Question:

It sounds like that fish needed to be caught like he needed a hole in his head!!! ARG… Eric

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – This summer, I either caught or witnessed being caught the same fish 7 different times from the same pool, once each on 7 different fishing trips. The trout had a very unique circular hole in its head, looked like it had been pecked at by a heron. Every visit I made to that pool, either on my own, with a friend, or with a client, resulted in that same fish getting caught. Tim Lysyk timlysyk at telus dot net

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<SNIP. Now the real dilemma. What to do with a dead fish right in front of our campsite knowing that there’s a griz in the area. I slid it back into the water and had a sleepless night.

Its only a dead fish.  There are a lot of other reasons for sleepless nights. Few of them have to do with fish. TL MC

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I don’t have a story to add, but I wanted to write-in to say that this is a darned interesting thread. Keep them coming. Memphis Jim

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – recent threads…. what is the strangest, perhaps the weirdest trout you have caught on the fly? one that always amuses me, and provides fond memories, is a brookie that was taken on up high on the spine of grandfather mountain, up high on boone’s fork… a few years ago… i approached the curvaceous body with eager anticipation. every nerve on edge, every move forsaken, every breath…. well, bated. the body of my desire being that of waterworn, finely sanded granite, obviously the design of a female god…. hence the sexuality….. and obviously, the desire to fondle the trout that lay at the artistic granitic turn in the clear pristine waters beneath the ever-present, prevalent growth of rhododendron. a few here at roff have fished this forlorn yet gorgeous pool…. i have taken them there…. i digress… the cast was adequate. the tippet turned over to present the fly. it stuck….. adhered in a spider’s web strung between some low-riding rhodo branches….  the fly dangling about six inches above the surface of the crisp cool mountain water. shit. i’m flummoxed as to how to loosen the fly without spooking the fish i just know is residing below. i try a soft twitch of my rod, transmitting a soft and gentle energy via the line to the leader, through the hewn tippet knots, onward, ever so craftily to the tippet. the fly sveltely dances, as it precariously dangles from the web…. but does not dislodge. whoosh…. sweet baby jesus…. a take. the brookie has leapt from the depths like a submarine launched missile and taken the fly. once hooked, the darling was brought to hand rather easily, as he was shy of a foot by a few inches. i have never caught a trout like that again, but whenever i see a spider web spun close to the water, i try to recreate the –waldo

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While the legal requirement to return a mortally wounded fish if it’s undersized, or caught in a C&R area, or otherwise "illegal" to keep seems nonsensical at first, but the reason is logical and actually rather obvious. Without the requirement, it would be impossible to enforce the regulations. Also, like Ken and and Jim point out, it also doesn’t do any great harm (although I’m pretty sure Tbone is extremely offended by the practice). I will very occasionally keep a doomed fish caught in C&R waters, but only when I’m damned sure I won’t be caught with it. It does feel somehow ethically wrong to release it, even if it’s legally right.

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  I’ve thought about this a bit since it happened. My first thought was   that it’s pretty damn silly to "waste" a fish that’s already dead   regardless of Park regulations to the contrary. Why not just fry it up   and eat it, especially since putting it back could be considered tempting   fate in grizzly country. But I’ve come around to the position that   considering ME not eating the fish to be the equivalent of "wasting" the   fish is wrongheaded. There are many organisms, from the microscopic to the   aforementioned griz that would consider that carcass a feast. I did the   right thing.   For me, it’s a tough call. Fish dying and returning to the ecosystem is how they evolved, but not returning fish that were killed by angling. I think it’s a weakness of C&R regulation. I think you should keep and eat a fish that’s badly hooked, but like RW said, if that were allowed the regulation would be unenforceable. Willi

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My wife and I fished with a guide in Maine last year. We both made it clear that we were C&R only – something the guide practiced as well. My wife hooked a 10" Brookie as we sailed through some white water. No way to stop, we could only drag the fish behind us. By the time we were through, the rapids had gotten the best of the little Brookie (that and the fact that the fish had taken the fly very deeply for some reason). Then the debate was on – do we keep the little guy (he was under the size limit as I recall) illegally and at least he serves some purpose, or put him back to float down stream. Decided quickly to return him to the ecology. Plenty of things feasted on him. Never regreted it a bit. Course, not the same as a 22" Cutty, but I don’t believe it would have changed my decision. I’m with you Ken. Jim Ray

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – … What to do with a dead fish … Shoulda kept it in your tent. Unethical. I’ve thought about this a bit since it happened. My first thought was that it’s pretty damn silly to "waste" a fish that’s already dead regardless of Park regulations to the contrary. Why not just fry it up and eat it, especially since putting it back could be considered tempting fate in grizzly country. But I’ve come around to the position that considering ME not eating the fish to be the equivalent of "wasting" the fish is wrongheaded. There are many organisms, from the microscopic to the aforementioned griz that would consider that carcass a feast. I did the right thing. — Ken Fortenberry

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… What to do with a dead fish … Shoulda kept it in your tent.

Unethical. I’ve thought about this a bit since it happened. My first thought was that it’s pretty damn silly to "waste" a fish that’s already dead regardless of Park regulations to the contrary. Why not just fry it up and eat it, especially since putting it back could be considered tempting fate in grizzly country. But I’ve come around to the position that considering ME not eating the fish to be the equivalent of "wasting" the fish is wrongheaded. There are many organisms, from the microscopic to the aforementioned griz that would consider that carcass a feast. I did the right thing. — Ken Fortenberry

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Now the real dilemma. What to do with a dead fish right in front of our campsite knowing that there’s a griz in the area. I slid it back into the water and had a sleepless night.

Shoulda kept it in your tent.

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recent threads…. what is the strangest, perhaps the weirdest trout you have caught on the fly? …

Slough Creek circa 1980 something, I caught a 22" cutthroat and when I brought it to hand the hopper was impaled on the OUTSIDE of the gill plate. I went to pluck it off only to realize that the fish had inhaled the hopper. The fly had gone in its mouth, out the gills, and then attached itself to the outside. Needless to say, when I plucked at the fly the tippet, which was still in the fishes mouth, sliced through the gills. A bloody mess and I knew I had a dead fish on my hands. My wife, who is normally off doing photography while I fish, was looking on because she was afraid to get off by herself. The rangers had warned us about a female griz in the area. I had to sheepishly admit that I’d killed the fish despite my rather pompous pontificating about C&R around the campfire the night before. Now the real dilemma. What to do with a dead fish right in front of our campsite knowing that there’s a griz in the area. I slid it back into the water and had a sleepless night. — Ken Fortenberry

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recent threads…. what is the strangest, perhaps the weirdest trout you have caught on the fly?

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Almost caught…. I was fishing on the N.F. Clearwater below Kelly Forks, casting across a deep pool to a little riff, up comes a 6 inch rainbow. I started pulling the little guy toward me and it dove down about 10 feet away, all of the sudden this 6 inch rainbow was stripping line off my reel. I fought the fish for a few minutes and got it within sight. A bull trout had latched onto the side of the rainbow, I pulled the two fish up and tried to net them, as I went down with the net and the bull trout let go. I stood there with a puzzled look on my face explaining the story to my friend down the way. During out conversation the 6 inch trout was up at the surface swimming around, once again the bull trout came back and latched on. I fought the pair, this time almost netting the fish. Wish I had, the bull trout looked to be in the 25 inch range. I release the rainbow, he seemed to be okay despite the teeth marks in his side. I had read a similar story however, never thought I would experience it first hand.

Had a customer hook a 14" cutthroat on the Blackfoot once. As he was bringing it in a very large pike took the trout and held on for a good ten minutes. We worked him into an eddy but couldn’t even begin to get him even half into the net (which will hold fish in the 18" to 22" range without difficulty). He finally let go after several attempts just to scoop him up onto the bank. We didn’t want to scoop him into the inflatable raft we were drifting in. The trout was trashed but, due to catch-and-release regs, we had to release it. — Tight Lines! Brian D. Nelson Diamond N Outfitters, Missoula, Montana www.diamondnoutfitters.com

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This summer, I either caught or witnessed being caught the same fish 7 different times from the same pool, once each on 7 different fishing trips. The trout had a very unique circular hole in its head, looked like it had been pecked at by a heron. Every visit I made to that pool, either on my own, with a friend, or with a client, resulted in that same fish getting caught. Tim Lysyk timlysyk at telus dot net

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— Fly fishing is the most fun you can have … standing up.   Greg

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – recent threads…. what is the strangest, perhaps the weirdest trout you have caught on the fly? one that always amuses me, and provides fond memories, is a brookie that was taken on up high on the spine of grandfather mountain, up high on boone’s fork… a few years ago… i approached the curvaceous body with eager anticipation. every nerve on edge, every move forsaken, every breath…. well, bated. the body of my desire being that of waterworn, finely sanded granite, obviously the design of a female god…. hence the sexuality….. and obviously, the desire to fondle the trout that lay at the artistic granitic turn in the clear pristine waters beneath the ever-present, prevalent growth of rhododendron. a few here at roff have fished this forlorn yet gorgeous pool…. i have taken them there…. i digress… the cast was adequate. the tippet turned over to present the fly. it stuck….. adhered in a spider’s web strung between some low-riding rhodo branches….  the fly dangling about six inches above the surface of the crisp cool mountain water. shit. i’m flummoxed as to how to loosen the fly without spooking the fish i just know is residing below. i try a soft twitch of my rod, transmitting a soft and gentle energy via the line to the leader, through the hewn tippet knots, onward, ever so craftily to the tippet. the fly sveltely dances, as it precariously dangles from the web…. but does not dislodge. whoosh…. sweet baby jesus…. a take. the brookie has leapt from the depths like a submarine launched missile and taken the fly. once hooked, the darling was brought to hand rather easily, as he was shy of a foot by a few inches. i have never caught a trout like that again, but whenever i see a spider web spun close to the water, i try to recreate the –waldo

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is that what they call guiness out yer way? ;^) –waldo

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snip< i have never caught a trout like that again, but whenever i see a spider web spun close to the water, i try to recreate the

You recreated the scene nicely IMHO.  :-) Joe F.

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – recent threads…. what is the strangest, perhaps the weirdest trout you have caught on the fly? one that always amuses me, and provides fond memories, is a brookie that was taken on up high on the spine of grandfather mountain, up high on boone’s fork… a few years ago… i approached the curvaceous body with eager anticipation. every nerve on edge, every move forsaken, every breath…. well, bated. the body of my desire being that of waterworn, finely sanded granite, obviously the design of a female god…. hence the sexuality….. and obviously, the desire to fondle the trout that lay at the artistic granitic turn in the clear pristine waters beneath the ever-present, prevalent growth of rhododendron. a few here at roff have fished this forlorn yet gorgeous pool…. i have taken them there…. i digress… the cast was adequate. the tippet turned over to present the fly. it stuck….. adhered in a spider’s web strung between some low-riding rhodo branches….  the fly dangling about six inches above the surface of the crisp cool mountain water. shit. i’m flummoxed as to how to loosen the fly without spooking the fish i just know is residing below. i try a soft twitch of my rod, transmitting a soft and gentle energy via the line to the leader, through the hewn tippet knots, onward, ever so craftily to the tippet. the fly sveltely dances, as it precariously dangles from the web…. but does not dislodge. whoosh…. sweet baby jesus…. a take. the brookie has leapt from the depths like a submarine launched missile and taken the fly. once hooked, the darling was brought to hand rather easily, as he was shy of a foot by a few inches. i have never caught a trout like that again, but whenever i see a spider web spun close to the water, i try to recreate the –waldo

This shouldn’t count, but I was fishing a sulfur nymph, and got caught on bottom.  When I checked the hook after I got it unstuck, there was a natural sulfur nymph nicely threaded on the hook — Scott Reverse first field of address to reply

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I also caught the same fish that previously broke off but it wasn’t a trout but a pike.  I was fishing for trout though.  I got my fly back  when I caught the pike again. Next best one is my son caught a fish (cutthroat)  that was attached to a bait fisherman’s bobber (without the bait fisherman) that was swimming around the lake.  He used his fly rod to snag the bobber and bring the fish in. Eric

