also important ( I used to do my Coleman alone and I think the 15′ I had was about 85 lbs).  But I want the ability to hold two for fishing comfortably, or hold three on a day or overnight paddle.  I favor plastic boats for cost and durability. I’m hoping the experts here can help. What have I come up with?  My best guesses so far are: Old Town Discovery 160K Old Town Discovery 133K Old Town Discovery 147 (current front runner) It seems to me that Old Town makes more general purpose boats than the other manufacturers, let me know if I am wrong. Let me know what you think. Thanks a lot, Keith Hatfull Woodbury, MN

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Old Town is OK but consider a Mad River Explorer in Royalex.  They cost a bit more, but have more stability, and load carrying capacity.  They can handle any reasonable whitewater. (The first  open canoe down the Grand Canyon was Jim Shelander’s explorer. )

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If you can take the time paddle every boat that is recommended to you. I am totally biased but I don’t think you will find a better boat for your described purpose than a Dagger Sewannee. 15 feet, reasonably light, and paddles better than you will believe until you try it. Go with the three seat version and venture  into only very mild whitewater in any of this type of  boat. There should be a description at www.Dagger.com Steve Scarborough

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Question:

My sister in law is getting married. She lives in France. I’ve got to go. Cause that’s the only way they’re going to get me there! Ari Ari Bert                                        Gaelle Bert +27 (0) 83 232 9903                             +27 (0) 83 236 5308 Flyfishing Corner +27 (0) 11 447 7230                             Shop 94, Admirals Court +27 (0) 11 882 8537 (fax)                       Cnr Craddock & Tyrwhitt www.troutfishing.co.za                                Street, Rosebank P.O.Box 79067 Senderwood 2145 South Africa

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There is plenty of flyfishing in France Ari. It is quite complicated getting a licence etc.   A web search will turn up plenty of info. TL MC – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – My sister in law is getting married. She lives in France. I’ve got to go. Cause that’s the only way they’re going to get me there! Ari

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My sister in law is getting married. She lives in France.

great fishing, great fishermen. Whereabouts in France~? Tony — Tony Knox remove the bit about not spamming

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The French have a long tradition in flyfishing. The possibilities for (sea)trout depend largely on the region you’re going to, and when in case of seatrout. Be prepared for _very_, _very_ (and I’m holding back here), _very_ spooky trout. The mentioned long tradition combined with the fine French cuisine have made the bigger trout (i.e. edible size) quite hard to find. Even if you find them it will be hard to get withing casting range. The best chances are late in the evening or very early in the morning, there is no sense at all in fishing during daytime. Getting a license (permis de peche) is not so hard, although it must sound strange for Americans who are used to buy a license for an entire state. Lucky basterds. France is devided in regions, and each region sells license for their waters. Very often regions cooperate by allowing acces on certain waters for license holders for other regions, but check this carefully. Furthermore, the waters are divided in two categories, 1st and (duh) 2nd. From the top of my head 1st category (premier categorie in French) is potential(!) trout water, 2nd category anything else, like big rivers, lakes etcetera. When you buy a license, you’ll need the ‘trout stamp’ which allows you to fish the 1st category waters. Every fishing shop sells them, and if you can’t find any ask in a local ‘Tabac’. Since the French are just as avid smokers as they are fishermen they’ll most certainly be able to tell you where to buy one, or even sell you one right away. I’ve bought licenses in the most unexpected places. According to http://perso.libertysurf.fr/CANTON/ouverture/pech4.htm a holiday license (three weeks license, available from the 1st of June to 30th of Septembre) will set you back FF 150, which is about 25 USD. Outside that time slot you depend on the availability of day/week tickets, but you’ll have to figure that out with the local chaps. Don’t go out without one – you’ll have an expensive holiday if you get caught. Some tips: 1. Speaking French helps a lot. 2. Speaking French helps a lot. 3. ‘Reserve de peche’ signs in a river don’t mean reserved for fishermen. It means fish reserve – NO FISHING!! Certain areas of most rivers, mostly over a length of a hundred to a few hundred meters are kept void of fishermen in order to keep some fish in the river. You wonder where those big trout are? <g 4. Have a great time. France is a nice country outside the big cities. People are friendly, and there is some great food & wine and scenery to be enjoyed. Salut, Herman – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – My sister in law is getting married. She lives in France. I’ve got to go. Cause that’s the only way they’re going to get me there! Ari Ari Bert                                        Gaelle Bert +27 (0) 83 232 9903                             +27 (0) 83 236 5308 Flyfishing Corner +27 (0) 11 447 7230                             Shop 94, Admirals Court +27 (0) 11 882 8537 (fax)                       Cnr Craddock & Tyrwhitt www.troutfishing.co.za                          Street, Rosebank P.O.Box 79067 Senderwood 2145 South Africa

–         Cheers, Herman         Herman Nijland         Daytime webmaster         Lifetime flyfisher

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Hi Ari,   I live and fish in France and YES there is good flyfishing here.  When and where are you going? I live in the eastern part (near Geneva, Switzerland) and there are plenty of trout streams within two hours drive. However, the other regions also have good trout streams and lakes.  If you tell me where you are going I can help you to get some info. Cheers, Peter. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – My sister in law is getting married. She lives in France. I’ve got to go. Cause that’s the only way they’re going to get me there! Ari

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I will be in southern France (Bordeaux) in late September/early October. Does anyone have information on freshwater flyfishing in southern France or NOrthern Spain (Pyrenees mtns)? Thanks in advance. Alan Hanson

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I will be in southern France (Bordeaux) in late September/early October. Does anyone have information on freshwater flyfishing in southern France or NOrthern Spain (Pyrenees mtns)? Thanks in advance. Alan Hanson

Hello, I’m french even If I don’t know this area pretty well, there are very fine spot to fly fish trout in this area of france the number of the "departements" (it s french versions of states) are 64 "pyrenes atlantiques" 65 "hautes pyrennees" 66 "pyrennes orientales". You ‘ll find streams named the "nives" exemple: nive de baiguorri, etc plus they are moutain lakes stocked with browns, brooks, and even cristivomers. You may try to contact the "ministere du tourisme" in paris and ask for the "relais St Pierre" It’s a directory of french hotels everywhere in france who have special accomadation for fishermen. Hope this helps regards Gh P.s at the moment you are coming ( September/early October ) the fish will probably be closed for trouts, so be sure to check that first, if it’s not recontact me later my fishing partner is gone with the river directory of france ( a book with all the rivers listed and quoted regarding how they are stocked). —                          http://www.cortosys.fr                               Paris FRANCE                              01-46-38-06-93     "I have also seen children successfully surmounting the effects of     "an evil inheritance. That is due to purity being an inherent     "attribute of the soul."                                                      [Mahatma Gandhi]

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Question:

Has any body been to Casa Blanca fishing lodge in the Yucatan. Any Info would be greatly appeciated. Thanks  :-)

I was there in the fall of ‘95 and found it to be one of the nicer flats lodges that I have visited. Ascension Bay is a great fisheries with great wadable flats for bones. It is famous for permit and has some tarpon. They have good guides and new Dolphin skiffs with poling platforms. Our guide said that March/April was the best time for permit. April/May/June is prime time for all species. November is another time for bones and permit. We can help you make a reservation there or any other flats location you are interested in. If you have more questions you can call me at my toll free 800#. William Kiene Kiene’s Fly Shop Sacramento,CA,USA 800/4000FLY

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Has any body been to Casa Blanca fishing lodge in the Yucatan. Any Info would be greatly appeciated. Thanks  :-)