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – about a 15 inch pod Bow at Silver Creek He ate the exact same pattern I had broken off in his mouth about 5, no more than 10 minutes earlier … the fly was still there and a unique pattern, so I’m sure it was the same fish. I was very surprised that he was still feeding, let alone that he would take the same fly … he broke off after a decent fight, and I figured he was sulking somewhere.. Ditto, a small brown on the Onion just outside Sheboygan, WI.  Took a Pass Lake and broke me off under a bridge just as we started fishing. Coming back an hour and a half later, I got my fly back. Stranger still (though by no means all that rare….in some waters anyway) are the brookies that pounce from the sky.  DAMNED hard to get used to! Wolfgang

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Very detailed writing….ever consider writing for Penthouse?  :) The weirdest thing I’ve caught with a fly is,… well…, my brother. Double weird, considering he is a major league entaphobic.  "It kinda makes it worse when you keep slapping the damn thing like it is alive." Twice on the same lake I caught two bass on a bait with two treble hooks. And once, on the same lake, I caught a bass by it being "lipped" between the split ring of the lure and the lure’s diving lip. Scott

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – recent threads…. what is the strangest, perhaps the weirdest trout you have caught on the fly? one that always amuses me, and provides fond memories, is a brookie that was taken on up high on the spine of grandfather mountain, up high on boone’s fork… a few years ago… i approached the curvaceous body with eager anticipation. every nerve on edge, every move forsaken, every breath…. well, bated. the body of my desire being that of waterworn, finely sanded granite, obviously the design of a female god…. hence the sexuality….. and obviously, the desire to fondle the trout that lay at the artistic granitic turn in the clear pristine waters beneath the ever-present, prevalent growth of rhododendron. a few here at roff have fished this forlorn yet gorgeous pool…. i have taken them there…. i digress… the cast was adequate. the tippet turned over to present the fly. it stuck….. adhered in a spider’s web strung between some low-riding rhodo branches….  the fly dangling about six inches above the surface of the crisp cool mountain water. shit. i’m flummoxed as to how to loosen the fly without spooking the fish i just know is residing below. i try a soft twitch of my rod, transmitting a soft and gentle energy via the line to the leader, through the hewn tippet knots, onward, ever so craftily to the tippet. the fly sveltely dances, as it precariously dangles from the web…. but does not dislodge. whoosh…. sweet baby jesus…. a take. the brookie has leapt from the depths like a submarine launched missile and taken the fly. once hooked, the darling was brought to hand rather easily, as he was shy of a foot by a few inches. i have never caught a trout like that again, but whenever i see a spider web spun close to the water, i try to recreate the –waldo

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Almost caught…. I was fishing on the N.F. Clearwater below Kelly Forks, casting across a deep pool to a little riff, up comes a 6 inch rainbow. I started pulling the little guy toward me and it dove down about 10 feet away, all of the sudden this 6 inch rainbow was stripping line off my reel. I fought the fish for a few minutes and got it within sight. A bull trout had latched onto the side of the rainbow, I pulled the two fish up and tried to net them, as I went down with the net and the bull trout let go. I stood there with a puzzled look on my face explaining the story to my friend down the way. During out conversation the 6 inch trout was up at the surface swimming around, once again the bull trout came back and latched on. I fought the pair, this time almost netting the fish. Wish I had, the bull trout looked to be in the 25 inch range. I release the rainbow, he seemed to be okay despite the teeth marks in his side. I had read a similar story however, never thought I would experience it first hand. JRT – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – recent threads…. what is the strangest, perhaps the weirdest trout you have caught on the fly? one that always amuses me, and provides fond memories, is a brookie that was taken on up high on the spine of grandfather mountain, up high on boone’s fork… a few years ago… i approached the curvaceous body with eager anticipation. every nerve on edge, every move forsaken, every breath…. well, bated. the body of my desire being that of waterworn, finely sanded granite, obviously the design of a female god…. hence the sexuality….. and obviously, the desire to fondle the trout that lay at the artistic granitic turn in the clear pristine waters beneath the ever-present, prevalent growth of rhododendron. a few here at roff have fished this forlorn yet gorgeous pool…. i have taken them there…. i digress… the cast was adequate. the tippet turned over to present the fly. it stuck….. adhered in a spider’s web strung between some low-riding rhodo branches….  the fly dangling about six inches above the surface of the crisp cool mountain water. shit. i’m flummoxed as to how to loosen the fly without spooking the fish i just know is residing below. i try a soft twitch of my rod, transmitting a soft and gentle energy via the line to the leader, through the hewn tippet knots, onward, ever so craftily to the tippet. the fly sveltely dances, as it precariously dangles from the web…. but does not dislodge. whoosh…. sweet baby jesus…. a take. the brookie has leapt from the depths like a submarine launched missile and taken the fly. once hooked, the darling was brought to hand rather easily, as he was shy of a foot by a few inches. i have never caught a trout like that again, but whenever i see a spider web spun close to the water, i try to recreate the –waldo

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recent threads…. what is the strangest, perhaps the weirdest trout you have caught on the fly?

Walt, The weirdest trout I ever caught was a pike  =) To make short sentence, like the above, a bit longer story: I had noticed a feeding trout picking spent spinners on the neck of a riffle for about five minutes. This was in Savar Creek outside Umea in northern Sweden. After seing the trout rise for its fifth or sixth time I decided to give it a try. The trout looked as if it could be of some nicer size and I did everything I could to get it right. After a diagonal downstream cast with a reach mend I saw the fish rise and take my fly. I striked and felt a heavy weight at the end of my line. To my surprise the initial rush that so often comes when hooking trout was totally absent. I called out to my friend Fred that I had hooked a relly nice trout, but that it was acting a bit strange. Fred, who of course got interested, hurried over to watch the fight. I shouldn’t have called out to him……he makes me eat my words every now and then, and if I actually do hook a trout he usually makes remarks about a lb3 pike ( /Roger

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recent threads…. what is the strangest, perhaps the weirdest trout you have caught on the fly? one that always amuses me, and provides fond memories, is a brookie that was taken on up high on the spine of grandfather mountain, up high on boone’s fork… a few years ago… i approached the curvaceous body with eager anticipation. every nerve on edge, every move forsaken, every breath…. well, bated. the body of my desire being that of waterworn, finely sanded granite, obviously the design of a female god…. hence the sexuality….. and obviously, the desire to fondle the trout that lay at the artistic granitic turn in the clear pristine waters beneath the ever-present, prevalent growth of rhododendron. a few here at roff have fished this forlorn yet gorgeous pool…. i have taken them there…. i digress… the cast was adequate. the tippet turned over to present the fly. it stuck….. adhered in a spider’s web strung between some low-riding rhodo branches….  the fly dangling about six inches above the surface of the crisp cool mountain water. shit. i’m flummoxed as to how to loosen the fly without spooking the fish i just know is residing below. i try a soft twitch of my rod, transmitting a soft and gentle energy via the line to the leader, through the hewn tippet knots, onward, ever so craftily to the tippet. the fly sveltely dances, as it precariously dangles from the web…. but does not dislodge. whoosh…. sweet baby jesus…. a take. the brookie has leapt from the depths like a submarine launched missile and taken the fly. once hooked, the darling was brought to hand rather easily, as he was shy of a foot by a few inches. i have never caught a trout like that again, but whenever i see a spider web spun close to the water, i try to recreate the –waldo

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recent threads…. [slightly disturbing scenic snipped] i digress… the cast was adequate. the tippet turned over to present the fly. it stuck….. adhered in a spider’s web strung between some low-riding rhodo branches….  the fly dangling about six inches above the surface of the crisp cool mountain water.

A nymph under a Royal Wulff, a backwater edged with grassy tussocks, the flys just beyond one in the water one over it, a fish rose to the Wulff missed, landed on the tippett with the nymph dropper, flipped the nymph over its back and caught the tippett in the bend. This noose tightened on the fish behind the pecs and in front of the dorsal. My first and probably last lassooed fish – don’t do droppers much now. Steve (Look ma! no hands!)

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about a 15 inch pod Bow at Silver Creek He ate the exact same pattern I had broken off in his mouth about 5, no more than 10 minutes earlier … the fly was still there and a unique pattern, so I’m sure it was the same fish. I was very surprised that he was still feeding, let alone that he would take the same fly … he broke off after a decent fight, and I figured he was sulking somewhere.. —–= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =—– http://www.newsfeeds.com – The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! —–==  Over 80,000 Newsgroups – 16 Different Servers! =—–

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about a 15 inch pod Bow at Silver Creek He ate the exact same pattern I had broken off in his mouth about 5, no more than 10 minutes earlier … the fly was still there and a unique pattern, so I’m sure it was the same fish. I was very surprised that he was still feeding, let alone that he would take the same fly … he broke off after a decent fight, and I figured he was sulking somewhere..

Ditto, a small brown on the Onion just outside Sheboygan, WI.  Took a Pass Lake and broke me off under a bridge just as we started fishing. Coming back an hour and a half later, I got my fly back. Stranger still (though by no means all that rare….in some waters anyway) are the brookies that pounce from the sky.  DAMNED hard to get used to! Wolfgang

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anyway) are the brookies that pounce from the sky.  DAMNED hard to get used to! Wolfgang

dang …not a trout …but was a fly trying to shoot a small hair Bass bug under a bush tight to the bank I missed and the bug hung up in the bush … I fiddled and fiddled trying to get it loose.  It was "weedless" and I moved it from limb to limb.  It was a good foot out of the water …. when a Bass came out and grabbed it <g not a big Bass but it made me shout and whoop ( and I hate it when guys shout when they hookup, very annoying   —–= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =—– http://www.newsfeeds.com – The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! —–==  Over 80,000 Newsgroups – 16 Different Servers! =—–

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recent threads…. what is the strangest, perhaps the weirdest trout you have caught on the fly?

a few The Greediest – on Snowbird using the NC dry, dropper, I had a nice brookie on the dry and as I lift and reach for him, he wiggles off the dry, drops into the water only to be lifted back out by the dropper stuck firmly inside his jaw.  The greedy little bugger had taken the dropper on the way up to the dry. The Ugliest – A brown on Penns of about 14" whose lower jaw had been broken at the point early in its life and it had grown into an "X". The Best Jumper – A baby steelie of about 8" that I noticed jumping and taking mayflies on the wing.  I stood upstream and upwind of him, letting the dry bounce around in the wind – he leapt clean out of the water and took it. The Most Persistent – A Grand River brown of about 12" who chased, swirled and missed my mini-brown three times, covering the full width of the pool in his chase, only to be hooked on his fourth lunge. The Fastest – That JATO equipped steelie at Altmar. No sex in the pool though.   Damn southern guys get all the sexy pools.  :( Peter Visit The Streamer Page at http://www.mountaincable.net/~pcharles/streamers/index.html

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Question:

I live in Utah and i am wondering what the best fly to use is. I Am fishing provo river and Hobble creek.  What would be the best fly to use for fishing lakes.  I have fished Scofeild and electric lake.  if you could help me i would appriciate it.

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I live in Utah and i am wondering what the best fly to use is.

The one that catches fish. Sorry, couldn’t resist

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As long as your muffler bearings have not gunkulated your framistat it is fairly harmless. TL MC — "In order to achieve what is possible, one must constantly attempt the impossible" http://www.mikeconnor.de

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I just can not wait to see the Fortenberry tartan !  Make sure you get photos ! TL MC — "In order to achieve what is possible, one must constantly attempt the impossible" http://www.mikeconnor.de

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Yeah, OK, so you’re justified in dropping an F-bomb on a guy for a first-time mistake.

You don’t read so well, first-time I said, and I quote: Try to learn a little something about the forum before you come barging in with a bunch of bullshit. It’s called netiquette and you’re in dire need of it. Now tell me why it is again that you called Vern a clueless idiot.

I called Vern a clueless idiot for the obvious reason. — Ken Fortenberry

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Mr. Dreamer,  the post from your grandson was loaded with potentially dangerous and extremely annoying features, dumping cookies, starting browsers, filling screens with HTML code,  initiating auto-dial-ups, etc. This is a very bad thing to do.  When I opened the post I got very alarmed at all the things it did before I could do anything to stop it.  It shot my machine down, and I was obliged to do a restart etc.  I was also obliged to attempt to delete it unread at first, and after trying this three times, and re-setting my machine, I was able to actually read the post, albeit by this time most unwillingly. Apart from which, this newsgroup discusses fly-fishing and not boats. Now at least you know what your grandson did wrong.  I doubt anybody wished to hurt him, but this sort of post is not only annoying, but potentially dangerous.   As you obviously know better, you can perhaps explain to him why what he did was wrong, and in future when you allow him to use your e-mail, you might supervise him a little more closely, and aid him in his endeavours.  Usenet or the internet in general is not the place to allow 10 year old boys free rein. If you or your grandson has any questions pertaining to fishing, then there are lots of people here, including Mr.Harrison, who would be only to pleased to help you. The gut reaction from many to posts which manipulate the machine is to immediately protest to the sender and the ISP of that sender. Regarding the information requested in the original post, there are two basic reasons for a two stroke motor smoking, one is too much oil in the mixture, and the second is the oil scraper rings are worn. This bungs up the spark plugs. If you take the plug out and it is covered in black soot, then one of these reasons is usually the problem. This will eventually also result in misfiring, and difficult starting. Two stroke motors are rarely used for fly-fishing per se. For this type of info, go to a boating group, or your local garage, marina  etc. This and other groups are not free information services. I am sure anybody would welcome a newbie on here with any genuine questions. If your grandson wishes to try again, WITHOUT ANY EXOTIC CODING IN THE MESSAGE, then I am sure both you and he will be pleasantly surprised. I hope this is of help to you. Tight lines ! Mike Connor — "In order to achieve what is possible, one must constantly attempt the impossible" http://www.mikeconnor.de

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… this skirmish shall take place on a glen atop grandfather mountain at 2pm on may 8th in the year of our glorious salmo, 2000. standard scottish kilts shall be worn …

Nope, no way. I know what’s under a kilt, more to the point I know what’s NOT under a kilt. Janik can be Evil Ken Twin #1. Actually I prefer it that way, when I refer to him as #1, I feel positively Patrick Stewarty. — Ken Fortenberry

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Hey, who knows I just might be finding myself back in cowtown in the not so distant future.  And…hee hee hee…I know my way around DCL.  Don’t worry, I’ll be armed with Bud as a peace offering.  :-)

Oh gawd, another "corporate partner" come to rape the alma mater. 1412 DCL, and check the "born on date", stale Bud ain’t no peace offering. — Ken Fortenberry

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What can you expect from a jerk? Ernie

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – <snip There wasn’t malice in the first post but the second post was definitely out of line. You do not post private email to a USENET newsgroup without the authors permission, and I am assuming that Ernie didn’t give his permission to post that rather mild rebuke to ROFF. That’s malice #1, whether they have enough of a clue to realize it or not, it is definitely malice of a most egregious nature. Fuck ‘em. — Ken Fortenberry

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Rhode Island Dreamer,    If you are going to turn your grandson loose with your computer you should teach him news group regulations.  He sent a bunch of crap which tied up my computer and made me shut down the program just to get rid of it.  If your grandson wants to communicate with this news group let him do it in plain English.  He will find the group is friendly and helpful.  I guess the rest of the group told you what they think about his message and yours. I’ll just say wake up jerk, if you weren’t dreaming perhaps you would know what your grandson is doing. Ernie Harrison I hope that someone can help me. My grandson (10) was on his grandfather’s email so that he could go to discuss: fly fishing. Fly fishing is his favorite. He wrote in on a few questions, that he knew back(included below). Not exactly what I thought good sportsmanship was all about. I have always put fisherman up there with people I like to associate with.  One bad apple spoils it for everyone. My grandson was so hurt. He didn’t know what he did wrong and now doesn’t  want to cotribute to the discuuss group any more.     CAN"T BLAME HIM, CAN YOU! X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 What the hell do you think this is? Quit posting the Webb junk to this news group Ernie Harrison – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text —— Original Message —– Newsgroups: rec.outdoors.fishing.fly Sent: Thursday, April 06, 2000 1:43 PM

Response:

There wasn’t malice in the first post but the second post was definitely out of line. You do not post private email to a USENET newsgroup without the authors permission, and I am assuming that Ernie didn’t give his permission to post that rather mild rebuke to ROFF.

Yeah, OK, so you’re justified in dropping an F-bomb on a guy for a first-time mistake. Now tell me why it is again that you called Vern a clueless idiot a few days ago for dropping an F-bomb on someone who spammed the group? Seems to me if you’re gonna ream some guy for trying to explain the errant newsgroup behavior of his grandkid you’d certainly champion the cause of anyone who would rail on newsgroup spammers. You cannot possibly think the grandpa or the grandson knew any better–yet that’s essentially the same defense you used in your "take-a-chill-you-idiot" post to Vern. –Steve

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – … but unless I’m missing something on this one, it seems uncalled for…and I’m not generally considered a softie on these things. Ah HAH ! SO, you relinquish the title Evil Ken Twin #1  ?? Hey, I gotta have something to keep my edge sharp on. With George killfiled and Timmy giving up his mental cluster fuck lately I guess I’m just getting rusty. Newbies just aren’t much fun to pick on IMHO.      - Ken — "During my service in the United States Congress, I took the  initiative in creating the Internet."  - Al Gore

let me see if i understand this…. some clueless newbie posts a message with a obscene webtv html sig (killfiled his honor immediately)….. ernie, in moderation rebukes him…. grandma gets in a huff…. et1 is moderate…..ET2, seeing a chink in ET1’s armor, wants to wrestle the blooded praetorial monniker away from ET1…. yup, makes sense to me….. as clavemeister, i call for a meeting of the et’s to settle this most unpleasant matter. this skirmish shall take place on a glen atop grandfather mountain at 2pm on may 8th in the year of our glorious salmo, 2000. standard scottish kilts shall be worn and the combatatants, aside from their mercurious wit, shall be armed with cabers and blarney stones and of course, proper drink. last man standing takes the name. waldo

Response:

… but unless I’m missing something on this one, it seems uncalled for…and I’m not generally considered a softie on these things.

Ah HAH ! SO, you relinquish the title Evil Ken Twin #1  ?? By your own admission, I am the more Evil of the Evil Ken Twins. Please change your moniker to ET2. — Ken Fortenberry- it was just a matter of time

Response:

… but unless I’m missing something on this one, it seems uncalled for…and I’m not generally considered a softie on these things. Ah HAH ! SO, you relinquish the title Evil Ken Twin #1  ??

Hey, I gotta have something to keep my edge sharp on. With George killfiled and Timmy giving up his mental cluster fuck lately I guess I’m just getting rusty. Newbies just aren’t much fun to pick on IMHO.      - Ken — "During my service in the United States Congress, I took the  initiative in creating the Internet."  - Al Gore

Response:

– Other ROFFians laugh with glee?

FWIW, the experience with the dentist wasn’t fun nor was it, in my opinion, called for. If he had tried the extremely cold test on the bad tooth and I didn’t feel it we could have gone right on with the root canal, IMO. I didn’t think I was laughing with glee about anything, then or now. — Charlie…

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Let me get this straight: – Some kid, or potentially clueless adult posted an innocent   question, but had the mime and/or html set on their browser. – Some ROFFian reamed them for it. – Kid’s parents, grandparents, or potentially same clueless adult   posts whining about the treatment. – Some ROFFian reams them for it. – Other ROFFians laugh with glee? Yeah, usenet is rough, but should we really go out of our way to be rough?  When there is malice on the newbie’s part I can understand it, but unless I’m missing something on this one, it seems uncalled for…and I’m not generally considered a softie on these things.

There wasn’t malice in the first post but the second post was definitely out of line. You do not post private email to a USENET newsgroup without the authors permission, and I am assuming that Ernie didn’t give his permission to post that rather mild rebuke to ROFF. That’s malice #1, whether they have enough of a clue to realize it or not, it is definitely malice of a most egregious nature. Fuck ‘em. — Ken Fortenberry

Response:

I hope that someone can help me.

USENET newsgroups are not "discuss" groups for every muddle headed moron with a webTV account. If you or your 10 year old wants to participate here, learn how to do it right. For what it’s worth, Ernie Harrison was quite polite given the circumstances. Now, fuck off. Hope this helps. — Ken Fortenberry

Response:

I hope that someone can help me. My grandson (10) was on his grandfather’s email so that he could go to discuss: fly fishing. Fly fishing is his favorite. He wrote in on a few questions, that he knew back(included below). Not exactly what I thought good sportsmanship was all about. I have always put fisherman up there with people I like to associate with.  One bad apple spoils it for everyone. My grandson was so hurt. He didn’t know what he did wrong and now doesn’t  want to cotribute to the discuuss group any more.     CAN"T BLAME HIM, CAN YOU!

Sorry your grandson got singed, but all of that music and pictures and junk in the webTV signatures is considered very rude on text-only newsgroups, and cost European subscribers that pay by the minute a lot of money to download the big files.  The only people who can enforce these rules are the newsgroup users.  The responses were probably a little too harsh, but no one expects kids to actually read roff with all the politics and BS they’d have to wade through. — Levi "There are no facts, only interpretations." -Friedrich Nietzsche

Response:

For what it’s worth, Ernie Harrison was quite polite given the circumstances. Now, fuck off. Hope this helps.

LOL.   This is one of those threads that I catch the end of then have to go back and see where it started. Joe F.

Response:

LOL.   This is one of those threads that I catch the end of then have to go back and see where it started.

Oh, now I understand. Joe F.

Response:

Hope this helps. I had a root canal a few weeks ago and, before he did it, the dentist wanted to verify that the root was dead. He did this by touching the tooth with an extremely cold object. The bad news was that he calibrated it by testing a known good tooth first so I would know what extreme pain felt like. Forty provides the same service on roff<g.

ROFLMAO.     Is it safe? Joe F.

Response:

Oh, now I understand.

Except for how he got Jack Webb’s TV. Joe F.

Response:

Hope this helps.

I had a root canal a few weeks ago and, before he did it, the dentist wanted to verify that the root was dead. He did this by touching the tooth with an extremely cold object. The bad news was that he calibrated it by testing a known good tooth first so I would know what extreme pain felt like. Forty provides the same service on roff<g. — Charlie…

Response:

Hey, Ernie, why didn’t you tell them what you *really* felt?   <g Dave L.

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hope this helps. I had a root canal a few weeks ago and, before he did it, the dentist wanted to verify that the root was dead. He did this by touching the tooth with an extremely cold object. The bad news was that he calibrated it by testing a known good tooth first so I would know what extreme pain felt like. Forty provides the same service on roff<g. ROFLMAO.     Is it safe? Joe F.

Let me get this straight: – Some kid, or potentially clueless adult posted an innocent   question, but had the mime and/or html set on their browser. – Some ROFFian reamed them for it. – Kid’s parents, grandparents, or potentially same clueless adult   posts whining about the treatment. – Some ROFFian reams them for it. – Other ROFFians laugh with glee? Yeah, usenet is rough, but should we really go out of our way to be rough?  When there is malice on the newbie’s part I can understand it, but unless I’m missing something on this one, it seems uncalled for…and I’m not generally considered a softie on these things.      - Ken — "During my service in the United States Congress, I took the  initiative in creating the Internet."  - Al Gore

Response:

– Other ROFFians laugh with glee? FWIW, the experience with the dentist wasn’t fun nor was it, in my opinion, called for. If he had tried the extremely cold test on the bad tooth and I didn’t feel it we could have gone right on with the root canal, IMO. I didn’t think I was laughing with glee about anything, then or now.