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I was there last March and am returning this year in April. I would suggest you call Frontiers at 1-800-245-1950 and ask for information. Will be glad to give u any help I can. I have no connection financially with Frontiers. I think you can also book thru Cutters, or Kaufmans on the West Coast. Their brochures are good and offer loads of info. Email me if you wish and we can set up a phone contact if you wish. Good luck. Jack

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Question:

  Which sinking line should I choose for nymph fishing in small rivers?   unless the river is really large, you don’t need a sinking at all…   TimW

Do you change for a sinking leader or will the nymph drag the leader down with it quickly enough? Peter. —  Peter Sollander, CERN ST/MC/TCR  Tel: (+41) 22.767.8081          Fax: (+41) 22.767.8910        

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  Which sinking line should I choose for nymph fishing in small rivers?   unless the river is really large, you don’t need a sinking at all…   TimW Do you change for a sinking leader or will the nymph drag the leader down with it quickly enough?

I use a long leader and split shot and fish effectively in 6+ feet of water.  One spot in particular that comes to mind.  The majority of the Roaring Fork flows between these two big rocks right in the main channel causing impressive rapids.  I would routinely wade deep right to the edge of this and nail nice ‘bows one nymphs fished deep with 5 or more BB’s right in this fast water.   My problem with sinking lines, leaders etc. is that the fly will float up from the bottom too far, unless the weight is RIGHT THERE within 6 inches or so of the bug.  A fly one or two feet off the bottom in this fast water will not catch fish. TimW For larger rivers, and some streamer applications, a Hi-speed, Hi-D Sinking tip line is WAY cool.  Dragging a big wooley behind a driftboat with a sink tip can be deadly. TimW

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: If the river is unusually fast or deep, you might want to use a sink : tip, the weight of the line depends on what your rod is rated for. The : idea is to get the nymph to bounce on the bottom once in a while. A : small split shot or some "Shape-A-Weight" on the leader can do the same : thing. True. A great time and money saver. : As far as being a beginning caster, I would get the Weight Forward (WF) : line as it is easier to put the fly where you want it. I’ve been told this often, but my experience has been that they’re really not that much easier to cast than a DT line, and DT lines turn over a mite easier. PLus, you can turn ‘em around when then get worn! –mike

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Which sinking line should I choose for nymph fishing in small rivers? DT, WF?  sinking tip? #1-#4? and what about leaders?  Sinking? Fast Sinking, Extra Fast Sinking?

If you are fishing "small rivers" I wouldn’t bother with a sinking line. You can get a fly down to the fish even with a floating line. A long leader with a small split shot or bead head  will do in most situations. I’ve been tying beads into the body of many nymphs instead of lead and find they work great. You can also add a sink tip to your line, sized to the situation. I always carry a few in different sizes just in case. If you are planning to fish a lake, or a fast, deep river then a sinking line would be handy. I carry a med. sink for lakes and time the decent. For Steehead in rivers I pack a floating, 10 ft. sink tip, and a 24 ft 325 gn. sink tip. The last line works great for strippers….but casting is kind of chuck and duck….

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For nymph fishing small rivers and creeks a floating line is generally all that is required.  For especially deep hole a weight forward would be a good choice, but in  most instances a floating line with a leader set for the depth of water, and a strike indicator, is my general set-up of choice. Clint

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writes: Which sinking line should I choose for nymph fishing in small rivers? DT, WF?  sinking tip? #1-#4? and what about leaders?  Sinking? Fast Sinking, Extra Fast Sinking? What’s a beginner’s choice Any ideas?

Hi Pete, I would not choose a sinking line for nymph fishing in most situations. The object of most nymph fishing is to get the fly to *dead drift* in the bottom 6" or so of water.  It’s very tough to dead drift a nymph on a sinking line as you have no control over the sinking line once it sinks. You are at the mercy of the currents because you can’t mend the line.  It is much more effective to fish nymphs on a floating line with a long leader because you can mend it and control the drift; and it’s especially effective to use a strike indicator to suspend the nymph exactly where you want in the water column and drift it down the current lane you choose. If you want particulars on this, drop me some e-mail & I’ll let you know how to set such a system up, along with casts to help you fish it. The place I use a full sinking line is in a lake as it allows you to swim your fly right over the top of weedbeds and structure which is very difficult to do with a floating line and a long leader.  Works well because there is no current in the lake to push your line around.  You could also use a sink tip for this though It tends to rise up a bit as you retrieve it.   A sink tip is a good choice in rivers because you can mend the belly section (the floating part) to control the sinking part.  Unfortunately it’s not real good for "dead drifts" as you need to have some tension on the line to detect the strike and if you have tension on the line you’re not getting a dead drift.  I will use a sink tip for swimming streamers across the current and also for swinging nymphs through the current to imitate a big swimming nymph (like an isonychia) or perhaps a caddis pupa (rarely but once in a while). Don’t feel you need to go out and buy all the different types of lines – floating, sinking (in 6 different densities), and sink tips (in all the different densities and about 10 or 12 different lengths).  Get a floating line and learn how to use it.  Then if you are going to fish specific conditions – such as on a lake at a depth of 10 feet deep – get the appropriate line for those conditions.  Otherwise you can go out and buy 6 different lines or more and still not have the one you need when you need it.                                          Hope this helps,                                                   Dan Dan Gracia                                                               Orvis West Coast Fly Fishing Schools If you kill that big fish you can’t catch ‘em again.  So what if they eat other fish?  If you kill the big ones there will only be little ones left (funny how that works!).

Response:

Which sinking line should I choose for nymph fishing in small rivers? DT, WF?  sinking tip? #1-#4? and what about leaders?  Sinking? Fast Sinking, Extra Fast Sinking? What’s a beginner’s choice Any ideas? Cheers,        Pete. —  Peter Sollander, CERN ST/MC/TCR  Tel: (+41) 22.767.8081          Fax: (+41) 22.767.8910        

Response:

Which sinking line should I choose for nymph fishing in small rivers?

unless the river is really large, you don’t need a sinking at all… TimW

Response:

Which sinking line should I choose for nymph fishing in small rivers?

If the river is unusually fast or deep, you might want to use a sink tip, the weight of the line depends on what your rod is rated for. The idea is to get the nymph to bounce on the bottom once in a while. A small split shot or some "Shape-A-Weight" on the leader can do the same thing. As far as being a beginning caster, I would get the Weight Forward (WF) line as it is easier to put the fly where you want it.

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Question:

So now you know you must either dress the hook with thread, or you must not.  Hmmmmm.  Well, I guess that eventually becomes a matter of personal preference.  I prefer to have a thread base whether I’m spinning the hair (as with a Muddler head) or not (as with a Try-It or Caddis).  It has been my experience that I get a bit more control. If the problem you are having is with the spinning of the hair to distribute around the hook shank, then practice is the best answer.  Use a small clump of hair, warp the thread arond the hair and hook, all the way.  Then continue over the top and down the far side.  On your way down, tighten down on the thread, and release the hair from your (usually left) hand.  This USUALLY will draw the hair around the hook. An important part of making a Muddler head is to pack the hair backwards – away from the eye of the hook, and build it up a little bunch at a time.  It is generally sufficient to push it with your thunmbnail and index finger.  Then you can trim it as you see fit after the head is all roughed in and the thread is tied off. G’Luck Bob Lundy IWFFC Mississauga

Response:

I’m a beginning tyer who has been having trouble with making muddlers.   I’m hung up on the deer hair – have been having a hard time getting the hair to make that funky head.  ANy suggestions? THanks, JOnathan Vlaming Duluth, Minnesota (woke up to -43 today, WITHOUT the windchill!!)