Wasn’t necessarily replying to your message or portion of the thread. Yours just happened to be the message I had handy after going back and reading the beginning of the thread.      - Ken — "During my service in the United States Congress, I took the  initiative in creating the Internet."  - Al Gore

Response:

I hope that someone can help me. My grandson (10) was on his grandfather’s email so that he could go to discuss: fly fishing. Fly fishing is his favorite. He wrote in on a few questions, that he knew back(included below). Not exactly what I thought good sportsmanship was all about. I have always put fisherman up there with people I like to associate with.  One bad apple spoils it for everyone. My grandson was so hurt. He didn’t know what he did wrong and now doesn’t  want to cotribute to the discuuss group any more.       CAN"T BLAME HIM, CAN YOU! X-MSMail-Priority:

Question:

I can’t go anymore.  I just got this new job and couldn’t get time off and will have family in town.  Why can’t I find a job that just lets me fish? – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – 26 days to go.  I’m getting a bit anxious. I offered a while back to provide transportation if there was anyone interested in meeting up in Seattle, or between Seattle and Devils Lake.  I’m still interested in that, but I’m also considering going on to Chicago for my 30th college reunion after the clave.  It’s another 800 miles or so, and I’m only about half interested.  If I’m giving someone a ride, I’ll be able to blow off the reunion. Warren had expressed some interest in a ride, as had someone else in Washington or Oregon, I can’t remember for sure, but maybe it was Padishar Creel (Chris)?  I’m expecting to go for the whole week, leaving Seattle Friday, May 17 plus or minus a day, and returning Sunday May 26 plus or minus a couple days. I’ve got room for two people and gear.  I’m planning on bringing my Dave Scaden Escalade and possibly my canoe. Anyone interested? Chas P.S.  Kevin, are you going to post those fly pictures I sent on the website? Fix underscore in address to reply

– Warren change addy to yahoo for email Henry’s Fork Clave info and Bozeman, MT fishing info http://www.geocities.com/troutbum_mt3/HFclave.html

Response:

Well, Warren, you’re a step ahead of most folks, not only do you know what your problem is, you know the solution.  All that’s left is findind a way to implement it. We’ll miss you in ND.  Any interest in a day or two of fishing in Montana on either end of the clave? Chas I can’t go anymore.  I just got this new job and couldn’t get time off and will have family in town.  Why can’t I find a job that just lets me fish? — Warren change addy to yahoo for email Henry’s Fork Clave info and Bozeman, MT fishing info http://www.geocities.com/troutbum_mt3/HFclave.html

Fix underscore in address to reply

Response:

We’ll miss you in ND.  Any interest in a day or two of fishing in Montana on either end of the clave?

I can probably swing something on either end of the clave, but the 17th or 18th would work better for me.  Drop me an email and we can figure something out. — Warren change addy to yahoo for email Henry’s Fork Clave info and Bozeman, MT fishing info http://www.geocities.com/troutbum_mt3/HFclave.html

Response:

26 days to go.  I’m getting a bit anxious. I offered a while back to provide transportation if there was anyone interested in meeting up in Seattle, or between Seattle and Devils Lake.  I’m still interested in that, but I’m also considering going on to Chicago for my 30th college reunion after the clave.  It’s another 800 miles or so, and I’m only about half interested.  If I’m giving someone a ride, I’ll be able to blow off the reunion. Warren had expressed some interest in a ride, as had someone else in Washington or Oregon, I can’t remember for sure, but maybe it was Padishar Creel (Chris)?  I’m expecting to go for the whole week, leaving Seattle Friday, May 17 plus or minus a day, and returning Sunday May 26 plus or minus a couple days. I’ve got room for two people and gear.  I’m planning on bringing my Dave Scaden Escalade and possibly my canoe. Anyone interested? Chas P.S.  Kevin, are you going to post those fly pictures I sent on the website? Fix underscore in address to reply

Response:

Question:

Guiding is a very tough business and dealing with cranks who won’t do as they’re told to catch fish has to be frustrating. I mean, one of the ways that a guide evaluates his own job performance is to tally up the fish count and I don’t have a problem with that per se. But it will be a cold day in hell before Ken Fortenberry is caught using a gawdamn bobber on a fly line. Nothing against those who do, strictly a personal foible, but catching a fish just ain’t all THAT friggin’ important. — Ken Fortenberry- tired of arguing politics, but not tired of arguing

Response:

Guiding is a very tough business and dealing with cranks who won’t do as they’re told to catch fish has to be frustrating. I mean, one of the ways that a guide evaluates his own job performance is to tally up the fish count and I don’t have a problem with that per se. But it will be a cold day in hell before Ken Fortenberry is caught using a gawdamn bobber on a fly line. Nothing against those who do, strictly a personal foible, but catching a fish just ain’t all THAT friggin’ important. — Ken Fortenberry- tired of arguing politics, but not tired of arguing

I’ve never been on a guided fishing (or hunting, or anything) trip, but if the client won’t listen, well, what can you do…  I have worked as a deckhand on Halibut charters in Alaska, and the first instruction to the clients (known affectionately as ‘pukers’) is to hold the weight when the hook is being baited.  It’s often a 2 lb. lead, and holding the hook doesn’t stop it from swinging.  Getting beaned by a 2 lb. lead can leave one hell of a goose egg on the ol’ noggin.  Still, there’s always a couple of pukers every year that don’t listen–and guess who pays the price… I’ve never used a strike indicator, as such.  This past summer, I had the privilege of fishing with Mark Faulkner on Spring Creek near Bellefonte, PA.  He introduced me to the ‘dry as an indicator’ method, which seems like a good idea and could catch fish now and then, too. I’ve got a friend who ties his own leaders and uses Stren HiVis Gold for some of the thicker sections of his leaders as a sort of ‘in-line indicator’. In general, though, I’ll have to agree.  Bobbers (by any other name, still a bobber) and fly fishing don’t mix. Tom G how about them Nittany Lions, eh? Before you buy.

Response:

But it will be a cold day in hell before Ken Fortenberry is caught using a gawdamn bobber on a fly line.

Why would you use a bobber with a dry? You don’t mean you are nymphing, do you? Why, that’s just like using freeze dried bait<g. — Charlie…

Response:

But it will be a cold day in hell before Ken Fortenberry is caught using a gawdamn bobber on a fly line. Nothing against those who do, strictly a personal foible, but catching a fish just ain’t all THAT friggin’ important.

Yeah but what about those bloody mud sucking fish who don’t show a trace of having taken the fly – or are you only talking about bobbers and not yarn strike indicators. — Ken Fortenberry- tired of arguing politics, but not tired of arguing

Ari Bert                                        Gaelle Bert +27 (0) 83 232 9903                             +27 (0) 83 236 5308 Flyfishing Corner +27 (0) 11 447 7230                             Shop 94, Admirals Court +27 (0) 11 882 8537 (fax)                       Cnr Craddock & Tyrwhitt www.troutfishing.co.za                        Street, Rosebank P.O.Box 79067 Senderwood 2145 South Africa

Response:

I use a bivisible about 18" to 2′ up from a dry.  These old eyes just can’t see a #22 or #24 midge dry 30" away. Bob in El Paso – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – But it will be a cold day in hell before Ken Fortenberry is caught using a gawdamn bobber on a fly line. Why would you use a bobber with a dry? You don’t mean you are nymphing, do you? Why, that’s just like using freeze dried bait<g. — Charlie…

Response:

My, perhaps odd, definitions: strike indicator – anything that indicates a fish has taken a fly – leader, knots, line, floaties – and the fly! especially ones with wings to see for miles. Bobber – a device that suspends a fly at a fixed depth- leader, line, knots, floaties and a fly itself could be in that class (eg: parachute tied apart from body so it suspends body well below film) IMO, leaving floaties out of these groups still leaves a whole lot of strike indicators and bobbers that you are using. If you ever de/grease a leader … Steve (As ever – just tired – apologies if this shows up twice

Response:

 There’s a whole range of "indicators" ranging from a "bobber" to a colored a colored leader link, that I seem to remember you use. The question is how far are you willing to go?  A colored leader butt, a smear of flor. putty on the leader knots, a dry fly as an indicator, yarn, cork, foam, etc. etc. etc. Willi – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Guiding is a very tough business and dealing with cranks who won’t do as they’re told to catch fish has to be frustrating. I mean, one of the ways that a guide evaluates his own job performance is to tally up the fish count and I don’t have a problem with that per se. But it will be a cold day in hell before Ken Fortenberry is caught using a gawdamn bobber on a fly line. Nothing against those who do, strictly a personal foible, but catching a fish just ain’t all THAT friggin’ important. — Ken Fortenberry- tired of arguing politics, but not tired of arguing

Response:

Ken Fortenberry writes: But it will be a cold day in hell before Ken Fortenberry is caught using a gawdamn bobber on a fly line. Nothing against those who do, strictly a personal foible, but catching a fish just ain’t all THAT friggin’ important.

Man, you’ll say just about *anything* to get in an argument.  <g So, tell me, old wise one, how are you going to detect strikes?  You *could* watch the end of your floating line, that’ll work.  But then you are using *it* as a strike indicator.  So, to be a purist, you can not watch your line — it’s a strike indicator.  Aha, you will go by feel, right?  Well, for every fish you feel take the nymph, 99 have preceeded him.  And if you *feel* it, the fish has caught itself; you had nothing to do with it.  That ain’t fishing.  That’s hookin’!   <g Best to stay home and fish parachute Adams.  But I am looking forward to seeing you on the SJ.  Should be a great time. Dave L.

Response:

Best to stay home and fish parachute Adams.  But I am looking forward to seeing you on the SJ.  Should be a great time.

We should be able to find some fish midging on the surface or feeding on midge clusters. Willi

Response:

Bob Instead of the #22-24 midges . . . why not go to a Griffets Knat in a 16 or 18. The rationale is that the midges are hatching from egg clusters just under the surface. The GK mimics the dimple of the egg cluster in the meniscus, the fish are usually slurping the egg clusters anyway (not the midges) and ITS BIG EFUFF to SEE. There is no way that #24 is going to look like anything real with the tippit and knot, with any daylight at all. Dave

Response:

Bob Instead of the #22-24 midges . . . why not go to a Griffets Knat in a 16 or 18. The rationale is that the midges are hatching from egg clusters just under the surface. The GK mimics the dimple of the egg cluster in the meniscus, the fish are usually slurping the egg clusters anyway (not the midges) and ITS BIG EFUFF to SEE.

My understanding of midge clusters is that they hatch as individuals and then the clusters are formed when the adults gather in groups in the slow water near the banks.  These masses of midges can be VERY large in fertile waters. Current wind etc. will break off parts of these masses and the fish will take these clusters. Sometimes there aren’t enough clusters around for the fish to key into them.  Often the fish will key into feeding on individual pupas either in or just under the film. Willi – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – There is no way that #24 is going to look like anything real with the tippit and knot, with any daylight at all. Dave

Response:

But it will be a cold day in hell before Ken Fortenberry is caught using a gawdamn bobber on a fly line. Nothing against those who do, strictly a personal foible, but catching a fish just ain’t all THAT friggin’ important.

I’m on the fence on this one. I far prefer to fish without an indicator, but I will use when I feel it’s warranted. My home water contains a large number of fish that feed on midge larvae. Their take is extremely subtle, and I do often fish for them with an indicator. On the other hand, I fished in Northern New Hampshire for a week, using mainly nymphs, and was quite successful without once using an indicator. Faster water, larger flies, more aggressive fish, all make a difference. I definitely agree that guides rely far to much on using indicators, especially when teaching beginners. Many newbies I’ve observed the past few years never remove the indicator, even when attempting to fish dry. One afternoon in New Hampshire, I was fishing across the stream from a couple who had hired a guide as an instructor. He was spending most of his time with the wife, (big surprise), and had her casting reasonably well with a huge indicator about 3′ above some sort of nymph. After about a half hour, fish began to rise, I tied on a #14 Usual, and caught three or four fish in short order. The guide asked me what I was using, but never once suggested that either one of his sports switch over to a dry. Too bad, because the woman was in a perfect position for a long drift over several good fish. Would have been an ideal opportunity to introduce her to the joys of catching fish on a dry. George Adams "From the rockin’ of the cradle to the rollin’ of the hearse, the goin’ up was worth the comin’ down." ___Kris Kristofferson "The Pilgrim/Chapter 33"

Response:

But it will be a cold day in hell before Ken Fortenberry is caught using a gawdamn bobber on a fly line. Nothing against those who do, strictly a personal foible, but catching a fish just ain’t all THAT friggin’ important.

I’ve always liked the fact that you and I have similar fishing tastes and likes. However on your upcoming trip to the Juan, and IF the fish are not keying on the emergers in the surface film, you will more than likely be fishing midges in the 22-26 range, a bobber is almost a requirement, along with ability to mend, mend, mend, and then mend again. I spent an entire morning ignoring my guide and a more experienced Juan fisherman, only when I acquiensed and used the indicator could I detect the strikes. — Wayne Knight Expert in creating tailing loops and windknots Otherwise Fishless in Kansas Before you buy.

Response:

Willi writes: We should be able to find some fish midging on the surface or feeding on midge clusters.

I’m planning on it, Willi.  But, after tying some of these iddybiddythingies, I doubt I’ll be able to see ‘em on the water! <g Now, a big old yarn indicator — easy to see!!!!!   d;0) Dave

Response:

Willi, Some of my recent tying attempts are #18 Griffith’s Gnats. Are these small enough for the San Juan? I’ve got some #20 and #22 hooks on order just in case. Danl (home today with back spasms. its hell gettin old) – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – We should be able to find some fish midging on the surface or feeding on midge clusters. Willi

Response:

Guiding is a very tough business and dealing with cranks who won’t do as they’re told to catch fish has to be frustrating. I mean, one of the ways that a guide evaluates his own job performance is to tally up the fish count and I don’t have a problem with that per se. But it will be a cold day in hell before Ken Fortenberry is caught using a gawdamn bobber on a fly line. Nothing against those who do, strictly a personal foible, but catching a fish just ain’t all THAT friggin’ important. — Ken Fortenberry- tired of arguing politics, but not tired of arguing

I’m going to be indelicate again (but not irrelevant) – weren’t you using one of the Muskegon.  <g  But we drew the line at egg flies, eh? BTW – the P. Charles distinction between bobbers and strike indicators. === A bobber will float your rig, a strike indicator won’t. Peter – the honest broker who admits to using a bobber ’cause he can’t nymph fish worth a shit, especially without one.

Response:

We should be able to find some fish midging on the surface or feeding on midge clusters.

That’s my understanding as well, and one of the reasons I decided to make the trip. Somewhere between France and Urbana is a silk flyline with my name on it. It will be here in time to be spooled up on a Hardy Princess for use on an old Granger Aristocrat. Can’t think of a better place to wet a new flyline for the first time than with a bunch of ROFFians on a world famous trout stream. — Ken Fortenberry

Response:

But it will be a cold day in hell before Ken Fortenberry is caught using a gawdamn bobber on a fly line. Nothing against those who do, strictly a personal foible, but catching a fish just ain’t all THAT friggin’ important.

Ken, please ask Mr. Fortenberry to define "strike indicator" for us if he wouldn’t mind. –Steve

Response:

: So, tell me, old wise one, how are you going to detect strikes?   [...] : feel take the nymph, 99 have preceeded him.  And if you *feel* it, Ya know, the best of ‘em simply *know* when a fish has taken… JonCook. — Not that I’m one of them, but I bet Willi is

Response:

1. all the pins are down 2. you cross a picket line 3. your nose is bleeding 4. there are lines through all of your letters 5. the player is walking back to the dugout —

Response:

I’m going to be indelicate again (but not irrelevant) – weren’t you using one of the Muskegon.  <g

Yes, that was a gift from Herman Nijland, an ingenious piece of work involving a very small metal ring and a piece of yarn, a "hinged leader system" I believe he called it. I still have it somewhere, but it’s not really my cup of tea and I didn’t use it for the steelhead, those I dredged up with a small black stonefly nymph and no indicator. But we drew the line at egg flies, eh?

And the poor guide looked to be close to tears when we told him so. BTW – the P. Charles distinction between bobbers and strike indicators. === A bobber will float your rig, a strike indicator won’t.

As good a distinction as any. If I’m gettin’ skunked and the guide is taking it personally, I could probably be convinced to catch a fish using whatever flyfishing method is legal in that locale. I’m not impervious to a guide’s discomfort, but someone coined a phrase one time about the customer always being right. — Ken Fortenberry

Response:

Regarding the SJ:  You’ve got to be pretty damn slick up there to NEVER use an indicator because  1.  sometimes the fish are deep and/or the water’s not clear enough to see them  2.  their take is notoriously subtle. I use everything from a big yarn ball 11 ft from my flies to a small foam one to a dry fly to nothing, watching for my leader/tippet to straighten.  And yes i fish plenty of dries. Hopefully Channer will be there to provide tips to those who don’t want any lead or yarn on their leader.  Less discriminating flyfishers can cut a "lifetime supply" of yarn from my spool and follow me.  I fish nymphs, dries, and emergers there and with nymphs and emergers and even sometimes dries i’ll have an indicator of some type. Dave, a size 22 with a knot and everything still looks like a midge, and on some days on that river you’ll catch twice as many fish with a 24 and even more on a 26, no kidding. bruce h Before you buy.

Response:

That’s my understanding as well, and one of the reasons I decided to make the trip. Somewhere between France and Urbana is a silk flyline with my name on it. It will be here in time to be spooled up on a Hardy Princess for use on an old Granger Aristocrat. Can’t think of a better place to wet a new flyline for the first time than with a bunch of ROFFians on a world famous trout stream.

Ah, the irony! Striking a blow for Piscatorial Purity — the silk line, the venerable rod and reel, the death-before-strike-indicators stance — on the banks of the San Juan river, a place where flyfishing for trout wouldn’t even exist were it not for that big ole dam and its tailwaterrific releases! Course, I usually wear plus-fours to the mini-golf course , – sid

Response:

Ah, the irony! …

How true. Must be something in the air this fall. Ds arguing for states rights, R’s looking to the federal courts for injunctive relief and yours truly fishin’ a tailwater. Can the apocalypse be far behind ? — Ken Fortenberry

Response:

Willi writes: We should be able to find some fish midging on the surface or feeding on midge clusters. I’m planning on it, Willi.  But, after tying some of these iddybiddythingies, I doubt I’ll be able to see ‘em on the water! <g Now, a big old yarn indicator — easy to see!!!!!   d;0)

Any surface fishing will probably be to individual fish in slow water areas.  It’s best to fish these from upstream letting the fly drift down before the tippet. Even if you can’t see the fly, you have a pretty good idea where it is and you can strike on the take. I’ve only fished the Juan a couple of times but when I did, I found that you could drag your fly directly into the correct feeding lane several feet above the rising fish without disturbing it. The rest is timing the drift, getting a drag free one and having an acceptable fly. The fish don’t get put down easilly and they will give you many chances (which you’ll probably need.) Willi

Response:

Question:

Dear All, Here I am working at the tool corral cash register at Home Depot a few months ago, getting minimum wage filling in for a person on lunch. I normally work in the paint department, paint is what I know about. There is this guy rushing around like a bull in a china shop with his arms overloaded with breakable objects, he comes up to the counter to ask a question about something on the floor. I suggest he unload his goods for everyone’s convenience. I told him would try to help him, but that this wasn’t my department and I was just filling in for someone on lunch. He was looking at some table thingie with what looked like a motor mounted underneath of it. He asked if we had any more, I checked the computer, it said we didn’t, but the computer isn’t always correct, so I checked the shelf as well. He seemed annoyed that this was the only one we had. I suggested he could buy the floor model, he pointed out that this unit had actual dust on it and it might have to be cleaned and wanted a discount. It didn’t have manuals either, but I told him we would take his name and make sure he was sent some, he didn’t want to hear that, he was just looking to chisel the price down. I called a manager and asked what the policy was on floor models, I was told we take a standard 10% off, which is basically selling the tool at cost. This guy was a little steamy already, but when I told him the discount would be 10%, he lost it, I truly thought he was about to go postal on me. With arms flailing, he knocks stuff off the counter and is muttering something about how he is single handily responsible for the success of Home Depot with the millions in business he has brought to the chain and goes on and on about how he will never be shopping here again. I am trying not to shake my head while this display is going on, and I carelessly utter under my breath, "what an asshole". Little did I know, this guy has his Whisper 2000 cranked to maximum amplification. Big mistake. Now I am almost 6 foot, but my build is what I politely call slight, I am only 150 pounds soaking wet. This ape is 6′5"+ and twice my weight, he leans over the counter right in my face and spraying as he yells, he dares me to repeat what I just said. I am pushing the emergency security button as hard and as fast I can thinking I have about 3 seconds to live before this guy squishes me like a bug. I of course don’t repeat what I said, I cannot believe he even heard it in the first place. Before Dino and Rocko get to the Coral, this guy has stormed out and I am about to quit my job and go live in Alaska. I think this is what they mean by roid rage. A few weeks later, I am called into the carpet on this matter. Apparently this guy has been emailing everyone about this incident and is even trying to rally Ralph Nader to his aid. Ralph said he hates Home Depot, but this guy was to radical for even him. I explain the incident, including the ‘asshole’ remark. I could see the store manager was not to upset with me and he said he might have said worse to the guy, PR be dammed, some people we just don’t need in the store. The store manager also said that the head office has his letters framed and get a chuckle out of them every time they read them. Nothing bad came of it, except that I hear he is still writing congress trying to get a bill passed that when things don’t go your way, you get 10% back on all previous purchases. Don’t worry, I don’t get it either. Oh well, back to the paint department… Thanks, David. May you live in Interesting Times – Ancient Chinese Curse. Newbies, please read this newsgroups FAQ. rec.ww FAQ http://www.robson.org/woodfaq/ Archives http://x29.deja.com/home_ps.shtml crowbar FAQ http://www.concentric.net/~Odeen/oldtools/crowbar.shtml

Response:

BWAH HAH HAH!!! Oh man, I gotta go, I think just wet myself!!! BWAHHHHH HAH HAHHH!!!! Oh Man, Oh GOD, here comes the floor!!!!! Rob — visit our web siite: http://www.randc.bizhosting.com – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Dear All, Here I am working at the tool corral cash register at Home Depot a few months ago, getting minimum wage filling in for a person on lunch. I normally work in the paint department, paint is what I know about. There is this guy rushing around like a bull in a china shop with his arms overloaded with breakable objects, he comes up to the counter to ask a question about something on the floor. I suggest he unload his goods for everyone’s convenience. I told him would try to help him, but that this wasn’t my department and I was just filling in for someone on lunch. He was looking at some table thingie with what looked like a motor mounted underneath of it. He asked if we had any more, I checked the computer, it said we didn’t, but the computer isn’t always correct, so I checked the shelf as well. He seemed annoyed that this was the only one we had. I suggested he could buy the floor model, he pointed out that this unit had actual dust on it and it might have to be cleaned and wanted a discount. It didn’t have manuals either, but I told him we would take his name and make sure he was sent some, he didn’t want to hear that, he was just looking to chisel the price down. I called a manager and asked what the policy was on floor models, I was told we take a standard 10% off, which is basically selling the tool at cost. This guy was a little steamy already, but when I told him the discount would be 10%, he lost it, I truly thought he was about to go postal on me. With arms flailing, he knocks stuff off the counter and is muttering something about how he is single handily responsible for the success of Home Depot with the millions in business he has brought to the chain and goes on and on about how he will never be shopping here again. I am trying not to shake my head while this display is going on, and I carelessly utter under my breath, "what an asshole". Little did I know, this guy has his Whisper 2000 cranked to maximum amplification. Big mistake. Now I am almost 6 foot, but my build is what I politely call slight, I am only 150 pounds soaking wet. This ape is 6′5"+ and twice my weight, he leans over the counter right in my face and spraying as he yells, he dares me to repeat what I just said. I am pushing the emergency security button as hard and as fast I can thinking I have about 3 seconds to live before this guy squishes me like a bug. I of course don’t repeat what I said, I cannot believe he even heard it in the first place. Before Dino and Rocko get to the Coral, this guy has stormed out and I am about to quit my job and go live in Alaska. I think this is what they mean by roid rage. A few weeks later, I am called into the carpet on this matter. Apparently this guy has been emailing everyone about this incident and is even trying to rally Ralph Nader to his aid. Ralph said he hates Home Depot, but this guy was to radical for even him. I explain the incident, including the ‘asshole’ remark. I could see the store manager was not to upset with me and he said he might have said worse to the guy, PR be dammed, some people we just don’t need in the store. The store manager also said that the head office has his letters framed and get a chuckle out of them every time they read them. Nothing bad came of it, except that I hear he is still writing congress trying to get a bill passed that when things don’t go your way, you get 10% back on all previous purchases. Don’t worry, I don’t get it either. Oh well, back to the paint department… Thanks, David. May you live in Interesting Times – Ancient Chinese Curse. Newbies, please read this newsgroups FAQ. rec.ww FAQ http://www.robson.org/woodfaq/ Archives http://x29.deja.com/home_ps.shtml crowbar FAQ http://www.concentric.net/~Odeen/oldtools/crowbar.shtml