I think we’ve all been there. It really helps to watch someone who’s good at it. If you don’t know anyone, try getting a video. I have heard people suggest the Jimmy Nix bass bug video  but I have not watched it. The Jack Dennis video, "Tying Western Trout Flys" has some good Information on different types of hair and what they are good for. Make sure you clean out all of the fuzz and any short hairs with a comb or your scissor points. I use larger bunches of hair than most people suggest. I also leave the hook shank bare under the head area. Good luck, Jay Whitworth

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With all the good advice given, someone forgot to mention combing out the fuzz from the hair before you spin it.  You don’t have to get it all, just use a comb or scissor points or even your fingers to get most of it out.   This helps the spinning process considerably. Rob Gregoire Dallas, Tx

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I’m a beginning tyer who has been having trouble with making muddlers.   I’m hung up on the deer hair – have been having a hard time getting the hair to make that funky head.  ANy suggestions? THanks, JOnathan Vlaming Duluth, Minnesota (woke up to -43 today, WITHOUT the windchill!!)

Hi Jonathan-    A cool trick is to wet the deer hair the let it get *almost* dry. It will spin and flair with ease. OK, well almost. Trick #2 is to trim with a razor blade rather than scissors. Trick #3 is to hit the head with a butane lighter or propane torch (lightly). It will burn all the stray hair even with the base head. Trick #4, have your wife tie it.    Tight heads, Ralph —

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With all the good advice given, someone forgot to mention combing out the fuzz from the hair before you spin it.  You don’t have to get it all, just use a comb or scissor points or even your fingers to get most of it out.   This helps the spinning process considerably. Rob Gregoire Dallas, Tx

Take a run down to your local drug store, go to the cosmetics section and pick up an eyebrow comb… I got the one with metal teeth… real tight and does a great job on removing the fuzz from deer hair.

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The hair you select is important.  Choose hair that is not brittle, such as coastal hair.  Spin it with a soft loop, then a tighter loop and finally a tight loop.  The last loop should spin the hair.  Pack it tight and start again until you get the head you are looking for.  Spinning hair is not easy to learn. I suggest you rent a good video or take a leson. Good luck!

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Take a run down to your local drug store, go to the cosmetics section and pick up an eyebrow comb… I got the one with metal teeth… real tight and does a great job on removing the fuzz from deer hair.

Might also show up under the moniker of "mustache comb".  I use one (for fly tying) and am able to report it works quite well! Charley

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With all the good advice given, someone forgot to mention combing out the fuzz from the hair before you spin it.  You don’t have to get it all, just use a comb or scissor points or even your fingers to get most of it out.   This helps the spinning process considerably. Rob Gregoire Dallas, Tx Take a run down to your local drug store, go to the cosmetics section and pick up an eyebrow comb… I got the one with metal teeth… real tight and does a great job on removing the fuzz from deer hair.

Static electricity is also a problem when working with any animal hair.   I use Static Guard to remove that problem.  You can find it in most super markets in the detergent/soap area. Good Luck Al Beatty BT’s Fly Fishing Products Bozeman, MT (catalog avail)

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Recently viewed two videos by Chris Helm (Hooked on Fly Tying series). Chris answers most questions one could have about stacking and spinning deer hair.  Also, Dave Whitlock’s video on bass flies is quite a work. Between them, a tyer should have no trouble tying deer hair patterns for trout or bass.   VA Angler

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I’ve enjoyed reading about various  techniques to improve spinning deer hair.  Has anyone tried STACKING deer hair?    I prefer this method over spinning. It allows me to segment the color of the bass bug I’m tying (white underneath, green on top).   You can create a very realistic fly.  Comments?

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writes: Has anyone tried STACKING deer hair?    I prefer this method over spinning. It allows me to segment the color of the bass bug I’m tying (white underneath, green on top).   You can create a very realistic fly.  Comments?