Response:

He is what he is! I will discuss a problem that anyone has with me but I will not put up with screaming idiots! — Jim Ferrill The Ellaville Bed Co. http://www.sowega.net/~jimkim/ rec.ww FAQ http://www.robson.org/woodfaq/ Archives http://x29.deja.com/home_ps.shtml – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Dear All, Here I am working at the tool corral cash register at Home Depot a few months ago, getting minimum wage filling in for a person on lunch. I normally work in the paint department, paint is what I know about. There is this guy rushing around like a bull in a china shop with his arms overloaded with breakable objects, he comes up to the counter to ask a question about something on the floor. I suggest he unload his goods for everyone’s convenience. I told him would try to help him, but that this wasn’t my department and I was just filling in for someone on lunch. He was looking at some table thingie with what looked like a motor mounted underneath of it. He asked if we had any more, I checked the computer, it said we didn’t, but the computer isn’t always correct, so I checked the shelf as well. He seemed annoyed that this was the only one we had. I suggested he could buy the floor model, he pointed out that this unit had actual dust on it and it might have to be cleaned and wanted a discount. It didn’t have manuals either, but I told him we would take his name and make sure he was sent some, he didn’t want to hear that, he was just looking to chisel the price down. I called a manager and asked what the policy was on floor models, I was told we take a standard 10% off, which is basically selling the tool at cost. This guy was a little steamy already, but when I told him the discount would be 10%, he lost it, I truly thought he was about to go postal on me. With arms flailing, he knocks stuff off the counter and is muttering something about how he is single handily responsible for the success of Home Depot with the millions in business he has brought to the chain and goes on and on about how he will never be shopping here again. I am trying not to shake my head while this display is going on, and I carelessly utter under my breath, "what an asshole". Little did I know, this guy has his Whisper 2000 cranked to maximum amplification. Big mistake. Now I am almost 6 foot, but my build is what I politely call slight, I am only 150 pounds soaking wet. This ape is 6′5"+ and twice my weight, he leans over the counter right in my face and spraying as he yells, he dares me to repeat what I just said. I am pushing the emergency security button as hard and as fast I can thinking I have about 3 seconds to live before this guy squishes me like a bug. I of course don’t repeat what I said, I cannot believe he even heard it in the first place. Before Dino and Rocko get to the Coral, this guy has stormed out and I am about to quit my job and go live in Alaska. I think this is what they mean by roid rage. A few weeks later, I am called into the carpet on this matter. Apparently this guy has been emailing everyone about this incident and is even trying to rally Ralph Nader to his aid. Ralph said he hates Home Depot, but this guy was to radical for even him. I explain the incident, including the ‘asshole’ remark. I could see the store manager was not to upset with me and he said he might have said worse to the guy, PR be dammed, some people we just don’t need in the store. The store manager also said that the head office has his letters framed and get a chuckle out of them every time they read them. Nothing bad came of it, except that I hear he is still writing congress trying to get a bill passed that when things don’t go your way, you get 10% back on all previous purchases. Don’t worry, I don’t get it either. Oh well, back to the paint department… Thanks, David. May you live in Interesting Times – Ancient Chinese Curse. Newbies, please read this newsgroups FAQ. rec.ww FAQ http://www.robson.org/woodfaq/ Archives http://x29.deja.com/home_ps.shtml crowbar FAQ http://www.concentric.net/~Odeen/oldtools/crowbar.shtml

Response:

Wow!  Everyone once in a while these HD/Lowes posts get pretty darn entertaining!  LOL Mike

Response:

David, May I introduce Matthew J. Prusik Jr.    He is whining on the post HD HORROR STORIES!!! about you. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Dear All, Here I am working at the tool corral cash register at Home Depot a few months ago, getting minimum wage filling in for a person on lunch. I normally work in the paint department, paint is what I know about. There is this guy rushing around like a bull in a china shop with his arms overloaded with breakable objects, he comes up to the counter to ask a question about something on the floor. I suggest he unload his goods for everyone’s convenience. I told him would try to help him, but that this wasn’t my department and I was just filling in for someone on lunch. He was looking at some table thingie with what looked like a motor mounted underneath of it. He asked if we had any more, I checked the computer, it said we didn’t, but the computer isn’t always correct, so I checked the shelf as well. He seemed annoyed that this was the only one we had. I suggested he could buy the floor model, he pointed out that this unit had actual dust on it and it might have to be cleaned and wanted a discount. It didn’t have manuals either, but I told him we would take his name and make sure he was sent some, he didn’t want to hear that, he was just looking to chisel the price down. I called a manager and asked what the policy was on floor models, I was told we take a standard 10% off, which is basically selling the tool at cost. This guy was a little steamy already, but when I told him the discount would be 10%, he lost it, I truly thought he was about to go postal on me. With arms flailing, he knocks stuff off the counter and is muttering something about how he is single handily responsible for the success of Home Depot with the millions in business he has brought to the chain and goes on and on about how he will never be shopping here again. I am trying not to shake my head while this display is going on, and I carelessly utter under my breath, "what an asshole". Little did I know, this guy has his Whisper 2000 cranked to maximum amplification. Big mistake. Now I am almost 6 foot, but my build is what I politely call slight, I am only 150 pounds soaking wet. This ape is 6′5"+ and twice my weight, he leans over the counter right in my face and spraying as he yells, he dares me to repeat what I just said. I am pushing the emergency security button as hard and as fast I can thinking I have about 3 seconds to live before this guy squishes me like a bug. I of course don’t repeat what I said, I cannot believe he even heard it in the first place. Before Dino and Rocko get to the Coral, this guy has stormed out and I am about to quit my job and go live in Alaska. I think this is what they mean by roid rage. A few weeks later, I am called into the carpet on this matter. Apparently this guy has been emailing everyone about this incident and is even trying to rally Ralph Nader to his aid. Ralph said he hates Home Depot, but this guy was to radical for even him. I explain the incident, including the ‘asshole’ remark. I could see the store manager was not to upset with me and he said he might have said worse to the guy, PR be dammed, some people we just don’t need in the store. The store manager also said that the head office has his letters framed and get a chuckle out of them every time they read them. Nothing bad came of it, except that I hear he is still writing congress trying to get a bill passed that when things don’t go your way, you get 10% back on all previous purchases. Don’t worry, I don’t get it either. Oh well, back to the paint department… Thanks, David. May you live in Interesting Times – Ancient Chinese Curse. Newbies, please read this newsgroups FAQ. rec.ww FAQ http://www.robson.org/woodfaq/ Archives http://x29.deja.com/home_ps.shtml crowbar FAQ http://www.concentric.net/~Odeen/oldtools/crowbar.shtml

Response:

Well, the very least you could have done was to offer the guy 50 bucks to get the eyesore out of the store for you. Then you could pushed bamboo wedges up under your finger nails by way of atonement. Then to show that you were really sincere, maybe have yourself drawn and quarter….. of course you might have found something painful to do to yourself in between. I think it’s shameful, the way you skinny little guys gotta keep on picking Enjoyed it immensely, David 8^). — Jim Warman http://www.telusplanet.net/public/mechanic – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Dear All, Here I am working at the tool corral cash register at Home Depot a few months ago, getting minimum wage filling in for a person on lunch. I normally work in the paint department, paint is what I know about.

Response:

Now that you and the human-hemroid have each others names…  maybe you can get together and have tea or something. Nex time you stuck in tools and a freaker goes nuts on you…  defend yourseldf with a plunge-router…  will make for a better story…

Response:

Dear All, Here I am working at the tool corral cash register at Home Depot a few months ago, getting minimum wage filling in for a person on lunch. I normally work in the paint department, paint is what I know about. There is this guy rushing around like a bull in a china shop with his arms overloaded with breakable objects, he comes up to the counter to ask a question about something on the floor.  <snip snip

Better you than me, David.  I would have grabbed the closest tool and told him those were his nuts on the floor!  Oh well, glad you liked your visit from Sigh!  <g — Jim Mc Namara Future Collectibles www.futurecollectibles.com

Response:

Bet you like the paint department better now……got any deals???? – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Dear All, Here I am working at the tool corral cash register at Home Depot a few months ago, getting minimum wage filling in for a person on lunch. I normally work in the paint department, paint is what I know about. There is this guy rushing around like a bull in a china shop with his arms overloaded with breakable objects, he comes up to the counter to ask a question about something on the floor. I suggest he unload his goods for everyone’s convenience. I told him would try to help him, but that this wasn’t my department and I was just filling in for someone on lunch. He was looking at some table thingie with what looked like a motor mounted underneath of it. He asked if we had any more, I checked the computer, it said we didn’t, but the computer isn’t always correct, so I checked the shelf as well. He seemed annoyed that this was the only one we had. I suggested he could buy the floor model, he pointed out that this unit had actual dust on it and it might have to be cleaned and wanted a discount. It didn’t have manuals either, but I told him we would take his name and make sure he was sent some, he didn’t want to hear that, he was just looking to chisel the price down. I called a manager and asked what the policy was on floor models, I was told we take a standard 10% off, which is basically selling the tool at cost. This guy was a little steamy already, but when I told him the discount would be 10%, he lost it, I truly thought he was about to go postal on me. With arms flailing, he knocks stuff off the counter and is muttering something about how he is single handily responsible for the success of Home Depot with the millions in business he has brought to the chain and goes on and on about how he will never be shopping here again. I am trying not to shake my head while this display is going on, and I carelessly utter under my breath, "what an asshole". Little did I know, this guy has his Whisper 2000 cranked to maximum amplification. Big mistake. Now I am almost 6 foot, but my build is what I politely call slight, I am only 150 pounds soaking wet. This ape is 6′5"+ and twice my weight, he leans over the counter right in my face and spraying as he yells, he dares me to repeat what I just said. I am pushing the emergency security button as hard and as fast I can thinking I have about 3 seconds to live before this guy squishes me like a bug. I of course don’t repeat what I said, I cannot believe he even heard it in the first place. Before Dino and Rocko get to the Coral, this guy has stormed out and I am about to quit my job and go live in Alaska. I think this is what they mean by roid rage. A few weeks later, I am called into the carpet on this matter. Apparently this guy has been emailing everyone about this incident and is even trying to rally Ralph Nader to his aid. Ralph said he hates Home Depot, but this guy was to radical for even him. I explain the incident, including the ‘asshole’ remark. I could see the store manager was not to upset with me and he said he might have said worse to the guy, PR be dammed, some people we just don’t need in the store. The store manager also said that the head office has his letters framed and get a chuckle out of them every time they read them. Nothing bad came of it, except that I hear he is still writing congress trying to get a bill passed that when things don’t go your way, you get 10% back on all previous purchases. Don’t worry, I don’t get it either. Oh well, back to the paint department… Thanks, David. May you live in Interesting Times – Ancient Chinese Curse. Newbies, please read this newsgroups FAQ. rec.ww FAQ http://www.robson.org/woodfaq/ Archives http://x29.deja.com/home_ps.shtml crowbar FAQ http://www.concentric.net/~Odeen/oldtools/crowbar.shtml

Response:

Nov. 5, 2000 The Home Depot 100 Borg Lane Anyplace, USA  12345 Dear Sirs: I would like to complain about the service I got while trying to purchase some paint at one of your stores today. I was patiently waiting in line to buy some paint.  Finally it was my turn, but just as I was ready to tell the gentleman what I needed, he was called away to work in the tool department.  A gentleman from the electrical department came to assist me.  He explained that when somebody goes to lunch, everybody just rotates into the next department to the left.  I didn’t think this made much sense but Home Depot seems to be a large company so they must know what they’re doing. At any rate, I asked him for 2 gallons of a pale pink for my daughters room. He then explained that he is from the electrical department and only deals in white, black and green.  I told him that I really wasn’t interested in any of those colors but wanted chip number 115 off of card P-2430.  He once again told me he would really like to help but as he was bound by law to only deal in white, black and green.  He excused himself to help a nice young lady who wanted some sky blue paint.  He explained that while he couldn’t sell her the blue, she had her choice of green,  which he said was very "earthy"; black, which he was neutral about; or white, which is the hot color this season. I grew disgusted with the whole situation when suddenly a huge ruckus erupted in the tool department.  I decided that enough was enough and started to leave the store.  I kept hearing a store employee tell some guy what an a-hole he was.  I looked at the two of them.  The employee was a slim guy with glasses in his mid thirties.  He had that swarthy look about him like he was from the Middle-East or Canada or one of those exotic locales you only read about.  The other guy was about 6′ 4 and the same slim build but he had a gut on him that would put any dedicated beer drinker to shame.  With the gut, he must have gone 300 lbs or better. Suddenly Mr. Gut turns around and storms out of the building.  I guess he didn’t see me because as he turned around to shout something back to the clerk, his gut hit me and knocked me into a display of Black and Decker power screwdrivers.  I hit the ground and all the screwdrivers fell on me. By the time I looked up, he was gone.  Just as I was getting to my feet, two of your other employees named Dino and Rocko knocked me back to the floor while giving chase to Mr. Gut.  Once again I was getting to my feet when Dino and Rocko came back in.  They were muttering about not catching the guy because he jumped into a stretch limo Ford F-350 (short bed).  They were impressed that the guy has so much money as to be able to afford one of those. I got out to my car, realized I left my keys and the paint counter and then had to go back in to get them.  The slim guy was back at the paint counter muttering something about the mean winter temperature in Alaska and generally shooting daggers at anybody who looked at him. Just then a voice came over the loud speaker that it was time for another lunch switch.  As I left, I heard the guy from Plumbing go to the Millwork department and try to explain to some poor guy that he didn’t know what a scarf joint was but if he wanted to join two pieces of baseboard, all he had to do was put male and female threads on the two ends and everything would be right as rain. In the future, I will be shopping at Builders Square or HomeQuarters.  There always seems to be a parking spot available… — Dolmen Productions http://members.home.net/dolmen.prod – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Dear All, Here I am working at the tool corral cash register at Home Depot a few months ago, getting minimum wage filling in for a person on lunch. I normally work in the paint department, paint is what I know about. There is this guy rushing around like a bull in a china shop with his arms overloaded with breakable objects, he comes up to the counter to ask a question about something on the floor. I suggest he unload his goods for everyone’s convenience. I told him would try to help him, but that this wasn’t my department and I was just filling in for someone on lunch. He was looking at some table thingie with what looked like a motor mounted underneath of it. He asked if we had any more, I checked the computer, it said we didn’t, but the computer isn’t always correct, so I checked the shelf as well. He seemed annoyed that this was the only one we had. I suggested he could buy the floor model, he pointed out that this unit had actual dust on it and it might have to be cleaned and wanted a discount. It didn’t have manuals either, but I told him we would take his name and make sure he was sent some, he didn’t want to hear that, he was just looking to chisel the price down. I called a manager and asked what the policy was on floor models, I was told we take a standard 10% off, which is basically selling the tool at cost. This guy was a little steamy already, but when I told him the discount would be 10%, he lost it, I truly thought he was about to go postal on me. With arms flailing, he knocks stuff off the counter and is muttering something about how he is single handily responsible for the success of Home Depot with the millions in business he has brought to the chain and goes on and on about how he will never be shopping here again. I am trying not to shake my head while this display is going on, and I carelessly utter under my breath, "what an asshole". Little did I know, this guy has his Whisper 2000 cranked to maximum amplification. Big mistake. Now I am almost 6 foot, but my build is what I politely call slight, I am only 150 pounds soaking wet. This ape is 6′5"+ and twice my weight, he leans over the counter right in my face and spraying as he yells, he dares me to repeat what I just said. I am pushing the emergency security button as hard and as fast I can thinking I have about 3 seconds to live before this guy squishes me like a bug. I of course don’t repeat what I said, I cannot believe he even heard it in the first place. Before Dino and Rocko get to the Coral, this guy has stormed out and I am about to quit my job and go live in Alaska. I think this is what they mean by roid rage. A few weeks later, I am called into the carpet on this matter. Apparently this guy has been emailing everyone about this incident and is even trying to rally Ralph Nader to his aid. Ralph said he hates Home Depot, but this guy was to radical for even him. I explain the incident, including the ‘asshole’ remark. I could see the store manager was not to upset with me and he said he might have said worse to the guy, PR be dammed, some people we just don’t need in the store. The store manager also said that the head office has his letters framed and get a chuckle out of them every time they read them. Nothing bad came of it, except that I hear he is still writing congress trying to get a bill passed that when things don’t go your way, you get 10% back on all previous purchases. Don’t worry, I don’t get it either. Oh well, back to the paint department… Thanks, David. May you live in Interesting Times – Ancient Chinese Curse. Newbies, please read this newsgroups FAQ. rec.ww FAQ http://www.robson.org/woodfaq/ Archives http://x29.deja.com/home_ps.shtml crowbar FAQ http://www.concentric.net/~Odeen/oldtools/crowbar.shtml

Response:

LOL, Darn it you made me loose my soda all over my keyboard.  I guess you owe me a rebate on something or other Dear All,

Humor snipped – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – A few weeks later, I am called into the carpet on this matter. Apparently this guy has been emailing everyone about this incident and

Response:

Great Add-on. — Sincerely, Sy Kaplan Black Sheep Woodworks North Chittenden, Vermont http://www.blacksheepwoodworks.com

Response:

David, Do you have good health insurance up there in Canada?  :-)  Thanks for the belly laughs. — Sincerely, Sy Kaplan Black Sheep Woodworks North Chittenden, Vermont http://www.blacksheepwoodworks.com

Response:

Dear Steve, I was going to ask if that was you that Mr. Gut knocked down, I thought for sure I recognised the scarred hand from ABPF, but it was time to move to the left again, so I didn’t get a chance to chat. Mr. Gut is lucky this took place in New Jersey and not Texas. The HD employees down there are all issued Glock 9mm’s and part of the in-house training program involves close range marksmanship. Next time you are in a Texas HD, look for a bulge in the front of those fashionable back supports we are all issued. From re-reading the employee manuals addendum for Texican employees on rules of engagement and reasonable use of force, I would have been justified in winging him in the kneecap. Might have got me employee of the Month… Thanks, David. May you live in Interesting Times – Ancient Chinese Curse. Newbies, please read this newsgroups FAQ. rec.ww FAQ http://www.robson.org/woodfaq/ Archives http://x29.deja.com/home_ps.shtml crowbar FAQ http://www.concentric.net/~Odeen/oldtools/crowbar.shtml

Response:

Hahahahhhahahahhh ROTFLMAO!!

Response:

you guys are killin me  lol

Response:

David,   Thanks for this.  I am LMAO at 7:30 am on a Monday morning, in an otherwise quiet office.  I know people think I’m strange now.  I read, and posted to the other thread/rant.  I’m glad I took the time to read this one too. P. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Dear All, Here I am working at the tool corral cash register at Home Depot a few months ago, getting minimum wage filling in for a person on lunch. I normally work in the paint department, paint is what I know about. There is this guy rushing around like a bull in a china shop with his arms overloaded with breakable objects, he comes up to the counter to ask a question about something on the floor. I suggest he unload his goods for everyone’s convenience. I told him would try to help him, but that this wasn’t my department and I was just filling in for someone on lunch. He was looking at some table thingie with what looked like a motor mounted underneath of it. He asked if we had any more, I checked the computer, it said we didn’t, but the computer isn’t always correct, so I checked the shelf as well. He seemed annoyed that this was the only one we had. I suggested he could buy the floor model, he pointed out that this unit had actual dust on it and it might have to be cleaned and wanted a discount. It didn’t have manuals either, but I told him we would take his name and make sure he was sent some, he didn’t want to hear that, he was just looking to chisel the price down. I called a manager and asked what the policy was on floor models, I was told we take a standard 10% off, which is basically selling the tool at cost. This guy was a little steamy already, but when I told him the discount would be 10%, he lost it, I truly thought he was about to go postal on me. With arms flailing, he knocks stuff off the counter and is muttering something about how he is single handily responsible for the success of Home Depot with the millions in business he has brought to the chain and goes on and on about how he will never be shopping here again. I am trying not to shake my head while this display is going on, and I carelessly utter under my breath, "what an asshole". Little did I know, this guy has his Whisper 2000 cranked to maximum amplification. Big mistake. Now I am almost 6 foot, but my build is what I politely call slight, I am only 150 pounds soaking wet. This ape is 6′5"+ and twice my weight, he leans over the counter right in my face and spraying as he yells, he dares me to repeat what I just said. I am pushing the emergency security button as hard and as fast I can thinking I have about 3 seconds to live before this guy squishes me like a bug. I of course don’t repeat what I said, I cannot believe he even heard it in the first place. Before Dino and Rocko get to the Coral, this guy has stormed out and I am about to quit my job and go live in Alaska. I think this is what they mean by roid rage. A few weeks later, I am called into the carpet on this matter. Apparently this guy has been emailing everyone about this incident and is even trying to rally Ralph Nader to his aid. Ralph said he hates Home Depot, but this guy was to radical for even him. I explain the incident, including the ‘asshole’ remark. I could see the store manager was not to upset with me and he said he might have said worse to the guy, PR be dammed, some people we just don’t need in the store. The store manager also said that the head office has his letters framed and get a chuckle out of them every time they read them. Nothing bad came of it, except that I hear he is still writing congress trying to get a bill passed that when things don’t go your way, you get 10% back on all previous purchases. Don’t worry, I don’t get it either. Oh well, back to the paint department… Thanks, David. May you live in Interesting Times – Ancient Chinese Curse. Newbies, please read this newsgroups FAQ. rec.ww FAQ http://www.robson.org/woodfaq/ Archives http://x29.deja.com/home_ps.shtml crowbar FAQ http://www.concentric.net/~Odeen/oldtools/crowbar.shtml

–         PHoeve …Those that can, do. …The rest just talk about it. Before you buy.

Response:

David, David, David,  those "bulges in the front sides of the men’s back notice a lot of out of stater’s looking at the men’s back supports.  What’s up with that ?  LOL – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Dear Steve, I was going to ask if that was you that Mr. Gut knocked down, I thought for sure I recognised the scarred hand from ABPF, but it was time to move to the left again, so I didn’t get a chance to chat. Mr. Gut is lucky this took place in New Jersey and not Texas. The HD employees down there are all issued Glock 9mm’s and part of the in-house training program involves close range marksmanship. Next time you are in a Texas HD, look for a bulge in the front of those fashionable back supports we are all issued. From re-reading the employee manuals addendum for Texican employees on rules of engagement and reasonable use of force, I would have been justified in winging him in the kneecap. Might have got me employee of the Month… Thanks, David. May you live in Interesting Times – Ancient Chinese Curse. Newbies, please read this newsgroups FAQ. rec.ww FAQ http://www.robson.org/woodfaq/ Archives http://x29.deja.com/home_ps.shtml crowbar FAQ http://www.concentric.net/~Odeen/oldtools/crowbar.shtml

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This is the most fun to hit this group in a long time. Now the kicker will be it was all a troll and he will have a big Gotcha! Well I’m hoping…… John

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Ahhh, you don’t understand at all the new world of political correctness… -Doug – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have always maintained that you should never get in trouble for speaking the truth.  Just my opinion!