As the saying goes,"You Betcha!"  You can see some good examples of the technique on Jimmy Nix’s Tying Bass Flies or Dave Whitlock’s 2 tape set. If you get a chance to see Mark Hoesner (sp?) at any of the shows, stop and watch as he is amazing.                                          Dan Dan Gracia                                                               Orvis West Coast Fly Fishing Schools If you kill that big fish you can’t catch ‘em again.  So what if they eat other fish?  If you kill the big ones there will only be little ones left (funny how that works!).

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Just as a side note… Deer hair isn’t really hollow, its more a function of the number of air pockets that are in the hair. The hair on the back of the animal is less "hollow" than on the belly due to this feature of air pockets. I find that the belly hair is better for bass bug bodies and the back hair is better for collars. I really stay away from deer hair for caddis and use elk hair because even the worst deer hair still flares too much for my taste. Charles (Chuck) Abbott      The MITRE Corporation "There is not a single blackfly in the Adirondacks. All are married and have large families." Henry Wells

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Both of the other posters have given excellent advise. If however, you still have trouble, get this video- "Tying Bass flies with Jimmy Nix". The man REALLY knows how to teach it. Good luck. — Phil Koenig Manhattan Custom Tackle Ltd. http://fishdoc.com./ "I’m the boss,so WHATEVER I say is OK"

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’m a beginning tyer who has been having trouble with making muddlers.   I’m hung up on the deer hair – have been having a hard time getting the hair to make that funky head.  ANy suggestions? THanks, JOnathan Vlaming Duluth, Minnesota (woke up to -43 today, WITHOUT the windchill!!) OK, first pay close attention to the deer hair you’re using. The deer hair must be hollow, that crucial. You can try your deer hair when you push with your finger nail onto some deer hairs. If they spread very well -use it, if not- use it for deer hair caddis. BTW, the best hair for spinning is Caribou, try it (especially if you start tying Irresistibles). Another problem might be the thread – If you change from 8/0 to 6/0 you will less likely break the tread. I usually wind a base of thread before I spin the deer hair (before you start spinning the deer hair make one half hitch just in case you brake the tread). Take a small (!) bunch of deer hair, hold it onto the hook and make one tread turn and then pull it tight and make another turn exactly on top of the first- the deer hair will spread around the hook. Push the hair bach to the shank and make one half hitch (just in case you break the tread) and tie in the next bunch of Caribou. After you spinned enough deer hair whip finish (or make two half hitches- you can do the latter faster and it is equaly stable). Trim the hair with a razor blade. I don’t use a hair stacker for the deer hair (for the first bunch of deer hair you can if you like). I usually take a bunch and take out very long hairs, then I hold the bunch at the tip and pull out very short hairs and underfur. That is simply faster and it looks more natural to me. If you tie in the deer hair close to the base it spinns easier! Hope that helps               Thomas

Forgot to mention two things: The best introduction how to work with deer hair is probably in the WESTERN FLY TYING MANUAL VOL. II b= y Jack Dennis (revised edition!). One tip of Jack is: tie at least on dozen of each fly, with tying only two or three you won’t get = it- don’t be frustrated (I can confirm by myself, it works only this way: tie at least one or two dozen- the only way to get real go= od flies and to improve speed).                   Thomas – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – ——                                         /                       Harvard University                                                / Institute for Molecular and Cellular Biology                     / 16 Divinity Ave.                                                / Cambridge, MA 02138                                            / Tel: (USA) 617 495 3716                                       / Fax:  (USA)  617 495 9300                                 O  /                                                          |_/o                                                        / | _______

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I had the same hangup when I started.  I found that the thread and packer were key to success with deer hair.  First, a good strong thread (kevlar if you can afford the bulk) was critical for me as a beginner.  A descent packer helped, too – especially when using the heavier threads.  Lastly, try trimming with a razor if you’re not doing so already.  I’ve found the razor yeilds a much better shape when all is said and done. — Ray Anderson Fall River MA  USA "Imagination is more important than knowledge." –  Albert Einstein

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I’m a beginning tyer who has been having trouble with making muddlers.   I’m hung up on the deer hair – have been having a hard time getting the hair to make that funky head.  ANy suggestions? THanks, JOnathan Vlaming Duluth, Minnesota (woke up to -43 today, WITHOUT the windchill!!)