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I have always maintained that you should never get in trouble for speaking the truth.  Just my opinion!

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Dear Home Depot Customers:   I would like to take this opportunity to tell you what happens to those employees who are flushed out of the HD system.   We become deckhands in Alaska.  Some of us are more fortunate than others, in that we get jobs on commercials boats and therefore are not compelled to deal with clients.   Myself?  None such luck.  I ended up working as a deckhand on a 34′ charter boat called the ‘Irish Mist.’  I was called the "master baiter."  I had to bait their hooks and gaff their fish.  Also, I had to take care of them when they were sick…"Sir…lean over the boat…yes, that’s it…ALL THE WAY over the boat, sir…."   I had to scrub herring scales off the boat daily…and damn, they’d make a good wood glue if someone could come up with a formula…. One day, we had a rather large fellow, probably six-four and about 300 pounds plus.  He was drunk and belligerent when he arrived, and this was at 7am. Well, I knew my work was cut out for me.   He got in my face and demanded to know what time the "all ya can eat for 10% off barbeque starts." I tried to explain to him that we had no such offer.  I tried and tried.  He complained that the boat was dusty and missing parts.  I muttered, "what an asshole," as I climbed up to the flybridge.   Well, luckily for me we’d just taken off from port.  So at the time he was attempting to clamber up the fly ladder after me, he was a victim of too much booze and five foot waves.  I happily sat out the rest of my voyage to see with my walkman and the Eurythmics.   Now, at the time, Alaska fishing laws limited charter boats to two fish per person. The big guy (he kept bragging about some sort of Ford truck limo thing he owned–said he’s bought a wax replica of John Rocker to put on permanent display in it), drank all day and basically threw up the entire time.  He didn’t fish.  Or cut bait. Basically, he slept.  I cut bait.   We’d had a bad day on the water, and were heading back into port in Homer, AK. Mr. Big Guy gets up and suddenly wants to fish.  I, being 19 at the time, was in no position to stop him.  I wasn’t yet ornery enough to challenge men much larger and meaner than me to physical fights.  So, I baited up his hook for him and he took to fishing.   It’s really amazing how quickly one can be lost to the wonders of the sea, especially what with those big boat propellers whirring and spinning about.  Me being a simple girl, how would I know?   I just thought we’d gotten caught up in a nest of sea otters.  I don’t care how cute they look clapping their little hands, they’re pesky creatures to be sure…  It was a tragic accident, to be sure.  However, the rest of our passengers were very pleasantly surprised when they discovered all those "fancy filets" waiting for them at the fishing dock.   So, I hope this will encourage all HD customers to treat your future charter boat deckhands with some respect, as we are quite good with the gaff hook and the filet knife, and are willing to accommodate you in any way we see fit. We look forward to your next visit to Alaska!   Sincerely, Meredith PS:  Of course this is a satire, but I really was a deck hand in Alaska.  Talk about a cool place… "Suppose you were an idiot.  Suppose you were a member of Congress. But I repeat myself."  Mark Twain

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Don’t think of working EMS.  First they cuss you for arriving late, then they puke on you before they pass out and force you to dead lift their 300-lb carcasses out of the vehicle or up/down the narrow stairs.  That’s where the EMS corollary to Murphy’s come into play – "the bigger the patient the smaller your partner." Do I have to tell you how big my partner was they day I responded to a 460lb man ejected through (how, I’ll never know) the windscreen of a Toyota mini-pickup?

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Myself?  None such luck.  I ended up working as a deckhand on a 34′ charter boat called the ‘Irish Mist.’  I was called the "master baiter."  I had to bait their hooks and gaff their fish.  Also, I had to take care of them when they were sick…"Sir…lean over the boat…yes, that’s it…ALL THE WAY over the boat, sir…."   I had to scrub herring scales off the boat daily…and damn, they’d make a good wood glue if someone could come up with a formula…. One day, we had a rather large fellow, probably six-four and about 300 pounds plus.  He was drunk and belligerent when he arrived, and this was at 7am. Well, I knew my work was cut out for me.   He got in my face and demanded to know what time the "all ya can eat for 10% off barbeque starts." I tried to explain to him that we had no such offer.  I tried and tried.  He complained that the boat was dusty and missing parts.  I muttered, "what an asshole," as I climbed up to the flybridge.

Response:

That’s nothing. I got a paper cut on my finger at work one day last year. Null.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Don’t think of working EMS.  First they cuss you for arriving late, then they puke on you before they pass out and force you to dead lift their 300-lb carcasses out of the vehicle or up/down the narrow stairs.  That’s where the EMS corollary to Murphy’s come into play – "the bigger the patient the smaller your partner." Do I have to tell you how big my partner was they day I responded to a 460lb man ejected through (how, I’ll never know) the windscreen of a Toyota mini-pickup? Myself?  None such luck.  I ended up working as a deckhand on a 34′ charter boat called the ‘Irish Mist.’  I was called the "master baiter."  I had to bait their hooks and gaff their fish.  Also, I had to take care of them when they were sick…"Sir…lean over the boat…yes, that’s it…ALL THE WAY over the boat, sir…."   I had to scrub herring scales off the boat daily…and damn, they’d make a good wood glue if someone could come up with a formula…. One day, we had a rather large fellow, probably six-four and about 300 pounds plus.  He was drunk and belligerent when he arrived, and this was at 7am. Well, I knew my work was cut out for me.   He got in my face and demanded to know what time the "all ya can eat for 10% off barbeque starts." I tried to explain to him that we had no such offer.  I tried and tried.  He complained that the boat was dusty and missing parts.  I muttered, "what an asshole," as I climbed up to the flybridge.

Response:

That’s nothing. I got a paper cut on my finger at work one day last year. Null.

ROTFLMAO!

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Question:

HI, has anyone built a whitewater dory from plans.  I have found some Mckenzie Drift boat plans, and these seam very similat to what I want. Any help appreciated. Steve Gubser Johnson City, TN

Response:

There are a number of suppliers for your project. Check out a fly fishing magazine in the classified.  Don Hill  in Springfield Oregon  puts out plan, partial kit, and full kit.  (www.driftboats.com)  or Driftboat plans from Montana, www.montana-riverboats.com/boats/index.html,  Tracy Obrian at www.calacess.com/tracy/boatpage.htm or Greg Tatman Wooden boats  at www.gregboats.com .  Also John’s  page if useful, www.cyber-dyne.com/jkohnen/nautical.html  Have fun.  I’m currently working on a highsided 18′  for GrandCanyon and Salmon/Snake waters.

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Question:

Thanks. I’d love to go there, maybe next year! Miikeh – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Very Nice,         maybe some day I will see my local waters (On your site)   like Hat creek or the Pit River.

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If anyone is intersted, I have a new fly fishing site.  It’s nothing fancy, but I would appreciate any input or suggestions.  It has lots of pictures of streams I fish near my home in Minneapolis and other streams out west.  I also will be posting the current stream conditions for spots as I fish ‘em. http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/mmhodg/ Thanks. MikeH

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Very Nice,          maybe some day I will see my local waters (On your site)    like Hat creek or the Pit River.

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Question:

I live in Manhattan, and don’t have a car.  I want to take the train to Kensico Resevoir.  Does anyone know where I can fish this resevoir from the bank? Also, do you know other places I can fly Fish via public transportaion? Thanks, Randy Kadish

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I live in Manhattan, and don’t have a car.  I want to take the train to Kensico Resevoir.  Does anyone know where I can fish this resevoir from the bank? Also, do you know other places I can fly Fish via public transportaion? Thanks, Randy Kadish

Randy – I have absolutely no idea, but I am very interested in seeing any replies – hope you get some.  Public transportation to flyfishin – real dedication.  What about packing up a float tube to take to the lake?  Might be doable. mark Faulkner

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Don’t know about public tranportation( probably railroad to neareat town and then taxi) However, I believe in addition to your license you’ll need a reservoir permit. They’re available from one of the NYC gov’t offices in Mahattan. You used to need some photos and it was free and good forever. May not be true now. If you can’t find the office(dept of water?) call urban Anler , Capitol tackle oe or Orvis, someone wil have the info They may even know a way to get there with public transit. gerry

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I believe in addition to your license you’ll need a reservoir permit. They’re available from one of the NYC gov’t offices in Mahattan. You used to need some photos and it was free and good forever. May not be true now. gerry

It is not true now. NYC watershed permits no longer require a photo and are good for five years.  As for public transportation to good fly fishing, it is definitely possible. I can think of two prime spots near train stations on Metro North’s Harlem line.

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I can think of the same places along the Metro North Hudson line. Better get Jim Capposella’s book, "Good Fishing Within 50 Miles of New York City" – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I live in Manhattan, and don’t have a car.  I want to take the train to Kensico Resevoir.  Does anyone know where I can fish this resevoir from the bank? Also, do you know other places I can fly Fish via public transportaion? Thanks, Randy Kadish

Response:

Kensico, like most of the Croton Watershed reservoirs, is not easily fishable from shore because of steep dropoffs. Also, belly boats and the like are forbidden. In fact, there are a number of restrictions, rules etc. for fishing this water because it’s owned by NYC. You will need a special watershed permit, as well. Having said that, why not consider the connecting streams? The West Branch of the Croton, the Amawalk and, especially, the East Branch of the Croton offer fine fishing easily accessible from Metro-North. The Croton TU chapter published a very fine guide to the area some years ago and some of the local shops still carry it.

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If the Bedford Sportsman in Bedford, NY is still around , they may have those maps. gerry

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Go talk to Edwin Valentin at the Urban Angler in NYC.  Though not so often now, in the past he used to take the Metro North train all the time up to the East Branch of the Croton.  He’d get let off in Brewster, then either hop a cab or walk to the stream.

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Question:

Been thinking of heading down to the Kenai/Russian for trout and dollies and maybe lakers near Skilak.  Anybody interested in sharing any recent reports of the area?  I thought I’d go down Thursday and give it a try. —                  GEORGE SCHERRER                   ANCHORAGE, ALASKA             "I’d rather be flyfishing"             http://www.alaska.net/~gjs/

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Been thinking of heading down to the Kenai/Russian for trout and dollies and maybe lakers near Skilak.  Anybody interested in sharing any recent reports of the area?  I thought I’d go down Thursday and give it a try. —                 GEORGE SCHERRER                  ANCHORAGE, ALASKA            "I’d rather be flyfishing"            http://www.alaska.net/~gjs/

Hi George:   I lived in Kenai until 1992 and at that time the Kenai and Russian was closed to fishing until June 15. Has that changed? Jim

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Question:

Help!  The good news is that I’m going on a dive trip in a few weeks to Puerto Rico and Grand Cayman.  The bad news is that I’ve never caught a bonefish and would sure like to fix that during this trip.  Anybody out there have some knowledge about flyfishing these areas for bones, permits, tarpon, whatever.  I’m looking for locations, outfitters, phone numbers, anything.  I live in Southeast Alaska and would be glad to return the favor for anglers heading this way next year.

If you call the Cayman Is. Tourism board in (I think) New York, they will send you the current copy of the Cayman Angler, which lists current action, as well guides. I’ve tried the west side of Puerto Rico several times with no luck as far as bones go (found cuda, jacks, snappers, etc.). The SE corner looked more promising but I haven’t gotten a chance to go back. I met a guy from P.R. in a tackle shop in Maine, and he said the lagoons around the airport and San Juan all hold tarpon, which he regularly took on spinning gear. There is one guide in P.R. who advertises in the back of Saltwater Sportsman too. He appears to be more offshore oriented, but he may be able to help you out. If you can’t find a copy let me know, I’ll try to dig it up.                                                         jc

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Help!  The good news is that I’m going on a dive trip in a few weeks to Puerto Rico and Grand Cayman.  The bad news is that I’ve never caught a bonefish and would sure like to fix that during this trip.  Anybody out there have some knowledge about flyfishing these areas for bones, permits, tarpon, whatever.  I’m looking for locations, outfitters, phone numbers, anything.  I live in Southeast Alaska and would be glad to return the favor for anglers heading this way next year.

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