OK, first pay close attention to the deer hair you’re using. The deer hair must be hollow, that crucial. You can try your deer hair when you push with your finger nail onto some deer hairs. If they spread very well -use it, if not- use it for deer hair caddis. BTW, the best hair for spinning is Caribou, try it (especially if you start tying Irresistibles). Another problem might be the thread – If you change from 8/0 to 6/0 you will less likely break the tread. I usually wind a base of thread before I spin the deer hair (before you start spinning the deer hair make one half hitch just in case you brake the tread). Take a small (!) bunch of deer hair, hold it onto the hook and make one tread turn and then pull it tight and make another turn exactly on top of the first- the deer hair will spread around the hook. Push the hair bach to the shank and make one half hitch (just in case you break the tread) and tie in the next bunch of Caribou. After you spinned enough deer hair whip finish (or make two half hitches- you can do the latter faster and it is equaly stable). Trim the hair with a razor blade. I don’t use a hair stacker for the deer hair (for the first bunch of deer hair you can if you like). I usually take a bunch and take out very long hairs, then I hold the bunch at the tip and pull out very short hairs and underfur. That is simply faster and it looks more natural to me. If you tie in the deer hair close to the base it spinns easier! Hope that helps                Thomas ——                                          /                       Harvard University                                                / Institute for Molecular and Cellular Biology                     / 16 Divinity Ave.                                                / Cambridge, MA 02138                                            / Tel: (USA) 617 495 3716                                       / Fax:  (USA)  617 495 9300                                 O  /                                                           |_/o                                                         / | _______

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I’m a beginning tyer who has been having trouble with making muddlers.   I’m hung up on the deer hair – have been having a hard time getting the hair to make that funky head.  ANy suggestions? THanks, JOnathan Vlaming Duluth, Minnesota (woke up to -43 today, WITHOUT the windchill!!)

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Try Fly & Field at http://www.flyfield.com. e-mail them and ask about Chris Helm’s deer hair products. He sorts the various hair from various species to get you just the stuff you need for the particular job. Todd

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I’m a beginning tyer who has been having trouble with making muddlers.   I’m hung up on the deer hair – have been having a hard time getting the hair to make that funky head.  ANy suggestions?

Practice if necessary with thread strong enough never to break; and be sure to comb out all fluff from hair butts first. Place a pinch (no more than will fit in a .22 shell case) of aligned hair across the naked hook shank (i.e. no thread base at all) and secure with two loose turns of thread.  Then pull gradually but quite hard, to spin thread around the hook while you tighten. If OK, keep tension on thread while you shove everything rearward with thumbnail(s) — not too much — and then spin on some more.  Only experience will indicate how much hair to use.  Sparse heads sink better, massive heads float better. — |  Donald Phillipson, 4180 Boundary Road, Carlsbad Springs,  | |        Ontario, Canada, K0A 1K0, tel. 613 822 0734         |

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Hi, I see another person steered you toward Chris Helm — he did you a real favour.  Chris has some great hair and you can reach him at 419-474-2348. His business is called White Tail Supplies or something like that. Just tell Chris what you need the hair for and he will make sure you get the right stuff. A tip: If you decide to go to a fly shop instead of calling Chris be sure to look for hair (in the packages, of course) that is basically light grey rather than dark grey.  The light grey hair will spin into a very nice muddler head BUT the dark grey hair will NOT. Good Luck! Al Beatty

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donald thanks for the advise as I am haveing the same problem. I am new to fly tying, and fishing, I just started flyfishing here in northern alberta, some very good streams, just have to learn how to catch some fish keith wyman

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Question:

If you are on the north end of town, or maybe even if you are not, call the St. Vrain Angler in Longmont, 651-6061. — Ken Clark Ft. Lupton, CO

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Hi Craig, There are several good shops in Denver including the Orvis shop in the downtown area close to the convestion center.  I’m not sure which street it’s on. Also consider contacting the Federation of Fly Fishers, they have an active club in your area called the High Plains Drifters.  You could learn more about them by calling the FFF Council President for that area. His name is Dan Turner, he’s a good guy, and he lives in Thornton.  His number is 1-303-457-4248. Good Luck Al Beatty BT’s Fly Fishing Product Bozeman, MT (catalog avail)

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I’m looking for some recommendations on good fly fishing ships in Denver.

<SNIP If you’re on the South side of town there’s Angler’s All, on S. Sante Fe, Royal Stevens on Hampden, and Complete Angler on Arapahoe (?). They’re all pretty good, and if you get into R Stevens tell Steve I said Hi!. </chaz

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Hollenbaugh) writes: I’m looking for some recommendations on good fly fishing ships in Denver. I’m a beginner, and I’m looking for a reputable shop that has classes, trips, and most importantly people willing to help transform a novice spinning rod guy into a fly fisherman. TIA KRU Consulting Group                http://rainbow.rmii.com/~csh/kru

Craig,     Two shops come to mind:     The Colorado Angler on West Wadsworth at Nelson (I think).  They are nice people (just a touch of elitism, but only a touch).  The second is Joe Butler’s All Tackle west of the Westminister Mall.  Seems to be a nice place; lots of material.  (Some attitude, but it is tolerable.  It just depends)     There, of course, are others.  There is one on the south side, but I can’t remember the name which is probably the best of the lot. Unfortunately, I can’t remember the name.  If I do, I’ll get back to you.

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I’m looking for some recommendations on good fly fishing ships in Denver. I’m a beginner, and I’m looking for a reputable shop that has classes, trips, and most importantly people willing to help transform a novice spinning rod guy into a fly fisherman. TIA KRU Consulting Group            http://rainbow.rmii.com/~csh/kru

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  I’m looking for some recommendations on good fly fishing ships in Denver.   I’m a beginner, and I’m looking for a reputable shop that has classes,   trips, and most importantly people willing to help transform a novice   spinning rod guy into a fly fisherman.   TIA   KRU Consulting Group          http://rainbow.rmii.com/~csh/kru Go see Len or Darryl at "The Troutfisher" on Parker Rd. IMO, they have the

best selection of equipment and fly-tying materials in the area. Denver, Colorado                ftp.rmii.com/pub2/gwgodden

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Question:

I have a short list of about a dozen fishing books (mostly fly fishing) these are out-of-print or first edition copies.  If you collect books on fishing, or just love to read about it (you probably do if you are on this list)  you might enjoy my occasional lists of sporting books. Thank you for reading. David Holloway

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Iam looking for a copy of "the compleat angler"can you help. nav9200

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Question:

I’m going to have to buy some stocking foot chest waders soon. I fly fish mostly in rivers in the northeast (New York state, eastern Ontario, western Quebec), so the water temp isn’t a problem.  Any suggestions?  Do I need the 5mm ones, or would 3mm be heavy enough? How much should I expect to pay ($US) for waders and boots? Thanks – Tim

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writes: I bought some great ones from LL Bean, around $150 bucks.  I think they are the 5mm, which will also be more tear resistant than the thinner ones, and you never know when you might go someplace colder.

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writes: I bought some 5mm chest waders from Cabella’s for about $90 about 3 years ago.  I use them for all types of fishing, including rock picking abalone on the west coast near Petaluma where I live.  They have held up quite well for the stress my 240 lbs. put them thru.

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writes: I do a little steelhead fishing throughout the winter,  I have never felt that the insulated waders I wear were too warm…I suggest  the 5mm if you plan to join me this november steelheading.

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